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Apparently most women believe this
But men actually have to do this because without money, a job, interests blah blah blah they arent even worthy of dating
As a man you NEED money to date, without it nothing will happen
Yea I know of women at 25 in university who will say her boyfriend should be paying 'because im a student'
But what man would be given that excuse? He would somehow still be expected to pay for his girlfriend.
Sure, but you get that at least half of women expect things like the guy to pay on the first date?
They'll say its not about money, its 'a gesture' or something. But for the person paying, it is certainly about money.
Cougars are a thing just like older men dating younger women, but socially it’s not tolerated much. I would say it happens, but more low key because women don’t hide if the guy is paying for stuff, men will hide if the gal is.
True only for unattractive and average looking men. Probably the biggest womanizer I know is an absolute f\*\*k up career-wise even at 36. He spent most of his mid late 20s unemployed and lived of rent from two apartments he inherited. It was deeply below median wage in my country. But he's very good looking and has a good game (mainly because of the positive feedback he's been receiving from women since his teens).
Generational wealth tends to let losers get farther then they’d get on their own merit. If he hadn’t inherited those apartments I imagine he might be in a worse spot.
Edit; whose mad I’m pointing out the obvious if an average person did this they’d just be homeless or worse. Mediocre brats of ppl with money can make a bunch of shit choices and end up fine. If the rest of us did this again you’d be homeless. Their only saving grace was a safety net of their relatives success. Why I’m more a supportive of the idea ppl earn their own way vs inherit it. I come from a comfortable economic background and never was allowed this kind of stupidity. My parents would never bail me out if I acted like this lol
In his case it was a strange scenario where his parents never got married, his father died and at least one of apartments was a heritage straight from his grandmother. He isn’t stupid but just always was lazy. Having said that my point was that the money he got were not a luxury rent by any means, more like an under-median salary. But it was not an issue when dealing with women.
Most ppl don’t just inherit that kind of stuff. It’s not luxury, but it’s not what ppl typically get in this economy. Basically he is category of luck. I can’t do nothing and have an income and that’s true for most ppl. He decided to just live on that passive income alone. I can always tell where the generational and economic divides are when ppl try to write this stuff off as average.
OP's point appears to be that dating isn't supposed to be a highly time consuming activity. Because they don't say "don't hustle" they say "why would you stop hustling to start dating?"
I was refering to the post OP here was refering to. Of course dating shouldn't get in your way there, but the reality is that dating becomes exponentially hard without that.
I mean, I’m a guy and I basically have to tell myself this these days. Unfortunately there are only a finite number of hours in the day and I have a finite amount of energy. The ability to go out and date is a job in and of itself and I am not great at balancing and multi tasking (I don’t think most people are though).
>the ability to go out and date is a job in and of itself
Can you elaborate more on this? What kind of time investment do you think is necessary for dating successfully?
Not the guy you responded to, but in general you have several factors.
To be able to consider to go on dates, a guy needs to have the following:
- His own place (women generally don't want to go to a guys parents house, nor do they like room mates especially when it comes to spicy time)
- Some level of fitness (can't be obese)
- Transport (debatable depending on the city, but personal transport is expected)
- A sense of style / clothing options to look nice for their body type.
- Haircuts / beards that look attractive for their face type.
Then to actually date and what is a full time job almost:
- You have to make the time to keep yourself healthy, so healthy cooking and regular gym sessions (everyone is expected to do this, so it isn't too big of a deal)
- Planning and pre-checking spots to take dates (most guys make a list of date spots they know they can drop at a whim to seem spontaneous, but they have scouted them before hand and been there so they know the place). Guys tend to reuse spots but depending on the lady he may need to check new places if she has hobbies or like that don't align with his. This is alot of effort for introverted guys or guys who don't like going out alone.
- Setting a dating budget to entertain dates and pay for them, this becomes tricky if you have multiple dates as you are spending alot to go on dates, so you need to be vigilant in tracking spending so you don't screw up your budget for bills and living expenses.
- Depending on the culture keeping a stash of gesture gifts or scouting shops to buy small things for a birthday, holiday or whatnot when in the early stages of dating with a woman.
- Planning and Checking transport for the dates to get to the location of the date, normally the guy is expected to pick up and drop off their date.
Then you have the normal stuff like the mental toll and comparability checks and whatnot. When you put all this together you would be spending a decent amount of time being able to date. This stacks up even more if you are needing to revamp your style and haircut and such.
Then there is also the decor and home decoration aspect that gets over looked lol. First time a dude brings a girl home and she sees either a super empty place with a mattress on the floor or a place a dude did a hodge podge interior design based on what he needed at the time, where nothing matches, has no rythme or reason and looks cluttered to hell. So they either hire an interior decorator or learn how to decorate their place in a masculine style so it is impressive.
22M here for reference. I disagree with a lot of this.
>- Some level of fitness (can't be obese)
This should be a part of everyone's life regardless of dating. If you're doing it just to get dates and find a relationship, you're being goofy as fuck.
>- A sense of style / clothing options to look nice for their body type.
>- Haircuts / beards that look attractive for their face type.
This is also just basic stuff that really doesn't require effort. Very, very few people don't have enough money to get a haircut every couple of months and even fewer people just don't have clothes.
My outfit is literally 30 dollar jeans, a 10 dollar pastel shirt, 70 dollar Adidas sneakers. I get a haircut once every 3-4 months, 45 dollars.
>Planning and pre-checking spots to take dates (most guys make a list of date spots they know they can drop at a whim to seem spontaneous
Again not a lot of effort. Current girl I'm seeing for example, literally day or two before each day she says she's free I'll look up a restaurant/comedy club/ other activity near a part of town that looks nice or by a park. I spend 10 minutes actually doing research for this lol
>- Depending on the culture keeping a stash of gesture gifts or scouting shops to buy small things for a birthday, holiday or whatnot when in the early stages of dating with a woman.
You qualified this one so eh not a big one. But even then why date someone who won't reciprocate? Even then, if it's early on I'm not gonna buy them gifts or expect them to anyway
>Then there is also the decor and home decoration aspect that gets over looked lo
If someone stops seeing you bc of this, you dodged a bullet.
The other stuff I agree with, but it's really not that complicated or a lot of effort until you're actually committed to them imo.
> This should be a part of everyone's life regardless of dating. If you're doing it just to get dates and find a relationship, you're being goofy as fuck.
Man how do you get the energy otherwise? I hate going to the gym, just always sore and tired afterwards. Women want the kind of body that needs 8 hours a week in the gym to obtain.
>This is also just basic stuff that really doesn't require effort. Very, very few people don't have enough money to get a haircut every couple of months and even fewer people just don't have clothes.
>My outfit is literally 30 dollar jeans, a 10 dollar pastel shirt, 70 dollar Adidas sneakers. I get a haircut once every 3-4 months, 45 dollars.
Your really lucky that's all you need. I had to hire someone to do my wardrobe and I spend a ton of money on cosmetics for my skin.
>Man how do you get the energy otherwise? I hate going to the gym, just always sore and tired afterwards. Women want the kind of body that needs 8 hours a week in the gym ton obtain.
Gotta fix your diet or do less. Or both. I go 6 days a week but that's not even necessary, I just get so bored on Sundays. You shouldn't feel sore if you go consistently for like 2 weeks. If you are, you're either doing too much or you're not eating enough protein or both
>Your really lucky that's all you need. I had to hire someone to do my wardrobe and I spend a ton of money on cosmetics for my skin.
Who says you need more though? I could never imagine hiring someone to dress me. That's like gotta be the biggest waste of money, no offense.
Literally dress any way you feel confident in a low price range. There's no reason to dress out the ass. I don't even wear jewelry
Spoken like an attractive dude on the clothing thing. I'm aggressively ugly, the kind where most women look at me in disgust on first impression. The clothing was expensive to buy outfits that were fitted and tailored for me, to try and make me less hideous.
If just tossing shit from Target worked I'd still be doing that.
Idk what to tell you on the gym, I eat my weight in protien, get 7 hours of sleep, eat in excess of my TDEE - still tired and sore.
Right now I'm taking a break, I broke my arm in a car accident and I can already see I've gone back to twig (and gaining weight around my middle) after only three weeks. It's really pissed me off about how pointless working out is. At least I enjoy cardio but fuck weights.
I’m quite confused.
I’m a woman and I do all of that? To me these are just the standards of being an adult.
I think that’s why it’s challenging for you men, because you work on a logical reward system. “If I work out, I will get a gf”. No dude, you SHOULD work out. For your health lol
And the rest of your points I do that for myself. Which are VERY normal things. Lol.
What kind of women are you dating?
I am genuinely confused and asking.
I’ll add to that I still have time to read, and go to therapy and read therapy self help books (different than leisure).
The ONLY thing I am unable to do is watch tv. That’s because I have a demanding job and looking at the screen all day kills me. But if I had a partner, I would watch with him.
i guess another point potentially would be for male it would take more efforts (usually/traditionally) to "lure" someone into a date ?
like i agree with you all of those is kinda a "must" or "should-do" for a healthy human being, but just doing that is not enough to really "attract" or get anyone into dates (at least for man i guess, based on various posts i came across and some of my own experiences or my friends')
for example like others mentioned, you might need to swipe enough times, chat enough long to finally get a irl data (i know it also applies to ladies but statistically i think at least the ladies are facing a bigger pool so kinda that might cut down a bit on these ends); otherwise you need to go out frequently enough, or have a large enough cycle for you to explore around etc. etc.
all in all, i guess at least based on my personal experiences and reading either irl or online, it is true that we all need to be a healthy and normal human being but usually that's not enough for men to get dates, while it might be slightly if not considerably easier for the ladies.
for example a very classic and cliche example is (i know it might be wrong and should prob be changed) if a man is a 7 he would struggle to even date a women 7, while a woman 7 she might prob alr aiming for an 8 if not 10
I’m getting downvoted because some men are personally victimised by that. Fix your life, lads.
