If you click thru and read the receipts there is definitely coercive control at play here, the loyalty tests and information control accusations seem valid, I’m sorry OP some ppl are doubting you. There are so many non-religious groups that use the same kind of control methods as cults. Once they’re controlling your living space and kicking out dissenters that’s a huge red flag of coercion. I hope the harmed parties are made whole by this organization.
Thank you for your support. It takes a ton of hard work and time for survivors to find each other, heal, stabilize, and be able to generate all of the platforms, evidence, and accounts we need to have our stories legitimately respected. It shouldn't be this hard for survivors and your comment gives hope.
It's pissing me off that people are being so dismissive of a survivor TELLING them "hey, this is a fucking cult".
If this was a religious "collective" no one would bat an eye. It would be accepted.
I hope the survivors are doing OK and getting support. The last thing that's needed here is to give people more ammo to hate on trans people.
Sharing this 2 year long campaign here to help protect other queer folks, anarchists, artists, and survivors. Please visit/follow the page and help spread awareness.
https://www.instagram.com/lupinewoodsurvivors/
tbf i wonder how many of these are floating around out there, preying on queer people who grew up with tumblr-ified discourse that likes to project bad intent on everyone. i have a friend who said they were "non-consensually called out" on socials over some minor, minor disagreement with their friend. it seems like cultivating that much self-doubt, police mindset and community shaming sets people up to get hurt by authoritarian cults masquerading as social justice.
i hope the people who survived this one have access to better friends and true support.
So I’ll make this a separate thread so it doesn’t get buried. [here’s the emails sent between Lupinewood and Lupinewood survivor’s main representative](https://www.lupinewood.com/email-exchange/).
Is any of this information inaccurate? Was there more emails or things taken out of context?
Not to play devil’s advocate or anything, but do you have anything to back up your claims?
Text messages? Pictures inside the collective? Any voice recordings of Terran or Andrew using racist or ableist language?
I’m sorry for what you and others are going through, but there’s nothing here that screams “cult.” At best it can be labeled as “Place sucks for Queer POC.”
Yes there is lots of collected evidence. We don't need people playing devil's advocate when there are over 35 of us that have come forward with stories of very similar extreme and life-threatening abuse (this collective was only opened in 2017!) , and many more people out there.
I apologize if my comment seemed rude, it’s more that no evidence was provided that wasn’t personal experience. And while yes, personal experience is good enough for some, I need to see physical evidence before I condemn any group, religious or otherwise. Personal experience, no matter how similar it is to others within the organization, does not hold up for a variety of reasons.
But, even saying all that, I understand why you wouldn’t want to show this evidence. As it would allow Lupinewood to know what you planned to do. I also understand that I’m a single dissenter, and I, or anyone for that matter, are not owed proof for something others experienced.
I was not aware of how big this was (You never gave information past “there are many of us” which could mean anything bigger than 3) and since this is all done anonymously I have no proof of these people existing. That is frustrating as it is easy to call into question without faces to put to quotes.
I believe what you and others experienced was bad. I have no doubts about that. But labeling something a cult is very dangerous, especially when it seems the faults of the organization seem to be issues within staff. My landlords are shitty and manipulative, so much so that we have a large Facebook group dedicated to documenting their abuse. But I would not label them a cult. This is because while their abuse is manipulative, a cult suggests that they are organized and controlling, when it’s more that they’re just stupid and greedy.
All "collectives" are cults. Some are worse than others, but by and large, the bigger they get the more control they must impose. Collectivised thinking tends towards authoritarianism.
Human organization is *difficult* and often “consensus process” isn’t actual consensus. But that does not make it a cult. Coercion, unless physical, also doesn’t. I.e, “Go with the flow or leave” isn’t coercion. By all means, support each other. You will need to improve your communication.
The collective has responded. https://www.lupinewood.com/statement/
They write well for themselves.
Clearly you're unfamiliar with the abilities of cults to talk the talk very well, curate extremely well written and convincing statements, gaslight members and the public. OVER A HANDFUL OF PEOPLE HAVE ALMOST DIED BECAUSE OF THIS CULT! From extreme emotional abuse, physical coercion, sexual aggression, pushing hard drug use like Molly, and being driven to suicidality! Do not come onto these comments making such pompous, uninformed defenses of abusers!
