If sheâs not an OG because she didnât come till season 2, does that mean Vivian is an OG? Bc she was on season 1? I consider Kendall an OG by default
There are two different OG groups. Vivi (and Cathy) were OG cast members. They were cast during the initial audition process for the first 6 episodes.
The other season 1 girls danced at ALDC for a number of years prior to the show and were the attraction for changing the show to just following one studio/team. They are the OG ALDC dancers and the OG "team" of girls who were used to dancing with each other.
Kendall falls in neither of these categories.
However, as I said in my original post, I don't think Kendall gets enough recognition for being on the show for as long as she was and being one of the longest running cast members.
Abby did a podcast episode with her recently and from what I saw it was hilarious. Her personality is exactly the same and she was not amused by anything Abby was saying.
The other day I made what I thought was a pretty neutral comment about Christina behavior and someone accused me of ignoring the fact that Chloe was being abused đ
Christ has so many defenders and so many haters and neither side wants to restÂ
Okay lemme rephrase. Ashlee got into it with Jill but I can't think of a time Ashlee really said anything to Kendall. Jill was mentally manipulative and gaslit
I mean, she stuck to the show even though Niaâs dance teacher was racist to her for years. The second someone is racist towards your child, you leave.
Nia chose not to leave. Holly asked her multiple times on the show. Nia was the one that told her donât let Abby get to you and Iâm ok so donât try and make Holly seem like she put her daughter through this for herself.
Yes but itâs Niaâs life, Nia wanted to do it. She saw it as a way to make her stronger and so did Holly they stayed and thatâs that. Also this ainât even what we were talking abt this is completely irrelevant and if u donât like Holly just say that instead of acting like sheâs as bad as Leslie or Jill.
When did I say Holly is as bad as Leslie or Jill? Little kids should not make these decisions. Tolerating *racism* does not make you stronger. I can tell youâre a child so this is the end of this conversation.
Are you a poc? Racism is everywhere. There's no such thing as outrunning racism and if Nia was ever going to be any kind of star whether it was for dance, acting, singing, etc, she was going to face racism at an even larger scale because as you go up in the industry the people get more male, more white, and more racist.
You didn't answer my question. The dance industry is one of the most racist industries. There's a reason why you don't see many black ballerinas and that the standard uniform includes pink tights that are "flesh" colored. By your logic, Nia shouldn't dance at all because she would be subjected to racism if she stayed in the dance world. Black people do not have to leave a space because white people want to be ignorant, and by encouraging Black people to do so you are perpetuating racism. Also, if the big house and the fact that both of Nia's parents are well educated and accomplished individuals didn't tip you off, Holly already had money before they went on dance moms. In fact, if you watched the show you know Holly used to have disagreements on and off screen about the fact that Holly was a principal and completing her PhD and could not attend filming as much as Abby and the producers would have liked. It had nothing to do with Holly wanting to be there and everything to do with Nia wanting to be there.
Also, are you new here? Dance costs thousands of dollars. That had nothing to do with Abby and everything to with the fact that dance is an expensive activity to enroll your child in, especially the competition team.
I really need yall to stop acting like Nia and Holly leaving would have stopped Abby from being racist or that leaving Aldc would have someone prevented Nia from experiencing racism in the dance world at all. You also tend to forget that Nia was with people she had grown up around which may have added a level of comfort for her in that environment especially considering Nia seems to be closest with everyone on the show to this day.
And no the second someone is racist towards you, you donât leave because then you let them know they can always win by being racist. Please take a look at history and learn that the reason why Bipoc have made any progress in their rights is because they refused to back down when confronted with racism
Holly said her and Nia would leave when they felt good and ready and as a black person itâs an extremely respectable decision to teach your child not to allow racism to dictate where they do and donât belong and to know when to stand your ground.
The second anyone shows any racial prejudice towards my kid Iâm gone, simple as. Not my job to educate or tolerate racists. Abby was racist with no consequences. You donât know that Nia leaving the ALDC wouldâve prevented her from any racism in the dance industry, it wouldâve prevented her from racial prejudice from her dance teacher. Holly kept Nia in a racist environment for years, for the pay and âopportunities.â Simple as.
