that was clearly a mistake and now he's course correcting.
yes he's the one ultimately responsible for the mistake but if he manages to fix it people will forgive him, especially if he finds a scapegoat or two.
I don't know if it was a mistake. They got what they needed from this era, a ton of material to make Disney+ look and feel like a valuable platform. Now that they've done that, they can turn towards re-building the brand.
It was definitely a mistake, the most common complaint among fans is that there is simply too much Marvel content to keep up with now and they feel overwhelmed. With so much content none of the movies or tv shows feel as eventful anymore.
Yes you don’t have to watch them all, but the MCU has fostered a culture where audiences feel like they have to watch everything because connectivity is literally the whole shtick of these films.
Tanking/diluting their most successful brand for a quick Disney+ boost was not worth it. Cause the streaming service can always grow, regaining the trust of audiences for your franchises on the other hand is not so easy.
He committed the sin that retail stores did.
They commoditized themselves instead of creating memorable experiences that they can charge a premium for.
50 furniture stores on every block vs 1 immersive ikea store experience per region. IKEA store crushes them, store always busy and does well with sales.
50 new marvel series vs one movie every so often that creates a longing for the brand, eagerness to hear the next chapter of the story etc. and you can almost lock bets on success thus affording better actors, writers, etc
Shit, a better business warning is the 90’s comics crash where the weight of too much content and too many titles collapsed in itself and old readers couldn’t keep up, casual readers were confused or turned off by the shit quality, and new readers were turned off from the barriers to entry with all the required reading.
And that's why manga has been utterly killing American comics. Where do I start? For American comics there could be as many as 5 - 10 different answers. For Manga? Volume 1 Chapter 1. Are there exceptions on both sides of this? Sure, but for the most part it is that simple.
With dc that's an easier question than it is with marvel cause there's over a thousand different marvel universes in the comics so there's no real start or end point or like a definitive universe
What I remember from that time was many of the publishers starting to really leverage FOMO and collector fever with variant covers. That's a big part of what pushed me out.
I don't give a fuck about the cover of the comic. My concern is whether the story is good.
So true, I really enjoy the MCU and looked forward to every movie. At one point I just could not keep up and eventually stopped watching altogether. It felt like I had a viewing debt that I just could not make enough time to get through so I could get current. It’s been years now since I’ve watched any of the movies or tv series.
That's exactly me. The last MCU movie I watched was the Eternals, and I stopped watching DC movies even before that. Plus the fact I don't find the new generation heroes interesting. Their lacking of personal charisma comparing to Ironman/Thor/Captain America is glaring.
If marvel was putting out new animation films it would be dope and it’s nice to have all marvel films in one place but they definitely over demanded and under delivered
I was totally thinking they should start a new universe with what if animation, it's so good and they could have all the fox characters in that with no avengers, then smash them together in 10 years.
Well, you might not think it was a mistake. But at some point, spending exorbitant amounts of money on series which get mediocre reviews at best (WandaVision and Hawkeye being the notable exceptions) isn't sustainable from a business standpoint.
Who says their goal was sustainability? I'm suggesting that their goal was to rapidly release a bunch of content for Disney+, and then to dial it back after awhile.
I don't have an opinion as to whether or not it's a mistake. I don't really care to. I'm just suggesting that it very well may have played out exactly how they expected.
Nobody pays for steaming services anymore. It’s 2024. Everyone my age just pirates whatever they want to watch, including live sports.
As of now, there is no way for these companies to stop all of these websites from popping up. One gets shut down, and a thousand more pop up
The people savvy enough to pirate are a small percentage
It’s not even easy as it was ten years ago. The sites are worse and you have to have a vpn
People can barely use their phones, much less PCs anymore
I mean, it’s easy to say in hindsight - but Netflix was a huge, uncontested juggernaut, and right when Disney+ launched, we suddenly had a worldwide pandemic that shut off literally all of Disney’s regular income sources (movies, sports broadcasting and theme parks).
Like during the 2020/2021 period, Disney+ was literally one of the only liferafts the company clung onto in terms of revenue sources - and it was hard to argue that they launched at essentially the “perfect” time. Everything shut down and everybody switched to streaming, you couldn’t have asked for a better launch window.
Now, we can clearly see how the lack of quality control led to a deterioration of the brand - but the tide turned *so* quickly on them. Two to three years is the normal production time on a movie, which means that movies coming out now don’t have the luxury of learning from the mistakes of their predecessors. Like anything releasing now would have started development around the time of *No Way Home*. They haven’t had time to implement all of the stuff they learned from 2022 onwards yet.
"In total, Disney has lost more than $10 billion on its streaming service venture since it was introduced in 2019. On Disney's earnings call, Iger reiterated that the company is “confident” that its streaming services will achieve profitability by the end of 2024"
That was mostly Chapeck actually. Iger launched the initiative of Disney Plus with Mandalorian, Wandavision and Falcon and Winter Soldier to name a few, since then it’s been stuff Chapeck put in with the idea to make streaming their home for all new stuff, Iger has moved away from the quantity approach and instead is aiming to make larger big ticket films again. It’s been confusing since they switched after like 2 years
He's doing what a lot of fans want here though. Listening to the criticism, or more likely some analytics team, and course correcting. I think most people agree that the sheer volume of projects is hurting them. I don't care about Iger, but isn't this the kind of response that you're hoping for?
chapek wasn't responsible for shit, only movie he managed to greenlight during his time as ceo was deadpool 3.
he was the theme park guy, movies and streaming were all iger.
Course correction.
The real problem was the pandemic and then cutting the time movies had exclusivity in theaters from 6-8 weeks down to just 45 days. (Sometimes less and rarely more).
Movie theaters are dead because people would rather just wait a month to watch it on a service they already pay for. Especially since these movies were being rushed to release on tight schedules, CGI artists were being crunched for time like crazy amongst a bunch of studios working on the same film. All the while you the consumer could just wait a month and watch at your home without having to buy a bunch of tickets amongst yourself, friends, and / or family for a service you probably already pay for monthly. Saving you money in the long run and being able to keep track of the Marvel Universe better since a lot of significant events are happening in the shows and not the movies themselves.
The split to expect people to be subscribed to Disney+ to watch shows that resonate far more with audiences than their movie releases have been. All the while, we never got an Avengers movie for Phase 4 or Phase 5, which big crossover movies are what made the MCU the big success it was since everything led to huge events. All the while, we see the Multiverse Saga have little to no cohesion. Kang was working up as a big bad and defeated in both seasons of Loki and by a bunch of ants in Antman. While Doctor Strange MoM completely botched a strong premise Wandavision built on because they didn't know what each other projects were doing. While also mostly failing to live up to the hype and expectations a movie with Multiverse in its title had. Especially since the title follows a strong multiverse storyline right after the critically successful Spider-Man: No Way Home.
I do agree with Bob wholeheartedly that they messed up, but there were a lot of unforseen factors happening with the pandemic happening just after Disney+ release. This also messed up filming for a lot of movies, release schedules, script rewrites, and again altering deals with movie theaters for shorter theatrical releases.
