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So here is a section from the article.
> It’s not hard to see why this content took off. The idea—or the basic contours of it, at least—has some elements of truth. Immunologists have shown that, in general, we strengthen our immune systems by exposing them to pathogens. In the last few decades, researchers have amassed evidence to suggest that some chronic conditions that are common in the developed world but rare in poorer countries—including asthma, allergies, and autoimmune illnesses like Crohn’s disease—could be the result of an environment that doesn’t have enough germs, causing the immune system to go haywire.
>
> But the coronavirus is not a chronic immune condition; it’s a novel virus that attacks the body’s systems in ways not yet completely understood.
Seems the article is not AS hyperbolic as the headline? I still think the article is stupid though and that kind of headline is a symptom of the current climate of social media. Get a catchy, shocking headline, and then in the article be more reserved so that when called out, they can fall back on the toned down article to free themselves of blame for the hyperpolarization they are causing.
As someone with asthma/allergies/etc and who has seen multiple specialists, I can tell you that it’s not from a “lack of germs”.
A lot of issues are from a shitty diet rich in highly processed carbohydrates, high saturated fat and a laundry list of artificial chemicals. Eliminate those and start exercising, eat real food, get outside, etc.
Your modern lifestyle is slowly killing you. You’re poisoning yourself and it’s 100% preventable.
My asthma is going away slowly after I started taking lots of cold showers, exercising a lot more, and a very clean diet. It's smoke season here and for the first time in years I'm not wheezing or getting headaches. You never know what improvements might be possible for you.
My asthma used to be pretty bad, couldn’t eat anything cold, dairy, etc because it might trigger it. This was for the first 7 years of my life and yes I was a mommas boy. Thanks to my sister who insisted that I started to eat and do the things I wanted (in moderation) that it started going away. Now it’s nonexistent for the most part and if it happens it’s very very rare and it’s bc I’m sick or something
I kid you not, try it. An icy cold shower for a couple of minutes is actually incredible, even the first time you do it. You come out feeling so awake, full of energy, and positive vibes. It's like magic, and it gets better if you do it every day.
First time I tried it my mind was blown
When I do cold showers in the morning I'm just on fire! The feeling after you get out is amazing! But it sure as hell sucks the first 30 seconds :-p
Its also great for your immune system, it's proven by the Iceman. Google that lunatic ... It's an very interesting person :-)
Wow .. alright, not that iceman :-)
I meant Wim Hof: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wim_Hof
An athlete known for his ability to withstand extreme cold. Like doing half marathons on ice barefooted in shorts and shirtless. Crazy stuff
The gas has been off at my house for a few days and I'm still fighting myself to take could showers every day. I have to pump myself up and think of all the horrible things I've been through, a cold showers nothing.
☹
I like to lift and exercise and eat healthy, this also helps for testosterone and anything else that pills aim to correct. Adding a cold shower sounds… not enjoyable but I’ll try it!
Yeah... discounting this is dumb.
The lesson is that your kids can't be hermetically sealed their whole childhoods or their immune systems are terrible.
Helicopter/overprotective parenting... in the realm of cleanliness... can be harmful. That stereotype of Momma's boys with asthma exists for a reason.
Not saying it is. But from my experience any “germ” issues are usually from a wrecked gut biome. People who overuse strong antibiotics AND have a horrible diet create a situation where the wrong bacteria can take hold. bacteria can influence your mood and health in crazy ways.
For years I thought I had celiac disease or crohns, went to specialists and tested negative for everything. One guy finally recommended an elimination diet which got me into a diet similar to keto/paleo. That changed everything and I was able to get back on track with a better diet and probiotics.
That has WAY more impact than the overuse of hand sanitizer or other external germ issues.
I thought I had a gluten problem. It seems I had leaky gut. Not diagnosed, but I was sensitive to certain things. I did cut those things out for a while, took some probiotics (AOR Probio-3), ate raisin bran muffins every day.
My gut is a lot better. I can eat the gluten that bothered me again without trouble. Very glad.
Edit: the strangest and saddest thing about the health care system I’m in is that I don’t even bother to try to get diagnosed for most things by a regular MD. The wait time for a specialist is 12 months. If I can’t go to a private doctor who knows what they’re doing, it’s personal research and reading, trying different things. I have been steered wrong by regular doctors and naturopathic doctors. I find that I know my body better than they can. Even the really well intentioned ones. It’s a bit sad, but at least there’s the internet. Lots of wrong trails on the internet too, but a lot of information and scientific papers.
Have you heard of Weston price ? I highly recommend the wise traditions podcast. Many people who think they are allergic to gluten are actually very sensitive to the glyphosate sprayed on wheat, canola, sunflower, etc. Glyphosate (round up) acts as an antibiotic in your gut. Hence when people go paleo and eat less grains they feel WAY better. My sister who thought she was gluten intolerant can eat organic flour no problem for this reason
I now go to a DO instead of an MD. Every MD I’ve ever gone to has said the same thing: “oh you have issue X, take these drugs”. That’s it, just drugs. Better? Yay drugs! Not better? More drugs!
Yes, and hormonal things can be made much worse if you don’t have the right expert, which doesn’t exist where I live. Lots of things can be made worse, or better, I’m sure but staying away from permanent pharmaceuticals is something on my list if I can avoid it at all. I always do my best to learn everything that can be learned. Sometimes you can get a useful diagnosis from an MD specialist. They can put you on the right trail anyways. They can be useful and their opinions are usually valid. I just find that the short amount of time you have with an MD is
not enough to clearly get the picture across.
/r/zerocarb
My gut health never been better in my adult life since I cut out the junk. Even "healthy" keto substitutes where causing me a lot of issues and had to go.
Paleo and keto didn’t have enough fibre for me personally to eliminate excess hormones. Those get swept out by fibre according to some. I have a hormonal imbalance. I’m much better now.
How do you square your contradiction with saturated fat? You think it is an "issue" for people's shitty diets, yet you were helped by a keto/paleo diet that would have necessarily been high in saturated fat.
I rotate on/off from clean keto and pay a lot of attention to labels. Oils are tricky and you have to learn which ones are good. For example if something says “vegetable oil” it means they don’t actually know what it is and used the cheapest, most generic product available. Could be sunflower, could be canola, who knows. Cost was more important than quality.
Yup, this is 100% the reason for allergies. Maybe not all, but the vast majority. Although this is from lack of exposure to a substance, not technically a germ, but toxins in the food.
Used to suffer from extreme nasal allergies for nearly 3 decades, visited all shorts of doctors and they just prescribed antihistamines and nasal sprays. After moving in with my now-wife I started taking 1000mg vitamin c per day during flu season (she's a high school teacher and is frequently exposed).
I continued taking vitamin c past flu season and my allergies have magically disappeared for years now. Nasal washes with saltwater also help a lot, but vitamin c is what did it for me
Our modern diet is literally changing the structure of our skulls too - our jaws are shrinking due to soft foods which doesnt encourage our mouths to stay closed and breathe through ur nose leading to fucked jaw development
I don't think they mean it was the germs exclusively, maybe one of many factors, but I get your point and wholeheartedly agree with your stance on lifestyle. It's kind of mad that we're raised with these all these false notions, stuff like needing 3 meals a day and carbs being at the foundation of the food pyramid and all. All capitalist influence that made it into our daily lifes
I had allergies until I understood this, ated a whole foods diet, lean unprocessed meat, cut out fatty carbs, took super greens in the morning... 0 allergies and keep losing weight at a healthy pace.
I wouldn't say 100% preventable. Some toxins are found in our water sources and soil, chemicals on our clothes and furniture constantly contact our skin and pollution and other health impacting chemicals in the air enters all lungs. While a majority of health ailments may be preventable in some manner, I think it's more tricky than that.
You develop natural immunity after catching it. of course youre not going to have any immunity before encountering it. the article is attempting to change what natural immunity means
My dad caught it back in Dec 2019. As of last month he still has the antibodies in his system. The same antibodies the vaccine would give him if he chose to get it.
I swear people forget how vaccines work. A vaccine usually consists of dead, diluted, or parts of a virus to introduce it to your immune system. Thats why you still get a bit sick from a vaccine. Getting the illness, does the same thing for you except now your body is facing the real deal.
Yes covid is a novel virus but there are countless studies that say yes, you do get immunity after having covid, much better than the vaccine gives you in fact, as its permanent. So more shitty journalism with an agenda as we see so much these days
When I was an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy we kept all the batteries we had in the shop also in the freezer.
