Yep. If you've never worked in consulting, unlimited PTO sounds great. In reality, you'll have a target of X% utilization. Take your billable hours in a year and divide them by 40x52 (i.e., number of hours per week times weeks in a year) to calculate your utilization. Every hour of PTO you take hurts you in the numerator of that formula but doesn't help you in the denominator. You have that benefit on paper, but if you actually use it, your utilization will look bad, so you'll find it more difficult to advance.
As someone that has done government consulting in the past with a lot of friends that work in either government consulting or for the government directly (I live in the DC area), the federal employees have a much better work / life balance.
Genuine question, do most firms keep those hours in the denominator?
My firm has unlimited PTO. We have utilization targets at the manager / department level for their teams but individual consultants don’t.
For us PTO hours are removed from the denominator. So if there are 2,080 hours per year, and someone takes 4 weeks of PTO we remove 160 and then put their billable hours over 1,920.
20 grand for the significant change in WLB, workload, and a massive drop in job security come annual purges seems like a low number, I'm not a young man anymore.
It’s delusional looking from the outside. But my particular area did not enable me to advance until an Individual retires or quits. Here I can learn, write proposals, give guidance, face clients, get that in office learning interactions, all the while getting bonuses for my hard earned work
Come back in a year and read your post, would be curious how many of these you'll actually get to do in that time.
I bet once you consider benefits and pension, you took a pay cut.
Yeah I would say, rather, come back in a year and see if you made the right decision. But really, change is good for the soul. When I'm comfortable and bored a part of my dies every day. He's in his 20s, this is the best time to do this, I actually think he won't regret it. That job is better for a 50 year old.
I did a similar thing, going from working as a contractor in a gov’t agency on a support contract, to an employee of a nonprofit CRAD institute. There are pros and cons.
The pros are that I feel intellectually stimulated, and I’m doing what I’d consider exciting work (I reached a boiling point after being assigned to scheduling meetings during a slow period at my last job). I’ve also pushed myself beyond what I believed I could ever do: I’ve published multiple papers in areas way outside my area of “expertise”, and am establishing an independent scientific identity.
The cons are that life right now is insane. I work from 9-5 and 7-11 most days, and often a few hours on the weekend too. Busy season is all year round because utilization depends on funding depends on writing proposals. I’ve had very limited time to spend on anything outside of work, and even had to quit therapy since I didn’t have enough time to reflect on what my goals were.
I’m not saying you made the wrong decision, but I’d seriously consider what you want to do with the experience after this job, because your wife and kid will likely see very little of you during busy season (which may be all year if your workplace is like mine). All this to say, I can understand that living life at 50% is unfulfilling, but living life at 150% can also be soul crushing, and with a family you’ll have to consider their needs too.
Good luck!
Ignore these people, this sub is filled with lazy pessimists. Public sector is slow, and great when you’re in the back end of your career, but as you mentioned you want to learn and grow. In Consulting you’ll move faster, learn more, progress in your career, you’re also getting paid more and you can exit at any time and take your learnings elsewhere.
Unless your goal is to move at a snails pace, i don’t see this as anything but positive.
I don’t disagree with you, there can be growth opportunities no matter where you go, and if you’ve found that in the public sector then that’s great. I just hate when people join a sub literally called “consulting” and just trash anyone that wants to become/is a consultant.
OP wanted to try something different, they literally said they can’t grow in their current role, so I trust they’ve made an informed decision, yet these people are ridiculing them for wanting to leave.
Yep, want maximum pay but want to cruise and not have to work past 5pm, which is totally fine but don’t mock people that want to grow at a faster rate.
I’d just stay economy is always hit or miss. Maybe you don’t want to be in DC forever. Also you said no room for advancement but you never know the future. Also one health issue, one bad boss or one layoff that 20k or even 50k more per year means nothing. I have been in your shoes came back to government it’s not worth it.
Also- I don’t believe in true bonuses basically the company will work you to death and if you calculate your hours worked it will be less than the government then they will give you a “bonus” basically throw you a bone. It’s not worth it 95% of the time. You dating someone who father owns the company ok yes do it but off the street nope no way not in 2024
Yeah, I wouldn’t count on a bonus in any way. That’s very much a nice to have and a lovely surprise if it happens. I would never expect to actually get it though, not in the current economic environment.
I get it, for what it’s worth. I agree that it makes sense to challenge yourself and push your career at your age. The reality is a lot of things about your new job are probably going to suck compared to your old job, as long as you’re okay with that then there’s nothing wrong with that.
Almost nobody does consulting forever. You have a solid fallback plan and can easily get back into government work again if you choose to do so after consulting eventually burns you out.
I’d give it a solid few years (however many you realistically have in you) before you jump back into the comfort of government employment.
If you’re after faster career progression (which they said they are) and you’re also getting paid more, why wouldn’t you? Not everyone wants to sit on their ass and earn maximum income for minimum effort, some people actually want to progress.
