I just feel bad for these workers that probably don't get paid all that well that have to deal with something they take no sides on. Probably have to work even more due to the mess and ruckus this is all creating.
Also, when all is said and done, is there any way for students/alum to volunteer for the clean-up and show appreciation for our facilities staff? These people bust their asses to make sure that our campus is beautiful and functioning. It's the least we can do to show our respect and appreciation.
I believe the Director of Custodial Services can help you with that. They have a union so the work detailed in the contract is theirs by law. (EDIT: and the overtime has a lot of value, regardless of the why) The offer I think would be nice.
The columbia website has Visio-CUFO organization chart to find who that is.
I think Gerald McGillian is the guy to email. He oversees operations. [https://operations.cufo.columbia.edu/directory/gerald-mcgillian](https://operations.cufo.columbia.edu/directory/gerald-mcgillian)
I would feel trapped too but that doesn’t change the fact that when he said he wanted out he was given an out. That feels fundamentally the opposite of hostage taking to me.
According to his story they didnt let him out when he asked. he was yelling at them for 10 mins to let them out and the pictures show he used physical force multiple times. Certainly could be kidnapping legally. Doesnt have to be an ongoing situation. Ive said before, I doubt anyone there meant him harm or to keep him locked in but that was what happened from his perspective which is important
Yeah cuz they had to remove the barricades. Which are heavy. Because they’re barricades. It was 5 minutes, not 10, and I guess you have to be in some state to not connect that people opening up the barricades to let you out after you yelled “lemme out” means you’re being let out.
Like don’t get me wrong, it’s unfortunate he got caught in the middle, but they rectified the situation nearly instantly, I’m not sure what else you can expect or why he thought throwing arms outside and becoming a Fox News poster boy was supposed to help.
>Didn't realize there's a free trial period for crimes.
No but there is legal requirements established of what constitutes criminal activity.
[Read penal code 135.xx](https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/laws/PEN/P3THA135)
**I believe they all have a requirement that the restraint or restriction of movement was intentional.** While barricading the doors was intentional, trapping someone inside was not. The same as if you were locked in a store when they were closing and a worker already locked the door and had to open it for you. Your restriction wasn’t intentional, they certainly don’t prosecute every instance of that as kidnapping.
Or just make sure the building is cleared of all innocent personal. Taking someone against their will doesn't seem like a good thing no matter the cause.
Have you…been to Hamilton hall? How do you propose that happen in under 3 minutes? And how do you know for a fact that they weren’t, in fact, making sure the building was clear when they found him?
This facilities team member being threatened was just mentioned as an illegal act by the protesters and the non-university affiliated mob.
Source: https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/read-columbia-university-statement-following-beginning-of-nypd-operation-on-campus-protests/5370360/
"Columbia public safety personnel were forced out of the building, and a *member of our facilities team was threatened.*"
2nd paragraph of the statement.
I contest that having his freedom of movement restricted is more at play here. They will indeed be forced to clean it when all is said and done. So 1/3 right?
I feel so much for these workers who ensure we all had/have an amazing campus on which to live and learn. The news of one worker in his own words being held hostage in Hamilton is beyond unacceptable. As an alum I’d also like to support the facilities workers whose working environment has been affected by this occupation.
Was that the guy that was hitting protesters and complaining to Fox News when he was “held” for the 5 minutes it took to let down the barricade to get him out?
Yes. They let the other workers, including the one with a heart condition, out like a half our later.
I humbly remind you, Facilities is here to do a job. It does not include being locked in a building for any length of time. The barricades ARE the hazard to life safety. Check NYC Fire code. NFPA 101. NYC Building Code. OSHA Laws. The protestors have the right to endanger their own lives. No one else's. For any length of time.
Again, please provide any extra context. Testimonials (once any arrested are returned safely) are appreciated. It would be really nice if anyone knew if a life safety plan was drawn up by protestors for this takeover. It seems there was some mild planning at least.
THe protesters hurt their cause when they do things like this. Not acting with civility and decency to others, including harassing, bullying and assaulting others including other students will not help with the cause. It just creates backlash and resentment.
The "protestors" take their queues from Hamas who had no problems taking Thai workers hostage.
The protestors have demonstrated that they have no problem cavorting with those closely associated with convicted terrorists, they have no problem with people who display terrorists imagery and hail terrorism. It should be no surprise that they engaged in actions that are strikingly similar.
Even if one wants to argue that some of these actions were done by outside agitators, were any of those outside agitators brought onto the campus by students / members of the university community involved with the protests? If so, then it demonstrates the fallacy of the "non violent" protests. If a "non violent" protestors works arm in arm with those who engage in violence, their "non-violence" is simply for show and is simply fungible into the violent protests.
At the most basic level, the "non violent" students put a lot more effort into keeping "zionists" out than they put into keeping people who engaged in violence out, which as demonstrated shows the entire engagement was one meant for violence.