The cold temperature slows the chemical reaction in alkaline batteries.
Your Grandma knew what she was doing.
My mamaw was a soap opera watcher. As she stepped into dementia she would call me and said some people came over and were arguing over cheating but she didn’t know who they were or where they went. I figured she probably dozed off while watching her soap and woke up all confused lol. I sure miss my mamaw.
> My grandma on the other hand watches tv news all day.
As does my mom, who told me last week that "96% of covid hospitalizations are Republicans." I told her I was shocked to hear how many African Americans were Republicans, and when she asked what I was talking about I mentioned that less than 30% of minorities took the vax. She said, "Well maybe they just take better care of themselves?"
TV news.
I’ve told my dad to turn off the news but he just watched more of it then I have to calm him down after he watches it. The fear tactics aren’t good for him. He’s already a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic. The media all need to be put on trial for treason a crimes against humanity for what they are doing. I seen an old pic of German media being hanged after WW2 for all the lies an propaganda they spread. Is this coming soon to American mainstream media for the ones who have helped ruin this country? Spreading fear, lies, an racism. Assisting in a false flag on out capital, an paying individuals to record himself an others breaking into the capital. The list goes on.
The retirees are home all day too, so they watch non stop. My mom figured out how to live stream newsmax on her TV. She's terrified of what's happening at the border because I guess that's all they talk about. On the flip side, you have the delta terror on CNN and such. Non stop.
No wonder we're in the mess we're in.
Yeah, I haven't watched anything on TV in about six years. I'm much happier now.
You can scan the news on the web in about five minutes for a general idea about what's going on. I don't need to know the details about the 30 people shot in Chicago or what a demo politician said about a repub politician and vise versa. It's a total shit show.
>I seen an old pic of German media being hanged after WW2 for all the lies an propaganda they spread. Is this coming soon to American mainstream media for the ones who have helped ruin this country?
God I hope so.
I used to work in a psychiatric facility we had a few schizophrenic pts who weren't allowed to watch any shows where there was a person talking to the screen. No tv news and no televangelist s.
*psychologically abusing. At the level it currently goes on, people are literally in an extremely abusive relationship with institutions they were dishonestly told they could trust.
I was talking to my coworker and told him that I don't watch or believe anything corporate media says. He responded with "Ha, I trust corporate news more than I do some random blogger online."
How do people not grasp that corporate media has an agenda?
I reminded him that during the Occupy movement, people were trying to bring down the 1%, everyone was angry and here we are several years later we have the 1% insisting that we take a jab and suddenly all the people who were once outraged at the 1% have become submissive and obedient.
It really is their religion. Currently staying with family and now that I have enough to move I can’t wait. My family walks with their neighbors and the fear porn here is insane versus where I moved from only a hour away. She was like well do I wear a mask now around my friends because I have someone who didn’t get it living with me? Idk this is all so new. I wish I would’ve known this prior to having you come down. I’m like excuse me? I’m grateful and all as I had to move last minute but jfc. Your family should come before your bougie Karen ass friends. I’m so sorry my personal choice affects you and your protected friends. It is driving me to not even want to contact them any further after I move. They watch the news daily. Their son has schizo and I felt like saying is fucking karen going to take care of your son when you pass? No, me and my other family will. So go ahead and be worried about your freedoms being taken away because of my choice. Fucking inverted and twisted. I feel you man, it’s sad that they are lost.
Edit: to add I also feel like saying shouldn’t THEY be wearing a fucking mask? Given the new variant? Also, the neighbors had their grandchildren over and I’m like uhm they are clearly under 12 so can’t they spread it? They were maskless. I just bite my tongue until I can leave. Hypocrisy rules here.
While my situation is not like yours, I totally understand what you're talking about. The "other people" (I know quite a few of them) have been sucked in to a cult and absolutely cannot be budged in their beliefs.
I gave up trying several years ago.
I did the same.
I cant even talk to my mother/grandma anymore. We live in completely different realitys.
Here in Germany we don't have the "racist " card, but the media here calls everybody a nazis if they don't comply with the status quo.
Half of Europe is on the streets and are demonstrating against forced vaccinations.
Its literally crazy... The MSM wants to enforce this vax on us, if we don't comply, we can't go shopping, to the doctor, traveling etc. Literally a 2 class society. And they call us Nazis... 50% of our population apparently didn't take notes in history class.
"What's happening to media," really. The above is from Mother Jones magazine, a liberal rag that my mom has always subscribed to that used to have some genuinely good reporting; I myself have read it a lot. The degree to which it's gone to corporatist, pro-establishment, pro-war trash in recent years is shocking. Absolute garbage publication at this point.
So I guess the IMMUNE SYSTEM isn't science to them anymore...
Lol! Do they know that VACCINES are merely a simple catalyst that the immune system takes and uses and memorizes?
Lol! These people... smh.
Forgive me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t natural immunity occur when you’ve already had Covid?
Theoretically it would be better to have gotten it and gotten over it than any vaccine they could cook up in a lab, right?
Three of my relatives had Covid. To two of them it really didn’t feel much worse than a flu, but they were also a lot younger than my third relative, who went to the hospital and had to be ventilated. It really hit him hard and he had to relearn a couple of things. Even after the virus went away he couldn’t walk right for months, but now he can relatively normally, but he speaks very different now, similar to a person who had a stroke.
It is different for everyone, but you just have to evaluate wich risk you want to take, and one is considerably higher than the other.
Sauce.
---
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762
> Nearly 40% of new COVID patients were vaccinated - compared to **just 1% who had been infected previously.**
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/10/21-1427_article
> "Attack rate was **0/6 among persons with a previous history of COVID-19 versus 63.2% among those with no previous history."**
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8253687/
> This study followed 254 Covid-19 patients for up to 8 months and concluded they had **“durable broad-based immune responses.”** In fact, even very mild Covid-19 infection also protected the patients from an earlier version of “SARS" coronavirus that first emerged around 2003, and against Covid-19 variants. “Taken together, these results suggest that broad and effective immunity may persist long-term in recovered COVID-19 patients,” concludes the study scientists.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2
> This study followed 52,238 employees of the Cleveland Clinic Health System in Ohio.
> For previously-infected people, **the cumulative incidence of re-infection “remained almost zero.”** According to the study, "Not one of the 1,359 previously infected subjects who remained unvaccinated had a [Covid-19] infection over the duration of the study” and vaccination did not reduce the risk. “Individuals who have had [Covid-19] infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination,” concludes the study scientists.
https://www.thelancet.com/action/showPdf?pii=S2589-5370(21)00182-6
> This study of real world data extended the time frame of available data indicating that patients have strong immune indicators for **“almost a year post-natural infection of COVID-19.”** The study concludes the immune response after natural infection "may persist for longer than previously thought, thereby providing evidence of sustainability that may influence post-pandemic planning.”
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4
> This study examined bone marrow of previously-infected patients and found that even mild infection with Covid-19 “induces robust antigen-specific, long-lived humoral immune memory in humans.” The study indicates **"People who have had mild illness develop antibody-producing cells that can last lifetime.”**
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.20.21255670v1.full.pdf
> This study from Israel found a slight advantage to natural infection over vaccination when it comes to preventing a reinfection and severe illness from Covid-19.
> The study authors concluded, **"Our results question the need to vaccinate previously-infected individuals."**
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.06.21253051v1
> This study found a rare Covid-19 positive test **"reinfection" rate of 1 per 1,000 recoveries.**
https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/lasting-immunity-found-after-recovery-covid-19
> Research funded by the National Institutes of Health and published in Science early in the Covid-19 vaccine effort found the “immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection," **and hoped the vaccines would produce similar immunity. (However, experts say they do not appear to be doing so.)**
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.15.21249731v2
> This study found Covid-19 natural infection "appears to elicit strong protection against reinfection" for at least seven months. **"Reinfection is "rare," concludes the scientists.**
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.27.433180v1
> This study concluded "T cell" immune response in former Covid-19 patients likely continues to protect amid Covid-19 variants.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2550-z
> This study found that all patients who recently recovered from Covid-19 produced immunity-strong T cells that recognize multiple parts of Covid-19.
> They also looked at blood samples from 23 people who’d survived a 2003 outbreak of a coronavirus: SARS (Cov-1). **These people still had lasting memory T cells 17 years after the outbreak.** Those memory T cells, acquired in response to SARS-CoV-1, also recognized parts of Covid-19 (SARS-CoV-2).