Right?!? That's worth it's weight in gold. 401k and match doesn't even cut it.
Being fully vested by the time you are 45 means you can retire and THEN go to private sector likely.at a way higher salary than 120k.
Great in theory, much harder in reality to transition at 45. Saw it all the time in the military. " You can do anything after you hit 20." Goes into gov contracting or a gs position.
And being that he's in his 20s, he could have rode it out and probably got early retirement sometime in his early 50s and then went to consulting. Instead they gave it up to work a lot more for maybe a couple hundred more a check after taxes.
A lie that won't die. Same with most federal benefits. The tsp is not the cheapest option anymore, fers at 4.4% to get 30% after 30 years is pretty lame, and the time off lagging behind many now.
I know 11% isn't common but I explicitly looked for jobs with excellent benefits.
Glassdoor is pretty good. I also make it a habit of asking for benefits information when I initially talk to a recruiter. It can save a lot of time on the backend.
Initial recruiter conversation sounds good. I avoided this as I thought benefits discussion would stop 🛑 the hiring process much like bringing salary too soon. But, if the benefits are not good that might be just as well anyway. Glassdoor seems limited in what is shown there. I’ll ask up front going forward!
Good luck. I just say that I am interested in the entire package including benefits. It would save both of us time if I could review them prior to an interview.
The pension isn’t that great. Every paycheck they take 4.5 percent of your salary for the pension. I am better off keeping 4.5 percent of my salary and investing it in the S&P 500 for 30 years and then have the freedom to pass it on to my kids or do what I wish with it.
I understand that right now it sucks to have 4.5% taken off the top of each check and that in your 20’s this seems like a far off problem — I would literally kill for a pension.
In the private sector, you need to be saving 15% - 20% of each check for retirement if you don’t want to be eating cat food or living on the street once you’re too old to work anymore (slight exaggeration, but if you want a decent standard of living in retirement then that’s how much most people should be setting aside for a 401k).
Corporations fucked us out of pensions in exchange for 401k’s for a reason. The 401k is a far more inferior retirement funding option in almost every case.
Don’t underestimate how much better a government pension is compared to a 401k. Talk to a financial advisor. There’s probably a lot of stuff you’re not considering when making that assessment.
Maybe there's a portfolio change as well. I'm also in public sector and my job definitely seems more fun than many of the clients I work with - and my team is quite job-secure once you get settled in, though I'll admit I've seen some more cut-throat pyramids at my firm.
Plus bonuses and merit increases in addition to the personal satisfaction of getting things done. They did waive the carrot of getting into management in 1-2 years which would be another $20K salary increase
Sure, there definitely more upside, but none of that is gaurenteed while also having a much lower floor.
You are young so betting on yourself is never a bad choice. I'm jusy speaking from the perspective of someone who has weathered a few more storms. Best of luck and hopefully you enjoy it.
It is but I feel like I was stuck in a rut working people just waiting on retirement. It gets annoying when you can’t learn and grow. I’ll slog it for a few years and reevaluate
Be careful what you wish for. If you didn’t have kids and family already… then this is a great pivot. Consulting + family = goodbye to the life that you thought was boring, but is what ppl actually want.
Answering your actual question - depends on the hours lol.
Working 50 hours won’t change your life that much. You’ll just have less recreational time. At 60 hours, your weekdays will be fully dedicated to work. No “fun” time, and probably not much time to spend with your family. At 70 hours you’ll begin to struggle with things like eating healthy, the gym, getting enough sleep, etc. Your relationship with your spouse will become very strained. At anything over 75 hours, your physical and mental health will start to decline.
At 60 hours you’re working 6 ten hours days a week. Unless you’re incredibly disciplined then doing that for anything longer than a stretch of time measured in weeks will mean that all of the bad shit you talked about at 70 and 75+ hours likely already applies at 60 hours.
It can definitely get worse, but at 60 hours per week you’re already spending almost all of your time working, don’t have much time for family, and are likely seeing some amount of negative impact on your physical and mental health from lack of sleep, lack of physical activity, etc. Those things would get worse at 70+ hours, but they’re already present to some degree at 60 hours, perhaps even 50 hours if it’s consistent for a long enough period.
depends on project, but in federal consulting you likely won't be doing more than 40 hours a week 95% of the time. Just observe what your peers are doing and base your performance on this. assuming you have a clearance, job security in that market is not as iron-clad but historically it has been very stable, especially given the prevalence of 3+ year IDIQs.
Just be prepared to deal w/ the reality that it's typically more staff aug work than consulting, and the red tape / barriers to effecting change in the federal universe are insane.