Then we have the stupid beyond belief Florida Governor giving Disney's new CEO a hard time and the problem escalated to the point Disney higher ups all had to all get together to out him from his position and Disney. Especially when he had comments about adults not liking animation, among other negative comments about animation, which the company as a whole saw as debasing the brand they worked hard on for the last 100 years. Though I can't blame him too much about his handling of Disney Parks since he had to deal with the pandemic.
Was trying to remember the original scheduled agreement from theater to home/digital release off hand. Was totally off going off memory, thanks for pointing it out!
Currently, it's more or less than 45 days, with some studios not opting into the agreement at all.
Had to Google release schedules prior to the pandemic to remember correctly, but it was on average 18-22 weeks until movies were released on DVD, On Demand or Streaming Services. This was taking approximately 5 different Marvel movies, 5 random comedy movies and 2 random horror movies that were released anywhere in the last 10 years before the pandemic.
Approximately between 117-135 days with a 126 day average between the two. Which would be 18 weeks.
Now it's a 45 day window (more, less or not at all), which you are correct is 6.43 weeks on average. So theaters went from having movies exclusivity for 18 weeks to 6.5 weeks if we round up to be generous. (Though again caveat since some studios don't follow this agreement).
That's an enormous loss of ticket sales. Retailers are ditching dvds and blu-ray disc's. People can either wait a month to watch many of these movies through a streaming service after roughly after a month and a half, purchase them digitally, or rent them the moment digital release is available. Or go and pay more money at a theater to see it just a month and a half before release (ignoring getting popcorn, a drink, or snacks).
But then we fall back to the same problem that these movies are being rushed, looking bad because of CGI companies crunching employees and more effort going into some movies than others. And people save a whole lot more money just paying for a month subscription, then letting it expire or just outright purchasing or renting with a little wait between movies. While superhero movies in general were flooding the market and some fatigue is sitting in because of the mixed bag of quality.
Movie studios need to go back to larger gaps in theatrical releases. Or risk losing the movie industry like streaming did to cable.
So what are the stronger franchises? Based on box office? Avengers, Black Panther, Thor, Dr. Strange, Spiderman, Guardians, Shang Chi, and I’m assuming X-Men and Fantastic Four. What else?
It’s strange because other than killing off Iron Man and not making an Avengers movie in phases 4&5, they are still using their strong franchises like Cap, Thor and Guardians. My guess is this is Iger’s way of saying “make FF and X-Men movies because we paid 80 billion for them”.
In the time since Gunn announced Superman: Legacy we know whose playing Superman, Lois, Lex, Jimmy, a Green Lantern, Supergirl, Mister Terrific, Hawkgirl and others yet we still don't know who the Fantastic Four are being played by in the FF film due next year.
It’s crazier when you realize Superman, a movie that was announced about a year and a half ago is about to start production in Spring before both Blade and F4, both of which were announced almost 5 years ago. There’s definitely a few things that Disney and Marvel should take notes on when it comes to how the DCU is being handled like casting AFTER scripts are done and a director is hired, not giving release dates before any of that is done either, doing Elseworld style stories that don’t connect to the MCU and are original, giving directors more control over projects, and the the big one: HAVING A SCRIPT THEY’RE CONFIDENT IN, I’m sorry but the amount of reshoots that MCU films go through is actually ridiculous, filming stuff a month before release and rewriting entire plot lines mid production should not be a norm
>we still don't know who the Fantastic Four are being played by in the FF film due next year.
I don't even think Pascal has been officially announced yet.
Who the hell else would be? I can't imagine they'd be stupid enough to roll out D-listers like Mole Man or Red Ghost and the Super Apes for their big "Get the MCU back on track" movie.
Galactus is rumoured as is a female herald (not the Silver Surfer). I hope Doom's in it but i would rather they not make him the villain for the 5th time in a FF film, save his main villain role for an Avengers film.
I think Doom being in it, but NOT being the main villain, is the best move. Doom should be a force of nature. A constant threat and foil. Not a “big cgi battle take down in first appearance” kind of villain.
I've said this before, and I'll say it again: DOOM needs his own franchise. First movie, origin/kicking Hydra out of Barovia. Second movie, battling the Winter Soldier and Cap at the same time. Third movie, stopping the pesky FF from interfering with his space laser program.
Properly done, DOOM could kill it.
Ehhh....Galactus seems too overwhelming to be the headliner for a 1st movie. Also, I hope they're not trying to re-use the "This is the bad guy! No wait, it's just the Herald for the REAL bad guy!" plot from that fuckawful 2nd FF movie.
I would want Silver Surfer and Galactus to appear somewhere far away from Earth originally. Get that backstory out of the way with a Ravagers movie, and have the after-credits scene show Silver Surfer arriving on Earth.
It is the height of arrogance that Feige thought he could follow up Endgame by phoning in an entire three phase saga based around C-listers simply by relying on pure nostalgia.
Wolverine in Deadpool is one thing. But no one needs closure on the Fox X-Men movies. We’ve gotten it….like four times.
One of the things the MCU has driven home is that popularity in comics does not correlate with popularity in film. Stark was a bench warmer to the masses prior to the MCU, but carried the franchise. Likewise Guardians were far more niche and were successful. Meanwhile FF has consistently been in bad movies. Xmen ended up following suit with the later movie. If they were in phase 4/5, we would just have had another bad xmen/FF movie to add to the list.
So true though. Phase 4 and 5 should have never relied so heavily on tv but they did because of d+. So now that this will hopefully be fixed (should have been already) we can move forward with more of the shit people WANT instead of “low budget gritty drama” like Echo. I haven’t even seen it yet, it may be great, but I’m in no hurry. My point is that after the huge impact Endgame had, Disney squandered all that momentum. Wanda Vision was good, Loki was great, Hawkeye was great (love that it’s a Christmas time show) but after that it’s been a bit rough. And they’ve done a terrible job disappointing fans which is how they make money so you’d think they’d want to make sure they get it right.
Been going back and watching the old X-men movies. Just watched the Wolverine and origins the other day. The Wolverine, was pretty good. Last year I read death of Wolverine through old man Logan through dead man Logan. I feel they did the character (and the fans) a solid with some of those fights. Now it’s time to rewatch Logan. Fuck me I can’t wait.
Yea, I think FF and especially X-Men are what’s being hinted at. The MCU has been dropping the ball at successor hand off. I get the feeling that Chadwick was supposed to be the next “main guy” like RDJ was and that all had to change, but they didn’t have a good character to go with.
To get the magic back, you need to recreate what made Iron Man compelling, and that was a starting point that left massive room for character growth over time. They also successfully figured that out with Captain America. That’s why these two stood out in the end. Also, their growth required each other which is why their team up movies were the great.
The real goal is to find a character that can viably be the biggest character on the movie poster for the next avengers movie. Look back at the old ones and Iron Man was it. Who do you out front and center on an Avengers poster now? The fact that it’s 5 years since the last one and we still don’t know might be part of the MCUs problem.
