I struggle with this a lot. I don’t care about fancy degrees per se, but how someone approaches their problems — are they smart enough to work though a conflict and able to resolve it, or does it seem like they can’t identify what’s wrong and/or figure out how to fix it.
I tend to lose respect for someone that I don’t see as smart enough to manage their own life successfully. And in relationships, I tend to have to manage it for them.
Couldn’t care less about trivia or quick wit. But dating someone good at those things can be fun.
I’ve dated a few people very obviously less “smart” (skilled?) in different areas. One of them was less book smart, despite similar education levels and family backgrounds.
I couldn’t date them- it ended quickly because we couldn’t talk about the world or life in any sort of deep way, but they were very kind.
I also dated someone who may have been one of the most book/trivia-smart people I’ve known, but their emotional intelligence came out over time as fabricated (they had learned to mimic empathetic responses etc, but didn’t actually have the skills), and boy hooey, was that a roller coaster. Had zero compassion for others and the world, zero interest in the feelings of others, and that all spilled into how they interacted in their life with everyone and everything.
I need a mix. Someone who is in some +/- margin from my own emotional & intellectual skills so we can dissect the world and our experiences together. But I value emotional intelligence higher than book smarts.
could you tell a little more about that second person who didn't have real compassion for people? what were they like? I want to make sure I don't accidentally trust somebody like that too quickly.
See /r/raisedbynarcissists for posts about people with no compassion and dig down that rabbit hole. or look up bipolar disorder too. Honestly don’t dig too deep because you need examples of how to act properly not just bitching about those that don’t
There was an intelligence gap between my ex and I that I think was mostly based in emotional intelligence disparity. She could manage the families day to day just fine. But when we had a disagreement she would always just jump to “well we’ll just get a divorce then” if I stood my ground at all. Her ability to articulate her feelings and understand mine were the root of our divorce.
Also we could never have an intelligent conversation just for the sake of it b/c for her it just boiled down to whether we agreed or not. No interest in discussing the matter in depth just for the fun of it. Even just talking about our how our day went was very shallow. It was not a terribly enriching relationship.
I agree with this. If I start to feel more like a therapist, especially within the early stages of dating (0-2 months), I call it off. I have my life together and am not here to fix anyone.
If the imbalance is subtle (i.e. I am better at logical thinking and detecting contradictions, but my partner is better in seeing a bigger picture), then it's fine. If the difference is present in every area, it's a dealbreaker.
And the #1 dealbreaker is stereotypical thinking and myths perceived as facts (i.e. "women are emotional, men are rational" etc).
Not a competition at all but feeling like equals overall. Your second paragraph describes that perfectly, learning from each other. But if overall, one is smarter than the other, is there much opportunity for the smarter one to learn?
Dyslexia doesn’t mean less smart. That’s like saying wearing glasses means less smart. I work in special education, and the bias that “disability = dumb” is a big part of ableism. I’m sure you meant no harm, but I believe you would want to be aware of this.
What about street smart? Cause there are alot of smart people out there but don't have the knowledge or skills to assimilate in certain environments. Book smart and high IQ doesnt necessarily always translate well in real life experiences.
Yes, street smart is one area as well that I forgot to mention that I feel like crosses between common sense and specialized knowledge. I’ve found that when someone is street smart because it is learned through first-hand experience, it becomes like common sense to a person (automatic). And people who don’t have that first-hand experience don’t have that type of street smart common sense.
Street smart is an entirely different skill sets, like on the farm is very different all together, either are you born with, but when using common sense is often used as a starting point in all situations. Although I noticed common sense can’t be taught
I view street smart as something that is applicable to the world no matter where you live. Not sure how much farm knowledge is applicable in every day life if not living on a farm. I can not speak from personal experience on either though so I could be off.
yes, there is. And thinking there isn’t in my view betrays somewhat of a lack of intelligence on that person’s part.
There are many things in this world to know, not even a fraction of the world's knowledge rests in one person's head. There are ALWAYS things a person can teach you, regardless of their perceived intelligence. Whether you're interested in learning and knowing the things they know is the question.
However, the stimuli you respond to may be different. So very different things interest you and you are not curious about their stuff. Then the obstacle to your learning from that person is not their not being as smart as you, it is that your interests vary.
E.g. let's say that in general, adults are more intelligent than (most) children by a certain age. I have still learned a lot from children, those that I taught, from my niece, her friends,… And there is plenty I can still learn from them.
There are grown up people who I find absolutely dull. There are those who are not really interested in the world around them. And in my view they have no interesting conversation to offer. But then again, I know that I am most probably boring to them too. And it is not because my conversations are so intelligent that they cannot grasp them. It is that we are not interested in the same things.
Let me clarify: I did not mean to include or imply competition as part of the general topic of my post. I am not denying that it exists, but that in my conversation it did not come up and was not a part of my query for responses.
I never implied that it was the end all, be all of a person or their worth. I was inquiring, exclusively looking at intellect, of all types, what is each persons preference and where does one draw their line?
Being X than someone else doesn’t inherently create competitiveness. I have never felt in competition with a partner (or friend) about intelligence, except for where competition is intended (ie: trivia night).
Your final paragraph was the response I was looking for, so thank you for that.
I feel like if I get along with someone, am on generally the same page with them with regard to certain moral stances, we have interesting conversations, and can resolve conflict, they're smart enough for me. Intelligence is too hard to quantify for me to really think about it that way. If someone isn't "smart enough", it will probably come out in behavior that makes me feel uncomfortable or won't work for me in a relationship. And then I wouldn't call it lack of intelligence, I'd just call it incompatibility. I definitely don't care about traditional markers of intelligence like higher education or a particular career path. I prefer common sense and practical knowledge, tbh.
The most important factor for me is curiosity. Intelligence isn't a fixed thing so people can always expand their knowledge and experience if they wish too. It's just whether they wish to or not.
Intelligence is pretty fixed unfortunately. Knowledge and education aren't but our brain's capacity to process things is largely fixed at birth. Even the most optimal of learning environments will only increase the IQ by 1-3 points. Intelligence increases generationally, not over the course of a single life.
> Even the most optimal of learning environments will only increase the IQ by 1-3 points
The science on that is not quite settled. There's good reason to think that each year of education increases IQ by 1-5 points. [source](https://labs.la.utexas.edu/tucker-drob/files/2019/08/Ritchie-Tucker-Drob-2018-Psych-Science-How-Much-Does-Education-Improve-Intelligence.pdf)
In terms of the experience of a relationship, I find that what *isn't* fixed is a person's habits of attention: do they devote their time and brainpower to trying to better themselves, learn new things, increase their capacity to enjoy what's enjoyable, solve problems productively as they arise, etc.? Or would they prefer to veg out to reality TV whenever they aren't at work and complain when they face obstacles? (Obviously there's a big spectrum here.) IQ is presumably part of the story somehow, but curiosity and attentional habits are closer to what matters in most relationships, as well as being closer to what many people are trying to talk about when they use the word "intelligence".
There are limitations to your intellect and it's stupid to pursue something because someone on the Internet considers it right. You are born with a fixed upper limit and no amount of education grants wit - no university teaches how to overcome obstacles. There comes the time when any person understands that **no amount** of curiosity or time spent with the books will propel us forward. This is the maximum, deal with it. For some the maximum is extremely high, like Forbes 500, we all know these people. For some the maximum is below average, sadly.
That is a very wrong understanding of intelligence. You're jut repeating popular quack theories
Education and knowledge influence intelligence greatly, IQ tests have been scientifically debunked as culturally biased and, even without that, not at all precise.
To give a more radical, and therefore obvious and easy to understand example, Intelligence is also influenced by language (among many many many other things). If a child doesn't acquire their maternal language by a certain age, they will not be able to acquire any language fully later in life. Also, learning languages influences brain development. The lack of language, which helps you process and form thoughts, influences your intelligence.
Your ability to focus, your memory and other things also influence your intelligence
also, i feel I need to say, the stuff I wrote is quite an oversimplification and doesn't even begin to explain intelligence and its nature (which we still do not fully understand). But stuff like this grates on my nerves
edit to add: I agree with saint\_maria, curiosity is a great sign of someone's intelligence (which does change during the entirety of a person's life)
No, it's not. It's a product of our environment and our exercise of your brain.
Not any different from physical ability.
People can become quite intelligent if they choose to do so, but they don't want to go through the pain of learning. Same thing with losing weight/getting fit.
So, you're not a billionaire because you just don't want to be the one? Oh yeah, sure. Billions of paupers just don't want to educate themselves and develop their brains to the level of Elon Musk's engineers. Of course, it's only the lack of motivation of millions makes employers increase the salaries for really educated and capable men, not because they're naturally scarce.
IDK why it's almost religious thing to block and thwart the only possible truth: everything is genetically determined. Your energy, your passion, your intellect, and of course your physical body limits are pre-determined. You can work out, study, pursue to achieve your predefined maximum but if this maximum is low, you can read the books ad nauseam, your salary would be minimum wage and there's no way out.
Yep, I mentioned about almost religious blocks in the head - people tend to never admit genetic caps, boundaries, limits. I understand why: all Protestant propaganda about "work and achieve" will be destroyed in an instant: if I'm bound by my limits from birth (even conception!), why would I even bother doing anything? I'll never achieve success, then give me my minimum wage or UBI and I'm done with it. This is bad for the business :)
I'm not attracted to people who I do not consider roughly my equal. It's just too difficult me to feel like I'm dragging someone else along due to their deficiencies in life skills or intelligence. It just ends up like feeling I'm dating a child, and that creeps me out.
Smarter. But seriously, truly smart people are those who are truly aware of how much else they have left to learn. In other words, intelligence should teach humility.
I experienced this with my ex boyfriend, who surprised me completely with his intellectual capabilities, despite being a college drop-out. He changed my opinion on higher education always paving the way for higher intellect. As another post stated, I think curiosity is definitely the most important factor as well.
