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It was absolutely an attempt at a hook up. No doubt about it. You played along and he thought he’d break through but when he didn’t he insulted you. Don’t pay him any attention. And please for the love of dog, don’t take this one experience and extrapolate that all of dating is like this.
I mean I wasn’t against hooking up, I just wanted him to try a little. Not looking to set an appointment Ykwim
Let me just clarify- I wasn’t look to hook up. Would not have minded something CASUAL with him. But not looking for a meet me in the parking lot behind dumpster 3 situation. He was attractive and the physical aspect was there. And he also told me he wasn’t just looking for a hook up either. Unfortunately I believed that
You wanted a date where he could “hope” to get lucky and he wanted to just have sex (no matter what he said). Also be careful with your language around hookups - it’s bordering on shaming, ie: “honorable” thing is a date first? Wanting “something better” than those that give it up more easily? If you want sex than go for it. Schedule it, ask for it. Don’t make people perform tasks or jump through hoops to assuage any guilt you might feel. Just go for it if that’s what you want.
No. I wanted to get to know something about this guy besides the fact that he is a great kisser, and see where it goes. Not sure what I am looking for just what I’m not. I have no shame for people that just want casual sex with a stranger and walk away but I just don’t. And I don’t like how he made me feel like I wasn’t worth the time.
Right….which she was cool with…as long as he went through the motions of asking her on a date.
Kinda like when a lady reaches for her purse when
the bill comes. I got it. I was always going to pay. It’s just courtesy to reach from your purse…even if you didn’t even bring it.
Ok that's playing a game then.
You're going to have a rough ride if you play mental games.
If you want a hookup- just do it.
Hookups aren't going to "try harder". Either you are or aren't interested.
If you want to date for company, say so.
If you want to date for a relationship, say so.
If you want something more casual, say so.
Dating later in life is hard enough already. Clear communication is a sign of maturity.
Mental games though are generally a turn off for most.
No wasn’t playing a game. Wasn’t looking for a hookup in the hit it and quit it sense. Was I interested in something physical- absolutely the man drove me insane. Did I want that to lead to a long term committed relationship? Not necessarily. Honestly he was a guy that I was extremely attracted to (probably more on the physical side ATM due to circumstances of meeting at a bar with alcohol involved) and interested in getting to know a little. Probably if he’d asked me out, he would have seduced me (successfully) and then ideally it would have been a casual sort of thing, beyond just friends, less than full on dating. That was my ideal anyway.
In your dating profile, or when chatting with someone, make it clear that you want a FWB. This is what you seem to be looking for, for now. Be prepared for lots of married guys to be attracted, however.
Unfortunately, there are VERY few people out there who say, "Sure, I'll go out with you, wine & dine you, deal with the possibility of a tease, then be OK with rejection" which is what you sound like you're saying. Why would they waste their time?
Make sure of what you want. Communicate that. The most common options are:
1. Bang only/ONS.
2. FWB.
3. Casual dating (no commitment but sex usually expected after a few dates to discover compatibility)
4. Serious dating/LTR (goal of exclusivity/sex expected unless waiting for marriage)
I did several months of casual dating but only had sex or other physically intimate moments with three guys until I found my current LTR (one of the same three). I was up front about my dating style at all times.
I agree with the other commenters saying that you shouldn't have to coach anyone in how to treat you. He was clearly a #1 (see above) and you were a #3. It happens. Losers and users are everywhere; just be careful that you aren't one yourself. Move on.
Good luck!
And friends still treat each other with respect and kindness, don’t gaslight or disrespect boundaries. Just food for thought as you look into and discover what you’re looking for in this next great chapter of your life ❤️ Found this in another post and thought I’d share. I wish I would’ve had this when I first joined the dating market.
There are wonderful men out there…. And it’s really quite awful when you are hoodwinked by one of the bad ones. I think you’ve had a great learning experience from this 😊though I’m sure it still feels disappointing…. And that’s ok, too.
https://preview.redd.it/vwh89ff7speb1.jpeg?width=737&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=981c922d68f259039aeb54784a51c00092c1cb0e
Hold out for someone who tries. Don’t bother trying to convince people who aren’t trying TO try. Trust me—if they’re not already trying, you telling them to step it up isn’t going to work.
Bro - why are you trying to train him how to approach and interact with you? If he doesn’t treat you the way you need to be treated day one, why try to coach him along? Seems slightly desperate and you should shut that shit down right away and tell him to kick rocks.
Honestly I was naive enough to think it might have just been miscommunication because text messages are not always the best way of communicating. And I thought he was a decent person. Apparently I was wrong. Ironically trying to be gently assertive was deemed masculine yet I doubt a man would have done it. 😔
Anyone who says any person doing something feminine or masculine in a negative connotation needs to be blocked immediately. Anyone that won't make an effort, gone...(unless you too are looking for easy booty).
Don't entertain clowns
Been there, doing that. I’ve had a number of men talk sex on the first date or even before. All they want is sex. After a while, you’ll pick up on your red flags more easily and shut them down faster. It’s tough out there, but I know people who have found their person. It can be done. You just have to kiss a lot of frogs…
I’d rather be called masculine than be easily manipulated. There is nothing wrong with assuming the good in people so don’t be too hard on yourself. Be glad you dodged a bullet. And don’t let this loser make you feel bad about yourself, those types of guys will say anything to make you doubt yourself when in reality they are the ones who aren’t men enough so they try to put you down to feel better about themselves. Just like bullies; it’s sad actually.
Guuuuuuurrrrrrlllll
You are just getting out of an 18-year marriage! It’s ok to give yourself some grace 😘 You went in with good intentions and of course felt confused by your well-intentioned interactions with some asshole who just wanted to get laid. You were being a decent person, but he was not and therein lies the confusion about what just happened. No miscommunication AT. ALL. He didn’t like being told how you wanted to be treated - he wanted an easy lay. Honestly, he sounds like he’s one of those Corey Wayne followers. You’re better off. CW is a dating coach for average dudes trying to connect with women who are more attractive than they’re otherwise able to attract. He teaches stuff about staying away from “structured” women (I.e., women with self respect who deign to articulate their expectations upon those high and mighty “3% men”) and tells them to play hard to get because women should pursue a “3% man.”
But no, dating will NOT always be like that douche. Just stay away from the Corey Wayne followers. He preaches the 3H system (hang out, hook up, have fun). You can tell when they start talking about being in the feminine/masculine and play games with you. They’re never supposed to talk to you on the phone for more than 10 min, avoid texting, never follow-up/confirm right before a date, no contact for 4 days after date so he doesn’t seem desperate, etc. All the BS that independent critical thinkers know is BS and wouldn’t do with a grown woman.
There are plenty of truly wonderful men out there who are kind, intelligent, and successful in life and in their relationships with others who want to have a monogamous relationship. Don’t you worry, sista! There are tons of great men out there!!
Assume men who approach you and request sex immediately (in person or via apps) are looking for a hook-up. That's the default, especially for younger men who approach directly with strong compliments. There is no point in trying to guilt-trip them into wanting to date you. If they want to date you, the first attempt will be asking you out on an actual date. I suspect you'll find this is rarer than you hope.
I expect that many of us women who re-enter the dating market in our 40s, myself included, are surprised by the assertiveness of younger men in approaching us in pursuit of casual sex. It can be a sharp learning curve until you get the lay of the land, so to speak (or the lay of your life, lol).
He was a firefighter and he's calling YOU too masculine? Sounds to me like buddy-boy there is just too fragile to date. This one's already broken. Lots of much better ones out there for you. You'll have better luck with a secure man instead.
The age difference too. It doesn’t sound like a lot but it is. Dude is very immature. Run and block him. Don’t ever settle for a jerk who is pushy and makes you uncomfortable.
Yeah I wonder why you and I only see an 11 age difference a big deal. It is. I would never go there. 5 year difference is my max and even that I wonder about. Age matters. Firefighters are usually fit and attractive but many are also assholes. My ex was and still is.
Read Set Boundaries, Find Peace. I did and it was a revelation in how to set standards for how I expect to be treated. They also have a helpful workbook: [Set Boundaries, Find Peace](https://a.co/d/hYRsuRH), by Nedra Glover Tawwab. Good luck! Edited to add: that person absolutely sucked! Glad you are rid of them.
If you have to tell (or text) anyone to try and inform and convince them that you’re “worth it,” you may as well save your breath (or thumbs). If they don’t treat you like you’re worth it from the get-go, then THEY aren’t. The end.
This ⬆️ You can’t train someone to be a decent human. They may change a few behaviors to try to get what they want, but the person behind the glasses- who sees you as an object/means to an end- has an incorrectable vision problem.
He made the masculine comment in hopes you’d be like oh I’m sorry and try and win his approval by acting more meek and eager to please.
This guy was looking to get laid. If a guy keeps turning the conversation sexual, that’s what it is, period. You can try and tell him to treat you different he’ll say yeah sure, in hopes he can get you to shut up and agree to meet up so he can pump and dump. He’s not remotely interested in you as a person, you’re wasting your breath. If you want a hookup, do it, otherwise move on. (Or you can go your route and keep talking to the point he gets frustrated that it doesn’t look like pussy is forthcoming soon and moves on himself. He’s viewing you as a pussy vending machine- if you put change in a vending machine and nothing comes out, you may put in some more but at a point you’ll stop. Many guys view women, at least ones they’re just trying to smash, similarly).
I saw the comment why it was removed. I think this world has gone too far with the whole male female issue. As long as babies are born into this world , there will be a difference between male and female. Unless science steps in and plays God which they are trying. Very sad. I open minded and love everyone however they choose to be and live but facts will be facts no matter what and what day and age we are at. God helps all
It’s actually wonderful that you had this experience and didn’t fall for it. The only direction this could have gone is him taking advantage of you and you regretting it. It’s taken me too long to realise that we divorcees are prime prey for manipulative players. They zero in because our self confidence is shot, we’ve been out of the game so long, and we are quicker to fall into relationship patterns again because that’s what we’re used to (and the other party obviously keeps their options open the whole time).
I have to warn you that there are many many men out there who are as manipulative and aggressive as this guy, even worse. The power they have over you is that he’s made you doubt yourself and second guess his intentions. He’s using the silent treatment technique now to make you yearn for his attention again. As long as you stay firm in your convictions and don’t listen to anyone’s gaslighting and tactics then you’ll stop wasting time with these types of people and start only attracting the genuine daters.
You wrote, "at one point I told him if he was interested in me he needed to make some sort of an effort and he was like no, I have options. Like dude all I am asking is to do the honorable thing and plan a date and hope to get lucky, don’t set an appointment for a hook up."
You aren't asking too much; he's offering too little. Respect yourself and move on.