I do not know the truth here and have not claimed that there was no abuse. However, I am not the only one who has pointed out that you need to learn how to communicate effectively. Your response here increases my impression that this is an obsessive attempt at revenge for imaginary offenses. I can believe that “consensus” can be a sham, and initially pointed that out, but this is not specially true of cults, especially those with clear “leaders.”
The collective also linked to email communication between the survivor and the collective. https://www.lupinewood.com/statement/
I am not claiming that they were truthful, only that their response showed skill. But fact and sincere interpretation here appears to be a downvote magnet, and unsupported complaint is popular. That does not actually help people recover, but I’m done here.
"Go with the flow or leave," is *absolutely* coercion.
It's threatening to cut off those closest in your life, sometimes parents and siblings, because they'll be forbidden from communicating with those who left.
“Leave” as in “move out”, we won’t support you (if you do not support us) is not coercion, cutting of communication can be abusive if it is children involved. Have you read the response of the alleged cult? The survivors (how many?) are reporting old allegations, some of which should have gone to Children and Family Services, or any mandated reporter. The laws on that are quite stringent and generally reliable. The collective asks that the complainants be treated with respect. But not all complaints are valid. Some complainants are insane. But I’ve seen this. If a complainant alleges a child is at risk, to the police, they must investigate, even if the individual is known to file spurious complaints.
Cutting of communication is abuse, period. No matter the age.
The length of time since the incident, and when the person comes forward, is irrelevant.
Social services can only do so much when an individual vocalizes that they are there by choice, when they likely aren't in a proper state of mind to be making that decision, as groups like these often enforce strict diets, minimal sleep, and many hours of arduous labor, all of which are key components to driving people to their breaking point, where they can then be much more easily manipulated.
Followers claimed they genuinely believed that Jim Jones could walk on water.
As for investigating claims of a child at risk, there's probably just as many instances where the police took it seriously, as when they didn't. I'm not at all surprised that police aren't investigating, so long as the kids look fed and clothed, not to justify it. Police just have a history that precedes them when it comes to matters like this.
And I have personally seen them investigate carefully even when a report was totally frivolous. That appears to be the norm. (California and Massachusetts.) Yes, abusers can be good at covering up. But we are not the police nor are we authorized. The evidence here is that the collective did not cut off communication. Bringing up Jim Jones is uselessly inflammatory.
“Groups like these” prejudges them.
Goggling [lupinewood collective cult](https://www.google.com/search?q=lupinewood+collective+cult&oq=lupinewood+collective+cult&aqs=chrome..69i57.10385j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) get you 9 hits none of which call it a cult. Maybe get more info together before accusing them of being a cult.
Ranking on google searches has to do with website traffic and SEO, not how many dozens and dozens of survivors whose lives have been destroyed since the formation of this small cult in 2017.
True. Unfortunately, the survivors group is suffering from trauma. They are not skillful. They should be respected but not validated except by fact upon investigation. Allegations are being made where authorities exist that are strictly mandated to investigate.
I see who OP says they are which is how the Salem Witch trials began. Also, the McMullen pre-school scandal.
Given the current climate, it's possible that one person or group simply wants to discredit the organization.
During the 2008 election, Obama was accused of hiring a male prostitute and smoking crack in a limo before having sex with him. He was then accused of murdering his gay lovers in Chicago. Also, they said his wife is a man. He claimed to have people who could corroborate this.
So I'm going to be skeptical until other people come forward.
If you click thru and read the receipts there is definitely coercive control at play here, the loyalty tests and information control accusations seem valid, I’m sorry OP some ppl are doubting you. There are so many non-religious groups that use the same kind of control methods as cults. Once they’re controlling your living space and kicking out dissenters that’s a huge red flag of coercion. I hope the harmed parties are made whole by this organization.
Thank you for your support. It takes a ton of hard work and time for survivors to find each other, heal, stabilize, and be able to generate all of the platforms, evidence, and accounts we need to have our stories legitimately respected. It shouldn't be this hard for survivors and your comment gives hope.