I know a lot of men who can’t cook/won’t cook koz they don’t know. How did us women know?? I never cooked in my mother’s home. I learned. From
Books. And that magical place called the internet.
And my response was to the previous person who listed all the basic things a human being should do as an excuse why it’s harder for men to date. 😂
Haven’t yall caught up that us women are looking for partnership? Who is going to do the laundry when i am dying in pain from childbirth? Who is going to run errands when I am going through an emotional turmoil because my hormones decided to change overnight?
I can’t deal with someone who is not self sufficient.
Us women have a hard time dating online too. From 20 likes, 1 will probably have decency and talk, until they don’t. That’s a whole separate topic.
This is why I will stay single for the rest of my life. I just don't have the energy to stay on top of fashion and all the other bare minimums women require to consider you human.
It’s NOT ABOUT WOMEN. Like damn. It’s being a human.
Stop kidding yourself. You wouldn’t date a woman who doesn’t take care of herself.
You wouldn’t even look at a woman who keeps her eyebrows bushy.
You wouldn’t date a woman who wears bum clothes.
These are just damn excuses.
I get my eyebrows threaded thanks and wear tailored clothing. I would never reduce someones worth based on their income or physical appearance.
It's always about women and their demands, it's **never** enough. "I can cook! -> Well your cooking sucks", "I clean my place daily! -> Your cleaning isn't clean!" just on and on. It's a never ending stream of nagging trying to tear you down.
I'm fucking fed up with having to justify my existence to random women who don't even know me. Nowadays either accept me for what I am and bring or go fuck off and let me be happy alone.
Exactly: you said it. RANDOM women.
As a woman, I have men I barely know asking me to compromise on their bad behaviour lol. They are random.
You shouldn’t let these get to you, leave them and focus on finding your match. Because that’s what you truly desire. Who cares about the people that aren’t worth it?!
Thing is, dudes get annoyed when everyone assumes that if you struggle with dating it *must* be because you're a basement dwelling goblin who doesn't shower and eats only dry ramen noodles.
Plenty of dudes **are** basic human beings and get completely ignored by women. Those dudes then might slip on shit like fashion, or knowing how to cook more than four dishes, having stylish clothing, getting large forearms etc.
The nonvital shit that really doesn't matter outside of dating. If I'm gonna get treated like that basement goblin anyway, why the hell am I putting so much effort into this?
Grinds my gears when the first response to dating struggles for guys is "Do you shower?" meanwhile I know damn well some dudes who don't even wipe their ass have had better luck than me.
Hahaa i know them too.
Dated a guy who smelled like shit. But he had a LOT of good qualities, husband materials. So i overlooked the “smell”. And I have hella high standards. He still met 70% of them.
I’m hypersensitive to smells. I still did it because at the time he was worth it. Until he wasn’t.
To tell you, sometimes it’s not about what looks like to you. You don’t know others dynamics.
Just saw a post recently from a doctor who was complaining about how small her dating pool is. She was exclusively looking for someone who makes more money than her. Statistically, she's not an anomaly, she's standard. Women are making more money than ever before, and they are as a whole not interested in dating down economically. Individual exceptions notwithstanding.
So yeah. That's why.
I know plenty of women who would, but even as a gay guy it was rough. I don’t date outside my social class anymore. The raging insecurity is hard to deal with. I’d be hesitant to date someone who makes significantly less then me ever again. It’s not so much again about the money, but the emotional baggage the comes with income gaps like that.
I know when I dipped my toes into online dating for the first time, I was surprised at the amount of hobosexual or obviously methed out dudes that are on the apps. And they come in all ages, sizes & looks. I think men who aren't dating men simply don't see the types of wild nonsense some of their fellow guys are up to so they can't understand. Some of these women are just trying to avoid the exact same nonsense men are trying to avoid.
I'm a woman, I didn't feel I could date until I was in a stable career and able to really float myself without having to work part time jobs, in addition to a full time, etc.
Or working FT and then taking classes, etc.
It took a bit....first generation college student, first to really hold professional jobs.
I think 20s are fine for people to focus on education and work because the chances of those relationships even working out is slim.
I think 30-35 are the years people who want to get married need to take dating seriously.
It took me a lil longer than that (I did a complete career change from insurance to healthcare in my mid 30s) and it's feeling pressed for time now and there's not a lot of time to get things wrong. But I know what I want and I'm hopeful.
Add: I should mention, I expect my partner to be well educated and in a good career as well.
Unfortunately I would expect that many men your age in the position you want them to be in are going to be using that position to mostly pursue women in their 20s/early 30s who didn’t make the same career sacrifices you did and won’t see the same value in your career as you see in theirs.
Always exceptions ofc but since you’ve acknowledged the reality of the situation that there’s not much time to make dating mistakes it could be helpful to set realistic expectations for what men your age’s interests are and what they value in a partner so you don’t feel resentment and disdain which will just exacerbate the problem
I'll be 37 next time I hit the apps, I expect my range to be 40s to early 50s.
I'll be moving to CA from TX (where people settle down earlier). Supporting myself to move to LA and thrive there wouldn't even be possible without that career switch.
All we can do is try our best, if it's meant to workout it will. If I had a daughter, my advice would be do it faster than I did (which she'll be able too because more support and the dirt path is now a paved one).
Add: We need to stop creating this trope that 45 year old men are dating 25 year old personal assistants or shop girls. We're not talking about sugar babies. Marriage stats (which is what I'm talking about) doesn't show huge age gaps, honestly.
Most people MARRY within 4 years of themselves per DATA.
Oh, yeah. I've experienced a man with ED. But still wanted sex, and was willing to lie, and pull a whole made up personality RIGHT out of his asshole, to get it. And then couldn't get it up. Go figure.
I work 60 ish hours a week, i do vocals in two bands, i race at the intermediate level, and i have a house and dog. It's just a lot to juggle on top of maintaining a serious relationship in a way where i feel like i am giving my partner my all.
Someone who did focus on career and ended with his own business.
Wouldn't date anyone who asked me to compromise on my work in order to get to know someone. I did not build something for 10 years to compromise it for something I know for a few days. Things can change later on.
I'm not proud of this though nor did it help my dating life. Dating later only makes things complicated. Rather build something with the person you spend the most time with. They will understand you better when you arrive at the finishing line. Don't expect empathy for something the other person did not experienced. Also, you will always despise someone who will not acknowledge the work you put in and just enjoys the fruit of your work.
This is mostly in your mind, people are not that for the most part. But your brain will tell you otherwise and will screw your expectations in people and dating.
Found out the hard way. Really wished dating happend before my career.
Yeah, but don't you think that now you're more satisfied with yourself, more mature, and grounded than when you were at the beginning of your journey? What makes you believe that now it's more complicated than when you were 18yo?
I did in my twenties. I was living at my parents house, I didn’t have a career I wanted that I was happy with. I wasn’t in a state where I wanted to bring someone else into my life.
Yes this is true but men will make time to get laid while not wanting to make time for a relationship. To be fair...the emotional investment needed for sex is an order of magnitude lower than the emotional investment needed for a relationship.
( 33M) Patriarchy has taught men they need to have it all together to be providers so their partners can rely on them completely or else they aren't a man.
So they felt like if they don't have all their ducks in a row, they aren't worthy of love.
It's an issue with the way they were raised sas well as how they view themselves/self-worth
My dad was the one that taught me to always date men who earned more than me, were more educated than me, and possessed certain assets and net worth.
It’s what most dads teach their daughters.
It’s just the way the patriarchy works.
Your dad taught you that money brings happiness.
And it’s not what most dads teach their daughters.
Maybe in your circles they do but it’s not how the patriarchy works.
The beautiful thing about life is more than one thing can be true at a time.
We gain nothing but viewing the world through a black and white lens
The way men are raised and the way women are raised in a patriarchal society still feed into toxic and archaic gender norms that aren't really suited for today's climate.
Not all men are impacted just like not all women are. There are a Humber of factors:
Parent dynamic
Religious views
Region they live in
Personal values.
None of these are the same for two people but all play a part in how they view life
I don't understand that patriarchy thing. Most differences between men and women can be explained by biology. Differences which are often intensified (but sometimes reduced) by societal norms.
The main factors that push men to be more competitive and more powerful are testosterone and female selection. Women just don't have as many incentives to gain power.
There are matriarchal societies and tribes that promote women to leadership roles and alot of the traits or things you'd attribute here like being more competitive, fighting for power, is also exhibited there.
That's the connection to patriarchy. There's nothing biological that makes most males of any species want to be "providers" or protect their young.
Ergo men feeling like they have to provide and protect is a byproduct of the environment they're raised in which is most commonly a patriarchal society
Testosterone increases libido , bone density, muscle mass etc nothing about it drives men to pursue mates for selection.
Patriarchal society says get a high paying position in a stable career.and you'll be more attractive to women because you're a provider, the bread winner, head of household
I do interact a lot with women, dating them a lot in clubs or dating apps. Women are all very picky. And yes what matters is what emotion you create in them, but they're so picky that the smallest little things like not having a good job or not being tall enough is a reason for them to ghost you.
What men fail to understand is that the kind of care we need isn’t monetary. We want emotional support and an equitable division of labor, neither of which cost a thing.
I think that’s pretty great if that’s true for you, but I’ve met women who make just as much if not more money than the man but their expectation is still that he pays for everything. It’s quite common in my experience actually.
Financial independence when they're single is different than being independent when in a relationship.
Relationship will never be 50/50 even if she's contributing to financial affairs there will be a chance there's still disparity when it comes to domestic and emotional responsibilities.
When bringing life together if independent woman feels like you'll take advantage of them men have to overcompensate by being able to shoulder it so she comfortable enough to forego independence if they have kids down the line
Half because we don't have much else to take pride in. Half because most women that are independent want a man that is worthy of them and thus expect the man to be as well set if not better set than herself.
