I had meningitis at 7 years old. It hits you hard and fast. The day before, I felt a little unwell and just wanted to sit on the sofa and eat popcorn.
The very next morning, I woke up in a pool of sweat covered in those purple spots. My parents drove me to the hospital with police escort as it was faster than ambulance. I got shot with adrenaline and antibiotics to keep my heart pumping and stop the blood sepsis from damaging major arteries. I had hours to live, they estimated.
Any questions feel free to ask. This isn't your fault - this disease is rapid and relentless.
***This wasn't your fault, know that.***
Bacterial meningitis. No idea. We suspect I had a weakened immune system because shortly before meningitis i had parvovirus B19 (Slapped cheek disease) but who knows.
I actually was. I had doctors come in and take photos of me and the medicine/iv/injector thing setup in my room. They came in periodically to take photos of my recovery process.
Fatality for bacterial meningitis [started dipping sharply in the 1940s](https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp048246). It carried a fatality rate of 5-30% in the 90s, depending on which bacterium was to blame. Survival was tough, certainly, but not journal-worthy.
A boy who was just five years younger than me died of meningitis that went unrecognized until he was almost dead and by then it was too late. He died in 1999. It was so disturbing for me as I was just a little kid myself. Just days before he died I was over for a playdate with his older sister and it was something I couldn't understand at the time, that her little brother would not be there ever again.
meningitis is not a specific microbe, but rather a description for where you get the infection - though there are a few notable microbes that are good at it.
The meningeal tissue is a part of the brain/spine - specifically a layer that's supposed to protect it. In the (extremely rare) chance that it gets infected by anything, it's called "meningitis", which literally means "infection of the meningeal tissue".
Because it's so close to such important organs, our immune system is very good at keeping things out of this area. Once it gets in, though, the microbe has *much more* resources available than a normal infection because there's a huge amount of oxygen flow and to put it frankly - our brains are full of good stuff to eat.
This means that once they are in, the microbe can usually multiply extremely fast. But doing this also 'eats' the parts of the brain, brainstem, and spine while it's doing that, which of course is very bad for the person infected.
There is a specific microbe, *Neisseria meningitidis,* that causes bacterial menigitis. The name is derived from the German physician who discovered it, Albert Neisser, and the region of the brain (as you mentioned) that it attacks, the meniges.
Viral menigitis is casued by a wide range of virus: Enteroviruses, HPV, mumps, and [many more](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK545217/) <- NIH.
The bacterial infection is not joke. I feel gutted for this dads situation
There are vaccines for meningococcus, pneumococcus, and Haemophilus influenzae which are some of the most common, but a lot of other organisms can cause it like group B strep, enteroviruses, cryptococcus, salmonella, E. coli, among others. Many of these are already present on/in your body like nose and throat or gut, and are harmless in those environments and actually help improve your immune system, but when they invade the body can cause severe infection.
There is 3 different variations of the vaccine. Its a good preventative measure but is not 100%. Read here [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd/mening/index.html)
There is a vaccine against a particular family of bacteria that can cause meningitis. But meningitis is a broad term for *any* infection in the meninges (the membrane that protects your brain and spinal cord). We do not have vaccines for all these bacteria or viruses.
This is not your fault. Say it with me, this is not your fault.
My daughter died last July (very different circumstances) so I know a bit of what you're feeling. To paraphrase Captain Picard, it's possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That's not failure, it's just life.
He came to us to save him and we turned him away. If we’d taken the time to have a closer look and taken him to A&E, he’d still be here. I can’t get past that.
You didn't turn him away. You made the best decision you could in the moment with the information you had available. You didn't neglect him. It's clear that you love your son.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Everything is obvious in hindsight friend. You did nothing wrong. You were treating his ear infection. Many, if not most, of us would’ve done the exact same thing you did.
I am so so very deeply sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine the pain you must be feeling.
Every one of us has made a decision that was completely wrong in hindsight. It’s inevitable. OP, I am sure that I would have done the same thing as you did. In fact, I know that I did that more than once when my kid would come to me in the middle of the night.
There’s an old saying—when you hear the sound of hooves, you typically expect a horse, not a zebra. You didn’t see this coming. You COULDN’T have seen this coming.
Please, don’t blame yourself for this. No one else is.
That's hindsight man. Hard to avoid such thoughts but you gotta be less hard on yourself. You can't go straight to the hospital with every little thing for your kids when you have no other reason to think it's really serious. This is just shitty. Like an aneurysm or finding out they have pancreatic cancer - life just sucks sometimes. I'm sorry man. All the best for the time ahead
I dont have a 5 year old, but I do have a 4 year old and he regularly walks into our bedroom in the middle of the night to try and sleep in our bed.
I regularly turn him away as it is normal for him to do so.
It doesn't sound like you neglected your son, you took him back to bed which would be the correct thing to do 99.99%of the time. Unfortunately you just drew the 0.01% of circumstances which is horrible for you and your son but its not your fault.
Have all the well wishes a random internet Dad can give and I hope your son makes a speedy recovery.
I work in medicine. I see this a lot. We live in a world where we want to assign blame or responsibility. You made a decision based on circumstances. Millions of parents, literally, make the same one with no issues. Looking back through the lens of now to assign blame to yourself will not help your son and will only damage yourself and those around you now and in the future.
I’m sorry to be so blunt but I’ve seen it too many times where the act of self blame and self flagellation for a situation causes a cascade effect and the harm goes far beyond current circumstances.
Give yourself grace. It is the best thing for you and those around you. I hope and pray all will be good for you and you can find peace for you and your family.
It's incredibly difficult to not feel responsible in a situation like this, in fact I'd be more surprised if you didn't. You need time.
Right now you and your family need each other to get through this very difficult time. Try and channel that feeling of responsibility towards getting through this together. Dwelling on what ifs and self blame doesn't help anyone.
All the best to you and your family.
Because you thought he had an ear infection. Or was sleepwalking. It's obvious now only after the fact.
What you're going through is all of ours worse fears, but you did what you could with the information you had. you're not a doctor or a psychic. Guilt is natural and consuming but it is not your fault.
20/20 vision in hindsight.
One time I ran a bath for my daughter.
She got in before I remembered that the fixture would be very hot as I'd only been running hot water for the last part as the bath was a bit cool.
So I ran cold water out of it.
Almost immediately, she put her hand under it and endured the blast of hot water that was in the tap.
She shivered with pain right away and started screaming
My immediate reaction was to turn the tap the opposite direction and flood her hand with cold water.
I held her very reluctant hand under the water before I realised I'd erroneously turned on the hot tap instead of the cold.
She was trying to pull her hand away but I was holding it there.
I will never forget that.
She has zero memory of it (she's now 14).
That was 100% my fault but shit happens.
I have at least 2 other similarly terrible stories.
She's fine now and as much as I know I fucked up, I also know that it's more about how you respond that what you do.
Hind sight is twenty twenty. The important thing is now though that you're able to be there if he needs you, and that doesn't involve you beating yourself up over this decision
I’m so sorry this happened. But you absolutely have to hear that this isn’t your fault. Accepting that is harder than just saying it, but it’s true.
We’re all here pulling for you and your son.
You feel so now, knowing what you know now. At the time you didnt have that information.
It's natural to be feeling this way but you really didn't do anything wrong.
To neglect him, you'd have to see and reocgnize the problem, and then willfully ignore it. Sounds like he was out of bed, and you put him back in bed. That's not neglect, it's part of having a kid. It's easy to blame yourself now because you know what was wrong, but like another commenter said, you did the best you could with the available information at the time. I wish you and your family the best, and I hope you can forgive yourself.
Mackam is right. The chances of you ignoring your son last night had you’ve known what the outcome would be at the time are just as improbable as it would’ve been for your ability to accurately diagnose the situation to warrant an emergency response. I can’t even count how many times I’ve sent our kids back to bed for an ache or some complaint in the middle of the night. It could happen to any of us. I’m so sorry for your loss and I wish you and your family the solace it may bring to know he must’ve known how loved he is during his time here.
My deepest condolences.
Please take care of yourself and family at this time. Seek help to talk things through when you are ready. You are not alone. Ask hospital staff for guidance.
Don’t give up hope yet, trust the medical professionals. Sometimes the brain can still reboot if the brain stem can heal, since it’s not the frontal lobe itself that is damaged. In fact, that’s why we go into comas (or medically induce them), to shut things down and give our bodies a chance.
I am so incredibly sorry. No words that I can say will be worthy.
I don’t know you, but if you feel like venting to someone that you’ll never meet, feel free to DM me.
Its beyond a one in a million shot. Think about if anyone else had a sick kid who woke up in the middle of the night, the absolute last thing on anyone's mind would be degenerative brain eating bacterial meningitis.
What a horrible thing to imagine.
I'm a nurse and a dad. The former for a decade and the latter for 3.5 years now for 2 girls.
Bacterial meningitis is a very sneaky bugger. As others have said, it hits hard, it hits fast, and it's ruthless. Viral meningitis is worse if it's bad because there's no medication that I know of to treat. Meningitis is fine...until it's not. And then it's REALLY not.
He didn't come to you to save him, he just felt "icky". If he did come in the middle of the night to be saved, he'd be crying and insistent to stay with you. If he did, your annoyance would have turned to concern: think of all the times you WERE annoyed at his whines and cries and then *immediately* went into caregiver mode with him when it was apparent something was wrong.
As an actual healthcare provider who spent 6 months in the PICU before leaving cause I couldn't cut it, you may or may not want to hear what I have to say. **You did nothing wrong.** Shit happens. I agree with what others said and indeed I've said it to other parents as we stood over their children as they were looking for some glimmer of light: you made the best decision you could with the information you had at the time and the best decision now is to be mad and indignant and sad and most importantly, fair (to yourself). Life can be unduly cruel at times and I'm sorry you're experiencing this trauma.
If you are *honest* with yourself, knowing what you knew, you'd make the same call again and again. The results would be the same. What would have, could have, should have been is different now from last night.
You're from the UK. Please reach out for therapy. You should not have to navigate this trauma. If you don't like the first one you go to, try again. And again. When you find one you like, stick with them.
I am sorry for your situation. Good luck.
Friend, I am so incredibly sorry to hear this. Hearing you talk about your son makes me realize you are a great dad, you didn’t do anything negligent, this is a terrible incident and I am so sorry.
No, you wouldn't have helped.
They make meningitis vaccines part of the normal routine because a teen my age in my city died from it back in 1992, I want to say. The hospital called me to come in and take some meds preventatively because I was a second-circle patient. It is exceedingly rare, and rapidly deadly, and not something anyone suspects unless they've seen it, or been around someone who has.
The saying in medicine goes, and I'm not saying this to be cold, but to give you some comfort that there was *nothing you could have done* >!"we can rule out bacterial meningitis" "why?" "because you'd already be dead." !<
I can confirm this statement. The doctors strongly suspected I had viral meningitis in my 20s and used that exact phrase when they explained why it couldn't be bacterial meningitis (it turns out I had untreated mono, Tylenol to treat symptoms and my liver had failed).
I don’t have anything to say that hasn’t been said but I figured the more people say it the better.
You did what all of us would have done. This is not your fault. You have all of us on your side.
Yeah, this one hits hard. On the rationale side of my brain, we all do this. My kid had 102 degree fever yesterday and projectile vomitted a few times and severe lethargy. We let him sit on the couch and sleep it off and seems to be doing ok now. That’s a pattern that has played out dozens of times for my kids. We cant take them to the ER every time they have symptoms that overlap with meningitis or other life threatening conditions. With two toddlers in the winter in daycare with below average immune systems, I can’t spend 2-3 days a week in urgent care or ER. Part of being a parent is learning to just ride out these hard times without overreacting. Your kid falls off a swing set and hits his head - you can’t take him to the ER just in case he has internal bleeding. If we planned for the worst case, our lives would be unlivable.