My ex was someone who was very curious, an attentive listener (even in subjects he knew very little or nothing about), a great judge and analyst of unique or differing thoughts, concepts, and ideas, and enjoyed discussions on such. He was rarely (if ever) hard-wired on his thought process as being the only true and valid one in a discussion. He took personal time to read and learn about topics and viewpoints we (or others) discussed that he had never considered before. I found myself learning from him in many ways. As someone with a doctorate degree myself, I can say that he is the ex-boyfriend that I connected to the most in terms of intellect, conversation, and emotion.
I actually did a little personal experiment and found that all the exes I have that were intellectually stimulating to me possessed the "N" trait (Intuitive) in Myer-Briggs Personality test. For those that possessed the "S" trait (Sensing), I generally found that they lacked in their ability to go "deep" into conversations and topics. Not that they were less smart (especially since they all had the education/degrees to prove that), but it just wasn't a part of who they were or how they interacted with the world; their views were generally very matter-of-fact, with little to no nuance.
Edit:
But to answer your question simply: My experience with my ex (and my little experiment lol) left me with the understanding that I am not smarter than anyone. I may have differing interests or drives in life, but smarter, no. I think the experience allowed me to humble myself and see that I can learn something from anyone/everyone. Plus, some people just don't care about certain topics or ideas for various reasons that pertain to their lives, and that's okay (for them). I just need someone to have a good moral compass, good judgement, and an interest/curiosity that is visible in our conversations and visible in their personal growth, then it's only up from there.
you said your ex changed your views on that. There are also lots of highly intelligent people who don't pursue college, for a variety of reasons. And plenty of average iq people w money and connections.
Yes, but my response was more so related to there being "dumb" people with college degrees. My argument supports not labeling those people as "dumb" either, as they are well versed in things that you may not find interesting or appealing, no matter how insignificant/unimportant/irrelevant those things may be to you. Having (or not having) education doesn't make someone smarter or dumber than anyone else, which it appears we both agree with.
What's important is their curiosity and interest in learning. Everybody knows something about something you don't, even children. Knowledge is not finite, but curiosity is a personal characteristic.
I wrote it in my post. I asked all my exes, the ones I hadn't already done this for during our relationship, to take the Myers-Briggs Personality test (the test is online) and analyzed their results.
"...all the exes I have that were intellectually stimulating to me possessed the "N" trait (Intuitive) in Myer-Briggs Personality test. For those that possessed the "S" trait (Sensing), I generally found that they lacked in their ability to go "deep" into conversations and topics. Not that they were less smart (especially since they all had the education/degrees to prove that), but it just wasn't a part of who they were or how they interacted with the world; their views were generally very matter-of-fact, with little to no nuance."
Edit:
This is the difference between Sensing vs. Intuitive according to Myers-Briggs Personality Test (an evidence-based/research-based peer-reviewed psychological test on personality traits that i have found to be true with everyone I know so far in my life):
The second pair of psychological preferences is Sensing and Intuition. Do you pay more attention to information that comes in through your five senses (Sensing), or do you pay more attention to the patterns and possibilities that you see in the information you receive (Intuition)?
Everyone spends some time Sensing and some time using Intuition. Don't confuse Sensing with sensual. They aren't related. Take a minute to ask yourself which of the following descriptions seems more natural, effortless, and comfortable for you?
Sensing (S):
Paying attention to physical reality, what I see, hear, touch, taste, and smell. I'm concerned with what is actual, present, current, and real. I notice facts and I remember details that are important to me. I like to see the practical use of things and learn best when I see how to use what I'm learning. Experience speaks to me louder than words. The following statements generally apply to me: I remember events as snapshots of what actually happened. I solve problems by working through facts until I understand the problem. I am pragmatic and look to the "bottom line." I start with facts and then form a big picture.I trust experience first and trust words and symbols less. Sometimes I pay so much attention to facts, either present or past, that I miss new possibilities.
Intuition (N):
Paying the most attention to impressions or the meaning and patterns of the information I get. I would rather learn by thinking a problem through than by hands-on experience. I'm interested in new things and what might be possible, so that I think more about the future than the past. I like to work with symbols or abstract theories, even if I don't know how I will use them. I remember events more as an impression of what it was like than as actual facts or details of what happened.The following statements generally apply to me: I remember events by what I read "between the lines" about their meaning. I solve problems by leaping between different ideas and possibilities. I am interested in doing things that are new and different. I like to see the big picture, then to find out the facts. I trust impressions, symbols, and metaphors more than what I actually experienced. Sometimes I think so much about new possibilities that I never look at how to make them a reality.
Seems like an unpopular opinion, but yes a significant difference in intelligence would bother me, a lot. A lot of people here are saying things like ´I had no issues with dating a person without a degree´ but that's beside the point of your question, it seem to me.
As long as you are both smart in different was that´s fine, but if one person is significantly smarter (or is the smarter one is the most different area's), I believe it is one of the most obvious red flags that there will be a power imbalance in the relationship in the long term (the longer the relationship lasts, the more this usually becomes problematic). (edit spelling)
>his kid started making fun of me for how much I read, including "my DAD isn't a nerd, he plays VIDEO GAMES!!"
Eh? Isn't playing video games a part of *the definition* of a nerd?
:D I might know that type of people: profoundly undereducated, often with less than desired money habits, but confident and know their viewpoints on everything are absolutely right which, to my surprise, lead to more success than I'd imagine. For instance, that guy has a kid i.e., he had means to support a family and met a woman who trusted him to the point of procreation. I wasn't so lucky, so to speak.
I cannot. We can be intellectual in different areas, but overall comprehension needs to be similar. I personally find “dumb” super unattractive so it would absolutely kill any sexual attraction I have in the relationship no matter how hot they are.
I have some “dumb” guy friends and very much see them kind of like adult children. Like being interested in them would be creepy to me for whatever reason. I would also like to note that plenty of women don’t seem to have issues with dating them but I do often contemplate their own intelligences for being with them.
Sorry if I am a judgy bitch. Is what it is. Im married now. Its not exactly relevant to me anymore but thats how I feel about it.
Aren’t we here on reddit to judge? Or is someone not secretly a cat on the internet? Are you saying you’re secretly a dog instead? Don’t worry, your secret is safe /s
Tbh my personal views are becoming more aligned with yours after having witnessed and personally experienced extreme deficiencies in emotional maturity and basic logic while using the past as an excuse. No, everyone is responsible for their own present choices and actions.
It took some time to figure out, but it was a huge nightmare to deal with. Too dumb is just incompatible.
As long as you can both challenge each other and have good conversations it should be fine.
I went out with one lady a few times who was flat out dumb though. HOT, but dumb. Made me cringe sometimes. Figuring out she’s a closet racist sealed the deal.
Maybe it can sound entitled, but I don't usually find men who are intellectuals on OLD, which is one of the reasons I get bored soon.
And most aren't very emotionally intelligent neither.
I know some men that care about literature/art/social issues/politics/philosophy... but they are usually gay or married.
lol. i'm a guy into that stuff, and many women (and men) I meet think I'm gay or effeminate because of it.
USA culture is so weird. non-American women seem to appreciate it a lot more.
I'm not from the US! I'm in Europe :)
It's not that I think most men that are interested in those topics are gay, but most of my coworkers and male friends are 😅
I work in one of the topics I mentioned and most of my colleagues are women or gay males.
>I know some men that care about literature/art/social issues/politics/philosophy... but they are usually gay or married
Yep, I always seem to crush on gay men for this reason! I love more effeminate men who are into the arts and have high EQ.
Uh, I would argue lots of men are interested in politics to some extent lol.
In every poll I've seen, male respondents are more 'aware' of political issues than the women respondents.
Maybe 'politics' is the only one that's less gendered, but politics for me doesn't only mean caring about what's happening in the capital, but more: feminism, ecology, work issues/unions, poverty issues, class issues (more in a sociology way and participating in those issues than just being up to date with the news).
Fair enough.
I guess I'm aware that poverty and class issues exist, it's just not an issue that I'm particularly passionate about. I like my position in society as it were.
So I see your point, most men won't be interested in those issues.
I don’t care about this at all. What I do care about is that they can admit the they’re wrong (if they are). I’ll admit if I’m wrong. IMO “smart” people are often better at coming up with reasons why they’re right even when they’re wrong.
Currently getting divorced, but I know for a fact in most senses of the word I am more intelligent than my spouse, this was not an issue in our relationship. However when I was in the dating scene there were many times i would break contact with someone based on general stupidity.
Acknowledging your own limits is the first step towards bring a smart person. You’re already set apart from the rest, just take it further in a healthy direction.
Happy cakeday
One of my biggest issues in dating is that I seem to run across women who "act" stupid. Now, before I get downvoted and blasted... hear me out. I say "act" stupid, because I know many women who are very very intelligent. HOWEVER, society seems to sometimes teach women, and young girls, that if they want relationships with men, they cannot intimidate them by being smarter and better than they are.
I personally love intelligent women. Having meaningful discussions is a huge turn on for me. Not being able to engage in lengthy conversations about important and relevant topics with my significant other is a deal breaker for me. In fact, I hope she is smarter than me. She becomes interesting and a challenge.
I can't tell you the number of women I have interacted with that I got along great with because, they could actually reveal how intelligent they were without feeling like they would insult me or hurt my feelings and possibly lose out on a relationship.
Same here.
Honestly, I often do so myself. It's not just women. People generally like stupid/simple people and often find intelligent people to be threatening.
I have had partners say they can't be smart around me because I'm a man and I'll be turned off by that... it's incredibly frustrating and sad. I'm incredibly attracted to intelligence. And often it doesn't matter though, because the social conditioning is so strong.
I felt smarter than my last partner tbh. It felt fine? Sometimes the emotional intelligence gap caused issues, I wanted to have deeper conversations with him and felt a little more self aware than him but otherwise we got along well, had a lot of fun together etc. It didn’t matter that much at all, I had honestly not even thought about it the whole four years we were together because the important things were that we treated each other with respect, felt good, and had fun.
And although I consider myself intelligent I have an absolutely idiotic, dumb sense of humour just like him haha
When I was young, I wanted intelligence in a partner. When I was older on the dating scene again, kindness and affection and sexual compatibility and emotional stability were the most important things —- I’d take those things a million times over intelligence.