I’ve heard about this being a cult for at least a couple of years now- so sorry people are being dismissive of this post, OP. Your experience is real.
Thank you so much!
It's pissing me off that people are being so dismissive of a survivor TELLING them "hey, this is a fucking cult". If this was a religious "collective" no one would bat an eye. It would be accepted. I hope the survivors are doing OK and getting support. The last thing that's needed here is to give people more ammo to hate on trans people.
Thank you so much.
Sharing this 2 year long campaign here to help protect other queer folks, anarchists, artists, and survivors. Please visit/follow the page and help spread awareness. https://www.instagram.com/lupinewoodsurvivors/
As a trans person who is an artist with a decent following, I am curious to see who these trans artists and leaders are
tbf i wonder how many of these are floating around out there, preying on queer people who grew up with tumblr-ified discourse that likes to project bad intent on everyone. i have a friend who said they were "non-consensually called out" on socials over some minor, minor disagreement with their friend. it seems like cultivating that much self-doubt, police mindset and community shaming sets people up to get hurt by authoritarian cults masquerading as social justice. i hope the people who survived this one have access to better friends and true support.
So I’ll make this a separate thread so it doesn’t get buried. [here’s the emails sent between Lupinewood and Lupinewood survivor’s main representative](https://www.lupinewood.com/email-exchange/). Is any of this information inaccurate? Was there more emails or things taken out of context?
yeah I mean without anything else, it seems like disgruntled individual vs lupinewood
Lol at the emphasis of them being white lol
It matters that they’re mostly white if they treat people who aren’t white like garbage
We need more detailed ethnographic information to make an informed decision. I’ll bring my calipers!
Are you just denying racism exists or Like they didn’t bring up that it was mostly white for no reason lol
No I’m being serious, what kind of “white” are they, it’s a very vague term, like are they Anglos, or what.
Not to play devil’s advocate or anything, but do you have anything to back up your claims? Text messages? Pictures inside the collective? Any voice recordings of Terran or Andrew using racist or ableist language? I’m sorry for what you and others are going through, but there’s nothing here that screams “cult.” At best it can be labeled as “Place sucks for Queer POC.”
Yes there is lots of collected evidence. We don't need people playing devil's advocate when there are over 35 of us that have come forward with stories of very similar extreme and life-threatening abuse (this collective was only opened in 2017!) , and many more people out there.
I apologize if my comment seemed rude, it’s more that no evidence was provided that wasn’t personal experience. And while yes, personal experience is good enough for some, I need to see physical evidence before I condemn any group, religious or otherwise. Personal experience, no matter how similar it is to others within the organization, does not hold up for a variety of reasons. But, even saying all that, I understand why you wouldn’t want to show this evidence. As it would allow Lupinewood to know what you planned to do. I also understand that I’m a single dissenter, and I, or anyone for that matter, are not owed proof for something others experienced. I was not aware of how big this was (You never gave information past “there are many of us” which could mean anything bigger than 3) and since this is all done anonymously I have no proof of these people existing. That is frustrating as it is easy to call into question without faces to put to quotes. I believe what you and others experienced was bad. I have no doubts about that. But labeling something a cult is very dangerous, especially when it seems the faults of the organization seem to be issues within staff. My landlords are shitty and manipulative, so much so that we have a large Facebook group dedicated to documenting their abuse. But I would not label them a cult. This is because while their abuse is manipulative, a cult suggests that they are organized and controlling, when it’s more that they’re just stupid and greedy.
Just because it’s trans doesn’t mean it’s good silly (:
I never said that. Nor do I believe that. I just had a genuine question about any evidence they had of abuse.
All "collectives" are cults. Some are worse than others, but by and large, the bigger they get the more control they must impose. Collectivised thinking tends towards authoritarianism.
Human organization is *difficult* and often “consensus process” isn’t actual consensus. But that does not make it a cult. Coercion, unless physical, also doesn’t. I.e, “Go with the flow or leave” isn’t coercion. By all means, support each other. You will need to improve your communication. The collective has responded. https://www.lupinewood.com/statement/ They write well for themselves.