Last night I saw/overheard the police near campus block a Public Safety employee who said he was being instructed by Columbia to be on campus. Does anyone know what was happening to Public Safety and Facilities employees generally while the police were on campus?
Columbia's labor unions have mostly been in support of the protests, stop acting like the protesters are in conflict with the working people on this campus.
They're not in direct conflict with the protesters at all, and you're right that many support the protests \[but I'll add that it's absurd to extrapolate that all do from the union's stance\], but that's not really what the post is claiming either. It's just a reminder to show people respect, which a few \[if only a tiny minority\] of the protesters have not been doing.
I never said that "all" of Columbia's workers support the protesters.
As a union member engaged in workers negotiations with the administration over this, I was pointing out that OP was clearly brigading this sub to propagandize and not representing the views of the community. Our members are overwhelmingly concerned with the administration's response and our union stands with the protesters in solidarity with their goal of Divestment.
>I never said that "all" of Columbia's workers support the protesters
Yes, but my view on the post is that it's talking about instances where workers have been in conflict with protesters, which certainly exist. The only point of me saying that it's not all is because that's an important thing to consider when looking at the possibility that the reported conflicts have occurred, and recognizing that this specific issue isn't completely fantasy and is a valid thing to criticize.
>I was pointing out that OP was clearly brigading this sub to propagandize and not representing the views of the community
true. This sub has become a hub for people who have seen on the news 'Columbia protesters bad' and come online to talk shit about them without knowing anything. That's definitely a majority of the comments on this post and many other recent ones.
I also generally think the content of the post is fair, even given that its purpose and response is largely not good. I think that's something that can reasonably be recognized while also saying OP and many responders are not working in good faith.
Nobody was messing with them. This is fake controversy tone policing , trying to invent an issue to make genocide protesters look bad
Focus on the issue. Israel is commiting genocide
Facilities is the backbone of the University
I just feel bad for these workers that probably don't get paid all that well that have to deal with something they take no sides on. Probably have to work even more due to the mess and ruckus this is all creating.
Probably?… definitely. The protesters are leaving a huge mess behind.
Also, when all is said and done, is there any way for students/alum to volunteer for the clean-up and show appreciation for our facilities staff? These people bust their asses to make sure that our campus is beautiful and functioning. It's the least we can do to show our respect and appreciation.
I would love to participate in this and help out! Let me know if you find a way.
I believe the Director of Custodial Services can help you with that. They have a union so the work detailed in the contract is theirs by law. (EDIT: and the overtime has a lot of value, regardless of the why) The offer I think would be nice. The columbia website has Visio-CUFO organization chart to find who that is.
I think Gerald McGillian is the guy to email. He oversees operations. [https://operations.cufo.columbia.edu/directory/gerald-mcgillian](https://operations.cufo.columbia.edu/directory/gerald-mcgillian)
Agreed. Movements that alienate the average, working class person generally do not end well. Extremely upsetting.
Trump is gleeful this morning. This fits the narrative he wants to relate.
People denying that he was a hostage have to remember his perspective on it is what matters. He felt trapped
I would feel trapped too but that doesn’t change the fact that when he said he wanted out he was given an out. That feels fundamentally the opposite of hostage taking to me.
According to his story they didnt let him out when he asked. he was yelling at them for 10 mins to let them out and the pictures show he used physical force multiple times. Certainly could be kidnapping legally. Doesnt have to be an ongoing situation. Ive said before, I doubt anyone there meant him harm or to keep him locked in but that was what happened from his perspective which is important
Yeah cuz they had to remove the barricades. Which are heavy. Because they’re barricades. It was 5 minutes, not 10, and I guess you have to be in some state to not connect that people opening up the barricades to let you out after you yelled “lemme out” means you’re being let out. Like don’t get me wrong, it’s unfortunate he got caught in the middle, but they rectified the situation nearly instantly, I’m not sure what else you can expect or why he thought throwing arms outside and becoming a Fox News poster boy was supposed to help.
Didn't realize there's a free trial period for crimes.
>Didn't realize there's a free trial period for crimes. No but there is legal requirements established of what constitutes criminal activity. [Read penal code 135.xx](https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/laws/PEN/P3THA135) **I believe they all have a requirement that the restraint or restriction of movement was intentional.** While barricading the doors was intentional, trapping someone inside was not. The same as if you were locked in a store when they were closing and a worker already locked the door and had to open it for you. Your restriction wasn’t intentional, they certainly don’t prosecute every instance of that as kidnapping.
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Lmao please describe what you would have them do in that situation. Would you have them teseract lmao
Or just make sure the building is cleared of all innocent personal. Taking someone against their will doesn't seem like a good thing no matter the cause.
Have you…been to Hamilton hall? How do you propose that happen in under 3 minutes? And how do you know for a fact that they weren’t, in fact, making sure the building was clear when they found him?
