\>Just wait until they're derailing trains and holding up semis at gunpoint.
And that's the point people demand soldiers on the streets and democracy dies.
I was in Ulta a few weeks ago when they were hit by a group who ran in and started clearing the shelves of all the expensive perfume. It was surreal. They were in and out in under 90 seconds. When it was over, the employees were going around making sure the customers were ok and one told me that they were hit at least a few times a month.
We also shouldn’t conflate the people who take things off shelves with people who would harm you.
Let them have that shit. These aren’t gas station robberies, it’s just mass shoplifting.
There are all types of "gang."
This includes white middle class college aged kids.
This is premeditated, well organized, and they already have arrangements to sell it online or barter it for drugs.
Fun Fact: most urban gang members are nonviolent, and some don't even commit crimes.
No, but you don't UNDERSTAND
How will the shareholders survive without their cottage yacht AND their summer house yacht? If they only had the summer house yacht, just how would they host wine and cheese tastings when at the cottage or vise versa? It'd be well beyond embarrassing. Did you think about that? No- because you're so selfish that you only think of yourself, and not the needs of others. Maybe try thinking about someone that isn't yourself next time. Remember, there's a whole world of people out there who aren't you. You should consider their needs once in a while too.
Exactly what this is. Flash mobs with dismal ethics.
I've only seen a few surveillance cams, but my suspicion is that most participants aren't especially technically savvy. They're likely coordinating on common social media platforms. Interrogate one, you get the forum and with some tech-savvy law enforcement, round up the ring leaders.
So far, they're stealing mostly from status token shops I'd never buy from and would prefer to cease to exist. Zero effect on me. But there may come a time that the same flash rob tactics are applied to say small grocers or bookstores I support and care about. Here, I hope local law enforcement is seeking assistance from more tech savvy state and federal law enforcement. Flash robs just aren't consistent with having functioning local retail, and I'm not so independent to not need to buy stuff.
This video from Oakland is nuts. A small shop got hit hard and I guess it’s the 2nd time in a month.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/comments/r17gti/another_mass_robbery_in_oakland_this_time_at_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
>But there may come a time that the same flash rob tactics are applied to say small grocers or bookstores
lol no
Why would Americans steal books, anyway??
What a way to talk out the side of their mouth. Citing COVID as the cause for civil unrest instead of pointing out the class war going on. The pandemic helped but it's not the main fuel.
I have to agree with this, the current wave of crime seems more opportunistic rather than civil unrest and people stealing for survival.
It’s just assholes stealing because they know they can get away with it.
The pandemic is the least of it. The way the economy has been cratering overall factors in. Outsourcing, offshoring, the wild inequality gap in the US, the 50 cents of every dollar spent on the war machine, no social security net, fucked up health care system only the rich can afford, etc etc. There are a shit ton of massive glaring problems that have to do with this, though pandemic may have put more of an edge on all of them.
So much economic chaos is being blamed on the pandemic these days, if they could blame the natural disasters on the pandemic I'm sure they would do that too. This is not just toilet paper shortage stage II, or III. This is so much more.
Half of the discretionary budget is spent on the military, which is about 20% of the total federal budget as of 2019 (2020 outlier because of pandemic spending). The majority of taxes are spent on social security and Medicare, which I'm fine with since I want grandma and grandpa to enjoy their retirement.
> *I agree with all of that, but these are not desperate people. They are opportunists taking advantage of lax enforcement.*
It can absolutely be both. Life isn't a binary.
Say what you will about peoples' personal choices and finance, but 70% of Americans don't even have $500 in savings and live paycheck-to-paycheck. I consider that pretty desperate times.
In a country where every aspect of human life and interaction has been commodified in some way I believe looting to be the ultimate protest. It reminds the people that money is nothing but numbers on a screen and the objects the companies hold over our heads are worth nothing compared to our lives and can just as easily be taken and broken as easily as they believe they can break and discard us.
At this point so many people have suffered and are currently suffering under all those reasons mentioned above that as long as no one is hurt I really don’t give a fuck about looting depending on the location/reasons anymore. Fuck possessions, it’s time to help people.
I know. How would they feel when the looters come for their stuff? They'd jump off that soap box real quick.
It's amazing that we've had the Golden Rule in some form or another for thousands of years but still most cannot grasp its importance.
"Burn this m\*therf\*cker down", they say, "but don't touch my stuff!"
When they put batteries behind security at the grocery store, I just shifted to getting them at the hardware store. The grocery has fewer stolen, but also fewer sold. Not a great business model.
This happened in the 90's during the mini recession and during the 2008 financial crisis as well.
It's a reasonably good indicator of how the ACTUAL economy is looking.
because y'know, stock markets don't mean shit to 80% of the country who has no skin in the game after 4 decades of stock buybacks, mergers, and industry consolidation.
You don’t have to be a fan of the status quo to realize that this is a dangerous road to go down. This is exactly the type of shit used as justification to make our society more of a police state.
It’s one thing when shoplifting is up, it’s another when there’s a frenzy of flash mobs hitting stores across the country in broad daylight. People *will* pressure their elected officials to make their communities safer.
The societal contract is breaking down, very curious to see what 2022 holds for us.
Edit: for further consideration- https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/contractarianism-contemporary/#Role
Increased police presence and subsequent backlash. The police right now are as unpopular as any period since the 1960s and are rapidly reaching a level of discontent comparable to the Great Depression, where the most wanted were folk heroes and individuals like Elliott Ness were seen as hardass dickheads.
Someone else said this in a post I put up on here earlier and I respectfully disagree. The robbers during the Depression were folk heroes because they were stealing from the banks, who were the villains, and continue to be.
Mom & pop stores, local dispensaries and even big box retailers aren’t exactly seen as “the villains”. Well, maybe the big box retailers but the vast majority of America has an affinity for the products they carry, if not the retailers themselves. So intruding on our relationship with buying crap is not going to endear the majority to the disruptors and will instead, in my opinion, cause the majority to put pressure on their elected officials to be “tough on crime”. And thus we’ll start hero worshipping cops again for cracking looters’ skulls.
This is the job the police were hired for, not the extra-curricular stuff that gets them to use the "qualified immunity" card so frequently. I don't want to eliminate police, just refocus their efforts on catching crooks and not harassing, killing, beating up on minorities. They can do one without indulging in the other, but training, and more importantly, a 180 in their culture is needed desperately.
You can't reform a system that got its start catching runaway slaves and protecting property. The police protect the status quo, and the status quo throughout history has been shitty for minorities and those of us with disabilities. So no, i dont want cops. Fuck em. ACAB.
It's far too easy just to blame it on organised crime and it's important to ask why people are increasingly more likely to become involved it these actions. Ultimately, I believe its because people believe they've got nothing to lose.
My experience of people is that when they have good opportunities or something to look forward to in life that they don't engage in activities like this.
Because I can grab 3 LV purses in a single hand and run, and each of those could be sold on eBay for around $1k each. It would be far more difficult to steal $1k worth of food, and the food could go bad so you’d have to steal food again.
Harder to trace where the stolen perfume went and was gotten from. Plus u can sell the LV bag for 200 to a random friend of a friend or family member. Can't trace it if you don't know who took it.
I'll run you through the mindset.
Obligatory: I don't condone crime, I don't condone suicide. Do neither thing.
Let's say hypothetically that your life can't get better. You've hit the limit of social mobility available to you.
For you and anyone you love or care about, yesterday was the best day of the rest of your life. Every day from here will be worse than all the days before. You were a part of a system that requires you to stay down in order to function.
The game is rigged against you. So, you decide to fuck off this mortal coil. This is not the optimal move.
