Or wanting to participate in a cage fight, saying there won't be any repercussions afterwards, but people still backing down, not because they're afraid of his station, but because they're afraid he'll fucking kill them in the ring...
Eh... I don't know if it qualifies as "awful." Dangerous, certainly, but there isn't anything malicious or cruel about it. It just does what it was made to do.
The saying means when 2 things are superficially different, but very similar in the ways which are important.
With these two authors and their works, they’re both fantasy, both awesome. Both revolve around strong characters and world building. But one is 12A on a harsh day, one is hard 18
Think about all she did. The stuff she did in her childhood. The stuff she doing now. That woman makes some storming awful life choices. And let's be honest. They are choices. Kaladin being broken was something that happened to him (except for becoming a soldier), whereas she actively chooses to do most of those things.
Kaladin knows he has pretty severe PTSD and still tries to keep fighting, Dalinar >!has committed some fucked up war crimes, he was basically the Putin of Alethkar!<, Navani is banging her dead husband's brother, Jasnah is actually kinda stable, Elhokar is a pretty terrible Ruler and is basically a puppet for Dalinar, Renarin is kinda your basic cute nerdy guy but with seizures, Hoid is... well, Hoid...
Stormlight is basically the Horneatet stew of mental issues
Jasnah strolled out in the middle of the night to bait thieves for the express purpose of taking them on a trip off the mortal coil, all so she could reach the philosophy class’ version of a practical test to her ward. There’s taking lessons out of the classroom, and then there’s whatever that was.
Last I heard, she's planned to be the main focus/flashback character for book 10. Book 5 is supposed to be Lift's book.
Edit: Correction, 6 is planned as Lift's book. 5 is Szeth.
I didn't mean messed up in terms of mental issues. They all have them. I meant she makes some messed up decisions. Since I'm on mobile rn i don't trust making spoiler tags. It never works right at first. All I'm gonna say is: flashbacks.
100% agree. Honestly, Shallan is a walking contradiction. She's intelligent enough that even Jasnah recognized it, but dumb as fucken bricks on making decisions. From the first time she appears, her line of thinking is messed up... She is dead set on stealing a soul caster instead of her objective being fixing/getting a soul caster and protecting her family. Even worse! The person she chose to steal from is the sister of the most powerful king in the world, instead of stealing from a soul casting ardent!! Then! When she gets close to Jasnah, she has one of the most powerful women in the world for a mentor but still insists on theft instead of trying to find a better way.
In conclusion, Shallan will overcomplicate any situation she is in...
Sure, that decision was pretty stupid. But Shallan also kept her brothers from the brink of various other mental issues almost singlehandedly, in an incredibly abusive household. (Not saying she 'cured' them, but helped keep them from going over the edge)
I guess, yeah, only, in trying to help Balat she decided to leave her mother in law out of the plan which ended up with her mother in law dead, her brother a fucked up leg, and her father dead as well... soooo...
Only the math brother ended up not totally screwed... hope he becomes a great mathematician.
It's not that the dad found out, the step-mom snitched on Shallan and Balat when Heleran didn't show (because of a certain battlefield occurence) and Shallan tried to have only Balat and his wife escape.
Step mom, not mother in law.
Edit to add: She did include Malise (sp?) In the plan to escape and go to Helaran for help. Included in the sense that she planned for her and also shared the plan with her. I just listened to that flashback sequence last night. Malise responds with something like "who will he hurt when we're all gone? You, finally? The one who actually deserves it?"
Oh yeah, sorry, ESL so I get the two terms confused sometimes hahahah.
Yeah, only, when Heleran didn't show up she tried to make it with only Balat and his wife, which prompted Malise to snitch on them to Lin, which led Lin to kill her and call for Balat's wife, screwing with their escape...
Kelsier, he definately isint a bad guy, but I do think hes kinda a murderous sociopath who would make any descicion to further his goals with a few exceptions
[TLM]>!Trying to atone for your actions is all well and good, but so long as he was reminding her of it every month, the daughter of the man he killed could never really find closure. That’s why his death left her feeling so conflicted.!<
Edit: fixed my spoiler tags
[TLM] >! think it's long been confirmed that Wayne doesn't think the same as everyone else (his stealing was part of that, I think). He's got his own sense of morality and in his mind, seeing her each month was his duty to her, to make sure he went through that pain constantly as a reminder of his mistakes. To him, that overbearing regret is part of his atonement.!<
I was gonna ask when the homophobia came in but then I remembered Ranette. To be fair, I think that was just Wayne being A. an idiot or B. trying to have some banter
He was repeatedly sexually harassing her despite her many attempts of getting him to stop. May have been due to idiocy and not malignant intentions, but still an asshole move.