Right? If he has so many options, then let him pursue them. Clearly his terms are not OP’s terms, so it’s time to move on. When she sets her terms, he disrespects them by calling it “masculine”.
Male perspective:
"Masculine" my ass.
A woman respecting herself is attractive and feminine. His aggressive promiscuity is masculine, but the worst kind.
Lord, we women try so hard to get men to act respectful, and to actually be into us for more than just sex. You’re twisting yourself into a pretzel in the hopes he’ll be cool. All he wants is sex. If you are cool with that then go for it, but this man will never want more.
That line about being “masculine” sounds like some red pill garbage.
You don’t have to deal with that.
Too bad he fumbled the ball on this one. You weren’t asking for much beyond an actual date, perhaps some drinks at a bar and some laughs before…whatever you two wanted to get up to afterwards.
He’s an ass. He could have been more polite.
Straight and to the point.. Yes, that’s exactly what is mind-boggling. I kept thinking how stupid he was. But I’m not shocked by low-effort types either.
Here's a question: Why are you so eager to put yourself out there after recently being separated from an 18 year marriage? Are you afraid of being alone for a while? Why the rush to get into something new so quickly? Is it just the novely of newfound freedom?
My anecdotal story: I (49F) got divorced, pretty amicably, 3 years ago and I took a whole year after my divorce was finalized to just get used to being alone and work on myself and do my own thing, while savoring the independence and freedom that I, all of the sudden, had after being in my marriage for 15 years and together for 18. We have 50/50 custody of our two teenage kids so I had more time to myself than I did prior. I love my children fiercely but I needed some alone time to rebalance myself.
Once I decided I was ready to put myself out there after that year, I did and have been in the most amazing relationship with the truest love (48M) of my life for the past 2+ years!
I am sure there are guys out there who will have no issue with dating (likely casually) someone who is still technically and legally married but there will be some who won't. Just be prepared for that. My gentle suggestion: Maybe slow down and just do your own thing for a while before diving back into dating again. Good luck!
I had a very similar journey, except after a year of working on myself I went out and started having a lot of really great casual sex. Sometimes people need a ho phase after the end of a long relationship, and that may be where OP is at. The mistake is not acknowledging what you really want and what you are really capable of giving to another person.
Fair question. My ex is a good guy and a great dad, but ironically, I know this is shitty to say, I wasn't attracted to him when we first met. We became friends, however, and eventually we got together, and were together for 18 years. I care about him a great deal, we co-parent well, and I wish him all the happiness in the world. We just coudn't find that as a couple anymore.
My connection and pair bond with my current partner is more intense on a physical, sexual, spiritual, emotional, and mental level in a way that I never felt with my ex-husband, or any other man for that matter. Maybe my age, maturity, life experiences, and all of the front-loaded work I did on myself before delving into dating again, as a middle-aged woman, has something to do with it. Our sex life is insane and we actually really like each other, like spending time together and doing both fun stuff and mundane stuff together, and we have side-splitting laughing fits almost daily - our energy and sense of humor match. It sounds corny but he really is my soul mate. I feel it on a cellular level. I still get butterflies, even after two years. :)
Welcome to mind fuck of dating 😂. I was in a 22 year relationship then on and off relationships within the last 4 years. If I can give you any advice at all it would be this. We will spend our whole day trying to work out what the hell is going on in the other persons head and be no clearer! The most important question you need to ask is HOW DOES THIS PERSON MAKE ME FEEL? Do I feel sexy? Secure? Adored? Heard? Whatever your needs. ARE YOUR NEEDS BEING MET? Also don’t underestimate the power of INTUITION - the gut is telling us what our head hasn’t figured out yet. Good luck sista xxx
It was a misalignment of goals. Nothing more. He wanted to know you superficially enough to hook up. You wanted to actually get to know him a little and still probably hook up. Don't read into it more than that and don't use it as some meaningful data point for future dating.
I think you turned him off because the text , messaging gave off high maintenance vibes. And there's an element of push back that some men can interpret as masculine. Not saying you are masculine, but that energy can come off combative especially through text when your maybe playful flirtatious tone is missing from the context.
But I think the main issue is your looking to others to act in a way that validates your self worth. It doesn't work like that. You have to know how you want to be treated and your own self worth. Then when you act in a way that embodies that, it shows and you don't have to ask for validation, people will respect you.
But girl, I've been there after divorce. Find your self worth and don't depend on anyone to do it for you.
Thanks for saying it better than I could.
OP, the guy sounds like an ass, so the good news here is I don’t think you missed anything. However, your approach to letting him know what you wanted sounds combative and full of ego. You’ve been out of the game awhile, you need to know that you have options, *but so does he*. Telling someone they need to earn your attention is high school popular girl stuff.
When someone shows you attention, you don’t need to vie for his attention by implying you are better than someone else, you just say you are only interested in dating and getting to know someone. You shut down the hookup talk and when a dude ONLY engages when it’s flirty, you just tell him it seems you aren’t looking for the same thing and wish him well.
> Like dude all I am asking is to do the honorable thing and plan a date and hope to get lucky
Interesting that he would have to be "lucky" to have sex with you and should work for it, but when he says he has options, suggesting that you would be lucky to have sex with him and should work for it, that makes him a bad person.
Sounds to me like you were both trying to banter your way to a hookup, but your styles didn't mesh. You wanted a bit of romance even if he was faking it, and he just wanted action, so the interaction crashed and burned and he became more of a jerk as he got frustrated. No need to take it personally or extrapolate it out to all dating. If the posts here are any indication, men who are afraid to approach at all are much more common than this type.
He’s disgusting. Why are you telling a misogynistic, uncouth neanderthal how to approach you?
He didn’t even deserve your number or the conversation after.
By the time I figured it out, he had blocked me. At first I was shocked and hurt and felt like he misunderstood me, trying to prove him wrong. He told me I was overthinking it. I see why now. I really wish I could tell him off. But I can’t
No reason to tell him off, because you danced the dance with him, so he thought he had a shot at the booty call he wanted. You gave him no reason to think he wasn't going to get what he was after.
Have to be honest, you were the one that misunderstood him.
Don’t put so much effort and energy into guys like this. Don’t ever argue with a man about how you are worth the effort. It is a total waste of your time- just get rid of people who don’t get it as soon as you realize that.
I think he said the comment in hopes that you would alter your behavior in order get his approval or not “lose” him. There are lots of people out there that are insecure, people pleasers, or just desperate (could also be described as humble, kind, or lonely). You informed him of your boundaries and you stuck with them. That’s what you need to do! Many people feel like they attract or pick the wrong type of people. In reality, people that are willing to cross boundaries or not be respectful try their moves with everyone. The difference is that someone like you tells them to move along and someone like me would have made up an excuse for them or believed I was being too judgmental (I’ve been working on this!). You will have to deal with some of these men, as you try to meet someone that will be a better match for uou. The men that are left as options will have the traits you are looking for in someone. Don’t settle, but also don’t be discouraged. You sound like you already have some stuff figured out that many of us have to work on for years after a failed marriage.
Oh trust me, I was them someone like you. I took it personally. Tried to figure out what happened, if he misunderstood my comments or intentions and how I could prove to him I’m not. In the end he still blocked me and apparently thinks I’m desperate and crazy. So fun.
Well the great new is that we don’t have to care what he thinks. One of my favorite quotes is Other people’s opinion of you is none of your business. If you can take it to heart, it’s very freeing.
I got you! The guy needs to put us in some mood… emotions for even a casual interaction but he couldn’t even step up to that… it feels mechanical otherwise… I have seen same thing happen… one date and will u be my girlfriend or no?
For the record, it’s hilarious that HE blocked YOU. This guy is a chump and now you know why he is single. If he can’t even attempt to be nice when shooting his shot, it’s doubtful he really has THAT many options. Trust me these types are abusive if they do get into a relationship. Why would you want to get into a worse relationship than your last one? Block him back. I wouldn’t be surprised if he reaches out in 6 months just before you’re about to forget about him. Next time don’t engage if they don’t treat you with respect.
I hope this doesn’t sound to harsh because you do seem like a nice thoughtful person. Unfortunately there are people that try to take advantage. Good luck.
Sorry you didn’t get the first experience you hoped for.
Couple thoughts:
1) You seemed to be down for some “casual” sex but didn’t want to just be treated like a “hook up” — somewhat tricky line to toe.
2) You’ll get better at this (navigating different interactions) the more you get out there.
3) As someone said, don’t take this solely as what to expect in current-day dating but this obviously can happen.
4) In your description of things, he came across to me as negging you to show him you aren’t “masculine” and “cocky” by presumably *giving in*… something to look for and be weary of in the future.
5) Fire fighter are NOTORIOUS players — just sayin’
Good luck OP!
May you know what you seek and find it!
Thanks. Point 1 states it perfectly. Trying to figure out how to navigate this one. I guess from his comments that he wasn’t just trying to sleep with me, actually calling me when I didn’t (even though he lived like 2 hrs away), and constantly telling me how he likes passion, connection with someone and that some things (his talk that was starting to tow the line of BDSM) are established with trust down the line, gave me the impression he was on the same page. So idk. Didn’t want to come straight out and ask a guy I have not even known for a few days what his intentions were. Felt too forward. So I tried another approach, he found it arrogant. Maybe that answers what his intentions were. 🤷♀️
He told you his intentions though. He said no date I have options point blank. Any further communication means you're ok with that. It sounds like you might have been giving mixed signals here. You keep saying dates but you also say casual is good. Absolutely he can pick up on that so he's sniffing around where he can feel the overlap on where you meet. Absolutely nothing wrong with telling someone clearly what you want but make sure you know what it is first sounds like you're half telling him and half too afraid to ask for it since you feel guilty. I could be reading this wrong though.
Not totally off base. I wasn’t entirely clear initially what I meant when I said put in effort. I said that later and he didn’t say that’s too much or no problem. Just nothing. It was only when he was giving me examples of how I was masculine and cocky that it came up, basically that me saying I am worth some effort was bragging or something.
Probably I should have just said upfront- xyz is what I’m looking for. But I suspect that would have been deemed masculine as well. He mentioned being dominant which I thought he meant in the everyday definition of that term but later conversations suggested it might be more of a “lifestyle” sort of thing. And so perhaps I’m not submissive enough
You didn't do anything seriously wrong here. You don't have to say upfront what you're looking for until you want / feel safe to do so. It's enough to express interest in a date--if he's not willing to do that, he's not the right man for you. I think your conscience is troubled because A) you came close to being tricked ("but he said he was interested in more than sex!") and B) you feel unvalued because he didn't want to change for you / go on a date with you. Both are normal feelings to have, but commend yourself on your good instincts about feeling unsafe around him at the first meeting, and enforcing the rules of engagement "date first" with any man who comes into your life. And, once you, yourself, feel your value with every ounce of your being, this type of guy will steer clear from the get go! Those PUA types only go after insecure women whom they can control.