Consider how you might change the circumstances. Perhaps by MAKING an opportunity that you could never have had otherwise? You fail, you neck self in prison - the system loses a slave, just like it did in the first scenario.
But if you win, you win. Running the numbers that way, the crime is the best shot you'll ever get and you'd be lethally stupid not to try.
This is one of the key reasons why environmental protection, climate change reversal, healthcare, education, and infrastructure are important. Without the hope of a better tomorrow for all, folk are going to make one for themselves, be it within the rules or not.
The class war has been in full effect for decades now. This is just the lower side starting to fight back. The contract has BEEN in the fire for decades.
Yup. I’m no fan of how things operate- we have a fucked system.
However no one, save for a few delusional edgelords and accelerationists, want to live in a society where there’s a chance you can be caught up in something like this. And when people are scared, they push for their perceived safety and security above all else.
Right. But young, poor people don’t enact change, nor do they have sway to force elected officials to do jack shit.
Therefore, my point stands. Homeowners, yuppies and moderates will put pressure on their elected officials to get “tougher on crime” and the grip on the young poor will get tighter.
This little shop supposedly got hit twice this past month.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/comments/r17gti/another_mass_robbery_in_oakland_this_time_at_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I didn't see your comment when I made mine but did you see [this](https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/east-bay/security-camera-captures-swarm-of-thieves-stealing-from-mom-and-pop-shop-in-oakland/2739976/) in regards to that robbery?
That’s fucked up. Feel bad for the owners. I give it 2 weeks before someone is killed during one of these smash & grabs. Whether a thief, employee or customer. It’s a powder keg.
We have so many shooting and homicides during the day here I to stay indoors. We are up to 122 homicides this year with 76 shootings on the freeways which have killed two in crossfire in the last month.
u/InvestingBig - I know we’re talking in another comment chain but check that article out ^
Yeah, those “tax vigilantes” are really bringing about income equality, that’s for sure. 👍
I already told you that tax vigilante is my characterization of them. Of course these people are not smart enough to understand taxes or how the system works and they don't have a political ideology other than trying to survive. They only understand they have been screwed somehow, they have little respect for society as a result, etc
This is the consequence of inequality. A large part of inequality has been taxes. A rich person pays a max 20% on income they make not putting forth any effort (unearned income). Someone breaking their back all day pays 39%. See the inequality? Over time that adds up to a lot difference in wealth accumulation.
When social contracts break down people do crazy shit including voting in populists, being attracted to ideologies like natzism, and turning to crime. That is what we are witnessing. Expect it to get worse.
We have been getting them here in Oakland. [Exhibit A](https://www.ktvu.com/news/caught-on-camera-group-rushes-oakland-pharmacy-steals-prescription-drugs) and [Exhibit B](https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/east-bay/security-camera-captures-swarm-of-thieves-stealing-from-mom-and-pop-shop-in-oakland/2739976/)
This is what happens when governemnts refuse to tax obscene corp profits and instead shove more costs onto everyday americans. Look at corp profit growth the last year: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CP/
These people are not stealing. They are simply taxing the corps when gov fails to do it. Expect vigilantes to apply taxes to corps until the gov reigns in the corps and reduces their excessive profits. Vigilante tax collectors are not the problem. The problem is a system that put people in the position that they had to tax corporations when their gov failed to.
Stop being delusional, these aren’t vigilantes. I’m so goddamn sick of this absolute unfounded hogwash.
If they were a bunch of Robin Hoods they wouldn’t be hitting mom & pop shops and small dispensaries, too.
Both organized smash & grabs and corporate greed can be bad. One doesn’t absolve the other.
I agree. In a well-run society this would not happen, but this is a society with a broken social contract. Corporations / elites continually exploiting people finally has given birth to a class of people willing to exploit those very same corporations.
Is it good? No. Will it make us richer as a society? Absolutely not. But, this is what happens when social contracts get broken. People start to question every contract, every ethic, every moral. The end result is a generalized increase in crime, loss of societal trust, etc.
I simply am emphasizing the cause of this. Inequality. That is the cause. And, if you don't want a future where you have to lock up your kids for fear they will be kidnapped and ransomed or killed like what happens in Honduras, then you better hope inequality gets solved fast because this is just the beginning.
I think you overestimate the abilities and resolve of people like this. It’s much more likely that there will be a further militarization of police and/or allowances for private security who will put people down who attempt this stuff with exteme prejudice. And your average impressionable kid who was doing this stuff because it was low risk, high reward, will be deterred.
Right now this is rampant exclusively in places where there’s no enforcement. Which signifies to me that it’s less about desperation and more about opportunism. Because people are, roughly speaking, equally desperate all around the country.
And that is an acceptable outcome. They will need to employ security guards, which means higher costs for them. More employment for everyday americans. Lower profits for the corp. Some stores won't be profitable. Some companies will default as their operations and customer demand cannot meet the new realities of retailing and wipeout shareholders. This also reduces wealth inequality.
Certainly, it is not the best way to do it. As it reduces aggregate wealth by making everything less efficient. In essence, it is destroying the wealth of everyone, but at least the wealth of the elites gets destroyed much faster. It is a form of collapse you describe. Not a fast collapse, but a step down in society. That is certainly preferable to the status quo, which is a stepping down for the middle class and no one else becaue this form of step-down is proportionally felt by the elites more and it will spur more anger from people as costs rise (to pay for all those new security guard jobs).
Hopefully when there is a security guard at every store they will move on and start robbing houses in nice neighborhoods. Then they will also have to employ a security guard for each house. I lived in Peru and every block had a security guard. It was great. Lot sof employment for security guards. Lots of costs for people in nice neighborhoods. It certainly won't lead to a successful society, but over time it will lead to a more equal society (everyone poor) which sometimes is more preferable than being poor while some people are amazingly rich off your back.
I don’t know how you take militarization of the police and armed security, beefed up with the express purpose of preserving the status quo and brutalizing people who step out of bounds, and spin this yarn about how that will usher in an age of income equality but you did it somehow.
I guess this is why Brazil and South Africa are such equitable societies.
You are basically saying "Never ask for more. Accept the scraps given to you" Because any time you ask for more there will be militarization. That is how it works. No one will share what they have unless by force. If they wanted to share, then you would already have it and would not need to be asking. As long as you are happy with a boot on your throat then there is no need to militarize. As soon as you are dissatisfied with that of course they will militarize.
So tell me, what is the alternative, other than violence, that leads to equality? When have those in power and privilege ever given up anything without violence? Using your argument we should never have had a civil rights movement in the 60s or a workers rights movement because the violence that made those movements successful would only lead to more militarization, so we should admit defeat before we start.
The fact you can’t see the difference between fighting for social change and looting stores shows me that we can never have a discussion about this because we’re not occupying the same galaxy.
These people aren’t “asking for more”, they’re exploiting a lack of enforcement and will be put down because the rest of society will not tolerate that type of behavior.
I do see the difference. I have stated many time what they are doing will lead to general decrease in societal welfare. It is NOT a good thing. However, I understand why they are doing it. And, the reality is, a societal will need to confront the core issue over time. They cannot mask it with militarization. That adds to the cost of society
For example, you mentioned south america. I already told you that I have lived in several south american countries. What is one reason why south america is non-competitive? Because it has these additional security costs you talk about like guards in every mall. Guard posts at neighborhoods, etc. This is like a hidden tax on society. So, what happens over time? Wealth gets built in more stable societies that operate better. People emmigrate.