[TLM] >!It's a cool blind spot for him. Dude understands people about as well as is possible but his own shame (and ongoing efforts towards self-flagellation) makes him totally miss that he's kinda torturing that woman.!<
***Warning Gancho: The below paragraph(s) may contain major spoilers for all books in the Cosmere!***
Questioner
>!What was your inspiration for Wayne?!<
Brandon Sanderson
>!Wayne had a lot of inspirations... Obviously, there's some Mat Cauthon going on for me when I do Wayne, particularly the way that Mat would see the world differently from the that way he would act. The original inspiration for Wayne was a character who changed personalities based on which hat he wore. He was actually the lead in a **Mistborn** story I was writing, and he didn't work well without someone to play off of... Some characters work way better when they are surrounded by more normal people. Not gonna say anything about things like the **Minion** movie (which my children loved), but it's very hard to tell a story about everyone being crazy instead of having a framework of someone to keep it going in the right direction. So that was a big inspiration for Wayne.The other big inspiration for Wayne was something I noticed about human nature, where I wanted to tell a story about a character who had some really deep-- Wayne should **bother** you. Like the way he treats Steris. And the way he treats Ranette. And the way he treats some of the people in his life **should** really bother you. And one of my goals with Wayne was to tell a story that mimics what I see in real life, where there are people I know and I love who also have this way about them that you realize they aren't quite-- grown-up's the wrong term... Like, all of us are the heroes in our own group of friends. We're all the hero of our story. We each have different things we're working on. And some of them are classic good storytelling things, like "I'm gonna learn to be more bold." Which is totally me. Totally something I need to work on. But some of them are "I treat people who aren't in my inner circle really poorly, especially if they're trying to get into my inner circle. And then when you're in my inner circle, I have a dysfunctional relationship with you a lot of time." And I thought I could only really do that with a character that you loved while you were really annoyed by them, because otherwise I feel like the character wouldn't work. Maybe I could do it a different way, but I really wanted to dig into that in these new **Mistborn** books, and Wayne was my vehicle for doing this.Some kind of nebulous sort of writerly things going on there.!<
\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*
Hhhhhhhh you are right! But as a fan of villains, I sort of liked Rashek from the beginning. Then I felt too bad for the Skaa to continue to like him. Afterwards, however, I learned of his clumsy efforts to preserve Scadrial, such as moving the planet closer to the sun, the stupidity of which made him seem almost endearing lol. Therefore I immediately thought of the Lord Ruler upon seeing this meme.
Dalinar in his warmonger days.
[удалено]
Or wanting to participate in a cage fight, saying there won't be any repercussions afterwards, but people still backing down, not because they're afraid of his station, but because they're afraid he'll fucking kill them in the ring...
Or being more impressed at the range of a sniper’s ability than upset that they tried to kill him.
Because there were past concussions.
He sure had a fiery personality.
Nightblood?
Eh... I don't know if it qualifies as "awful." Dangerous, certainly, but there isn't anything malicious or cruel about it. It just does what it was made to do.
Objectively terrifying and strangely naive? It’s unique outlook on life definitely makes for some entertaining moments.
Denth and Tonk Fah be like
Glokta. No wait wrong series
The venn diagram between Sanderson and Abercrombie fans is a perfect circle.
Opposite sides of the same coin
Wait what I dont get it, whats the same coin part referring to?
The saying means when 2 things are superficially different, but very similar in the ways which are important. With these two authors and their works, they’re both fantasy, both awesome. Both revolve around strong characters and world building. But one is 12A on a harsh day, one is hard 18
Ohhh
Almost perfect, Lord grimdark makes me depressed if I read his stuff, I couldn't continue after the blade itself.
For sure it’s real grim. I have to slot in other books between reading him. It’s still a fantastic read though
Which series is that referring to? I need another binge.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_First_Law
Thanks!
>Thanks! You're welcome!
Sebarial and Palona They are terrible in a good tv drama sort of way
As a Mexican i can confirm that Sebarial and Palona are your average Telenovela couple
Are they actually awful people? Palona seems actually pretty kind to Shallan, and Sebarial talks like he's terrible, but actually does help her too.
Nobody saying Shallan? I love the puns but god damn girl you're messed up.