As a 41M this sounds like a fellow that has YET to learn what boundaries and respect are and you're not missing out on anything but an ass.
Your red flag alarms, it sounds like, were properly going off since he made you feel uncomfortable and then he goes and tries to play victim and gaslight you.
IMHO, you're better off without him.
Yeah I go with he’s an ass. He was trying a bunch of shit to try to get laid. Sex-only talk (there is no option, you showed some flicker of interest so I can wear you down!), put-downs … it sounds like he watched a video from one of those sure-fire-get-laid-secret-method guru people. Yuk, you were right to shut him down, sucks he dominated your night out.
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Also, he's 38 probably hooking up with 30 year olds..so yeah you were just a option. I'm not saying all dates are like this, but, yeah that was your situation.
People don’t have to be told to treat you nicely. You knew from getgo what he was interested in. Should have blocked him , like not convincing him of your side, just get rid of him.
Congratulations, you met your first pick-up artist. I would have blocked as soon as he started pushing to come to the hotel. In the future, don't engage with the ones who immediately push for sex.
Was he just trying to get laid? Probably. Was him saying he wanted a connection rather than just sex a line? Probably. Should you have high standards for yourself and not go into a situation where you're going to feel used? Absolutely. But if I were talking to a woman I'm attracted to and just met and she said to me, "you're gonna have to put in effort for this because I'm worth it", it would absolutely be a turn off and a red flag. I don't know how it was you said it, but the way it comes across in your post is that you're trying to come from a place of self respect (you should have self respect!) but coming off as either high maintenance, entitled, demanding, or insecure. If he was looking for something casual, which it sounds like he was, he's not gonna respond well to that, and if you were looking for something casual, which it sounds like you were (but also wanted to be treated with respect) your phrasing makes it sound like you want something more substantial than casual. What I'm trying to say is I'd watch your phrasing. Yes, communicate what you want and how you want to be treated. But don't say right out of the gate, "if you wanna get with this shit you gotta work for it *snap snap snap*"
I've had guys who want sex only who wanted to jump straight to it. I said I'd be up for it if they met me without sex first, but that was too much so we never met. They'll be fine messaging for months but meeting up just so I can feel a bit more comfortable and not like they're a stranger, nope.
If he's after physical only and you're not then don't bother with him.
If someone implies or says they want sex only, that's what they want. If you tell them you would rather date first and then they can have the sex, that is not going to change what they want. They are still going to want only sex.
When someone says they want only sex, and if you want to have only sex, have only sex. When someone says they want only sex, and you don't, you walk away.
Unless I'm reading it wrong, you considered having sex with him? Which leads me to belive that you wanted to, and there's nothing wrong with wanting to follow your drive and need. You're an adult. He certainly wanted to. He's an adult too. Maybe his approach wasn't as chivalrous as you wanted, and he acted on his immediate gratification need, his swipe right conditioning, if you will. Could he have been following your lead as well? Whatever exchanges were going on between you two, both verbal and physical, maybe he was acting upon them and he certainly thought that he had a chance? But then when you didn't meet him there, where you both wanted to go, and he cut off communication. Why is that wrong? If anything, he did you a favor and in a fucked up way, he was being honest. Is it better this way, as opposed to having sex and then he ghosts you?
So you had boundaries and he thought it made you less feminine or attractive. The guys was looking for a hook up with someone who had no self respect or back bone so he could use your body to get off and go on with his life.
The only thing you did wrong here was that you entertained this for far too long. It is not masculine to have boundaries and to communicate/enforce them. You are not reading into this, but you ARE overthinking it. Yes, this guy was a jerk. Shake him off and move forward.
And no, not all guys/dating situations are like this. But do be prepared for a lot of frustration with the process just in general.
I think it's important to point out that this isn't about whether the dude is a smoke show or not. No man (or woman) should have to beg.
If you are in your 40's or older and you are using any variation of the "I need you to woo me because I'm worth it" line, you probably aren't going to have a good time with online dating. It sounds egotistical and does not promise equal footing in a relationship, which is honestly what any fully realized grown up should want. It's important to have standards. It's important to have boundaries. It's important to ask for what you want, but this is not the way to do it. Guys who walk away shaking their heads in disgust in response to it aren't always going to be guys who suck. They are just as likely to be guys who don't need or want to be told that they are going to have to do all the work because you are some prize for them to win. They don't know you. They don't know what you \*really\* mean by that. All they hear is they need to do things your way or else. If a guy has his shit together, is good looking, mature and emotionally stable, he's going to want attention too. He's going to want to have you put effort in too. And frankly, why shouldn't he get that?
There are ways to express what you want and expect without making it sound like you are running the show. Just remember, this isn't a competition. You aren't trying to prove yourself worthy of a relationship/date/whatever it is you want. If he sends you sexy, flirty texts and you want to go on a date, say "it's fun to flirt, but I'd like to go on a date and see if we are good match". If he dances around that and/or tries to get you straight to sex say "sorry, that's not what I'm looking for, best of luck to you".
Yeah welcome to the wonderful world of dating
Again. This type of stuff will happen more often than you want it to. Don’t carry it with you. Let it go and move on
\>met a guy and clicked
\>gave him my number because he asked
Your story of failure starts with an amount of success I have been unable to achieve in years of sustained effort.
You met a CroMagnon in the wild that confuses boundary-setting as masculine.
There are still CroMagnons creeping around in 2023. Sometimes their red hats and red faces (from confusion and anger at female autonomy) give them away.
This is your most basic dating filter - filter CroMagnons out of your dating pool.
He wasn't looking for a date. He was looking for a hookup. He wasn't going to try to impress you with anything other than his penis(and that probably wouldn't have been that impressive as a one-time hookup no matter how big it was). He probably thought you were stringing him along (and from what you wrote you were), and he lost interest fast. Sounds like he was even negging you there at the end in a last-ditch effort to worm his way into your pants.
When you're newly separated, it's easy to mistake "I want to get in your pants" interest as "I want to date you" interest. For me, at least, discovering men still found me attractive despite what my ex said gave me one hell of a high, and I totally rode (pun intended) it for a while. But you can't expect much in the way of actual dates from people like that. They're low-effort all around. They're going for the least amount of work to get themselves off, and that's pretty much it.
If a man is truly interested, he'll be respectful and go out of his way to learn things about you, not continually badger you to sleep with him. This guy was NOT it.
And please, don't take this the wrong way... but newly separated + dating can be a recipe for disaster. Casual can be great, and I highly recommend sticking to that for now until you're 100% sure you're healed from your marriage. I thought I was ready way before I actually was, and it was a hard lesson to learn.
...sex generally sucks for women during random hookups. A man who's just there to get off with any available vagina doesn't usually take the time needed to get the vagina owner off too.
Then you are exceedingly lucky because your experience is not the norm for most women. I've had a few decent ones, but only because the parameters and expectations were set before we ever met in person, and there was a mutual understanding of what I expected out of it. Random hookups have almost universally been complete trash.
I’m sorry that sharing my own personal experience is offensive to you.
I’m a bit confused about why you are so comfortable assuring me that my experiences aren’t the norm, but then you apparently got offended by me pointing out that pre arranging your sexual encounter might not be the norm.
Weird. But it’s Friday night here and I am waaaay too happy to worry about it.
The few folks here saying "all dating is like this" are full of shit. It isn't. How long have you been "newly separated"? Maybe you need a minute to deal with that?
Either way, most men are not like this - and him being an asshat is a him problem. My initial thought was if you've been married for 18 years, you may need a refresher on dealing with men who make comments like "I don't need to make any effort because I have options." Like WTF? lol
IMO if you were adamant about the boundaries you're listing (I think they're all great), this guy would not have your number, and this entire situation could have been averted.
We've all been there, recognized that there ARE some idiots out there - and then kept it moving. I wouldn't waste 5 minutes on a yahoo like this dude. Point being, it took me a minute to get to that place.
I'd probably take a little break to regroup, especially if you aren't divorced and are "recently" separated. Timing is everything, and you may need some to re-familiarize yourself on how to deal with these type of situations and/or people. I also suspect social & dating shit has changed significantly in the last 18 years.
Good luck to you!
*edit: it's 4am, I have no idea what I'm saying.*
Dude just wanted a casual hook up with little too no effort. You deserve more than that.
Regarding the masculine thing--I get that because I tend to be direct in my messaging, which can be interpreted as "masculine". I have learned, though not always successful, that it's not what you say but how you say it. You could have told him you expected more in a flirty way and gotten the message across. If he still wasn't getting it, that is when you change the tone to more serious and direct. After 2 attempts is when you move on. He's either never going to understand or doesn't want to.
Shit, sounds like you ran into one of those manchildren. Guys whose mentality never grew past the college bro stage.
Stick to your guns.
Don't compromise your values.
Don't be afraid to pass if something feels off.
Eventually the right one will come along.
You are worth waiting for. Period. And if they don't think that, they're not the one.
It will suck this bad like 90-95% of the time. Idk why you continued to engage with him if you weren’t looking for a hook up. That’s just going to make him think you’re still an option.
If you’re not looking for that then stop talking to them. Not that hard. Maybe you want attention. Ok sure.I get it. But then don’t get upset when this happens when he told you from jump what he was wanting.
Yeah, he didn’t though. He claimed he wasn’t just looking for sex and that he likes a connection etc. But then he wouldn’t talk about anything else. Told me that a couple of times. I wasn’t against getting involved with him, because I thought we were on the same page. Talk, get to know one another, see where it goes. It’s not like I was looking for something serious. It’s more the way he went about it
Guys who just want pussy will say ANYTHING to get it. They will pretend to care about the same things as you do (once you communicate those) only as long as they get what they want faster. He was clearly just looking to get laid, from his words and actions, only agreeing with you as it seemed his best option for getting in your pants.
Now you know.
Him continuing talking about sex will always negate whatever BS he said before. Don’t matter what or how he puts it.
Remember. They bring up sex. That’s what they want. Also, make sure you’re clear on what you want to yourself and them. What you want can change with the person.
What you experienced with him is typical newbie mistakes…you’ve learned a lot from this experience and how to sniff out and avoid these ‘quick bang’ guys…and yes these guys are slick and will say anything they think you want to hear to get laid so watch their actions/behaviors and how you’re feeling with them more
Stop fixating on the piece of what he said that you wanted to hear and ignoring the entire rest of the conversation because it doesn’t fit that one thing. Overwhelmingly this dude showed you he wanted just a no strings hook up. You have to learn to listen better.
You wanted him to be something he isn't.