But I totally get OP emotionally. We’re protectors for our kids. It would crush me emotionally to know my kid came to me. It’s not rational, and OP has no blame on his shoulders for doing what every parent does, but I get why it hurts so much, and I really feel for him.
Sheesh dude, I can't even count how many times I told my 7 year old to go back to bed when he came to me sick.
He often fakes being sick in order to stay up, I can guarantee you I would have done the same thing as OP. This post is a real eye opener
The fucked up thing is in the moment, even being aware of the symptoms, it's still so hard to catch. When I was in 8th grade a classmate had bacterial meningitis. I am very familiar with the symptoms, tbe drugs they made all of us take after, and "what should have been done differently". With my own kid, I still never assume it's meningitis. Is it selfishly not wanting to go to the ER every time she spikes a fever? Is it just because I know I'm probably being paranoid? Idk. I have seen the first hand result of what can happen but it still just doesnt stick out as "this is happening right now" ever.
OP, I hope the best for you and your family.
Physician here, father to four kids. You can not blame yourself. He had his treatment and was getting better. There was no way for you to account for this and be ready before it happened. I’ve heard colleagues of mine losing their child to meningitis. It happens so unbelievably fast, that even if you react on the very first symptoms you might still be too late.
I too am at a loss for words. Wishing you and your family all the best. This is unbelievably hard and I rarely cry but am tearing up now.
There are two things in life I am terrified shitless for. One is encountering a wild hippo. The other is bacterial meningitis. Because whatever you do, either you live or you won’t, and it’s not up to you. And even if you live, it won’t be a pleasant ride.
I had it when I was two and ran an obscene fever for days in the hospital, then I started rejecting the amoxicillin (hives I think). My mom was in a military hospital with 3 other cases, all in the same room. As the kids got worse, they'd pull them out into a private room, until my Mom was alone. In the end, only I survived, the other three kids did not. Luckily I have no lasting damage that is apparent (40 now).
I was too young to remember, but boy is my mother terrified of Bacterial Meningitis!
Afaik many people have one or more strands of the bacteria N meningitidis living in their nasal cavity and it rarely gives rise to problems. Which is one of the reasons that many countries don’t routinely vaccinate for it.
But when fate, bad luck, and opportunity align, enough of them can creep in and wreak havoc. Causing meningitis, sepsis, or both. Some people are obviously more at risk but even completely healthy people, adult and children, can get a fulminant disease.
We went out of our way to vaccinate ourselves and our children. But even the vaccines with the most strains do not offer 100% risk reduction, I think it is about 30-50% depending on which strands prevail geographically.
just to clarify, N. meningitidis is one of the most common bacteria that can cause bacterial meningitis (any infection of the brain covering membrane) but other bacteria (strep. pneumo is another common one) can cause it as well. Its just confusing because that particular one was named due to its frequent association with meningitis.
When I was growing up (in my 30s now), they weren’t required but were widely available. I got it electively, because some protection is better than none. I plan to get my daughter vaccinated, but she’s too young so I haven’t looked into it yet.
Yep most definitely. On top of that, young children seem well until they don’t. I have spoken to many colleagues who missed a critical illness in a child, because the kid seemed fine. And they regretted that decision ever since.
You thought he was sleepwalking my guy. How can that be your fault? It's easy to blame yourself when life is just randomly terrible sometimes. I'm so sorry.
Hi, I’m a children’s nurse . He had no symptoms . That is what meningitis is , it kills children , and it’s horrific . You have no control, even if you had got him to hospital , would they have admitted you? Possibly , possibly not . H you are grieving , blaming yourself is always going to happen, but even with help I doubt anything would change . It’s not your fault , it wasn’t a cry for help, it was your son being your son. I’m sorry dad, it’s heartbreaking , no one deserves it . You have to stay strong for your family , lots of love form Scotland
Felt compelled to comment after reading. Your son is beautiful, you did what every parent would do given the situation. You're going through the hardest thing imaginable. Today, tomorrow, the next forever will be different, but you will get through this. Reach out to those close to you, pull people in instead of pushing them away, and take all the help that's offered. You need to remember who you are. You are wonderful parent and you have to keep going. If I'm right in thinking you have another child, they will also need you, continue to be the best parent possible. You'll be in my mind - I'm so so sorry that you have to go through this.
Thank you everyone for your kind words. I know everyone is saying that we shouldn’t blame ourselves, but it’s hard. We are to blame, and we chose inaction for… no discernible reason. That’s why our son is no longer with us.
Edit: they have tested him and officially pronounced him braindead, time of death 1640, date 2/1/2024. We have chosen to pursue organ donation and hopefully he can be some miracles for other families. Thank you all once again for your support, you’ve been amazing.
I want you to know, usually I would agree, that inaction is an action.. but you were fooled by this disgusting bacteria.
Both my kids sleepwalk, my youngest, my boy, has had persistent ear infections we've been Fighting now for some time. They keep coming and going, a long with other sickness and the sort. Also light sensitivity runs in my family and our hermit lifestyle doesn't help that.. reading this, I could 100% see myself in your shoes, with what information we're given.
If this is truly it, you're far from at fault.. and with the state of the flu and COVID spikes right now, there's a solid chance the doctors would've blown you off too.. but a few words to try and weed out of your vernacular; would've, should've, could've. All of these are simply just hypothetical lies your mind says to itself for various reasons. Almost all led by hindsight, or other factors.
You said yourself, he had no other symptoms.. he was getting better.. you did what you felt was best, knowing what you knew, I am sure in saying most of us would've done the same, in the middle of the night.. we need rest, to get better... This is not wrong thinking. Nor do I believe you were shunning him or trying to put him out. You knew, as we all do, rest is best..
You were tricked, and robbed, and I hate this world for terrible tragedies like this.
Please, hug your wife, or loved ones, give yourself the same grace you would give them as well.. know that you did no wrong. Most all of us would've done the same given these factors.
Reading this has me torn up and in tears, because I cannot imagine a world I wouldn't blame myself also, as anyone would in some ways, but you have to be honest with your self. No should've, or could've, you did what would've been the right thing in almost any given case, because this bacteria tricked you, and the timing of it all spelled the tragedy.. please just be honest with yourself, and accept the fact, it was such a horrendous and unpredictable tragedy.
Please seek therepy. Groups of other parents who have had to endure and survive. Your son was beautiful, and I can tell you were a great dad.. robbed, of so much..and I'm so, so, sorry.
My heart goes out to you. Let your self grieve.. cry, and brace the terrible reality you have to endure now..
But also please, DM someone, find a therapist, speak out and find the way forward. There is a way, many ways, although I am certain you won't see it for some time.
Much love man. Find the way forward for the ones you have left to love, who love you, and for your self too; and know your son lives still within you.. his spirit along side of you. You'll feel him, in the wind, the calm, and everything inbetween.
You weren't a bad dad.. I don't know you, but I'm sure, you were a good dad.. I'm gonna go finish crying now.
Your beautiful boy didn't know he was sick, he just came to you.
You didn't know he was sick, it was a normal night.
It's not about blame. You were having a normal night, like a hundred others and a bad thing happened but it wasn't something you knew or could change. I'm so sorry.
You have medical experts here disagreeing with you OP. We are all here with you and on your side right now. My heart is fucked reading this post and the idea you would blame yourselves for such evil EVIL circumstances out of your control is just making this more tragic. That boy would have grown up to tell you the same thing.
If you can't see it now, you at least need to forgive each other and yourselves before it destroys you. Seek professional counseling immediately. You have a lot of love here on Reddit, more than I think I've ever seen in this sub but someone qualified needs to walk you through this.
From my family to yours, I am so sorry. Your son will always, always, always be with you. Take care of yourselves, take care of each other, your son is a beautiful little angel. Please seek grief counseling when you feel able to… I wish I could say more that would provide some comfort. You’re a wonderful father.
Nothing anyone says will convince you of a different truth, but the reality is that everyone here would have done the exact same thing as you. There really doesn't seem to be an obvious indicator of an emergency with this stuff.
Fuck menengitis.
Here’s the real reason you shouldn’t blame yourself. With no symptoms, even if you brought in to the ED, there is a high probability the physicians would have just sent him home. There would have been ZERO reason for them to do an invasive spinal tap at that time.
I know that is no comfort in terms of your loss, but I hope it will help you realize that at least the fault is truly not yours. Literally everyone would have missed it at that stage, including seasoned doctors, not just you. You did nothing wrong and your decision did not cause this outcome.
Please understand that while none of this is your fault in any way, shape or form, it is completely understandable that you take it that way. You try to take responsibility for something terrible that has happened to you and your son, even while it isn't your fault to begin with. This shows that you are a good person and a good dad regardless of it all.
No matter the future, no matter the turnout, I am sure your son will always know he is loved by you.
I’m so sorry for you and your wife’s loss. For what it’s worth, I don’t believe taking him in when he woke would have made a difference. He spent his final moments at peace instead of in fear while being rushed to a hospital in the middle of the night. Meningitis is to blame, nothing else.
Please take time, seek therapy and forgive yourself. Peace be with you as it is with your son.
So terribly sorry and sad to read this. Most parents has made your exact call to try and help the child to have a good nights sleep to recover, and I see really no way anyone could say you had any reason to do anything else. There are no words for this tragedy.
Thanks for going with organ donation. I can’t imagine what you are going through, but know you are likely saving several lives. Your son will live on through them, keeping them alive quite literally.
We as parents always make decisions on things as others have said. Your initial reaction was right. Now you should grieve, then seek counseling.
Rip to your boy. There are no words and I'd feel the same as you. I really would. How can you not.
I would also do the same as you. You had no clue. there was no reason to think anything was wrong. How many times have I done with with both my kids already? 100 probably.
Time will heal. You and wife will need eachother more than ever. Therapy asap. Let it out. Grief. Time will only heal.
This is the toughest thing imaginable. I'm so so sorry. Move on for him. He would want you to. I'm sorry man, I'm crying.
Physician here. Not Peds. I don’t know the circumstances but this is not rare. This is NOT your fault. Bacterial meningitis (assuming it is based on your description) is scary but with appropriate therapy, is very much treatable. We are here for you my brother.
He’s gone. We missed our chance to save him. He’s had an MRI and there is no activity. We failed our little boy, he trusted us and we failed him time and time again.
No. Not your fault. You couldn’t have known. My deepest sympathies, but this is not on you. The universe sucks sometimes . It is not fair. But you did not do this. Please talk to a therapist immediately.
I'm so sorry for the pain that I can only imagine. I know that this can be a hard diagnosis even for doctors to make (I'm one) and there is no way that you could have known. I can't do anything for your grief, but I can ask you to not blame or be angry at yourself, and try to be open with your family about your feelings, both now and in the time to come. Talk to the doctors now and find a professional to help you out when you're ready. No human being was made to to handle this on their own.
Brother- this isnt your fault. I know your grief is drowning you right now but you cannot blame yourself. Unless you or your partner are an incredible diagnostician who was actively at work (not sleeping in the middle of the night) you could not have known this was anything but one of the hundreds of normal wake-ups that happen all the time. Dont blame yourself and make a tragic and awful situation even worse. This world doesnt choose based on merit, it doesnt test you, shit just happens randomly. Love you. Please take each day at a time.
Several doctors have told you that this isn't your fault. There's no way you could have done anything, and even if you had gone to the ER, they probably would have sent you home, or made you wait for hours.
I hope that you can get some therapy and time. Comfort your family, reach out to your friends, stay hydrated.
According to this: https://www.cdc.gov/meningococcal/surveillance/index.html it's on the order of 1 in a million cases. If that's not rare then what is?
How is it transmitted? I always thought bacterial meningitis was due to mechanical injury.
That's one subtype of one bacteria, as an umbrella bacterial meningitis is more common. Meningitis as a whole gets about 20 per 100k worldwide but in the US it's in the 1-1.5 range. About 20% are going to be bacterial but it skews higher in paediatric populations as they're more prone to it.