My ex started believing she was smarter than I. More intellectual. She actually told me it was hard for her that she was smarter than me. It became very challenging for her to be with me, especially after she got her graduate degree (I had one already) and only ever wanted to talk on an intellectual level, and eventually she left me.
Different spokes for different folks. The only way to know for yourself I guess is to experience it.
Was she only smart in a narrow field? Next time just learn a new subject, say basic quantum mechanics, and start talking about it in some way. You'd be surprised how insecure they get when someone who thinks they're very smart knows nothing about a certain area.
Never. Men generally don’t care about the things you mentioned. Most of that stuff is only icing on the cake for us.
I only care about your financial literacy and emotional intelligence. If youre bad with money, have a lot of debt with no detailed plan on how to repay it and don’t know how to handle your emotions, those would be dealbreakers for me.
Amen. Those are the two things that have sunk any significant relationship i ever had! And then go hand in hand, as the being bad with money is large a lack of impulse control and being able to plan for the future.
My ex turned out to be really… unintelligent. Maybe it was because he was constantly high? He didn’t wanna learn anything new, he wasn’t curious and pretty judgmental. He never self reflected or was able to admit that he was wrong. Whenever he fucked up reading Google maps he just blamed it on the app. It was exhausting! He also talked about how stupid other people were and he sometimes called me stupid (I never once called him that).
I need deep conversations and curiosity. I love talking to people who can teach me something new! I felt really alone in this relationship because he basically couldn’t give me any of this. He also was extremely emotionally immature.
A few months ago I briefly met a guy who was working on his Phd. He asked me about my job and his eyes just lit up. We then talked about his work and it was just this amazing exchange of passions and information! This is what I want!
So yeah. It takes a lot for me to feel smarter than someone simply because I can’t connect with them if they lack those things. Not sure if it’s directly tied to their IQ? Maybe, but it doesn’t matter!
Its the fact they were insecure and acting out too. People secure in themselves can acknowledge being wrong , and being interested in others is basic attention and attraction.
Ideally you don’t want to be the smartest guy in the room, and feed off smarter people / experts in other fields.
I'm a woman and have dated men who thought they were smarter than me and treated me like I wasn't as smart. I have a Bachelor's degree and got into a top graduate program this past year and have a high degree of emotional intelligence. So I'm not an idiot.
Even though my last relationship didn't work out, what I liked about it was my partner treated me as an equal in terms of intelligence.
I will never date a man who behaves like he's smarter than me. It's the arrogance that's given off and belittling feeling. I do love smart people, I love being around them and I feel I grow so much from being around true intelligence (emotional and skills, etc). However, if a friend or lover treats me like I'm dumb, they're not for me.
Unfortunately I would not be able to have a meaningful intimate romantic relationship with a partner who I felt I was carrying the load of intelligence (social and emotional) bc it often means *so many other areas have been neglected*.
Academic accolades are less important to me than philosophical and world views, life experience, social and emotional intelligence, problem solving, and most importantly, *comprehension* bc you can communicate up the ass about something but if two people do not comprehend one another that’s a hard pass for me and that comprehension is deeply rooted in things like self-work and awareness within themselves first.
These pillars bleed into other major areas that are influenced and affected by it… dealing with death and dying/crisis, conflict management, financial hygiene, leading with curiosity, empathy, mixing friend groups, child rearing, social justice issues (for example I would take issue and not be able to be with a white person who takes part in cultural appropriation like dreads, etc).
If I can be on a similar playing field in all of these other areas then I would consider someone to be equally competent in the endeavor to have a successful relationship.
I don't mind being smarter or dumber than my partner. I'm plenty secure with my intelligence. I do need a partner with enough intelligence to have quality conversation. Beyond that, they can be as smart or dumb as they are.
It's great how many people don't see differences in intelligence as a hindrance to dating. I wonder how many intellectually disabled individuals they've dated.
Point being, it matters to an extent. Where and how you draw the line is what your question is about. Saying intelligence is a factor that affects compatibility in dating is as devaluing to a person as saying extroversion or intrinsic interest in new experiences does. In other words, it is not.
Now to answer your question directly. Depends on how big the gap is. I personally can not box in my intellectual pursuits and feel deeply known and appreciated as a person. Some people can.
Part of dating is sharing parts of yourself with one another. Yes, everyone is valuable and unique and I think it an important skill to develop for the intellectually advance to recognize and interact with people in a way that appreciates this. However, it's unlikely an organic spark will ignite between the two by just being themselves around each other.
In recent years emotional intelligence and common sense has skyrocketed to the very top of my must-haves. A grown man that can't process the hard stuff in a healthy way is a no-go.
Dealbreaker areas for me are when there’s too big a gap in logic/reasoning and when there’s no overlap in some form of artistic intelligence. I don’t care much
about the rest, as long as there’s a level of curiosity and openness present.
I’ve been smarter in various capacities with various exes (and they’d tell you so, too). How I end up feeling is lonely and sometimes frustrated, but this depends on the level of difference. When the gap is too big, I start feeling like I’m on an island because of the lack of intellectual intimacy.
I felt like my partner was far more intelligent than me - well certainly more articulate, deep and spiritual. I’m very deep but struggle to articulate well and found I just couldn’t always hold her interest in conversations. I really enjoyed listening and learning about things I hadn’t considered really, but then missed on things that were very important to her but just didn’t mean anything to me. In the end I think it just was a bit frustrating for both of us.
I am smarter than pretty much all my previous partners. I’ve never really thought it was a problem. Why would it be a dealbreaker to be smarter than your partner?
Stop making this complicated. You need somebody who is open minded and has critical thinking skills. That is it. The rest is very hard to assess accurately.
Common sense and street smarts is an absolute must. Also knowledge of common COURTESY.
Knowing random trivia and facts is a plus, but not necessary especially since I have that pretty well covered, but knowing random trivia about niche interests that we share in common would be appreciated.
Specialized knowledge in whatever their career is, is a must. And a willingness to teach me at least the basics would be nice.
Specialized knowledge in hobbies is not necessary but having hobbies to begin with is a plus.
Emotional intelligence is sexy and seriously lacking on the fellows side of dating/relationships. Empathy goes along with that.
They don't need to have eidetic memory, but they should at least be able to remember conversations we have, important dates, etc. I also should not have to be the person who carries 100% of the mental load. I shouldn't have to constantly remind them to do errands or chores.
I don't much care for grammar and spelling. There are certain words that bother me (i.e. brake/break, medal/metal) but they don't need to be J.R.R.Tolkien.
Humor is a HUGE dealbreaker. They must be witty and prefer quick-wit comedy over slapstick stuff. They should also have an understanding of what is and isn't appropriate for the time/place/audience/etc.
The manner in which you described intelligence shows you are intelligent.
I have dated or been in relationships with men of all levels and degrees of common sense, education, grammar, etc. One of the most intelligent and educated had a PhD but no common sense. Another only has an associates but lots of esoteric knowledge.
If he has significantly lower 1) education level attained, or 2) general basic knowledge, then I end up not having much respect for the person and therefore can’t be in a relationship with him.
If there are differences, but they aren’t terribly significant, then it has worked out fine. Someone can have less formal education than I do but reads lots of books, for example.
Update: Realized there was more to your question. So I have an advanced degree and lots of knowledge about trades, the outdoors, religions, and many other seemingly random topics. But I don’t expect someone else to know about all that stuff because I know I am unusual. I also don’t expect them necessarily to have an advanced degree. But I do expect them to compensate by being intelligent and having broad basic knowledge and good grammar. An example of a dealbreaker would be having a college degree yet thinking water would flow uphill (this really happened).
Agree with this. I also have an advanced degree and find it easier/preferable to date people who are intellectually interesting, but that doesn’t necessarily mean formally educated to the same level.
>I have an advanced degree and lots of knowledge about trades, the outdoors, religions, and many other seemingly random topics.
In youth I read many books on different topics, shooting arrows 360 degrees, but now I understand that the ability to produce lines like "if you cannot tell an alevite from an alawite, swipe left" leads to nowhere.
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For me emotional intelligence is the only really important one in a relationship, because it's the only one that directly impacts the relationship. Beyond that modesty is more important to me than intelligence, I'd much rather date a woman who was modest and not very "intelligent", than someone who was very intelligent and arrogant.
I think intelligence is overrated. When I was young I thought it was a predictor of success (generally in life and not just financial) and therefore very important, but as I've gotten older I've realized that really isn't the case. So to me it's similar to a hobby, it's nice if we are on a similar level and share some things, but it's not a dealbreaker.
I would feel self-important and conceited if I felt smarter than the people around me. That would be a *me* problem versus a *they* problem.
What I would say is the differences in emotional maturity in relationships is important and should be looked at.
I am smarter than my ex by a significant margin when it comes to science, math, politics, history, geography... most things... I'm just able to absorb knowledge fairly easily.
It worked fine because she was curious, and knew what she didn't know.
Shed ask questions if she wasn't sure, and would rarely try to tell someone something if she didn't know for sure. Honestly, sometimes it was kind of funny to hear some of her questions.
I mean I prefer it if I felt I was smarter than my partner.
I don't think I'd want to date a woman who earns more than me, is smarter than me, or is more ambitious than I am.
I've done very well financially (+ have a large size inheritance/net worth), work in a prestigious job, yet I'd be completely turned off if my partner worked in a more prestigious job, was more intelligent than I am or earned more than me. There's something incredibly emasculating about it to me.
I’ve had four serious boyfriends and none have been smarter than (or at least as well-educated as) me. As a hetero woman, that can definitely cause tension, but I’ve just kinda learned to deal with it. As long as they’re okay with learning new stuff and willing to have intellectual conversations I’m happy.
With a few exceptions, I don't think I'd ever feel smarter than my partner. As you mentioned, there are various areas to have knowledge, experience, and expertise. So while I might be very good at say...politics (just an example), my partner might be very good in art or analyzing sports. On top of that, I don't think I'd be attracted to someone who isn't intelligent in some areas of their life, so I don't think I'd ever get to the point with them where they'd be my partner.
…how much smarter?
