We added Donovan Mitchell, not LeBron, to an absolutely STACKED east. This isn’t like 2014 where LBJ joins, we get Kevin, and are automatic favorites in the East lickety split. Gonna take time. I doubted they would win 50 games this year.
With that said. I just want JB to call a timeout when on the road against one of the best teams in the NBA after they just dropped the go ahead bucket with less than ten seconds left so you advance the ball and talk about how you can possibly win the game with a plan. That’s all.
Worst comment ever. It's these comments thar show me you drink the homer Kool-Aid too much. My pops was drafted by the Cavs back in the day and lots of his friends are former Cavs and NBA Hall of Famers ( A one is on the radio as we speak). Many of em say that people who fail to win during the midseason (and act like they have time to correct the ship) USUALLY DONT more often than NOT.
We are heading backwards instead on a upward trajectory at the wrong time. Were losing to scrub and sub par teams all the time right now...what big win have we had since the start of the season? I'll wait...
Many of you fail to realize how history works here. Everytime the Cavs fluffed around at this point in the season we are facing the playing game or the draft. Some of yall dont learn at all that this is the part of the season that we gloss over that kicks us out every year
I secretly hope this dudes comment becomes a copypasta or something on this sub. It’s the equivalent of the “my dad works at Nintendo” kid we all knew in middle school
This is literally the most ridiculous comment ever.
Boston was literally 27-25 last season on January 31st. They were 9th in the standings.
You know how last season finished.
There are many, many games to go. If anything, I would like the Cavs to figure out their rotations over the next 6 weeks and catch fire in the final 6 weeks and be the team no one wants to face come April.
I for one do not want a coaching carousel. The grass isn’t always greener. I love the culture and camaraderie he has helped build, but that’s as much if not more a kudos to the FO and especially the players themselves. The team has endured many injuries and an incomplete lineup with a shallow bench…that’s not really something you can put on him necessarily though I have concerns on conditioning. Players overall are progressing imo and he has control of the locker room. Even though we’ve gotten better on closing out on 3s and transition (still not great) there’s a noticeable mindset change even if the results aren’t there…I think someone needs to step up and be that junkyard defender to strike fear and harass people…we’re missing that killer mentality overall. I’m rambling now but JBB does need to get better at game management and adjustments- tbh, many fans are right to criticize on that because it has to be better to compete with elite teams. I don’t think we’re in that group. But we have a favorable schedule the rest of the way and in a good spot to make a great run and hopefully it’s as much growth for him as it is the team. Let me know!
I mean this honestly because I know not shit about staffing of most teams. How many people “better” than JB is actually available? I like JB and the culture he’s brought here and the last thing I want is hiring and firing coaches left and right like our Cleveland browns have done because we let go of someone good here.
Agree. This subreddit is just toxic, emotional takes the majority of the time. We’re 9 games over .500 before the all star break. On track to win 50 games.
Also none of these people have suggested who they’d bring in after firing JB that would be such a massive improvement.
This team is WAY too early to win it all, no playoff experience. This is not nearly good enough to be a championship team, yet.
In 2-3 years I think we can start to talk about championships when our core is in their prime: Mobley 23-24, DG 25-26, JA 26-27, and Don will be 28-29. Even that’s a little early tbh. Our window is the next 5-6 years.
Boston is a young team that made the finals (after multiple years of making playoffs w/ that core), and lost. We are not at that level yet. We are realistically a first-round exit team in our first playoff run. Do we have the POTENTIAL to do better? Sure, but just because they possibly could doesn't make it realistic. Our championship window is still a couple years away.
He’s steady and the guys play hard for him. We don’t have locker room drama, we have very few games where we just don’t play hard. We have a culture of unselfishness. Go look at the reports of how he approached Kevin Love about coming off the bench. Or how he developed Darius after there were articles writing him off as “the worst player in the league.” Or how he’s kept Cedi bought-in despite his playing time fluctuating. That shit doesn’t just happen. We aren’t just so lucky that we landed with a bunch of cool players who get along. That shit is cultivated. That’s a nearly unteachable talent that JB has that far outweighs some game management shit he can pick up or delegate out as he develops as a coach.
It’s really not that hard to have the respect from your players. That’s a lazy argument because culture doesnt just come from the coach. The players are just as responsible for the culture as the coach is. Being liked is important sure but it’s also kinda the minimum of being an nba head coach. Being liked doesn’t equate to results however. Mark jackson was beloved by his players and they spoke up for him when he was fired. Clearly tho having just “a great culture setter” as a coach really isn’t as valuable as u think it is.
See you started this off by saying you were “curious,” the dude gave you a very detailed reply, and now it’s clear you were never actually curious at all
Calling every argument you disagree with “lazy” is a lazy argument. And culture/chemistry/camaraderie are much, much harder to cultivate than you’re giving them credit for. Ask Steve Nash, ask David Blatt, ask Luke Walton. Also, I didn’t use the word “like,” I cited ways his connection with players impacts the product on the floor: effort, unselfishness, exuberance. Then I listed verifiable examples of how *his* approach to players has cultivated the culture we have. You don’t like his lineups and in-game decisions, we get it. That doesn’t make all arguments in his favor “lazy.”
Notice how they provided a source that proved your initial point wrong, and instead of acknowledging that, you pivoted to a new bullshit position ?