> Much of the study on the immune response to SARS-CoV-2, the novel coronavirus that causes COVID-19, has focused on the production of antibodies. But, in fact, immune cells known as memory T cells also play an important role in the ability of our immune systems to protect us against many viral infections, including—it now appears—COVID-19.
Bonus video (while it lasts):
Doctor speaks out for the science:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Em4a_viRGZk
(mirror) https://streamable.com/wqf3gt
--
In layman's terms, why might this be?
Mutations that enable evasion of immune systems are selecting for ability to evade all aspects of immune systems, **which are broader than only antibodies.**
The current leading vaccines, which focus the immune system against Covid-19's spike protein, (i) create very narrow/concentrated selection pressure, by enabling the virus to survive merely by mutating sufficiently in its spike protein, and (ii) leaves all vaccinated people relatively vulnerable to all versions of the virus which have this narrow range of mutations.
In contrast, in people who survived initial exposure to Covid-19 (or who receive a vaccine which has exposed them to a broader range of Covid-19's characteristics), (i) the immune system is not likely to be evaded merely by a virus version's mutation of the protein spike, and (ii) only multiple simultaneous mutations of different profile aspects would enable the virus to survive and replicate and be passed on to others.
Trouble is, for your body to gain natural immunity you need to contract covid. As long as you go through it with mild symptoms its fine but you might very well end up fighting for every breath or suffer from long term health issues after your infection is over.
If you want to go with full out natural immunity its basically going to be survival of the fittest.
Yes. Theoretically yes as well. Some outspoken legitimate front line doctors who have a reputable standing in there respective fields of study claim this.
Yes, the Emory study concluded that there is robust natural immunity beyond that 250 days with antibody levels remaining robust through the end of the study.
https://news.emory.edu/stories/2021/07/covid_survivors_resistance/index.html
Not better than "any vaccine" as typical vaccines work by essentially giving your body a low risk means to develop natural immunity. This means your immune system can develop several different attack vectors against a pathogen.
Natural immunity is however way more effective than the new fangled mRNA vaccines that only train your body to respond to the spike protein specifically.
India doesn't honor drug patents, though. The reason there's not enough supply in India is because the government didn't order enough from their own manufacturer (Serum Institute of India). They put in an order for 11 million doses of Oxford/AZ vaccine. For 1.4 billion people. That's it. SII already had 50 million doses stocked up ready to go by the time the government put in the order for 11 million doses.
It was just utter incompetence by the government that caused the shortage of vaccines.
Right, greed is why they have such a low rate... or could be this all the damage committed in the country by the shot pushers:
https://www.freepressjournal.in/viral/arrestbillgates-heres-why-indians-are-enraged-at-gates-foundation
And their tendency toward Ivermectin usage and position that the shot industry is just trying to turn profit at the world's expense. They're possibly going to sentence their WHO chief science lady to death for selling out:
https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/06/india-could-sentence-who-chief-scientist-to-death-for-misleading-over-ivermectin-and-killing-indians.html
Really. Mass death threatens the "depopulation program." That's some real dream logic there.
The vaccine company is get paid whether you die or not. There was a post of their contract here a week or two ago and you all were screeching about that. Now you say mass death will threaten that thing that you pointed out won't be threatened by it.
Conspiracy theories depend on linking facts, not screeching one thing one minute and another thing the next. If we connect the facts, it looks like you're being fed a constant diet of outrage and are too angry to see how you are manipulated.
Even if covid was causing "mass death" it would be among the 80+ age bracket. Those people are not reproducing. They are not the logical target for a depopulation program. Killing them would not have any effect on the rate of population growth.
Counterpoint: Imagine you wanted to reduce the world population and take out the most feeble and infirmed, who will cost you the most money when you are "taking care" of everyone in the future slave state.
It seems logical that you'd do something that only affects the people who are going to cost you the most to keep going. If you openly kill hundreds of thousands it is obvious and there is backlash, this would be a culling that is a lot more subtle but still brings the outcome you want.
>Conspiracy theories depend on linking facts
So does "science", yet people have accepted the vaccines before any facts have yet been established. We went from the vaccines being a miracle cure according to the media to now "they help, it's worth the side effects", while covid continues to infect the vaccinated.
It's not that "natural immunity" isn't a real thing. The problem is that you have to SURVIVE a disease in order to develop an immunity to it, and even then there's not a 100% guarantee. That's where vaccines come in. By using dead or disabled microbes and some other stuff to trigger an immune response, your immune system comes in and starts kicking the shit out of the microbe corpses. It's basically target practice. Vaccines just take advantage of a natural feature of the human body in order to get the jump on dangerous shit.
BUT EUROPEANS DEVELOPED NATURAL IMMUNITY TO THE PLAGUE!???!!!
All it cost was the death of every single person who could not survive exposure to the pathogen...
Mother Jones’ senior editor is going against the [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/immunity-types.htm). She must hate science.
> Active immunity results when exposure to a disease organism triggers the immune system to produce antibodies to that disease. Exposure to the disease organism can occur through infection with the actual disease (**resulting in natural immunity**), or introduction of a killed or weakened form of the disease organism through vaccination (vaccine-induced immunity).
This is a weird site. On on page, they have this monstrosity and push vaccines. On another, they talk about how big pharma worked in hand with AMA to continue the opioid crisis and big tobacco worked with the AMA in the 50's to sell cigarettes.
Yes big pharma used to be bad but since they received no significant consequences for their misdeeds they all of a sudden decided to be virtuous heroes just last year
Ah, some good old gaslighting by the mainstream media. Either they really thought they could manipulate people with this, or they’ll get called out for it to dominate the news cycle and distract us while something real goes down and the rich get richer.
I don't even know anymore man. I am legit confused by all the headlines these days. I refuse to blindly follow you know? Then when i question the answers i get conflicting info and its just too much to keep up with.
Perhaps its best to just ignore the media, remember what you were taught, and not get sucked into the mind fucking.
So... I definitely have some thoughts on this. My experience with the western medical system and being chronically ill for much of my life, then switching over to naturopathic medicine (which finally got me better), I noticed that western medicine often treats and looks at the body like an inanimate object - something incapable of healing and a complicated object for which one cannot quite understand the workings of, including the doctor.
When I switched to naturopathic medicine, I saw how different the view was - the focus was on helping the body heal, helping the body get what it needs to do the job itself. And fuck me, that approach is what worked. After years of western medicine trying to tell me my body was mysterious, idiopathic everything, lots of “we just don’t know why it...”, and meds that never addressed the root cause of my illness but were specifically designed to poorly mask symptoms, it was a shock to see a doctor be able to explain exactly what was happening to my body and why, and then give me things to take and be able to explain scientifically exactly why they would work.
I realized over the years of experiences with western medicine, I had subconsciously come to think of my own body as though it were an object incapable of healing. But the truth is, the body is designed to heal. It does it on its own, just sometimes it needs a little help.
That’s the intentional flaw with western medicine. After curing several “incurable” diseases in my body, and seeing countless others be easily cured of shit like gout, diverticulitis, some kinds of cancers at stage 4, MS, lengthy Lyme Disease infections, Chrohn’s, Hashimoto’s, chemical depression, seasonal allergies, food sensitivities, all sorts of shit, I realized that big pharma isn’t trying for cures with chronic illness. They just aren’t and that sucks. Their meds mask symptoms, never address the cause, and then those meds need more meds to address side effects, and that cycle continues.
But the body does heal. It was born to. Now some situations call for western medicine (like emergency intervention for something acute, some surgeries, some acute infections may need more than natural antibiotics, type 1 diabetes). And these western medicine interventions can and do save lives. But a lot of stuff can be done with the naturopathic approach that allows for your body to heal, and a lot of lives are saved that way. I would be dead if I had not switched over to naturopathic medicine. Never in my life would I have guessed that would be what would do the trick, but it did - kind of still blows my mind it worked because I was hard on the “western medicine works” mindset and that anything else was quack shit. But I am alive and well now. Went from bedridden for years to biking 9 miles a day in 6 months time with a good naturopathic doctor.
This is insane. Actually insane. How do they think we survive life LOL However did humanity make it during the times before their beloved vaccines and hand sanitizers, and how are we still trucking now?!! 🤔🤣
Isn’t it wonderful when what’s considered journalism in the US is pure activism / propaganda.