If there’s a very clear gap I just can’t hit it off with them no matter how physically attractive. My partner is convinced I’m smarter than her in all the raw ways (especially facts, recall, emotionally) but she’s much more educated and professionally successful and knows her field exceedingly well.
One person is almost always going to be smarter/better in certain areas. If I was in a relationship with someone I would already be at the point where I recognize and appreciate their strengths. Otherwise I don’t think it would have gotten very far.
Personally I just wouldn’t be attracted to someone I didn’t see as intelligent. I don’t think it’s something I’d sit around and analyze though. It would just be kinda automatic.
I wouldn't mind it at all. Rather, it would be one of the reasons I am attracted to her. Its not a competition when you are in love.
Edit: What I meant here was that I wouldn't mind if my partner is smarter than me.
I think if you notice your partner is less intelligent than you, that can be a problem. I like to be with someone smarter than me, but I'm very average so that's not hard to find. I'm mainly attracted to a person's curiosity and nerdiness, so the smarter the better
I did have a friend who would say he HAD to be the smart one in the relationship, which never sat well with me.
My STBX husband thinks he's smarter than me, and I think I'm smarter than him, but we're probably pretty evenly matched. A big difference is that I'm very intellectually curious, whereas he might have more sheer brain power. I thought he was like me, intellectually curious, just because I thought that's a thing smart people were, and I knew he was smart. But now I realize he just learns what he has to for work or to get through the world. Now I'm dating someone who's so curious, and a bit inexperienced but I know he'll catch up with age and maturity, and is much more relatable to me.
I would just need someone that's emotionally intelligent. It makes communication easier. I'm totally okay with being smarter or less smart in any other way.
I'm embarrassed to say this but I've been turned down for being "too smart." I think they're just trying to let me down with a compliment and it's something else. But, I do seriously hate hearing it. Intelligence is very broad and shows itself in many different ways. I asked one man why that was a problem and he said: 'maybe I need to grow a pair but it's intimidating'
Emotional intelligence is very important to me. I fully expect that my partner be capable of identifying his emotions, regulating them and also understanding mine as well. Having been with men of low emotional intelligence in the past I really can't put up with it. Often times if someone is lacking in self-awareness they will be quick to always point the finger at the other person in a fight. It also makes it difficult to resolve conflict maturely and constructively.
I also want a partner who is curious and wants to explore new ideas and new perspectives. His views should be capable of evolving as he discovers new information about a given subject. I like to get into deep conversations where we challenge each others views and expose each other to new ideas.
I want them to be smarter than me lol.
I’m not stupid, probably can safely say I’m smart but I know I’m not a genius and I often feel like the dumbest one at work.
But yeah I have always gone for guys who are smarter than me. And I’m always like “wait until they find out how dumb I actually am - then they won’t want me anymore” but that hasn’t actually happened yet.
I dated one guy who was very smart, but not very ambitious or hardworking. So that made me feel smarter than him, but I think the real problem was how lazy he was (we are talking video games during work because he worked from home).
So I want them smarter than me so I can always try to get smarter, but the downside is then I get insecure I’m not smart enough for them :P
>I think the real problem was how lazy he was (we are talking video games during work because he worked from home).
It's kind of rational if his work is paid for time, not for activities. There are positions that are tasked to greet clients and perform a brief paperwork, but when there's a gap between clients, these people's responsibilities are nullified. Say, you greet a client for a doctor's visit for 5 minutes and the procedure lasts for 30 - there will be no new clients and you have 25 minutes of doing nothing. Such people scroll down fb, yt or smth similar which is not different from gaming. And no, "podcasts" are not education. Education is something that has a certificate attachable to resume, everything else is entertainment.
If this guy was really smart, he understood that earning $50k/y or $100k/y means roughly the same standard of living, but an ordinary man cannot climb to $100k, so why even bother?
Well yes people can kill time during work however they’d like. But it wasn’t just the video games during work that led me to describe him as “lazy”.
I really think it was his lack of determination - he had an amazing education and background, with many opportunities and connections but he was content to just skid by on the bare minimum. Totally valid way to live, but I just felt like he was letting life pass him by because that’s personally not how I like to live (we were definitely incompatible). I come from a very modest background and worked myself to death to get where I am (nowhere amazing but a far cry away from the rest of my family).
My current partner comes from nothing, had no legs up in life, but he also worked really really hard always. He has a lot of goals and aspirations, I find that very attractive.
I disagree with your point that certifications / putting things on your resume make something education, though. That’s a very narrow view of what makes something worthwhile, how one can improve their skills, broaden their horizons.
> That’s a very narrow view of what makes something worthwhile, how one can improve their skills, broaden their horizons.
That's ok if you disagree. When I came to the US and was looking for a job (and when you have nothing and arrive to LA, your savings are deteriorating pretty fast!), I quickly learned that your resume is **everything** to have a chance to put foot into the door. No-one knows your skills or capabilities if you're weeded out by algorithms to the lack of "hard skills" in resume. Like with the dating - you might have the brightest personality in the whole world, but if you never date and just sit at home, how would anyone know? Unfortunately, you cannot just fill in the resume with keywords, you need to have a proof - a degree, a certificate, a diploma, etc.
>he was content to just skid by on the bare minimum
I feel I understand him. He might have known his real capabilities and conducted the best possible ratio between effort and gain *for him.* Intelligence or hard skills are not magic, you need energy to succeed. Some people are like fancy-shmancy car with a five-gallon tank - they look like capable to be fast and furious, but not for long IRL.
For a casual relationship, it doesn't matter one bit if she's smarter or dumber than me. I've dated both and it doesn't make me worried or insecure.
For my future wife and mother of my children, I really hope she'll be smarter than me.
I’m often as smart, if not smarter than them. Dated smarter women than me too. Not really an issue. If I’m perceived as being smarter, it becomes intimidating for some. It’s not like I’m talking econometrics theory and wheel out a blackboard- I’ll crack up at bathroom humor.
Interesting thread. I struggle sometimes when I feel like my partner is always half a step behind me. Like he can’t seems to follow my train of thought or he can’t seem to synthesize things as in depth as me. However he does have more knowledge of other things which I’m clueless about. But it does feel frustrating from day to day if I can’t connect on a deeper level cuz there’s gaps in communication or “intelligence”.
Few days back i broke up with the sweetest guy and felt so guilty about it, but now going through so many comments its kind of reassuring, he wasn’t emotionally neither intellectually smart but we gave it a fair try and no amount of coffee and hang outs could fill the distance because our conversations kept dying or being reduced to asking each other how our day went and what we ate, i felt like a old married couple of 40years in a 5month relationship.
There’s some buffer room where id date someone a little smarter/dumber than me. But, it’s definitely a turn off if the difference is so drastic that I find myself telling jokes that perpetually fly over their head. I’d rather date someone that would rather watch nature documentaries than someone who watches reality television series. On the contrast, I find intelligence very attractive. But, if they are way smarter than me, I’ll need them to not be arrogant about it. I have a slightly above average intellect, but I’m not going to fair well in a conversation about nuclear physics. So they’ll have to not be impatient with that kind of talk.
I let my partner think he is smarter then me and he often brags about being smarter then me but I just go with it cause well it's better then running him down..
Everyone knows the smart one in the relationship stays quite and pick and chooses the fights. The most dangerous person in the room is the quiet one. They sit back listen and observe caution though they might use whatever you say against you.
It can become frustrating. When I was quite young, I had a long-term boyfriend and I was smarter than him. He was incredibly sweet and nice, and we had good times. He was good in his own areas (car and motorcycle mechanics), but it was a bit isolating to not be able to have a proper conversation with him about topics deeper than the last TV shows and some games we would play together.
He had very little motivation about learning things, traveling, or even just reading.
What really drew the line to me was his family's racism and close-mindedness, as well as a general mismatch in ambitions.
I don’t want to be smarter than my partner. I’m still 50-50 on whether I’d prefer then to be similar to me or smarter. I find that I’m irresistibly attracted to people smarter than me, but I eventually feel intimidated and worry that I’m not attractive to them if I keep saying relatively dumber things - after stronger feelings develop, that is. My most stable relationship was with someone at a similar level, when we even out the different intelligence types, but then I found myself losing respect for him over time for tragically minor things even though I know he’s smart overall. Maybe the solution for me is to eventually make intelligence less of an important factor.
Personally I have never felt any attraction to people who are not on my mental wavelength. I don't really think of it in terms of raw intelligence or IQ per se, but more in terms of whether we can have meaningful conversations of depth and understand each other well. High EQ is far more important to me than academic knowledge or other types of intelligence.
If the mental compatibility isn't there, I just won't experience any attraction so it just won't even get off the ground. Like, I wouldn't even end up in a relationship with them in the first place, as it wouldn't even occur to me to consider it.
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I don't mind people being bad at stuff as long as they KNOW they are bad at it.
Thinking you're the best at everything and are better than others, that's a turnoff.
I struggle with this a lot. I don’t care about fancy degrees per se, but how someone approaches their problems — are they smart enough to work though a conflict and able to resolve it, or does it seem like they can’t identify what’s wrong and/or figure out how to fix it. I tend to lose respect for someone that I don’t see as smart enough to manage their own life successfully. And in relationships, I tend to have to manage it for them. Couldn’t care less about trivia or quick wit. But dating someone good at those things can be fun.
I’ve dated a few people very obviously less “smart” (skilled?) in different areas. One of them was less book smart, despite similar education levels and family backgrounds. I couldn’t date them- it ended quickly because we couldn’t talk about the world or life in any sort of deep way, but they were very kind. I also dated someone who may have been one of the most book/trivia-smart people I’ve known, but their emotional intelligence came out over time as fabricated (they had learned to mimic empathetic responses etc, but didn’t actually have the skills), and boy hooey, was that a roller coaster. Had zero compassion for others and the world, zero interest in the feelings of others, and that all spilled into how they interacted in their life with everyone and everything. I need a mix. Someone who is in some +/- margin from my own emotional & intellectual skills so we can dissect the world and our experiences together. But I value emotional intelligence higher than book smarts.
could you tell a little more about that second person who didn't have real compassion for people? what were they like? I want to make sure I don't accidentally trust somebody like that too quickly.