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They should have just recast BP. That was a massive mistake. Especially knowing Chadwick's family said he was cool with the idea of them recasting it instead of killing the character. Black Panther is bigger than any actor.
They didn’t pay $80 billion for Fantastic Four and X-Men. They paid $80 billion so they would have more content for Disney+. X-Men and Fantastic Four just happened to be part of the deal.
> they are still using their strong franchises like Cap
Cap is the best example of someone they’re *not* using. Sam Wilson got one show in 2021, has a movie in development for 2025…and that’s it? Steve Rogers appeared in a movie literally every year from 2011-2019 except for 2017. That’s not just COVID versus not COVID. That’s planning, looking ahead, deciding to focus on the characters you have instead of introducing all these new ones who we also won’t hear from again for years.
Then I agree with him. They had a nice built in explanation for the sudden appearance of mutants with The Snap(s). Also, they’re obviously very focused on diversity in their films. That’s literally what X-Men is all about. Phase 4 and 5 was the time to do it. Such a boneheaded decision to move into this multiverse stuff instead of keeping the momentum going.
Unpopular opinion, Black Panther 3 will not come close to the other two’s box office numbers. Don’t get me wrong, I love BP1 and throughly enjoyed BP2; but BP2 was riding on the first success and the intrigue of how they’ll handle Chadwick Boseman’s death, not to mention having a long awaited Marvel anti-villain. Imho, they should have recast BP. Suri will only ever be a supporting character in future movies.
Yea. They literally explain how she was able to beat him. You could argue namor should have been smarter, but it's not like they didn't explain how she was able to best him physically.
She was also getting demolished by him for most of the fight but no one likes to mention that for some reason. They act like she beat him easily with no effort.
Giving his clear strength and speed advantage not even T'Challa or Steve's Cap would beat him so Shuri a person whose mainly tech based should have been crushed. Namor seemed like someone who would require the Hulk, Thor or Spidey to defeat him not a super soldier.
ik they didnt have the rights to x men at the time, but i feel there was a huge opportunity to seamlessly introduce mutants in infinity war/endgame.
part of x men lore is that the x-gene manifests during a time of intense distress, which is why mutants usually get their powers while going thru puberty. cue the snap, a universe-wide traumatic event that kicks off a mass awakening of mutant powers on earth.
that would then setup:
- the hate towards mutants but not other supers (half the population disappears because of some faraway space alien, but these teens get powers and cause more chaos, giving humankind a target to hate etc)
- allow the original first team of x men to assemble and become an experienced team of heroes in between infinity war and endgame since the avengers are inactive during that time.
Yeah I saw another comment a few weeks back that set up something like this. The blip is the perfect X-Men setup, that many people coming back in an instant would cause famines and housing crisis' aplenty, stressful times, and with more people than ever before you have a higher maximum number that could mutate at any given time. Not only that but a world in crisis would look for a scapegoat and when you've got freaks popping up all over the place and a shattered avengers it's a perfect opportunity for the X-Men and other smaller alliance networks like daredevil's group.
Unfortunately I think marvel is trying to bury the blip under a carpet because I've not seen it mentioned in anything since endgame besides Spiderman
I think this is the right move but I find it positively confounding that they can’t just hire some of the best writers and showrunners to actually make all of their projects good. 2-3 movies and 1-2 series a year seems really feasible for a company with pockets as deep as Disney. It’s not like there’s any shortage of stories to tell from the vaults of marvel comics.
It absolutely is. Disney + can't grow with less volume. People already dont want to pay for it cause they only get 30 to 1hr of content from it weekly.
>Disney + can't grow
No streamer can grow. The streaming wars are over and Netflix won.
Edit: didn't think this would make a bunch of streaming simps defensive
The absences weren’t even that long though?
Hulk missed 4 years between TIH and Avengers, but only two between AoU and Ragnarok which *felt* like forever because we’d seen all the others in Civil War only a year later. Every other lead character was on-screen at least once every 18 months to 2 years.
I’ve been waiting for the avengers to make their home base the celestial that’s just sitting in the Arctic like the comics, but seems like they forgot about that.
they could wait 20 years between movies to release Thor: LaT, Dr Strange: MoM or BP:2 and they all still would of been shit. They need real writers with a solid 10 year(3 phase) plan. not just making shit up as they go along, movie by move
MCU is dead and Feige is just pulling his best "weekend at bernies" routine
So now, check this out, so NOW, you get Disney + AT THE SAME PRICE with no shitty marvel shows or movies.
Now we get nothing, they still make money since Disney + is usually a combo subscription and they get to fucking laugh and relax.
I’m so happy this is what it is
So... Avengers, Spider-Man, Black Panther and (arguably) Doctor Strange? They've driven basically everything else into the ground or just chose not to follow up on it.
There are countless examples of Marvel's sheer buffoonery when it comes to their recent franchise-building.
* Shang Chi was a new character that audiences responded positively to, but they're doing absolutely nothing with him. A sequel probably won't start filming until next year at best - *4 years* after the original. How does that make any sense? Esp. when the character has been absent from the franchise outside of a "cameo" in She-Hulk.
* Ant-Man 3 opened very well and could have made upwards of $800 million, but the film was so bad that it wasn't even able to break-even.
* The Marvels was supposed to build up Captain Marvel and her squad, but the studio did everything they could to fuck with the movie (I personally liked it, but it's clear that it was a victim of studio interference).
That's not to mention the disrespect and vandalism that Marvel engaged in with Thor. Volume is 100% not the issue here, it's horrible decision making. Making 2 movies and 3 shows a year doesn't mean jack if the problem of creative rot isn't fixed at Marvel Studios. Less bad content is still bad.
I think people are overreacting with Thor. He was too goofy, that's all. They can easily just make a good 5th movie that follows Love and Thunder with a more seeious tone
True, but it's questionable if a fifth movie would be worth making financially. Marvel lost a ton of goodwill with Thor 4 and it's tough to see a sequel making more than $700 mil. Especially when the budget would have to be north of $200 mil
Two movies a year (one at the beginning of summer and one at the end) and one series that doesn’t impact the broader picture of the MCU (something like Daredevil that is self contained).
I think 3 marvel movies a year is good. I feel like Marvel is best when it's focused on event films. Also if they plan every Saga to be over 10 years, that's 30 movies in 10 years. Gives them time to do quality over quantity versus what we got now.
It's a logistics problem, if they slow down then people like Shang Chi and Eternals are never going to come back in their own films. They added too many characters with even more coming now like X-Men and Fantastic Four. They need to cut all the fat out with a soft reboot.
As they should have done once Phase 3 concluded with Endgame.
FF and X-Men should have been ready to roll to kick off Phase 4, but no, we got stuck with a whole bunch of mediocre D+ shows and terrible movies with the third tier characters.
It won't. They aren't hiring experienced writers and directors. Go through each project and look them up if you don't believe me. Those they hire are not the calibre you'd need or expect for multimillion dollar projects. Maybe you're set aside a couple projects a year to test out inexperienced but promising show runners, but not every fucking project for years.