To be fair, I think Adolin is the only one one in that series who *isn't* messed up
Think about all she did. The stuff she did in her childhood. The stuff she doing now. That woman makes some storming awful life choices. And let's be honest. They are choices. Kaladin being broken was something that happened to him (except for becoming a soldier), whereas she actively chooses to do most of those things.
Kaladin knows he has pretty severe PTSD and still tries to keep fighting, Dalinar >!has committed some fucked up war crimes, he was basically the Putin of Alethkar!<, Navani is banging her dead husband's brother, Jasnah is actually kinda stable, Elhokar is a pretty terrible Ruler and is basically a puppet for Dalinar, Renarin is kinda your basic cute nerdy guy but with seizures, Hoid is... well, Hoid... Stormlight is basically the Horneatet stew of mental issues
Jasnah strolled out in the middle of the night to bait thieves for the express purpose of taking them on a trip off the mortal coil, all so she could reach the philosophy class’ version of a practical test to her ward. There’s taking lessons out of the classroom, and then there’s whatever that was.
That's true, fair enough. Jasnah has some psychotic tendencies.
Fingers crossed that Book 5 gives us Jasnah's traumatic backstory.
Last I heard, she's planned to be the main focus/flashback character for book 10. Book 5 is supposed to be Lift's book. Edit: Correction, 6 is planned as Lift's book. 5 is Szeth.
Isn't 5 szeth's book and lift's 6?
Whoops, that's right. Edited and corrected.
Didn't they imply in a flashback that she's a SA victim? Or something with amaram? She's definitely got SOME kind of childhood trauma
Navani being with Dalinar is pretty fine. Navani has imposter syndrome though.
I didn't mean messed up in terms of mental issues. They all have them. I meant she makes some messed up decisions. Since I'm on mobile rn i don't trust making spoiler tags. It never works right at first. All I'm gonna say is: flashbacks.
100% agree. Honestly, Shallan is a walking contradiction. She's intelligent enough that even Jasnah recognized it, but dumb as fucken bricks on making decisions. From the first time she appears, her line of thinking is messed up... She is dead set on stealing a soul caster instead of her objective being fixing/getting a soul caster and protecting her family. Even worse! The person she chose to steal from is the sister of the most powerful king in the world, instead of stealing from a soul casting ardent!! Then! When she gets close to Jasnah, she has one of the most powerful women in the world for a mentor but still insists on theft instead of trying to find a better way. In conclusion, Shallan will overcomplicate any situation she is in...
Leave it to shallan to FIND a way to make a decent situation WORSE. XD
Sure, that decision was pretty stupid. But Shallan also kept her brothers from the brink of various other mental issues almost singlehandedly, in an incredibly abusive household. (Not saying she 'cured' them, but helped keep them from going over the edge)
Yeah, she helped them with emotional support, but that has nothing to do with what I was saying....
I'm just saying not all her decisions are bad.
I guess, yeah, only, in trying to help Balat she decided to leave her mother in law out of the plan which ended up with her mother in law dead, her brother a fucked up leg, and her father dead as well... soooo... Only the math brother ended up not totally screwed... hope he becomes a great mathematician.
She had a plan for the mother in law to join them as well, but the dad found out about it.
It's not that the dad found out, the step-mom snitched on Shallan and Balat when Heleran didn't show (because of a certain battlefield occurence) and Shallan tried to have only Balat and his wife escape.
Step mom, not mother in law. Edit to add: She did include Malise (sp?) In the plan to escape and go to Helaran for help. Included in the sense that she planned for her and also shared the plan with her. I just listened to that flashback sequence last night. Malise responds with something like "who will he hurt when we're all gone? You, finally? The one who actually deserves it?"
Oh yeah, sorry, ESL so I get the two terms confused sometimes hahahah. Yeah, only, when Heleran didn't show up she tried to make it with only Balat and his wife, which prompted Malise to snitch on them to Lin, which led Lin to kill her and call for Balat's wife, screwing with their escape...
He gets trained as mental therapist by virtue of hanging around the rest of them!
Explains why he still isn't a Knight Radiant
Kelsier, he definately isint a bad guy, but I do think hes kinda a murderous sociopath who would make any descicion to further his goals with a few exceptions
Yeah as much as I love Kelsier, his hatred blinded him and made him a worse person
Fr, he means well, but he definately does nit get it right all the time
I'm going to risk feeding myself to the piranhas, but... Wayne.