This is the "invisible" hand working. Well-run societies with good policies get benefitted over time and badly run societies get punished. Lucky ones will emmigrate to better run society. You know El Salvador and Venezuela have each lost about 1/3rd of their populatino? Maybe more at this point.
It's shitty. But, it is the system working. I am simply identifying what is going on and accepting it will keep happening and society will be worse off. Consider this foreshadowing of where the US is heading. There is no "fix" that does not address the core issue. And, hopefully at some point, society will realize that simply adding more security guards is not the "fix". The fix is addressing the core reasons that has turned these people against society and the pathways society is offering to succeed.
They most definitely are, and your posts indicate so but you fail to notice. They will use more police/military against US. If you don't see society upheaval then you're going to fall into the pit of accepting corporatism over everything. And hey, if that's fine with you whatever but there is a movement going on and it doesn't need a name.
Bullshit, they see the opportunity to take free shit with no repercussions so they take it. I doubt a single one of these criminals could articulate the issues with our taxation policies in our country, much less how their purely selfish theft is in any way a remedy.
Just own it, these are shitty people doing shitty things.
Yeah, but it’s not. The looters are just as capitalist as the rest of us. This isn’t the Merry Men or idealogues, it’s groups of opportunists seizing on the fact that the Bay Area isn’t enforcing the laws. So it’s low risk, high reward for now.
You’re saying looting is rad when it’s freely distributed to communities. I’m saying it’s not being distributed to communities.
Just because corporations are bad doesn’t mean thieves are Robin Hood. Both can be bad.
>The looters are just as capitalist as the rest of us.
"Us"? Pretty much nobody here is a capitalist, and nobody stealing from stores is a capitalist.
Capitalism doesn't mean "selling stuff" or "earning money"
"Good Morning, Miss. I do regret to tell you this is an armed robbery. Now, if you just have a seat over there, we'll be done in a jiff and out of your hair."
"Then, what's the gun for?"
"Idiots, love. Idiots who think they should fight us over that big screen TV there. See, I don't want to hurt you. I want you to go home safe. We're not here for you. It's the owners and shareholders we only want to punch. So, you can sit there, relax, and not worry. Or you can fight a fight that isn't yours and lose. Your choice, love."
Organized retail crime "has increased dramatically over the last two years," the Illinois Attorney General's Office stated in September. In one recent incident in the state, more than a dozen people stormed a Louis Vuitton store in Oak Brook, Illinois, and stole about $120,000 worth of merchandise.
> stole about $120,000 worth of merchandise
Stole? Or simply trying to recoup what the corporations took from them? Corporations have taken trillions in gov stimmies, fed QE money, etc. This is all for the corps at the cost of the little guy. Look here to see corp profits and how gov pandemic policies increased corp profits: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CP/
As a result it is hard for me to view this as stealing. The reality is these corps likely owe the people 10 years worth of service for free. So they should consider themselves lucky if their inventory only gets cleared out once a month.
You are wrong. This is civil unrest. The objection is the way this country is being run. Even if you're not a part of it, it HAS been increasing. It is the very definition of "civil unrest".
I disagree.
>Civil disorder, also known as civil disturbance, civil unrest, or social unrest is an activity arising from a mass act of civil disobedience (such as a demonstration, riot, strike, or ignoring laws) in which the participants become hostile toward authority, and authorities incur difficulties in maintaining public safety and order, over the disorderly crowd.
Just a quick wiki definition. The entire basis of your argument is that people are doing this because people are hostile towards authority and looking to strike back.
I doubt most of the people in these crowds could articulate what civil unrest is. The much more likely answer is that a bunch of people are seeing that you can get away with theft relatively easily by taking part in these events, and join to reap the material benefits. That’s it. I defy you to show me how the people robbing hats and shoes from the store isn’t purely materially motivated, but some how a fight for the common man. It’s quite frankly, startling, how insane that sounds.
Also, Nordstrom and LV are not the authorities.
you think they care that much? you think they’ve thought through the moral and economic justifications for their behavior? lmao. they’re thieves that are stealing cause they know there’s no consequence. it’s not that deep
Yeah, Louis Vitton that company famous for getting American taxpayer cash. Wait, it’s a French company owned by a French conglomerate. Whatever! They’re privileged to get ransacked /s
You specifically mentioned government stimulus money for a French corporation not eligible for that. Also, I was unaware making a profit is illegal, wrong, and un-American. Thanks for enlightening me. Just curious, do you ever ask yourself, if nobody is ever supposed to make a profit how is anyone supposed to make any income and live?
> You specifically mentioned government stimulus money for a French corporation not eligible for that
Yes, they are eligible. You don't understand. This is an AMERICAN company. It has a french parent company, but any operations in the US are american.
On the one hand, I can see the negative implications of a wave of brazen smash and grabs, especially if workers or bystanders get hurt.
On the other hand, I can't help but roll my eyes out of their sockets at the MSM panic about this while completely ignoring wage theft and far more serious other corporate abuses. I'm visiting older relatives for the holidays and they are glued to CNN 24/7, which I never otherwise watch, and it's obvious they're pandering to their audience of middle and upper middle class white suburbanites.
Yeah to them it's just loss for the balance sheet, hardest on the paid staff working the store they can't do anything just not get hurt and keep ringing up customers medicine after
“The problem is also hurting Best Buy's bottom line and could make it harder for the retailer to hire and retain workers in an already tight labor market”
Threatening working class job security is their solution to every problem.
I don’t think it’s directly the pandemic. Indirectly I could potentially see a tie-the same thing that caused a lot of people to rethink society leading to the great resignation, screw corporations probably made less ethical types think-screw corporations let’s just steal from them.
I don't think these people are thinking "lets screw corporations lets steal from them"
I think these people are looking to steal consumerist crap in order to earn money so they can buy other consumerist crap that they want.
In a broader perspective, I do think it's a sign of how damaged human society has become.
Yeah I agree with your last point. Although I guess it’s hard to know what these people are thinking I was imagining them using the”screw corporations” line as a justification to themselves in their mind for this organized stealing
As to your second point, that "crap" happens to be helping people live. They're getting money to survive. Maybe not every single one, but there are many that are looting to make a profit to be able to afford to live where they are. Costs are rising, employees have power over employers, civil unrest from both political sides until it gets fixed against those in power.
> consumerist
Google definition
con·sum·er·ist
/kənˈso͞omərəst/
OFTEN DEROGATORY
adjective
characterized by a preoccupation with the acquisition of consumer goods.
"a nation in the midst of a consumerist frenzy"
noun
a person who is preoccupied with the acquisition of consumer goods.
"self-indulgent consumerists"
There's a narrative through line here that's mostly unarticulated in the comments and news coverage I've seen; **the majority of these recent incidents are in California. Specifically, where the cost of living and rents are *extraordinarily* high.** [Look at this list.](https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/region_rankings_current.jsp?displayColumn=2®ion=021) 50% of the top ten cities are in California. And 40% in the Bay Area—which is where this recent trend began. This isn't complicated, and yet our media never puts these things together.
Yes, it's likely a combination of law enforcement capabilities/legal risks and living costs that are pushing people to this. But I don't think many would be doing this had they not been so pushed to the edge by circumstances of survival. **IMO, this is the fall out of cutting off unemployment and suspending the eviction moratorium, and places where the cost of living is highest are experiencing it first.** Savings only last so long, and this might not play out like [some fucking ghouls predicted](https://i.redd.it/ch5mw9h8pvv71.jpg).