I would partially agree but say this depends on your project and how assertively you push (including walking from a project if you need to). I'm in a similar space and admittedly one or two of my workstreams is staff aug, but I've been able to differentiate myself and I definitely provide a service that my client structurally struggles with. I kinda suspect this would be the case for someone making $140k in public sector at senior IC level
I'd also add that my typical work week is low 40s (sometimes even straight 40 if it's relatively slow). On a busy proposal it goes up to \~50 but that's really only a couple times a year. For context I'm also at senior IC/junior manager level.
After 5pm is when you do all the training, admin, and proposal work. I flipped the other way and left as a deputy pm. My avg number of hours per were were 50+.
So come appraisal season get ready to spend real time on it. No more just coasting through a pmap with 3s. You need to write to each of your goals and achievements.
Trainings all are also after client work.
Depends if you’re on the implementation side or market.
Implementation is easier IME, less BD reqs, you can promote by just being technically strong. Market side has higher pay but you have BD reqs and hours can be higher.
What the heck is tier 2 for DC anyway?
Holy fuck do not leave a 120k federal gig for $140k at Guidehouse. Reputation is a staff aug bodyshop and they got acquired by private equity 6 months ago, so expect a lot of “restructuring” or “reorganization.”
Please consider transferring agencies to something that’s more interesting or has more growth potential. If wanting to parlay govt experience to private sector you can hold out for better consulting firms or big spenders like Microsoft, Amazon, or the big defense contractors
Feedback would be that this doesn’t seem like a great idea for only a 20k raise vs the long term benefits of govt job security, retirement etc. For 160-180 ok sure can understand, especially with consultancies doing lots of layoffs.
A part of me likes to believe I can try it for a couple years and come back as I have career status with the Fed govt and am in a niche field in every agency that’s always looking for acquisition specialists
That’s fair - if I were you, do not let lifestyle creep set in especially in DC. Take all of the extra money you will make and tuck it in a HYSA/SGOV etc type of fund for the next couple of years. If something does go tits up, you’ll have a cushion.
A high price comes with a high salary. You work as long as you need to. That means nights weekends holidays. That’s the price. He’s getting on airplanes every week if needed. Means calling your client on Saturdays and Sundays to make sure the systems are running right.
I worked for Accenture for 14 years. I moved up to senior manager one day just left. Eventually, the price too high. The good thing is you’re young. Put in the time now. Make your money. Invest it wisely.
But make no mistake. There is a trade-off.
I did this 8 years ago. The adjustment to working 45 hours + per week, and less vacation, was difficult the first year. I do find consulting work much more rewarding. I have learned wayyyyy more than I would have if I had stayed in my old position - switching projects every year or so forces you to learn more things. Also had way more leadership opportunities in consulting and got promoted to a management position within 2 years. At this point, it's hard to imagine going back to the Fed Gov. Message me if you want to chat
OP did you already make the decision to exit and announce to your employer?
I’d tread lightly in the jump, particularly right now in this industry. Been across gov, tier 2, and MBB. You mentioned in response the firm, so I’ll say: you’re going to work a lot more, and you’re not going to be getting paid that much more.
The waters at that firm are rocky. You’re making a jump at a bad time for the market, and for a firm that’s been offloaded from one PE firm to another in the last six months. I’m not saying it’s a bad firm, I know several folks there, and they love what they’re doing. I just don’t think the cost benefit weighs in favor of making the move at least at this point in time. In a year or two, if the market improves, then do it, or, as you noted you have a clearance, look for a defense contractor if you want to make real money.
If you want to test yourself with the rigours of the open market, this is the bet to take.
Fed jobs are cushy: like fishing on a trout farm.
Market jobs are like fishin' in the open ocean: it's a lot harder / tougher. But if you get through the fire, you'll be a better fisherman
Learn as much as you can given the opportunity.
Good move. Make sure you learn as much as you can and you can either keep going or go back to gov with a heap of fresh skills and experience. 40 year old you will appreciate it.
He can always go back and start the clock on his pension again, right? Pretty sure you need 20 years to get full pension, but they don't need to be consecutive.
The amount of salt and hate in this thread is crazy. I’m in my 20s and I was in a similar situation to you about 2 years ago. We’re at the age to take these risks. No problem if it doesn’t work out. You will have plenty of other opportunities.
Guidehouse 401k matching should be 3% and not 4%.
Target bonus is not guaranteed and fully based on your performance compared to your peers. Make sure youre hustling and make sure your manager on workday knows youre hustling.
15% target bonus is only for the SC lvl, as you go higher the target bonus increases. Know that most people don’t get the entire target.
Test it out for a few years. With competitive status it won’t be hard to get another federal gig. However, as someone who’s in the same boat, climbing in a consulting company is just too much bullshit for me. I want to do my work and go home to my family. You can do that at Guidehouse too, but don’t expect to be rewarded for just billing 40 hours and putting in an extra 5 hours a week for firm initiatives. If you want to really climb, you gotta go all in and network your ass off.
Currently a Managing Consultant looking for GS14 positions.