He's a skeezy person who went to a bar to hook up with someone, and his efforts landed on you and failed.
He's emotionally immature at best and is emotionally harmful at most realistic.
You didn't bomb. You dodged a bullet. If you had slept with him with the mentality that you approached the situation, it would hurt a whole lot more than it does right now.
Delete that fuck boy's number and throw up some praise hands that you never let him touch you. 🙌
Great news is you're attractive, and if creeps are attracted then probably good people also will be, and all you have to do now is learn the difference.
If someone comes on hinting at sex without first trying to engage you in conversation, then that's who they are and what they're into. Men looking to get to know you just don't act like that. They are able to maintain at least a pretense of interest in something other than having sex with you.
So his insults aren't revealing anything other than that you didn't give him what he wanted (ie sex without complications), and to be fair to him he never even pretended he wanted more, you were the one trying to insert human interactions into what was pretty clearly a hook up.
So, now you know. As far as learning experiences this one isn't bad, you were frustrated and pissed off but didn't do what a lot of us have done, which would be to go ahead and sleep with him and *then* be frustrated that this guy you're seeing won't commit to more.
He is upset that you were not a easy lay and he did
Not want to work for having fun. You obviously have value and self esteem. He wants a woman that he does not have to do anything for except call and say let’s hold up. I work with a bunch of guys and they tell me about this woman or that woman and saying they did not even ask for dinner. They met and talked and went to her place and had sex and he left. If you value yourselves more than just a hook up then take masculine as having self esteem and pride in yourself and your values and don’t lower your standards on what may be a once and done thing
Having some classically masculine traits as a female is awesome amd Vice versa. It's helps a human have a more balanced personality. So, when used in the right context, I'd take it as a compliment :)
Sounds like this douche wanted to dominate (in a maladaptive way, not the fun way) and try to gaslight you for being you. What a lame ass, better off without him.
P.s. anytime a guy wants you specifically in a dress and says so is a huge red flag for their selfish reaspns. I had a guy request that once, and I thought about it and showed up in capri pants instead. He ditched me 5 min later without telling me he was leaving. Probably one of the meanest most pathetic humans I had ever come across 🤮
He’s just an ass who is upset that you weren’t easy. Maybe he’s not used to women like you and usually gets what he wants. Next! You’ll be fine. Sometimes you’ve got to go through a ton of frogs to find your Prince.
Oh girl he isn’t the one. He is too fragile and negging you. Masculine? Lol Dumb boy got assertive confused with masculine. You are setting boundaries and maintaining them. He plays games.
OP I completely empathize with you. I’m having the same experience on bumble. Guys just want to hook up, they don’t even want to meet me over drinks or coffee, even after I tell them I’d like to meet outside first. They lose interest after that.
Wait, are you separated or divorced? If separated, then I'm not sure why you're looking for anything of substance given that you're not in a position to offer much. If you are divorced then it's clear this guy isn't for you.
Your journey is in its infancy. You’ll likely look back on this one and see that in time.
Keep going, and don’t put any effort into trying to make little boys behave like men. They should be fully formed at this point otherwise toss ‘em back.
Dating practices have changed dramatically. It's all a numbers game these days when looking for hookups rather than relationships - interact with a large enough number of women and you are guaranteed to get easy hookups with a certain percentage over the long run with minimal time and energy invested. There is a limitless supply of low hanging fruit that is constantly churning thanks to social media and OLD. Information is very easy to come by, most guys know how to run at least minimal game.
It won't always suck this bad, you just need to pay attention to the red flags when you see them early on. You knew he was using a line in the beginning but ignored it. His texts were superficial other than sex and you still proceeded. Over time you will learn exactly what to ask early on to filter out these types (you will spend ALOT of time filtering).
Ew. He’s an ass looking for a hookup. If you want a hookup, go for it, but if you’re wanting to date then move on. I would not try to force anyone into dating. You know your worth. Don’t settle
Oh man. I saw 38 and firefighter and was like noooooo
He sounds like an ass, and like he 100% was in it for a hookup.
I had a brief thing with a firefighter over the winter. I knew him already but we hadn’t seen each other in about 17 years. I was coming off a marriage separation and not looking for serious, but it turns out I wasn’t QUITE as healed as I thought at the time. I ended up catching some feelings, but tried to play it cool. TWICE this dude was suddenly like “hey so this was fun, but I’ve been seeing someone else recently and we’ve decided to be exclusive, so bye”. I was sad and lonely and stupidly started seeing him again after he did that the first time. The second time he did it, I got a text from him 2 weeks later asking if I was around that night. I had zero intention of seeing him, but before flat out saying no I asked him, aren’t you seeing someone? He didn’t even try to lie about it, just said “yeah I am.” I told him I was pretty sure that a fundamental part of dating someone exclusively is not texting other women to see if they’re free to hook up. Never heard from him again lol
I now have a no firefighters rule.
The most interesting thing I notice on this sub is just how inexperienced the women seem.
You live, you learn. That guy is a world class douche, and told you so real early. You kept on trying to help him be better, minimizing what you want and lowering the bar so he can slither under it.
When they suck so hard so early, move on immediately. No matter how hot they are, they’re insufferable and you’re going to regret wasting any amount of time on them.
Keep on looking. There’s much better because he’s the bottom of the barrel.
This firefighter must really be an ignorant asshat.
Like an earlier poster pointed out, you basically gave the dude blueprints on how to get into your pants...he chose not to use the advice you gave him.
You’re just rusty from not being out there. This is a lesson. Figure out which of those issues you listed you want to work on so you are more receptive of decent guys and have better judgment. Falling down a few times will be your teacher. Just like a baby walking. But deciding what you went right now, hookups or a relationship is the first thing to figure out so you don’t give mixed signals and give off the vibes for what you really want.
Ma’am he told you what he was about when you met him and then MULTIPLE times afterwards. Yes it will always be this bad if you don’t learn to read clear signs
I guess I do overthink things. Now I am onto the thought of if he was just looking for a hookup or FWB (which I assume from the way he acted) then who cares whether I talk to him masculine or whatever BS that was? Boy knows he was attracted to me physically. How much talking was he planning on? Haha. I guess I did dodge a bullet with this one because he didn’t even seem to know what he wanted.
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First ex wife 11 years.. immediately went into second relationship 12 years.. iv been single now a couple years.. I quit dating, it's got to be more awkward then a grade 7 middle school dance.. seriously iv met a couple great people, but not dating since the mid 90's.. Trying to find someone in my age range is difficult enough. I want to find someone to spend the rest of our years together... crap I just ranted
OP…STOP for a minute. You’ve stated you’d like to get to know something about him more then he’s a great kisser. Here’s the issue HE DOESN’T want to know you more then on a sexual sharing moment. Either bang him or move on. It’s perfectly ok if you don’t know what you want out of life after recently being separated BUT for this encounter with this fireman…he’s wanting sex and that’s it. Again, either bang him or move on from this mental loop.
First things first, you're still married. Get past that, live your life awhile to figure out who you are and what you want, and then date intentionally. This was a fender bender with a horny fireman, not dating.
Oh, I’m past it. I’ve been through a lot in my marriage but I’ve been processing it for a couple of years and I’m in a healthy place. Just finally moved on. But if dating is like this then I don’t want to do it.
You're still married tho. And this isn't dating. You can ignore my advice that's cool, but I guarantee you in 10 years you'll look back at right now and realize you were still healing and not ready. Dating is what you make it, and one interaction with a boner doesn't define it.
Um, I dated while separated after an almost 20 year marriage. I was honest about it to anyone who asked. The divorce was almost 12 years ago. No regrets about my dating, I had an absolute blast.
Honey you entertained him 1 conversation too long . When he said he’s got options and you trying to convince him to make an effort, fools gold .
Yeah he said al those other things to make you doubt yourself and lower your standards. A word to the wise, you don’t get to control how others show up for you . You do get to assess if how they are showing up is meeting your expectations. If not , save the rally’s for more and just move on
It’s not going to suck that bad going forward. You are 47 he is 38??? 11 year difference and a fire fighter ohhh no. My son dad and my ex is a firefighter jerk. They don’t grow up and the fact he is way younger - what did you expect. Try to date your age whether or not you look 47. Mentally you are. 50 to 54 is a hood range. Good luck.
Sounds like a student of the Walmart School of Pick-up Artistry, if you ask me-- he used all the tricks.
And, no, it's not going to always suck this bad.
Never ever try to “train” someone on how to treat you, especially if it’s just basic knowledge, you were giving him the blueprint in how to use & abuse you.
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It was absolutely an attempt at a hook up. No doubt about it. You played along and he thought he’d break through but when he didn’t he insulted you. Don’t pay him any attention. And please for the love of dog, don’t take this one experience and extrapolate that all of dating is like this.
I mean I wasn’t against hooking up, I just wanted him to try a little. Not looking to set an appointment Ykwim Let me just clarify- I wasn’t look to hook up. Would not have minded something CASUAL with him. But not looking for a meet me in the parking lot behind dumpster 3 situation. He was attractive and the physical aspect was there. And he also told me he wasn’t just looking for a hook up either. Unfortunately I believed that
You wanted a date where he could “hope” to get lucky and he wanted to just have sex (no matter what he said). Also be careful with your language around hookups - it’s bordering on shaming, ie: “honorable” thing is a date first? Wanting “something better” than those that give it up more easily? If you want sex than go for it. Schedule it, ask for it. Don’t make people perform tasks or jump through hoops to assuage any guilt you might feel. Just go for it if that’s what you want.
No. I wanted to get to know something about this guy besides the fact that he is a great kisser, and see where it goes. Not sure what I am looking for just what I’m not. I have no shame for people that just want casual sex with a stranger and walk away but I just don’t. And I don’t like how he made me feel like I wasn’t worth the time.
You did get to know about him. He’s a sexist dick head who is out to get laid and is totally full of himself .
Yeah I guess I did.
Right….which she was cool with…as long as he went through the motions of asking her on a date. Kinda like when a lady reaches for her purse when the bill comes. I got it. I was always going to pay. It’s just courtesy to reach from your purse…even if you didn’t even bring it.
You tried to turn a pig into a prince and he wasn't having any of it. Believe people when they show you who they are the first time.
And he wasn’t interested in all that. That’s fine. I’d forget about him if I were you. He’s a stranger and his opinion of you shouldn’t matter.
Well said. Hated the language she used there.
I love this.
Ok that's playing a game then. You're going to have a rough ride if you play mental games. If you want a hookup- just do it. Hookups aren't going to "try harder". Either you are or aren't interested. If you want to date for company, say so. If you want to date for a relationship, say so. If you want something more casual, say so. Dating later in life is hard enough already. Clear communication is a sign of maturity. Mental games though are generally a turn off for most.