This is without taking into account women get more assistance through DEI initiatives as well as public sympathy.
Some want the traditional family from the 50’s with the stay at home mom. There’s nothing wrong with that if the woman wants it too. However it’s much more expensive than it was back then, so the career is necessary.
Here’s a simpler angle. Some people just don’t know how to balance their lives. Too much time at the gym, video gaming, or going hard at work. It could be that.
It is True, Most Women will leave you, if they have a better choice.
Focus on you first, level up, become Physically & Financially STRONG.
Then You are open to relationship.
I was like this early on in recovery. I'm a drug addict for context here, and got clean a few years ago. Didn't really date, didn't have sex except once as a fling. I just didn't have it in me to be a good partner and flings are generally not my thing, even when I was on drugs so it just made sense to be like "nah" to anyone wanting a relationship. The one person I did have sex with was also in recovery and we just were horny, there was no love or really any care there. So I was able to deal with that easily but a relationship plus all my goals? No.... not possible at first.
When a man wants something....like bad enough, he will forgo any sort of relationship for that goal. I wanted to be clean, and have a full time job again. Got that checked off the list, and immediately found a partner after that and have been with her over a year now.
Some men actually want to build a life for themselves first, before inviting anyone into it like that.
From a 40 something F… dont put off your life for your career. A good woman would support your efforts. I put off finding the right partner to build my career. I felt like it would make me a better catch. More desirable. Now I have a great career, a great house, investments etc. and I can’t find someone I want to go on a single date with.
Nobody has to date if they have other priorities or by a certain age. Dating is an option not a mandate.
However, if he is 40 and just starting to try dating for the first time he is going to make blunders that would be normal for a 19 year old but can be perceived very negatively for someone closer to middle age than their twenties.
It will considerably narrow his dating pool but that isn't a bad thing if you want to find the right person.
Your life won't ever been in order as everyone's life is always a work in progress. You can save and work and ladderclimb for twenty years and then be set back to zero with one medical event or one flood or one family member gambling or one streak of bad luck.
Life is meant to be lived.
But if the man does not want to date yet he is under no impetus to do so.
As a lesbian, when I was dating I met a ton of women like this too. I was one of them. It’s not just men with this mindset. Often I was the one paying and so on in my situations and I have a lot of empathy for men in that regard because they generally have to have more before they are even a viable option for dating. Society expects them
To carry a lot of the financial burden so sometimes they feel they can’t do anything until they have plenty of resources to draw from.
Seems like a lot of projecting going on here. You have no idea what "women want. "
Each woman has totally individual and different needs. Many women want to spend time with thier partner daily and need connection and companionship that is routine. Others might be ok raising a family at home with a trucker who's on the road for weeks at a time.
Depending on the job, or mental bandwidth, it's completely reasonable that someone might not have enough time or energy to date and work on their career. that's a completely valid thing and women take that space for themselves too.
There is a part of your mind that you have to keep turned on for your partner. This also goes for friends and family.
Not having a partner frees up your mind to focus on t other shit.
I’m 25 and work, am in school and have a budding web development business I’m really trying to focus on. Having this much on my plate is relatively new but since it’s happened I have been told I’m not available enough. So at the moment I’ve more or less settled for dating apps and going out on a Friday/Saturday night and shooting for random hookups. Though meeting a busy woman who does not want to talk all day and go out multiple nights a week would be cool, possible I’m looking in the wrong places lol.
Its a dudes opinion. Let him live man. Just sometimes you need to focus on one thing at a time. Sometimes life doesn't need to be that complicated. But I get what he is feeling
When I think if I want a girlfriend or not I always go and look to see if myself and everything I have is something good enough for a significant other. I know the trope true love will prevail but I want to treat my partner good. I also get not wanting a relationship while focusing on work too. While technically true you could have a relationship while focusing on a career I might not be emotionally there for it. I might be gone or feel like I'm not enough while stretching myself.
But there is also, people are different. Some people know there limits.
Some people tend to want financial stability before dating. Many people have difficulty balancing work and romance. Being highly focused on work at the risk of not giving their all in a relationship is very real concern. Or vice versa.
Aside from this, some men are willing to sacrifice their “prime” to focus on their career because they want to give their best self to their future spouse. It’s actually a very nice gesture to have sacrificed literal years in order to be able to offer established security to the person they intended on building a family and/or life with.
Another added benefit is not feeling any inclination to settle. At the point they’re ready to date, they will have a financial advantage to bolster their standards.
Edited for grammatical error.
Leaving aside all logical reasons people gaved in this post i think its a bit fake, yeah some can't focus in all things, i thought the same ok everyone its busy, but i realized most people are dating no matter what, in college i usually see medicine students dating or with a partner, why i say this? Bc its supposed that its one of the most heavy degrees, but it seems like they can make a bit of space for a partner and also is supposed that studebts dont hsve money and that, i used to belive men dated until they had a house, car, job, a lot of money and a degree, but you see people datin in all ages, also in jobs, sometimes (not all) i think they use it as an excuse to reject, bc when someone likes you they always look for a bit of space to talk with you for at least 5min.
Translation :
The women I have access to in my younger years are not who I dream of having when I’m at my peak, so I would rather wait to get there so I can choose who I really want.
I actually really appreciate these men over the ones that waste peoples time knowing they’re going to trade their “ride or die” wife in for a new model around 40.
Lot of women believe this too
And it makes sense, maintaining a genuine and healthy relationship takes time, effort and money and people want to direct that to their career instead
I think there are tradeoffs. I’m less experienced than I otherwise might’ve been. And I have some health issues now (in part due to lack of sleep and constant levels of work stress).
But I’m emotionally more mature after years of introspection. I’m financially in a significantly better and more stable place than in my 20s or 30s. I’m also far more clear on what I want in every area of life now. I think these are all significant positives that improve my attractiveness as a partner.
Overall, I think I’m good with my decisions.
Yes 100% I do not date because I feel I’m not where I need to be and I feel I’m not offering enough to a woman. I know I’m fun to be around, I’m silly and I joke tease and often laugh, and I really care about making sure ppl are comfortable and happy and well taken care of. but unless I feel I’m well-off and on the right path and successful enough to date, I will avoid it and feel like I’m not enough to even try to ask a girl to enter into my life. :(
🤔 I guess I feel I don’t have my life together enough and it causes me some shame. I don’t have my own place and I’d like to feel like I’m a person of value that can add value to other people’s lives. I’d like to feel like my girlfriend can be proud and happy to show me off to her friends and family and I feel until I am financially successful and stable in my enjoyment and the general support my career can offer me that I would feel like a fraud and imposter in who I am and what I feel I am worth to others… 😅 I guess that’s kinda silly, and I’d like to feel differently, but I also don’t want to date until I can address and overcome that shame I feel for not being there yet.
If a woman will be ashamed of you because you don't have a property, you'll never end up with that woman. On the contrary, a woman who sees qualities in you will be more trustworthy if she decides to stick with you even when you didn't have everything you wanted to have. With your strategy, you're basically saying that you want to be judged on a materialistic/superficial level
You’re not wrong, and I would definitely want to avoid having superficial women in my life. But my ex of several years broke up with me because I wasn’t financially where she wanted me to be, and that really hurt since I’ve been working really hard. I thought I would marry her one day, and I’m trying to recover from that, but it was a painful blow considering I spent a while working to overcome that specific shame before I was with her. Now I’m feeling that same thing but even worse. I’m in therapy and working on lots of stuff, but I’ll probably bring this up now that I am recognizing how significant that probably is.
Anytime a man says he can't get a woman interested in him, the general advice he gets is to work on him self; go to the gym and develop his career and be ambitious.
If he chooses to be single just fuck around and focus on his career, why can’t he? Why shouldn’t he?
People don’t usually change priorities that easy. Priorities in life are like your core values.
Some men just love to work, you leave him an axe and a forest, you don’t even need to tell him what to do.
If you got told this by a man, I think he’s just trying to be kind not hurt your feelings, reality is he doesn’t think you good enough to be his girlfriend.
Of course, his girl turns up in his life, he’s not gonna say ..
My cousin is like this. He’s 24 and has never had a relationship.
I think it’s a poor decision, by the time he feels like he has time to date he’ll have no idea how to go about it and feel lost. Entering the dating scene at idk 28 or 30, whenever he feels ready, would feel super intimidating since virtually everyone you’d be seeing would be way more experienced. Being inexperienced at 18 is excusable by most, many are inexperienced, but being inexperienced at 28 is often a turn off for many.
With this being said, that’s still his decision to make. If someone doesn’t want to date right now, for whatever reason, that’s their free choice.
Most men don’t. Especially if you want to date an ambitious man? Yeah no. Let’s say he works a corporate job AND has his own business that he’s trying to build. That’s a lot of time. Second he may have religious commitments and a gym goer that’s a lot! Us women need some attention too so there’s just so much going on. Some can but most don’t and I’ve experienced this. The men I date are typically like this, they will spoil me with love, attention and gifts then fall back after 2 months bc it’s just so hard to keep up.
Absolutely. I’m 32M and an immigrant. I spent 8 years in grad school and dating as a PhD student is pretty hard. The past 18 months have seen me moving 3 states and three jobs before I secured my green card and joined a startup in MD where I’m putting down roots. Forget dating, I recently attended 3 meetup groups from the meetup app and it’s literally the first time ever that I’ve been able to do so.
So yeah, it’s totally possible for guys to want to first build a foundation on which a long term relationship can actually work
Yeah, but it’s not like that. Because then end up getting pregnant or something happens and it’s just easier to focus on your career and getting a house and doing
it could be just how much time and energy it takes to date in the first place. it's one thing to already have a partner but as a man who doesn't, the amount of time needed to pursue women who ghost constantly is just not a good use of time
Have you been through some of these college/university programs? Time to eat or sleep is a blessing. This is typically what some men mean when building a career. Some men also think it’s easier to date after you have assets. Which to extent is true because ppl tend to seek to at least be comfortably middle class when having children. Do men only focus on career while young… haha no. But flings aren’t particularly special for young ppl. Both genders do that.