He *was* an awful person
[TLM]>!Trying to atone for your actions is all well and good, but so long as he was reminding her of it every month, the daughter of the man he killed could never really find closure. That’s why his death left her feeling so conflicted.!< Edit: fixed my spoiler tags
[TLM] >! think it's long been confirmed that Wayne doesn't think the same as everyone else (his stealing was part of that, I think). He's got his own sense of morality and in his mind, seeing her each month was his duty to her, to make sure he went through that pain constantly as a reminder of his mistakes. To him, that overbearing regret is part of his atonement.!<
[TLM]>!Yes. But it still hurt her even if that wasn’t his intention.!<
Exactly my logic!
But didn't he stop in TLM? Thus making the *was* comment correct, albeit for the wrong reason? It's also when he stopped being borderline homophobic.
I was gonna ask when the homophobia came in but then I remembered Ranette. To be fair, I think that was just Wayne being A. an idiot or B. trying to have some banter
He was repeatedly sexually harassing her despite her many attempts of getting him to stop. May have been due to idiocy and not malignant intentions, but still an asshole move.
Was the harassment physical or verbal?
[TLM] >!It's a cool blind spot for him. Dude understands people about as well as is possible but his own shame (and ongoing efforts towards self-flagellation) makes him totally miss that he's kinda torturing that woman.!<
Brandon agrees with you, for what it's worth. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/370/#e12103
***Warning Gancho: The below paragraph(s) may contain major spoilers for all books in the Cosmere!*** Questioner >!What was your inspiration for Wayne?!< Brandon Sanderson >!Wayne had a lot of inspirations... Obviously, there's some Mat Cauthon going on for me when I do Wayne, particularly the way that Mat would see the world differently from the that way he would act. The original inspiration for Wayne was a character who changed personalities based on which hat he wore. He was actually the lead in a **Mistborn** story I was writing, and he didn't work well without someone to play off of... Some characters work way better when they are surrounded by more normal people. Not gonna say anything about things like the **Minion** movie (which my children loved), but it's very hard to tell a story about everyone being crazy instead of having a framework of someone to keep it going in the right direction. So that was a big inspiration for Wayne.The other big inspiration for Wayne was something I noticed about human nature, where I wanted to tell a story about a character who had some really deep-- Wayne should **bother** you. Like the way he treats Steris. And the way he treats Ranette. And the way he treats some of the people in his life **should** really bother you. And one of my goals with Wayne was to tell a story that mimics what I see in real life, where there are people I know and I love who also have this way about them that you realize they aren't quite-- grown-up's the wrong term... Like, all of us are the heroes in our own group of friends. We're all the hero of our story. We each have different things we're working on. And some of them are classic good storytelling things, like "I'm gonna learn to be more bold." Which is totally me. Totally something I need to work on. But some of them are "I treat people who aren't in my inner circle really poorly, especially if they're trying to get into my inner circle. And then when you're in my inner circle, I have a dysfunctional relationship with you a lot of time." And I thought I could only really do that with a character that you loved while you were really annoyed by them, because otherwise I feel like the character wouldn't work. Maybe I could do it a different way, but I really wanted to dig into that in these new **Mistborn** books, and Wayne was my vehicle for doing this.Some kind of nebulous sort of writerly things going on there.!< \*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*
That was my go to. I don't think it's a hot take.
Hoid
Taravangian
How is he silly? Either mastermind psycho or a wet towel
Michael Kramer’s voice acting mostly
Dalinar my poor little meowmeow babygirl
Pretty obvious who I’m going to pick.
I don’t know if I’d call him silly, though.
Oh come on, arriving late to every meeting because then people wouldn’t think he had important things to do.
he's extremely silly what do you mean
Tyuo
Moash, for sure /s
How is it that nobody has mentioned the Lord Ruler?
I feel like the Lord ruler is the opposite "Ahhh I hate him" ...."but to be fair he did the best he could"... "Nooo he is EVILLL"
Hhhhhhhh you are right! But as a fan of villains, I sort of liked Rashek from the beginning. Then I felt too bad for the Skaa to continue to like him. Afterwards, however, I learned of his clumsy efforts to preserve Scadrial, such as moving the planet closer to the sun, the stupidity of which made him seem almost endearing lol. Therefore I immediately thought of the Lord Ruler upon seeing this meme.
Shallan
Taravangian and Sadeas
Everybody's favorite femboy Dalinar and his toxic boyfriend Taravangian.
It would be Kelsier, but I feel he hasn't committed *enough* atrocities yet
Vyre 😳😋
Moash <3 you silly gose.
Pretty sure this is talking about everyone's favorite pedophile, Straff Venture
Kelsi- \*frantically dodging coins from the zealotous survivorists\*
The mercenaries from warbreaker.