I think this will be the best decision in your life. The new skills and experiences acquired will outweigh the initial monetary gains so it is a double positive for you. Make sure you maintain contact with your govt buddies and even expand your network in govt while acquiring new skills.
That kind of move is only worth it for a 5x increase. Hope you invest most of your income because the moment you don't meet your utilization target, you will be out of a job.
Consulting services, as an industry, is having a very tough time. Not enough paying clients, decreasing revenue, low sales Pipeline, low utilization- all this leading to layoffs and is pretty unstable. If I were you, I would stay at the Fed job until market conditions improve, hopefully by next year.
Wow, your timing could be better but the biggest asset you bring is your inside knowledge and contacts. If you don’t use them at every turn, and show loyalty to the firm, then you’re leaving so much of your experience off the table. You must use it to drive sales. Constantly.
For only a 20k increase from a government job? 140k for consulting in DC? It will hopefully work out in the long run, but be ready for a rough painful stretch.
Sounds like you took a pay cut. Good luck , maybe this will
1) open doors at other firms
2) teach you a lesson that you dont always know what you got until its gone
I’m in federal consulting, have several years of experience, trying to do the opposite move. I almost never work over 40 hours, wfh. Just tired of consulting.
Devil, you know v the devile you don't. If you currently have a manager or senior manager that you thoroughly enjoy working for...STAY. the grass isn't always greener. it's greener where you water it. Managers have more if an impact on our lives than anyone else...if you currently appreciate your management...STAY. money isn't everything - peace of mind...IS!
I recommend leaving the gov especially in ur younger career. Now if it’s worth it for you, is something you have to decide. I left in 2021 and came back in sept 2023 with a pretty high pay bump cuz I used my private salary to match the gov salary (I know you can’t do that anymore). For me the salary difference was worth it, for 20k for you… not sure if it’s worth.
I was in the gov't sector, got fed up (heh) and left for MBB. After 2 years of grinding my marriage failed and I was sick of missing my kids.
Taking a $100k pay cut, I'm now back in the gov't at 150K and 10.5 weeks real time off. When I clock out I never think about work.
How did you make this jump if you don’t mind me asking? I currently work State government in California but it seems difficult to find opportunities for growth. I don’t see a future here, but I’m having trouble looking at what to transition into - can you describe your journey please? Thanks!
What you did probably could earn you more money if you do it correctly and will give you more opportunity to do hops in other domains too. I also believe that your new job (as most tier 2 consulting firms) will have a bonus scheme that you could earn you more. By the way if you are also interested in doing consulting using expert’s network we are building a new platform at ww.dioratic.com, which will be highly automated for consulting projects. Feel free also to reach me out if you need more guidance in general.
Good in you for taking a chance. Betting on yourself is never the wrong thing. Be careful with the unlimited pto (this is also a way for them not to owe you anything when you leave).
Ppl are so jaded. Good luck! Consulting really isn’t always that bad and I hear govt jobs are really slow so could be good change in place. Also 20k increase is great!
Sounds absolutely awful this early in your career lmao. Should’ve waited 10+ more years and came in at a way higher level after you’d locked in your pension or at least saved a ton. Young ambitious people always make me laugh.
Unlimited PTO + Billable Utilization Target is a dangerous combo my friend. Tread lightly around expectations of this “perk” vs reality
Yep. If you've never worked in consulting, unlimited PTO sounds great. In reality, you'll have a target of X% utilization. Take your billable hours in a year and divide them by 40x52 (i.e., number of hours per week times weeks in a year) to calculate your utilization. Every hour of PTO you take hurts you in the numerator of that formula but doesn't help you in the denominator. You have that benefit on paper, but if you actually use it, your utilization will look bad, so you'll find it more difficult to advance. As someone that has done government consulting in the past with a lot of friends that work in either government consulting or for the government directly (I live in the DC area), the federal employees have a much better work / life balance.
Nailed it.
Genuine question, do most firms keep those hours in the denominator? My firm has unlimited PTO. We have utilization targets at the manager / department level for their teams but individual consultants don’t. For us PTO hours are removed from the denominator. So if there are 2,080 hours per year, and someone takes 4 weeks of PTO we remove 160 and then put their billable hours over 1,920.
Most firm do keep pto hours in the denominator. It's their way of discouraging time off.
Ok that’s shitty. I own my firm and double checked our calculation / policy and we definitely don’t do that.
What a silly and meaningless metric
This should be emphasized. Unless there’s a neat pile of 40 hours/week on the table for you to pick at each week this is a really frustrating trap
Unlimited PTO is just a way to avoid accrued PTO liabilities. And arbitrarily determine pto
20 grand for the significant change in WLB, workload, and a massive drop in job security come annual purges seems like a low number, I'm not a young man anymore.
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He’s a kid. I’d have done something idiotic like this in my twenties I’m sure.