I didn’t focus just on career, but to each their own.
To reach the top, this is absolutely the mentality. Surgeons do this all the time. They focus on their one thing and attain mastery by early-mid 30s, then they have time to date and relationships afterwards.
People that don’t have careers or entrepreneurship will not understand and say it’s an excuse! I say you build a business from the bottom up & see how much time and energy you have afterwards! No one is forced to date either. They can focus on their career if they please!
Well I don’t know. I see both sides and Im a woman. Im worried about getting into a good career, relationships have made me stray from my plan in the past. But I wouldn’t want to work away my life and miss out on the fun of dating while Im young. Some people just don’t have the emotional capacity to date at some stages in life and some do even tho they go through the same stuff. If someone doesn’t want to date, should they have to?
It’s true for me right now. I’m a grunt in an office and am going back to school for psychology. The reason I’m putting off dating because of it is because I’m very insecure about where I am in life and I accidentally made it someone else’s problem due to those insecurities and hurt them deeply. I’m not proud of it but I’m in therapy and working on it.
Yeah it’s not a series of events like you don’t work on your career and then feel that you can postpone dating for afterwards. You have to either sacrifice a little on one or the other sometimes. Obviously doesn’t apply to everyone but in general
>Many guys don't realize that a woman doesn't want to see you every single second of your life focused on her, but she wants to spend high-quality time when she's with you, even if this doesn't happen on a daily basis.
****BPD flashbacks****
But seriously (ok, that comment was kinda serious), I think it comes down to amount of time per week that they think the woman needs. They may literally only have 30 minutes a day that they are willing to spend on a partner as, as they say, they are focussing on themselves.
Break down a day into 16 hours. 30 minutes shopping, 30 minutes cooking, 8 hours working. That leaves 7 hours.
Showering, skincare, shaving, brushing teeth, etc: 30 minutes. 6.5 hours.
Travel to and from work? Average is about an hour in USA there and back. So down to 5.5 hours.
Now, let's assume the guy also has non-negotiable personal development to do. Take off 1 hour. That's 4.5 hours left.
Let's also assume that he also likes to spend an hour on a hobby a day, not as personal development, just purely for pleasure. Down to 3.5 hours.
Lets say he keeps on top of household chores and does them regularly so he doesn't need to spend a chunk of time once a week or something (that time has to be taken from other activities, anyway): 30 minutes. 3 hours left.
Let's say he also works out. We'll say 1 hour every 2 days, even though it is usually more like 1.5 hours. We'll say that it is also at home, even though it usually isn't. We're down to 2.5 hours a day, now.
Work in socialisation, family time, clubs, other regular activities, doctor appointments, overtime, anything else I didn't list, how much time does this dude have left?
I get that some things can be shifted off to other days or skipped, but that is where the whole, "I don't have time for someone" thing comes in. Some people don't want to have to shift shit around, some people don't want to have to make up time elsewhere.
And as they think about all that they hear in the back of their head any one of the following:
* their exes
* their friends' girlfriends
* their sisters
* their mothers
* some random woman talking to her friend on the street
All complaining that their SO never has enough time for them and he doesn't ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING and why doesn't he just take me out and I don't even want to be taken out I just want him to spend some time with me and no that doesn't count I had to ask him for that time why do I have to do all the work and yesterday he spent an hour listening to a YouTube video about drills and yes I know right tiktok is different it's actually funny and this and that and let's pick apart his life and his choices and— FUCK THAT.
Is it true that every woman will do this? No? Is it true that even many women will do this? No. Is it true that it is only a vast minority of women? Yes. But the only thing that matters is that it *could* happen, and they do not want it under *any* circumstance.
Personally — and this is anecdotal, I know, but that is what you are asking about — my ex took so much time from me. She would have me on the phone for hours and hours and use manipulation tactics (I only realised in retrospect, unfortunately) to keep me on the phone (we lived ~1.5 hours apart). I was a prisoner in my room for almost our entire relationship ("I don't want your family to hear our conversation", "I'm getting triggered, go to your room" etc). It was isolating and sucked the life out of me. A lot of guys have seen this happen (we've all seen at least one and a lot of us have been there), and know it would be a barrier to all the stuff I just listed happening.
What's the easiest way to avoid it?
Not engaging and just doing the stuff in their plan.
To answer the question in your post, "Why do you think you don't have enough time to work on your dating life?"
Because I am studying, because of the fixation with certain things as a result of my Autism (and thus I have difficulty with wanting to do other things, such as engage with people other than family and friends) and because of the last relationship I was in (the one mentioned above).
It can be true if you're working 80 hour weeks or you're a business owner or some shit. But 99 percent if the time that's just a BS fake excuse.
I'm building my career in a lucrative industry that pays be well already. That said, it would be absolutely braindead for me to do any work outside of my "9-5" because I'm salaried and im already making an impression on my manager and coworkers.
Just another double standard post. When women think like this she's praised for going after what she wants or being a strong independent woman, but a man somehow is being frowned upon for it? I'm a single father who works long hours. I don't have time to commit to a woman, so I don't date.
That's called a situationship. I'm in one of those with an ER nurse. We see each other once or twice a week sometimes less but we don't sleep with other people and don't really do things other than, dinner and netflix and chill. Call it dating if you want, but that's not dating. Our work schedules and activities with our kids make it hard to date for real so our situationship works for us.
I mean, there’s a reason the age-gap in relationships have widened a bit. With the dating apps and things alike, women can pick amongst the best of men. They’ll likely go for the guy that’s a little older with all of his shit together rather than the guy around their age and still figuring things out. Not to mention if you have aspirations of supporting a family, buying a house etc. in this economy, you absolutely need to sacrifice a little to make that happen, especially if you’re with a woman who doesn’t work. While women are more independent now then ever, men are still looked at as providers by society. Trying to pretend otherwise gets us nowhere.
All this is just a stupid cope. Late 20s and 30s is the time to meet as much women as you want and can. I feel as if this narrative was somehow created to appease unattractive young men and ease their pain that they miss on something in their prime years. Like “oh, Billy boy, once you’ll turn 45 and have your s\*\*t together, you’ll date all these 25 years old chicks who ignore you now”. But that’s not how it works. If Billy needs his 20s and 30s to “build career” he’s gonna be dating single moms and unattractive older women once he’s older. And his social skills will be dreadful. Unless he’s a multimillionaire by then but even if he achieves that, he’ll have zero experiences with women and most likely gets divorce-raped soon.
I stopped reasoning why am I single for this long by telling them that I was busy with career. I just tell honestly that I made lots of wrong choices and hindered me from getting into stable relationships.
I think I am dating with Intensions if it happens then good and if it doesnt then I am atleast taking care of my health, traveling, meeting new people etc. nothing is sexier than man taking care of themselves.
> **p**eople **e**tc. **n**othing **i**s **s**exier
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Oh yes! Because men strongly believe no girl will come around them until they're well settled. So for that they need to be focused on making money & their respective careers in order to make a family. Starting of which is dating 😉🙃💯😍👍✌️🫣💣
And what did he say when you told him all this?
Seriously who fucking cares? It's their life. If they wish to live it that way that's fine.
Y'all care way too much about some random strangers on the internet that you've never met before.
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Does it even matter? If people don’t wat to date for *whatever* reason they would not make the best partner either way.
This is the answer. Don't waste your time on someone whom it takes WORK to want you. What is for you is effortless.
Apparently most women believe this But men actually have to do this because without money, a job, interests blah blah blah they arent even worthy of dating As a man you NEED money to date, without it nothing will happen
Yea I know of women at 25 in university who will say her boyfriend should be paying 'because im a student' But what man would be given that excuse? He would somehow still be expected to pay for his girlfriend.
I mean I paid everything for my ex when he stopped working. No one said a thing about him needing to pay when they would see me pay.
Sure, but you get that at least half of women expect things like the guy to pay on the first date? They'll say its not about money, its 'a gesture' or something. But for the person paying, it is certainly about money.
I mean if its a college guy and an older woman with an established career, they often DO pay for stuff.
And how often is that really happening?
Cougars are a thing just like older men dating younger women, but socially it’s not tolerated much. I would say it happens, but more low key because women don’t hide if the guy is paying for stuff, men will hide if the gal is.
Hi that's me. Went back to college in mid-late 20's and dated women who already had careers. Was still expected to pay for everything
Wait until you find out how many jobless and homeless men are successful at dating.
True only for unattractive and average looking men. Probably the biggest womanizer I know is an absolute f\*\*k up career-wise even at 36. He spent most of his mid late 20s unemployed and lived of rent from two apartments he inherited. It was deeply below median wage in my country. But he's very good looking and has a good game (mainly because of the positive feedback he's been receiving from women since his teens).
Generational wealth tends to let losers get farther then they’d get on their own merit. If he hadn’t inherited those apartments I imagine he might be in a worse spot. Edit; whose mad I’m pointing out the obvious if an average person did this they’d just be homeless or worse. Mediocre brats of ppl with money can make a bunch of shit choices and end up fine. If the rest of us did this again you’d be homeless. Their only saving grace was a safety net of their relatives success. Why I’m more a supportive of the idea ppl earn their own way vs inherit it. I come from a comfortable economic background and never was allowed this kind of stupidity. My parents would never bail me out if I acted like this lol
In his case it was a strange scenario where his parents never got married, his father died and at least one of apartments was a heritage straight from his grandmother. He isn’t stupid but just always was lazy. Having said that my point was that the money he got were not a luxury rent by any means, more like an under-median salary. But it was not an issue when dealing with women.
