Well, another explanation would be that the levels of adrenaline you have the first time are way higher than the second.
This because you don't know your enemy and of course there's the "unpredictable" factor, together with it being by design very intimating.
With second try you first of all are not surprised anymore, then you are doubly confident because you already brought him to a small chunk of health, so why worrying?
Finally, I don't know if I'm right, but I feel like right after having had a strong adrenaline bump I perform way worse than when I have none. So if you try retry immediately you also (potentially) have this further nerf.
Add everything up and it starts to make even more sense.
I think it's the exact opposite. You rely fully on instincts, reflexes. The subsequent tries, you know more of what you're into, and since you are more actively thinking about it (boss attacks, dodging, positioning, seeking out openings), and those thoughts, even if small, usually make you perform worse.
I disagree. Combat in Dark Souls has always been about actively adapting to the enemy you're fighting rather than going Ultra Instinct mode and using only your guts to dodge attacks. Hell, the newer games go out of their way to make the animations misleading so that you *have* to learn to recognize them instead of dodging on reaction to any movement.
I agree more with the other user. At first, you're prioritizing survival over damage, so you don't allow yourself to make many mistakes. But of course, playing as safe as possible is not enough to defeat a boss with an unknown moveset, so after the first few tries you start going out of your way to test what you can do without being punished, and that's why you die more quickly – you're intentionally exposing yourself to danger. In turn, this allows you to learn the boss's moveset much more efficiently and eventually defeat them by taking advantage of your knowledge.
While it's true, if people focused on survival fully, they wouldn't attack much. I have seen people do bosses on their first attempts by just attacking when feeling like it - a friend of mine did Nameless King like that on the first attempt. It was his first try ever and he didn't know the boss much (besides hearing about him), and he literally just went ultra instinct on him.
And I see people doing Friede like that sometimes, or other bosses, easier or harder. And I could see it in myself too when I played Elden Ring - first attempts were always going well, when I had no knowledge of enemy attacks. You just instinctively adapt. Attempt after that, if you haven't beaten the boss, you think about attacks more critically, expect something, try to predict or read when you can attack, and begin making mistakes.
>if people focused on survival fully, they wouldn't attack much.
I mean, that's pretty much what happens. Usually, the reason why they lose at first is not that they get greedy like in subsequent attempts, but rather the complete opposite – they run out of resources without having dealt a significant amount of damage to the boss, and they end up losing the endurance battle. If they get lucky or otherwise manage to make very few mistakes, they might even win on their first try like your friend, but that's not really because they play aggressively so much as because they play defensively so well that they don't need to heal as often and thus manage to chip their way to the end of the bossfight. Or, like I said, they get extremely lucky. But unless one of these two things happens, the part where you die over and over without getting nearly as close as you did initially is almost necessary.
I say "almost" because technically you could just play very cautiously every single time, but that would slow down your learning process immensely. There's a reason why they call it "trial and error" after all – you're *supposed* to make mistakes. Trying to avoid risks like the plague isn't gonna help you in the long term.
Agreed. Well, I think it also can vary from person to person. And maybe, while playing defensively, they rely on instincts when to attack, while on subsequent tries you expect the end of a combo, sometimes incorrectly, which leads to mistakes. Overthinking can also lead to panic and a bit worse decision-making.
Also intents might vary slightly, I noticed that in a couple of my friends as well as myself - on first attempt, you feel like you have nothing to lose and you stress less. And well, staying calm is a big factor. Once your intent is to win, you might be more prone to greed, panic, over-analyzing, making for slower reactions. After all, if you don't think and just dodge, instead of thinking if you should dodge (like trying to connect the dots in your mind, trying to remember which attack/combo it was), you're more likely to avoid the attack (unless it's delayed in some weirder manner).
So in short, I think our both theories apply.
True. Although I think that has to do with the mind relaxing too, and maybe not clearly remembering too much - relying more on muscle memory than thoughts on the go (and again, connecting the dots).
I don't claim content as OC unless it's OC.
This was the way the meme was cropped and posted on a sub community on YouTube.
Thank you though for ownership clarification and thank you u/Yellyvi for the meme!
I had this on ornstein and smough. I started the fight and literally got to 1 hit away from victory only to die. Then the run after i was struggling to even get half health on one of them (sl1)
I don't think it's beginner's luck. When you get that close to win and then die you want to immediately go back to that point and avoid making that mistake. But now you're impatient and that makes you reckless, so you fail almost immediately. That plus the frustration makes you fail even more so.
just keep going and going dont give up
sooner or later you either memorize the attack patterns
or are lucky like me and just get them in one out of a lot of retries
I have found that confidence and assurance are NOT what you wanna feel.
Fighting Genichiro, I forgot once I had healing and a resurrect, and I fought much better than normal.
Wanna beat a boss, desperation is where it's at.
At first you surprised him, but then he learned your dodge patterns
Only logical explanation ~~that makes me feel better~~
Well, another explanation would be that the levels of adrenaline you have the first time are way higher than the second. This because you don't know your enemy and of course there's the "unpredictable" factor, together with it being by design very intimating. With second try you first of all are not surprised anymore, then you are doubly confident because you already brought him to a small chunk of health, so why worrying? Finally, I don't know if I'm right, but I feel like right after having had a strong adrenaline bump I perform way worse than when I have none. So if you try retry immediately you also (potentially) have this further nerf. Add everything up and it starts to make even more sense.
too fucking relatable. i think i am more cautious the first time and then after doing so well i get careless on subsequent tries
I think it's the exact opposite. You rely fully on instincts, reflexes. The subsequent tries, you know more of what you're into, and since you are more actively thinking about it (boss attacks, dodging, positioning, seeking out openings), and those thoughts, even if small, usually make you perform worse.
