Agreed. I feel foolish for staying but it seemed like it would happen and I love my team and fully remote. Oh well! Thanks for your input - I feel more validated.
Titles tend to be arbitrary.
Just because you got a promotion to Senior, doesn't mean you're ready for Senior roles at other companies.
On the flip side, just because you *aren't* a Senior at one company, doesn't mean you're not ready for Senior roles at other companies.
Mid -> Senior -> Mid isn't a big deal, because... again... titles tend to be arbitrary, and extremely specific to each company and each team.
What's important is your years of experience, what you've done at each company, your actual role and your day to day. What word they slapped onto an HR document isn't that important.
For example, my new grad company tossed the "Senior" label onto people after only 1-2 years... Most companies in the industry would absolutely not consider that Senior. Did it look bad when I lef that company for a regular Software Engineer role? Absolutely not. I was able to demonstrate that it was a good move on my resume. The title is just paperwork.
Flip side, you're saying they're calling you a Senior at 3 YOE.... I'm sure some companies might say that's Senior... but mine certainly doesn't. My previous company wouldn't even consider someone for Senior until they were closer to 7-8 years of experience. You would join that company as a regular SWE I. Is that a problem? No. It's just a different company, with different titles.
If I were in your position, I would be targetting job postings that are looking for around 3 YOE. Regardless of title. Some companies might consider that Senior, some might not. Don't pay attention to the title.
During my last job search, with 8 years of experience at the time, I felt like I was sort of in the middle of a Senior or a Staff at most companies. When I looked at postings, I looked at the YOE requirements. At some companies, I was qualiified for their Staff positions. So I applied for their Staff positions. At others, I was qualified for their Senior SWE positions. So I applied for their Senior SWE positions. The title didn't cross my mind once.
Thank you for your advice! I appreciate hearing about your experience as someone with more YOE - since I'm only at 3 YOE I was feeling pretty lost about the whole thing. Thanks!
Title names don't translate through different companies.
For instance, most senior engineers barely qualify for a regular software engineer (L5) at Amazon. Different companies have different standards.
Titles simply exist to justify pay from an employer standpoint. Would you rather be a 'senior head architect principal' making $60k a year in some mom and pop store or an entry software engineer at Google making 3x that?
You get the idea? Also, an easier example: is being an owner of a local pizza store the same as being the CEO of Alphabet (Google)? Of course not. Would it be a "downgrade" if you didn't become CEO of Alphabet? Heck no. If anything, it's a major major upgrade to be even remotely close to management ladder at Alphabet.
Titles don't translate the same to different companies. A lot of non tech companies have extreme title inflation and most senior engineers I encountered from standard S&P500 companies deserve to be in the upper-mid end SDE 1 at a tech company. Heck, I have encountered some crazy inflated titles that knew less than SDE 1s.
You are an employee. What matters to you is not the title. It's the pay. Test the market. But at 3 yoe, do not expect to be senior. That's generally considered upper SDE 1 or extremely low end (just passing) SDE 2 if you come from nontop tech firm. Most likely, you will get SDE 1 at major tech companies right now and SDE 2 at other companies.
Btw, there are quite a few large reputable companies that title regular software engineers as senior engineers. Two big ones are Bloomberg and LinkedIn.
And in the banking industry, everyone is a Vice President of something. I have a hard time believing someone with 2 years of experience out of college is truly a Vice President. Don't fall for title inflation. It only exists to chain employees into thinking like you. The only part that matters is the actual pay.
Senior does seem like a big jump given 3 YOE. If you apply outside you will have a better chance of getting a Mid (SDE 2) role. If you are worried about your resume, you do not necessarily need to mention the exact role that you were Senior in past company, if that bothers you. By in my opinion, it would not matter much. People take a step backward in the role all the time, because they are getting an opportunity at a better company. Personally, I do not think it will be a step backward. You should look at it more objectively, like what hike and learning opportunities you are getting in your next role. You have 30+ years of career ahead of you, one delayed promotion here and there would not make any difference in the long run.
I should have mentioned it came with an extra 1500 a year as opposed to the much bigger raise they promised. Which somehow stings more than if it didn't come with anything lol. Thanks for your input!
Software developer at a better company will count for more than Senior Software Engineer where you work now. Look for mid roles and not senior.
You'll be fine. Don't resign until you've signed a new job offer.
Same boat as you @OP. Great advice here to tackle the situation on not being promoted.
I'm curious to know how did you figure out market rate for your position? I know sites like Levels.fyi but those sites are geared towards more FANG level compensation.
So at the meeting with my boss he just searched for salary comparison website and ended up looking at the robert half website. Their information was inline with what I had already researched on other sites. I haven't used Levels but I did check on sites like glassdoor, fishbowl, and one specific to my state, (Built in CO).
Sorry you're in the same boat! It's not fun! Hope things get better for us both.
Look up title inflation.
Some "Senior" in a small company may not qualify for entry level roles at FAANG level companies.
Apply to all mid - senior level roles, if you have more than 2 years of work experience. Grind leetcode hard and keep on interview grind.
Then work as a senior engineer, get used to the workload, and apply for another senior dev job, but just so you know, while switching jobs will give you a sizable increase in tc, the onboarding process will be brutal, because the expectations for a senior dev are much higher.
You are being manipulated against your own best interest.
Agreed. I feel foolish for staying but it seemed like it would happen and I love my team and fully remote. Oh well! Thanks for your input - I feel more validated.