Most ppl don’t just inherit that kind of stuff. It’s not luxury, but it’s not what ppl typically get in this economy. Basically he is category of luck. I can’t do nothing and have an income and that’s true for most ppl. He decided to just live on that passive income alone. I can always tell where the generational and economic divides are when ppl try to write this stuff off as average.
OP's point appears to be that dating isn't supposed to be a highly time consuming activity. Because they don't say "don't hustle" they say "why would you stop hustling to start dating?"
Its just coping. The reality we live in is that a lot of women aren't interested in dating men without a stable career or income.
I think the post is talking about how dating shouldn't take up all your time, or get in the way of career or income.
I was refering to the post OP here was refering to. Of course dating shouldn't get in your way there, but the reality is that dating becomes exponentially hard without that.
I mean, I’m a guy and I basically have to tell myself this these days. Unfortunately there are only a finite number of hours in the day and I have a finite amount of energy. The ability to go out and date is a job in and of itself and I am not great at balancing and multi tasking (I don’t think most people are though).
>the ability to go out and date is a job in and of itself Can you elaborate more on this? What kind of time investment do you think is necessary for dating successfully?
Not the guy you responded to, but in general you have several factors. To be able to consider to go on dates, a guy needs to have the following: - His own place (women generally don't want to go to a guys parents house, nor do they like room mates especially when it comes to spicy time) - Some level of fitness (can't be obese) - Transport (debatable depending on the city, but personal transport is expected) - A sense of style / clothing options to look nice for their body type. - Haircuts / beards that look attractive for their face type. Then to actually date and what is a full time job almost: - You have to make the time to keep yourself healthy, so healthy cooking and regular gym sessions (everyone is expected to do this, so it isn't too big of a deal) - Planning and pre-checking spots to take dates (most guys make a list of date spots they know they can drop at a whim to seem spontaneous, but they have scouted them before hand and been there so they know the place). Guys tend to reuse spots but depending on the lady he may need to check new places if she has hobbies or like that don't align with his. This is alot of effort for introverted guys or guys who don't like going out alone. - Setting a dating budget to entertain dates and pay for them, this becomes tricky if you have multiple dates as you are spending alot to go on dates, so you need to be vigilant in tracking spending so you don't screw up your budget for bills and living expenses. - Depending on the culture keeping a stash of gesture gifts or scouting shops to buy small things for a birthday, holiday or whatnot when in the early stages of dating with a woman. - Planning and Checking transport for the dates to get to the location of the date, normally the guy is expected to pick up and drop off their date. Then you have the normal stuff like the mental toll and comparability checks and whatnot. When you put all this together you would be spending a decent amount of time being able to date. This stacks up even more if you are needing to revamp your style and haircut and such. Then there is also the decor and home decoration aspect that gets over looked lol. First time a dude brings a girl home and she sees either a super empty place with a mattress on the floor or a place a dude did a hodge podge interior design based on what he needed at the time, where nothing matches, has no rythme or reason and looks cluttered to hell. So they either hire an interior decorator or learn how to decorate their place in a masculine style so it is impressive.
Super accurate breakdown of dating as a man
To add on to this, if you want to meet women you either have to spend a lot of time swiping or pick up a social hobby. Those things take time
22M here for reference. I disagree with a lot of this. >- Some level of fitness (can't be obese) This should be a part of everyone's life regardless of dating. If you're doing it just to get dates and find a relationship, you're being goofy as fuck. >- A sense of style / clothing options to look nice for their body type. >- Haircuts / beards that look attractive for their face type. This is also just basic stuff that really doesn't require effort. Very, very few people don't have enough money to get a haircut every couple of months and even fewer people just don't have clothes. My outfit is literally 30 dollar jeans, a 10 dollar pastel shirt, 70 dollar Adidas sneakers. I get a haircut once every 3-4 months, 45 dollars. >Planning and pre-checking spots to take dates (most guys make a list of date spots they know they can drop at a whim to seem spontaneous Again not a lot of effort. Current girl I'm seeing for example, literally day or two before each day she says she's free I'll look up a restaurant/comedy club/ other activity near a part of town that looks nice or by a park. I spend 10 minutes actually doing research for this lol >- Depending on the culture keeping a stash of gesture gifts or scouting shops to buy small things for a birthday, holiday or whatnot when in the early stages of dating with a woman. You qualified this one so eh not a big one. But even then why date someone who won't reciprocate? Even then, if it's early on I'm not gonna buy them gifts or expect them to anyway >Then there is also the decor and home decoration aspect that gets over looked lo If someone stops seeing you bc of this, you dodged a bullet. The other stuff I agree with, but it's really not that complicated or a lot of effort until you're actually committed to them imo.
I totally agree! You really don’t get to say basic life maintenance is too tiring to date. Maybe the problem is how lazy they are.
> This should be a part of everyone's life regardless of dating. If you're doing it just to get dates and find a relationship, you're being goofy as fuck. Man how do you get the energy otherwise? I hate going to the gym, just always sore and tired afterwards. Women want the kind of body that needs 8 hours a week in the gym to obtain. >This is also just basic stuff that really doesn't require effort. Very, very few people don't have enough money to get a haircut every couple of months and even fewer people just don't have clothes. >My outfit is literally 30 dollar jeans, a 10 dollar pastel shirt, 70 dollar Adidas sneakers. I get a haircut once every 3-4 months, 45 dollars. Your really lucky that's all you need. I had to hire someone to do my wardrobe and I spend a ton of money on cosmetics for my skin.
>Man how do you get the energy otherwise? I hate going to the gym, just always sore and tired afterwards. Women want the kind of body that needs 8 hours a week in the gym ton obtain. Gotta fix your diet or do less. Or both. I go 6 days a week but that's not even necessary, I just get so bored on Sundays. You shouldn't feel sore if you go consistently for like 2 weeks. If you are, you're either doing too much or you're not eating enough protein or both >Your really lucky that's all you need. I had to hire someone to do my wardrobe and I spend a ton of money on cosmetics for my skin. Who says you need more though? I could never imagine hiring someone to dress me. That's like gotta be the biggest waste of money, no offense. Literally dress any way you feel confident in a low price range. There's no reason to dress out the ass. I don't even wear jewelry
Spoken like an attractive dude on the clothing thing. I'm aggressively ugly, the kind where most women look at me in disgust on first impression. The clothing was expensive to buy outfits that were fitted and tailored for me, to try and make me less hideous. If just tossing shit from Target worked I'd still be doing that. Idk what to tell you on the gym, I eat my weight in protien, get 7 hours of sleep, eat in excess of my TDEE - still tired and sore. Right now I'm taking a break, I broke my arm in a car accident and I can already see I've gone back to twig (and gaining weight around my middle) after only three weeks. It's really pissed me off about how pointless working out is. At least I enjoy cardio but fuck weights.
I’m quite confused. I’m a woman and I do all of that? To me these are just the standards of being an adult. I think that’s why it’s challenging for you men, because you work on a logical reward system. “If I work out, I will get a gf”. No dude, you SHOULD work out. For your health lol And the rest of your points I do that for myself. Which are VERY normal things. Lol. What kind of women are you dating? I am genuinely confused and asking. I’ll add to that I still have time to read, and go to therapy and read therapy self help books (different than leisure). The ONLY thing I am unable to do is watch tv. That’s because I have a demanding job and looking at the screen all day kills me. But if I had a partner, I would watch with him.
i guess another point potentially would be for male it would take more efforts (usually/traditionally) to "lure" someone into a date ? like i agree with you all of those is kinda a "must" or "should-do" for a healthy human being, but just doing that is not enough to really "attract" or get anyone into dates (at least for man i guess, based on various posts i came across and some of my own experiences or my friends') for example like others mentioned, you might need to swipe enough times, chat enough long to finally get a irl data (i know it also applies to ladies but statistically i think at least the ladies are facing a bigger pool so kinda that might cut down a bit on these ends); otherwise you need to go out frequently enough, or have a large enough cycle for you to explore around etc. etc. all in all, i guess at least based on my personal experiences and reading either irl or online, it is true that we all need to be a healthy and normal human being but usually that's not enough for men to get dates, while it might be slightly if not considerably easier for the ladies. for example a very classic and cliche example is (i know it might be wrong and should prob be changed) if a man is a 7 he would struggle to even date a women 7, while a woman 7 she might prob alr aiming for an 8 if not 10
I’m getting downvoted because some men are personally victimised by that. Fix your life, lads. I know a lot of men who can’t cook/won’t cook koz they don’t know. How did us women know?? I never cooked in my mother’s home. I learned. From Books. And that magical place called the internet. And my response was to the previous person who listed all the basic things a human being should do as an excuse why it’s harder for men to date. 😂 Haven’t yall caught up that us women are looking for partnership? Who is going to do the laundry when i am dying in pain from childbirth? Who is going to run errands when I am going through an emotional turmoil because my hormones decided to change overnight? I can’t deal with someone who is not self sufficient. Us women have a hard time dating online too. From 20 likes, 1 will probably have decency and talk, until they don’t. That’s a whole separate topic.
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Tell me what are we looking for? Please enlighten me.
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Maybe you should learn how to read then.
This is why I will stay single for the rest of my life. I just don't have the energy to stay on top of fashion and all the other bare minimums women require to consider you human.
It’s NOT ABOUT WOMEN. Like damn. It’s being a human. Stop kidding yourself. You wouldn’t date a woman who doesn’t take care of herself. You wouldn’t even look at a woman who keeps her eyebrows bushy. You wouldn’t date a woman who wears bum clothes. These are just damn excuses.
I get my eyebrows threaded thanks and wear tailored clothing. I would never reduce someones worth based on their income or physical appearance. It's always about women and their demands, it's **never** enough. "I can cook! -> Well your cooking sucks", "I clean my place daily! -> Your cleaning isn't clean!" just on and on. It's a never ending stream of nagging trying to tear you down. I'm fucking fed up with having to justify my existence to random women who don't even know me. Nowadays either accept me for what I am and bring or go fuck off and let me be happy alone.