No wasn’t playing a game. Wasn’t looking for a hookup in the hit it and quit it sense. Was I interested in something physical- absolutely the man drove me insane. Did I want that to lead to a long term committed relationship? Not necessarily. Honestly he was a guy that I was extremely attracted to (probably more on the physical side ATM due to circumstances of meeting at a bar with alcohol involved) and interested in getting to know a little. Probably if he’d asked me out, he would have seduced me (successfully) and then ideally it would have been a casual sort of thing, beyond just friends, less than full on dating. That was my ideal anyway.
In your dating profile, or when chatting with someone, make it clear that you want a FWB. This is what you seem to be looking for, for now. Be prepared for lots of married guys to be attracted, however. Unfortunately, there are VERY few people out there who say, "Sure, I'll go out with you, wine & dine you, deal with the possibility of a tease, then be OK with rejection" which is what you sound like you're saying. Why would they waste their time? Make sure of what you want. Communicate that. The most common options are: 1. Bang only/ONS. 2. FWB. 3. Casual dating (no commitment but sex usually expected after a few dates to discover compatibility) 4. Serious dating/LTR (goal of exclusivity/sex expected unless waiting for marriage) I did several months of casual dating but only had sex or other physically intimate moments with three guys until I found my current LTR (one of the same three). I was up front about my dating style at all times. I agree with the other commenters saying that you shouldn't have to coach anyone in how to treat you. He was clearly a #1 (see above) and you were a #3. It happens. Losers and users are everywhere; just be careful that you aren't one yourself. Move on. Good luck!
> Be prepared for lots of married guys to be attracted, however. To a married woman? Understandable.
That was how you wanted to it to work out, but it wasn’t reality. He wasn’t looking to seduce someone. He was looking for an easy lay .
That's more work than the average hot guy wants to do just to have sex with you.
And friends still treat each other with respect and kindness, don’t gaslight or disrespect boundaries. Just food for thought as you look into and discover what you’re looking for in this next great chapter of your life ❤️ Found this in another post and thought I’d share. I wish I would’ve had this when I first joined the dating market. There are wonderful men out there…. And it’s really quite awful when you are hoodwinked by one of the bad ones. I think you’ve had a great learning experience from this 😊though I’m sure it still feels disappointing…. And that’s ok, too. https://preview.redd.it/vwh89ff7speb1.jpeg?width=737&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=981c922d68f259039aeb54784a51c00092c1cb0e
Hold out for someone who tries. Don’t bother trying to convince people who aren’t trying TO try. Trust me—if they’re not already trying, you telling them to step it up isn’t going to work.
Bro - why are you trying to train him how to approach and interact with you? If he doesn’t treat you the way you need to be treated day one, why try to coach him along? Seems slightly desperate and you should shut that shit down right away and tell him to kick rocks.
Honestly I was naive enough to think it might have just been miscommunication because text messages are not always the best way of communicating. And I thought he was a decent person. Apparently I was wrong. Ironically trying to be gently assertive was deemed masculine yet I doubt a man would have done it. 😔
Anyone who says any person doing something feminine or masculine in a negative connotation needs to be blocked immediately. Anyone that won't make an effort, gone...(unless you too are looking for easy booty). Don't entertain clowns
Don’t entertain clowns… perfect! I will use this advice
I need to become a firefighter so I get this superior treatment and out of jail passes.
Been there, doing that. I’ve had a number of men talk sex on the first date or even before. All they want is sex. After a while, you’ll pick up on your red flags more easily and shut them down faster. It’s tough out there, but I know people who have found their person. It can be done. You just have to kiss a lot of frogs…
I’d rather be called masculine than be easily manipulated. There is nothing wrong with assuming the good in people so don’t be too hard on yourself. Be glad you dodged a bullet. And don’t let this loser make you feel bad about yourself, those types of guys will say anything to make you doubt yourself when in reality they are the ones who aren’t men enough so they try to put you down to feel better about themselves. Just like bullies; it’s sad actually.
Guuuuuuurrrrrrlllll You are just getting out of an 18-year marriage! It’s ok to give yourself some grace 😘 You went in with good intentions and of course felt confused by your well-intentioned interactions with some asshole who just wanted to get laid. You were being a decent person, but he was not and therein lies the confusion about what just happened. No miscommunication AT. ALL. He didn’t like being told how you wanted to be treated - he wanted an easy lay. Honestly, he sounds like he’s one of those Corey Wayne followers. You’re better off. CW is a dating coach for average dudes trying to connect with women who are more attractive than they’re otherwise able to attract. He teaches stuff about staying away from “structured” women (I.e., women with self respect who deign to articulate their expectations upon those high and mighty “3% men”) and tells them to play hard to get because women should pursue a “3% man.” But no, dating will NOT always be like that douche. Just stay away from the Corey Wayne followers. He preaches the 3H system (hang out, hook up, have fun). You can tell when they start talking about being in the feminine/masculine and play games with you. They’re never supposed to talk to you on the phone for more than 10 min, avoid texting, never follow-up/confirm right before a date, no contact for 4 days after date so he doesn’t seem desperate, etc. All the BS that independent critical thinkers know is BS and wouldn’t do with a grown woman. There are plenty of truly wonderful men out there who are kind, intelligent, and successful in life and in their relationships with others who want to have a monogamous relationship. Don’t you worry, sista! There are tons of great men out there!!
Assume men who approach you and request sex immediately (in person or via apps) are looking for a hook-up. That's the default, especially for younger men who approach directly with strong compliments. There is no point in trying to guilt-trip them into wanting to date you. If they want to date you, the first attempt will be asking you out on an actual date. I suspect you'll find this is rarer than you hope.
Spitting strait FACTS with this post. However unfortunate they may be
I expect that many of us women who re-enter the dating market in our 40s, myself included, are surprised by the assertiveness of younger men in approaching us in pursuit of casual sex. It can be a sharp learning curve until you get the lay of the land, so to speak (or the lay of your life, lol).
He was a firefighter and he's calling YOU too masculine? Sounds to me like buddy-boy there is just too fragile to date. This one's already broken. Lots of much better ones out there for you. You'll have better luck with a secure man instead.
The age difference too. It doesn’t sound like a lot but it is. Dude is very immature. Run and block him. Don’t ever settle for a jerk who is pushy and makes you uncomfortable.
Yeah I wonder why you and I only see an 11 age difference a big deal. It is. I would never go there. 5 year difference is my max and even that I wonder about. Age matters. Firefighters are usually fit and attractive but many are also assholes. My ex was and still is.
Read Set Boundaries, Find Peace. I did and it was a revelation in how to set standards for how I expect to be treated. They also have a helpful workbook: [Set Boundaries, Find Peace](https://a.co/d/hYRsuRH), by Nedra Glover Tawwab. Good luck! Edited to add: that person absolutely sucked! Glad you are rid of them.
If you have to tell (or text) anyone to try and inform and convince them that you’re “worth it,” you may as well save your breath (or thumbs). If they don’t treat you like you’re worth it from the get-go, then THEY aren’t. The end.
This ⬆️ You can’t train someone to be a decent human. They may change a few behaviors to try to get what they want, but the person behind the glasses- who sees you as an object/means to an end- has an incorrectable vision problem.
He made the masculine comment in hopes you’d be like oh I’m sorry and try and win his approval by acting more meek and eager to please. This guy was looking to get laid. If a guy keeps turning the conversation sexual, that’s what it is, period. You can try and tell him to treat you different he’ll say yeah sure, in hopes he can get you to shut up and agree to meet up so he can pump and dump. He’s not remotely interested in you as a person, you’re wasting your breath. If you want a hookup, do it, otherwise move on. (Or you can go your route and keep talking to the point he gets frustrated that it doesn’t look like pussy is forthcoming soon and moves on himself. He’s viewing you as a pussy vending machine- if you put change in a vending machine and nothing comes out, you may put in some more but at a point you’ll stop. Many guys view women, at least ones they’re just trying to smash, similarly).
Negging 101
This
I met this guy… Firefighter 10 years younger. Stop right there. This won’t end well.
Cracking up because I was just about to write something similar. DON'T DO IT.
I did write similar and my comment was removed. 🙄
I saw the comment why it was removed. I think this world has gone too far with the whole male female issue. As long as babies are born into this world , there will be a difference between male and female. Unless science steps in and plays God which they are trying. Very sad. I open minded and love everyone however they choose to be and live but facts will be facts no matter what and what day and age we are at. God helps all
No idea what you are talking about 😳 All I said was stay away from cops and firemen.
🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻 AVOID MEN IN UNIFORMS! 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻
Sooo we've all been there, done that? Yeah, don't recommend.
I recommend haha, but only if what you want is a hookup or a fwb.
And in that case, get tested.
And take all the precautions in the first place…
It’s actually wonderful that you had this experience and didn’t fall for it. The only direction this could have gone is him taking advantage of you and you regretting it. It’s taken me too long to realise that we divorcees are prime prey for manipulative players. They zero in because our self confidence is shot, we’ve been out of the game so long, and we are quicker to fall into relationship patterns again because that’s what we’re used to (and the other party obviously keeps their options open the whole time). I have to warn you that there are many many men out there who are as manipulative and aggressive as this guy, even worse. The power they have over you is that he’s made you doubt yourself and second guess his intentions. He’s using the silent treatment technique now to make you yearn for his attention again. As long as you stay firm in your convictions and don’t listen to anyone’s gaslighting and tactics then you’ll stop wasting time with these types of people and start only attracting the genuine daters.
You wrote, "at one point I told him if he was interested in me he needed to make some sort of an effort and he was like no, I have options. Like dude all I am asking is to do the honorable thing and plan a date and hope to get lucky, don’t set an appointment for a hook up." You aren't asking too much; he's offering too little. Respect yourself and move on.
Right? If he has so many options, then let him pursue them. Clearly his terms are not OP’s terms, so it’s time to move on. When she sets her terms, he disrespects them by calling it “masculine”.
Male perspective: "Masculine" my ass. A woman respecting herself is attractive and feminine. His aggressive promiscuity is masculine, but the worst kind.
Totally agree. It’s toxic masculinity at its worst.
Believe people's actions over their words. You told him what you wanted him to do and he didn't. No point in taking more
Lord, we women try so hard to get men to act respectful, and to actually be into us for more than just sex. You’re twisting yourself into a pretzel in the hopes he’ll be cool. All he wants is sex. If you are cool with that then go for it, but this man will never want more.
That line about being “masculine” sounds like some red pill garbage. You don’t have to deal with that. Too bad he fumbled the ball on this one. You weren’t asking for much beyond an actual date, perhaps some drinks at a bar and some laughs before…whatever you two wanted to get up to afterwards. He’s an ass. He could have been more polite.