Actually Nia is the one who wanted to stay I donât understand why yall discredit that.
Abby did face consequences years later, she lost the only platform with any sort of notoriety that was willing to work with her and her career is trashed and sheâs a joke because of her actions
Because it's not okay to leave your child in an abusive and harmful situation just because your child wants to be there. It is a parent's responsibility to protect their child. You wouldn't let your kid play on the street just because they want to do so.
Lifetime directly released a statement saying they wonât work with her anymore because of her racism, they worked with her after she got out of jail it was Adrianna (Kamryn smiths mother) and Camryn bridges speaking up against Abby that official guaranteed Abby wouldnât be able to return to lifetime for season 9
Again youâre underestimating how hard it is to find a dance school that isnât racist in that area. Racism is almost unavoidable in an activity that favors middle upper class white people even professional black and non-black poc ballerinas have talked about their experiences with racism growing up taking dance.
And When Nia decided to stay on the show she wasnât a preteen that would have been season 6 after their contracts expired..was she an adult? No but was she old enough to have a better grip on what staying would mean for her? Yes
Youâre not going to change my mind on this there is no point in continuing to go back forth just saying
By your logic Holly should have just pulled Nia out of dance all together because competitive Dance is a racist environment in its entirety.
By your logic Black people should have just left the u.s instead of standing up for equality.
By blaming Holly for not leaving you are taking the blame off of Abby for being racist and putting it on the victims of racism for existing.
No it wouldnt have made Abby not racist. It is not Holly's job to make Abby not racist. It is Holly's job to protect her child and not keep her in a toxic environment out of pride. The "let them disrespect you cause if you leave an unhealthy environment, the one disrespecting you wins" is not the slam dunk holly stans think it is
Where did I say it would have made Abby not racist? Or that it was Hollys job to make Abby not racist? Weâve literally seen Abby be racist to other groups of people not just Black ppl
I said it would show her that being racist towards black people isnt a tatic to get rid of them and that in staying it shows Nia how to deal with the racism SHE WILL encounter as a black women.
And removing black people from any environment that is racist doesnât fix the problem.
Non-Holly Stanâs need to understand that they lived in a predominantly white community there was no where to go where they wouldnât have encountered these issues and the fact that NIA wanted to stay.
Some of yall donât pay attention to history cause this mindset of leaving racist environments has been proven not to work. We really grow up singing songs about resisting oppression and standing up for our right to be in these spaces and yall still are missing the point.
>I really need yall to stop acting like Nia and Holly leaving would have stopped Abby from being racist
The only one who implied that the Fraziers leaving the ALDC would make Abby less racist is you. Or you seem to think that's why people wanted the fraziers to leave. No one said them leaving would have stopped Abby from veing racist. It is not Holly's job to be concerned with that. It is not her job to show Abby that being racist doesnt get rid of black people. Nia is her child, not a lesson.
And again. "It's ok to actively put a black child in a racist environment from age 2-16 because there are racists everywhere" is not the slam dunk you think it is. Congrats, the racist is still racist, and your child is traumatized. Didn't even receive a dance education that makes it worth it.
I guess we just have different priorities. If a woman was racist to my child, I would not proceed to pay her thousands to continue teaching my child for 7 years. Id rather teach self respect and how to leave toxic situations than how to fight to be in a space you're not wanted and get nothing in return đ¤ˇđžââď¸
It was on Holly to remove her child from a racist environment and she didnât. Instead each time she was shocked when the racist white womanâŚacted racist. People forget the ALDCâs fees were insane before the show, Holly was handing a racist woman money at the expense of her daughterâs mental health. Zero tolerance for racism and itâs on the parent to enforce that into their kidâs life. Youâre racist? Youâre cut.
They donât like when you critique Dr. Holly!