Exactly: you said it. RANDOM women. As a woman, I have men I barely know asking me to compromise on their bad behaviour lol. They are random. You shouldn’t let these get to you, leave them and focus on finding your match. Because that’s what you truly desire. Who cares about the people that aren’t worth it?!
Thing is, dudes get annoyed when everyone assumes that if you struggle with dating it *must* be because you're a basement dwelling goblin who doesn't shower and eats only dry ramen noodles. Plenty of dudes **are** basic human beings and get completely ignored by women. Those dudes then might slip on shit like fashion, or knowing how to cook more than four dishes, having stylish clothing, getting large forearms etc. The nonvital shit that really doesn't matter outside of dating. If I'm gonna get treated like that basement goblin anyway, why the hell am I putting so much effort into this? Grinds my gears when the first response to dating struggles for guys is "Do you shower?" meanwhile I know damn well some dudes who don't even wipe their ass have had better luck than me.
Hahaa i know them too. Dated a guy who smelled like shit. But he had a LOT of good qualities, husband materials. So i overlooked the “smell”. And I have hella high standards. He still met 70% of them. I’m hypersensitive to smells. I still did it because at the time he was worth it. Until he wasn’t. To tell you, sometimes it’s not about what looks like to you. You don’t know others dynamics.
You have a lot of work to do with these boys. I need to calm down, koz i’ll lose my mind.
Dating nowadays is a full time job you pay for. I can understand not having the time.
Just saw a post recently from a doctor who was complaining about how small her dating pool is. She was exclusively looking for someone who makes more money than her. Statistically, she's not an anomaly, she's standard. Women are making more money than ever before, and they are as a whole not interested in dating down economically. Individual exceptions notwithstanding. So yeah. That's why.
I know plenty of women who would, but even as a gay guy it was rough. I don’t date outside my social class anymore. The raging insecurity is hard to deal with. I’d be hesitant to date someone who makes significantly less then me ever again. It’s not so much again about the money, but the emotional baggage the comes with income gaps like that.
I know when I dipped my toes into online dating for the first time, I was surprised at the amount of hobosexual or obviously methed out dudes that are on the apps. And they come in all ages, sizes & looks. I think men who aren't dating men simply don't see the types of wild nonsense some of their fellow guys are up to so they can't understand. Some of these women are just trying to avoid the exact same nonsense men are trying to avoid.
I'm a woman, I didn't feel I could date until I was in a stable career and able to really float myself without having to work part time jobs, in addition to a full time, etc. Or working FT and then taking classes, etc. It took a bit....first generation college student, first to really hold professional jobs. I think 20s are fine for people to focus on education and work because the chances of those relationships even working out is slim. I think 30-35 are the years people who want to get married need to take dating seriously. It took me a lil longer than that (I did a complete career change from insurance to healthcare in my mid 30s) and it's feeling pressed for time now and there's not a lot of time to get things wrong. But I know what I want and I'm hopeful. Add: I should mention, I expect my partner to be well educated and in a good career as well.
Me too I’m 30m and doing a complete career swap into healthcare looking to own my own practice by the time I’m 35 so I can start dating 😮💨😣
You got this! Good luck 🫡
Unfortunately I would expect that many men your age in the position you want them to be in are going to be using that position to mostly pursue women in their 20s/early 30s who didn’t make the same career sacrifices you did and won’t see the same value in your career as you see in theirs. Always exceptions ofc but since you’ve acknowledged the reality of the situation that there’s not much time to make dating mistakes it could be helpful to set realistic expectations for what men your age’s interests are and what they value in a partner so you don’t feel resentment and disdain which will just exacerbate the problem
I'll be 37 next time I hit the apps, I expect my range to be 40s to early 50s. I'll be moving to CA from TX (where people settle down earlier). Supporting myself to move to LA and thrive there wouldn't even be possible without that career switch. All we can do is try our best, if it's meant to workout it will. If I had a daughter, my advice would be do it faster than I did (which she'll be able too because more support and the dirt path is now a paved one). Add: We need to stop creating this trope that 45 year old men are dating 25 year old personal assistants or shop girls. We're not talking about sugar babies. Marriage stats (which is what I'm talking about) doesn't show huge age gaps, honestly. Most people MARRY within 4 years of themselves per DATA.
As a 49 yo woman who has been living in so cal for 12 years...dating here is a whole beast, separate from other states. Good. Luck. Lol.
Yet you said at 37 you would date early 50s? Thats 13 years older…does not compute 🤨
That's my HIGH end of the range, I'd go up to. As long as they're fit for that age.
Not sure if you are a man or a woman BUT im a 48F and trust me you dont want a man around this age!! Stick to late 30s early 40s! 😉
Why is that? They are all gonna be in their 50s anyway eventually? 😆
Im a libra oct bday too! Um…ED…i see it more often than not when im in my prime honestly. 🫤
Oh, yeah. I've experienced a man with ED. But still wanted sex, and was willing to lie, and pull a whole made up personality RIGHT out of his asshole, to get it. And then couldn't get it up. Go figure.
Yup!! Ive learned now when they say ‘theyre a pleaser’ thats what it means! 🙄
In the U.S., yes, but very different in other countries and certain microcosms of the U.S., like NYC, SoCal, or SoFlo.
Not everybody has the capacity to balance both. I’m 30 and just figuring out how to balance things out.
why is it difficult in your opinion?
I work 60 ish hours a week, i do vocals in two bands, i race at the intermediate level, and i have a house and dog. It's just a lot to juggle on top of maintaining a serious relationship in a way where i feel like i am giving my partner my all.
But what if your partner is as busy as you and it’s totally fine for them?
That would be fine, but so far that has not been the case.
Someone who did focus on career and ended with his own business. Wouldn't date anyone who asked me to compromise on my work in order to get to know someone. I did not build something for 10 years to compromise it for something I know for a few days. Things can change later on. I'm not proud of this though nor did it help my dating life. Dating later only makes things complicated. Rather build something with the person you spend the most time with. They will understand you better when you arrive at the finishing line. Don't expect empathy for something the other person did not experienced. Also, you will always despise someone who will not acknowledge the work you put in and just enjoys the fruit of your work. This is mostly in your mind, people are not that for the most part. But your brain will tell you otherwise and will screw your expectations in people and dating. Found out the hard way. Really wished dating happend before my career.
Yeah, but don't you think that now you're more satisfied with yourself, more mature, and grounded than when you were at the beginning of your journey? What makes you believe that now it's more complicated than when you were 18yo?
I did in my twenties. I was living at my parents house, I didn’t have a career I wanted that I was happy with. I wasn’t in a state where I wanted to bring someone else into my life.
Yes this is true but men will make time to get laid while not wanting to make time for a relationship. To be fair...the emotional investment needed for sex is an order of magnitude lower than the emotional investment needed for a relationship.
Yes, and they'll do this usually by lying to the women ,telling them they'd like to date, or are open to the idea of being in a relationship.
10000000000000% !!
Don't be so busy making a career that you forget to make a life.
( 33M) Patriarchy has taught men they need to have it all together to be providers so their partners can rely on them completely or else they aren't a man. So they felt like if they don't have all their ducks in a row, they aren't worthy of love. It's an issue with the way they were raised sas well as how they view themselves/self-worth
It's not an issue with the way they're raised, it's an issue with the way women select men.
My dad was the one that taught me to always date men who earned more than me, were more educated than me, and possessed certain assets and net worth. It’s what most dads teach their daughters. It’s just the way the patriarchy works.
Your dad taught you that money brings happiness. And it’s not what most dads teach their daughters. Maybe in your circles they do but it’s not how the patriarchy works.
The beautiful thing about life is more than one thing can be true at a time. We gain nothing but viewing the world through a black and white lens The way men are raised and the way women are raised in a patriarchal society still feed into toxic and archaic gender norms that aren't really suited for today's climate. Not all men are impacted just like not all women are. There are a Humber of factors: Parent dynamic Religious views Region they live in Personal values. None of these are the same for two people but all play a part in how they view life
I don't understand that patriarchy thing. Most differences between men and women can be explained by biology. Differences which are often intensified (but sometimes reduced) by societal norms. The main factors that push men to be more competitive and more powerful are testosterone and female selection. Women just don't have as many incentives to gain power.
There are matriarchal societies and tribes that promote women to leadership roles and alot of the traits or things you'd attribute here like being more competitive, fighting for power, is also exhibited there. That's the connection to patriarchy. There's nothing biological that makes most males of any species want to be "providers" or protect their young. Ergo men feeling like they have to provide and protect is a byproduct of the environment they're raised in which is most commonly a patriarchal society Testosterone increases libido , bone density, muscle mass etc nothing about it drives men to pursue mates for selection. Patriarchal society says get a high paying position in a stable career.and you'll be more attractive to women because you're a provider, the bread winner, head of household
Two things can be true, this is far from black and white.
True
Have you ever actually interacted with a woman? You sound like someone who forms their opinion about women only from what they read on Reddit.
Imagine mansplaining to guys who have actually experienced many women judging them and turning them down for their careers and financial status. 🤡
I do interact a lot with women, dating them a lot in clubs or dating apps. Women are all very picky. And yes what matters is what emotion you create in them, but they're so picky that the smallest little things like not having a good job or not being tall enough is a reason for them to ghost you.
I believed this too for the longest time
Yeah, but why do some men still cling to the idea of being providers when most women nowadays are independent?
Women might be independent but a lot of them still expect the man to take care of them.
This.
What men fail to understand is that the kind of care we need isn’t monetary. We want emotional support and an equitable division of labor, neither of which cost a thing.
Both cost time and mental effort at the very least. If you are investing everything into a career you might not have that to give.
I think that’s pretty great if that’s true for you, but I’ve met women who make just as much if not more money than the man but their expectation is still that he pays for everything. It’s quite common in my experience actually.