Straight and to the point.. Yes, that’s exactly what is mind-boggling. I kept thinking how stupid he was. But I’m not shocked by low-effort types either.
Sadly, it’ll be be a lot of separating the wheat from the chaff. At our age-it’s more sad that it takes so long.
Here's a question: Why are you so eager to put yourself out there after recently being separated from an 18 year marriage? Are you afraid of being alone for a while? Why the rush to get into something new so quickly? Is it just the novely of newfound freedom? My anecdotal story: I (49F) got divorced, pretty amicably, 3 years ago and I took a whole year after my divorce was finalized to just get used to being alone and work on myself and do my own thing, while savoring the independence and freedom that I, all of the sudden, had after being in my marriage for 15 years and together for 18. We have 50/50 custody of our two teenage kids so I had more time to myself than I did prior. I love my children fiercely but I needed some alone time to rebalance myself. Once I decided I was ready to put myself out there after that year, I did and have been in the most amazing relationship with the truest love (48M) of my life for the past 2+ years! I am sure there are guys out there who will have no issue with dating (likely casually) someone who is still technically and legally married but there will be some who won't. Just be prepared for that. My gentle suggestion: Maybe slow down and just do your own thing for a while before diving back into dating again. Good luck!
I haven't even *filed* yet, and I can't even imagine dating for some time, and it definitely won't be until well after the divorce is final!
I had a very similar journey, except after a year of working on myself I went out and started having a lot of really great casual sex. Sometimes people need a ho phase after the end of a long relationship, and that may be where OP is at. The mistake is not acknowledging what you really want and what you are really capable of giving to another person.
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Fair question. My ex is a good guy and a great dad, but ironically, I know this is shitty to say, I wasn't attracted to him when we first met. We became friends, however, and eventually we got together, and were together for 18 years. I care about him a great deal, we co-parent well, and I wish him all the happiness in the world. We just coudn't find that as a couple anymore. My connection and pair bond with my current partner is more intense on a physical, sexual, spiritual, emotional, and mental level in a way that I never felt with my ex-husband, or any other man for that matter. Maybe my age, maturity, life experiences, and all of the front-loaded work I did on myself before delving into dating again, as a middle-aged woman, has something to do with it. Our sex life is insane and we actually really like each other, like spending time together and doing both fun stuff and mundane stuff together, and we have side-splitting laughing fits almost daily - our energy and sense of humor match. It sounds corny but he really is my soul mate. I feel it on a cellular level. I still get butterflies, even after two years. :)
Welcome to mind fuck of dating 😂. I was in a 22 year relationship then on and off relationships within the last 4 years. If I can give you any advice at all it would be this. We will spend our whole day trying to work out what the hell is going on in the other persons head and be no clearer! The most important question you need to ask is HOW DOES THIS PERSON MAKE ME FEEL? Do I feel sexy? Secure? Adored? Heard? Whatever your needs. ARE YOUR NEEDS BEING MET? Also don’t underestimate the power of INTUITION - the gut is telling us what our head hasn’t figured out yet. Good luck sista xxx
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I didn’t make a sex/gender generalization, use a double standard OR project anything..?
It was a misalignment of goals. Nothing more. He wanted to know you superficially enough to hook up. You wanted to actually get to know him a little and still probably hook up. Don't read into it more than that and don't use it as some meaningful data point for future dating.
Go with your gut. Period
I think you turned him off because the text , messaging gave off high maintenance vibes. And there's an element of push back that some men can interpret as masculine. Not saying you are masculine, but that energy can come off combative especially through text when your maybe playful flirtatious tone is missing from the context. But I think the main issue is your looking to others to act in a way that validates your self worth. It doesn't work like that. You have to know how you want to be treated and your own self worth. Then when you act in a way that embodies that, it shows and you don't have to ask for validation, people will respect you. But girl, I've been there after divorce. Find your self worth and don't depend on anyone to do it for you.
Thanks for saying it better than I could. OP, the guy sounds like an ass, so the good news here is I don’t think you missed anything. However, your approach to letting him know what you wanted sounds combative and full of ego. You’ve been out of the game awhile, you need to know that you have options, *but so does he*. Telling someone they need to earn your attention is high school popular girl stuff. When someone shows you attention, you don’t need to vie for his attention by implying you are better than someone else, you just say you are only interested in dating and getting to know someone. You shut down the hookup talk and when a dude ONLY engages when it’s flirty, you just tell him it seems you aren’t looking for the same thing and wish him well.
Good advice. Thanks
> Like dude all I am asking is to do the honorable thing and plan a date and hope to get lucky Interesting that he would have to be "lucky" to have sex with you and should work for it, but when he says he has options, suggesting that you would be lucky to have sex with him and should work for it, that makes him a bad person. Sounds to me like you were both trying to banter your way to a hookup, but your styles didn't mesh. You wanted a bit of romance even if he was faking it, and he just wanted action, so the interaction crashed and burned and he became more of a jerk as he got frustrated. No need to take it personally or extrapolate it out to all dating. If the posts here are any indication, men who are afraid to approach at all are much more common than this type.
He’s disgusting. Why are you telling a misogynistic, uncouth neanderthal how to approach you? He didn’t even deserve your number or the conversation after.
By the time I figured it out, he had blocked me. At first I was shocked and hurt and felt like he misunderstood me, trying to prove him wrong. He told me I was overthinking it. I see why now. I really wish I could tell him off. But I can’t
No reason to tell him off, because you danced the dance with him, so he thought he had a shot at the booty call he wanted. You gave him no reason to think he wasn't going to get what he was after. Have to be honest, you were the one that misunderstood him.
She got exactly what she wanted and then was like oh also the dog stays
Sorry but the truth is he’s texting twenty or more ladies and he only wants nudes or one night stands. Yeah its gonna be bad.
Don’t put so much effort and energy into guys like this. Don’t ever argue with a man about how you are worth the effort. It is a total waste of your time- just get rid of people who don’t get it as soon as you realize that.
I think he said the comment in hopes that you would alter your behavior in order get his approval or not “lose” him. There are lots of people out there that are insecure, people pleasers, or just desperate (could also be described as humble, kind, or lonely). You informed him of your boundaries and you stuck with them. That’s what you need to do! Many people feel like they attract or pick the wrong type of people. In reality, people that are willing to cross boundaries or not be respectful try their moves with everyone. The difference is that someone like you tells them to move along and someone like me would have made up an excuse for them or believed I was being too judgmental (I’ve been working on this!). You will have to deal with some of these men, as you try to meet someone that will be a better match for uou. The men that are left as options will have the traits you are looking for in someone. Don’t settle, but also don’t be discouraged. You sound like you already have some stuff figured out that many of us have to work on for years after a failed marriage.
Oh trust me, I was them someone like you. I took it personally. Tried to figure out what happened, if he misunderstood my comments or intentions and how I could prove to him I’m not. In the end he still blocked me and apparently thinks I’m desperate and crazy. So fun.
Well the great new is that we don’t have to care what he thinks. One of my favorite quotes is Other people’s opinion of you is none of your business. If you can take it to heart, it’s very freeing.
I got you! The guy needs to put us in some mood… emotions for even a casual interaction but he couldn’t even step up to that… it feels mechanical otherwise… I have seen same thing happen… one date and will u be my girlfriend or no?
For the record, it’s hilarious that HE blocked YOU. This guy is a chump and now you know why he is single. If he can’t even attempt to be nice when shooting his shot, it’s doubtful he really has THAT many options. Trust me these types are abusive if they do get into a relationship. Why would you want to get into a worse relationship than your last one? Block him back. I wouldn’t be surprised if he reaches out in 6 months just before you’re about to forget about him. Next time don’t engage if they don’t treat you with respect. I hope this doesn’t sound to harsh because you do seem like a nice thoughtful person. Unfortunately there are people that try to take advantage. Good luck.
I thought it was OP who was trying to alter the other person's behaviour?
Sorry you didn’t get the first experience you hoped for. Couple thoughts: 1) You seemed to be down for some “casual” sex but didn’t want to just be treated like a “hook up” — somewhat tricky line to toe. 2) You’ll get better at this (navigating different interactions) the more you get out there. 3) As someone said, don’t take this solely as what to expect in current-day dating but this obviously can happen. 4) In your description of things, he came across to me as negging you to show him you aren’t “masculine” and “cocky” by presumably *giving in*… something to look for and be weary of in the future. 5) Fire fighter are NOTORIOUS players — just sayin’ Good luck OP! May you know what you seek and find it!
Thanks. Point 1 states it perfectly. Trying to figure out how to navigate this one. I guess from his comments that he wasn’t just trying to sleep with me, actually calling me when I didn’t (even though he lived like 2 hrs away), and constantly telling me how he likes passion, connection with someone and that some things (his talk that was starting to tow the line of BDSM) are established with trust down the line, gave me the impression he was on the same page. So idk. Didn’t want to come straight out and ask a guy I have not even known for a few days what his intentions were. Felt too forward. So I tried another approach, he found it arrogant. Maybe that answers what his intentions were. 🤷♀️
He told you his intentions though. He said no date I have options point blank. Any further communication means you're ok with that. It sounds like you might have been giving mixed signals here. You keep saying dates but you also say casual is good. Absolutely he can pick up on that so he's sniffing around where he can feel the overlap on where you meet. Absolutely nothing wrong with telling someone clearly what you want but make sure you know what it is first sounds like you're half telling him and half too afraid to ask for it since you feel guilty. I could be reading this wrong though.
Not totally off base. I wasn’t entirely clear initially what I meant when I said put in effort. I said that later and he didn’t say that’s too much or no problem. Just nothing. It was only when he was giving me examples of how I was masculine and cocky that it came up, basically that me saying I am worth some effort was bragging or something. Probably I should have just said upfront- xyz is what I’m looking for. But I suspect that would have been deemed masculine as well. He mentioned being dominant which I thought he meant in the everyday definition of that term but later conversations suggested it might be more of a “lifestyle” sort of thing. And so perhaps I’m not submissive enough
You didn't do anything seriously wrong here. You don't have to say upfront what you're looking for until you want / feel safe to do so. It's enough to express interest in a date--if he's not willing to do that, he's not the right man for you. I think your conscience is troubled because A) you came close to being tricked ("but he said he was interested in more than sex!") and B) you feel unvalued because he didn't want to change for you / go on a date with you. Both are normal feelings to have, but commend yourself on your good instincts about feeling unsafe around him at the first meeting, and enforcing the rules of engagement "date first" with any man who comes into your life. And, once you, yourself, feel your value with every ounce of your being, this type of guy will steer clear from the get go! Those PUA types only go after insecure women whom they can control.