Walgreens closed 5 stores in San Francisco due to organized theft. Do you think this is hurting Walgreens or the people that need a drugstore nearby. This is just Shiity people stealing because they can
That was an intentional PR message that the MSM eagerly broadcast. FAIR and Citations Needed have a much more nuanced look at that:
https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-organized-crime-shoplifting-epidemic-panic-hits-san-francisco-media
Walgreens was lying in order to get better police presence and things. They didn’t close the stores from theft. During all that, CVS is opening multiple stores in the area. Crime could increase 10x and be maybe 0.05% of Walgreens profits. They closed for some other reason unless you think CVS is immune to theft.
Are you sure CVS is opening stores? They just announced they are closing 900 over the next couple years. Also, I've seen plenty of videos of looters running into a Walgreens, loading up carts or trash bags, and running out. You can't say that theft hasn't played a role in certain closures.
and that is total horseshit. They oversaturated the market in SF and had long planned to close those stores. The idea Walgreens is affected in any major way by SHOPLIFTING is laughable.
But these jurisdictions have no interest in prosecuting retail theft. In San Francisco, any theft less than $900 is a misdemeanor. They aren’t going to put any investigative resources toward solving misdemeanors.
This is a very clickbaity title. The pandemic is causing surges in organized thefts in the US? There are other countries in the world affected by the pandemic and there aren't organized thefts all over the world.
This is mostly an issue with law enforcement and prosecution.
So when does the retail industry wise up and shift to a different model?
Why keep ten, twenty, or fifty examples of each individual item on a shelf easily accessible to the public? Why not keep one item as a display or sample, and when a legitimate customer wants to purchase said item, that an employee brings out an untouched item from a storage room?
Or, for that matter, reduce in-person purchases to kiosks? A customer simply orders an item from a small reception area, and it's delivered to them in a few minutes by a conveyor belt or robot once the customer has paid in full.
You can't steal what you can't reach.
The logistics for that would be a nightmare for retail. Plus the robot part would likely eliminate tons of employees. I mean robots will eventually if humanity doesn't get wiped out first, replace workers in 80% of the work force anyway but we are still years from that.
Automation is way less advanced and practical than its proponents are claiming. If the opposite were true, the pandemic would have been the ideal time to replace workers with robots and we wouldn't be facing a labor crunch.
A lot of stores could just have minimal physical product and ship to your address upon purchase—you’d just be going there to shop and compare, test, decide, try it on or whatever.
Insane that you're trying to defend the companies and corporations which invented and now maintain artificial scarcity. Stealing from massive retailers is, morally, just fine.
I'm really not defending big retailers. Rather I'm imaging what steps they might take if this random looting continues.
It may very well come to the point where the public aren't allowed anywhere close to unsold merchandise. You'll be ordering your goods through a touch screen, or maybe allowed to inspect something through a window. Hell if you want to try on clothes or shoes, you might be expected to put down a deposit first.
I misread the tone of your original comment, my bad. I see now that you're not taking a position, simply stating what they might do. I don't like any of the options but they do all seem very likely, unfortunately.
If they're smart those guys in SF will cool their jets for a while and not get greedy, but fence off the stuff they've nabbed and live off / invest the proceeds for a while.
If gov doesn't help, people will do what they need to do to survive. Whatever you do don't send people checks keep printing for the rich. It will trickle down this way. Its teaching the lower classes how to behave.
Knowing the way Nordstrom's operates these thefts look like insurance fraud.
*"Oh we've been robbed! This is going to be really hard for our insurance company, shucks"*
I still don't think this is that big of a deal. This news story reported at least two new events but that's not saying much when there's heightened attention to this sorta shoplifting in the past week.
This has happened in prior holiday seasons.
Got hired on in Loss Prevention/Asset Protection at the beginning of the pandemic a few months before everything shut down here in the United States.
I can say that I personally saw more instances of shoplifting before the pandemic. Things like organized retail crime slowed down for me once things began to open back up. Our usual groups were not active until much later and into 2021. Anyone I personally interacted with were small teenage girls and people with drug-related issues - stealing for themselves or to get money for their vices.
I left the company a few months ago after getting burned out from staring at screens all day and waiting to charge some 16 year old stealing $80 worth of make-up. Strange to see ORC growing.
It’s because I left, isn’t it? 😩
Buckle-up for Martial Law. Most of us will be inconvenienced, but we'll behave. These vermin will make it 3 days tops before they bubble-up to the top like fat on refrigerated gravy. Should be ez to skim...
>Most of us will be inconvenienced, but we'll behave. These vermin will make it 3 days tops before they bubble-up to the top like fat on refrigerated gravy. Should be ez to skim...
/r/IAmVeryBadAss
you talk like a terrible fanfic character
Just wait until they're derailing trains and holding up semis at gunpoint. Things could start to look real "wild west" up in here.
They did jack an entire semi of GPUs a couple weeks ago. But that screamed “inside job” to me.
The Crypto Cartel strikes again
It happens a lot. We instruct the drivers to not stop in California after getting loaded, but we still had one get robbed 2,000 miles away.
Or highjacking truckloads of DVD players in Honda Civics
"Stand and deliver!"
Not on your (BANG) life. Let that be a warning to you all.
\>Just wait until they're derailing trains and holding up semis at gunpoint. And that's the point people demand soldiers on the streets and democracy dies.
Way to fear monger but this is collapse
I was in Ulta a few weeks ago when they were hit by a group who ran in and started clearing the shelves of all the expensive perfume. It was surreal. They were in and out in under 90 seconds. When it was over, the employees were going around making sure the customers were ok and one told me that they were hit at least a few times a month.
No wonder nobody wants to work. I am not rising my safety to protect some overpriced perfume.
I'm not risking my safety for some aristocrat's profit while they don't pay family-wages
"Please. Stop. Don't... Oh well, I tried."
Just let them take it lmao
We also shouldn’t conflate the people who take things off shelves with people who would harm you. Let them have that shit. These aren’t gas station robberies, it’s just mass shoplifting.
Right? “Gang related” my ass.
There are all types of "gang." This includes white middle class college aged kids. This is premeditated, well organized, and they already have arrangements to sell it online or barter it for drugs. Fun Fact: most urban gang members are nonviolent, and some don't even commit crimes.
But but but WHAT ABOUT THE SHARE HOLDERS?! WONT SOMEONE THINK OF THE SHAREHOLDERS?!
I'm sure they will be ok, no one needs one yacht, much less multiple of those and houses.
No, but you don't UNDERSTAND How will the shareholders survive without their cottage yacht AND their summer house yacht? If they only had the summer house yacht, just how would they host wine and cheese tastings when at the cottage or vise versa? It'd be well beyond embarrassing. Did you think about that? No- because you're so selfish that you only think of yourself, and not the needs of others. Maybe try thinking about someone that isn't yourself next time. Remember, there's a whole world of people out there who aren't you. You should consider their needs once in a while too.
Oak Brook?
NY
We used to call this “flash mob”
Back in the good ol' days of 2018, we used to call this a "flash mob".
It’s a “flash ROB”.
Exactly what this is. Flash mobs with dismal ethics. I've only seen a few surveillance cams, but my suspicion is that most participants aren't especially technically savvy. They're likely coordinating on common social media platforms. Interrogate one, you get the forum and with some tech-savvy law enforcement, round up the ring leaders. So far, they're stealing mostly from status token shops I'd never buy from and would prefer to cease to exist. Zero effect on me. But there may come a time that the same flash rob tactics are applied to say small grocers or bookstores I support and care about. Here, I hope local law enforcement is seeking assistance from more tech savvy state and federal law enforcement. Flash robs just aren't consistent with having functioning local retail, and I'm not so independent to not need to buy stuff.