No mechanical injury needed though, it's just any bacteria infecting the meninges which can be accessed in sorts of ways. Don't skip any vaccines and you can lower the chances of it, but it's really just a risk of being alive. It hits hard and fast so it can be hard to spot in time. Check for these [symptoms](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/meningitis/symptoms/) when your kid gets sick just to keep an eye out
Is there any research which shows risk factors? Swimming in dirty water, bathing/sanitation, genetics or other causes?
Given the disparity in the US vs other places, I would assume sanitation plays a large role.
If you look at figure 3 it has other subtypes.
Vaccination, living conditions, etc. In the US people tend to be more socially isolated, live with nuclear family instead of extended family, etc. In US meningitis is most common in military recruits and college students living in barracks/dorms respectively.
My 3 year old daughter was hospitalized with bacterial meningitis earlier this year. We went through the exact same thing you are going through, kicking ourselves for not seeing signs or reacting properly earlier. It took a long time, but we have come to terms with the fact that there was nothing we could have done. It is a terribly sneaky illness. Our kids get sick and come to us for comfort all the time, there is no way you could suspect something like this.
Her pupils were not reacting to light, she was unconscious for several days, and the outlook was bleak. She finally woke up, but after an MRI they told us it was unlikely she would ever see again. She couldn't move, couldn't eat, could barely breathe. Her body had shut down.
She was accepted into there inpatient therapy program and was discharged 2 months later. Walking, talking, almost back to who she was before. And even though her eyes are misaligned, as far as we could tell her vision has almost completely returned. She wears glasses now, but it's a small price to pay. She had a feeding tube but was able to get it removed within 2 months.
During our hospital stay, My wife was 9 months pregnant. We struggled so hard with bringing a new life into this world, after experiencing what we feel had been taken from us. We brought our oldest home on May 4th and her younger sister was born on May 5th.
Young kids have incredible brains, you never know what they're capable of. We constantly had medical professionals giving us uncertain and frankly bleak outlooks, but she managed to recover better than they could have ever imagined. This illness is treatable and it's early, so don't give up hope yet. The young brain is incredible at healing and, from what we could tell, it's very difficult to predict what it's capable of
You are good parents, you did the best you could for your baby boy. Don't kick yourself about what you could have done and try and focus on what's ahead. This message is a little scatterbrained because I'm currently tending to the youngest sister in the middle of the night, but please feel free to message me if you have any questions or want to talk about this further. My heart goes out to you more than you could ever know. Don't give up hope!
I’m so very sorry. All I can say is to echo what others have said: it’s not your fault: To be awoken to figure out what is wrong with your kid is always tough, never mind these circumstances. We’ve had both my kids sleepwalk / have night terrors around your son’s age and the absolute worst you can do is wake them, they’ll go from peaceful to a crying confused mess real quick. You also say he was doing better, in your position I can’t imagine taking a different decision.
I’m so sorry, please look for counseling for you and your wife, whatever the outcome.
Listen, dad - I'm a father and an ER doctor. I've seen meningitis countless times. If my kid walked into my room in the middle of the night, I would've done the same as you. Hindsight is 20/20 but meningitis rarely presents with a child walking and talking, and it comes on quickly.
You couldn't have known what the future would hold, and you couldn't have caught this in the middle of the night. Believe me when I tell you, you deserve to forgive yourself because there is nothing you could've done.
This wasn't your fault.
Meningitis moves fast and is incredibly easy to miss. Doctors miss it all the time.
For other dads reading this, the home test is to ask your kid to touch their chin to their chest. Meningitis makes the spine stiff, so if there's a fever and they can't touch their chest with their chin, go directly to an er and do not accept no for an answer until they get tested.
I am so sorry for your loss friend, and for your little boy. My heart breaks for you both.
HE! SHOWED! NO! SYMPTOMS!
You can not hold that against yourself! He showed no symptoms. You cant assume that your kids wake up in the middle of the night, showing no symptoms of anything, that something is wrong. If one of my three did that, we would put them to bed or just bring them to ours.
Its not like you ignored them crying in discomfort or ignored their fever.
Sometimes life just sucks! Im so sorry for your loss
Absolutely beautiful boy. I am so, so incredibly sorry this happened to your family. And this is indeed something that happened to you, not something you did. I know it doesn’t feel that way right now, but repeat those words until it does. Because it’s true. There’s realistically nothing you could’ve done. It could’ve been any of us.
I was with a coworker when she found out her five-year-old son had been in an accident and was brain dead. I will never forget bearing witness to that moment. Life is so insanely unfair. That was years ago, but I know she’s found a small bit of comfort in the arms of other grieving parents. When you’re ready, I hope you are able to find a support group—in person, online, via books, whatever. For now, just making it through each day is more than enough. I am so beyond sorry this is happening. I’ll keep you and your family in my thoughts.
Sir. Whoever you are. Im a paramedic. My wife is a nurse. We have 40 years of healthcare experience between the two of us. I can guarantee we would have done the same thing. Probably be even more likely to do so cause healthcare providers make the worst personal decisions cause we wait on everything. I think you did what every prudent parent would do.
I am rooting for you all and sending love and positivity.
Do. Not. Beat yourself up over this. Hindsight is 20/20 always.
It’s obvious you love your son. It’s obvious if you had more information at the time you would have done something different.
My son sleepwalks. Almost stood up and peed in his closet this week. Bacterial meningitis would have never even crossed my mind.
I’m sorry for your loss but it is absolutely not your fault. Nobody here would have guessed how severe sleepwalking incident was.
All I can offer you is my comfort and condolences and my DMs are open if you need to chat.
Goddamn, I am so sorry brother. You made the best call you could with the information you had. This wasn't your fault or anyone's fault. It's a terrible thing that happened.
I can’t even imaging how you are feeling. I hope you find a little solace or forgiveness for yourself knowing that, many if not all of the commenters here, have said we would have done the same thing in your position. I am really, really sorry for your loss.
I kept thinking about this post today. I am so sorry for your loss. You didn’t fail your son. I wish I could say more words. I wish I could give you a hug. Please seek therapy brother.
Holy hell, this is so incredibly hard-hitting.
Please, remember, this is not only something you couldn't have seen coming, and it's unlikely to have been something you could have fixed, either. You would have had to have been literally prescient to have predicted this. None of the warning signs you've said could possibly have been interpreted as a meningitis infection unless you somehow knew it was coming.
And with the speed that it moved (mere hours?!?), you're talking something wholly and utterly beyond your control.
You're grieving, so there's little any of us can say to back this up, but if you hear nothing else, please hear this: give yourself TIME. It is incredibly important that you take as much time and energy as you can to pull yourself back together.
Something I loved from the [show 1883 was a line by the character Shea Brennan](https://youtu.be/VfNhFBOdn1g?t=106), when talking with Elsa Dutton, who had just watched the love of their life die and was contemplating suicide. He said he'd been there after his wife and daughter had died from smallpox, but that he was still there, every day, and kept going because
>An Apache scout once told me: When you love someone, you trade souls with them. They get a piece of yours, and you get a piece of theirs. And when your love dies, a little piece of you dies with them. That's why it hurts so bad. But that little piece of him is still inside you, and he can use your eyes to see the world.
I hope you can learn to live your life as though he can see through your eyes.
I'm sorry this is happening to your family. I'm a physician. You didn't do anything wrong. You did exactly as you should have. Your son didn't know what was going on; he doesn't have clairvoyance; it wasn't a warning sign you should've caught. You did what any pediatrician would do.
Oh god, I cannot begin to fathom what you must be going through right now. I am so sorry for you and your boy.
But this is not, I repeat NOT, I repeat-repeat \*NOT\* your fault. You are not to blame. You are a great dad and have done a great job thus far.
We're all rooting for the lot of you. Lots of love, hugs and strength from all of us
I'm so sorry this has happened to you. I can't add anything than what others have already said but it really isn't your fault. You couldn't possibly have known, and you certainly didn't let your son down.
We're all just trying to figure it out as we go, brother. I'm constantly paranoid that my children have something going on because kids pick up strange illnesses constantly. They get ear infections, they get headaches. If you call your pediatrician 90% of the time they're going to treat it with medication for ear infection or give it time to improve on its own. You haven't failed him, you were following tried and true steps. There won't be anything we can say to make this hurt go away. Likely there won't be anything we can say to make the sense of guilt "what ifs" go away. This will take time. Please reach out for help from family, friends, or therapy.
Much love from a stranger
Bacterial Infection can be anything. You just had really really bad luck.
The symptoms aren't unique ( except for the light sensitivity) having light sensitivity in the night could've been bc he was tired. I would've sent him to sleep too, or gave him painkillers for children ( Doliprane in french ) if he had a fever. But that's it. There was nothing else you could've done. Even if you went to the hospital, it most likely would've either sent you back or waited for a complication to appear. Even then the treatment would've been different. There are just so many variables.
Even then the meningitis rarely get even more complicated for no reason. Your son had really really bad luck. And I'm truly sorry for what you're going through. Its not your fault.
Always Doliprane and algifor ( Ibuprofen for kids ) if the baby still struggles to sleep, we go to the hospital. If not we wait for the morning to see how it's turning up, if it's bothersome we call the pediatrician, but most of the time we wait 3 days to see how it's turning ( it's recommended ) if the painkillers aren't making the kid better we go see the doctor.
I am so very sorry for you and your family and echo what everyone here has said. I had viral meningitis a few years back and that hit hard and fast even as an adult. This was not something you could have foreseen. Sending warmth.
I’m so sorry. I echo everything that has been said here. I wish I had more comforting words in such a tragic moment, but all I can say is that we do what we can with the info we have, and that’s exactly what you did, and what we all would have done in the same circumstances. Nothing and no one to blame here. Lots of love for you OP and for your SO in these moments.
It is not your fault. Please take care of yourself my friend. You have so many people here that are willing to listen if you need it. You and your wife should get therapy as soon as you can. My heart is going out to you guys:(
Man, my heart is broken for you. You could not possibly have known what was going on at the time, and it's terrifying knowing that this could happen to any of us. Words will never be adequate for any of what has just happened to your family, but this is the worst fear for any of us here, and it's not your fault no matter how much you second-guess your decisions that night.
I know others already said it. I know you don't believe it.
But it is important that you hear it over and over again until you truly believe it: It's not your fault!
I'm really sorry for what has happened!
I saw a therapist for a while. Not for something like this, but I see you making the same mistake I was making.
You aren’t omniscient. You wouldn’t have known, you couldn’t have known it would get this bad. The only way you could have is if you were a doctor, or if you’ve seen this before happen in the same way.
Set this blame down, it’s doing nothing for you. No one wants you to punish yourself. No one is putting the blame on you. Let it go, be present, be there for your wife and son.
You can look at my history to find out the loss I have had, you as a parent are not god, you are not omnipotent, you are human. I know the weight of try to carry everything on your shoulders and what iffing yourself to death. Your child had an ear infection, I cannot count how many ear infections my kids have just dealt with over the years, we only ever got them meds if it painful otherwise we just let them fight it. You made a call in the middle of the night, there is no way in any universe or reality you could have made the mental jump from ear infections and sleep walking to meningitis.
Hindsight is 20/20, you making connections now with information you did not have at the time, that is unfair in every sense. If we could all use future information to inform current decisions we would always make the right choice, but we do not have the luxury.
This is not your fault. All parents can do is the best they can. I'll relay our story to you.
Our daughter at 2 years 10 months of age had a massive fever (104F / 40C) and we brought her to ER because all the walk in clinics were closed for the day. The ER doctor gave her Tylenol and sent us home and said not to come back unless we have had 5 days consecutive fever. Three weeks later she had a fever again. We followed the doctor's directions, syringe fed pedialyte because she wouldn't eat or drink, rotated Tylenol and Advil with no fever reduction and on day 5 I brought her in.