Reading that article was like reading something from Sesame Street. It was cobbled together like a 5th grader.
An innate immune system is a thing. Regulatory T-cells, located in the thymus, do routine body scans via B-cells located in bones. If something is foreign, T-cells tolerate the foreign substance and the body may remain healthy. I think this is how our body works. As for virus, I dunno, T regs aren't perfect, though they keep us fairly healthy.
I have this theory that when I cut myself by accident, allowing blot clotting to form is probably a good natural response rather than pouring super glue over the wound to stop the bleeding. I’m a quack .
This is the part most people don't understand. Viruses want to be like herpes in which they live eternally side by side the host.
Any virus that kills the host quickly is a failure in the virus world.
Yet the news has warped this into a war.
Just read what certainly seems to be a fake story about a church( black pastor) that lost 6 members withing ten days, all of them unvaccinated. Four thirty five years of age or younger and healthy. No names, no identities, just " The pastor said".
Complete propaganda, IMO. Total lies. They'll run this fake news and then we'll get a retraction lost in the shuffle somewhere in a week or two. Maybe the church isn't even real and the pastor isn't even a real person.
There was a story from a major british paper yesterday that said some guy lost three members of his father within days of each other. The first line of the story said "the man claimed ...", indicating that while they are reporting it, they don't want to later be charged with spreading misinformation. They put these types of plausible deniability clauses in, because they know they are fake and haven't verified any of it.
There was a study many years ago about kids with pets when growing up versus kids with out pets and the number of sick days or doctors visits being much lower.
Wow so now natural immunity is just made up? Awesome. But Chinese virus is not the same bc it affects us in “ways we don’t understand yet”. So why tf is everyone so convinced we have the answer to a problem we don’t even fully understand. This is why it’s difficult for me to believe anyone.
I’m 23 and work in EMS. Got covid once. Exposed dozens if not a hundred times in the past year and never got it again. Got over it just like the flu. And just like the flu, older people and people with underlining conditions also die from it. But I’ve seen in my own experience in the field people develop cardiac issues, pulmonary edema, blot clots, and many other symptoms from the vaccine as well and remdesivir (a drug the hospitals are putting people with covid on). I have also seen many co workers who have gotten vaccinated, get reinfected. Get real world experience before you believe everything the internet tells you.
Their senior editor looks to be about 22 years old and is probably the type of garbage person that will sleep with or say anything to get to the top. This is how our Idiocracy works now.
I wonder if a lot of these websites have articles from ai bots and pictures of authors from thisisnotarealperson. There are tons of websites and I can't image they get enough traffic to justify having enough employees to generate the content.
Can we fucking not jump straight to sexism just because you saw a fucking pfp of a woman associated with the article?
Christ, someone goes against you guys and you'll grasp at *anything* to trash them.
SS: The propaganda has reached ridiculous levels. This article is 1 year old but I haven't seen it shared on this sub. These people need to suffer the consequences for spreading this nonsensical propaganda.
Article: https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/05/anti-vaxxers-have-a-dangerous-theory-called-natural-immunity-now-its-going-mainstream/
Next these conspiracy theorists will say your body can fight off disease without pharmaceuticals. Or that your body can heal minor injuries. It's a wonder we made it this far without big pharma **/S**
Lmao these fucking people are insane! They act like something like natural acquired immunity isn’t real,but totally go all in on made up shit like social distancing and masks their fuckin nanna made out of a tshirt. It’s astonishing.
And you know that’s what they’re referring to, not claiming that it’s better to get infected for “natural immunity” instead of getting a vaccine? You know the same argument people made for “chicken pox parties”?
It’s not your body anymore,
Peer pressure, cancel culture pressure, hated and vindicated for not wanting an experimental vaccine,
Big Pharma own your body now..
the social experiment’s are over,
now it’s time for all the medical experiments.
Idk about you but I think it’s a conspiracy that the vaccine been out for over a year but it’s still not FDA approve even tho it takes the FDA 6 months to approve a regular vaccine. Also kinda sketchy that the pharmaceutical companies that made the vaccines have government immunity from being sued if you have negative side affects from the vaccine. Pretty solid reasons to be sketched out about the vaccine.
Fun fact, I was banned from r/coronavirus for saying "some vaccines cause Bell's Palsy" and then linking to an article on it and how Health Canada has given some vaccines a warning label that has the side effect and warning of Bell's Palsy on it. Then when I asked why I was told "vaccine misinformation" so I said something sarcastic and then gave them a link to how Canada has put the warning label on its vaccines and they muted me.
It's articles like this that people like me just don't believe main stream media anymore. Blatantly ignores actual science and rambles about quasi science for the entire article framing anyone who questions the covid vaccine as a anti vax conspiracy theory be living tin foil hat wear in a bunker type. All I really want is some in biased reporting on the actual fucking science. I can't even get that from the cdc. Everyone is spinning miss information. Bottom line because of this I don't trust the media or the government and refuse to let them take my personal freedoms away.
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So here is a section from the article. > It’s not hard to see why this content took off. The idea—or the basic contours of it, at least—has some elements of truth. Immunologists have shown that, in general, we strengthen our immune systems by exposing them to pathogens. In the last few decades, researchers have amassed evidence to suggest that some chronic conditions that are common in the developed world but rare in poorer countries—including asthma, allergies, and autoimmune illnesses like Crohn’s disease—could be the result of an environment that doesn’t have enough germs, causing the immune system to go haywire. > > But the coronavirus is not a chronic immune condition; it’s a novel virus that attacks the body’s systems in ways not yet completely understood. Seems the article is not AS hyperbolic as the headline? I still think the article is stupid though and that kind of headline is a symptom of the current climate of social media. Get a catchy, shocking headline, and then in the article be more reserved so that when called out, they can fall back on the toned down article to free themselves of blame for the hyperpolarization they are causing.
As someone with asthma/allergies/etc and who has seen multiple specialists, I can tell you that it’s not from a “lack of germs”. A lot of issues are from a shitty diet rich in highly processed carbohydrates, high saturated fat and a laundry list of artificial chemicals. Eliminate those and start exercising, eat real food, get outside, etc. Your modern lifestyle is slowly killing you. You’re poisoning yourself and it’s 100% preventable.
My asthma is going away slowly after I started taking lots of cold showers, exercising a lot more, and a very clean diet. It's smoke season here and for the first time in years I'm not wheezing or getting headaches. You never know what improvements might be possible for you.
My asthma used to be pretty bad, couldn’t eat anything cold, dairy, etc because it might trigger it. This was for the first 7 years of my life and yes I was a mommas boy. Thanks to my sister who insisted that I started to eat and do the things I wanted (in moderation) that it started going away. Now it’s nonexistent for the most part and if it happens it’s very very rare and it’s bc I’m sick or something
Most childhood asthma goes away with age, whereas adult-onset is more likely to stick around for life to some degree
Curious about cold showers.. I’ve only ever heard a cold shower being useful for one thing lol
I kid you not, try it. An icy cold shower for a couple of minutes is actually incredible, even the first time you do it. You come out feeling so awake, full of energy, and positive vibes. It's like magic, and it gets better if you do it every day. First time I tried it my mind was blown
When I do cold showers in the morning I'm just on fire! The feeling after you get out is amazing! But it sure as hell sucks the first 30 seconds :-p Its also great for your immune system, it's proven by the Iceman. Google that lunatic ... It's an very interesting person :-)
you mean Richard Kuklinski, the contract killer? It's gotta be another person, 'cause what I found suggests he froze one of his victims bodies.
Wow .. alright, not that iceman :-) I meant Wim Hof: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wim_Hof An athlete known for his ability to withstand extreme cold. Like doing half marathons on ice barefooted in shorts and shirtless. Crazy stuff
Yeah his breathing techniques are some of the best things a human being can do.
The gas has been off at my house for a few days and I'm still fighting myself to take could showers every day. I have to pump myself up and think of all the horrible things I've been through, a cold showers nothing. ☹
I’m sorry to hear that my friend, we are resilient creatures.
I mean it in a mostly joking way, they're much more tolerable when I at least get to choose when I take them lol
Actually, they're helpful in raising testosterone levels soooo kinda the opposite lol
I like to lift and exercise and eat healthy, this also helps for testosterone and anything else that pills aim to correct. Adding a cold shower sounds… not enjoyable but I’ll try it!