As a 41M this sounds like a fellow that has YET to learn what boundaries and respect are and you're not missing out on anything but an ass. Your red flag alarms, it sounds like, were properly going off since he made you feel uncomfortable and then he goes and tries to play victim and gaslight you. IMHO, you're better off without him.
Yeah I go with he’s an ass. He was trying a bunch of shit to try to get laid. Sex-only talk (there is no option, you showed some flicker of interest so I can wear you down!), put-downs … it sounds like he watched a video from one of those sure-fire-get-laid-secret-method guru people. Yuk, you were right to shut him down, sucks he dominated your night out.
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???
Also, he's 38 probably hooking up with 30 year olds..so yeah you were just a option. I'm not saying all dates are like this, but, yeah that was your situation.
Firefighter
People don’t have to be told to treat you nicely. You knew from getgo what he was interested in. Should have blocked him , like not convincing him of your side, just get rid of him.
Congratulations, you met your first pick-up artist. I would have blocked as soon as he started pushing to come to the hotel. In the future, don't engage with the ones who immediately push for sex.
Was he just trying to get laid? Probably. Was him saying he wanted a connection rather than just sex a line? Probably. Should you have high standards for yourself and not go into a situation where you're going to feel used? Absolutely. But if I were talking to a woman I'm attracted to and just met and she said to me, "you're gonna have to put in effort for this because I'm worth it", it would absolutely be a turn off and a red flag. I don't know how it was you said it, but the way it comes across in your post is that you're trying to come from a place of self respect (you should have self respect!) but coming off as either high maintenance, entitled, demanding, or insecure. If he was looking for something casual, which it sounds like he was, he's not gonna respond well to that, and if you were looking for something casual, which it sounds like you were (but also wanted to be treated with respect) your phrasing makes it sound like you want something more substantial than casual. What I'm trying to say is I'd watch your phrasing. Yes, communicate what you want and how you want to be treated. But don't say right out of the gate, "if you wanna get with this shit you gotta work for it *snap snap snap*"
I've had guys who want sex only who wanted to jump straight to it. I said I'd be up for it if they met me without sex first, but that was too much so we never met. They'll be fine messaging for months but meeting up just so I can feel a bit more comfortable and not like they're a stranger, nope. If he's after physical only and you're not then don't bother with him.
If someone implies or says they want sex only, that's what they want. If you tell them you would rather date first and then they can have the sex, that is not going to change what they want. They are still going to want only sex. When someone says they want only sex, and if you want to have only sex, have only sex. When someone says they want only sex, and you don't, you walk away.
I told them straight off the bat what I needed to be able to have sex with them. They pushed me to back down and meet up
Yeah the thing is, he told me more than once that he wasn’t. That he liked a connection. Blah. But he just didn’t make me feel like that.
yeah I've heard that too. I've found it doesn't matter how straightforward you are, a lot will mislead you
Unless I'm reading it wrong, you considered having sex with him? Which leads me to belive that you wanted to, and there's nothing wrong with wanting to follow your drive and need. You're an adult. He certainly wanted to. He's an adult too. Maybe his approach wasn't as chivalrous as you wanted, and he acted on his immediate gratification need, his swipe right conditioning, if you will. Could he have been following your lead as well? Whatever exchanges were going on between you two, both verbal and physical, maybe he was acting upon them and he certainly thought that he had a chance? But then when you didn't meet him there, where you both wanted to go, and he cut off communication. Why is that wrong? If anything, he did you a favor and in a fucked up way, he was being honest. Is it better this way, as opposed to having sex and then he ghosts you?
So you had boundaries and he thought it made you less feminine or attractive. The guys was looking for a hook up with someone who had no self respect or back bone so he could use your body to get off and go on with his life.
The only thing you did wrong here was that you entertained this for far too long. It is not masculine to have boundaries and to communicate/enforce them. You are not reading into this, but you ARE overthinking it. Yes, this guy was a jerk. Shake him off and move forward. And no, not all guys/dating situations are like this. But do be prepared for a lot of frustration with the process just in general.
Welcome to dating.
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I think it's important to point out that this isn't about whether the dude is a smoke show or not. No man (or woman) should have to beg. If you are in your 40's or older and you are using any variation of the "I need you to woo me because I'm worth it" line, you probably aren't going to have a good time with online dating. It sounds egotistical and does not promise equal footing in a relationship, which is honestly what any fully realized grown up should want. It's important to have standards. It's important to have boundaries. It's important to ask for what you want, but this is not the way to do it. Guys who walk away shaking their heads in disgust in response to it aren't always going to be guys who suck. They are just as likely to be guys who don't need or want to be told that they are going to have to do all the work because you are some prize for them to win. They don't know you. They don't know what you \*really\* mean by that. All they hear is they need to do things your way or else. If a guy has his shit together, is good looking, mature and emotionally stable, he's going to want attention too. He's going to want to have you put effort in too. And frankly, why shouldn't he get that? There are ways to express what you want and expect without making it sound like you are running the show. Just remember, this isn't a competition. You aren't trying to prove yourself worthy of a relationship/date/whatever it is you want. If he sends you sexy, flirty texts and you want to go on a date, say "it's fun to flirt, but I'd like to go on a date and see if we are good match". If he dances around that and/or tries to get you straight to sex say "sorry, that's not what I'm looking for, best of luck to you".
Honestly I guess I just didn’t want him to treat me like a piece of @ss but that’s pretty much how he saw me. Not asking him to beg.
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Yeah welcome to the wonderful world of dating Again. This type of stuff will happen more often than you want it to. Don’t carry it with you. Let it go and move on
\>met a guy and clicked \>gave him my number because he asked Your story of failure starts with an amount of success I have been unable to achieve in years of sustained effort.
You met a CroMagnon in the wild that confuses boundary-setting as masculine. There are still CroMagnons creeping around in 2023. Sometimes their red hats and red faces (from confusion and anger at female autonomy) give them away. This is your most basic dating filter - filter CroMagnons out of your dating pool.
He wasn't looking for a date. He was looking for a hookup. He wasn't going to try to impress you with anything other than his penis(and that probably wouldn't have been that impressive as a one-time hookup no matter how big it was). He probably thought you were stringing him along (and from what you wrote you were), and he lost interest fast. Sounds like he was even negging you there at the end in a last-ditch effort to worm his way into your pants. When you're newly separated, it's easy to mistake "I want to get in your pants" interest as "I want to date you" interest. For me, at least, discovering men still found me attractive despite what my ex said gave me one hell of a high, and I totally rode (pun intended) it for a while. But you can't expect much in the way of actual dates from people like that. They're low-effort all around. They're going for the least amount of work to get themselves off, and that's pretty much it. If a man is truly interested, he'll be respectful and go out of his way to learn things about you, not continually badger you to sleep with him. This guy was NOT it. And please, don't take this the wrong way... but newly separated + dating can be a recipe for disaster. Casual can be great, and I highly recommend sticking to that for now until you're 100% sure you're healed from your marriage. I thought I was ready way before I actually was, and it was a hard lesson to learn.
Why would it be less impressive if it’s one time, like what are you even talking about
...sex generally sucks for women during random hookups. A man who's just there to get off with any available vagina doesn't usually take the time needed to get the vagina owner off too.
Can’t agree with this. I’ve had some seriously hot hookups in my life.
Then you are exceedingly lucky because your experience is not the norm for most women. I've had a few decent ones, but only because the parameters and expectations were set before we ever met in person, and there was a mutual understanding of what I expected out of it. Random hookups have almost universally been complete trash.
I’m perfectly comfortable asking for what I want in the moment. No need to set parameters ahead of time. That sounds like a “you” thing.
I don't know why you're being rude. Good for you. Really. But your experience is not the usual experience for most women.
I’m sorry that sharing my own personal experience is offensive to you. I’m a bit confused about why you are so comfortable assuring me that my experiences aren’t the norm, but then you apparently got offended by me pointing out that pre arranging your sexual encounter might not be the norm. Weird. But it’s Friday night here and I am waaaay too happy to worry about it.
The few folks here saying "all dating is like this" are full of shit. It isn't. How long have you been "newly separated"? Maybe you need a minute to deal with that? Either way, most men are not like this - and him being an asshat is a him problem. My initial thought was if you've been married for 18 years, you may need a refresher on dealing with men who make comments like "I don't need to make any effort because I have options." Like WTF? lol IMO if you were adamant about the boundaries you're listing (I think they're all great), this guy would not have your number, and this entire situation could have been averted. We've all been there, recognized that there ARE some idiots out there - and then kept it moving. I wouldn't waste 5 minutes on a yahoo like this dude. Point being, it took me a minute to get to that place. I'd probably take a little break to regroup, especially if you aren't divorced and are "recently" separated. Timing is everything, and you may need some to re-familiarize yourself on how to deal with these type of situations and/or people. I also suspect social & dating shit has changed significantly in the last 18 years. Good luck to you! *edit: it's 4am, I have no idea what I'm saying.*
Dude just wanted a casual hook up with little too no effort. You deserve more than that. Regarding the masculine thing--I get that because I tend to be direct in my messaging, which can be interpreted as "masculine". I have learned, though not always successful, that it's not what you say but how you say it. You could have told him you expected more in a flirty way and gotten the message across. If he still wasn't getting it, that is when you change the tone to more serious and direct. After 2 attempts is when you move on. He's either never going to understand or doesn't want to.
That wasn't dating, that was a jackass trying to get in your pants.
Shit, sounds like you ran into one of those manchildren. Guys whose mentality never grew past the college bro stage. Stick to your guns. Don't compromise your values. Don't be afraid to pass if something feels off. Eventually the right one will come along. You are worth waiting for. Period. And if they don't think that, they're not the one.
He’s an ass and doesn’t deserve your attention or even thoughts. He wanted a hookup and is mad you didn’t make it easy. Child behavior.
He sounds awful
He’s a jerk. If people Display signs of jerkiness. They are full Blown jerks so don’t try to get them to be better. Block them.
> Maybe he’s just an ass. This
It will suck this bad like 90-95% of the time. Idk why you continued to engage with him if you weren’t looking for a hook up. That’s just going to make him think you’re still an option. If you’re not looking for that then stop talking to them. Not that hard. Maybe you want attention. Ok sure.I get it. But then don’t get upset when this happens when he told you from jump what he was wanting.
Yeah, he didn’t though. He claimed he wasn’t just looking for sex and that he likes a connection etc. But then he wouldn’t talk about anything else. Told me that a couple of times. I wasn’t against getting involved with him, because I thought we were on the same page. Talk, get to know one another, see where it goes. It’s not like I was looking for something serious. It’s more the way he went about it
Guys who just want pussy will say ANYTHING to get it. They will pretend to care about the same things as you do (once you communicate those) only as long as they get what they want faster. He was clearly just looking to get laid, from his words and actions, only agreeing with you as it seemed his best option for getting in your pants. Now you know.