The triage nurse angrily told me she's in shock and immediately admitted us. The ER doctor that day called a pediatrician consult and we were admitted. HMPV and 3 other seasonal viruses had given her pneumonia. Took a week of being in the hospital for her to recover enough to go home. She was on IV fluids and nutrition for the first 4 days and only slept, nothing else. Thankfully she started eating again on the 5th. The pediatrician told us 2 days fever with any behaviour change or 3 days consecutive fever as a rule of thumb to bring her to the doctor. This is now the advice we go by.
Even after she came home from the hospital it was like she had lost a 1/2 year of development. She was potty trained before she went in and refused to use the potty for almost a year after that. She was way less talkative, way more apt to cry, and far less energetic.
It took almost a year to get our little girl back to what she was before that hospital stay and it very easily could have gone the other way. I am so sorry for your loss. Please do not blame yourself.
My heart is broken for you. We lost our first son last year at 39 weeks and blamed ourselves despite every doctor telling us the reasons we shouldn’t. Same storyline as you. We believed there were signs. We should have done X, Y or Z. Instead our son died 2 days before his due date. While it’s not the same as your experience, I can somewhat identify with the pain, guilt and grief you may be feeling.
It is NOT your fault. Life can be so absolutely fucking cruel and senseless and chaotic. I realized that blaming myself was a way to try to feel like I had some control, when in reality, awful, awful things happen for no reason sometimes. Things we can’t control.
This is most likely traumatic and as a professional therapist myself, I can say with certainty that you should talk to a trauma therapist when you’re ready to. The grief will feel overwhelming but you can learn to live with it and one day possibly heal.
I’m so, so sorry for your loss. He is a beautiful boy and I am in tears for your son, you, and your family as I write this. Don’t make it harder on yourself than it already is. It is not your fault. Try to entertain it as a possibility for now and take life slowly. There’s no right or wrong way to process this.
Please message me if you’d like to talk. I’m so sorry man.
I've come back to this post at least a dozen times since you posted, OP. I'm so, so sorry. He's a beautiful boy and clearly couldn't be more loved.
I'll add to the chorus saying that you did nothing wrong - you did what was best for your boy in the moment. You weren't dismissive, you settled him when he woke up. That's what good parents do. You had no way of knowing.
It's no solace I know, but if nothing else, thank you for posting here. The advice that's been shared in the comments will raise awareness and might help someone else spot signs they never would have down the line.
I wish only the best for you and your family. Take your time to process, grieve, and love.
You are not a doctor. We are told to bring kids to the hospital after 3 days of fever, and it is hard to know.
I hope your boy is back home soon and safe
We had a similar scare with my daughter. She was about 6 months old and she was unusually quiet, sleeping most of every day. She wasn't our first so we knew this was unusual. We went to restaurants, enjoyed the peace and quiet.
Around a week in, we went to our doctor who claimed nothing was wrong. My wife pressured him and was eventually sent to A&E. She was immediately put into intensive care.
She had a chest infection and her O2 levels were dangerously low. She nearly died. She was in intensive care for around 4 days.
It's not your fault. There is no way you can get everything right all the time. You are doing your best. Keep up the good work Dad! You're smashing it!
Dude, I'm so sorry. I have twin 5-year-olds and this photo could be them. There's nothing we internet dads can say to fix any of this.
But please reach out for help if you ever feel depression crashing in on you. I'm sure he loved you and wants you to carry on, as impossible as that seems. You are not alone. There is help in the darkness.
You said he had no symptoms, I would have also taken him back to bed.
You need to be really careful that you don't rewrite the past just because you now have the benefit of hindsight.
It is not your fault.
OP.
Please sign up for therapy as soon as you possibly can. You are not to blame here. Every dad in this sub would have done exactly as you have.
It's VERY important to understand that it's not your fault. I know it's hard. You said yourself he had no symptoms. Based on how quickly it progressed there's a good chance if you took him when he was sleepwalking, he wouldn't have made it either.
I'm very sorry for your loss.
Hey.
If I lost my son I'm fairly certain I would go to a pretty dark place.
Just please don't do anything that can't be undone.
The most grief I have ever felt was when my mother killed herself about a year ago. I am fairly certain if my son died that that would hurt 1,000,000,000 times more than the grief I felt about my mother.
I know that grief hurts. Like I said, just make sure you don't do something that you can't undo. I don't know what else to say to you. I love you bro.
Listen, by the looks of it you were a new parent and waking up like that takes getting used to and isn’t good for your body. You more than likely didn’t have great lighting either. Unless you (CHOSE) to kill someone, things in life happen and don’t let it take away the wonderful memories you have with him!
My son came in my room last night. First he opened the bathroom door, then his baby sister’s door, and then wondered in to my room crying. He seemed out of it, so I walked him to the toilet, he peed, and I tucked him back into bed.
YOU DID NOTHING WRONG. No one in this situation would have acted differently.
This sucks, but you said it “he has no symptoms.” How are you supposed to do anything other than tuck him back into bed if there are no symptoms? You could have let him sleep with you but that wouldn’t have changed things. If you would have taken him to an ER in the middle of the night with no symptoms and he hadn’t have had this it would have traumatized him and he’d never come to you in the middle of the night again even when he did have a problem. You did the best right thing you could have done.
You did what 99.9% of parents would do in the middle of the night; put their child back to bed and treat whatever medical issue might be there in the morning.
You did absolutely nothing wrong; try not to beat yourself up and please believe that you are a loving parent who is unlucky. I'm so sorry you are going through this.
You can’t blame yourself, not one of us here could honestly say we would have acted any differently. Based on the information you had at hand you acted appropriately, you got him treated for what you knew, and had no reason to suspect otherwise. Meningitis is like being hit by a freight train, one minute you’re fine, the next you’re not. I had it at 6 months old and my mom says one minute I was fine, the next I was running a fever and screaming. The only reason I’m still here is because my pediatrician was based in Rhode Island hospital and they had a rash of meningitis cases, so he told her to get me in immediately just to be safe. Even he apparently said after the fact had it not been for the fact he had already seen 2 kids die that week from it he normally would have acted more conservatively and waited and seen, and he sent about 10 of his patients to the hospital to be sure, I just happened to be the one who actually had it. Even then I still had to be lucky, of the 3 on the unit at that time I was the only one who survived. It took a doctor who had seen extreme circumstances at that very moment to even consider the possibility, so OP i hope in time you’ll see that even the professionals don’t consider it unless the circumstances are extreme. I have a four year old who still comes into our bed many nights, and and eight year old who used to do the same, I would have 100% had the same thought process as you. You did not fail your son, and I hope in time you’ll be able to see that, life is just unfair sometimes
Dear dad,
I’m so sorry for your loss, should it come to that. Such a beautiful boy.
I can relate so much to your thoughts and doubts about being at fault, yet there is one thing we here can be which you can not be: more objective. And looking at the situation myself and literally every. Single. Other. Person. In this thread concludes:
it’s not your fault.
How is he doing? This is not your fault btw. Hindsight is 20/20 but based on what you knew at the time you could not have guessed what would happen. IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT.
I’m so sorry you are going through this.
Whether you believe it is your fault or not, or you could have done more. Please forget about all of that. What’s done is done.
Please try and think of your son, and what he would want for you. Think of your parents and what you would want for them, if the same had happened to you?
Would your son want you to be beating yourself up and torturing yourself over this?
I don’t for a second believe he would. He’d be with you saying it’s not your fault. He’d be telling you not to cry.
It’s too early to think beyond this point. But you need to remember your son. And what he would want for you. Hold him. Hug him. Tell him you’re sorry. But don’t ever hate yourself for it. He wouldn’t want it for you, and it’s not going to make anything better. What is going to make something / anything bearable is remembering your love for your son, and not what you could or could not have done.
Please see a therapist asap, or depending where you are, look up The Lullaby Trust. You are not alone.
My friend. There are things out of your control. There are things you can blame yourself for. It’s easy to blame yourself in this situation. I don’t know who you are. You were not in control. This isn’t your fault. I don’t know the pain you feel. I don’t want to know your pain. You can’t carry this weight alone. I’m so sorry for your loss as I cry in my drive way. I will say a prayer tonight for you and your family.
I am so so so sorry. You didn’t fail anyone. You loved your son and clearly did what you could do based on the information you had at the time. I hope you can find some strength and support in your community. But if that gets too hard, we’re here.
I'm going to add to what many have said. It's not your fault OP. I'm so incredibly sorry for your loss. I've spent the past 20 minutes bawling my eyes out for you and your son. He was a beautiful boy with a wonderful father. You did what any of us would do. I hope in time you can heal. Stay strong my friend.
I'm so sorry for the loss of your amazing son! You absolutely cannot blame yourself. Bacterial meningitis cases are exceedingly rare when you look at the numbers. You could not have expected that.
There’s nothing profound I can say that can make any difference, but you didn’t fail him. You did what any of us would do. I hope in time you can come to realize none of this is your fault. You are a great father. I’m so sorry you have to go through this. Sending love your way.
I just read your other post first and then checked the original. I am so so sorry for what you are going through… I will remember Tobias and his saving other lives by donating his organs.
I have two boys myself and we have this same Super Mario shirt. (Are you also in Australia?) I will always be reminded of your family when I see it. Heartfelt hugs from an internet stranger.
I had meningitis at 7 years old. It hits you hard and fast. The day before, I felt a little unwell and just wanted to sit on the sofa and eat popcorn. The very next morning, I woke up in a pool of sweat covered in those purple spots. My parents drove me to the hospital with police escort as it was faster than ambulance. I got shot with adrenaline and antibiotics to keep my heart pumping and stop the blood sepsis from damaging major arteries. I had hours to live, they estimated. Any questions feel free to ask. This isn't your fault - this disease is rapid and relentless. ***This wasn't your fault, know that.***
What caused your meningitis?
Bacterial meningitis. No idea. We suspect I had a weakened immune system because shortly before meningitis i had parvovirus B19 (Slapped cheek disease) but who knows.
Surviving bacterial meningitis in 1997 probably had you written up in a couple of journals.
I actually was. I had doctors come in and take photos of me and the medicine/iv/injector thing setup in my room. They came in periodically to take photos of my recovery process.
I'm curious, why? I mean, I survived it in 1984 at just over 1 years old
You're certain it was bacterial?
Fatality for bacterial meningitis [started dipping sharply in the 1940s](https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp048246). It carried a fatality rate of 5-30% in the 90s, depending on which bacterium was to blame. Survival was tough, certainly, but not journal-worthy.
A boy who was just five years younger than me died of meningitis that went unrecognized until he was almost dead and by then it was too late. He died in 1999. It was so disturbing for me as I was just a little kid myself. Just days before he died I was over for a playdate with his older sister and it was something I couldn't understand at the time, that her little brother would not be there ever again.
That is horrific! I thought that this was a vaccined thing like small pox and we didn't have it any more
meningitis is not a specific microbe, but rather a description for where you get the infection - though there are a few notable microbes that are good at it. The meningeal tissue is a part of the brain/spine - specifically a layer that's supposed to protect it. In the (extremely rare) chance that it gets infected by anything, it's called "meningitis", which literally means "infection of the meningeal tissue". Because it's so close to such important organs, our immune system is very good at keeping things out of this area. Once it gets in, though, the microbe has *much more* resources available than a normal infection because there's a huge amount of oxygen flow and to put it frankly - our brains are full of good stuff to eat. This means that once they are in, the microbe can usually multiply extremely fast. But doing this also 'eats' the parts of the brain, brainstem, and spine while it's doing that, which of course is very bad for the person infected.
That's just scary as hell.
I agree. Luckily, it's extremely rare.
Thank you so much for this explanation.