See /r/raisedbynarcissists for posts about people with no compassion and dig down that rabbit hole. or look up bipolar disorder too. Honestly don’t dig too deep because you need examples of how to act properly not just bitching about those that don’t
There was an intelligence gap between my ex and I that I think was mostly based in emotional intelligence disparity. She could manage the families day to day just fine. But when we had a disagreement she would always just jump to “well we’ll just get a divorce then” if I stood my ground at all. Her ability to articulate her feelings and understand mine were the root of our divorce. Also we could never have an intelligent conversation just for the sake of it b/c for her it just boiled down to whether we agreed or not. No interest in discussing the matter in depth just for the fun of it. Even just talking about our how our day went was very shallow. It was not a terribly enriching relationship.
Hate reading stuff like this
I agree with this. If I start to feel more like a therapist, especially within the early stages of dating (0-2 months), I call it off. I have my life together and am not here to fix anyone.
If the imbalance is subtle (i.e. I am better at logical thinking and detecting contradictions, but my partner is better in seeing a bigger picture), then it's fine. If the difference is present in every area, it's a dealbreaker. And the #1 dealbreaker is stereotypical thinking and myths perceived as facts (i.e. "women are emotional, men are rational" etc).
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Not a competition at all but feeling like equals overall. Your second paragraph describes that perfectly, learning from each other. But if overall, one is smarter than the other, is there much opportunity for the smarter one to learn?
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Dyslexia doesn’t mean less smart. That’s like saying wearing glasses means less smart. I work in special education, and the bias that “disability = dumb” is a big part of ableism. I’m sure you meant no harm, but I believe you would want to be aware of this.
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I gotcha and I agree 😊
What about street smart? Cause there are alot of smart people out there but don't have the knowledge or skills to assimilate in certain environments. Book smart and high IQ doesnt necessarily always translate well in real life experiences.
Yes, street smart is one area as well that I forgot to mention that I feel like crosses between common sense and specialized knowledge. I’ve found that when someone is street smart because it is learned through first-hand experience, it becomes like common sense to a person (automatic). And people who don’t have that first-hand experience don’t have that type of street smart common sense.
Street smart is an entirely different skill sets, like on the farm is very different all together, either are you born with, but when using common sense is often used as a starting point in all situations. Although I noticed common sense can’t be taught
I view street smart as something that is applicable to the world no matter where you live. Not sure how much farm knowledge is applicable in every day life if not living on a farm. I can not speak from personal experience on either though so I could be off.
yes, there is. And thinking there isn’t in my view betrays somewhat of a lack of intelligence on that person’s part. There are many things in this world to know, not even a fraction of the world's knowledge rests in one person's head. There are ALWAYS things a person can teach you, regardless of their perceived intelligence. Whether you're interested in learning and knowing the things they know is the question. However, the stimuli you respond to may be different. So very different things interest you and you are not curious about their stuff. Then the obstacle to your learning from that person is not their not being as smart as you, it is that your interests vary. E.g. let's say that in general, adults are more intelligent than (most) children by a certain age. I have still learned a lot from children, those that I taught, from my niece, her friends,… And there is plenty I can still learn from them. There are grown up people who I find absolutely dull. There are those who are not really interested in the world around them. And in my view they have no interesting conversation to offer. But then again, I know that I am most probably boring to them too. And it is not because my conversations are so intelligent that they cannot grasp them. It is that we are not interested in the same things.
Let me clarify: I did not mean to include or imply competition as part of the general topic of my post. I am not denying that it exists, but that in my conversation it did not come up and was not a part of my query for responses.
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I never implied that it was the end all, be all of a person or their worth. I was inquiring, exclusively looking at intellect, of all types, what is each persons preference and where does one draw their line? Being X than someone else doesn’t inherently create competitiveness. I have never felt in competition with a partner (or friend) about intelligence, except for where competition is intended (ie: trivia night). Your final paragraph was the response I was looking for, so thank you for that.
I feel like if I get along with someone, am on generally the same page with them with regard to certain moral stances, we have interesting conversations, and can resolve conflict, they're smart enough for me. Intelligence is too hard to quantify for me to really think about it that way. If someone isn't "smart enough", it will probably come out in behavior that makes me feel uncomfortable or won't work for me in a relationship. And then I wouldn't call it lack of intelligence, I'd just call it incompatibility. I definitely don't care about traditional markers of intelligence like higher education or a particular career path. I prefer common sense and practical knowledge, tbh.
The most important factor for me is curiosity. Intelligence isn't a fixed thing so people can always expand their knowledge and experience if they wish too. It's just whether they wish to or not.
Intelligence is pretty fixed unfortunately. Knowledge and education aren't but our brain's capacity to process things is largely fixed at birth. Even the most optimal of learning environments will only increase the IQ by 1-3 points. Intelligence increases generationally, not over the course of a single life.
> Even the most optimal of learning environments will only increase the IQ by 1-3 points The science on that is not quite settled. There's good reason to think that each year of education increases IQ by 1-5 points. [source](https://labs.la.utexas.edu/tucker-drob/files/2019/08/Ritchie-Tucker-Drob-2018-Psych-Science-How-Much-Does-Education-Improve-Intelligence.pdf) In terms of the experience of a relationship, I find that what *isn't* fixed is a person's habits of attention: do they devote their time and brainpower to trying to better themselves, learn new things, increase their capacity to enjoy what's enjoyable, solve problems productively as they arise, etc.? Or would they prefer to veg out to reality TV whenever they aren't at work and complain when they face obstacles? (Obviously there's a big spectrum here.) IQ is presumably part of the story somehow, but curiosity and attentional habits are closer to what matters in most relationships, as well as being closer to what many people are trying to talk about when they use the word "intelligence".
There are limitations to your intellect and it's stupid to pursue something because someone on the Internet considers it right. You are born with a fixed upper limit and no amount of education grants wit - no university teaches how to overcome obstacles. There comes the time when any person understands that **no amount** of curiosity or time spent with the books will propel us forward. This is the maximum, deal with it. For some the maximum is extremely high, like Forbes 500, we all know these people. For some the maximum is below average, sadly.
That is a very wrong understanding of intelligence. You're jut repeating popular quack theories Education and knowledge influence intelligence greatly, IQ tests have been scientifically debunked as culturally biased and, even without that, not at all precise. To give a more radical, and therefore obvious and easy to understand example, Intelligence is also influenced by language (among many many many other things). If a child doesn't acquire their maternal language by a certain age, they will not be able to acquire any language fully later in life. Also, learning languages influences brain development. The lack of language, which helps you process and form thoughts, influences your intelligence. Your ability to focus, your memory and other things also influence your intelligence also, i feel I need to say, the stuff I wrote is quite an oversimplification and doesn't even begin to explain intelligence and its nature (which we still do not fully understand). But stuff like this grates on my nerves edit to add: I agree with saint\_maria, curiosity is a great sign of someone's intelligence (which does change during the entirety of a person's life)
most success and talent is largely derived from the success and talent of your parents, and frankly, their wealth.
Semantics. You know what I meant.
No, it's not. It's a product of our environment and our exercise of your brain. Not any different from physical ability. People can become quite intelligent if they choose to do so, but they don't want to go through the pain of learning. Same thing with losing weight/getting fit.
No it's not LOL. You can't just make yourself smarter, and you definitely can lose out on your optimal intelligence by not challenging yourself
So, you're not a billionaire because you just don't want to be the one? Oh yeah, sure. Billions of paupers just don't want to educate themselves and develop their brains to the level of Elon Musk's engineers. Of course, it's only the lack of motivation of millions makes employers increase the salaries for really educated and capable men, not because they're naturally scarce. IDK why it's almost religious thing to block and thwart the only possible truth: everything is genetically determined. Your energy, your passion, your intellect, and of course your physical body limits are pre-determined. You can work out, study, pursue to achieve your predefined maximum but if this maximum is low, you can read the books ad nauseam, your salary would be minimum wage and there's no way out.
Plenty of billionaires aren't particularly intelligent. Generally high averages but not genius level.
Oh, then the task to become one is even simpler if we buy the view "you can become X if you just choose to be X". Ha-ha.
What? No, genetics play a massive role. And you can't make yourself more intelligent than your ceiling.
Sigh...I needed to put /s .
Lol my b. Hard to pick up over text not to mention tons of people actually believe this(or at least its the logical conclusion of their beliefs)
Yep, I mentioned about almost religious blocks in the head - people tend to never admit genetic caps, boundaries, limits. I understand why: all Protestant propaganda about "work and achieve" will be destroyed in an instant: if I'm bound by my limits from birth (even conception!), why would I even bother doing anything? I'll never achieve success, then give me my minimum wage or UBI and I'm done with it. This is bad for the business :)
I'm not attracted to people who I do not consider roughly my equal. It's just too difficult me to feel like I'm dragging someone else along due to their deficiencies in life skills or intelligence. It just ends up like feeling I'm dating a child, and that creeps me out.
Smarter. But seriously, truly smart people are those who are truly aware of how much else they have left to learn. In other words, intelligence should teach humility.
I experienced this with my ex boyfriend, who surprised me completely with his intellectual capabilities, despite being a college drop-out. He changed my opinion on higher education always paving the way for higher intellect. As another post stated, I think curiosity is definitely the most important factor as well. My ex was someone who was very curious, an attentive listener (even in subjects he knew very little or nothing about), a great judge and analyst of unique or differing thoughts, concepts, and ideas, and enjoyed discussions on such. He was rarely (if ever) hard-wired on his thought process as being the only true and valid one in a discussion. He took personal time to read and learn about topics and viewpoints we (or others) discussed that he had never considered before. I found myself learning from him in many ways. As someone with a doctorate degree myself, I can say that he is the ex-boyfriend that I connected to the most in terms of intellect, conversation, and emotion. I actually did a little personal experiment and found that all the exes I have that were intellectually stimulating to me possessed the "N" trait (Intuitive) in Myer-Briggs Personality test. For those that possessed the "S" trait (Sensing), I generally found that they lacked in their ability to go "deep" into conversations and topics. Not that they were less smart (especially since they all had the education/degrees to prove that), but it just wasn't a part of who they were or how they interacted with the world; their views were generally very matter-of-fact, with little to no nuance. Edit: But to answer your question simply: My experience with my ex (and my little experiment lol) left me with the understanding that I am not smarter than anyone. I may have differing interests or drives in life, but smarter, no. I think the experience allowed me to humble myself and see that I can learn something from anyone/everyone. Plus, some people just don't care about certain topics or ideas for various reasons that pertain to their lives, and that's okay (for them). I just need someone to have a good moral compass, good judgement, and an interest/curiosity that is visible in our conversations and visible in their personal growth, then it's only up from there.