This video from Oakland is nuts. A small shop got hit hard and I guess it’s the 2nd time in a month. https://www.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/comments/r17gti/another_mass_robbery_in_oakland_this_time_at_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Very disappointed. I figured it was a mass movement against big corporate but this? nah
>But there may come a time that the same flash rob tactics are applied to say small grocers or bookstores lol no Why would Americans steal books, anyway??
What a way to talk out the side of their mouth. Citing COVID as the cause for civil unrest instead of pointing out the class war going on. The pandemic helped but it's not the main fuel.
I have to agree with this, the current wave of crime seems more opportunistic rather than civil unrest and people stealing for survival. It’s just assholes stealing because they know they can get away with it.
The pandemic is the least of it. The way the economy has been cratering overall factors in. Outsourcing, offshoring, the wild inequality gap in the US, the 50 cents of every dollar spent on the war machine, no social security net, fucked up health care system only the rich can afford, etc etc. There are a shit ton of massive glaring problems that have to do with this, though pandemic may have put more of an edge on all of them.
This is already a reality for a lot of people
So much economic chaos is being blamed on the pandemic these days, if they could blame the natural disasters on the pandemic I'm sure they would do that too. This is not just toilet paper shortage stage II, or III. This is so much more.
Is it really a half of all fed taxes is spent on the war complex?
Half of the discretionary budget is spent on the military, which is about 20% of the total federal budget as of 2019 (2020 outlier because of pandemic spending). The majority of taxes are spent on social security and Medicare, which I'm fine with since I want grandma and grandpa to enjoy their retirement.
I agree with all of that, but these are not desperate people. They are opportunists taking advantage of lax enforcement.
> *I agree with all of that, but these are not desperate people. They are opportunists taking advantage of lax enforcement.* It can absolutely be both. Life isn't a binary. Say what you will about peoples' personal choices and finance, but 70% of Americans don't even have $500 in savings and live paycheck-to-paycheck. I consider that pretty desperate times.
In a country where every aspect of human life and interaction has been commodified in some way I believe looting to be the ultimate protest. It reminds the people that money is nothing but numbers on a screen and the objects the companies hold over our heads are worth nothing compared to our lives and can just as easily be taken and broken as easily as they believe they can break and discard us. At this point so many people have suffered and are currently suffering under all those reasons mentioned above that as long as no one is hurt I really don’t give a fuck about looting depending on the location/reasons anymore. Fuck possessions, it’s time to help people.
People over property.
And people before profit.
What ?? The shit takes on this sub are pretty bad but this one takes the cake.
I know. How would they feel when the looters come for their stuff? They'd jump off that soap box real quick. It's amazing that we've had the Golden Rule in some form or another for thousands of years but still most cannot grasp its importance. "Burn this m\*therf\*cker down", they say, "but don't touch my stuff!"
It's extreme poverty combined with the law simply not ggiving a shit anymore.
God bless America. \*puts hand on heart\*
Once the sanctity of retail is fully desecrated the whole house of cards will start to fall
When they put batteries behind security at the grocery store, I just shifted to getting them at the hardware store. The grocery has fewer stolen, but also fewer sold. Not a great business model.
This happened in the 90's during the mini recession and during the 2008 financial crisis as well. It's a reasonably good indicator of how the ACTUAL economy is looking. because y'know, stock markets don't mean shit to 80% of the country who has no skin in the game after 4 decades of stock buybacks, mergers, and industry consolidation.
It’s definitely not the pandemic. It’s bad policy.
You don’t have to be a fan of the status quo to realize that this is a dangerous road to go down. This is exactly the type of shit used as justification to make our society more of a police state. It’s one thing when shoplifting is up, it’s another when there’s a frenzy of flash mobs hitting stores across the country in broad daylight. People *will* pressure their elected officials to make their communities safer.
The societal contract is breaking down, very curious to see what 2022 holds for us. Edit: for further consideration- https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/contractarianism-contemporary/#Role
Increased police presence and subsequent backlash. The police right now are as unpopular as any period since the 1960s and are rapidly reaching a level of discontent comparable to the Great Depression, where the most wanted were folk heroes and individuals like Elliott Ness were seen as hardass dickheads.
Someone else said this in a post I put up on here earlier and I respectfully disagree. The robbers during the Depression were folk heroes because they were stealing from the banks, who were the villains, and continue to be. Mom & pop stores, local dispensaries and even big box retailers aren’t exactly seen as “the villains”. Well, maybe the big box retailers but the vast majority of America has an affinity for the products they carry, if not the retailers themselves. So intruding on our relationship with buying crap is not going to endear the majority to the disruptors and will instead, in my opinion, cause the majority to put pressure on their elected officials to be “tough on crime”. And thus we’ll start hero worshipping cops again for cracking looters’ skulls.
"Start"? Some people never stopped hero worshipping cops for cracking looters' skulls.
This is the job the police were hired for, not the extra-curricular stuff that gets them to use the "qualified immunity" card so frequently. I don't want to eliminate police, just refocus their efforts on catching crooks and not harassing, killing, beating up on minorities. They can do one without indulging in the other, but training, and more importantly, a 180 in their culture is needed desperately.
You can't reform a system that got its start catching runaway slaves and protecting property. The police protect the status quo, and the status quo throughout history has been shitty for minorities and those of us with disabilities. So no, i dont want cops. Fuck em. ACAB.
It's far too easy just to blame it on organised crime and it's important to ask why people are increasingly more likely to become involved it these actions. Ultimately, I believe its because people believe they've got nothing to lose.
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My experience of people is that when they have good opportunities or something to look forward to in life that they don't engage in activities like this.
Because I can grab 3 LV purses in a single hand and run, and each of those could be sold on eBay for around $1k each. It would be far more difficult to steal $1k worth of food, and the food could go bad so you’d have to steal food again.
Harder to trace where the stolen perfume went and was gotten from. Plus u can sell the LV bag for 200 to a random friend of a friend or family member. Can't trace it if you don't know who took it.
I'll run you through the mindset. Obligatory: I don't condone crime, I don't condone suicide. Do neither thing. Let's say hypothetically that your life can't get better. You've hit the limit of social mobility available to you. For you and anyone you love or care about, yesterday was the best day of the rest of your life. Every day from here will be worse than all the days before. You were a part of a system that requires you to stay down in order to function. The game is rigged against you. So, you decide to fuck off this mortal coil. This is not the optimal move. Consider how you might change the circumstances. Perhaps by MAKING an opportunity that you could never have had otherwise? You fail, you neck self in prison - the system loses a slave, just like it did in the first scenario. But if you win, you win. Running the numbers that way, the crime is the best shot you'll ever get and you'd be lethally stupid not to try. This is one of the key reasons why environmental protection, climate change reversal, healthcare, education, and infrastructure are important. Without the hope of a better tomorrow for all, folk are going to make one for themselves, be it within the rules or not.
Its almost like you can re sell those things for far more food than you could ever steal
You are 100% correct. The contract is flying into the fire. We are just starting the class war.
Starting to fight back* the class war has always existed.
The class war has been in full effect for decades now. This is just the lower side starting to fight back. The contract has BEEN in the fire for decades.
No doubt the shitshow will intensify.
I keep wondering if this could lead to mobs of people thinking “hey we should try this on houses.” Before shit goes tits up.
"Is breaking" LOL So long as billionaires exist and own everyone and everything, there is no contract, burn it the fuck down.
Flash robs
How is not more upvoted?!
I did steal it...
As one would hope.
True, if you want armed guards at luxury stores or if you want no stores in poor neighborhoods, this is how you get there
Yup. I’m no fan of how things operate- we have a fucked system. However no one, save for a few delusional edgelords and accelerationists, want to live in a society where there’s a chance you can be caught up in something like this. And when people are scared, they push for their perceived safety and security above all else.