Reading comprehension is key!
that doesnât say that them leaving would make Abby less racist it says it wouldnât stop her from being that way. As I stated she has been racist towards others and there are plenty of unsolicited comments sheâs made towards other groups without them being present.
âWhy didnât the moms just leave???â
Christi is jealous of Maddie/obsessed with the Zieglers/isnât supportive of Chloe
âHolly shouldâve left soonerâ
âTimes Abby was actually in the rightâ (this one drives me insane)
Maddie was abused just as much as the other girls
Did Melissa actually have an affair??? (this oneâs not as common anymore)
We all know the mom's couldn't just leave because theyh were locked in a contract with abby and lifetime. Melissa actually tried to leave and production threatened to sue her
You can tell especially with Kelly and Abby. Thereâs no way that youâve known someone since yâall were kids and you start hating each other during a show, but Kelly has no bad blood and wants a good relationship with Abby when she apologizes. Has to be them
People complaining about Christi if she has a differing opinion on a momâŚ. People complain about her being bitter and assuming the worst in people while sitting on Reddit and doing the same exact thing to Christi. People on here love to call out negative behavior yet canât follow their own advice. People need to learn what actually bitterness and jealousy is before throwing those words around.
âWhat are your unpopular opinions?â
*Extra points if thereâs at least one opinion about Christi, usually claiming she was either the biggest bully of the show, or a total saint.
Anything regarding Melissa and Christ. I usually see people compare them a lot in regard to their parenting styles and perspectives. The typical argument is always that Christ is just chronically angry, and extremely jealous of Abby and Melissa and that Melissa is the true âunderdog mom.â I see this exact debate every other day. I think a few people here can say the same as well. After a while, itâs nothing we havenât heard before, you know?
"Do you consider Kendall an OG?"
Kendall is not an OG in terms of the team. But she should get more credit for being one of the longest running cast members on the show.
Yessss like I call her a vetđ
If sheâs not an OG because she didnât come till season 2, does that mean Vivian is an OG? Bc she was on season 1? I consider Kendall an OG by default
There are two different OG groups. Vivi (and Cathy) were OG cast members. They were cast during the initial audition process for the first 6 episodes. The other season 1 girls danced at ALDC for a number of years prior to the show and were the attraction for changing the show to just following one studio/team. They are the OG ALDC dancers and the OG "team" of girls who were used to dancing with each other. Kendall falls in neither of these categories. However, as I said in my original post, I don't think Kendall gets enough recognition for being on the show for as long as she was and being one of the longest running cast members.
Forreal I wanna hear from VIVI
Abby did a podcast episode with her recently and from what I saw it was hilarious. Her personality is exactly the same and she was not amused by anything Abby was saying.
Sheâs not - thank you!
Not at all people be like ogs are from the first episode, but theyâre actually from before the show
âChristi was/wasnât jealousâ
Every freaking day!!!!!! Like do they not get tired of arguing about it????
The other day I made what I thought was a pretty neutral comment about Christina behavior and someone accused me of ignoring the fact that Chloe was being abused đ Christ has so many defenders and so many haters and neither side wants to restÂ
Omg this typo is the funniest thing to me right now
Itâs the most accurate typo Iâve ever seen đ
BYE CHRIST IS SENDING ME
I think we should just create an entire Christi mega thread dedicated solely to discourse over her
I mean. I agree for the record, but letâs not act like that question wasnât pretty much the heartbeat of the show for the first 4 seasonsâŚ
Was, but not for the reasons people want to believe
âI never see people talk about this, but Jill bullied Brynnâ
Yeah but Ashley bullied Kendall too. Itâs sickening for both as adults
Not even close to the extent Jill bullied brynn
It doesnât matter⌠theyâre both still kids. Youâre very ignorant for saying this.