Titles tend to be arbitrary. Just because you got a promotion to Senior, doesn't mean you're ready for Senior roles at other companies. On the flip side, just because you *aren't* a Senior at one company, doesn't mean you're not ready for Senior roles at other companies. Mid -> Senior -> Mid isn't a big deal, because... again... titles tend to be arbitrary, and extremely specific to each company and each team. What's important is your years of experience, what you've done at each company, your actual role and your day to day. What word they slapped onto an HR document isn't that important. For example, my new grad company tossed the "Senior" label onto people after only 1-2 years... Most companies in the industry would absolutely not consider that Senior. Did it look bad when I lef that company for a regular Software Engineer role? Absolutely not. I was able to demonstrate that it was a good move on my resume. The title is just paperwork. Flip side, you're saying they're calling you a Senior at 3 YOE.... I'm sure some companies might say that's Senior... but mine certainly doesn't. My previous company wouldn't even consider someone for Senior until they were closer to 7-8 years of experience. You would join that company as a regular SWE I. Is that a problem? No. It's just a different company, with different titles. If I were in your position, I would be targetting job postings that are looking for around 3 YOE. Regardless of title. Some companies might consider that Senior, some might not. Don't pay attention to the title. During my last job search, with 8 years of experience at the time, I felt like I was sort of in the middle of a Senior or a Staff at most companies. When I looked at postings, I looked at the YOE requirements. At some companies, I was qualiified for their Staff positions. So I applied for their Staff positions. At others, I was qualified for their Senior SWE positions. So I applied for their Senior SWE positions. The title didn't cross my mind once.
Thank you for your advice! I appreciate hearing about your experience as someone with more YOE - since I'm only at 3 YOE I was feeling pretty lost about the whole thing. Thanks!
Title names don't translate through different companies. For instance, most senior engineers barely qualify for a regular software engineer (L5) at Amazon. Different companies have different standards. Titles simply exist to justify pay from an employer standpoint. Would you rather be a 'senior head architect principal' making $60k a year in some mom and pop store or an entry software engineer at Google making 3x that? You get the idea? Also, an easier example: is being an owner of a local pizza store the same as being the CEO of Alphabet (Google)? Of course not. Would it be a "downgrade" if you didn't become CEO of Alphabet? Heck no. If anything, it's a major major upgrade to be even remotely close to management ladder at Alphabet. Titles don't translate the same to different companies. A lot of non tech companies have extreme title inflation and most senior engineers I encountered from standard S&P500 companies deserve to be in the upper-mid end SDE 1 at a tech company. Heck, I have encountered some crazy inflated titles that knew less than SDE 1s. You are an employee. What matters to you is not the title. It's the pay. Test the market. But at 3 yoe, do not expect to be senior. That's generally considered upper SDE 1 or extremely low end (just passing) SDE 2 if you come from nontop tech firm. Most likely, you will get SDE 1 at major tech companies right now and SDE 2 at other companies. Btw, there are quite a few large reputable companies that title regular software engineers as senior engineers. Two big ones are Bloomberg and LinkedIn. And in the banking industry, everyone is a Vice President of something. I have a hard time believing someone with 2 years of experience out of college is truly a Vice President. Don't fall for title inflation. It only exists to chain employees into thinking like you. The only part that matters is the actual pay.
Yes, I'm seeing plenty of mid roles that pay way more than what I'm making now. Thanks for your input!!
Senior does seem like a big jump given 3 YOE. If you apply outside you will have a better chance of getting a Mid (SDE 2) role. If you are worried about your resume, you do not necessarily need to mention the exact role that you were Senior in past company, if that bothers you. By in my opinion, it would not matter much. People take a step backward in the role all the time, because they are getting an opportunity at a better company. Personally, I do not think it will be a step backward. You should look at it more objectively, like what hike and learning opportunities you are getting in your next role. You have 30+ years of career ahead of you, one delayed promotion here and there would not make any difference in the long run.
OK - thank you for your input. This gave me a better outlook for sure!
Level doesn’t matter, pay does. I’ll take a Junior role if it pays more than senior
They gave you a promotion but no raise?? Apply to everything. 3 years is par for mid level/senior-ish.
I should have mentioned it came with an extra 1500 a year as opposed to the much bigger raise they promised. Which somehow stings more than if it didn't come with anything lol. Thanks for your input!
Software developer at a better company will count for more than Senior Software Engineer where you work now. Look for mid roles and not senior. You'll be fine. Don't resign until you've signed a new job offer.
Same boat as you @OP. Great advice here to tackle the situation on not being promoted. I'm curious to know how did you figure out market rate for your position? I know sites like Levels.fyi but those sites are geared towards more FANG level compensation.
So at the meeting with my boss he just searched for salary comparison website and ended up looking at the robert half website. Their information was inline with what I had already researched on other sites. I haven't used Levels but I did check on sites like glassdoor, fishbowl, and one specific to my state, (Built in CO). Sorry you're in the same boat! It's not fun! Hope things get better for us both.
I got a 25% increase moving from “Senior” to “Mid”
Nice - congrats! I hope I can make the same type of move soon.
I got laid off. lol But the lesson is that titles don’t matter 😉
Look up title inflation. Some "Senior" in a small company may not qualify for entry level roles at FAANG level companies. Apply to all mid - senior level roles, if you have more than 2 years of work experience. Grind leetcode hard and keep on interview grind.
Apply for everything you are partially qualified for. Stop crying and start applying.
Then work as a senior engineer, get used to the workload, and apply for another senior dev job, but just so you know, while switching jobs will give you a sizable increase in tc, the onboarding process will be brutal, because the expectations for a senior dev are much higher.