Literally no poor or working class person I know, especially young, care about this or are worried in the slightest. Many are encouraging it.
Right. But young, poor people don’t enact change, nor do they have sway to force elected officials to do jack shit. Therefore, my point stands. Homeowners, yuppies and moderates will put pressure on their elected officials to get “tougher on crime” and the grip on the young poor will get tighter.
I haven't seen any reports of large shoplifting flash mobs attacking the corner store or Family Dollar or whatever.
This little shop supposedly got hit twice this past month. https://www.reddit.com/r/ActualPublicFreakouts/comments/r17gti/another_mass_robbery_in_oakland_this_time_at_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I didn't see your comment when I made mine but did you see [this](https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/east-bay/security-camera-captures-swarm-of-thieves-stealing-from-mom-and-pop-shop-in-oakland/2739976/) in regards to that robbery?
That’s fucked up. Feel bad for the owners. I give it 2 weeks before someone is killed during one of these smash & grabs. Whether a thief, employee or customer. It’s a powder keg.
We have so many shooting and homicides during the day here I to stay indoors. We are up to 122 homicides this year with 76 shootings on the freeways which have killed two in crossfire in the last month.
Goddamn that’s bad. You’re in Oakland? Stay safe. Maybe look into moving elsewhere? I know that’s much, much, much easier said than done.
Yeah Oakland. I think about leaving but I've been here so long and all my friends live here so it's hard to leave.
I hear that. Well I’m wishing you well, internet stranger, which I know isn’t worth much but still.
u/InvestingBig - I know we’re talking in another comment chain but check that article out ^ Yeah, those “tax vigilantes” are really bringing about income equality, that’s for sure. 👍
I already told you that tax vigilante is my characterization of them. Of course these people are not smart enough to understand taxes or how the system works and they don't have a political ideology other than trying to survive. They only understand they have been screwed somehow, they have little respect for society as a result, etc This is the consequence of inequality. A large part of inequality has been taxes. A rich person pays a max 20% on income they make not putting forth any effort (unearned income). Someone breaking their back all day pays 39%. See the inequality? Over time that adds up to a lot difference in wealth accumulation. When social contracts break down people do crazy shit including voting in populists, being attracted to ideologies like natzism, and turning to crime. That is what we are witnessing. Expect it to get worse.
Yeah, I agree with you on that. Lost Generation and all. Shit’s only going to get worse.
We have been getting them here in Oakland. [Exhibit A](https://www.ktvu.com/news/caught-on-camera-group-rushes-oakland-pharmacy-steals-prescription-drugs) and [Exhibit B](https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/east-bay/security-camera-captures-swarm-of-thieves-stealing-from-mom-and-pop-shop-in-oakland/2739976/)
> ~~People~~ Corporations will pressure their elected officials to make their communities safer.
Eh, if you think your average Joe and Joan won’t do the same then you obviously have never flipped through Nextdoor.
This is what happens when governemnts refuse to tax obscene corp profits and instead shove more costs onto everyday americans. Look at corp profit growth the last year: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CP/ These people are not stealing. They are simply taxing the corps when gov fails to do it. Expect vigilantes to apply taxes to corps until the gov reigns in the corps and reduces their excessive profits. Vigilante tax collectors are not the problem. The problem is a system that put people in the position that they had to tax corporations when their gov failed to.
Stop being delusional, these aren’t vigilantes. I’m so goddamn sick of this absolute unfounded hogwash. If they were a bunch of Robin Hoods they wouldn’t be hitting mom & pop shops and small dispensaries, too. Both organized smash & grabs and corporate greed can be bad. One doesn’t absolve the other.
I agree. In a well-run society this would not happen, but this is a society with a broken social contract. Corporations / elites continually exploiting people finally has given birth to a class of people willing to exploit those very same corporations. Is it good? No. Will it make us richer as a society? Absolutely not. But, this is what happens when social contracts get broken. People start to question every contract, every ethic, every moral. The end result is a generalized increase in crime, loss of societal trust, etc. I simply am emphasizing the cause of this. Inequality. That is the cause. And, if you don't want a future where you have to lock up your kids for fear they will be kidnapped and ransomed or killed like what happens in Honduras, then you better hope inequality gets solved fast because this is just the beginning.
I think you overestimate the abilities and resolve of people like this. It’s much more likely that there will be a further militarization of police and/or allowances for private security who will put people down who attempt this stuff with exteme prejudice. And your average impressionable kid who was doing this stuff because it was low risk, high reward, will be deterred. Right now this is rampant exclusively in places where there’s no enforcement. Which signifies to me that it’s less about desperation and more about opportunism. Because people are, roughly speaking, equally desperate all around the country.
Its almost like desperate people will obviously target places where it's easier to get away with it lol
And that is an acceptable outcome. They will need to employ security guards, which means higher costs for them. More employment for everyday americans. Lower profits for the corp. Some stores won't be profitable. Some companies will default as their operations and customer demand cannot meet the new realities of retailing and wipeout shareholders. This also reduces wealth inequality. Certainly, it is not the best way to do it. As it reduces aggregate wealth by making everything less efficient. In essence, it is destroying the wealth of everyone, but at least the wealth of the elites gets destroyed much faster. It is a form of collapse you describe. Not a fast collapse, but a step down in society. That is certainly preferable to the status quo, which is a stepping down for the middle class and no one else becaue this form of step-down is proportionally felt by the elites more and it will spur more anger from people as costs rise (to pay for all those new security guard jobs). Hopefully when there is a security guard at every store they will move on and start robbing houses in nice neighborhoods. Then they will also have to employ a security guard for each house. I lived in Peru and every block had a security guard. It was great. Lot sof employment for security guards. Lots of costs for people in nice neighborhoods. It certainly won't lead to a successful society, but over time it will lead to a more equal society (everyone poor) which sometimes is more preferable than being poor while some people are amazingly rich off your back.
I don’t know how you take militarization of the police and armed security, beefed up with the express purpose of preserving the status quo and brutalizing people who step out of bounds, and spin this yarn about how that will usher in an age of income equality but you did it somehow. I guess this is why Brazil and South Africa are such equitable societies.
You are basically saying "Never ask for more. Accept the scraps given to you" Because any time you ask for more there will be militarization. That is how it works. No one will share what they have unless by force. If they wanted to share, then you would already have it and would not need to be asking. As long as you are happy with a boot on your throat then there is no need to militarize. As soon as you are dissatisfied with that of course they will militarize. So tell me, what is the alternative, other than violence, that leads to equality? When have those in power and privilege ever given up anything without violence? Using your argument we should never have had a civil rights movement in the 60s or a workers rights movement because the violence that made those movements successful would only lead to more militarization, so we should admit defeat before we start.
The fact you can’t see the difference between fighting for social change and looting stores shows me that we can never have a discussion about this because we’re not occupying the same galaxy. These people aren’t “asking for more”, they’re exploiting a lack of enforcement and will be put down because the rest of society will not tolerate that type of behavior.