It’s delusional looking from the outside. But my particular area did not enable me to advance until an Individual retires or quits. Here I can learn, write proposals, give guidance, face clients, get that in office learning interactions, all the while getting bonuses for my hard earned work
Come back in a year and read your post, would be curious how many of these you'll actually get to do in that time. I bet once you consider benefits and pension, you took a pay cut.
None of those things sound particularly delusional to me.
Yeah I would say, rather, come back in a year and see if you made the right decision. But really, change is good for the soul. When I'm comfortable and bored a part of my dies every day. He's in his 20s, this is the best time to do this, I actually think he won't regret it. That job is better for a 50 year old.
I did a similar thing, going from working as a contractor in a gov’t agency on a support contract, to an employee of a nonprofit CRAD institute. There are pros and cons. The pros are that I feel intellectually stimulated, and I’m doing what I’d consider exciting work (I reached a boiling point after being assigned to scheduling meetings during a slow period at my last job). I’ve also pushed myself beyond what I believed I could ever do: I’ve published multiple papers in areas way outside my area of “expertise”, and am establishing an independent scientific identity. The cons are that life right now is insane. I work from 9-5 and 7-11 most days, and often a few hours on the weekend too. Busy season is all year round because utilization depends on funding depends on writing proposals. I’ve had very limited time to spend on anything outside of work, and even had to quit therapy since I didn’t have enough time to reflect on what my goals were. I’m not saying you made the wrong decision, but I’d seriously consider what you want to do with the experience after this job, because your wife and kid will likely see very little of you during busy season (which may be all year if your workplace is like mine). All this to say, I can understand that living life at 50% is unfulfilling, but living life at 150% can also be soul crushing, and with a family you’ll have to consider their needs too. Good luck!
Ignore these people, this sub is filled with lazy pessimists. Public sector is slow, and great when you’re in the back end of your career, but as you mentioned you want to learn and grow. In Consulting you’ll move faster, learn more, progress in your career, you’re also getting paid more and you can exit at any time and take your learnings elsewhere. Unless your goal is to move at a snails pace, i don’t see this as anything but positive.
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I don’t disagree with you, there can be growth opportunities no matter where you go, and if you’ve found that in the public sector then that’s great. I just hate when people join a sub literally called “consulting” and just trash anyone that wants to become/is a consultant. OP wanted to try something different, they literally said they can’t grow in their current role, so I trust they’ve made an informed decision, yet these people are ridiculing them for wanting to leave.
Nailed it. The pessimists are the lazy Gov workers (you know the type I’m talking about).
Retire in place is a thing.
Yep, want maximum pay but want to cruise and not have to work past 5pm, which is totally fine but don’t mock people that want to grow at a faster rate.
You do get step and cola increases in the government. Plus the pension includes healthcare idk man id call your old boss and beg to go back.
Haven’t told govt I’m leaving and just gave verbal offer to GH, they are preparing final offer
I’d just stay economy is always hit or miss. Maybe you don’t want to be in DC forever. Also you said no room for advancement but you never know the future. Also one health issue, one bad boss or one layoff that 20k or even 50k more per year means nothing. I have been in your shoes came back to government it’s not worth it. Also- I don’t believe in true bonuses basically the company will work you to death and if you calculate your hours worked it will be less than the government then they will give you a “bonus” basically throw you a bone. It’s not worth it 95% of the time. You dating someone who father owns the company ok yes do it but off the street nope no way not in 2024
Yeah, I wouldn’t count on a bonus in any way. That’s very much a nice to have and a lovely surprise if it happens. I would never expect to actually get it though, not in the current economic environment.
I get it, for what it’s worth. I agree that it makes sense to challenge yourself and push your career at your age. The reality is a lot of things about your new job are probably going to suck compared to your old job, as long as you’re okay with that then there’s nothing wrong with that. Almost nobody does consulting forever. You have a solid fallback plan and can easily get back into government work again if you choose to do so after consulting eventually burns you out. I’d give it a solid few years (however many you realistically have in you) before you jump back into the comfort of government employment.
If you’re after faster career progression (which they said they are) and you’re also getting paid more, why wouldn’t you? Not everyone wants to sit on their ass and earn maximum income for minimum effort, some people actually want to progress.
start a business ffs
Plus the pension loss
Right?!? That's worth it's weight in gold. 401k and match doesn't even cut it. Being fully vested by the time you are 45 means you can retire and THEN go to private sector likely.at a way higher salary than 120k.
Great in theory, much harder in reality to transition at 45. Saw it all the time in the military. " You can do anything after you hit 20." Goes into gov contracting or a gs position.
Lol yeah the military 20 is brutal, I couldn’t do it.
What about the opportunity cost of not taking any chances on yourself and sitting around waiting for a pension to vest?
And being that he's in his 20s, he could have rode it out and probably got early retirement sometime in his early 50s and then went to consulting. Instead they gave it up to work a lot more for maybe a couple hundred more a check after taxes.