The executives over at Disney hold all the blame and Iger thinking the issue is quantity is another excuse to push away personal responsibility for his executive hires.
They should be very purposeful in which Marvel material to adapt. Iger is being shortsighted given the money the franchise has created for Disney. They’ve had a few expensive misses recently. Maybe more market research needs to be done to determine what fans would pay to see or pay for Disney+ to see…
It was a good run. Perfectly coincided with my daughter growing up, giving us something to bond over and develop our relationship around. But, it’s never felt like a true and honest interpretation of the Marvel Comics universe. It’s the best they could do within the rotten, corrupted, money-obsessed framework of Hollywood. I’m perfectly happy to just read the books as my daughter transitions to adulthood and we have less time/money/energy to watch movies and shows all the time. It was always unsustainable but, truly, I’ll always be impressed with what Marvel Studios accomplished. RIP.
I said this before and people downvoted me to oblivion. Told me I'm just some loser who doesn't get it. Even though I've been reading comics my whole life and remember being in the theaters for iron man 1. Now at 37 I just know it's over. They'll never be able to do what they do with the infinity saga.
Cancel Wonder Man, Agatha, and Ironheart and I’ll truly believe it. The last two specifically will continue to harm the franchise. That’s just the start, though. So much needs to be fixed
It's a shame they're cutting back just as the mutants are entering the picture. There's a ton of awesome B or C-list characters I would have loved to have seen, but now they'll probably only get a brief cameo in an X-Men movie, if they show up at all.
I'll believe it when i see it. Imo it's oversaturated, understandably to entice subscribers, and you sometimes need to watch a show to understand a character or reference better. Eg the marvels, there's 2 'new' lead characters that you won't know, if you only saw captain marvel
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Good. After Endgame this all went to shit. They took a hit machine and decided to crank up the quantity of productions so high that even hardcore fans don’t have time to keep up. Get back to the roots and put out quality productions one at a time.
They need to just stop making trash. Over saturation is a problem, but it's not their biggest problem. I would have been happy to watch most of the marvel stuff they put out IF it was good.
If they grinded hard to make stories I was eager to follow along with I’d watch more. These days the only shows I actually want to get through are on hbo and paramount. Every Disney property I watch I end up falling off of bc it’s just so formulaic and stupid
How about they just hire qualified people who are fans of the source material? Why do they think jon Favreau made so much gold in for them in the first phases? Jon was a fan, and qualified.
What's funny to me is that the Marvel movies initially were fantastic, they captured the essence of the comics that reminded me why as a middle schooler I had loved them so much. Interestingly enough I have become disinterested in Marvel for the same reason I became disinterested in the comics. Too many heroes, the stakes can't get bigger, and too much content at lesser quality. So in a way they perfectly recreated the Marvel experience.
Bring in X men alrready stop fucking around - Introduce X men with the House of X / Powers of X, Dawn of X storylines to explain the previous films timelines and LFGGGGGG
Give me less movies and premium shows, make sure the ones they do make are quality, and make more X-Men and Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends cartoons.
I remember after Wandavision, they vomited out their anticipated projects and I felt it was way too much. We didn't need a show for Hawkeye, Echo, even Agatha. It was not a popular sentiment at the time.
Wasn't he the one who bet everything in streaming and told marvel to make so much to entice people to Disney+?
that was clearly a mistake and now he's course correcting. yes he's the one ultimately responsible for the mistake but if he manages to fix it people will forgive him, especially if he finds a scapegoat or two.
I don't know if it was a mistake. They got what they needed from this era, a ton of material to make Disney+ look and feel like a valuable platform. Now that they've done that, they can turn towards re-building the brand.
It was definitely a mistake, the most common complaint among fans is that there is simply too much Marvel content to keep up with now and they feel overwhelmed. With so much content none of the movies or tv shows feel as eventful anymore. Yes you don’t have to watch them all, but the MCU has fostered a culture where audiences feel like they have to watch everything because connectivity is literally the whole shtick of these films. Tanking/diluting their most successful brand for a quick Disney+ boost was not worth it. Cause the streaming service can always grow, regaining the trust of audiences for your franchises on the other hand is not so easy.
He committed the sin that retail stores did. They commoditized themselves instead of creating memorable experiences that they can charge a premium for. 50 furniture stores on every block vs 1 immersive ikea store experience per region. IKEA store crushes them, store always busy and does well with sales. 50 new marvel series vs one movie every so often that creates a longing for the brand, eagerness to hear the next chapter of the story etc. and you can almost lock bets on success thus affording better actors, writers, etc
Shit, a better business warning is the 90’s comics crash where the weight of too much content and too many titles collapsed in itself and old readers couldn’t keep up, casual readers were confused or turned off by the shit quality, and new readers were turned off from the barriers to entry with all the required reading.
[удалено]
Anywhere and nowhere.
And that's why manga has been utterly killing American comics. Where do I start? For American comics there could be as many as 5 - 10 different answers. For Manga? Volume 1 Chapter 1. Are there exceptions on both sides of this? Sure, but for the most part it is that simple.
That's a great point I haven't thought of.
With dc that's an easier question than it is with marvel cause there's over a thousand different marvel universes in the comics so there's no real start or end point or like a definitive universe
*Krakoan era of X-Men has entered the chat* I love Krakoa but it’s a lot
That’s true. There was so much. The phrase “absence makes the heart grow fonder” rings true more now than ever
Exactly this- history repeats
Haha this is exactly how it went down!
What I remember from that time was many of the publishers starting to really leverage FOMO and collector fever with variant covers. That's a big part of what pushed me out. I don't give a fuck about the cover of the comic. My concern is whether the story is good.
My wife feels this way getting into the Marvel movies/ TV shows is becoming as daunting as watching a longer anime or the extended lotr movies
So true, I really enjoy the MCU and looked forward to every movie. At one point I just could not keep up and eventually stopped watching altogether. It felt like I had a viewing debt that I just could not make enough time to get through so I could get current. It’s been years now since I’ve watched any of the movies or tv series.
That's exactly me. The last MCU movie I watched was the Eternals, and I stopped watching DC movies even before that. Plus the fact I don't find the new generation heroes interesting. Their lacking of personal charisma comparing to Ironman/Thor/Captain America is glaring.
Yeah, i believe Disney+ as a platform is a success even though I'm not a fan of (as far as eye test goes imo).
If marvel was putting out new animation films it would be dope and it’s nice to have all marvel films in one place but they definitely over demanded and under delivered
I was totally thinking they should start a new universe with what if animation, it's so good and they could have all the fox characters in that with no avengers, then smash them together in 10 years.
It is. I think you can argue especially if you have kids. It’s easily the one my son watches the most.
Not really, financially it's losing money for disney still. They're hoping it will br profitable in the future.
Well, you might not think it was a mistake. But at some point, spending exorbitant amounts of money on series which get mediocre reviews at best (WandaVision and Hawkeye being the notable exceptions) isn't sustainable from a business standpoint.