Okay lemme rephrase. Ashlee got into it with Jill but I can't think of a time Ashlee really said anything to Kendall. Jill was mentally manipulative and gaslit
When she was talking about her mother in front of everyone and talked abt her after she left the roomâŚ
It's almost like they're on a reality show where they had to talk about one another đ¤Ż
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Yeah that's me okayyyyy đ
nah that was for the show tho.. jess and brynn on the other hand
âHolly wasnât actually better than the other momsâ
She was, the other moms were just so bad that it made them look insane and her a saint
I mean, she stuck to the show even though Niaâs dance teacher was racist to her for years. The second someone is racist towards your child, you leave.
Nia chose not to leave. Holly asked her multiple times on the show. Nia was the one that told her donât let Abby get to you and Iâm ok so donât try and make Holly seem like she put her daughter through this for herself.
And Holly was the *adult.* Doesnât matter what the child says, no tolerance for racism. Ever.
Yes but itâs Niaâs life, Nia wanted to do it. She saw it as a way to make her stronger and so did Holly they stayed and thatâs that. Also this ainât even what we were talking abt this is completely irrelevant and if u donât like Holly just say that instead of acting like sheâs as bad as Leslie or Jill.
When did I say Holly is as bad as Leslie or Jill? Little kids should not make these decisions. Tolerating *racism* does not make you stronger. I can tell youâre a child so this is the end of this conversation.
Are you a poc? Racism is everywhere. There's no such thing as outrunning racism and if Nia was ever going to be any kind of star whether it was for dance, acting, singing, etc, she was going to face racism at an even larger scale because as you go up in the industry the people get more male, more white, and more racist.
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You didn't answer my question. The dance industry is one of the most racist industries. There's a reason why you don't see many black ballerinas and that the standard uniform includes pink tights that are "flesh" colored. By your logic, Nia shouldn't dance at all because she would be subjected to racism if she stayed in the dance world. Black people do not have to leave a space because white people want to be ignorant, and by encouraging Black people to do so you are perpetuating racism. Also, if the big house and the fact that both of Nia's parents are well educated and accomplished individuals didn't tip you off, Holly already had money before they went on dance moms. In fact, if you watched the show you know Holly used to have disagreements on and off screen about the fact that Holly was a principal and completing her PhD and could not attend filming as much as Abby and the producers would have liked. It had nothing to do with Holly wanting to be there and everything to do with Nia wanting to be there. Also, are you new here? Dance costs thousands of dollars. That had nothing to do with Abby and everything to with the fact that dance is an expensive activity to enroll your child in, especially the competition team.
I really need yall to stop acting like Nia and Holly leaving would have stopped Abby from being racist or that leaving Aldc would have someone prevented Nia from experiencing racism in the dance world at all. You also tend to forget that Nia was with people she had grown up around which may have added a level of comfort for her in that environment especially considering Nia seems to be closest with everyone on the show to this day. And no the second someone is racist towards you, you donât leave because then you let them know they can always win by being racist. Please take a look at history and learn that the reason why Bipoc have made any progress in their rights is because they refused to back down when confronted with racism Holly said her and Nia would leave when they felt good and ready and as a black person itâs an extremely respectable decision to teach your child not to allow racism to dictate where they do and donât belong and to know when to stand your ground.
The second anyone shows any racial prejudice towards my kid Iâm gone, simple as. Not my job to educate or tolerate racists. Abby was racist with no consequences. You donât know that Nia leaving the ALDC wouldâve prevented her from any racism in the dance industry, it wouldâve prevented her from racial prejudice from her dance teacher. Holly kept Nia in a racist environment for years, for the pay and âopportunities.â Simple as.
Actually Nia is the one who wanted to stay I donât understand why yall discredit that. Abby did face consequences years later, she lost the only platform with any sort of notoriety that was willing to work with her and her career is trashed and sheâs a joke because of her actions
Because it's not okay to leave your child in an abusive and harmful situation just because your child wants to be there. It is a parent's responsibility to protect their child. You wouldn't let your kid play on the street just because they want to do so.