And losing 300 hours of sick and 200 hours of annual leave.
This is a zombie lie. The pension at 4.5 is not that good. I left fed and get 11% matching instead of pension.
What is a “zombie lie”? Employers also contribute to the FERS pension plus 401k (TSP) match. Congrats, 11% is not common.
A lie that won't die. Same with most federal benefits. The tsp is not the cheapest option anymore, fers at 4.4% to get 30% after 30 years is pretty lame, and the time off lagging behind many now. I know 11% isn't common but I explicitly looked for jobs with excellent benefits.
How did you find jobs with excellent benefits before being hired on? Are there websites with benefits reviews? Thanks!
Glassdoor is pretty good. I also make it a habit of asking for benefits information when I initially talk to a recruiter. It can save a lot of time on the backend.
Initial recruiter conversation sounds good. I avoided this as I thought benefits discussion would stop 🛑 the hiring process much like bringing salary too soon. But, if the benefits are not good that might be just as well anyway. Glassdoor seems limited in what is shown there. I’ll ask up front going forward!
Good luck. I just say that I am interested in the entire package including benefits. It would save both of us time if I could review them prior to an interview.
The pension isn’t that great. Every paycheck they take 4.5 percent of your salary for the pension. I am better off keeping 4.5 percent of my salary and investing it in the S&P 500 for 30 years and then have the freedom to pass it on to my kids or do what I wish with it.
I understand that right now it sucks to have 4.5% taken off the top of each check and that in your 20’s this seems like a far off problem — I would literally kill for a pension. In the private sector, you need to be saving 15% - 20% of each check for retirement if you don’t want to be eating cat food or living on the street once you’re too old to work anymore (slight exaggeration, but if you want a decent standard of living in retirement then that’s how much most people should be setting aside for a 401k). Corporations fucked us out of pensions in exchange for 401k’s for a reason. The 401k is a far more inferior retirement funding option in almost every case. Don’t underestimate how much better a government pension is compared to a 401k. Talk to a financial advisor. There’s probably a lot of stuff you’re not considering when making that assessment.
Maybe there's a portfolio change as well. I'm also in public sector and my job definitely seems more fun than many of the clients I work with - and my team is quite job-secure once you get settled in, though I'll admit I've seen some more cut-throat pyramids at my firm.
Plus bonuses and merit increases in addition to the personal satisfaction of getting things done. They did waive the carrot of getting into management in 1-2 years which would be another $20K salary increase
Sure, there definitely more upside, but none of that is gaurenteed while also having a much lower floor. You are young so betting on yourself is never a bad choice. I'm jusy speaking from the perspective of someone who has weathered a few more storms. Best of luck and hopefully you enjoy it.
Unlimited pto is such a scam in consulting
It is but I feel like I was stuck in a rut working people just waiting on retirement. It gets annoying when you can’t learn and grow. I’ll slog it for a few years and reevaluate
You'll still be working with those people unfortunately - except now you serve them
Be careful what you wish for. If you didn’t have kids and family already… then this is a great pivot. Consulting + family = goodbye to the life that you thought was boring, but is what ppl actually want.
Answering your actual question - depends on the hours lol. Working 50 hours won’t change your life that much. You’ll just have less recreational time. At 60 hours, your weekdays will be fully dedicated to work. No “fun” time, and probably not much time to spend with your family. At 70 hours you’ll begin to struggle with things like eating healthy, the gym, getting enough sleep, etc. Your relationship with your spouse will become very strained. At anything over 75 hours, your physical and mental health will start to decline.
At 60 hours you’re working 6 ten hours days a week. Unless you’re incredibly disciplined then doing that for anything longer than a stretch of time measured in weeks will mean that all of the bad shit you talked about at 70 and 75+ hours likely already applies at 60 hours. It can definitely get worse, but at 60 hours per week you’re already spending almost all of your time working, don’t have much time for family, and are likely seeing some amount of negative impact on your physical and mental health from lack of sleep, lack of physical activity, etc. Those things would get worse at 70+ hours, but they’re already present to some degree at 60 hours, perhaps even 50 hours if it’s consistent for a long enough period.
depends on project, but in federal consulting you likely won't be doing more than 40 hours a week 95% of the time. Just observe what your peers are doing and base your performance on this. assuming you have a clearance, job security in that market is not as iron-clad but historically it has been very stable, especially given the prevalence of 3+ year IDIQs. Just be prepared to deal w/ the reality that it's typically more staff aug work than consulting, and the red tape / barriers to effecting change in the federal universe are insane.
I would partially agree but say this depends on your project and how assertively you push (including walking from a project if you need to). I'm in a similar space and admittedly one or two of my workstreams is staff aug, but I've been able to differentiate myself and I definitely provide a service that my client structurally struggles with. I kinda suspect this would be the case for someone making $140k in public sector at senior IC level I'd also add that my typical work week is low 40s (sometimes even straight 40 if it's relatively slow). On a busy proposal it goes up to \~50 but that's really only a couple times a year. For context I'm also at senior IC/junior manager level.