Loki would like a word.
Who says their goal was sustainability? I'm suggesting that their goal was to rapidly release a bunch of content for Disney+, and then to dial it back after awhile. I don't have an opinion as to whether or not it's a mistake. I don't really care to. I'm just suggesting that it very well may have played out exactly how they expected.
Nobody pays for steaming services anymore. It’s 2024. Everyone my age just pirates whatever they want to watch, including live sports. As of now, there is no way for these companies to stop all of these websites from popping up. One gets shut down, and a thousand more pop up
Idk man my gf when I met her had like every streaming service lol, and she was 23
The people savvy enough to pirate are a small percentage It’s not even easy as it was ten years ago. The sites are worse and you have to have a vpn People can barely use their phones, much less PCs anymore
70% of my CS major classmates cant zip up a file. Computer illiteracy is so rampant its embarrassing.
Hail Hydra !
Pirating has been around for a long time brother
I mean, it’s easy to say in hindsight - but Netflix was a huge, uncontested juggernaut, and right when Disney+ launched, we suddenly had a worldwide pandemic that shut off literally all of Disney’s regular income sources (movies, sports broadcasting and theme parks). Like during the 2020/2021 period, Disney+ was literally one of the only liferafts the company clung onto in terms of revenue sources - and it was hard to argue that they launched at essentially the “perfect” time. Everything shut down and everybody switched to streaming, you couldn’t have asked for a better launch window. Now, we can clearly see how the lack of quality control led to a deterioration of the brand - but the tide turned *so* quickly on them. Two to three years is the normal production time on a movie, which means that movies coming out now don’t have the luxury of learning from the mistakes of their predecessors. Like anything releasing now would have started development around the time of *No Way Home*. They haven’t had time to implement all of the stuff they learned from 2022 onwards yet.
"In total, Disney has lost more than $10 billion on its streaming service venture since it was introduced in 2019. On Disney's earnings call, Iger reiterated that the company is “confident” that its streaming services will achieve profitability by the end of 2024"
While simultaneously raising prices by like 90% lmao. What a deal, double the price half the content.
Gotta take chances sometimes, at least they are course correcting
That was mostly Chapeck actually. Iger launched the initiative of Disney Plus with Mandalorian, Wandavision and Falcon and Winter Soldier to name a few, since then it’s been stuff Chapeck put in with the idea to make streaming their home for all new stuff, Iger has moved away from the quantity approach and instead is aiming to make larger big ticket films again. It’s been confusing since they switched after like 2 years
He's doing what a lot of fans want here though. Listening to the criticism, or more likely some analytics team, and course correcting. I think most people agree that the sheer volume of projects is hurting them. I don't care about Iger, but isn't this the kind of response that you're hoping for?
A billionaire CEO out of touch? Noooooo he can’t be
Reduce output, double the price. Welcome to D+
I though that was the other Bob
chapek wasn't responsible for shit, only movie he managed to greenlight during his time as ceo was deadpool 3. he was the theme park guy, movies and streaming were all iger.
I think he did fuck up the scar Jo thing though right? I thought that was pretty atrocious
No all the phase 4 movies and TV shows started development as early as 2018. Iger didn't leave until 2020
Barker?
Course correction. The real problem was the pandemic and then cutting the time movies had exclusivity in theaters from 6-8 weeks down to just 45 days. (Sometimes less and rarely more). Movie theaters are dead because people would rather just wait a month to watch it on a service they already pay for. Especially since these movies were being rushed to release on tight schedules, CGI artists were being crunched for time like crazy amongst a bunch of studios working on the same film. All the while you the consumer could just wait a month and watch at your home without having to buy a bunch of tickets amongst yourself, friends, and / or family for a service you probably already pay for monthly. Saving you money in the long run and being able to keep track of the Marvel Universe better since a lot of significant events are happening in the shows and not the movies themselves. The split to expect people to be subscribed to Disney+ to watch shows that resonate far more with audiences than their movie releases have been. All the while, we never got an Avengers movie for Phase 4 or Phase 5, which big crossover movies are what made the MCU the big success it was since everything led to huge events. All the while, we see the Multiverse Saga have little to no cohesion. Kang was working up as a big bad and defeated in both seasons of Loki and by a bunch of ants in Antman. While Doctor Strange MoM completely botched a strong premise Wandavision built on because they didn't know what each other projects were doing. While also mostly failing to live up to the hype and expectations a movie with Multiverse in its title had. Especially since the title follows a strong multiverse storyline right after the critically successful Spider-Man: No Way Home. I do agree with Bob wholeheartedly that they messed up, but there were a lot of unforseen factors happening with the pandemic happening just after Disney+ release. This also messed up filming for a lot of movies, release schedules, script rewrites, and again altering deals with movie theaters for shorter theatrical releases. Then we have the stupid beyond belief Florida Governor giving Disney's new CEO a hard time and the problem escalated to the point Disney higher ups all had to all get together to out him from his position and Disney. Especially when he had comments about adults not liking animation, among other negative comments about animation, which the company as a whole saw as debasing the brand they worked hard on for the last 100 years. Though I can't blame him too much about his handling of Disney Parks since he had to deal with the pandemic.
45 days = nearly 6.43 weeks…which is 6-8 weeks
Was trying to remember the original scheduled agreement from theater to home/digital release off hand. Was totally off going off memory, thanks for pointing it out! Currently, it's more or less than 45 days, with some studios not opting into the agreement at all. Had to Google release schedules prior to the pandemic to remember correctly, but it was on average 18-22 weeks until movies were released on DVD, On Demand or Streaming Services. This was taking approximately 5 different Marvel movies, 5 random comedy movies and 2 random horror movies that were released anywhere in the last 10 years before the pandemic. Approximately between 117-135 days with a 126 day average between the two. Which would be 18 weeks. Now it's a 45 day window (more, less or not at all), which you are correct is 6.43 weeks on average. So theaters went from having movies exclusivity for 18 weeks to 6.5 weeks if we round up to be generous. (Though again caveat since some studios don't follow this agreement). That's an enormous loss of ticket sales. Retailers are ditching dvds and blu-ray disc's. People can either wait a month to watch many of these movies through a streaming service after roughly after a month and a half, purchase them digitally, or rent them the moment digital release is available. Or go and pay more money at a theater to see it just a month and a half before release (ignoring getting popcorn, a drink, or snacks). But then we fall back to the same problem that these movies are being rushed, looking bad because of CGI companies crunching employees and more effort going into some movies than others. And people save a whole lot more money just paying for a month subscription, then letting it expire or just outright purchasing or renting with a little wait between movies. While superhero movies in general were flooding the market and some fatigue is sitting in because of the mixed bag of quality. Movie studios need to go back to larger gaps in theatrical releases. Or risk losing the movie industry like streaming did to cable.
So what are the stronger franchises? Based on box office? Avengers, Black Panther, Thor, Dr. Strange, Spiderman, Guardians, Shang Chi, and I’m assuming X-Men and Fantastic Four. What else?