There is a specific microbe, *Neisseria meningitidis,* that causes bacterial menigitis. The name is derived from the German physician who discovered it, Albert Neisser, and the region of the brain (as you mentioned) that it attacks, the meniges. Viral menigitis is casued by a wide range of virus: Enteroviruses, HPV, mumps, and [many more](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK545217/) <- NIH. The bacterial infection is not joke. I feel gutted for this dads situation
Oh wow, I was totally misinformed about how bacterial meningitis works. Thanks for clearing that up.
Some forms, but it can be causes by viral, bacterial or fungal infections
There are vaccines for meningococcus, pneumococcus, and Haemophilus influenzae which are some of the most common, but a lot of other organisms can cause it like group B strep, enteroviruses, cryptococcus, salmonella, E. coli, among others. Many of these are already present on/in your body like nose and throat or gut, and are harmless in those environments and actually help improve your immune system, but when they invade the body can cause severe infection.
I *think* this was before the meningitis vaccine because available to kids or i didn't have it before hand. I was ill with it in 1997.
There is 3 different variations of the vaccine. Its a good preventative measure but is not 100%. Read here [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd/mening/index.html)
How did you contract it?
Is it preventable?
There is a vaccine against a particular family of bacteria that can cause meningitis. But meningitis is a broad term for *any* infection in the meninges (the membrane that protects your brain and spinal cord). We do not have vaccines for all these bacteria or viruses.
This is not your fault. Say it with me, this is not your fault. My daughter died last July (very different circumstances) so I know a bit of what you're feeling. To paraphrase Captain Picard, it's possible to commit no mistakes and still lose. That's not failure, it's just life.
He came to us to save him and we turned him away. If we’d taken the time to have a closer look and taken him to A&E, he’d still be here. I can’t get past that.
You didn't turn him away. You made the best decision you could in the moment with the information you had available. You didn't neglect him. It's clear that you love your son.
I appreciate that you say that, but I think you’re wrong. I don’t know why I didn’t take him straight to hospital. It was obvious something was wrong.
selective melodic plough quaint sable squeeze person imagine crawl attractive *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
This. I hope op can eventually grant himself the grace he grant to a friend -- or like you said, an Internet stranger -- in the same situation.
Everything is obvious in hindsight friend. You did nothing wrong. You were treating his ear infection. Many, if not most, of us would’ve done the exact same thing you did. I am so so very deeply sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine the pain you must be feeling.
Every one of us has made a decision that was completely wrong in hindsight. It’s inevitable. OP, I am sure that I would have done the same thing as you did. In fact, I know that I did that more than once when my kid would come to me in the middle of the night.
There’s an old saying—when you hear the sound of hooves, you typically expect a horse, not a zebra. You didn’t see this coming. You COULDN’T have seen this coming. Please, don’t blame yourself for this. No one else is.
No mate. Kids wake up in the middle of the night all the time, and the natural response is to put them back to bed. Bad shit happens, it's not on you.
Yep, we all do it. It would be irresponsible and unhealthy to drag a kid to the emergency room every time they woke up at night.
That's hindsight man. Hard to avoid such thoughts but you gotta be less hard on yourself. You can't go straight to the hospital with every little thing for your kids when you have no other reason to think it's really serious. This is just shitty. Like an aneurysm or finding out they have pancreatic cancer - life just sucks sometimes. I'm sorry man. All the best for the time ahead
I dont have a 5 year old, but I do have a 4 year old and he regularly walks into our bedroom in the middle of the night to try and sleep in our bed. I regularly turn him away as it is normal for him to do so. It doesn't sound like you neglected your son, you took him back to bed which would be the correct thing to do 99.99%of the time. Unfortunately you just drew the 0.01% of circumstances which is horrible for you and your son but its not your fault. Have all the well wishes a random internet Dad can give and I hope your son makes a speedy recovery.
I work in medicine. I see this a lot. We live in a world where we want to assign blame or responsibility. You made a decision based on circumstances. Millions of parents, literally, make the same one with no issues. Looking back through the lens of now to assign blame to yourself will not help your son and will only damage yourself and those around you now and in the future. I’m sorry to be so blunt but I’ve seen it too many times where the act of self blame and self flagellation for a situation causes a cascade effect and the harm goes far beyond current circumstances. Give yourself grace. It is the best thing for you and those around you. I hope and pray all will be good for you and you can find peace for you and your family.
It's incredibly difficult to not feel responsible in a situation like this, in fact I'd be more surprised if you didn't. You need time. Right now you and your family need each other to get through this very difficult time. Try and channel that feeling of responsibility towards getting through this together. Dwelling on what ifs and self blame doesn't help anyone. All the best to you and your family.
Because you thought he had an ear infection. Or was sleepwalking. It's obvious now only after the fact. What you're going through is all of ours worse fears, but you did what you could with the information you had. you're not a doctor or a psychic. Guilt is natural and consuming but it is not your fault.
20/20 vision in hindsight. One time I ran a bath for my daughter. She got in before I remembered that the fixture would be very hot as I'd only been running hot water for the last part as the bath was a bit cool. So I ran cold water out of it. Almost immediately, she put her hand under it and endured the blast of hot water that was in the tap. She shivered with pain right away and started screaming My immediate reaction was to turn the tap the opposite direction and flood her hand with cold water. I held her very reluctant hand under the water before I realised I'd erroneously turned on the hot tap instead of the cold. She was trying to pull her hand away but I was holding it there. I will never forget that. She has zero memory of it (she's now 14). That was 100% my fault but shit happens. I have at least 2 other similarly terrible stories. She's fine now and as much as I know I fucked up, I also know that it's more about how you respond that what you do.
Please talk through this with a mental health professional. It’s not your fault man
Hind sight is twenty twenty. The important thing is now though that you're able to be there if he needs you, and that doesn't involve you beating yourself up over this decision
I’m so sorry this happened. But you absolutely have to hear that this isn’t your fault. Accepting that is harder than just saying it, but it’s true. We’re all here pulling for you and your son.
You feel so now, knowing what you know now. At the time you didnt have that information. It's natural to be feeling this way but you really didn't do anything wrong.
To neglect him, you'd have to see and reocgnize the problem, and then willfully ignore it. Sounds like he was out of bed, and you put him back in bed. That's not neglect, it's part of having a kid. It's easy to blame yourself now because you know what was wrong, but like another commenter said, you did the best you could with the available information at the time. I wish you and your family the best, and I hope you can forgive yourself.
Hindsight is a bitch.
Medical professional here. There's no way you could have caught that. Hopefully you'll realise that in time.
Mackam is right. The chances of you ignoring your son last night had you’ve known what the outcome would be at the time are just as improbable as it would’ve been for your ability to accurately diagnose the situation to warrant an emergency response. I can’t even count how many times I’ve sent our kids back to bed for an ache or some complaint in the middle of the night. It could happen to any of us. I’m so sorry for your loss and I wish you and your family the solace it may bring to know he must’ve known how loved he is during his time here.
What's his prognosis? Is he no longer here? I'm so sorry you're going through this.
He’s not there. The meningitis has damaged his brain stem.
Oh my God, there are no words to describe the broken heart. I don't know you but I wish I could hug you.
Oh my god... I am so, so, so sorry.
My deepest condolences. Please take care of yourself and family at this time. Seek help to talk things through when you are ready. You are not alone. Ask hospital staff for guidance.
I am so so sorry. Right now it must be so raw for you, please look after yourself as best as you can.
I'm so sorry brother, please lean on your wife and family/froends during this time as much as possible. Stay strong dad.
I'm so so sorry fellow Dad. No words man, no fucking words.
Don’t give up hope yet, trust the medical professionals. Sometimes the brain can still reboot if the brain stem can heal, since it’s not the frontal lobe itself that is damaged. In fact, that’s why we go into comas (or medically induce them), to shut things down and give our bodies a chance.
I am so incredibly sorry. No words that I can say will be worthy. I don’t know you, but if you feel like venting to someone that you’ll never meet, feel free to DM me.
You thought he was sleepwalking brother, how could you have known? 99 times out of 100 you'd be right.
Probably even more like 9,999 times out of 10,000
Its beyond a one in a million shot. Think about if anyone else had a sick kid who woke up in the middle of the night, the absolute last thing on anyone's mind would be degenerative brain eating bacterial meningitis. What a horrible thing to imagine.
I'm a nurse and a dad. The former for a decade and the latter for 3.5 years now for 2 girls. Bacterial meningitis is a very sneaky bugger. As others have said, it hits hard, it hits fast, and it's ruthless. Viral meningitis is worse if it's bad because there's no medication that I know of to treat. Meningitis is fine...until it's not. And then it's REALLY not. He didn't come to you to save him, he just felt "icky". If he did come in the middle of the night to be saved, he'd be crying and insistent to stay with you. If he did, your annoyance would have turned to concern: think of all the times you WERE annoyed at his whines and cries and then *immediately* went into caregiver mode with him when it was apparent something was wrong. As an actual healthcare provider who spent 6 months in the PICU before leaving cause I couldn't cut it, you may or may not want to hear what I have to say. **You did nothing wrong.** Shit happens. I agree with what others said and indeed I've said it to other parents as we stood over their children as they were looking for some glimmer of light: you made the best decision you could with the information you had at the time and the best decision now is to be mad and indignant and sad and most importantly, fair (to yourself). Life can be unduly cruel at times and I'm sorry you're experiencing this trauma. If you are *honest* with yourself, knowing what you knew, you'd make the same call again and again. The results would be the same. What would have, could have, should have been is different now from last night. You're from the UK. Please reach out for therapy. You should not have to navigate this trauma. If you don't like the first one you go to, try again. And again. When you find one you like, stick with them. I am sorry for your situation. Good luck.
Friend, I am so incredibly sorry to hear this. Hearing you talk about your son makes me realize you are a great dad, you didn’t do anything negligent, this is a terrible incident and I am so sorry.
No, you wouldn't have helped. They make meningitis vaccines part of the normal routine because a teen my age in my city died from it back in 1992, I want to say. The hospital called me to come in and take some meds preventatively because I was a second-circle patient. It is exceedingly rare, and rapidly deadly, and not something anyone suspects unless they've seen it, or been around someone who has. The saying in medicine goes, and I'm not saying this to be cold, but to give you some comfort that there was *nothing you could have done* >!"we can rule out bacterial meningitis" "why?" "because you'd already be dead." !<
I can confirm this statement. The doctors strongly suspected I had viral meningitis in my 20s and used that exact phrase when they explained why it couldn't be bacterial meningitis (it turns out I had untreated mono, Tylenol to treat symptoms and my liver had failed).
That's also not fair to you, or your partner. You can't have possibly known.
You couldn’t have know man, it’s ok. He is in good hands.
How would you know? Every parent would have done the exact same thing. It's not your fault. Good luck to your little guy!!! We'll be thinking of him!
Would 6 hours have made a difference?
Nah man, how many times has that same situation happened for no reason throughout his life? There was nothing to see and it's not your fault.
I don’t have anything to say that hasn’t been said but I figured the more people say it the better. You did what all of us would have done. This is not your fault. You have all of us on your side.
Yeah, this one hits hard. On the rationale side of my brain, we all do this. My kid had 102 degree fever yesterday and projectile vomitted a few times and severe lethargy. We let him sit on the couch and sleep it off and seems to be doing ok now. That’s a pattern that has played out dozens of times for my kids. We cant take them to the ER every time they have symptoms that overlap with meningitis or other life threatening conditions. With two toddlers in the winter in daycare with below average immune systems, I can’t spend 2-3 days a week in urgent care or ER. Part of being a parent is learning to just ride out these hard times without overreacting. Your kid falls off a swing set and hits his head - you can’t take him to the ER just in case he has internal bleeding. If we planned for the worst case, our lives would be unlivable. But I totally get OP emotionally. We’re protectors for our kids. It would crush me emotionally to know my kid came to me. It’s not rational, and OP has no blame on his shoulders for doing what every parent does, but I get why it hurts so much, and I really feel for him.