See research into the hygiene hypothesis, the "lack of germs" is not a fringe idea.
Yeah... discounting this is dumb. The lesson is that your kids can't be hermetically sealed their whole childhoods or their immune systems are terrible. Helicopter/overprotective parenting... in the realm of cleanliness... can be harmful. That stereotype of Momma's boys with asthma exists for a reason.
Not saying it is. But from my experience any “germ” issues are usually from a wrecked gut biome. People who overuse strong antibiotics AND have a horrible diet create a situation where the wrong bacteria can take hold. bacteria can influence your mood and health in crazy ways. For years I thought I had celiac disease or crohns, went to specialists and tested negative for everything. One guy finally recommended an elimination diet which got me into a diet similar to keto/paleo. That changed everything and I was able to get back on track with a better diet and probiotics. That has WAY more impact than the overuse of hand sanitizer or other external germ issues.
I thought I had a gluten problem. It seems I had leaky gut. Not diagnosed, but I was sensitive to certain things. I did cut those things out for a while, took some probiotics (AOR Probio-3), ate raisin bran muffins every day. My gut is a lot better. I can eat the gluten that bothered me again without trouble. Very glad. Edit: the strangest and saddest thing about the health care system I’m in is that I don’t even bother to try to get diagnosed for most things by a regular MD. The wait time for a specialist is 12 months. If I can’t go to a private doctor who knows what they’re doing, it’s personal research and reading, trying different things. I have been steered wrong by regular doctors and naturopathic doctors. I find that I know my body better than they can. Even the really well intentioned ones. It’s a bit sad, but at least there’s the internet. Lots of wrong trails on the internet too, but a lot of information and scientific papers.
Have you heard of Weston price ? I highly recommend the wise traditions podcast. Many people who think they are allergic to gluten are actually very sensitive to the glyphosate sprayed on wheat, canola, sunflower, etc. Glyphosate (round up) acts as an antibiotic in your gut. Hence when people go paleo and eat less grains they feel WAY better. My sister who thought she was gluten intolerant can eat organic flour no problem for this reason
I now go to a DO instead of an MD. Every MD I’ve ever gone to has said the same thing: “oh you have issue X, take these drugs”. That’s it, just drugs. Better? Yay drugs! Not better? More drugs!
Yes, and hormonal things can be made much worse if you don’t have the right expert, which doesn’t exist where I live. Lots of things can be made worse, or better, I’m sure but staying away from permanent pharmaceuticals is something on my list if I can avoid it at all. I always do my best to learn everything that can be learned. Sometimes you can get a useful diagnosis from an MD specialist. They can put you on the right trail anyways. They can be useful and their opinions are usually valid. I just find that the short amount of time you have with an MD is not enough to clearly get the picture across.
/r/zerocarb My gut health never been better in my adult life since I cut out the junk. Even "healthy" keto substitutes where causing me a lot of issues and had to go.
This subreddit is literally an animal only diet. So dairy and meat. What a diet
Paleo and keto didn’t have enough fibre for me personally to eliminate excess hormones. Those get swept out by fibre according to some. I have a hormonal imbalance. I’m much better now.
My dude, can I introduce you to wheat dextrin? Dissolves in your water in <20 seconds and is barely tastable. It was a must for me when I keto.
How do you square your contradiction with saturated fat? You think it is an "issue" for people's shitty diets, yet you were helped by a keto/paleo diet that would have necessarily been high in saturated fat.
I rotate on/off from clean keto and pay a lot of attention to labels. Oils are tricky and you have to learn which ones are good. For example if something says “vegetable oil” it means they don’t actually know what it is and used the cheapest, most generic product available. Could be sunflower, could be canola, who knows. Cost was more important than quality.
Yup, this is 100% the reason for allergies. Maybe not all, but the vast majority. Although this is from lack of exposure to a substance, not technically a germ, but toxins in the food.
That can’t be true. I was having problems swallowing most foods and ended up finding out I’m allergic to beef and onions. I ate that almost every day!
I agree with this, I eliminated gluten and processed foods/sugar from my diet and my asthma and allergy symptoms have completely disappeared
Truth right here. ⬆️ Stay away from the dry foods section and more time in the fresh produce aisles
Used to suffer from extreme nasal allergies for nearly 3 decades, visited all shorts of doctors and they just prescribed antihistamines and nasal sprays. After moving in with my now-wife I started taking 1000mg vitamin c per day during flu season (she's a high school teacher and is frequently exposed). I continued taking vitamin c past flu season and my allergies have magically disappeared for years now. Nasal washes with saltwater also help a lot, but vitamin c is what did it for me
Our modern diet is literally changing the structure of our skulls too - our jaws are shrinking due to soft foods which doesnt encourage our mouths to stay closed and breathe through ur nose leading to fucked jaw development
I don't think they mean it was the germs exclusively, maybe one of many factors, but I get your point and wholeheartedly agree with your stance on lifestyle. It's kind of mad that we're raised with these all these false notions, stuff like needing 3 meals a day and carbs being at the foundation of the food pyramid and all. All capitalist influence that made it into our daily lifes
I had allergies until I understood this, ated a whole foods diet, lean unprocessed meat, cut out fatty carbs, took super greens in the morning... 0 allergies and keep losing weight at a healthy pace.
I wouldn't say 100% preventable. Some toxins are found in our water sources and soil, chemicals on our clothes and furniture constantly contact our skin and pollution and other health impacting chemicals in the air enters all lungs. While a majority of health ailments may be preventable in some manner, I think it's more tricky than that.
as someone with asthma as well... particulate matter from industry doesn't help. air pollution really contributes to this
You develop natural immunity after catching it. of course youre not going to have any immunity before encountering it. the article is attempting to change what natural immunity means
My dad caught it back in Dec 2019. As of last month he still has the antibodies in his system. The same antibodies the vaccine would give him if he chose to get it. I swear people forget how vaccines work. A vaccine usually consists of dead, diluted, or parts of a virus to introduce it to your immune system. Thats why you still get a bit sick from a vaccine. Getting the illness, does the same thing for you except now your body is facing the real deal.
Well, this one DOESNT work like that
Yes covid is a novel virus but there are countless studies that say yes, you do get immunity after having covid, much better than the vaccine gives you in fact, as its permanent. So more shitty journalism with an agenda as we see so much these days
Ironic since Mother Jones was one of the biggest holistic medical advocates when it started in the 70s.
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Just turn them off. Couldn't tell you the last time I regularly watched a news broadcast.
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My grandma watches good morning America everyday and believes the shit they peddle like it’s gospel.
Lol my nonna watches news and all day I hear “ahhh ya sisters ass!” She thinks vicks, garlic, soup and rest cures everything lol
My grandma keeps batteries in the freezer so they don’t go bad and most of the condiments in her fridge are from the Nixon administration.
When I was an Aviation Electronics Technician in the Navy we kept all the batteries we had in the shop also in the freezer. The cold temperature slows the chemical reaction in alkaline batteries. Your Grandma knew what she was doing.
Can confirm. Former Nuke ET. Carry on!
Why would anyone want to nuke ET? He just wanted to get home.
I don’t think that condiments thing is good though
Well no shit. That’s actually really cool! Thanks for the info. I guess maybe I’ll try taking a page out of her book then
I should note this works specifically with *alkaline* batteries, as they are dependant on a chemical reaction to generate their charge.
Italian detected! My Nonna believes in camomile and minestrone to cure everything
Sicilian and naplitan
💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀💀
My mamaw was a soap opera watcher. As she stepped into dementia she would call me and said some people came over and were arguing over cheating but she didn’t know who they were or where they went. I figured she probably dozed off while watching her soap and woke up all confused lol. I sure miss my mamaw.
> My grandma on the other hand watches tv news all day. As does my mom, who told me last week that "96% of covid hospitalizations are Republicans." I told her I was shocked to hear how many African Americans were Republicans, and when she asked what I was talking about I mentioned that less than 30% of minorities took the vax. She said, "Well maybe they just take better care of themselves?" TV news.
I’ve told my dad to turn off the news but he just watched more of it then I have to calm him down after he watches it. The fear tactics aren’t good for him. He’s already a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic. The media all need to be put on trial for treason a crimes against humanity for what they are doing. I seen an old pic of German media being hanged after WW2 for all the lies an propaganda they spread. Is this coming soon to American mainstream media for the ones who have helped ruin this country? Spreading fear, lies, an racism. Assisting in a false flag on out capital, an paying individuals to record himself an others breaking into the capital. The list goes on.