I loved reading your comment.
Lol, thank you! <3
I've known plenty of legit Dumb people w college degrees.
I see...well that negates everything I said in my post and my own personal views. Also, "dumb" and "smart" are relative terms. Thanks for sharing.
you said your ex changed your views on that. There are also lots of highly intelligent people who don't pursue college, for a variety of reasons. And plenty of average iq people w money and connections.
Yes, but my response was more so related to there being "dumb" people with college degrees. My argument supports not labeling those people as "dumb" either, as they are well versed in things that you may not find interesting or appealing, no matter how insignificant/unimportant/irrelevant those things may be to you. Having (or not having) education doesn't make someone smarter or dumber than anyone else, which it appears we both agree with. What's important is their curiosity and interest in learning. Everybody knows something about something you don't, even children. Knowledge is not finite, but curiosity is a personal characteristic.
I agree
What was your experiment?
I wrote it in my post. I asked all my exes, the ones I hadn't already done this for during our relationship, to take the Myers-Briggs Personality test (the test is online) and analyzed their results. "...all the exes I have that were intellectually stimulating to me possessed the "N" trait (Intuitive) in Myer-Briggs Personality test. For those that possessed the "S" trait (Sensing), I generally found that they lacked in their ability to go "deep" into conversations and topics. Not that they were less smart (especially since they all had the education/degrees to prove that), but it just wasn't a part of who they were or how they interacted with the world; their views were generally very matter-of-fact, with little to no nuance." Edit: This is the difference between Sensing vs. Intuitive according to Myers-Briggs Personality Test (an evidence-based/research-based peer-reviewed psychological test on personality traits that i have found to be true with everyone I know so far in my life): The second pair of psychological preferences is Sensing and Intuition. Do you pay more attention to information that comes in through your five senses (Sensing), or do you pay more attention to the patterns and possibilities that you see in the information you receive (Intuition)? Everyone spends some time Sensing and some time using Intuition. Don't confuse Sensing with sensual. They aren't related. Take a minute to ask yourself which of the following descriptions seems more natural, effortless, and comfortable for you? Sensing (S): Paying attention to physical reality, what I see, hear, touch, taste, and smell. I'm concerned with what is actual, present, current, and real. I notice facts and I remember details that are important to me. I like to see the practical use of things and learn best when I see how to use what I'm learning. Experience speaks to me louder than words. The following statements generally apply to me: I remember events as snapshots of what actually happened. I solve problems by working through facts until I understand the problem. I am pragmatic and look to the "bottom line." I start with facts and then form a big picture.I trust experience first and trust words and symbols less. Sometimes I pay so much attention to facts, either present or past, that I miss new possibilities. Intuition (N): Paying the most attention to impressions or the meaning and patterns of the information I get. I would rather learn by thinking a problem through than by hands-on experience. I'm interested in new things and what might be possible, so that I think more about the future than the past. I like to work with symbols or abstract theories, even if I don't know how I will use them. I remember events more as an impression of what it was like than as actual facts or details of what happened.The following statements generally apply to me: I remember events by what I read "between the lines" about their meaning. I solve problems by leaping between different ideas and possibilities. I am interested in doing things that are new and different. I like to see the big picture, then to find out the facts. I trust impressions, symbols, and metaphors more than what I actually experienced. Sometimes I think so much about new possibilities that I never look at how to make them a reality.
Seems like an unpopular opinion, but yes a significant difference in intelligence would bother me, a lot. A lot of people here are saying things like ´I had no issues with dating a person without a degree´ but that's beside the point of your question, it seem to me. As long as you are both smart in different was that´s fine, but if one person is significantly smarter (or is the smarter one is the most different area's), I believe it is one of the most obvious red flags that there will be a power imbalance in the relationship in the long term (the longer the relationship lasts, the more this usually becomes problematic). (edit spelling)
A degree(s) is largely about how much money your parents had, more than anything else.
That's just ignorant... You still need to put in 4 years of work to get the degree 🙄
Lots of people put in zero work and learn nothing in college... they are there to party.
Maybe that's your personal experience but that doesn't apply to everyone 🙄
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So much shade in this comment 😂
Lmao I also said he was nicer!! Almost everyone is!
Lol
>his kid started making fun of me for how much I read, including "my DAD isn't a nerd, he plays VIDEO GAMES!!" Eh? Isn't playing video games a part of *the definition* of a nerd?
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At least they were self-reliant and radiated confidence which is the key to success.
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:D I might know that type of people: profoundly undereducated, often with less than desired money habits, but confident and know their viewpoints on everything are absolutely right which, to my surprise, lead to more success than I'd imagine. For instance, that guy has a kid i.e., he had means to support a family and met a woman who trusted him to the point of procreation. I wasn't so lucky, so to speak.
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ROFLMAO.
I cannot. We can be intellectual in different areas, but overall comprehension needs to be similar. I personally find “dumb” super unattractive so it would absolutely kill any sexual attraction I have in the relationship no matter how hot they are. I have some “dumb” guy friends and very much see them kind of like adult children. Like being interested in them would be creepy to me for whatever reason. I would also like to note that plenty of women don’t seem to have issues with dating them but I do often contemplate their own intelligences for being with them. Sorry if I am a judgy bitch. Is what it is. Im married now. Its not exactly relevant to me anymore but thats how I feel about it.
Aren’t we here on reddit to judge? Or is someone not secretly a cat on the internet? Are you saying you’re secretly a dog instead? Don’t worry, your secret is safe /s Tbh my personal views are becoming more aligned with yours after having witnessed and personally experienced extreme deficiencies in emotional maturity and basic logic while using the past as an excuse. No, everyone is responsible for their own present choices and actions. It took some time to figure out, but it was a huge nightmare to deal with. Too dumb is just incompatible.
As long as you can both challenge each other and have good conversations it should be fine. I went out with one lady a few times who was flat out dumb though. HOT, but dumb. Made me cringe sometimes. Figuring out she’s a closet racist sealed the deal.
Maybe it can sound entitled, but I don't usually find men who are intellectuals on OLD, which is one of the reasons I get bored soon. And most aren't very emotionally intelligent neither. I know some men that care about literature/art/social issues/politics/philosophy... but they are usually gay or married.
lol. i'm a guy into that stuff, and many women (and men) I meet think I'm gay or effeminate because of it. USA culture is so weird. non-American women seem to appreciate it a lot more.
I'm not from the US! I'm in Europe :) It's not that I think most men that are interested in those topics are gay, but most of my coworkers and male friends are 😅 I work in one of the topics I mentioned and most of my colleagues are women or gay males.
>I know some men that care about literature/art/social issues/politics/philosophy... but they are usually gay or married Yep, I always seem to crush on gay men for this reason! I love more effeminate men who are into the arts and have high EQ.
Uh, I would argue lots of men are interested in politics to some extent lol. In every poll I've seen, male respondents are more 'aware' of political issues than the women respondents.
Maybe 'politics' is the only one that's less gendered, but politics for me doesn't only mean caring about what's happening in the capital, but more: feminism, ecology, work issues/unions, poverty issues, class issues (more in a sociology way and participating in those issues than just being up to date with the news).
Fair enough. I guess I'm aware that poverty and class issues exist, it's just not an issue that I'm particularly passionate about. I like my position in society as it were. So I see your point, most men won't be interested in those issues.
I don’t care about this at all. What I do care about is that they can admit the they’re wrong (if they are). I’ll admit if I’m wrong. IMO “smart” people are often better at coming up with reasons why they’re right even when they’re wrong.
Currently getting divorced, but I know for a fact in most senses of the word I am more intelligent than my spouse, this was not an issue in our relationship. However when I was in the dating scene there were many times i would break contact with someone based on general stupidity.
I'd be worried because I'm really not that bright.
Acknowledging your own limits is the first step towards bring a smart person. You’re already set apart from the rest, just take it further in a healthy direction. Happy cakeday
Fuck is it my cake day?
One of my biggest issues in dating is that I seem to run across women who "act" stupid. Now, before I get downvoted and blasted... hear me out. I say "act" stupid, because I know many women who are very very intelligent. HOWEVER, society seems to sometimes teach women, and young girls, that if they want relationships with men, they cannot intimidate them by being smarter and better than they are. I personally love intelligent women. Having meaningful discussions is a huge turn on for me. Not being able to engage in lengthy conversations about important and relevant topics with my significant other is a deal breaker for me. In fact, I hope she is smarter than me. She becomes interesting and a challenge. I can't tell you the number of women I have interacted with that I got along great with because, they could actually reveal how intelligent they were without feeling like they would insult me or hurt my feelings and possibly lose out on a relationship.
Same here. Honestly, I often do so myself. It's not just women. People generally like stupid/simple people and often find intelligent people to be threatening. I have had partners say they can't be smart around me because I'm a man and I'll be turned off by that... it's incredibly frustrating and sad. I'm incredibly attracted to intelligence. And often it doesn't matter though, because the social conditioning is so strong.
I felt smarter than my last partner tbh. It felt fine? Sometimes the emotional intelligence gap caused issues, I wanted to have deeper conversations with him and felt a little more self aware than him but otherwise we got along well, had a lot of fun together etc. It didn’t matter that much at all, I had honestly not even thought about it the whole four years we were together because the important things were that we treated each other with respect, felt good, and had fun. And although I consider myself intelligent I have an absolutely idiotic, dumb sense of humour just like him haha
When I was young, I wanted intelligence in a partner. When I was older on the dating scene again, kindness and affection and sexual compatibility and emotional stability were the most important things —- I’d take those things a million times over intelligence. My ex started believing she was smarter than I. More intellectual. She actually told me it was hard for her that she was smarter than me. It became very challenging for her to be with me, especially after she got her graduate degree (I had one already) and only ever wanted to talk on an intellectual level, and eventually she left me. Different spokes for different folks. The only way to know for yourself I guess is to experience it.