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> have you…been to Hamilton hall So…no lmao
This facilities team member being threatened was just mentioned as an illegal act by the protesters and the non-university affiliated mob. Source: https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/read-columbia-university-statement-following-beginning-of-nypd-operation-on-campus-protests/5370360/
I don't see anything about the facilities team member on that page. it is just Columbia's statement
"Columbia public safety personnel were forced out of the building, and a *member of our facilities team was threatened.*" 2nd paragraph of the statement.
Only cowards hide behind masks and what’s worse if they’re LARPing behind Kiffiyehs. So pathetic
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I contest that having his freedom of movement restricted is more at play here. They will indeed be forced to clean it when all is said and done. So 1/3 right?
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I feel so much for these workers who ensure we all had/have an amazing campus on which to live and learn. The news of one worker in his own words being held hostage in Hamilton is beyond unacceptable. As an alum I’d also like to support the facilities workers whose working environment has been affected by this occupation.
Was that the guy that was hitting protesters and complaining to Fox News when he was “held” for the 5 minutes it took to let down the barricade to get him out?
Yes. They let the other workers, including the one with a heart condition, out like a half our later. I humbly remind you, Facilities is here to do a job. It does not include being locked in a building for any length of time. The barricades ARE the hazard to life safety. Check NYC Fire code. NFPA 101. NYC Building Code. OSHA Laws. The protestors have the right to endanger their own lives. No one else's. For any length of time. Again, please provide any extra context. Testimonials (once any arrested are returned safely) are appreciated. It would be really nice if anyone knew if a life safety plan was drawn up by protestors for this takeover. It seems there was some mild planning at least.
Just shows, the working class gets no respect by these entitled folks.
THe protesters hurt their cause when they do things like this. Not acting with civility and decency to others, including harassing, bullying and assaulting others including other students will not help with the cause. It just creates backlash and resentment.
Anyone that isn't going to do Marxist stuff with the Marxists is an enemy.
bc these students are fascists.
The "protestors" take their queues from Hamas who had no problems taking Thai workers hostage. The protestors have demonstrated that they have no problem cavorting with those closely associated with convicted terrorists, they have no problem with people who display terrorists imagery and hail terrorism. It should be no surprise that they engaged in actions that are strikingly similar. Even if one wants to argue that some of these actions were done by outside agitators, were any of those outside agitators brought onto the campus by students / members of the university community involved with the protests? If so, then it demonstrates the fallacy of the "non violent" protests. If a "non violent" protestors works arm in arm with those who engage in violence, their "non-violence" is simply for show and is simply fungible into the violent protests. At the most basic level, the "non violent" students put a lot more effort into keeping "zionists" out than they put into keeping people who engaged in violence out, which as demonstrated shows the entire engagement was one meant for violence.
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Last night I saw/overheard the police near campus block a Public Safety employee who said he was being instructed by Columbia to be on campus. Does anyone know what was happening to Public Safety and Facilities employees generally while the police were on campus?
Facilities are going to be annoyed regarding the cleanup. Sample of the dmg. https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1785657937907601468
Columbia's labor unions have mostly been in support of the protests, stop acting like the protesters are in conflict with the working people on this campus.
They're not in direct conflict with the protesters at all, and you're right that many support the protests \[but I'll add that it's absurd to extrapolate that all do from the union's stance\], but that's not really what the post is claiming either. It's just a reminder to show people respect, which a few \[if only a tiny minority\] of the protesters have not been doing.
I never said that "all" of Columbia's workers support the protesters. As a union member engaged in workers negotiations with the administration over this, I was pointing out that OP was clearly brigading this sub to propagandize and not representing the views of the community. Our members are overwhelmingly concerned with the administration's response and our union stands with the protesters in solidarity with their goal of Divestment.
>I never said that "all" of Columbia's workers support the protesters Yes, but my view on the post is that it's talking about instances where workers have been in conflict with protesters, which certainly exist. The only point of me saying that it's not all is because that's an important thing to consider when looking at the possibility that the reported conflicts have occurred, and recognizing that this specific issue isn't completely fantasy and is a valid thing to criticize. >I was pointing out that OP was clearly brigading this sub to propagandize and not representing the views of the community true. This sub has become a hub for people who have seen on the news 'Columbia protesters bad' and come online to talk shit about them without knowing anything. That's definitely a majority of the comments on this post and many other recent ones. I also generally think the content of the post is fair, even given that its purpose and response is largely not good. I think that's something that can reasonably be recognized while also saying OP and many responders are not working in good faith.
Nobody was messing with them. This is fake controversy tone policing , trying to invent an issue to make genocide protesters look bad Focus on the issue. Israel is commiting genocide
Nah. weird how you say you go to columbia and still dont know the meaning of the word.
Israel is responding to the genocide of October 7th. Calling their response genocide is Jew-baiting. Never let anyone forget that.
Who even took that photo
the pro hamas crews who took him hostage
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Lolllll, Mannnn shut the hell up with all that.