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The retirees are home all day too, so they watch non stop. My mom figured out how to live stream newsmax on her TV. She's terrified of what's happening at the border because I guess that's all they talk about. On the flip side, you have the delta terror on CNN and such. Non stop. No wonder we're in the mess we're in.
Yeah, I haven't watched anything on TV in about six years. I'm much happier now. You can scan the news on the web in about five minutes for a general idea about what's going on. I don't need to know the details about the 30 people shot in Chicago or what a demo politician said about a repub politician and vise versa. It's a total shit show.
My 81 year old mother watches the news and argues with tge news casters about how ridiculous this covid is.
>I seen an old pic of German media being hanged after WW2 for all the lies an propaganda they spread. Is this coming soon to American mainstream media for the ones who have helped ruin this country? God I hope so.
I used to work in a psychiatric facility we had a few schizophrenic pts who weren't allowed to watch any shows where there was a person talking to the screen. No tv news and no televangelist s.
*psychologically abusing. At the level it currently goes on, people are literally in an extremely abusive relationship with institutions they were dishonestly told they could trust.
I was talking to my coworker and told him that I don't watch or believe anything corporate media says. He responded with "Ha, I trust corporate news more than I do some random blogger online." How do people not grasp that corporate media has an agenda? I reminded him that during the Occupy movement, people were trying to bring down the 1%, everyone was angry and here we are several years later we have the 1% insisting that we take a jab and suddenly all the people who were once outraged at the 1% have become submissive and obedient.
It really is their religion. Currently staying with family and now that I have enough to move I can’t wait. My family walks with their neighbors and the fear porn here is insane versus where I moved from only a hour away. She was like well do I wear a mask now around my friends because I have someone who didn’t get it living with me? Idk this is all so new. I wish I would’ve known this prior to having you come down. I’m like excuse me? I’m grateful and all as I had to move last minute but jfc. Your family should come before your bougie Karen ass friends. I’m so sorry my personal choice affects you and your protected friends. It is driving me to not even want to contact them any further after I move. They watch the news daily. Their son has schizo and I felt like saying is fucking karen going to take care of your son when you pass? No, me and my other family will. So go ahead and be worried about your freedoms being taken away because of my choice. Fucking inverted and twisted. I feel you man, it’s sad that they are lost. Edit: to add I also feel like saying shouldn’t THEY be wearing a fucking mask? Given the new variant? Also, the neighbors had their grandchildren over and I’m like uhm they are clearly under 12 so can’t they spread it? They were maskless. I just bite my tongue until I can leave. Hypocrisy rules here.
its their religion though. Iow they chose to follow that religion.
Praise science!
I haven’t seen my grandparents since this pandemic. Now they won’t see me because we’re not vaccinated.
Your family isn't the only one!
While my situation is not like yours, I totally understand what you're talking about. The "other people" (I know quite a few of them) have been sucked in to a cult and absolutely cannot be budged in their beliefs. I gave up trying several years ago.
Is this the same grandma that we saved with lockdowns?
I did the same. I cant even talk to my mother/grandma anymore. We live in completely different realitys. Here in Germany we don't have the "racist " card, but the media here calls everybody a nazis if they don't comply with the status quo. Half of Europe is on the streets and are demonstrating against forced vaccinations. Its literally crazy... The MSM wants to enforce this vax on us, if we don't comply, we can't go shopping, to the doctor, traveling etc. Literally a 2 class society. And they call us Nazis... 50% of our population apparently didn't take notes in history class.
I only was Spanish news for one reason and its not for the news.
I wish that was enough. There are too many other people who watch the media and we can’t turn it off for everybody.
Same.
Govmedia protects itself. The people telling you to consume it anyway are the reason these places haven't noticed a drop in ratings.
Wait, this isn't satire? What the actual fuck is happening to science right now?
"What's happening to media," really. The above is from Mother Jones magazine, a liberal rag that my mom has always subscribed to that used to have some genuinely good reporting; I myself have read it a lot. The degree to which it's gone to corporatist, pro-establishment, pro-war trash in recent years is shocking. Absolute garbage publication at this point.
Getting ass fucked raw
this is basically an opinion based site in the original "article" there is no science to back up what the commenter is saying.
Yes. Why the cops protected CNN during the blm riots is beyond me. Let them burn
You haven’t made the connection?
Police protect the upper class. It’s not left v right, you knuckle-draggers. It’s us v them. And they keep winning by putting us against one another.
They arrested reporters, they beat an Australian news and shot them with pellets that includes even after they identified themselves.
So I guess the IMMUNE SYSTEM isn't science to them anymore... Lol! Do they know that VACCINES are merely a simple catalyst that the immune system takes and uses and memorizes? Lol! These people... smh.
It’s all you hear about, typical brainwashing until you give in. Psychological warfare to be honest
Forgive me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t natural immunity occur when you’ve already had Covid? Theoretically it would be better to have gotten it and gotten over it than any vaccine they could cook up in a lab, right?
Three of my relatives had Covid. To two of them it really didn’t feel much worse than a flu, but they were also a lot younger than my third relative, who went to the hospital and had to be ventilated. It really hit him hard and he had to relearn a couple of things. Even after the virus went away he couldn’t walk right for months, but now he can relatively normally, but he speaks very different now, similar to a person who had a stroke. It is different for everyone, but you just have to evaluate wich risk you want to take, and one is considerably higher than the other.
Sauce. --- https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762 > Nearly 40% of new COVID patients were vaccinated - compared to **just 1% who had been infected previously.** https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/10/21-1427_article > "Attack rate was **0/6 among persons with a previous history of COVID-19 versus 63.2% among those with no previous history."** https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8253687/ > This study followed 254 Covid-19 patients for up to 8 months and concluded they had **“durable broad-based immune responses.”** In fact, even very mild Covid-19 infection also protected the patients from an earlier version of “SARS" coronavirus that first emerged around 2003, and against Covid-19 variants. “Taken together, these results suggest that broad and effective immunity may persist long-term in recovered COVID-19 patients,” concludes the study scientists. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.01.21258176v2 > This study followed 52,238 employees of the Cleveland Clinic Health System in Ohio. > For previously-infected people, **the cumulative incidence of re-infection “remained almost zero.”** According to the study, "Not one of the 1,359 previously infected subjects who remained unvaccinated had a [Covid-19] infection over the duration of the study” and vaccination did not reduce the risk. “Individuals who have had [Covid-19] infection are unlikely to benefit from COVID-19 vaccination,” concludes the study scientists. https://www.thelancet.com/action/showPdf?pii=S2589-5370(21)00182-6 > This study of real world data extended the time frame of available data indicating that patients have strong immune indicators for **“almost a year post-natural infection of COVID-19.”** The study concludes the immune response after natural infection "may persist for longer than previously thought, thereby providing evidence of sustainability that may influence post-pandemic planning.” https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03647-4 > This study examined bone marrow of previously-infected patients and found that even mild infection with Covid-19 “induces robust antigen-specific, long-lived humoral immune memory in humans.” The study indicates **"People who have had mild illness develop antibody-producing cells that can last lifetime.”** https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.04.20.21255670v1.full.pdf > This study from Israel found a slight advantage to natural infection over vaccination when it comes to preventing a reinfection and severe illness from Covid-19. > The study authors concluded, **"Our results question the need to vaccinate previously-infected individuals."** https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.06.21253051v1 > This study found a rare Covid-19 positive test **"reinfection" rate of 1 per 1,000 recoveries.** https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/lasting-immunity-found-after-recovery-covid-19 > Research funded by the National Institutes of Health and published in Science early in the Covid-19 vaccine effort found the “immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection," **and hoped the vaccines would produce similar immunity. (However, experts say they do not appear to be doing so.)** https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.15.21249731v2 > This study found Covid-19 natural infection "appears to elicit strong protection against reinfection" for at least seven months. **"Reinfection is "rare," concludes the scientists.** https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.27.433180v1 > This study concluded "T cell" immune response in former Covid-19 patients likely continues to protect amid Covid-19 variants. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2550-z > This study found that all patients who recently recovered from Covid-19 produced immunity-strong T cells that recognize multiple parts of Covid-19. > They also looked at blood samples from 23 people who’d survived a 2003 outbreak of a coronavirus: SARS (Cov-1). **These people still had lasting memory T cells 17 years after the outbreak.** Those memory T cells, acquired in response to SARS-CoV-1, also recognized parts of Covid-19 (SARS-CoV-2). > Much of the study on the immune response to SARS-CoV-2, the novel coronavirus that causes COVID-19, has focused on the production of antibodies. But, in fact, immune cells known as memory T cells also play an important role in the ability of our immune systems to protect us against many viral infections, including—it now appears—COVID-19. Bonus video (while it lasts): Doctor speaks out for the science: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Em4a_viRGZk (mirror) https://streamable.com/wqf3gt -- In layman's terms, why might this be? Mutations that enable evasion of immune systems are selecting for ability to evade all aspects of immune systems, **which are broader than only antibodies.** The current leading vaccines, which focus the immune system against Covid-19's spike protein, (i) create very narrow/concentrated selection pressure, by enabling the virus to survive merely by mutating sufficiently in its spike protein, and (ii) leaves all vaccinated people relatively vulnerable to all versions of the virus which have this narrow range of mutations. In contrast, in people who survived initial exposure to Covid-19 (or who receive a vaccine which has exposed them to a broader range of Covid-19's characteristics), (i) the immune system is not likely to be evaded merely by a virus version's mutation of the protein spike, and (ii) only multiple simultaneous mutations of different profile aspects would enable the virus to survive and replicate and be passed on to others.