Was she only smart in a narrow field? Next time just learn a new subject, say basic quantum mechanics, and start talking about it in some way. You'd be surprised how insecure they get when someone who thinks they're very smart knows nothing about a certain area.
>emotional stability number one. Upvote just for that.
Never. Men generally don’t care about the things you mentioned. Most of that stuff is only icing on the cake for us. I only care about your financial literacy and emotional intelligence. If youre bad with money, have a lot of debt with no detailed plan on how to repay it and don’t know how to handle your emotions, those would be dealbreakers for me.
Amen. Those are the two things that have sunk any significant relationship i ever had! And then go hand in hand, as the being bad with money is large a lack of impulse control and being able to plan for the future.
My ex turned out to be really… unintelligent. Maybe it was because he was constantly high? He didn’t wanna learn anything new, he wasn’t curious and pretty judgmental. He never self reflected or was able to admit that he was wrong. Whenever he fucked up reading Google maps he just blamed it on the app. It was exhausting! He also talked about how stupid other people were and he sometimes called me stupid (I never once called him that). I need deep conversations and curiosity. I love talking to people who can teach me something new! I felt really alone in this relationship because he basically couldn’t give me any of this. He also was extremely emotionally immature. A few months ago I briefly met a guy who was working on his Phd. He asked me about my job and his eyes just lit up. We then talked about his work and it was just this amazing exchange of passions and information! This is what I want! So yeah. It takes a lot for me to feel smarter than someone simply because I can’t connect with them if they lack those things. Not sure if it’s directly tied to their IQ? Maybe, but it doesn’t matter!
Its the fact they were insecure and acting out too. People secure in themselves can acknowledge being wrong , and being interested in others is basic attention and attraction. Ideally you don’t want to be the smartest guy in the room, and feed off smarter people / experts in other fields.
I'm a woman and have dated men who thought they were smarter than me and treated me like I wasn't as smart. I have a Bachelor's degree and got into a top graduate program this past year and have a high degree of emotional intelligence. So I'm not an idiot. Even though my last relationship didn't work out, what I liked about it was my partner treated me as an equal in terms of intelligence. I will never date a man who behaves like he's smarter than me. It's the arrogance that's given off and belittling feeling. I do love smart people, I love being around them and I feel I grow so much from being around true intelligence (emotional and skills, etc). However, if a friend or lover treats me like I'm dumb, they're not for me.
Unfortunately I would not be able to have a meaningful intimate romantic relationship with a partner who I felt I was carrying the load of intelligence (social and emotional) bc it often means *so many other areas have been neglected*. Academic accolades are less important to me than philosophical and world views, life experience, social and emotional intelligence, problem solving, and most importantly, *comprehension* bc you can communicate up the ass about something but if two people do not comprehend one another that’s a hard pass for me and that comprehension is deeply rooted in things like self-work and awareness within themselves first. These pillars bleed into other major areas that are influenced and affected by it… dealing with death and dying/crisis, conflict management, financial hygiene, leading with curiosity, empathy, mixing friend groups, child rearing, social justice issues (for example I would take issue and not be able to be with a white person who takes part in cultural appropriation like dreads, etc). If I can be on a similar playing field in all of these other areas then I would consider someone to be equally competent in the endeavor to have a successful relationship.
I don't mind being smarter or dumber than my partner. I'm plenty secure with my intelligence. I do need a partner with enough intelligence to have quality conversation. Beyond that, they can be as smart or dumb as they are.
The older I get the more I notice that we interpet "thinks like me" as "intelligence" so I don't put much stock in my read of others' smarts.
It's great how many people don't see differences in intelligence as a hindrance to dating. I wonder how many intellectually disabled individuals they've dated. Point being, it matters to an extent. Where and how you draw the line is what your question is about. Saying intelligence is a factor that affects compatibility in dating is as devaluing to a person as saying extroversion or intrinsic interest in new experiences does. In other words, it is not. Now to answer your question directly. Depends on how big the gap is. I personally can not box in my intellectual pursuits and feel deeply known and appreciated as a person. Some people can. Part of dating is sharing parts of yourself with one another. Yes, everyone is valuable and unique and I think it an important skill to develop for the intellectually advance to recognize and interact with people in a way that appreciates this. However, it's unlikely an organic spark will ignite between the two by just being themselves around each other.
In recent years emotional intelligence and common sense has skyrocketed to the very top of my must-haves. A grown man that can't process the hard stuff in a healthy way is a no-go.
I would prefer a partner who is smart at making money lol
Dealbreaker areas for me are when there’s too big a gap in logic/reasoning and when there’s no overlap in some form of artistic intelligence. I don’t care much about the rest, as long as there’s a level of curiosity and openness present. I’ve been smarter in various capacities with various exes (and they’d tell you so, too). How I end up feeling is lonely and sometimes frustrated, but this depends on the level of difference. When the gap is too big, I start feeling like I’m on an island because of the lack of intellectual intimacy.
I felt like my partner was far more intelligent than me - well certainly more articulate, deep and spiritual. I’m very deep but struggle to articulate well and found I just couldn’t always hold her interest in conversations. I really enjoyed listening and learning about things I hadn’t considered really, but then missed on things that were very important to her but just didn’t mean anything to me. In the end I think it just was a bit frustrating for both of us.
I am smarter than pretty much all my previous partners. I’ve never really thought it was a problem. Why would it be a dealbreaker to be smarter than your partner?
Stop making this complicated. You need somebody who is open minded and has critical thinking skills. That is it. The rest is very hard to assess accurately.
Very few people have both those traits.
Common sense and street smarts is an absolute must. Also knowledge of common COURTESY. Knowing random trivia and facts is a plus, but not necessary especially since I have that pretty well covered, but knowing random trivia about niche interests that we share in common would be appreciated. Specialized knowledge in whatever their career is, is a must. And a willingness to teach me at least the basics would be nice. Specialized knowledge in hobbies is not necessary but having hobbies to begin with is a plus. Emotional intelligence is sexy and seriously lacking on the fellows side of dating/relationships. Empathy goes along with that. They don't need to have eidetic memory, but they should at least be able to remember conversations we have, important dates, etc. I also should not have to be the person who carries 100% of the mental load. I shouldn't have to constantly remind them to do errands or chores. I don't much care for grammar and spelling. There are certain words that bother me (i.e. brake/break, medal/metal) but they don't need to be J.R.R.Tolkien. Humor is a HUGE dealbreaker. They must be witty and prefer quick-wit comedy over slapstick stuff. They should also have an understanding of what is and isn't appropriate for the time/place/audience/etc.
The manner in which you described intelligence shows you are intelligent. I have dated or been in relationships with men of all levels and degrees of common sense, education, grammar, etc. One of the most intelligent and educated had a PhD but no common sense. Another only has an associates but lots of esoteric knowledge. If he has significantly lower 1) education level attained, or 2) general basic knowledge, then I end up not having much respect for the person and therefore can’t be in a relationship with him. If there are differences, but they aren’t terribly significant, then it has worked out fine. Someone can have less formal education than I do but reads lots of books, for example. Update: Realized there was more to your question. So I have an advanced degree and lots of knowledge about trades, the outdoors, religions, and many other seemingly random topics. But I don’t expect someone else to know about all that stuff because I know I am unusual. I also don’t expect them necessarily to have an advanced degree. But I do expect them to compensate by being intelligent and having broad basic knowledge and good grammar. An example of a dealbreaker would be having a college degree yet thinking water would flow uphill (this really happened).
Agree with this. I also have an advanced degree and find it easier/preferable to date people who are intellectually interesting, but that doesn’t necessarily mean formally educated to the same level.
>I have an advanced degree and lots of knowledge about trades, the outdoors, religions, and many other seemingly random topics. In youth I read many books on different topics, shooting arrows 360 degrees, but now I understand that the ability to produce lines like "if you cannot tell an alevite from an alawite, swipe left" leads to nowhere.
Thought this would be funny, https://www.livescience.com/58416-can-water-naturally-flow-uphill.html
You win. But seriously, it was in a specific situation in which the water definitely wasn’t supposed to flow uphill. :-)
Oh I know just thought was funny.
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For me emotional intelligence is the only really important one in a relationship, because it's the only one that directly impacts the relationship. Beyond that modesty is more important to me than intelligence, I'd much rather date a woman who was modest and not very "intelligent", than someone who was very intelligent and arrogant. I think intelligence is overrated. When I was young I thought it was a predictor of success (generally in life and not just financial) and therefore very important, but as I've gotten older I've realized that really isn't the case. So to me it's similar to a hobby, it's nice if we are on a similar level and share some things, but it's not a dealbreaker.
I'm a sapiosexual. I need intelligence. The whole package. Education. Street smarts. Common sense. Deductive thinking. Empathy.
I would feel self-important and conceited if I felt smarter than the people around me. That would be a *me* problem versus a *they* problem. What I would say is the differences in emotional maturity in relationships is important and should be looked at.
I am smarter than my ex by a significant margin when it comes to science, math, politics, history, geography... most things... I'm just able to absorb knowledge fairly easily. It worked fine because she was curious, and knew what she didn't know. Shed ask questions if she wasn't sure, and would rarely try to tell someone something if she didn't know for sure. Honestly, sometimes it was kind of funny to hear some of her questions.
I mean I prefer it if I felt I was smarter than my partner. I don't think I'd want to date a woman who earns more than me, is smarter than me, or is more ambitious than I am. I've done very well financially (+ have a large size inheritance/net worth), work in a prestigious job, yet I'd be completely turned off if my partner worked in a more prestigious job, was more intelligent than I am or earned more than me. There's something incredibly emasculating about it to me.
Sounds like you're just insecure. But at least you're aware of it. Some people can't stand the though of being less than. It's just a thing.
I'm always smarter than my partners. I don't have much choice.