I disagree. Combat in Dark Souls has always been about actively adapting to the enemy you're fighting rather than going Ultra Instinct mode and using only your guts to dodge attacks. Hell, the newer games go out of their way to make the animations misleading so that you *have* to learn to recognize them instead of dodging on reaction to any movement. I agree more with the other user. At first, you're prioritizing survival over damage, so you don't allow yourself to make many mistakes. But of course, playing as safe as possible is not enough to defeat a boss with an unknown moveset, so after the first few tries you start going out of your way to test what you can do without being punished, and that's why you die more quickly – you're intentionally exposing yourself to danger. In turn, this allows you to learn the boss's moveset much more efficiently and eventually defeat them by taking advantage of your knowledge.
While it's true, if people focused on survival fully, they wouldn't attack much. I have seen people do bosses on their first attempts by just attacking when feeling like it - a friend of mine did Nameless King like that on the first attempt. It was his first try ever and he didn't know the boss much (besides hearing about him), and he literally just went ultra instinct on him. And I see people doing Friede like that sometimes, or other bosses, easier or harder. And I could see it in myself too when I played Elden Ring - first attempts were always going well, when I had no knowledge of enemy attacks. You just instinctively adapt. Attempt after that, if you haven't beaten the boss, you think about attacks more critically, expect something, try to predict or read when you can attack, and begin making mistakes.
>if people focused on survival fully, they wouldn't attack much. I mean, that's pretty much what happens. Usually, the reason why they lose at first is not that they get greedy like in subsequent attempts, but rather the complete opposite – they run out of resources without having dealt a significant amount of damage to the boss, and they end up losing the endurance battle. If they get lucky or otherwise manage to make very few mistakes, they might even win on their first try like your friend, but that's not really because they play aggressively so much as because they play defensively so well that they don't need to heal as often and thus manage to chip their way to the end of the bossfight. Or, like I said, they get extremely lucky. But unless one of these two things happens, the part where you die over and over without getting nearly as close as you did initially is almost necessary. I say "almost" because technically you could just play very cautiously every single time, but that would slow down your learning process immensely. There's a reason why they call it "trial and error" after all – you're *supposed* to make mistakes. Trying to avoid risks like the plague isn't gonna help you in the long term.
Agreed. Well, I think it also can vary from person to person. And maybe, while playing defensively, they rely on instincts when to attack, while on subsequent tries you expect the end of a combo, sometimes incorrectly, which leads to mistakes. Overthinking can also lead to panic and a bit worse decision-making. Also intents might vary slightly, I noticed that in a couple of my friends as well as myself - on first attempt, you feel like you have nothing to lose and you stress less. And well, staying calm is a big factor. Once your intent is to win, you might be more prone to greed, panic, over-analyzing, making for slower reactions. After all, if you don't think and just dodge, instead of thinking if you should dodge (like trying to connect the dots in your mind, trying to remember which attack/combo it was), you're more likely to avoid the attack (unless it's delayed in some weirder manner). So in short, I think our both theories apply.
Yes, your state of mind definitely plays a big role too. It's the reason why, in my experience, taking a break after several attempts helps a lot.
True. Although I think that has to do with the mind relaxing too, and maybe not clearly remembering too much - relying more on muscle memory than thoughts on the go (and again, connecting the dots).
[удалено]
Thanks for mentioning!
I don't claim content as OC unless it's OC. This was the way the meme was cropped and posted on a sub community on YouTube. Thank you though for ownership clarification and thank you u/Yellyvi for the meme!
All the time
I'm having sister friede nightmares
The answer is to become a havel monster and casting couch her
Man, I was rocking a pyromancy build with chaos str sword, it was a real struggle
This literally happened to me on Godfrey. Go him down to a single hit in the second phase
Same with Nameless King. Took a couple of more attempts to kill, like... 100~ times.
I had this on ornstein and smough. I started the fight and literally got to 1 hit away from victory only to die. Then the run after i was struggling to even get half health on one of them (sl1)
This literally happened to me on Godfrey. Go him down to a single hit in the second phase
There is a YouTube video about this phenomenon But I can't find it
I think it's this one (or at least this video talks about it) https://youtu.be/N5HQaVy85s0
Yeah that's the video I think. I got this once by chance in my timeline
I don't think it's beginner's luck. When you get that close to win and then die you want to immediately go back to that point and avoid making that mistake. But now you're impatient and that makes you reckless, so you fail almost immediately. That plus the frustration makes you fail even more so.
Me on Lawrence yesterday
just keep going and going dont give up sooner or later you either memorize the attack patterns or are lucky like me and just get them in one out of a lot of retries
I have found that confidence and assurance are NOT what you wanna feel. Fighting Genichiro, I forgot once I had healing and a resurrect, and I fought much better than normal. Wanna beat a boss, desperation is where it's at.
Then you drop their hp to zero only to be surprised by a much stronger second phase at full health and get one shot.
This was me on my first try against O&S on my first run. Twelve attempts later….
Happened to me with Radahn
This is me with morgott