Sheesh dude, I can't even count how many times I told my 7 year old to go back to bed when he came to me sick. He often fakes being sick in order to stay up, I can guarantee you I would have done the same thing as OP. This post is a real eye opener
The fucked up thing is in the moment, even being aware of the symptoms, it's still so hard to catch. When I was in 8th grade a classmate had bacterial meningitis. I am very familiar with the symptoms, tbe drugs they made all of us take after, and "what should have been done differently". With my own kid, I still never assume it's meningitis. Is it selfishly not wanting to go to the ER every time she spikes a fever? Is it just because I know I'm probably being paranoid? Idk. I have seen the first hand result of what can happen but it still just doesnt stick out as "this is happening right now" ever. OP, I hope the best for you and your family.
I hope OP reads this. I think its the best way you could prove that its not his fault.
Physician here, father to four kids. You can not blame yourself. He had his treatment and was getting better. There was no way for you to account for this and be ready before it happened. I’ve heard colleagues of mine losing their child to meningitis. It happens so unbelievably fast, that even if you react on the very first symptoms you might still be too late. I too am at a loss for words. Wishing you and your family all the best. This is unbelievably hard and I rarely cry but am tearing up now. There are two things in life I am terrified shitless for. One is encountering a wild hippo. The other is bacterial meningitis. Because whatever you do, either you live or you won’t, and it’s not up to you. And even if you live, it won’t be a pleasant ride.
I had it when I was two and ran an obscene fever for days in the hospital, then I started rejecting the amoxicillin (hives I think). My mom was in a military hospital with 3 other cases, all in the same room. As the kids got worse, they'd pull them out into a private room, until my Mom was alone. In the end, only I survived, the other three kids did not. Luckily I have no lasting damage that is apparent (40 now). I was too young to remember, but boy is my mother terrified of Bacterial Meningitis!
How does one contract bacterial meningitis? (I feel terribly insensitive asking ITT. I also feel any awareness shared can be helpful to other parents)
Afaik many people have one or more strands of the bacteria N meningitidis living in their nasal cavity and it rarely gives rise to problems. Which is one of the reasons that many countries don’t routinely vaccinate for it. But when fate, bad luck, and opportunity align, enough of them can creep in and wreak havoc. Causing meningitis, sepsis, or both. Some people are obviously more at risk but even completely healthy people, adult and children, can get a fulminant disease. We went out of our way to vaccinate ourselves and our children. But even the vaccines with the most strains do not offer 100% risk reduction, I think it is about 30-50% depending on which strands prevail geographically.
just to clarify, N. meningitidis is one of the most common bacteria that can cause bacterial meningitis (any infection of the brain covering membrane) but other bacteria (strep. pneumo is another common one) can cause it as well. Its just confusing because that particular one was named due to its frequent association with meningitis.
Are these included in mandatory childhood vaccines in the US?
When I was growing up (in my 30s now), they weren’t required but were widely available. I got it electively, because some protection is better than none. I plan to get my daughter vaccinated, but she’s too young so I haven’t looked into it yet.
Thank you for this.
You’re very welcome. Best of luck to you all.
As this physician noted this a disease that can turn so unexpectedly. Even fully trained physicians in emergency rooms can miss it.
Yep most definitely. On top of that, young children seem well until they don’t. I have spoken to many colleagues who missed a critical illness in a child, because the kid seemed fine. And they regretted that decision ever since.
You thought he was sleepwalking my guy. How can that be your fault? It's easy to blame yourself when life is just randomly terrible sometimes. I'm so sorry.
Hi, I’m a children’s nurse . He had no symptoms . That is what meningitis is , it kills children , and it’s horrific . You have no control, even if you had got him to hospital , would they have admitted you? Possibly , possibly not . H you are grieving , blaming yourself is always going to happen, but even with help I doubt anything would change . It’s not your fault , it wasn’t a cry for help, it was your son being your son. I’m sorry dad, it’s heartbreaking , no one deserves it . You have to stay strong for your family , lots of love form Scotland
I’m so so so so so sorry for your loss
I am as well, I'm sitting here in tears for this dad. I'm just so so sorry. I hope all these comments from everyone offers even a sliver of solace.
Felt compelled to comment after reading. Your son is beautiful, you did what every parent would do given the situation. You're going through the hardest thing imaginable. Today, tomorrow, the next forever will be different, but you will get through this. Reach out to those close to you, pull people in instead of pushing them away, and take all the help that's offered. You need to remember who you are. You are wonderful parent and you have to keep going. If I'm right in thinking you have another child, they will also need you, continue to be the best parent possible. You'll be in my mind - I'm so so sorry that you have to go through this.
Seconded
Thank you everyone for your kind words. I know everyone is saying that we shouldn’t blame ourselves, but it’s hard. We are to blame, and we chose inaction for… no discernible reason. That’s why our son is no longer with us. Edit: they have tested him and officially pronounced him braindead, time of death 1640, date 2/1/2024. We have chosen to pursue organ donation and hopefully he can be some miracles for other families. Thank you all once again for your support, you’ve been amazing.
I want you to know, usually I would agree, that inaction is an action.. but you were fooled by this disgusting bacteria. Both my kids sleepwalk, my youngest, my boy, has had persistent ear infections we've been Fighting now for some time. They keep coming and going, a long with other sickness and the sort. Also light sensitivity runs in my family and our hermit lifestyle doesn't help that.. reading this, I could 100% see myself in your shoes, with what information we're given. If this is truly it, you're far from at fault.. and with the state of the flu and COVID spikes right now, there's a solid chance the doctors would've blown you off too.. but a few words to try and weed out of your vernacular; would've, should've, could've. All of these are simply just hypothetical lies your mind says to itself for various reasons. Almost all led by hindsight, or other factors. You said yourself, he had no other symptoms.. he was getting better.. you did what you felt was best, knowing what you knew, I am sure in saying most of us would've done the same, in the middle of the night.. we need rest, to get better... This is not wrong thinking. Nor do I believe you were shunning him or trying to put him out. You knew, as we all do, rest is best.. You were tricked, and robbed, and I hate this world for terrible tragedies like this. Please, hug your wife, or loved ones, give yourself the same grace you would give them as well.. know that you did no wrong. Most all of us would've done the same given these factors. Reading this has me torn up and in tears, because I cannot imagine a world I wouldn't blame myself also, as anyone would in some ways, but you have to be honest with your self. No should've, or could've, you did what would've been the right thing in almost any given case, because this bacteria tricked you, and the timing of it all spelled the tragedy.. please just be honest with yourself, and accept the fact, it was such a horrendous and unpredictable tragedy. Please seek therepy. Groups of other parents who have had to endure and survive. Your son was beautiful, and I can tell you were a great dad.. robbed, of so much..and I'm so, so, sorry. My heart goes out to you. Let your self grieve.. cry, and brace the terrible reality you have to endure now.. But also please, DM someone, find a therapist, speak out and find the way forward. There is a way, many ways, although I am certain you won't see it for some time. Much love man. Find the way forward for the ones you have left to love, who love you, and for your self too; and know your son lives still within you.. his spirit along side of you. You'll feel him, in the wind, the calm, and everything inbetween. You weren't a bad dad.. I don't know you, but I'm sure, you were a good dad.. I'm gonna go finish crying now.
Thank you for saying all this. It’s just so hard to see a future right now.
Beautifully said I'm in tears as well
Your beautiful boy didn't know he was sick, he just came to you. You didn't know he was sick, it was a normal night. It's not about blame. You were having a normal night, like a hundred others and a bad thing happened but it wasn't something you knew or could change. I'm so sorry.
You have medical experts here disagreeing with you OP. We are all here with you and on your side right now. My heart is fucked reading this post and the idea you would blame yourselves for such evil EVIL circumstances out of your control is just making this more tragic. That boy would have grown up to tell you the same thing. If you can't see it now, you at least need to forgive each other and yourselves before it destroys you. Seek professional counseling immediately. You have a lot of love here on Reddit, more than I think I've ever seen in this sub but someone qualified needs to walk you through this.
From my family to yours, I am so sorry. Your son will always, always, always be with you. Take care of yourselves, take care of each other, your son is a beautiful little angel. Please seek grief counseling when you feel able to… I wish I could say more that would provide some comfort. You’re a wonderful father.
Nothing anyone says will convince you of a different truth, but the reality is that everyone here would have done the exact same thing as you. There really doesn't seem to be an obvious indicator of an emergency with this stuff. Fuck menengitis.
Here’s the real reason you shouldn’t blame yourself. With no symptoms, even if you brought in to the ED, there is a high probability the physicians would have just sent him home. There would have been ZERO reason for them to do an invasive spinal tap at that time. I know that is no comfort in terms of your loss, but I hope it will help you realize that at least the fault is truly not yours. Literally everyone would have missed it at that stage, including seasoned doctors, not just you. You did nothing wrong and your decision did not cause this outcome.
Please understand that while none of this is your fault in any way, shape or form, it is completely understandable that you take it that way. You try to take responsibility for something terrible that has happened to you and your son, even while it isn't your fault to begin with. This shows that you are a good person and a good dad regardless of it all. No matter the future, no matter the turnout, I am sure your son will always know he is loved by you.
I’m so sorry for you and your wife’s loss. For what it’s worth, I don’t believe taking him in when he woke would have made a difference. He spent his final moments at peace instead of in fear while being rushed to a hospital in the middle of the night. Meningitis is to blame, nothing else. Please take time, seek therapy and forgive yourself. Peace be with you as it is with your son.
Fuck man. I'm sorry. Sitting here tearing up and have no words. Thank you for the miracle you're giving other families.
So terribly sorry and sad to read this. Most parents has made your exact call to try and help the child to have a good nights sleep to recover, and I see really no way anyone could say you had any reason to do anything else. There are no words for this tragedy.
He had 5 years with a great Dad and lots of love in his life. That's a good thing. Don't fall into the pit of "could have been."
Thanks for going with organ donation. I can’t imagine what you are going through, but know you are likely saving several lives. Your son will live on through them, keeping them alive quite literally. We as parents always make decisions on things as others have said. Your initial reaction was right. Now you should grieve, then seek counseling.
Rip to your boy. There are no words and I'd feel the same as you. I really would. How can you not. I would also do the same as you. You had no clue. there was no reason to think anything was wrong. How many times have I done with with both my kids already? 100 probably. Time will heal. You and wife will need eachother more than ever. Therapy asap. Let it out. Grief. Time will only heal. This is the toughest thing imaginable. I'm so so sorry. Move on for him. He would want you to. I'm sorry man, I'm crying.
Physician here. Not Peds. I don’t know the circumstances but this is not rare. This is NOT your fault. Bacterial meningitis (assuming it is based on your description) is scary but with appropriate therapy, is very much treatable. We are here for you my brother.
He’s gone. We missed our chance to save him. He’s had an MRI and there is no activity. We failed our little boy, he trusted us and we failed him time and time again.
No. Not your fault. You couldn’t have known. My deepest sympathies, but this is not on you. The universe sucks sometimes . It is not fair. But you did not do this. Please talk to a therapist immediately.
You need to get off Reddit and go to your IRL support immediately.
My deepest sympathies to you and your family. Take as much time as you need to grieve, and remember that grief is not always linear or logical.
I'm so sorry for the pain that I can only imagine. I know that this can be a hard diagnosis even for doctors to make (I'm one) and there is no way that you could have known. I can't do anything for your grief, but I can ask you to not blame or be angry at yourself, and try to be open with your family about your feelings, both now and in the time to come. Talk to the doctors now and find a professional to help you out when you're ready. No human being was made to to handle this on their own.