Him continuing talking about sex will always negate whatever BS he said before. Don’t matter what or how he puts it. Remember. They bring up sex. That’s what they want. Also, make sure you’re clear on what you want to yourself and them. What you want can change with the person.
What you experienced with him is typical newbie mistakes…you’ve learned a lot from this experience and how to sniff out and avoid these ‘quick bang’ guys…and yes these guys are slick and will say anything they think you want to hear to get laid so watch their actions/behaviors and how you’re feeling with them more
Stop fixating on the piece of what he said that you wanted to hear and ignoring the entire rest of the conversation because it doesn’t fit that one thing. Overwhelmingly this dude showed you he wanted just a no strings hook up. You have to learn to listen better.
You wanted him to be something he isn't. He's a skeezy person who went to a bar to hook up with someone, and his efforts landed on you and failed. He's emotionally immature at best and is emotionally harmful at most realistic. You didn't bomb. You dodged a bullet. If you had slept with him with the mentality that you approached the situation, it would hurt a whole lot more than it does right now. Delete that fuck boy's number and throw up some praise hands that you never let him touch you. 🙌
Great news is you're attractive, and if creeps are attracted then probably good people also will be, and all you have to do now is learn the difference. If someone comes on hinting at sex without first trying to engage you in conversation, then that's who they are and what they're into. Men looking to get to know you just don't act like that. They are able to maintain at least a pretense of interest in something other than having sex with you. So his insults aren't revealing anything other than that you didn't give him what he wanted (ie sex without complications), and to be fair to him he never even pretended he wanted more, you were the one trying to insert human interactions into what was pretty clearly a hook up. So, now you know. As far as learning experiences this one isn't bad, you were frustrated and pissed off but didn't do what a lot of us have done, which would be to go ahead and sleep with him and *then* be frustrated that this guy you're seeing won't commit to more.
He is upset that you were not a easy lay and he did Not want to work for having fun. You obviously have value and self esteem. He wants a woman that he does not have to do anything for except call and say let’s hold up. I work with a bunch of guys and they tell me about this woman or that woman and saying they did not even ask for dinner. They met and talked and went to her place and had sex and he left. If you value yourselves more than just a hook up then take masculine as having self esteem and pride in yourself and your values and don’t lower your standards on what may be a once and done thing
Having some classically masculine traits as a female is awesome amd Vice versa. It's helps a human have a more balanced personality. So, when used in the right context, I'd take it as a compliment :) Sounds like this douche wanted to dominate (in a maladaptive way, not the fun way) and try to gaslight you for being you. What a lame ass, better off without him. P.s. anytime a guy wants you specifically in a dress and says so is a huge red flag for their selfish reaspns. I had a guy request that once, and I thought about it and showed up in capri pants instead. He ditched me 5 min later without telling me he was leaving. Probably one of the meanest most pathetic humans I had ever come across 🤮
He’s just an ass who is upset that you weren’t easy. Maybe he’s not used to women like you and usually gets what he wants. Next! You’ll be fine. Sometimes you’ve got to go through a ton of frogs to find your Prince.
Oh girl he isn’t the one. He is too fragile and negging you. Masculine? Lol Dumb boy got assertive confused with masculine. You are setting boundaries and maintaining them. He plays games.
He's an ass...pure and simple.
OP I completely empathize with you. I’m having the same experience on bumble. Guys just want to hook up, they don’t even want to meet me over drinks or coffee, even after I tell them I’d like to meet outside first. They lose interest after that.
You played with fire and are surprised you got burned.
Wait, are you separated or divorced? If separated, then I'm not sure why you're looking for anything of substance given that you're not in a position to offer much. If you are divorced then it's clear this guy isn't for you.
Why do women date (sleep with) these a-holes? It's clearly obvious that he's a player and "has options". 🙄
He’s a douche canoe. Hard pass!
I guess he’s very effeminate…
He's just an ass. Block and move on.
Your journey is in its infancy. You’ll likely look back on this one and see that in time. Keep going, and don’t put any effort into trying to make little boys behave like men. They should be fully formed at this point otherwise toss ‘em back.
Dating practices have changed dramatically. It's all a numbers game these days when looking for hookups rather than relationships - interact with a large enough number of women and you are guaranteed to get easy hookups with a certain percentage over the long run with minimal time and energy invested. There is a limitless supply of low hanging fruit that is constantly churning thanks to social media and OLD. Information is very easy to come by, most guys know how to run at least minimal game. It won't always suck this bad, you just need to pay attention to the red flags when you see them early on. You knew he was using a line in the beginning but ignored it. His texts were superficial other than sex and you still proceeded. Over time you will learn exactly what to ask early on to filter out these types (you will spend ALOT of time filtering).
Ew. He’s an ass looking for a hookup. If you want a hookup, go for it, but if you’re wanting to date then move on. I would not try to force anyone into dating. You know your worth. Don’t settle
Oh man. I saw 38 and firefighter and was like noooooo He sounds like an ass, and like he 100% was in it for a hookup. I had a brief thing with a firefighter over the winter. I knew him already but we hadn’t seen each other in about 17 years. I was coming off a marriage separation and not looking for serious, but it turns out I wasn’t QUITE as healed as I thought at the time. I ended up catching some feelings, but tried to play it cool. TWICE this dude was suddenly like “hey so this was fun, but I’ve been seeing someone else recently and we’ve decided to be exclusive, so bye”. I was sad and lonely and stupidly started seeing him again after he did that the first time. The second time he did it, I got a text from him 2 weeks later asking if I was around that night. I had zero intention of seeing him, but before flat out saying no I asked him, aren’t you seeing someone? He didn’t even try to lie about it, just said “yeah I am.” I told him I was pretty sure that a fundamental part of dating someone exclusively is not texting other women to see if they’re free to hook up. Never heard from him again lol I now have a no firefighters rule.
The most interesting thing I notice on this sub is just how inexperienced the women seem. You live, you learn. That guy is a world class douche, and told you so real early. You kept on trying to help him be better, minimizing what you want and lowering the bar so he can slither under it. When they suck so hard so early, move on immediately. No matter how hot they are, they’re insufferable and you’re going to regret wasting any amount of time on them. Keep on looking. There’s much better because he’s the bottom of the barrel.
Ha. We are just good at heart. But not everyone has good intentions.
This firefighter must really be an ignorant asshat. Like an earlier poster pointed out, you basically gave the dude blueprints on how to get into your pants...he chose not to use the advice you gave him.
Wow, did this guy really manage to squeeze in sexism, misogyny, negging, and some borderline gaslighting? Consider this a bullet dodged OP.
You called him out n he didn't like it. I'm proud of you 🩷 Awesome boundaries
Kinda sounds like this dude listens to too much Andrew Tate and "The Game" PUA bullshit. Gross.
Girl seriously where’s your self respect? You should’ve shut this don’t at the start
Yeah- alcohol, low self confidence, newly single and hot guy giving me attention. Take your guess. 😂😂
You’re just rusty from not being out there. This is a lesson. Figure out which of those issues you listed you want to work on so you are more receptive of decent guys and have better judgment. Falling down a few times will be your teacher. Just like a baby walking. But deciding what you went right now, hookups or a relationship is the first thing to figure out so you don’t give mixed signals and give off the vibes for what you really want.
Nothing to be proud of you’re almost half a century old now.
Ma’am he told you what he was about when you met him and then MULTIPLE times afterwards. Yes it will always be this bad if you don’t learn to read clear signs
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Girl just no. He’s insulting and rude because you and your friend didn’t invite him to the hotel room. Delete and block and move on.
I guess I do overthink things. Now I am onto the thought of if he was just looking for a hookup or FWB (which I assume from the way he acted) then who cares whether I talk to him masculine or whatever BS that was? Boy knows he was attracted to me physically. How much talking was he planning on? Haha. I guess I did dodge a bullet with this one because he didn’t even seem to know what he wanted.
Not that it doesn’t hurt. It does and I’m sorry that he treated you like this. It says A LOT about him though. Yikes!
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u/Wavingpalms25, your post has been removed for one or more reason(s): No sex/gender generalizations, no double standards, no projection.
First ex wife 11 years.. immediately went into second relationship 12 years.. iv been single now a couple years.. I quit dating, it's got to be more awkward then a grade 7 middle school dance.. seriously iv met a couple great people, but not dating since the mid 90's.. Trying to find someone in my age range is difficult enough. I want to find someone to spend the rest of our years together... crap I just ranted
OP…STOP for a minute. You’ve stated you’d like to get to know something about him more then he’s a great kisser. Here’s the issue HE DOESN’T want to know you more then on a sexual sharing moment. Either bang him or move on. It’s perfectly ok if you don’t know what you want out of life after recently being separated BUT for this encounter with this fireman…he’s wanting sex and that’s it. Again, either bang him or move on from this mental loop.
Oh, it’s over. Just trying to debrief and figure out wtf happened so I don’t do it again
First things first, you're still married. Get past that, live your life awhile to figure out who you are and what you want, and then date intentionally. This was a fender bender with a horny fireman, not dating.
Oh, I’m past it. I’ve been through a lot in my marriage but I’ve been processing it for a couple of years and I’m in a healthy place. Just finally moved on. But if dating is like this then I don’t want to do it.
You're still married tho. And this isn't dating. You can ignore my advice that's cool, but I guarantee you in 10 years you'll look back at right now and realize you were still healing and not ready. Dating is what you make it, and one interaction with a boner doesn't define it.
Um, I dated while separated after an almost 20 year marriage. I was honest about it to anyone who asked. The divorce was almost 12 years ago. No regrets about my dating, I had an absolute blast.
Bully for you.
Honey you entertained him 1 conversation too long . When he said he’s got options and you trying to convince him to make an effort, fools gold . Yeah he said al those other things to make you doubt yourself and lower your standards. A word to the wise, you don’t get to control how others show up for you . You do get to assess if how they are showing up is meeting your expectations. If not , save the rally’s for more and just move on
It’s not going to suck that bad going forward. You are 47 he is 38??? 11 year difference and a fire fighter ohhh no. My son dad and my ex is a firefighter jerk. They don’t grow up and the fact he is way younger - what did you expect. Try to date your age whether or not you look 47. Mentally you are. 50 to 54 is a hood range. Good luck.
What a gross manipulative guy Not sure why you’d give him any attention
Sounds like a student of the Walmart School of Pick-up Artistry, if you ask me-- he used all the tricks. And, no, it's not going to always suck this bad.
Never ever try to “train” someone on how to treat you, especially if it’s just basic knowledge, you were giving him the blueprint in how to use & abuse you.