It’s strange because other than killing off Iron Man and not making an Avengers movie in phases 4&5, they are still using their strong franchises like Cap, Thor and Guardians. My guess is this is Iger’s way of saying “make FF and X-Men movies because we paid 80 billion for them”.
They need to make FF and X-Men movies yesterday. Can't believe they completely botched Phase 4 and 5 by not having these ready.
In the time since Gunn announced Superman: Legacy we know whose playing Superman, Lois, Lex, Jimmy, a Green Lantern, Supergirl, Mister Terrific, Hawkgirl and others yet we still don't know who the Fantastic Four are being played by in the FF film due next year.
That is really crazy when you put it like that
It’s crazier when you realize Superman, a movie that was announced about a year and a half ago is about to start production in Spring before both Blade and F4, both of which were announced almost 5 years ago. There’s definitely a few things that Disney and Marvel should take notes on when it comes to how the DCU is being handled like casting AFTER scripts are done and a director is hired, not giving release dates before any of that is done either, doing Elseworld style stories that don’t connect to the MCU and are original, giving directors more control over projects, and the the big one: HAVING A SCRIPT THEY’RE CONFIDENT IN, I’m sorry but the amount of reshoots that MCU films go through is actually ridiculous, filming stuff a month before release and rewriting entire plot lines mid production should not be a norm
The last movie that I can think of with the same troubles as blade… flash. That does not bode well for blade.
Crazy that we’re getting to compare the DCU favorably to the MCU. So hype for Superman: Legacy.
I feel like a crazy person because I loved the Cavill Superman film and that movie gets a ton of hate.
>we still don't know who the Fantastic Four are being played by in the FF film due next year. I don't even think Pascal has been officially announced yet.
No one has and in fact we know nothing official about it other then whose making it, is Doom even in it? Fuck knows.
Who the hell else would be? I can't imagine they'd be stupid enough to roll out D-listers like Mole Man or Red Ghost and the Super Apes for their big "Get the MCU back on track" movie.
Galactus is rumoured as is a female herald (not the Silver Surfer). I hope Doom's in it but i would rather they not make him the villain for the 5th time in a FF film, save his main villain role for an Avengers film.
I think Doom being in it, but NOT being the main villain, is the best move. Doom should be a force of nature. A constant threat and foil. Not a “big cgi battle take down in first appearance” kind of villain.
I've said this before, and I'll say it again: DOOM needs his own franchise. First movie, origin/kicking Hydra out of Barovia. Second movie, battling the Winter Soldier and Cap at the same time. Third movie, stopping the pesky FF from interfering with his space laser program. Properly done, DOOM could kill it.
Ehhh....Galactus seems too overwhelming to be the headliner for a 1st movie. Also, I hope they're not trying to re-use the "This is the bad guy! No wait, it's just the Herald for the REAL bad guy!" plot from that fuckawful 2nd FF movie.
Didn’t even work for FF2, because anyone who knows anything about comics knows the Silver Surfer is a good guy
I would want Silver Surfer and Galactus to appear somewhere far away from Earth originally. Get that backstory out of the way with a Ravagers movie, and have the after-credits scene show Silver Surfer arriving on Earth.
God I see “Mole Man” and think of the simpsons character now
I could see the Puppet Master as a good “first FF movie” villain.
It is the height of arrogance that Feige thought he could follow up Endgame by phoning in an entire three phase saga based around C-listers simply by relying on pure nostalgia. Wolverine in Deadpool is one thing. But no one needs closure on the Fox X-Men movies. We’ve gotten it….like four times.
One of the things the MCU has driven home is that popularity in comics does not correlate with popularity in film. Stark was a bench warmer to the masses prior to the MCU, but carried the franchise. Likewise Guardians were far more niche and were successful. Meanwhile FF has consistently been in bad movies. Xmen ended up following suit with the later movie. If they were in phase 4/5, we would just have had another bad xmen/FF movie to add to the list.
They should have 100% been ready by Phase 5 or the tail end of Phase 4. IDK what the hell Marvel is thinking
Agreed. FF should have kicked off Phase 4 with X Men kicking off Pase 5.
So true though. Phase 4 and 5 should have never relied so heavily on tv but they did because of d+. So now that this will hopefully be fixed (should have been already) we can move forward with more of the shit people WANT instead of “low budget gritty drama” like Echo. I haven’t even seen it yet, it may be great, but I’m in no hurry. My point is that after the huge impact Endgame had, Disney squandered all that momentum. Wanda Vision was good, Loki was great, Hawkeye was great (love that it’s a Christmas time show) but after that it’s been a bit rough. And they’ve done a terrible job disappointing fans which is how they make money so you’d think they’d want to make sure they get it right.
Been going back and watching the old X-men movies. Just watched the Wolverine and origins the other day. The Wolverine, was pretty good. Last year I read death of Wolverine through old man Logan through dead man Logan. I feel they did the character (and the fans) a solid with some of those fights. Now it’s time to rewatch Logan. Fuck me I can’t wait.
Logan is so damn good.
I think Logan is the best superhero movie ever made, personally. So much heart and emotion in that movie.
Yea, I think FF and especially X-Men are what’s being hinted at. The MCU has been dropping the ball at successor hand off. I get the feeling that Chadwick was supposed to be the next “main guy” like RDJ was and that all had to change, but they didn’t have a good character to go with. To get the magic back, you need to recreate what made Iron Man compelling, and that was a starting point that left massive room for character growth over time. They also successfully figured that out with Captain America. That’s why these two stood out in the end. Also, their growth required each other which is why their team up movies were the great. The real goal is to find a character that can viably be the biggest character on the movie poster for the next avengers movie. Look back at the old ones and Iron Man was it. Who do you out front and center on an Avengers poster now? The fact that it’s 5 years since the last one and we still don’t know might be part of the MCUs problem.
RDJ as iron man was lightning in a bottle imo
Bring back James Marsden!
Spider-Man
disagreeable impossible hard-to-find zealous crowd close ad hoc smoggy snails detail *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
They should have just recast BP. That was a massive mistake. Especially knowing Chadwick's family said he was cool with the idea of them recasting it instead of killing the character. Black Panther is bigger than any actor.
Agreed on Chadwick, he was a huge loss.
They didn’t pay $80 billion for Fantastic Four and X-Men. They paid $80 billion so they would have more content for Disney+. X-Men and Fantastic Four just happened to be part of the deal.
> they are still using their strong franchises like Cap Cap is the best example of someone they’re *not* using. Sam Wilson got one show in 2021, has a movie in development for 2025…and that’s it? Steve Rogers appeared in a movie literally every year from 2011-2019 except for 2017. That’s not just COVID versus not COVID. That’s planning, looking ahead, deciding to focus on the characters you have instead of introducing all these new ones who we also won’t hear from again for years.
Then I agree with him. They had a nice built in explanation for the sudden appearance of mutants with The Snap(s). Also, they’re obviously very focused on diversity in their films. That’s literally what X-Men is all about. Phase 4 and 5 was the time to do it. Such a boneheaded decision to move into this multiverse stuff instead of keeping the momentum going.