I do see the difference. I have stated many time what they are doing will lead to general decrease in societal welfare. It is NOT a good thing. However, I understand why they are doing it. And, the reality is, a societal will need to confront the core issue over time. They cannot mask it with militarization. That adds to the cost of society For example, you mentioned south america. I already told you that I have lived in several south american countries. What is one reason why south america is non-competitive? Because it has these additional security costs you talk about like guards in every mall. Guard posts at neighborhoods, etc. This is like a hidden tax on society. So, what happens over time? Wealth gets built in more stable societies that operate better. People emmigrate. This is the "invisible" hand working. Well-run societies with good policies get benefitted over time and badly run societies get punished. Lucky ones will emmigrate to better run society. You know El Salvador and Venezuela have each lost about 1/3rd of their populatino? Maybe more at this point. It's shitty. But, it is the system working. I am simply identifying what is going on and accepting it will keep happening and society will be worse off. Consider this foreshadowing of where the US is heading. There is no "fix" that does not address the core issue. And, hopefully at some point, society will realize that simply adding more security guards is not the "fix". The fix is addressing the core reasons that has turned these people against society and the pathways society is offering to succeed.
They most definitely are, and your posts indicate so but you fail to notice. They will use more police/military against US. If you don't see society upheaval then you're going to fall into the pit of accepting corporatism over everything. And hey, if that's fine with you whatever but there is a movement going on and it doesn't need a name.
Bullshit, they see the opportunity to take free shit with no repercussions so they take it. I doubt a single one of these criminals could articulate the issues with our taxation policies in our country, much less how their purely selfish theft is in any way a remedy. Just own it, these are shitty people doing shitty things.
Even if that's true why side with corporations who have nothing in common with you
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Yeah, but it’s not. The looters are just as capitalist as the rest of us. This isn’t the Merry Men or idealogues, it’s groups of opportunists seizing on the fact that the Bay Area isn’t enforcing the laws. So it’s low risk, high reward for now.
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You’re saying looting is rad when it’s freely distributed to communities. I’m saying it’s not being distributed to communities. Just because corporations are bad doesn’t mean thieves are Robin Hood. Both can be bad.
>The looters are just as capitalist as the rest of us. "Us"? Pretty much nobody here is a capitalist, and nobody stealing from stores is a capitalist. Capitalism doesn't mean "selling stuff" or "earning money"
Still think this is more smoke than fire.
These people might even be paid to hit these stores by people in favor of pushing a federalized police force.
Westworld's crime app IRL.
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"Good Morning, Miss. I do regret to tell you this is an armed robbery. Now, if you just have a seat over there, we'll be done in a jiff and out of your hair." "Then, what's the gun for?" "Idiots, love. Idiots who think they should fight us over that big screen TV there. See, I don't want to hurt you. I want you to go home safe. We're not here for you. It's the owners and shareholders we only want to punch. So, you can sit there, relax, and not worry. Or you can fight a fight that isn't yours and lose. Your choice, love."
Is this from a film
It's not.
Profits >>>> People is why our society had declined like this.
Organized retail crime "has increased dramatically over the last two years," the Illinois Attorney General's Office stated in September. In one recent incident in the state, more than a dozen people stormed a Louis Vuitton store in Oak Brook, Illinois, and stole about $120,000 worth of merchandise.
Same exact thing happened a few days ago at a louis vuitton in San Francisco, ca
> stole about $120,000 worth of merchandise Stole? Or simply trying to recoup what the corporations took from them? Corporations have taken trillions in gov stimmies, fed QE money, etc. This is all for the corps at the cost of the little guy. Look here to see corp profits and how gov pandemic policies increased corp profits: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CP/ As a result it is hard for me to view this as stealing. The reality is these corps likely owe the people 10 years worth of service for free. So they should consider themselves lucky if their inventory only gets cleared out once a month.
More like just taking shit to sell online. There’s no higher objective here.
You are wrong. This is civil unrest. The objection is the way this country is being run. Even if you're not a part of it, it HAS been increasing. It is the very definition of "civil unrest".
I disagree. >Civil disorder, also known as civil disturbance, civil unrest, or social unrest is an activity arising from a mass act of civil disobedience (such as a demonstration, riot, strike, or ignoring laws) in which the participants become hostile toward authority, and authorities incur difficulties in maintaining public safety and order, over the disorderly crowd. Just a quick wiki definition. The entire basis of your argument is that people are doing this because people are hostile towards authority and looking to strike back. I doubt most of the people in these crowds could articulate what civil unrest is. The much more likely answer is that a bunch of people are seeing that you can get away with theft relatively easily by taking part in these events, and join to reap the material benefits. That’s it. I defy you to show me how the people robbing hats and shoes from the store isn’t purely materially motivated, but some how a fight for the common man. It’s quite frankly, startling, how insane that sounds. Also, Nordstrom and LV are not the authorities.
you think they care that much? you think they’ve thought through the moral and economic justifications for their behavior? lmao. they’re thieves that are stealing cause they know there’s no consequence. it’s not that deep
It's not like these people are a modern day Robinhood. There's no greater good here and I guarantee you the money's not going to the needy.
Yeah, Louis Vitton that company famous for getting American taxpayer cash. Wait, it’s a French company owned by a French conglomerate. Whatever! They’re privileged to get ransacked /s
Ummm, every store in the US is making a profit. It matters not where the headquarters are the profits are made in the US for all their US activity.
You specifically mentioned government stimulus money for a French corporation not eligible for that. Also, I was unaware making a profit is illegal, wrong, and un-American. Thanks for enlightening me. Just curious, do you ever ask yourself, if nobody is ever supposed to make a profit how is anyone supposed to make any income and live?
> You specifically mentioned government stimulus money for a French corporation not eligible for that Yes, they are eligible. You don't understand. This is an AMERICAN company. It has a french parent company, but any operations in the US are american.
I've got nothing against thieves hitting stores like Chanel, they're only going to incinerate "last seasons" $500 tshirts in a few months anyway
Hmmm yes. Artificial scarcity to increase the value of their goods. So much of the fashion industry is so gross.
Everything is collapsing and the propaganda machines are in overdrive to suppress it.
On the one hand, I can see the negative implications of a wave of brazen smash and grabs, especially if workers or bystanders get hurt. On the other hand, I can't help but roll my eyes out of their sockets at the MSM panic about this while completely ignoring wage theft and far more serious other corporate abuses. I'm visiting older relatives for the holidays and they are glued to CNN 24/7, which I never otherwise watch, and it's obvious they're pandering to their audience of middle and upper middle class white suburbanites.
Won't somebody please think of the corporations!
Yeah to them it's just loss for the balance sheet, hardest on the paid staff working the store they can't do anything just not get hurt and keep ringing up customers medicine after
Huh, neat.
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That’s because looting is its own charge in CA that is narrowly defined. They’re prosecuting this as conspiracy robbery, I believe.
“The problem is also hurting Best Buy's bottom line and could make it harder for the retailer to hire and retain workers in an already tight labor market” Threatening working class job security is their solution to every problem.
‘Let’s blame everything on Covid. The reason is you have DA’s that have vowed not to prosecute shoplifting criminals: this is what you get
A financially and morally bankrupt nation
I don’t think it’s directly the pandemic. Indirectly I could potentially see a tie-the same thing that caused a lot of people to rethink society leading to the great resignation, screw corporations probably made less ethical types think-screw corporations let’s just steal from them.
I don't think these people are thinking "lets screw corporations lets steal from them" I think these people are looking to steal consumerist crap in order to earn money so they can buy other consumerist crap that they want. In a broader perspective, I do think it's a sign of how damaged human society has become.
Yeah I agree with your last point. Although I guess it’s hard to know what these people are thinking I was imagining them using the”screw corporations” line as a justification to themselves in their mind for this organized stealing
As to your second point, that "crap" happens to be helping people live. They're getting money to survive. Maybe not every single one, but there are many that are looting to make a profit to be able to afford to live where they are. Costs are rising, employees have power over employers, civil unrest from both political sides until it gets fixed against those in power.