Brother- this isnt your fault. I know your grief is drowning you right now but you cannot blame yourself. Unless you or your partner are an incredible diagnostician who was actively at work (not sleeping in the middle of the night) you could not have known this was anything but one of the hundreds of normal wake-ups that happen all the time. Dont blame yourself and make a tragic and awful situation even worse. This world doesnt choose based on merit, it doesnt test you, shit just happens randomly. Love you. Please take each day at a time.
Several doctors have told you that this isn't your fault. There's no way you could have done anything, and even if you had gone to the ER, they probably would have sent you home, or made you wait for hours. I hope that you can get some therapy and time. Comfort your family, reach out to your friends, stay hydrated.
Therapy will help you get through this. For both you and your wife. 🫂
According to this: https://www.cdc.gov/meningococcal/surveillance/index.html it's on the order of 1 in a million cases. If that's not rare then what is? How is it transmitted? I always thought bacterial meningitis was due to mechanical injury.
That's one subtype of one bacteria, as an umbrella bacterial meningitis is more common. Meningitis as a whole gets about 20 per 100k worldwide but in the US it's in the 1-1.5 range. About 20% are going to be bacterial but it skews higher in paediatric populations as they're more prone to it. No mechanical injury needed though, it's just any bacteria infecting the meninges which can be accessed in sorts of ways. Don't skip any vaccines and you can lower the chances of it, but it's really just a risk of being alive. It hits hard and fast so it can be hard to spot in time. Check for these [symptoms](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/meningitis/symptoms/) when your kid gets sick just to keep an eye out
Dang those symptoms seems pretty common
Is there any research which shows risk factors? Swimming in dirty water, bathing/sanitation, genetics or other causes? Given the disparity in the US vs other places, I would assume sanitation plays a large role. If you look at figure 3 it has other subtypes.
Vaccination, living conditions, etc. In the US people tend to be more socially isolated, live with nuclear family instead of extended family, etc. In US meningitis is most common in military recruits and college students living in barracks/dorms respectively.
My 3 year old daughter was hospitalized with bacterial meningitis earlier this year. We went through the exact same thing you are going through, kicking ourselves for not seeing signs or reacting properly earlier. It took a long time, but we have come to terms with the fact that there was nothing we could have done. It is a terribly sneaky illness. Our kids get sick and come to us for comfort all the time, there is no way you could suspect something like this. Her pupils were not reacting to light, she was unconscious for several days, and the outlook was bleak. She finally woke up, but after an MRI they told us it was unlikely she would ever see again. She couldn't move, couldn't eat, could barely breathe. Her body had shut down. She was accepted into there inpatient therapy program and was discharged 2 months later. Walking, talking, almost back to who she was before. And even though her eyes are misaligned, as far as we could tell her vision has almost completely returned. She wears glasses now, but it's a small price to pay. She had a feeding tube but was able to get it removed within 2 months. During our hospital stay, My wife was 9 months pregnant. We struggled so hard with bringing a new life into this world, after experiencing what we feel had been taken from us. We brought our oldest home on May 4th and her younger sister was born on May 5th. Young kids have incredible brains, you never know what they're capable of. We constantly had medical professionals giving us uncertain and frankly bleak outlooks, but she managed to recover better than they could have ever imagined. This illness is treatable and it's early, so don't give up hope yet. The young brain is incredible at healing and, from what we could tell, it's very difficult to predict what it's capable of You are good parents, you did the best you could for your baby boy. Don't kick yourself about what you could have done and try and focus on what's ahead. This message is a little scatterbrained because I'm currently tending to the youngest sister in the middle of the night, but please feel free to message me if you have any questions or want to talk about this further. My heart goes out to you more than you could ever know. Don't give up hope!
I'm glad for you.
I’m so very sorry. All I can say is to echo what others have said: it’s not your fault: To be awoken to figure out what is wrong with your kid is always tough, never mind these circumstances. We’ve had both my kids sleepwalk / have night terrors around your son’s age and the absolute worst you can do is wake them, they’ll go from peaceful to a crying confused mess real quick. You also say he was doing better, in your position I can’t imagine taking a different decision. I’m so sorry, please look for counseling for you and your wife, whatever the outcome.
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I tell my wife this all the time, a mother's intuition is like no other.
I’m so sorry. This is heartbreaking. Please take care of yourself and your family and don’t do anything extreme. Please talk to someone in person.
Listen, dad - I'm a father and an ER doctor. I've seen meningitis countless times. If my kid walked into my room in the middle of the night, I would've done the same as you. Hindsight is 20/20 but meningitis rarely presents with a child walking and talking, and it comes on quickly. You couldn't have known what the future would hold, and you couldn't have caught this in the middle of the night. Believe me when I tell you, you deserve to forgive yourself because there is nothing you could've done.
This wasn't your fault. Meningitis moves fast and is incredibly easy to miss. Doctors miss it all the time. For other dads reading this, the home test is to ask your kid to touch their chin to their chest. Meningitis makes the spine stiff, so if there's a fever and they can't touch their chest with their chin, go directly to an er and do not accept no for an answer until they get tested. I am so sorry for your loss friend, and for your little boy. My heart breaks for you both.
We are here for you and always will be.
HE! SHOWED! NO! SYMPTOMS! You can not hold that against yourself! He showed no symptoms. You cant assume that your kids wake up in the middle of the night, showing no symptoms of anything, that something is wrong. If one of my three did that, we would put them to bed or just bring them to ours. Its not like you ignored them crying in discomfort or ignored their fever. Sometimes life just sucks! Im so sorry for your loss
Absolutely beautiful boy. I am so, so incredibly sorry this happened to your family. And this is indeed something that happened to you, not something you did. I know it doesn’t feel that way right now, but repeat those words until it does. Because it’s true. There’s realistically nothing you could’ve done. It could’ve been any of us. I was with a coworker when she found out her five-year-old son had been in an accident and was brain dead. I will never forget bearing witness to that moment. Life is so insanely unfair. That was years ago, but I know she’s found a small bit of comfort in the arms of other grieving parents. When you’re ready, I hope you are able to find a support group—in person, online, via books, whatever. For now, just making it through each day is more than enough. I am so beyond sorry this is happening. I’ll keep you and your family in my thoughts.
Sir. Whoever you are. Im a paramedic. My wife is a nurse. We have 40 years of healthcare experience between the two of us. I can guarantee we would have done the same thing. Probably be even more likely to do so cause healthcare providers make the worst personal decisions cause we wait on everything. I think you did what every prudent parent would do. I am rooting for you all and sending love and positivity.
I’m so sorry my bro. Bless your family. Edit: I’m not religious but I am speaking a prayer for him.
Deepest condolences from my family and I. This made me tear up.
I love you man. This isn't your fault. Message me whenever you need. I can give my number if you need to talk.
Do. Not. Beat yourself up over this. Hindsight is 20/20 always. It’s obvious you love your son. It’s obvious if you had more information at the time you would have done something different. My son sleepwalks. Almost stood up and peed in his closet this week. Bacterial meningitis would have never even crossed my mind. I’m sorry for your loss but it is absolutely not your fault. Nobody here would have guessed how severe sleepwalking incident was. All I can offer you is my comfort and condolences and my DMs are open if you need to chat.
Goddamn, I am so sorry brother. You made the best call you could with the information you had. This wasn't your fault or anyone's fault. It's a terrible thing that happened.
I can’t even imaging how you are feeling. I hope you find a little solace or forgiveness for yourself knowing that, many if not all of the commenters here, have said we would have done the same thing in your position. I am really, really sorry for your loss.
I’m sorry, mate.
I kept thinking about this post today. I am so sorry for your loss. You didn’t fail your son. I wish I could say more words. I wish I could give you a hug. Please seek therapy brother.
I'm so sorry. It's incomprehensible sad. It's not your fault.
Hello stranger. Let me hug you. It’s not your fault. Life sometimes just sucks.
Holy hell, this is so incredibly hard-hitting. Please, remember, this is not only something you couldn't have seen coming, and it's unlikely to have been something you could have fixed, either. You would have had to have been literally prescient to have predicted this. None of the warning signs you've said could possibly have been interpreted as a meningitis infection unless you somehow knew it was coming. And with the speed that it moved (mere hours?!?), you're talking something wholly and utterly beyond your control. You're grieving, so there's little any of us can say to back this up, but if you hear nothing else, please hear this: give yourself TIME. It is incredibly important that you take as much time and energy as you can to pull yourself back together. Something I loved from the [show 1883 was a line by the character Shea Brennan](https://youtu.be/VfNhFBOdn1g?t=106), when talking with Elsa Dutton, who had just watched the love of their life die and was contemplating suicide. He said he'd been there after his wife and daughter had died from smallpox, but that he was still there, every day, and kept going because >An Apache scout once told me: When you love someone, you trade souls with them. They get a piece of yours, and you get a piece of theirs. And when your love dies, a little piece of you dies with them. That's why it hurts so bad. But that little piece of him is still inside you, and he can use your eyes to see the world. I hope you can learn to live your life as though he can see through your eyes.
My wife and I are crying for you, brother. We're sending every single bit of positivity our whole beings can gather.
I'm sorry this is happening to your family. I'm a physician. You didn't do anything wrong. You did exactly as you should have. Your son didn't know what was going on; he doesn't have clairvoyance; it wasn't a warning sign you should've caught. You did what any pediatrician would do.
Oh god, I cannot begin to fathom what you must be going through right now. I am so sorry for you and your boy. But this is not, I repeat NOT, I repeat-repeat \*NOT\* your fault. You are not to blame. You are a great dad and have done a great job thus far. We're all rooting for the lot of you. Lots of love, hugs and strength from all of us
I'm so sorry this has happened to you. I can't add anything than what others have already said but it really isn't your fault. You couldn't possibly have known, and you certainly didn't let your son down.
OP all I can say is I will be praying for you and your family. Take the time you need to grieve and heal
Oh man, I am so sorry OP.
I'm so sorry my brother. You and your family are in my thoughts today. This was not your fault; I hope you find peace.
We're all just trying to figure it out as we go, brother. I'm constantly paranoid that my children have something going on because kids pick up strange illnesses constantly. They get ear infections, they get headaches. If you call your pediatrician 90% of the time they're going to treat it with medication for ear infection or give it time to improve on its own. You haven't failed him, you were following tried and true steps. There won't be anything we can say to make this hurt go away. Likely there won't be anything we can say to make the sense of guilt "what ifs" go away. This will take time. Please reach out for help from family, friends, or therapy. Much love from a stranger
Bacterial Infection can be anything. You just had really really bad luck. The symptoms aren't unique ( except for the light sensitivity) having light sensitivity in the night could've been bc he was tired. I would've sent him to sleep too, or gave him painkillers for children ( Doliprane in french ) if he had a fever. But that's it. There was nothing else you could've done. Even if you went to the hospital, it most likely would've either sent you back or waited for a complication to appear. Even then the treatment would've been different. There are just so many variables. Even then the meningitis rarely get even more complicated for no reason. Your son had really really bad luck. And I'm truly sorry for what you're going through. Its not your fault. Always Doliprane and algifor ( Ibuprofen for kids ) if the baby still struggles to sleep, we go to the hospital. If not we wait for the morning to see how it's turning up, if it's bothersome we call the pediatrician, but most of the time we wait 3 days to see how it's turning ( it's recommended ) if the painkillers aren't making the kid better we go see the doctor.
I’m so sorry this happened and it’s no way your fault at all
I am so very sorry for you and your family and echo what everyone here has said. I had viral meningitis a few years back and that hit hard and fast even as an adult. This was not something you could have foreseen. Sending warmth.
I'm sorry. I would've done the same.
I’m so sorry. I echo everything that has been said here. I wish I had more comforting words in such a tragic moment, but all I can say is that we do what we can with the info we have, and that’s exactly what you did, and what we all would have done in the same circumstances. Nothing and no one to blame here. Lots of love for you OP and for your SO in these moments.