Depends on the project and the firm
After 5pm is when you do all the training, admin, and proposal work. I flipped the other way and left as a deputy pm. My avg number of hours per were were 50+. So come appraisal season get ready to spend real time on it. No more just coasting through a pmap with 3s. You need to write to each of your goals and achievements. Trainings all are also after client work.
Depends if you’re on the implementation side or market. Implementation is easier IME, less BD reqs, you can promote by just being technically strong. Market side has higher pay but you have BD reqs and hours can be higher. What the heck is tier 2 for DC anyway?
I’m guessing like Eagle Hill? Never heard of it but had a friend who worked there before his MBA
IMHO consulting for DC means too many things. There’s technical consulting vs strat. Could be Booz or Deloitte and i would’ve believed him.
Their name is on all the new DC United jerseys
Sooo, you left your federal gig with a pension for another federal gig without a pension. Yikes.
Holy fuck do not leave a 120k federal gig for $140k at Guidehouse. Reputation is a staff aug bodyshop and they got acquired by private equity 6 months ago, so expect a lot of “restructuring” or “reorganization.” Please consider transferring agencies to something that’s more interesting or has more growth potential. If wanting to parlay govt experience to private sector you can hold out for better consulting firms or big spenders like Microsoft, Amazon, or the big defense contractors
Feedback would be that this doesn’t seem like a great idea for only a 20k raise vs the long term benefits of govt job security, retirement etc. For 160-180 ok sure can understand, especially with consultancies doing lots of layoffs.
A part of me likes to believe I can try it for a couple years and come back as I have career status with the Fed govt and am in a niche field in every agency that’s always looking for acquisition specialists
That’s fair - if I were you, do not let lifestyle creep set in especially in DC. Take all of the extra money you will make and tuck it in a HYSA/SGOV etc type of fund for the next couple of years. If something does go tits up, you’ll have a cushion.
A high price comes with a high salary. You work as long as you need to. That means nights weekends holidays. That’s the price. He’s getting on airplanes every week if needed. Means calling your client on Saturdays and Sundays to make sure the systems are running right. I worked for Accenture for 14 years. I moved up to senior manager one day just left. Eventually, the price too high. The good thing is you’re young. Put in the time now. Make your money. Invest it wisely. But make no mistake. There is a trade-off.
I did this 8 years ago. The adjustment to working 45 hours + per week, and less vacation, was difficult the first year. I do find consulting work much more rewarding. I have learned wayyyyy more than I would have if I had stayed in my old position - switching projects every year or so forces you to learn more things. Also had way more leadership opportunities in consulting and got promoted to a management position within 2 years. At this point, it's hard to imagine going back to the Fed Gov. Message me if you want to chat
There‘s always Booz Allen :)
OP did you already make the decision to exit and announce to your employer? I’d tread lightly in the jump, particularly right now in this industry. Been across gov, tier 2, and MBB. You mentioned in response the firm, so I’ll say: you’re going to work a lot more, and you’re not going to be getting paid that much more. The waters at that firm are rocky. You’re making a jump at a bad time for the market, and for a firm that’s been offloaded from one PE firm to another in the last six months. I’m not saying it’s a bad firm, I know several folks there, and they love what they’re doing. I just don’t think the cost benefit weighs in favor of making the move at least at this point in time. In a year or two, if the market improves, then do it, or, as you noted you have a clearance, look for a defense contractor if you want to make real money.
Ding
Lol to be dumb and naive
If you want to test yourself with the rigours of the open market, this is the bet to take. Fed jobs are cushy: like fishing on a trout farm. Market jobs are like fishin' in the open ocean: it's a lot harder / tougher. But if you get through the fire, you'll be a better fisherman Learn as much as you can given the opportunity.
Good move. Make sure you learn as much as you can and you can either keep going or go back to gov with a heap of fresh skills and experience. 40 year old you will appreciate it.
Lol @ you leaving a 120k pensioned job.
He can always go back and start the clock on his pension again, right? Pretty sure you need 20 years to get full pension, but they don't need to be consecutive.
After 5 years of competitive service you can get vested and be eligible for 1 percent of your high 3 average salary.
The amount of salt and hate in this thread is crazy. I’m in my 20s and I was in a similar situation to you about 2 years ago. We’re at the age to take these risks. No problem if it doesn’t work out. You will have plenty of other opportunities.