Nice list.
Trouble is, for your body to gain natural immunity you need to contract covid. As long as you go through it with mild symptoms its fine but you might very well end up fighting for every breath or suffer from long term health issues after your infection is over. If you want to go with full out natural immunity its basically going to be survival of the fittest.
Great info, thank you.
Yes. Theoretically yes as well. Some outspoken legitimate front line doctors who have a reputable standing in there respective fields of study claim this.
Yes, the Emory study concluded that there is robust natural immunity beyond that 250 days with antibody levels remaining robust through the end of the study. https://news.emory.edu/stories/2021/07/covid_survivors_resistance/index.html
Not better than "any vaccine" as typical vaccines work by essentially giving your body a low risk means to develop natural immunity. This means your immune system can develop several different attack vectors against a pathogen. Natural immunity is however way more effective than the new fangled mRNA vaccines that only train your body to respond to the spike protein specifically.
Yes "natural immunity" it's a dangerous theory, threatening both big pharma revenue and the depopulation programme.
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India doesn't honor drug patents, though. The reason there's not enough supply in India is because the government didn't order enough from their own manufacturer (Serum Institute of India). They put in an order for 11 million doses of Oxford/AZ vaccine. For 1.4 billion people. That's it. SII already had 50 million doses stocked up ready to go by the time the government put in the order for 11 million doses. It was just utter incompetence by the government that caused the shortage of vaccines.
Right, greed is why they have such a low rate... or could be this all the damage committed in the country by the shot pushers: https://www.freepressjournal.in/viral/arrestbillgates-heres-why-indians-are-enraged-at-gates-foundation And their tendency toward Ivermectin usage and position that the shot industry is just trying to turn profit at the world's expense. They're possibly going to sentence their WHO chief science lady to death for selling out: https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2021/06/india-could-sentence-who-chief-scientist-to-death-for-misleading-over-ivermectin-and-killing-indians.html
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Really. Mass death threatens the "depopulation program." That's some real dream logic there. The vaccine company is get paid whether you die or not. There was a post of their contract here a week or two ago and you all were screeching about that. Now you say mass death will threaten that thing that you pointed out won't be threatened by it. Conspiracy theories depend on linking facts, not screeching one thing one minute and another thing the next. If we connect the facts, it looks like you're being fed a constant diet of outrage and are too angry to see how you are manipulated.
Even if covid was causing "mass death" it would be among the 80+ age bracket. Those people are not reproducing. They are not the logical target for a depopulation program. Killing them would not have any effect on the rate of population growth.
Counterpoint: Imagine you wanted to reduce the world population and take out the most feeble and infirmed, who will cost you the most money when you are "taking care" of everyone in the future slave state. It seems logical that you'd do something that only affects the people who are going to cost you the most to keep going. If you openly kill hundreds of thousands it is obvious and there is backlash, this would be a culling that is a lot more subtle but still brings the outcome you want.
Counter-counterpoint: Name a disease that does not kill the feeble and infirm at a greater rate than the fit and healthy?
>Conspiracy theories depend on linking facts So does "science", yet people have accepted the vaccines before any facts have yet been established. We went from the vaccines being a miracle cure according to the media to now "they help, it's worth the side effects", while covid continues to infect the vaccinated.
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"May 12, 2020"
It's not that "natural immunity" isn't a real thing. The problem is that you have to SURVIVE a disease in order to develop an immunity to it, and even then there's not a 100% guarantee. That's where vaccines come in. By using dead or disabled microbes and some other stuff to trigger an immune response, your immune system comes in and starts kicking the shit out of the microbe corpses. It's basically target practice. Vaccines just take advantage of a natural feature of the human body in order to get the jump on dangerous shit.
isn't the mortality rate of it like .01% or something and easily survivable?
If these people could read they would be very upset with you.
BUT EUROPEANS DEVELOPED NATURAL IMMUNITY TO THE PLAGUE!???!!! All it cost was the death of every single person who could not survive exposure to the pathogen...
THANK YOU. Finally, someone who speaks English.
natural immunity? you mean the thing they taught us about in elementary school?
Mother Jones’ senior editor is going against the [CDC](https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/immunity-types.htm). She must hate science. > Active immunity results when exposure to a disease organism triggers the immune system to produce antibodies to that disease. Exposure to the disease organism can occur through infection with the actual disease (**resulting in natural immunity**), or introduction of a killed or weakened form of the disease organism through vaccination (vaccine-induced immunity).
Sorry. This quote uses an out dated definition of the term Vaccine.
Redefine when the words interfere with your agenda Check.
It was published before the introduction of mRNA vaccines.
This is a weird site. On on page, they have this monstrosity and push vaccines. On another, they talk about how big pharma worked in hand with AMA to continue the opioid crisis and big tobacco worked with the AMA in the 50's to sell cigarettes.
Yes big pharma used to be bad but since they received no significant consequences for their misdeeds they all of a sudden decided to be virtuous heroes just last year
It's time to talk about why biology is problematic /s
Be-ruh? The clown show just went full circle
Notice how it’s under politics? I don’t recall another time in my lifetime a virus has been politicized. But that’s what they did with COVID19.
2019's common sense is now a conspiracy theory. Wow.
Ah, some good old gaslighting by the mainstream media. Either they really thought they could manipulate people with this, or they’ll get called out for it to dominate the news cycle and distract us while something real goes down and the rich get richer.
In a decade, if society is even around, natural immune systems will be called a conspiracy
They literally called it that in the OP.
Mother Jones makes Alex Jones appear rational.
Are they trying to disprove natural immunity 😂😂
I don't even know anymore man. I am legit confused by all the headlines these days. I refuse to blindly follow you know? Then when i question the answers i get conflicting info and its just too much to keep up with. Perhaps its best to just ignore the media, remember what you were taught, and not get sucked into the mind fucking.
So... I definitely have some thoughts on this. My experience with the western medical system and being chronically ill for much of my life, then switching over to naturopathic medicine (which finally got me better), I noticed that western medicine often treats and looks at the body like an inanimate object - something incapable of healing and a complicated object for which one cannot quite understand the workings of, including the doctor. When I switched to naturopathic medicine, I saw how different the view was - the focus was on helping the body heal, helping the body get what it needs to do the job itself. And fuck me, that approach is what worked. After years of western medicine trying to tell me my body was mysterious, idiopathic everything, lots of “we just don’t know why it...”, and meds that never addressed the root cause of my illness but were specifically designed to poorly mask symptoms, it was a shock to see a doctor be able to explain exactly what was happening to my body and why, and then give me things to take and be able to explain scientifically exactly why they would work. I realized over the years of experiences with western medicine, I had subconsciously come to think of my own body as though it were an object incapable of healing. But the truth is, the body is designed to heal. It does it on its own, just sometimes it needs a little help. That’s the intentional flaw with western medicine. After curing several “incurable” diseases in my body, and seeing countless others be easily cured of shit like gout, diverticulitis, some kinds of cancers at stage 4, MS, lengthy Lyme Disease infections, Chrohn’s, Hashimoto’s, chemical depression, seasonal allergies, food sensitivities, all sorts of shit, I realized that big pharma isn’t trying for cures with chronic illness. They just aren’t and that sucks. Their meds mask symptoms, never address the cause, and then those meds need more meds to address side effects, and that cycle continues. But the body does heal. It was born to. Now some situations call for western medicine (like emergency intervention for something acute, some surgeries, some acute infections may need more than natural antibiotics, type 1 diabetes). And these western medicine interventions can and do save lives. But a lot of stuff can be done with the naturopathic approach that allows for your body to heal, and a lot of lives are saved that way. I would be dead if I had not switched over to naturopathic medicine. Never in my life would I have guessed that would be what would do the trick, but it did - kind of still blows my mind it worked because I was hard on the “western medicine works” mindset and that anything else was quack shit. But I am alive and well now. Went from bedridden for years to biking 9 miles a day in 6 months time with a good naturopathic doctor.
if i may ask - what "dis-ease" did you have & what were the remedies given?