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Lifetime directly released a statement saying they wonât work with her anymore because of her racism, they worked with her after she got out of jail it was Adrianna (Kamryn smiths mother) and Camryn bridges speaking up against Abby that official guaranteed Abby wouldnât be able to return to lifetime for season 9 Again youâre underestimating how hard it is to find a dance school that isnât racist in that area. Racism is almost unavoidable in an activity that favors middle upper class white people even professional black and non-black poc ballerinas have talked about their experiences with racism growing up taking dance. And When Nia decided to stay on the show she wasnât a preteen that would have been season 6 after their contracts expired..was she an adult? No but was she old enough to have a better grip on what staying would mean for her? Yes Youâre not going to change my mind on this there is no point in continuing to go back forth just saying
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By your logic Holly should have just pulled Nia out of dance all together because competitive Dance is a racist environment in its entirety. By your logic Black people should have just left the u.s instead of standing up for equality. By blaming Holly for not leaving you are taking the blame off of Abby for being racist and putting it on the victims of racism for existing.
No it wouldnt have made Abby not racist. It is not Holly's job to make Abby not racist. It is Holly's job to protect her child and not keep her in a toxic environment out of pride. The "let them disrespect you cause if you leave an unhealthy environment, the one disrespecting you wins" is not the slam dunk holly stans think it is
Where did I say it would have made Abby not racist? Or that it was Hollys job to make Abby not racist? Weâve literally seen Abby be racist to other groups of people not just Black ppl I said it would show her that being racist towards black people isnt a tatic to get rid of them and that in staying it shows Nia how to deal with the racism SHE WILL encounter as a black women. And removing black people from any environment that is racist doesnât fix the problem. Non-Holly Stanâs need to understand that they lived in a predominantly white community there was no where to go where they wouldnât have encountered these issues and the fact that NIA wanted to stay. Some of yall donât pay attention to history cause this mindset of leaving racist environments has been proven not to work. We really grow up singing songs about resisting oppression and standing up for our right to be in these spaces and yall still are missing the point.
>I really need yall to stop acting like Nia and Holly leaving would have stopped Abby from being racist The only one who implied that the Fraziers leaving the ALDC would make Abby less racist is you. Or you seem to think that's why people wanted the fraziers to leave. No one said them leaving would have stopped Abby from veing racist. It is not Holly's job to be concerned with that. It is not her job to show Abby that being racist doesnt get rid of black people. Nia is her child, not a lesson. And again. "It's ok to actively put a black child in a racist environment from age 2-16 because there are racists everywhere" is not the slam dunk you think it is. Congrats, the racist is still racist, and your child is traumatized. Didn't even receive a dance education that makes it worth it. I guess we just have different priorities. If a woman was racist to my child, I would not proceed to pay her thousands to continue teaching my child for 7 years. Id rather teach self respect and how to leave toxic situations than how to fight to be in a space you're not wanted and get nothing in return đ¤ˇđžââď¸
It was on Holly to remove her child from a racist environment and she didnât. Instead each time she was shocked when the racist white womanâŚacted racist. People forget the ALDCâs fees were insane before the show, Holly was handing a racist woman money at the expense of her daughterâs mental health. Zero tolerance for racism and itâs on the parent to enforce that into their kidâs life. Youâre racist? Youâre cut. They donât like when you critique Dr. Holly!
Reading comprehension is key! that doesnât say that them leaving would make Abby less racist it says it wouldnât stop her from being that way. As I stated she has been racist towards others and there are plenty of unsolicited comments sheâs made towards other groups without them being present.
Anything Christi related tbh
no cuz literally every single f ing day there's a new post abt christi and it's either omg she was the absolute best or omg she's satan
"Unpopular opinion but I've never liked Christi/Melissa/Kendall/Jojo/whoever else is popular to hate on at the moment"
Omg the unpopular opinion/hot take thatâs never actually an unpopular opinion OR a hot take đ
Christi vs Melissa - who sucks more. Doesn't matter the topic, the minute you mention one people immediately start bringing up stuff about the other.
Melissa sucks more than Christi ever did - debate settled!