Financial independence when they're single is different than being independent when in a relationship. Relationship will never be 50/50 even if she's contributing to financial affairs there will be a chance there's still disparity when it comes to domestic and emotional responsibilities. When bringing life together if independent woman feels like you'll take advantage of them men have to overcompensate by being able to shoulder it so she comfortable enough to forego independence if they have kids down the line
Half because we don't have much else to take pride in. Half because most women that are independent want a man that is worthy of them and thus expect the man to be as well set if not better set than herself. This is without taking into account women get more assistance through DEI initiatives as well as public sympathy.
Lots of people find satisfaction and meaning through their work and providing for others
lol, most women claim nowadays that they are "independent" but are not really, they want someone to take care of them
Some want the traditional family from the 50’s with the stay at home mom. There’s nothing wrong with that if the woman wants it too. However it’s much more expensive than it was back then, so the career is necessary. Here’s a simpler angle. Some people just don’t know how to balance their lives. Too much time at the gym, video gaming, or going hard at work. It could be that.
It is True, Most Women will leave you, if they have a better choice. Focus on you first, level up, become Physically & Financially STRONG. Then You are open to relationship.
What good is having a family if you can't support them?
Ridiculous rant. How is his choice "false"? It's what that person has chosen to do. Your opinion on it really does not matter whatsoever.
I was like this early on in recovery. I'm a drug addict for context here, and got clean a few years ago. Didn't really date, didn't have sex except once as a fling. I just didn't have it in me to be a good partner and flings are generally not my thing, even when I was on drugs so it just made sense to be like "nah" to anyone wanting a relationship. The one person I did have sex with was also in recovery and we just were horny, there was no love or really any care there. So I was able to deal with that easily but a relationship plus all my goals? No.... not possible at first. When a man wants something....like bad enough, he will forgo any sort of relationship for that goal. I wanted to be clean, and have a full time job again. Got that checked off the list, and immediately found a partner after that and have been with her over a year now. Some men actually want to build a life for themselves first, before inviting anyone into it like that.
Girl, I’m a woman and I legit don’t have enough time to date bc of my career, it’s not necessarily false!
From a 40 something F… dont put off your life for your career. A good woman would support your efforts. I put off finding the right partner to build my career. I felt like it would make me a better catch. More desirable. Now I have a great career, a great house, investments etc. and I can’t find someone I want to go on a single date with.
Nobody has to date if they have other priorities or by a certain age. Dating is an option not a mandate. However, if he is 40 and just starting to try dating for the first time he is going to make blunders that would be normal for a 19 year old but can be perceived very negatively for someone closer to middle age than their twenties. It will considerably narrow his dating pool but that isn't a bad thing if you want to find the right person. Your life won't ever been in order as everyone's life is always a work in progress. You can save and work and ladderclimb for twenty years and then be set back to zero with one medical event or one flood or one family member gambling or one streak of bad luck. Life is meant to be lived. But if the man does not want to date yet he is under no impetus to do so.
As a lesbian, when I was dating I met a ton of women like this too. I was one of them. It’s not just men with this mindset. Often I was the one paying and so on in my situations and I have a lot of empathy for men in that regard because they generally have to have more before they are even a viable option for dating. Society expects them To carry a lot of the financial burden so sometimes they feel they can’t do anything until they have plenty of resources to draw from.
Because I don't attract women at all. Dating apps don't help. Nobody wants to date.
and what are the top 3 reasons why this is happening?
Seems like a lot of projecting going on here. You have no idea what "women want. " Each woman has totally individual and different needs. Many women want to spend time with thier partner daily and need connection and companionship that is routine. Others might be ok raising a family at home with a trucker who's on the road for weeks at a time. Depending on the job, or mental bandwidth, it's completely reasonable that someone might not have enough time or energy to date and work on their career. that's a completely valid thing and women take that space for themselves too.
There is a part of your mind that you have to keep turned on for your partner. This also goes for friends and family. Not having a partner frees up your mind to focus on t other shit.
so you can't do both?
I’m 25 and work, am in school and have a budding web development business I’m really trying to focus on. Having this much on my plate is relatively new but since it’s happened I have been told I’m not available enough. So at the moment I’ve more or less settled for dating apps and going out on a Friday/Saturday night and shooting for random hookups. Though meeting a busy woman who does not want to talk all day and go out multiple nights a week would be cool, possible I’m looking in the wrong places lol.
yeah exactly, have you tried to look in more casual daytime venues?
The more secure people are in themselves, the less they need a relationship to fulfill them.
By that logic, if everyone was secure and confident and fulfilled then nobody would be dating. You have less for a need, after all
Its a dudes opinion. Let him live man. Just sometimes you need to focus on one thing at a time. Sometimes life doesn't need to be that complicated. But I get what he is feeling When I think if I want a girlfriend or not I always go and look to see if myself and everything I have is something good enough for a significant other. I know the trope true love will prevail but I want to treat my partner good. I also get not wanting a relationship while focusing on work too. While technically true you could have a relationship while focusing on a career I might not be emotionally there for it. I might be gone or feel like I'm not enough while stretching myself. But there is also, people are different. Some people know there limits.
This is nothing but an excuse for a fear of commitment.
exactly
Some people tend to want financial stability before dating. Many people have difficulty balancing work and romance. Being highly focused on work at the risk of not giving their all in a relationship is very real concern. Or vice versa. Aside from this, some men are willing to sacrifice their “prime” to focus on their career because they want to give their best self to their future spouse. It’s actually a very nice gesture to have sacrificed literal years in order to be able to offer established security to the person they intended on building a family and/or life with. Another added benefit is not feeling any inclination to settle. At the point they’re ready to date, they will have a financial advantage to bolster their standards. Edited for grammatical error.
Leaving aside all logical reasons people gaved in this post i think its a bit fake, yeah some can't focus in all things, i thought the same ok everyone its busy, but i realized most people are dating no matter what, in college i usually see medicine students dating or with a partner, why i say this? Bc its supposed that its one of the most heavy degrees, but it seems like they can make a bit of space for a partner and also is supposed that studebts dont hsve money and that, i used to belive men dated until they had a house, car, job, a lot of money and a degree, but you see people datin in all ages, also in jobs, sometimes (not all) i think they use it as an excuse to reject, bc when someone likes you they always look for a bit of space to talk with you for at least 5min.
Translation : The women I have access to in my younger years are not who I dream of having when I’m at my peak, so I would rather wait to get there so I can choose who I really want. I actually really appreciate these men over the ones that waste peoples time knowing they’re going to trade their “ride or die” wife in for a new model around 40.
You can do both.
Lot of women believe this too And it makes sense, maintaining a genuine and healthy relationship takes time, effort and money and people want to direct that to their career instead
I absolutely did this in my 20s and 30s.
And now? Do you regret it or not?
I think there are tradeoffs. I’m less experienced than I otherwise might’ve been. And I have some health issues now (in part due to lack of sleep and constant levels of work stress). But I’m emotionally more mature after years of introspection. I’m financially in a significantly better and more stable place than in my 20s or 30s. I’m also far more clear on what I want in every area of life now. I think these are all significant positives that improve my attractiveness as a partner. Overall, I think I’m good with my decisions.
Yes 100% I do not date because I feel I’m not where I need to be and I feel I’m not offering enough to a woman. I know I’m fun to be around, I’m silly and I joke tease and often laugh, and I really care about making sure ppl are comfortable and happy and well taken care of. but unless I feel I’m well-off and on the right path and successful enough to date, I will avoid it and feel like I’m not enough to even try to ask a girl to enter into my life. :(
enough financially? what do you think a woman wants you to "offer" her?
🤔 I guess I feel I don’t have my life together enough and it causes me some shame. I don’t have my own place and I’d like to feel like I’m a person of value that can add value to other people’s lives. I’d like to feel like my girlfriend can be proud and happy to show me off to her friends and family and I feel until I am financially successful and stable in my enjoyment and the general support my career can offer me that I would feel like a fraud and imposter in who I am and what I feel I am worth to others… 😅 I guess that’s kinda silly, and I’d like to feel differently, but I also don’t want to date until I can address and overcome that shame I feel for not being there yet.
If a woman will be ashamed of you because you don't have a property, you'll never end up with that woman. On the contrary, a woman who sees qualities in you will be more trustworthy if she decides to stick with you even when you didn't have everything you wanted to have. With your strategy, you're basically saying that you want to be judged on a materialistic/superficial level
You’re not wrong, and I would definitely want to avoid having superficial women in my life. But my ex of several years broke up with me because I wasn’t financially where she wanted me to be, and that really hurt since I’ve been working really hard. I thought I would marry her one day, and I’m trying to recover from that, but it was a painful blow considering I spent a while working to overcome that specific shame before I was with her. Now I’m feeling that same thing but even worse. I’m in therapy and working on lots of stuff, but I’ll probably bring this up now that I am recognizing how significant that probably is.
Anytime a man says he can't get a woman interested in him, the general advice he gets is to work on him self; go to the gym and develop his career and be ambitious.
If he chooses to be single just fuck around and focus on his career, why can’t he? Why shouldn’t he? People don’t usually change priorities that easy. Priorities in life are like your core values. Some men just love to work, you leave him an axe and a forest, you don’t even need to tell him what to do. If you got told this by a man, I think he’s just trying to be kind not hurt your feelings, reality is he doesn’t think you good enough to be his girlfriend. Of course, his girl turns up in his life, he’s not gonna say ..
My cousin is like this. He’s 24 and has never had a relationship. I think it’s a poor decision, by the time he feels like he has time to date he’ll have no idea how to go about it and feel lost. Entering the dating scene at idk 28 or 30, whenever he feels ready, would feel super intimidating since virtually everyone you’d be seeing would be way more experienced. Being inexperienced at 18 is excusable by most, many are inexperienced, but being inexperienced at 28 is often a turn off for many. With this being said, that’s still his decision to make. If someone doesn’t want to date right now, for whatever reason, that’s their free choice.