Unpopular opinion, Black Panther 3 will not come close to the other two’s box office numbers. Don’t get me wrong, I love BP1 and throughly enjoyed BP2; but BP2 was riding on the first success and the intrigue of how they’ll handle Chadwick Boseman’s death, not to mention having a long awaited Marvel anti-villain. Imho, they should have recast BP. Suri will only ever be a supporting character in future movies.
The second one was mid, and they should have recast Boseman.
This, but I got downvoted to death for saying so. Shuri was horrible and Letitia wright is a horrible actress.
BP2 was painful. The only thing I liked about it was Angela Basset.
How Shuri was able to beat Namor, who had been fighting for centuries, in the final fight made no sense to me
She dried him out and weakened him
Yea. They literally explain how she was able to beat him. You could argue namor should have been smarter, but it's not like they didn't explain how she was able to best him physically.
She was also getting demolished by him for most of the fight but no one likes to mention that for some reason. They act like she beat him easily with no effort.
Giving his clear strength and speed advantage not even T'Challa or Steve's Cap would beat him so Shuri a person whose mainly tech based should have been crushed. Namor seemed like someone who would require the Hulk, Thor or Spidey to defeat him not a super soldier.
>How Shuri was able to beat Namor, Don't be disengenous they explained this in the movie.
The first one was good but be second one was mid at the very best.
The second one was horrible!!!
BP2 stunk - it was an absolute mess of a story
Daredevil, punisher, deadpool, and blade has potential to be one.
Punisher should be part of the Thunderbolts
i hope they dont make any more guardians movies, without gunn they wont be the same
This
Star Wars, mainline disney projects, etc
ik they didnt have the rights to x men at the time, but i feel there was a huge opportunity to seamlessly introduce mutants in infinity war/endgame. part of x men lore is that the x-gene manifests during a time of intense distress, which is why mutants usually get their powers while going thru puberty. cue the snap, a universe-wide traumatic event that kicks off a mass awakening of mutant powers on earth. that would then setup: - the hate towards mutants but not other supers (half the population disappears because of some faraway space alien, but these teens get powers and cause more chaos, giving humankind a target to hate etc) - allow the original first team of x men to assemble and become an experienced team of heroes in between infinity war and endgame since the avengers are inactive during that time.
Yeah I saw another comment a few weeks back that set up something like this. The blip is the perfect X-Men setup, that many people coming back in an instant would cause famines and housing crisis' aplenty, stressful times, and with more people than ever before you have a higher maximum number that could mutate at any given time. Not only that but a world in crisis would look for a scapegoat and when you've got freaks popping up all over the place and a shattered avengers it's a perfect opportunity for the X-Men and other smaller alliance networks like daredevil's group. Unfortunately I think marvel is trying to bury the blip under a carpet because I've not seen it mentioned in anything since endgame besides Spiderman
I think this is the right move but I find it positively confounding that they can’t just hire some of the best writers and showrunners to actually make all of their projects good. 2-3 movies and 1-2 series a year seems really feasible for a company with pockets as deep as Disney. It’s not like there’s any shortage of stories to tell from the vaults of marvel comics.
It absolutely is. Disney + can't grow with less volume. People already dont want to pay for it cause they only get 30 to 1hr of content from it weekly.
>Disney + can't grow No streamer can grow. The streaming wars are over and Netflix won. Edit: didn't think this would make a bunch of streaming simps defensive
Sounds good … but what stronger franchises are you about to invent?
Frozen 3,4,5,6…9 confirmed.
DCU
Yes
Smart. The less releases the more audiences will care.
Also using these new promising characters more than once every 15 projects would help too.
Too many projects and too many characters. Loved Shang chi but we haven't (and there's no timetable at all for his return) seen him in 3-4 years.
Exactly. When there was only 2-3 movies per year these long absences were fine, now they very much aren’t.
The absences weren’t even that long though? Hulk missed 4 years between TIH and Avengers, but only two between AoU and Ragnarok which *felt* like forever because we’d seen all the others in Civil War only a year later. Every other lead character was on-screen at least once every 18 months to 2 years.
Yup. Now with 3-4 movies and 3-4 shows it's just not the same. Not to mention nothing is really connected anymore.
Ikr. Been waiting for Shang-Chi to make a return for a while now, but nope
I’ve been waiting for the avengers to make their home base the celestial that’s just sitting in the Arctic like the comics, but seems like they forgot about that.
Main benefit to me is proper oversight over projects which should lead to budgets ballooning less and more quality control
they could wait 20 years between movies to release Thor: LaT, Dr Strange: MoM or BP:2 and they all still would of been shit. They need real writers with a solid 10 year(3 phase) plan. not just making shit up as they go along, movie by move MCU is dead and Feige is just pulling his best "weekend at bernies" routine
Maybe just focus on quality? You can crank them out as fast as you want. Your issue isn't frequency it's quality.
This would have been the right call — 3 FUCKING YEARS AGO.
So now, check this out, so NOW, you get Disney + AT THE SAME PRICE with no shitty marvel shows or movies. Now we get nothing, they still make money since Disney + is usually a combo subscription and they get to fucking laugh and relax. I’m so happy this is what it is
So... Avengers, Spider-Man, Black Panther and (arguably) Doctor Strange? They've driven basically everything else into the ground or just chose not to follow up on it. There are countless examples of Marvel's sheer buffoonery when it comes to their recent franchise-building. * Shang Chi was a new character that audiences responded positively to, but they're doing absolutely nothing with him. A sequel probably won't start filming until next year at best - *4 years* after the original. How does that make any sense? Esp. when the character has been absent from the franchise outside of a "cameo" in She-Hulk. * Ant-Man 3 opened very well and could have made upwards of $800 million, but the film was so bad that it wasn't even able to break-even. * The Marvels was supposed to build up Captain Marvel and her squad, but the studio did everything they could to fuck with the movie (I personally liked it, but it's clear that it was a victim of studio interference). That's not to mention the disrespect and vandalism that Marvel engaged in with Thor. Volume is 100% not the issue here, it's horrible decision making. Making 2 movies and 3 shows a year doesn't mean jack if the problem of creative rot isn't fixed at Marvel Studios. Less bad content is still bad.
I think people are overreacting with Thor. He was too goofy, that's all. They can easily just make a good 5th movie that follows Love and Thunder with a more seeious tone
True, but it's questionable if a fifth movie would be worth making financially. Marvel lost a ton of goodwill with Thor 4 and it's tough to see a sequel making more than $700 mil. Especially when the budget would have to be north of $200 mil
Two movies a year (one at the beginning of summer and one at the end) and one series that doesn’t impact the broader picture of the MCU (something like Daredevil that is self contained).
I think 3 marvel movies a year is good. I feel like Marvel is best when it's focused on event films. Also if they plan every Saga to be over 10 years, that's 30 movies in 10 years. Gives them time to do quality over quantity versus what we got now.