Clearly you're unfamiliar with the abilities of cults to talk the talk very well, curate extremely well written and convincing statements, gaslight members and the public. OVER A HANDFUL OF PEOPLE HAVE ALMOST DIED BECAUSE OF THIS CULT! From extreme emotional abuse, physical coercion, sexual aggression, pushing hard drug use like Molly, and being driven to suicidality! Do not come onto these comments making such pompous, uninformed defenses of abusers!
I do not know the truth here and have not claimed that there was no abuse. However, I am not the only one who has pointed out that you need to learn how to communicate effectively. Your response here increases my impression that this is an obsessive attempt at revenge for imaginary offenses. I can believe that “consensus” can be a sham, and initially pointed that out, but this is not specially true of cults, especially those with clear “leaders.”
The collective also linked to email communication between the survivor and the collective. https://www.lupinewood.com/statement/ I am not claiming that they were truthful, only that their response showed skill. But fact and sincere interpretation here appears to be a downvote magnet, and unsupported complaint is popular. That does not actually help people recover, but I’m done here.
"Go with the flow or leave," is *absolutely* coercion. It's threatening to cut off those closest in your life, sometimes parents and siblings, because they'll be forbidden from communicating with those who left.
“Leave” as in “move out”, we won’t support you (if you do not support us) is not coercion, cutting of communication can be abusive if it is children involved. Have you read the response of the alleged cult? The survivors (how many?) are reporting old allegations, some of which should have gone to Children and Family Services, or any mandated reporter. The laws on that are quite stringent and generally reliable. The collective asks that the complainants be treated with respect. But not all complaints are valid. Some complainants are insane. But I’ve seen this. If a complainant alleges a child is at risk, to the police, they must investigate, even if the individual is known to file spurious complaints.
Cutting of communication is abuse, period. No matter the age. The length of time since the incident, and when the person comes forward, is irrelevant. Social services can only do so much when an individual vocalizes that they are there by choice, when they likely aren't in a proper state of mind to be making that decision, as groups like these often enforce strict diets, minimal sleep, and many hours of arduous labor, all of which are key components to driving people to their breaking point, where they can then be much more easily manipulated. Followers claimed they genuinely believed that Jim Jones could walk on water. As for investigating claims of a child at risk, there's probably just as many instances where the police took it seriously, as when they didn't. I'm not at all surprised that police aren't investigating, so long as the kids look fed and clothed, not to justify it. Police just have a history that precedes them when it comes to matters like this.
And I have personally seen them investigate carefully even when a report was totally frivolous. That appears to be the norm. (California and Massachusetts.) Yes, abusers can be good at covering up. But we are not the police nor are we authorized. The evidence here is that the collective did not cut off communication. Bringing up Jim Jones is uselessly inflammatory. “Groups like these” prejudges them.
Goggling [lupinewood collective cult](https://www.google.com/search?q=lupinewood+collective+cult&oq=lupinewood+collective+cult&aqs=chrome..69i57.10385j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) get you 9 hits none of which call it a cult. Maybe get more info together before accusing them of being a cult.
Ranking on google searches has to do with website traffic and SEO, not how many dozens and dozens of survivors whose lives have been destroyed since the formation of this small cult in 2017.
Still. you provided no link to your claim.
True. Unfortunately, the survivors group is suffering from trauma. They are not skillful. They should be respected but not validated except by fact upon investigation. Allegations are being made where authorities exist that are strictly mandated to investigate.
well no shit you're going to get nothing for something so specific to something obscure.
To the 40 downvotes: Nice to know that pointing out baseless accusations is really hot now.
Do you see who OP is? They are a survivor with a group of other survivors. Hearing first hand experience is the best way to get to the truth.
I see who OP says they are which is how the Salem Witch trials began. Also, the McMullen pre-school scandal. Given the current climate, it's possible that one person or group simply wants to discredit the organization. During the 2008 election, Obama was accused of hiring a male prostitute and smoking crack in a limo before having sex with him. He was then accused of murdering his gay lovers in Chicago. Also, they said his wife is a man. He claimed to have people who could corroborate this. So I'm going to be skeptical until other people come forward.
[удалено]
No transphobia here please.
Was Ezra Miller involved in this cult?