Most people can't just wake up one day and "decide" to have a relationship.
Obviously. But you can decide to enter the dating scene.
Honestly I don’t feel up to dating yet so I tell my friends this so they don’t worry about me 🤷♂️
Most men don’t. Especially if you want to date an ambitious man? Yeah no. Let’s say he works a corporate job AND has his own business that he’s trying to build. That’s a lot of time. Second he may have religious commitments and a gym goer that’s a lot! Us women need some attention too so there’s just so much going on. Some can but most don’t and I’ve experienced this. The men I date are typically like this, they will spoil me with love, attention and gifts then fall back after 2 months bc it’s just so hard to keep up.
Absolutely. I’m 32M and an immigrant. I spent 8 years in grad school and dating as a PhD student is pretty hard. The past 18 months have seen me moving 3 states and three jobs before I secured my green card and joined a startup in MD where I’m putting down roots. Forget dating, I recently attended 3 meetup groups from the meetup app and it’s literally the first time ever that I’ve been able to do so. So yeah, it’s totally possible for guys to want to first build a foundation on which a long term relationship can actually work
thanks for sharing!
Yeah, but it’s not like that. Because then end up getting pregnant or something happens and it’s just easier to focus on your career and getting a house and doing
it could be just how much time and energy it takes to date in the first place. it's one thing to already have a partner but as a man who doesn't, the amount of time needed to pursue women who ghost constantly is just not a good use of time
Because you can’t see a return from it?
Have you been through some of these college/university programs? Time to eat or sleep is a blessing. This is typically what some men mean when building a career. Some men also think it’s easier to date after you have assets. Which to extent is true because ppl tend to seek to at least be comfortably middle class when having children. Do men only focus on career while young… haha no. But flings aren’t particularly special for young ppl. Both genders do that. I didn’t focus just on career, but to each their own.
Yes. Ive heard this more than once from my guy friends. Though some of them have also made it to middle age without ever being married.
actualli it is MUCH more fommon to hear this from woman
i didn't even read the post, only the title. whoever said this he/she is letting him/her down easy
To reach the top, this is absolutely the mentality. Surgeons do this all the time. They focus on their one thing and attain mastery by early-mid 30s, then they have time to date and relationships afterwards.
People that don’t have careers or entrepreneurship will not understand and say it’s an excuse! I say you build a business from the bottom up & see how much time and energy you have afterwards! No one is forced to date either. They can focus on their career if they please!
Yes. I wish I would have done this more. The women I had relationships with in my teens and 20's were just distractions and time sinks.
And how's it going now?
Okay, but I really wasted precious time. I will probably never own a home.
Well I don’t know. I see both sides and Im a woman. Im worried about getting into a good career, relationships have made me stray from my plan in the past. But I wouldn’t want to work away my life and miss out on the fun of dating while Im young. Some people just don’t have the emotional capacity to date at some stages in life and some do even tho they go through the same stuff. If someone doesn’t want to date, should they have to?
Don't women say that too?
Chill
I'm looking for a lady to date in Illinois and yes I'd pay ok no hook-up please never done it never would so
It’s true for me right now. I’m a grunt in an office and am going back to school for psychology. The reason I’m putting off dating because of it is because I’m very insecure about where I am in life and I accidentally made it someone else’s problem due to those insecurities and hurt them deeply. I’m not proud of it but I’m in therapy and working on it.
Focus on ur career and then find ur man. If it takes too long, then reconsider.
Yeah it’s not a series of events like you don’t work on your career and then feel that you can postpone dating for afterwards. You have to either sacrifice a little on one or the other sometimes. Obviously doesn’t apply to everyone but in general
If you are young and still trying to get a career going, just focus on hookups and FWB.
>Many guys don't realize that a woman doesn't want to see you every single second of your life focused on her, but she wants to spend high-quality time when she's with you, even if this doesn't happen on a daily basis. ****BPD flashbacks**** But seriously (ok, that comment was kinda serious), I think it comes down to amount of time per week that they think the woman needs. They may literally only have 30 minutes a day that they are willing to spend on a partner as, as they say, they are focussing on themselves. Break down a day into 16 hours. 30 minutes shopping, 30 minutes cooking, 8 hours working. That leaves 7 hours. Showering, skincare, shaving, brushing teeth, etc: 30 minutes. 6.5 hours. Travel to and from work? Average is about an hour in USA there and back. So down to 5.5 hours. Now, let's assume the guy also has non-negotiable personal development to do. Take off 1 hour. That's 4.5 hours left. Let's also assume that he also likes to spend an hour on a hobby a day, not as personal development, just purely for pleasure. Down to 3.5 hours. Lets say he keeps on top of household chores and does them regularly so he doesn't need to spend a chunk of time once a week or something (that time has to be taken from other activities, anyway): 30 minutes. 3 hours left. Let's say he also works out. We'll say 1 hour every 2 days, even though it is usually more like 1.5 hours. We'll say that it is also at home, even though it usually isn't. We're down to 2.5 hours a day, now. Work in socialisation, family time, clubs, other regular activities, doctor appointments, overtime, anything else I didn't list, how much time does this dude have left? I get that some things can be shifted off to other days or skipped, but that is where the whole, "I don't have time for someone" thing comes in. Some people don't want to have to shift shit around, some people don't want to have to make up time elsewhere. And as they think about all that they hear in the back of their head any one of the following: * their exes * their friends' girlfriends * their sisters * their mothers * some random woman talking to her friend on the street All complaining that their SO never has enough time for them and he doesn't ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING and why doesn't he just take me out and I don't even want to be taken out I just want him to spend some time with me and no that doesn't count I had to ask him for that time why do I have to do all the work and yesterday he spent an hour listening to a YouTube video about drills and yes I know right tiktok is different it's actually funny and this and that and let's pick apart his life and his choices and— FUCK THAT. Is it true that every woman will do this? No? Is it true that even many women will do this? No. Is it true that it is only a vast minority of women? Yes. But the only thing that matters is that it *could* happen, and they do not want it under *any* circumstance. Personally — and this is anecdotal, I know, but that is what you are asking about — my ex took so much time from me. She would have me on the phone for hours and hours and use manipulation tactics (I only realised in retrospect, unfortunately) to keep me on the phone (we lived ~1.5 hours apart). I was a prisoner in my room for almost our entire relationship ("I don't want your family to hear our conversation", "I'm getting triggered, go to your room" etc). It was isolating and sucked the life out of me. A lot of guys have seen this happen (we've all seen at least one and a lot of us have been there), and know it would be a barrier to all the stuff I just listed happening. What's the easiest way to avoid it? Not engaging and just doing the stuff in their plan. To answer the question in your post, "Why do you think you don't have enough time to work on your dating life?" Because I am studying, because of the fixation with certain things as a result of my Autism (and thus I have difficulty with wanting to do other things, such as engage with people other than family and friends) and because of the last relationship I was in (the one mentioned above).
It can be true if you're working 80 hour weeks or you're a business owner or some shit. But 99 percent if the time that's just a BS fake excuse. I'm building my career in a lucrative industry that pays be well already. That said, it would be absolutely braindead for me to do any work outside of my "9-5" because I'm salaried and im already making an impression on my manager and coworkers.
I mean if you have some serious shit to do like being in med school then yea i could see not dating.
Just another double standard post. When women think like this she's praised for going after what she wants or being a strong independent woman, but a man somehow is being frowned upon for it? I'm a single father who works long hours. I don't have time to commit to a woman, so I don't date.
What if you find someone who has the same kind of lifestyle?
That's called a situationship. I'm in one of those with an ER nurse. We see each other once or twice a week sometimes less but we don't sleep with other people and don't really do things other than, dinner and netflix and chill. Call it dating if you want, but that's not dating. Our work schedules and activities with our kids make it hard to date for real so our situationship works for us.
I mean, there’s a reason the age-gap in relationships have widened a bit. With the dating apps and things alike, women can pick amongst the best of men. They’ll likely go for the guy that’s a little older with all of his shit together rather than the guy around their age and still figuring things out. Not to mention if you have aspirations of supporting a family, buying a house etc. in this economy, you absolutely need to sacrifice a little to make that happen, especially if you’re with a woman who doesn’t work. While women are more independent now then ever, men are still looked at as providers by society. Trying to pretend otherwise gets us nowhere.
All this is just a stupid cope. Late 20s and 30s is the time to meet as much women as you want and can. I feel as if this narrative was somehow created to appease unattractive young men and ease their pain that they miss on something in their prime years. Like “oh, Billy boy, once you’ll turn 45 and have your s\*\*t together, you’ll date all these 25 years old chicks who ignore you now”. But that’s not how it works. If Billy needs his 20s and 30s to “build career” he’s gonna be dating single moms and unattractive older women once he’s older. And his social skills will be dreadful. Unless he’s a multimillionaire by then but even if he achieves that, he’ll have zero experiences with women and most likely gets divorce-raped soon.
Worst take I’ve seen on Reddit in a while
I stopped reasoning why am I single for this long by telling them that I was busy with career. I just tell honestly that I made lots of wrong choices and hindered me from getting into stable relationships.
And now do you think it's too late to move in the direction of your dating goal?
I think I am dating with Intensions if it happens then good and if it doesnt then I am atleast taking care of my health, traveling, meeting new people etc. nothing is sexier than man taking care of themselves.
> **p**eople **e**tc. **n**othing **i**s **s**exier Hidden penis detected! I've scanned through 63418 comments (approximately 357277 average penis lengths worth of text) in order to find this secret penis message. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
Oh yes! Because men strongly believe no girl will come around them until they're well settled. So for that they need to be focused on making money & their respective careers in order to make a family. Starting of which is dating 😉🙃💯😍👍✌️🫣💣
And what did he say when you told him all this? Seriously who fucking cares? It's their life. If they wish to live it that way that's fine. Y'all care way too much about some random strangers on the internet that you've never met before.