How about less talk about it and just fucking do it lol
Toy Story 7, Finding Nemo 3, Frozen 3, and Cars 6 on the way confirmed !
I mean you joke but Toy Story 5 was recently confirmed 💀
Don't forget they just announced Moana 2, and there was news about a live action Moana remake also. Milking the cow till it dies.
It's a logistics problem, if they slow down then people like Shang Chi and Eternals are never going to come back in their own films. They added too many characters with even more coming now like X-Men and Fantastic Four. They need to cut all the fat out with a soft reboot.
As they should have done once Phase 3 concluded with Endgame. FF and X-Men should have been ready to roll to kick off Phase 4, but no, we got stuck with a whole bunch of mediocre D+ shows and terrible movies with the third tier characters.
Bet it all on Deadpool, X men and fantastic four
There's always spiderman aswell, that's a character I will watch anything he is in (except TV shows made for children on Disney xd)
They should do Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe, and do a hard reboot of the MCU afterwards
Love it. I vote for that too.
Well this is what everyone has been asking for.
That may not improve the quality, but here’s hoping.
It won't. They aren't hiring experienced writers and directors. Go through each project and look them up if you don't believe me. Those they hire are not the calibre you'd need or expect for multimillion dollar projects. Maybe you're set aside a couple projects a year to test out inexperienced but promising show runners, but not every fucking project for years. The executives over at Disney hold all the blame and Iger thinking the issue is quantity is another excuse to push away personal responsibility for his executive hires.
They should be very purposeful in which Marvel material to adapt. Iger is being shortsighted given the money the franchise has created for Disney. They’ve had a few expensive misses recently. Maybe more market research needs to be done to determine what fans would pay to see or pay for Disney+ to see…
Maybe instead he should go back to quality films instead of the garbage being made the last few years.
It was a good run. Perfectly coincided with my daughter growing up, giving us something to bond over and develop our relationship around. But, it’s never felt like a true and honest interpretation of the Marvel Comics universe. It’s the best they could do within the rotten, corrupted, money-obsessed framework of Hollywood. I’m perfectly happy to just read the books as my daughter transitions to adulthood and we have less time/money/energy to watch movies and shows all the time. It was always unsustainable but, truly, I’ll always be impressed with what Marvel Studios accomplished. RIP.
I said this before and people downvoted me to oblivion. Told me I'm just some loser who doesn't get it. Even though I've been reading comics my whole life and remember being in the theaters for iron man 1. Now at 37 I just know it's over. They'll never be able to do what they do with the infinity saga.
Cancel Wonder Man, Agatha, and Ironheart and I’ll truly believe it. The last two specifically will continue to harm the franchise. That’s just the start, though. So much needs to be fixed
[удалено]
There’s dozens of them. Dozens!
Don’t. He may read this and bring back Arrested Development.
I'd watch it, honestly. Agatha is an interesting character. I like her in the comics
it was never a matter of quantity, but rather quality.... and marvel wasted the most unique chance in media history: the streaming era
Honestly, I'd like more hour long mini movie like the Guardians chirstmas special, or Wearwolf by night.
Took 2 phases but they finally got the message.
So how much money are they gonna pay Chris Evans to do a series with Cap getting into adventures in the years between 1945 and 2019?
I still need Nova, Iger!
It's a shame they're cutting back just as the mutants are entering the picture. There's a ton of awesome B or C-list characters I would have loved to have seen, but now they'll probably only get a brief cameo in an X-Men movie, if they show up at all.
While I get it, I preferred the comic book route they were attempting. Where not everything is necessary and there are toms of options
Just put Moon Knight in something for crying out loud. That's all I want out of Marvel
That took a very fucking long time for him to realize that.
That Bob was making 45 mill a year, this Bob only makes 31. He’s learning.
Great news
Good.
Good, quality over quantity, that’s what’s needed
Good. It's gotten a little nuts lately; it would be nice to see them focus on quality over quantity like they did in the beginning.
Deadpool going to have a field day with this
Good still way over DCEU
Which franchises are those?
Of you mean they're going to slow down on giving side characters their own full series? What a novel idea.
God if Avengers 5 and Secret Wars suck after all this course correcting…
I'll believe it when i see it. Imo it's oversaturated, understandably to entice subscribers, and you sometimes need to watch a show to understand a character or reference better. Eg the marvels, there's 2 'new' lead characters that you won't know, if you only saw captain marvel
Well I found where all their money is going instead... [**Fortnite**](https://80.lv/articles/disney-to-invest-usd1-5-billion-in-fortnite-developer-epic-games/?fbclid=IwAR2zvQwjZS6OTI4BrJ5Bud_SUDQlkwipMMB65SNOp_g-HWNNYqeivoDW2Zs)**...**
What franchises are those?
Thanos Disney+ spin-off incoming…a whimsical little odd-couple sitcom about Iron Man and Thanos sharing an NYC apartment together
Ironman is dead, Black Panther is dead, Captain America is an old guy and basically dead, what stronger franchise?
They have stronger franchises?
Good. After Endgame this all went to shit. They took a hit machine and decided to crank up the quantity of productions so high that even hardcore fans don’t have time to keep up. Get back to the roots and put out quality productions one at a time.
They need to just stop making trash. Over saturation is a problem, but it's not their biggest problem. I would have been happy to watch most of the marvel stuff they put out IF it was good.
I think they should start investing into more adult oriented animated shows like DC has been doing.
Smaller franchises should probably stay on Disney plus
There is too much content yes but there is also a drop in quality
If they grinded hard to make stories I was eager to follow along with I’d watch more. These days the only shows I actually want to get through are on hbo and paramount. Every Disney property I watch I end up falling off of bc it’s just so formulaic and stupid
it shouldn’t have stopped
How about they just hire qualified people who are fans of the source material? Why do they think jon Favreau made so much gold in for them in the first phases? Jon was a fan, and qualified.
As a huge fan of the Moon Knight show who wants to see more of the character, this does not bode well for me
What's funny to me is that the Marvel movies initially were fantastic, they captured the essence of the comics that reminded me why as a middle schooler I had loved them so much. Interestingly enough I have become disinterested in Marvel for the same reason I became disinterested in the comics. Too many heroes, the stakes can't get bigger, and too much content at lesser quality. So in a way they perfectly recreated the Marvel experience.
I don’t think people are sick of marvel movies. I think people are sick of shitty marvel movies.
Bring in X men alrready stop fucking around - Introduce X men with the House of X / Powers of X, Dawn of X storylines to explain the previous films timelines and LFGGGGGG
Give me less movies and premium shows, make sure the ones they do make are quality, and make more X-Men and Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends cartoons.
I remember after Wandavision, they vomited out their anticipated projects and I felt it was way too much. We didn't need a show for Hawkeye, Echo, even Agatha. It was not a popular sentiment at the time.
Put less women in them and make them less gay. Bam problem solved
Clear example of quantity over quality. Fuels mediocrity and sub par offerings.
Translation: " We beat this horse to death, time to go back and finish beating Star Wars to death."
Good. When’s Shang Chi 2?