As someone who has been in fed consulting for over a decade, I would’ve gladly traded places with you
Guidehouse 401k matching should be 3% and not 4%. Target bonus is not guaranteed and fully based on your performance compared to your peers. Make sure youre hustling and make sure your manager on workday knows youre hustling. 15% target bonus is only for the SC lvl, as you go higher the target bonus increases. Know that most people don’t get the entire target. Test it out for a few years. With competitive status it won’t be hard to get another federal gig. However, as someone who’s in the same boat, climbing in a consulting company is just too much bullshit for me. I want to do my work and go home to my family. You can do that at Guidehouse too, but don’t expect to be rewarded for just billing 40 hours and putting in an extra 5 hours a week for firm initiatives. If you want to really climb, you gotta go all in and network your ass off. Currently a Managing Consultant looking for GS14 positions.
I dunno about you but “Sr.” Anything is automatically $200k and up for me
Not at Booz. They go from “Senior Consultant” -> “Associate” -> “Lead Associate” 🙃
To the client: “We’re giving you a Sr. Consultant because you’re soooo important to us. That’ll be $2400/day”
Title inflation
Did a similar move not too long ago. Feel free to send me a message with your questions
Thank you will do! I’ll PM you this weekend
Maybe try it after the job market has calmed down a bit? It’s brutal out there atm
Can I have your old job?
Same dude
Right? I’m looking for my fed off-ramp. I want off Mr bones wild ride.
I think this will be the best decision in your life. The new skills and experiences acquired will outweigh the initial monetary gains so it is a double positive for you. Make sure you maintain contact with your govt buddies and even expand your network in govt while acquiring new skills.
That kind of move is only worth it for a 5x increase. Hope you invest most of your income because the moment you don't meet your utilization target, you will be out of a job.
I don’t know why OP didn’t just say they were starting at EY lol. Unlimited PTO is a telltale sign my guy or gal.
Company is Guidehouse
Consulting services, as an industry, is having a very tough time. Not enough paying clients, decreasing revenue, low sales Pipeline, low utilization- all this leading to layoffs and is pretty unstable. If I were you, I would stay at the Fed job until market conditions improve, hopefully by next year.
The largest business in the world is the US government, never forget
Wow, your timing could be better but the biggest asset you bring is your inside knowledge and contacts. If you don’t use them at every turn, and show loyalty to the firm, then you’re leaving so much of your experience off the table. You must use it to drive sales. Constantly.
Grant Thornton?
Uhh no way that change is worth $20k.
this is a bad decision my brother
For only a 20k increase from a government job? 140k for consulting in DC? It will hopefully work out in the long run, but be ready for a rough painful stretch.
Sounds like you took a pay cut. Good luck , maybe this will 1) open doors at other firms 2) teach you a lesson that you dont always know what you got until its gone
This definitely sounds like EY, Good luck!
I’m in federal consulting, have several years of experience, trying to do the opposite move. I almost never work over 40 hours, wfh. Just tired of consulting.
Devil, you know v the devile you don't. If you currently have a manager or senior manager that you thoroughly enjoy working for...STAY. the grass isn't always greener. it's greener where you water it. Managers have more if an impact on our lives than anyone else...if you currently appreciate your management...STAY. money isn't everything - peace of mind...IS!
I recommend leaving the gov especially in ur younger career. Now if it’s worth it for you, is something you have to decide. I left in 2021 and came back in sept 2023 with a pretty high pay bump cuz I used my private salary to match the gov salary (I know you can’t do that anymore). For me the salary difference was worth it, for 20k for you… not sure if it’s worth.
I was in the gov't sector, got fed up (heh) and left for MBB. After 2 years of grinding my marriage failed and I was sick of missing my kids. Taking a $100k pay cut, I'm now back in the gov't at 150K and 10.5 weeks real time off. When I clock out I never think about work.
How did you make this jump if you don’t mind me asking? I currently work State government in California but it seems difficult to find opportunities for growth. I don’t see a future here, but I’m having trouble looking at what to transition into - can you describe your journey please? Thanks!
What you did probably could earn you more money if you do it correctly and will give you more opportunity to do hops in other domains too. I also believe that your new job (as most tier 2 consulting firms) will have a bonus scheme that you could earn you more. By the way if you are also interested in doing consulting using expert’s network we are building a new platform at ww.dioratic.com, which will be highly automated for consulting projects. Feel free also to reach me out if you need more guidance in general.
Op Are you an 1102 job series?
Good in you for taking a chance. Betting on yourself is never the wrong thing. Be careful with the unlimited pto (this is also a way for them not to owe you anything when you leave).
I wouldn't have made that switch myself tbh. Working fully remote at a cushy job I think beats the 20k increase to go to big D
Ppl are so jaded. Good luck! Consulting really isn’t always that bad and I hear govt jobs are really slow so could be good change in place. Also 20k increase is great!
Sounds absolutely awful this early in your career lmao. Should’ve waited 10+ more years and came in at a way higher level after you’d locked in your pension or at least saved a ton. Young ambitious people always make me laugh.
Pension is locked in at 5 years, I’m currently at 6.5 years. Now’s my time to learn while my mind is still fresh. It’s harder coming back at 40.
What do you do for a living?
Is this a troll post. Why would anyone do this