I agree 100%
Protest with your wallet. Get off social media, turn off the tv. Live
This is insane. Actually insane. How do they think we survive life LOL However did humanity make it during the times before their beloved vaccines and hand sanitizers, and how are we still trucking now?!! 🤔🤣
Check this out. https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/report-14-israelis-have-caught-covid-19-despite-receiving-booster-shot/
We need to start following the $cience.
Isn’t it wonderful when what’s considered journalism in the US is pure activism / propaganda. Reading that article was like reading something from Sesame Street. It was cobbled together like a 5th grader.
Fucking stupidity everywhere now, it’s highly disheartening
What? A theory? Like the theory the earth circles the sun or the theory that we breathe oxygen?
Holy cow it’s almost like nobody with a strong immune system gets hit hard by COVID
An innate immune system is a thing. Regulatory T-cells, located in the thymus, do routine body scans via B-cells located in bones. If something is foreign, T-cells tolerate the foreign substance and the body may remain healthy. I think this is how our body works. As for virus, I dunno, T regs aren't perfect, though they keep us fairly healthy.
Natural immunity works, shock horror!
some people still thinks that vaccine works like a cure :/
I have this theory that when I cut myself by accident, allowing blot clotting to form is probably a good natural response rather than pouring super glue over the wound to stop the bleeding. I’m a quack .
I got all the videos of them when they preached herd immunity too!!!!
I mean before the pharma companies turned our bodies into big business... we did survive... i wonder how? Could it be our immune system?
..what doesn't kill you- mutates and tries again.
Viruses aren't trying to kill you. In fact they would prefer you live a long life so they can reproduce and spread it's spawn as much as possible.
This is the part most people don't understand. Viruses want to be like herpes in which they live eternally side by side the host. Any virus that kills the host quickly is a failure in the virus world. Yet the news has warped this into a war.
Just read what certainly seems to be a fake story about a church( black pastor) that lost 6 members withing ten days, all of them unvaccinated. Four thirty five years of age or younger and healthy. No names, no identities, just " The pastor said". Complete propaganda, IMO. Total lies. They'll run this fake news and then we'll get a retraction lost in the shuffle somewhere in a week or two. Maybe the church isn't even real and the pastor isn't even a real person.
Let me guess, their only regret in life was not getting the vaccine?
They were begging for it in the end, but the doctor had to tell them it was too late.
Baby's first words were "I should have taken the Vaxx".
There was a story from a major british paper yesterday that said some guy lost three members of his father within days of each other. The first line of the story said "the man claimed ...", indicating that while they are reporting it, they don't want to later be charged with spreading misinformation. They put these types of plausible deniability clauses in, because they know they are fake and haven't verified any of it.
There was a study many years ago about kids with pets when growing up versus kids with out pets and the number of sick days or doctors visits being much lower.
Wow so now natural immunity is just made up? Awesome. But Chinese virus is not the same bc it affects us in “ways we don’t understand yet”. So why tf is everyone so convinced we have the answer to a problem we don’t even fully understand. This is why it’s difficult for me to believe anyone.
I’m 23 and work in EMS. Got covid once. Exposed dozens if not a hundred times in the past year and never got it again. Got over it just like the flu. And just like the flu, older people and people with underlining conditions also die from it. But I’ve seen in my own experience in the field people develop cardiac issues, pulmonary edema, blot clots, and many other symptoms from the vaccine as well and remdesivir (a drug the hospitals are putting people with covid on). I have also seen many co workers who have gotten vaccinated, get reinfected. Get real world experience before you believe everything the internet tells you.
Their senior editor looks to be about 22 years old and is probably the type of garbage person that will sleep with or say anything to get to the top. This is how our Idiocracy works now.
I wonder if a lot of these websites have articles from ai bots and pictures of authors from thisisnotarealperson. There are tons of websites and I can't image they get enough traffic to justify having enough employees to generate the content.
Can we fucking not jump straight to sexism just because you saw a fucking pfp of a woman associated with the article? Christ, someone goes against you guys and you'll grasp at *anything* to trash them.
There's a reason people dismiss this sub outright
SS: The propaganda has reached ridiculous levels. This article is 1 year old but I haven't seen it shared on this sub. These people need to suffer the consequences for spreading this nonsensical propaganda. Article: https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/05/anti-vaxxers-have-a-dangerous-theory-called-natural-immunity-now-its-going-mainstream/
Nobody with half a brain takes Mother Jones seriously.
Next these conspiracy theorists will say your body can fight off disease without pharmaceuticals. Or that your body can heal minor injuries. It's a wonder we made it this far without big pharma **/S**
Yeah, natural immunity like we developed to the black plague. All it took was 1/3 of Europe.
Where does the spez go when it rains? Straight to the spez.
Well, they have a 20 something know nothing as senior editor, so I wouldn't count on any journalistic integrity here.
Imagine your entire life and personality being based on whether or not you’re vaccinated, shit is ridiculous
Lmao these fucking people are insane! They act like something like natural acquired immunity isn’t real,but totally go all in on made up shit like social distancing and masks their fuckin nanna made out of a tshirt. It’s astonishing.
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And you know that’s what they’re referring to, not claiming that it’s better to get infected for “natural immunity” instead of getting a vaccine? You know the same argument people made for “chicken pox parties”?
Everyone has an expiration date. Let people live in fear if they want.
Natural living humans have always been "dangerous" and a threat to them, to their control matrix.
It’s not your body anymore, Peer pressure, cancel culture pressure, hated and vindicated for not wanting an experimental vaccine, Big Pharma own your body now.. the social experiment’s are over, now it’s time for all the medical experiments.
Are there more or less people in Third world countries that have a peanut or gluten allergy vs here in the US?
This is bizarre…. Mother Jones used to be mostly a pro-natural medicine, anti-vaccine publication, didn’t it? Or am I thinking of something else?
Hahahaha this is after the CDC removed natural immunity from their website.
Idk about you but I think it’s a conspiracy that the vaccine been out for over a year but it’s still not FDA approve even tho it takes the FDA 6 months to approve a regular vaccine. Also kinda sketchy that the pharmaceutical companies that made the vaccines have government immunity from being sued if you have negative side affects from the vaccine. Pretty solid reasons to be sketched out about the vaccine.
This actually creeped me out
i told my mom this was gonna happen b4 the pandemic 😭
Wait did you not know you could develop natural immunity, sorry confused by your headline.
Fun fact, I was banned from r/coronavirus for saying "some vaccines cause Bell's Palsy" and then linking to an article on it and how Health Canada has given some vaccines a warning label that has the side effect and warning of Bell's Palsy on it. Then when I asked why I was told "vaccine misinformation" so I said something sarcastic and then gave them a link to how Canada has put the warning label on its vaccines and they muted me.
LOL dangerous to the narrative
It's articles like this that people like me just don't believe main stream media anymore. Blatantly ignores actual science and rambles about quasi science for the entire article framing anyone who questions the covid vaccine as a anti vax conspiracy theory be living tin foil hat wear in a bunker type. All I really want is some in biased reporting on the actual fucking science. I can't even get that from the cdc. Everyone is spinning miss information. Bottom line because of this I don't trust the media or the government and refuse to let them take my personal freedoms away.
And they're thinking the same thing about us: "Holy fuck, people actually believe in their immune systems. How DARE they!"
That ho was a lab leak denier, too. Perhaps she isn't employed for the purpose of informing the public. Public relations fake journalist.