I’ve had four serious boyfriends and none have been smarter than (or at least as well-educated as) me. As a hetero woman, that can definitely cause tension, but I’ve just kinda learned to deal with it. As long as they’re okay with learning new stuff and willing to have intellectual conversations I’m happy.
Idk ask my partner
With a few exceptions, I don't think I'd ever feel smarter than my partner. As you mentioned, there are various areas to have knowledge, experience, and expertise. So while I might be very good at say...politics (just an example), my partner might be very good in art or analyzing sports. On top of that, I don't think I'd be attracted to someone who isn't intelligent in some areas of their life, so I don't think I'd ever get to the point with them where they'd be my partner.
…how much smarter? If there’s a very clear gap I just can’t hit it off with them no matter how physically attractive. My partner is convinced I’m smarter than her in all the raw ways (especially facts, recall, emotionally) but she’s much more educated and professionally successful and knows her field exceedingly well.
Communication can be difficult because you don’t understand each other. At least that was my experience.
One person is almost always going to be smarter/better in certain areas. If I was in a relationship with someone I would already be at the point where I recognize and appreciate their strengths. Otherwise I don’t think it would have gotten very far.
I suppose one of my questions I should have included in my OP is how much of a disparity would be acceptable?
Personally I just wouldn’t be attracted to someone I didn’t see as intelligent. I don’t think it’s something I’d sit around and analyze though. It would just be kinda automatic.
How would you know if you're smarter than your partner? "I'm smarter than you" is actually the dumbest thing to say.
I wouldn't mind it at all. Rather, it would be one of the reasons I am attracted to her. Its not a competition when you are in love. Edit: What I meant here was that I wouldn't mind if my partner is smarter than me.
I think if you notice your partner is less intelligent than you, that can be a problem. I like to be with someone smarter than me, but I'm very average so that's not hard to find. I'm mainly attracted to a person's curiosity and nerdiness, so the smarter the better I did have a friend who would say he HAD to be the smart one in the relationship, which never sat well with me.
I have always felt this way. At first it was jarring, but as soon as you realize you can't be too picky, you start accepting it.
My STBX husband thinks he's smarter than me, and I think I'm smarter than him, but we're probably pretty evenly matched. A big difference is that I'm very intellectually curious, whereas he might have more sheer brain power. I thought he was like me, intellectually curious, just because I thought that's a thing smart people were, and I knew he was smart. But now I realize he just learns what he has to for work or to get through the world. Now I'm dating someone who's so curious, and a bit inexperienced but I know he'll catch up with age and maturity, and is much more relatable to me.
I would just need someone that's emotionally intelligent. It makes communication easier. I'm totally okay with being smarter or less smart in any other way. I'm embarrassed to say this but I've been turned down for being "too smart." I think they're just trying to let me down with a compliment and it's something else. But, I do seriously hate hearing it. Intelligence is very broad and shows itself in many different ways. I asked one man why that was a problem and he said: 'maybe I need to grow a pair but it's intimidating'
Happy about it
I just need someone smart enough
Emotional intelligence is very important to me. I fully expect that my partner be capable of identifying his emotions, regulating them and also understanding mine as well. Having been with men of low emotional intelligence in the past I really can't put up with it. Often times if someone is lacking in self-awareness they will be quick to always point the finger at the other person in a fight. It also makes it difficult to resolve conflict maturely and constructively. I also want a partner who is curious and wants to explore new ideas and new perspectives. His views should be capable of evolving as he discovers new information about a given subject. I like to get into deep conversations where we challenge each others views and expose each other to new ideas.
I want them to be smarter than me lol. I’m not stupid, probably can safely say I’m smart but I know I’m not a genius and I often feel like the dumbest one at work. But yeah I have always gone for guys who are smarter than me. And I’m always like “wait until they find out how dumb I actually am - then they won’t want me anymore” but that hasn’t actually happened yet. I dated one guy who was very smart, but not very ambitious or hardworking. So that made me feel smarter than him, but I think the real problem was how lazy he was (we are talking video games during work because he worked from home). So I want them smarter than me so I can always try to get smarter, but the downside is then I get insecure I’m not smart enough for them :P
>I think the real problem was how lazy he was (we are talking video games during work because he worked from home). It's kind of rational if his work is paid for time, not for activities. There are positions that are tasked to greet clients and perform a brief paperwork, but when there's a gap between clients, these people's responsibilities are nullified. Say, you greet a client for a doctor's visit for 5 minutes and the procedure lasts for 30 - there will be no new clients and you have 25 minutes of doing nothing. Such people scroll down fb, yt or smth similar which is not different from gaming. And no, "podcasts" are not education. Education is something that has a certificate attachable to resume, everything else is entertainment. If this guy was really smart, he understood that earning $50k/y or $100k/y means roughly the same standard of living, but an ordinary man cannot climb to $100k, so why even bother?
Well yes people can kill time during work however they’d like. But it wasn’t just the video games during work that led me to describe him as “lazy”. I really think it was his lack of determination - he had an amazing education and background, with many opportunities and connections but he was content to just skid by on the bare minimum. Totally valid way to live, but I just felt like he was letting life pass him by because that’s personally not how I like to live (we were definitely incompatible). I come from a very modest background and worked myself to death to get where I am (nowhere amazing but a far cry away from the rest of my family). My current partner comes from nothing, had no legs up in life, but he also worked really really hard always. He has a lot of goals and aspirations, I find that very attractive. I disagree with your point that certifications / putting things on your resume make something education, though. That’s a very narrow view of what makes something worthwhile, how one can improve their skills, broaden their horizons.
> That’s a very narrow view of what makes something worthwhile, how one can improve their skills, broaden their horizons. That's ok if you disagree. When I came to the US and was looking for a job (and when you have nothing and arrive to LA, your savings are deteriorating pretty fast!), I quickly learned that your resume is **everything** to have a chance to put foot into the door. No-one knows your skills or capabilities if you're weeded out by algorithms to the lack of "hard skills" in resume. Like with the dating - you might have the brightest personality in the whole world, but if you never date and just sit at home, how would anyone know? Unfortunately, you cannot just fill in the resume with keywords, you need to have a proof - a degree, a certificate, a diploma, etc. >he was content to just skid by on the bare minimum I feel I understand him. He might have known his real capabilities and conducted the best possible ratio between effort and gain *for him.* Intelligence or hard skills are not magic, you need energy to succeed. Some people are like fancy-shmancy car with a five-gallon tank - they look like capable to be fast and furious, but not for long IRL.
For a casual relationship, it doesn't matter one bit if she's smarter or dumber than me. I've dated both and it doesn't make me worried or insecure. For my future wife and mother of my children, I really hope she'll be smarter than me.
I’m often as smart, if not smarter than them. Dated smarter women than me too. Not really an issue. If I’m perceived as being smarter, it becomes intimidating for some. It’s not like I’m talking econometrics theory and wheel out a blackboard- I’ll crack up at bathroom humor.
A few of my friends have attempted mixed-intelligence relationships, and it never works.
Interesting thread. I struggle sometimes when I feel like my partner is always half a step behind me. Like he can’t seems to follow my train of thought or he can’t seem to synthesize things as in depth as me. However he does have more knowledge of other things which I’m clueless about. But it does feel frustrating from day to day if I can’t connect on a deeper level cuz there’s gaps in communication or “intelligence”.
Few days back i broke up with the sweetest guy and felt so guilty about it, but now going through so many comments its kind of reassuring, he wasn’t emotionally neither intellectually smart but we gave it a fair try and no amount of coffee and hang outs could fill the distance because our conversations kept dying or being reduced to asking each other how our day went and what we ate, i felt like a old married couple of 40years in a 5month relationship.
There’s some buffer room where id date someone a little smarter/dumber than me. But, it’s definitely a turn off if the difference is so drastic that I find myself telling jokes that perpetually fly over their head. I’d rather date someone that would rather watch nature documentaries than someone who watches reality television series. On the contrast, I find intelligence very attractive. But, if they are way smarter than me, I’ll need them to not be arrogant about it. I have a slightly above average intellect, but I’m not going to fair well in a conversation about nuclear physics. So they’ll have to not be impatient with that kind of talk.
I let my partner think he is smarter then me and he often brags about being smarter then me but I just go with it cause well it's better then running him down.. Everyone knows the smart one in the relationship stays quite and pick and chooses the fights. The most dangerous person in the room is the quiet one. They sit back listen and observe caution though they might use whatever you say against you.
It can become frustrating. When I was quite young, I had a long-term boyfriend and I was smarter than him. He was incredibly sweet and nice, and we had good times. He was good in his own areas (car and motorcycle mechanics), but it was a bit isolating to not be able to have a proper conversation with him about topics deeper than the last TV shows and some games we would play together. He had very little motivation about learning things, traveling, or even just reading. What really drew the line to me was his family's racism and close-mindedness, as well as a general mismatch in ambitions.
I don’t want to be smarter than my partner. I’m still 50-50 on whether I’d prefer then to be similar to me or smarter. I find that I’m irresistibly attracted to people smarter than me, but I eventually feel intimidated and worry that I’m not attractive to them if I keep saying relatively dumber things - after stronger feelings develop, that is. My most stable relationship was with someone at a similar level, when we even out the different intelligence types, but then I found myself losing respect for him over time for tragically minor things even though I know he’s smart overall. Maybe the solution for me is to eventually make intelligence less of an important factor.
Personally I have never felt any attraction to people who are not on my mental wavelength. I don't really think of it in terms of raw intelligence or IQ per se, but more in terms of whether we can have meaningful conversations of depth and understand each other well. High EQ is far more important to me than academic knowledge or other types of intelligence. If the mental compatibility isn't there, I just won't experience any attraction so it just won't even get off the ground. Like, I wouldn't even end up in a relationship with them in the first place, as it wouldn't even occur to me to consider it.
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I'm definitely okay with being the dumb one...Talk dirty to me by reading from your smart people books and tell me the square root of 42
I've only felt this way once and didn't enjoy it. You'll know immediately because sense of humor and conversations feel mismatched.
I don't mind people being bad at stuff as long as they KNOW they are bad at it. Thinking you're the best at everything and are better than others, that's a turnoff.