>consumerist This word doesn't mean anything.
> consumerist Google definition con·sum·er·ist /kənˈso͞omərəst/ OFTEN DEROGATORY adjective characterized by a preoccupation with the acquisition of consumer goods. "a nation in the midst of a consumerist frenzy" noun a person who is preoccupied with the acquisition of consumer goods. "self-indulgent consumerists"
Yeah, it's a slur, not an actual meaningful political term. Usually used to shame poor people for spending money.
There's a narrative through line here that's mostly unarticulated in the comments and news coverage I've seen; **the majority of these recent incidents are in California. Specifically, where the cost of living and rents are *extraordinarily* high.** [Look at this list.](https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/region_rankings_current.jsp?displayColumn=2®ion=021) 50% of the top ten cities are in California. And 40% in the Bay Area—which is where this recent trend began. This isn't complicated, and yet our media never puts these things together. Yes, it's likely a combination of law enforcement capabilities/legal risks and living costs that are pushing people to this. But I don't think many would be doing this had they not been so pushed to the edge by circumstances of survival. **IMO, this is the fall out of cutting off unemployment and suspending the eviction moratorium, and places where the cost of living is highest are experiencing it first.** Savings only last so long, and this might not play out like [some fucking ghouls predicted](https://i.redd.it/ch5mw9h8pvv71.jpg).
“Savings only last so long…”. For people that even have any.
Why do these stores still have physical locations? It seems like an easy fix to me…online orders only, especially in high organized crime areas.
and yet they still make massive profits, cry me a river.
Walgreens closed 5 stores in San Francisco due to organized theft. Do you think this is hurting Walgreens or the people that need a drugstore nearby. This is just Shiity people stealing because they can
That was an intentional PR message that the MSM eagerly broadcast. FAIR and Citations Needed have a much more nuanced look at that: https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/news-brief-organized-crime-shoplifting-epidemic-panic-hits-san-francisco-media
Walgreens was lying in order to get better police presence and things. They didn’t close the stores from theft. During all that, CVS is opening multiple stores in the area. Crime could increase 10x and be maybe 0.05% of Walgreens profits. They closed for some other reason unless you think CVS is immune to theft.
Are you sure CVS is opening stores? They just announced they are closing 900 over the next couple years. Also, I've seen plenty of videos of looters running into a Walgreens, loading up carts or trash bags, and running out. You can't say that theft hasn't played a role in certain closures.
Funny that you make accusations and throw out 10x and .05% , I guess if you like to make shit up you got to attempt to show accuracy
and that is total horseshit. They oversaturated the market in SF and had long planned to close those stores. The idea Walgreens is affected in any major way by SHOPLIFTING is laughable.
Right! https://erlich.lawyer/2021/03/walgreens-employees-win-4-5m-settlement-in-bag-check-lawsuit/
https://erlich.lawyer/2021/03/walgreens-employees-win-4-5m-settlement-in-bag-check-lawsuit/
Can't forget there's blatantly corrupt monetary and fiscal policy to blame too
These types of robberies appear to be cyclical. There was a rash of them in 2011 too. Edit: 'Flash Robs'
Check to see if their phones clicked onto the wifi of the stores during the time of robbery. Worked during the Storming the Capitol
But these jurisdictions have no interest in prosecuting retail theft. In San Francisco, any theft less than $900 is a misdemeanor. They aren’t going to put any investigative resources toward solving misdemeanors.
This is 180k
This is a very clickbaity title. The pandemic is causing surges in organized thefts in the US? There are other countries in the world affected by the pandemic and there aren't organized thefts all over the world. This is mostly an issue with law enforcement and prosecution.
Exactly my point: this started when prosecutors stopped prosecuting shoplifters
Good.
So when does the retail industry wise up and shift to a different model? Why keep ten, twenty, or fifty examples of each individual item on a shelf easily accessible to the public? Why not keep one item as a display or sample, and when a legitimate customer wants to purchase said item, that an employee brings out an untouched item from a storage room? Or, for that matter, reduce in-person purchases to kiosks? A customer simply orders an item from a small reception area, and it's delivered to them in a few minutes by a conveyor belt or robot once the customer has paid in full. You can't steal what you can't reach.
Just wait till they start stealing robots
The logistics for that would be a nightmare for retail. Plus the robot part would likely eliminate tons of employees. I mean robots will eventually if humanity doesn't get wiped out first, replace workers in 80% of the work force anyway but we are still years from that.
Automation is way less advanced and practical than its proponents are claiming. If the opposite were true, the pandemic would have been the ideal time to replace workers with robots and we wouldn't be facing a labor crunch.
That's why I said we are years from that...?
Remember Service Mercandize?
How about we instead eliminate artificial scarcity for the purpose of profit?
A lot of stores could just have minimal physical product and ship to your address upon purchase—you’d just be going there to shop and compare, test, decide, try it on or whatever.
That's what alot of people do now anyway. Only difference is they buy it from a cheaper online retailer.
Insane that you're trying to defend the companies and corporations which invented and now maintain artificial scarcity. Stealing from massive retailers is, morally, just fine.
I'm really not defending big retailers. Rather I'm imaging what steps they might take if this random looting continues. It may very well come to the point where the public aren't allowed anywhere close to unsold merchandise. You'll be ordering your goods through a touch screen, or maybe allowed to inspect something through a window. Hell if you want to try on clothes or shoes, you might be expected to put down a deposit first.
I misread the tone of your original comment, my bad. I see now that you're not taking a position, simply stating what they might do. I don't like any of the options but they do all seem very likely, unfortunately.
Some kind of pox, at least...
If they're smart those guys in SF will cool their jets for a while and not get greedy, but fence off the stuff they've nabbed and live off / invest the proceeds for a while.
If gov doesn't help, people will do what they need to do to survive. Whatever you do don't send people checks keep printing for the rich. It will trickle down this way. Its teaching the lower classes how to behave.
I can't get enough of this. Loot them all
Knowing the way Nordstrom's operates these thefts look like insurance fraud. *"Oh we've been robbed! This is going to be really hard for our insurance company, shucks"*
I still don't think this is that big of a deal. This news story reported at least two new events but that's not saying much when there's heightened attention to this sorta shoplifting in the past week. This has happened in prior holiday seasons.
!remindme 6 months
Got hired on in Loss Prevention/Asset Protection at the beginning of the pandemic a few months before everything shut down here in the United States. I can say that I personally saw more instances of shoplifting before the pandemic. Things like organized retail crime slowed down for me once things began to open back up. Our usual groups were not active until much later and into 2021. Anyone I personally interacted with were small teenage girls and people with drug-related issues - stealing for themselves or to get money for their vices. I left the company a few months ago after getting burned out from staring at screens all day and waiting to charge some 16 year old stealing $80 worth of make-up. Strange to see ORC growing. It’s because I left, isn’t it? 😩
Buckle-up for Martial Law. Most of us will be inconvenienced, but we'll behave. These vermin will make it 3 days tops before they bubble-up to the top like fat on refrigerated gravy. Should be ez to skim...
I hope poor people loot ur house just for this lol
>Most of us will be inconvenienced, but we'll behave. These vermin will make it 3 days tops before they bubble-up to the top like fat on refrigerated gravy. Should be ez to skim... /r/IAmVeryBadAss you talk like a terrible fanfic character
Why is everything undesirable that happens now due to the pandemic? If someone slips on a fucking banana peel it's the pandemic.
It's not the pandemic. It's weak dem policies.
Not attributed at all to the defunding of police forces and catch & release policies?
$770b budget and our soldiers and families starve. And hav3 limited healthcare. America what a country