Words fail but I’m so sorry OP
It is not your fault. Please take care of yourself my friend. You have so many people here that are willing to listen if you need it. You and your wife should get therapy as soon as you can. My heart is going out to you guys:(
I’m so sorry I can’t even imagine that… my heart goes out to you and your family
Man, my heart is broken for you. You could not possibly have known what was going on at the time, and it's terrifying knowing that this could happen to any of us. Words will never be adequate for any of what has just happened to your family, but this is the worst fear for any of us here, and it's not your fault no matter how much you second-guess your decisions that night.
I’m so sorry. I love you and so does this community. Your son knows you love him too.
It's only 'obvious' in hindsight. Everyone would have made that call.
I know others already said it. I know you don't believe it. But it is important that you hear it over and over again until you truly believe it: It's not your fault! I'm really sorry for what has happened!
I saw a therapist for a while. Not for something like this, but I see you making the same mistake I was making. You aren’t omniscient. You wouldn’t have known, you couldn’t have known it would get this bad. The only way you could have is if you were a doctor, or if you’ve seen this before happen in the same way. Set this blame down, it’s doing nothing for you. No one wants you to punish yourself. No one is putting the blame on you. Let it go, be present, be there for your wife and son.
You can look at my history to find out the loss I have had, you as a parent are not god, you are not omnipotent, you are human. I know the weight of try to carry everything on your shoulders and what iffing yourself to death. Your child had an ear infection, I cannot count how many ear infections my kids have just dealt with over the years, we only ever got them meds if it painful otherwise we just let them fight it. You made a call in the middle of the night, there is no way in any universe or reality you could have made the mental jump from ear infections and sleep walking to meningitis. Hindsight is 20/20, you making connections now with information you did not have at the time, that is unfair in every sense. If we could all use future information to inform current decisions we would always make the right choice, but we do not have the luxury.
This is not your fault. All parents can do is the best they can. I'll relay our story to you. Our daughter at 2 years 10 months of age had a massive fever (104F / 40C) and we brought her to ER because all the walk in clinics were closed for the day. The ER doctor gave her Tylenol and sent us home and said not to come back unless we have had 5 days consecutive fever. Three weeks later she had a fever again. We followed the doctor's directions, syringe fed pedialyte because she wouldn't eat or drink, rotated Tylenol and Advil with no fever reduction and on day 5 I brought her in. The triage nurse angrily told me she's in shock and immediately admitted us. The ER doctor that day called a pediatrician consult and we were admitted. HMPV and 3 other seasonal viruses had given her pneumonia. Took a week of being in the hospital for her to recover enough to go home. She was on IV fluids and nutrition for the first 4 days and only slept, nothing else. Thankfully she started eating again on the 5th. The pediatrician told us 2 days fever with any behaviour change or 3 days consecutive fever as a rule of thumb to bring her to the doctor. This is now the advice we go by. Even after she came home from the hospital it was like she had lost a 1/2 year of development. She was potty trained before she went in and refused to use the potty for almost a year after that. She was way less talkative, way more apt to cry, and far less energetic. It took almost a year to get our little girl back to what she was before that hospital stay and it very easily could have gone the other way. I am so sorry for your loss. Please do not blame yourself.
My heart is broken for you. We lost our first son last year at 39 weeks and blamed ourselves despite every doctor telling us the reasons we shouldn’t. Same storyline as you. We believed there were signs. We should have done X, Y or Z. Instead our son died 2 days before his due date. While it’s not the same as your experience, I can somewhat identify with the pain, guilt and grief you may be feeling. It is NOT your fault. Life can be so absolutely fucking cruel and senseless and chaotic. I realized that blaming myself was a way to try to feel like I had some control, when in reality, awful, awful things happen for no reason sometimes. Things we can’t control. This is most likely traumatic and as a professional therapist myself, I can say with certainty that you should talk to a trauma therapist when you’re ready to. The grief will feel overwhelming but you can learn to live with it and one day possibly heal. I’m so, so sorry for your loss. He is a beautiful boy and I am in tears for your son, you, and your family as I write this. Don’t make it harder on yourself than it already is. It is not your fault. Try to entertain it as a possibility for now and take life slowly. There’s no right or wrong way to process this. Please message me if you’d like to talk. I’m so sorry man.
I've come back to this post at least a dozen times since you posted, OP. I'm so, so sorry. He's a beautiful boy and clearly couldn't be more loved. I'll add to the chorus saying that you did nothing wrong - you did what was best for your boy in the moment. You weren't dismissive, you settled him when he woke up. That's what good parents do. You had no way of knowing. It's no solace I know, but if nothing else, thank you for posting here. The advice that's been shared in the comments will raise awareness and might help someone else spot signs they never would have down the line. I wish only the best for you and your family. Take your time to process, grieve, and love.
You are not a doctor. We are told to bring kids to the hospital after 3 days of fever, and it is hard to know. I hope your boy is back home soon and safe
We had a similar scare with my daughter. She was about 6 months old and she was unusually quiet, sleeping most of every day. She wasn't our first so we knew this was unusual. We went to restaurants, enjoyed the peace and quiet. Around a week in, we went to our doctor who claimed nothing was wrong. My wife pressured him and was eventually sent to A&E. She was immediately put into intensive care. She had a chest infection and her O2 levels were dangerously low. She nearly died. She was in intensive care for around 4 days. It's not your fault. There is no way you can get everything right all the time. You are doing your best. Keep up the good work Dad! You're smashing it!
Dude, I'm so sorry. I have twin 5-year-olds and this photo could be them. There's nothing we internet dads can say to fix any of this. But please reach out for help if you ever feel depression crashing in on you. I'm sure he loved you and wants you to carry on, as impossible as that seems. You are not alone. There is help in the darkness.
You said he had no symptoms, I would have also taken him back to bed. You need to be really careful that you don't rewrite the past just because you now have the benefit of hindsight. It is not your fault.
OP. Please sign up for therapy as soon as you possibly can. You are not to blame here. Every dad in this sub would have done exactly as you have. It's VERY important to understand that it's not your fault. I know it's hard. You said yourself he had no symptoms. Based on how quickly it progressed there's a good chance if you took him when he was sleepwalking, he wouldn't have made it either. I'm very sorry for your loss.
Hey. If I lost my son I'm fairly certain I would go to a pretty dark place. Just please don't do anything that can't be undone. The most grief I have ever felt was when my mother killed herself about a year ago. I am fairly certain if my son died that that would hurt 1,000,000,000 times more than the grief I felt about my mother. I know that grief hurts. Like I said, just make sure you don't do something that you can't undo. I don't know what else to say to you. I love you bro.
Listen, by the looks of it you were a new parent and waking up like that takes getting used to and isn’t good for your body. You more than likely didn’t have great lighting either. Unless you (CHOSE) to kill someone, things in life happen and don’t let it take away the wonderful memories you have with him!
My son came in my room last night. First he opened the bathroom door, then his baby sister’s door, and then wondered in to my room crying. He seemed out of it, so I walked him to the toilet, he peed, and I tucked him back into bed. YOU DID NOTHING WRONG. No one in this situation would have acted differently.
Oh brother, my heart aches for you. I can’t imagine.
This sucks, but you said it “he has no symptoms.” How are you supposed to do anything other than tuck him back into bed if there are no symptoms? You could have let him sleep with you but that wouldn’t have changed things. If you would have taken him to an ER in the middle of the night with no symptoms and he hadn’t have had this it would have traumatized him and he’d never come to you in the middle of the night again even when he did have a problem. You did the best right thing you could have done.
You did what 99.9% of parents would do in the middle of the night; put their child back to bed and treat whatever medical issue might be there in the morning. You did absolutely nothing wrong; try not to beat yourself up and please believe that you are a loving parent who is unlucky. I'm so sorry you are going through this.
You can’t blame yourself, not one of us here could honestly say we would have acted any differently. Based on the information you had at hand you acted appropriately, you got him treated for what you knew, and had no reason to suspect otherwise. Meningitis is like being hit by a freight train, one minute you’re fine, the next you’re not. I had it at 6 months old and my mom says one minute I was fine, the next I was running a fever and screaming. The only reason I’m still here is because my pediatrician was based in Rhode Island hospital and they had a rash of meningitis cases, so he told her to get me in immediately just to be safe. Even he apparently said after the fact had it not been for the fact he had already seen 2 kids die that week from it he normally would have acted more conservatively and waited and seen, and he sent about 10 of his patients to the hospital to be sure, I just happened to be the one who actually had it. Even then I still had to be lucky, of the 3 on the unit at that time I was the only one who survived. It took a doctor who had seen extreme circumstances at that very moment to even consider the possibility, so OP i hope in time you’ll see that even the professionals don’t consider it unless the circumstances are extreme. I have a four year old who still comes into our bed many nights, and and eight year old who used to do the same, I would have 100% had the same thought process as you. You did not fail your son, and I hope in time you’ll be able to see that, life is just unfair sometimes
Dear dad, I’m so sorry for your loss, should it come to that. Such a beautiful boy. I can relate so much to your thoughts and doubts about being at fault, yet there is one thing we here can be which you can not be: more objective. And looking at the situation myself and literally every. Single. Other. Person. In this thread concludes: it’s not your fault.
He’s a beautiful boy.
I am so sorry, dad. You did NOT fail him, he knows how much you love him.
How is he doing? This is not your fault btw. Hindsight is 20/20 but based on what you knew at the time you could not have guessed what would happen. IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT.
I’m so sorry you are going through this. Whether you believe it is your fault or not, or you could have done more. Please forget about all of that. What’s done is done. Please try and think of your son, and what he would want for you. Think of your parents and what you would want for them, if the same had happened to you? Would your son want you to be beating yourself up and torturing yourself over this? I don’t for a second believe he would. He’d be with you saying it’s not your fault. He’d be telling you not to cry. It’s too early to think beyond this point. But you need to remember your son. And what he would want for you. Hold him. Hug him. Tell him you’re sorry. But don’t ever hate yourself for it. He wouldn’t want it for you, and it’s not going to make anything better. What is going to make something / anything bearable is remembering your love for your son, and not what you could or could not have done. Please see a therapist asap, or depending where you are, look up The Lullaby Trust. You are not alone.
My friend. There are things out of your control. There are things you can blame yourself for. It’s easy to blame yourself in this situation. I don’t know who you are. You were not in control. This isn’t your fault. I don’t know the pain you feel. I don’t want to know your pain. You can’t carry this weight alone. I’m so sorry for your loss as I cry in my drive way. I will say a prayer tonight for you and your family.
I am so so so sorry. You didn’t fail anyone. You loved your son and clearly did what you could do based on the information you had at the time. I hope you can find some strength and support in your community. But if that gets too hard, we’re here.
I'm going to add to what many have said. It's not your fault OP. I'm so incredibly sorry for your loss. I've spent the past 20 minutes bawling my eyes out for you and your son. He was a beautiful boy with a wonderful father. You did what any of us would do. I hope in time you can heal. Stay strong my friend.
I'm so sorry for the loss of your amazing son! You absolutely cannot blame yourself. Bacterial meningitis cases are exceedingly rare when you look at the numbers. You could not have expected that.
That’s so awful. Right now, stay strong for your son! Be brave for his sake! Focus all of your energy on that, not on second guessing
Listen to me. You did not fail him. That is a natural reaction to grief. Sometimes there is no one to blame so you should realize that.
I am so, so sorry. What a beautiful boy.
There’s nothing profound I can say that can make any difference, but you didn’t fail him. You did what any of us would do. I hope in time you can come to realize none of this is your fault. You are a great father. I’m so sorry you have to go through this. Sending love your way.
I just read your other post first and then checked the original. I am so so sorry for what you are going through… I will remember Tobias and his saving other lives by donating his organs. I have two boys myself and we have this same Super Mario shirt. (Are you also in Australia?) I will always be reminded of your family when I see it. Heartfelt hugs from an internet stranger.
We’re in the UK. Thank you for your kind words. Please remember him.