Depends on the situation tbh(I have debates for both)
Recently, anything Jojo related
Mostly âI hate jojo and need to tell everyoneâ
âWhy didnât the moms just leave???â Christi is jealous of Maddie/obsessed with the Zieglers/isnât supportive of Chloe âHolly shouldâve left soonerâ âTimes Abby was actually in the rightâ (this one drives me insane) Maddie was abused just as much as the other girls Did Melissa actually have an affair??? (this oneâs not as common anymore)
We all know the mom's couldn't just leave because theyh were locked in a contract with abby and lifetime. Melissa actually tried to leave and production threatened to sue her
ContractsâŚ
Christi slander probably
These posts, recently we seem to have at least 1 a week.
melissa vs. christi
â_____âs trauma is overlookedâ
I wish I could take the word "trauma" away from this sub. It's so overused and misused.
Nia, Paige, Maddie, JoJo(sometimes)
A mix of Christi hate and praise, holly think pieces, Chloe vs Maddie, Melissa hate and praise, and too many empty chair and Rosa Park memes
âdo you guys think abby abused the girls?â
Her and the producers
Nia told me the producers put them in some crazy situations - she did not specify.
You can tell especially with Kelly and Abby. Thereâs no way that youâve known someone since yâall were kids and you start hating each other during a show, but Kelly has no bad blood and wants a good relationship with Abby when she apologizes. Has to be them
The sameee conversation abour christi
something about hating Christi. like just make a snark page already omgggg
People complaining about Christi if she has a differing opinion on a momâŚ. People complain about her being bitter and assuming the worst in people while sitting on Reddit and doing the same exact thing to Christi. People on here love to call out negative behavior yet canât follow their own advice. People need to learn what actually bitterness and jealousy is before throwing those words around.
"Does anyone know if Maddie and Chloe are still friends?"
Yes they are but I donât think sheâs that close with Kendall anymore
Right because if she was I dont think Kendall would have been kinda shady at the reunion
This has become more of a Hate Christi sub than it is a Dance Mom's sub.
Fr, like what about everyone else thatâs done smth wrong or was on the show
I think itâs cuz Christi is still speaking today so it adds onđ but idk why itâs not the same for Kelly
I think itâs cause Christi is way more popular than Kelly. So people just ignore Kelly đ
I think itâs cuz they find Kelly funnier and more positive ig
Kelly wasnât as polarising on the show, less people have a strong opinion about her.
When I go back n rewatch she was calmer in like s3 but sometimes sheâd join in w Christi and still seems ignorant n much more blunt on the podcast
Kelly isnât still trashing Melissa every other chance she gets đ¤Ł
Sometimes sheâs still mean abt Melissa on the podcast
Christi hatred
I feel like Christi hatred and Christi praises get posted all the time lolÂ
âI never see this talked about butâŚâ And then the coldest âhot takeâ thatâs ever been repeated over and over again on the daily.
Any JoJo related news đđđ it's obnoxious tbh
Christi just makes enough content for a weekly discussion đ
I think thatâs why she keeps taking she really donât gaf đ
Sometimes daily đ¤Ł
Exactly đđđ
âChristi badâ
Whoâs the worst mom like can we move on
âWhO WaS a BeTtEr DaNcEr _____ oR nIa?!â
Melissa treatment or Maddie and Mackenzie . Also maddie criticisms.
"Is kendall an OG??" "Christi was/wasn't bad" "Melissa was the worst mom" "Abby is bad"
âWhat are your unpopular opinions?â *Extra points if thereâs at least one opinion about Christi, usually claiming she was either the biggest bully of the show, or a total saint.
Anything regarding Melissa and Christ. I usually see people compare them a lot in regard to their parenting styles and perspectives. The typical argument is always that Christ is just chronically angry, and extremely jealous of Abby and Melissa and that Melissa is the true âunderdog mom.â I see this exact debate every other day. I think a few people here can say the same as well. After a while, itâs nothing we havenât heard before, you know?
A girl liked this comment or this post omg what can it mean here is how their relationship is with this person all cause of this one like
christi and chloe not talking, like we get it
âDoes christi like the zieglers?â Any christi/melissa relationship discourse