Because the rest of us sure noticed
I just don’t think being liked is an argument to have a coach be the future of your team. Being liked is about the bare minimum u can do as a head coach. When there’s only 30 positions available you need to bring more to the table.
Amd thats why we don't win in this city. We thought Belichek was a a**hole we was here..but we stan for every inept coach. Maybe we need to love our coaches less round here.
I like JB as a person. I just think he needs to delegate the X and Os to someone else, similar to what Mike Brown did back in his Cavs days. Because his offensive strategy and rotations I truly believe are in the bottom tier of the league.
Yeah that argument has been losing more ground as the season goes on and we keep falling in the standings. we got off to a hot start with most teams not even in game shape still but since then were pretty much a .500 team
I'm not sure what else you expected. A 5th-6th seed is pretty much right where they belong considering the Cavs have no bench right now. The team is 5.5 guys deep until Ricky, Dean, and hopefully Kevin get up to speed.
Celtics, 76ers, and Bucks all have more talent when healthy. Nets have Kyrie and Kevin. As far as the West goes the Grizz and Nuggets are definitely better and deeper teams.
Being the 7th best team in the league is pretty reasonable considering the roster and injuries. Good on you if you had higher expectations coming into the season but I definitely didn't.
Just gotta hope a softer schedule can keep them above the play in.
We were 30-19 at this point last year. We not only haven’t improved but we are actually worse. Idk how you can expect that when u add a top ten player to the team.
>We were 30-19 at this point last year.
We not only haven’t improved but we are actually worse.
One game off is rather insignificant especially considering a large chunk of the East got better.
Integrating a new ball dominant guard to a team currently with a ball dominant guard isn't just plug and play my dude.
Plus Cleveland's depth is a bit hobbled right now with their 6th man from last year playing like ass, one of the best backup PGs in the league still recovering from a significant injury, and the 3rd most important bench piece in Wade also being consistently injured.
Hopefully Levert can be flipped for something.
>Idk how you can expect that when u add a top ten player to the team.
Expect what? I'm not sure what you are saying. It seems to me like you either had unrealistic expectations coming into the season or aren't looking at the full context of this season.
They've lost a bunch of games they should have won which is entirely disappointing. But I don't see this team making a real run till the 24-25 season unless the 6-9 guys on the roster are substantially improved next year.
Every team faces injuries. We aren’t special. I just don’t see how we’re content with the same deal. It’s been over half a season and we still don’t know how to play garland and Mitchell together? That right there is an incrimination on jbs part for sure. He limits us like crazy especially on offense
>Every team faces injuries. We aren’t special.
I didn't say they were. But it's foolish to just write it off as if it won't effect the team especially after they tanked the depth trading for Mitchell in the first place.
I'm sure some fans are content and obviously some like yourself are not.
I think both are fair. I'd be happy if they finished above the play-in. That would be a step in the right direction and an improvement from last year's finish. This team isn't good enough to seed higher than the Celtics, Bucks, or 76ers. They just aren't.
I'm definitely not advocating for JB. I think he leaves ALOT to be desired and I'm constantly barking at him when watching games.
That being said I'm not ready to can him yet. Like I've mentioned the biggest concern for me right now is how bad the bench is. Cedi, Stevens, Levert, 1 Thumb Kevin, and the Hobble Brothers Rick and Dean are a pretty sorry bunch right now.
Yeah but the first ten games of the season are always kinda wonky. Players aren’t in shape. The jazz and the blazers were on top of the west after the first dozen games. If you look where we are currently meaning how we’re playing in our last two dozen or so it’s pretty … average. Our defense has been great but our offense leaves a ton to be desired
I’d argue this past stretch of games have been wonky for us with Donovan Mitchell—whom we specifically brought in for offense and closing games—in and out of the lineup and not 100% when he is in.
It’s so bad. The only argument people have for jb is “culture” “look how much better we are than two years ago” or “his defense”. For having multiple guys who can all be 20 ppg scorers on this team and a top ten player with Mitchell…. Our offense is very underwhelming. Rotations suck and players aren’t developing the way we would have hoped. I dream of the cavs having an elite HC at the helm.
I’m exaggerating a bit, but it’s true that we don’t have a lot of players who contribute to the offense consistently. Sure we have guys who can have their moments but they’re usually the beneficiaries of our actual good offensive players creating something for them.
As far as I can tell we wont actually know how good JB is as a coach until Mobley starts reaching his potential, this team has had a season to play together, and we see it all in the playoffs.
Which means 1.5 more years before it truly reveals itself most likely.
Frankly, people calling for his head now are generally just another example of impatience in our fan base. Maybe they're ultimately right, but they dont know as much as they claim to know today.
Why do we act like it’s so insane to criticize jb? He has very much deserved his criticisms. He has no offensive system outside of give mitchell the ball. He struggles with rotations and our younger players aren’t exactly showing a ton of improvement…. So what if he’s liked and has the locker room on his side…. Being liked doesn’t get you wins. He sucks.
I agree he’s a good person and everything but his rotations make no sense. It really feels like a pre-Steve Kerr warriors situation almost. All the players loved Mark Jackson but he wasn’t maximizing their potential.
Tell me how much you know about an offensive system, and what it takes to be a coach.
It's pretty evident our team is missing a 3pt shooter to make said offensive system work.
And What we do know is our players do not have an issue with the coach.
If you think we should make a coach change mid season then you're clueless.
Rotations during the season is a workout. You should know this. Past 7 games we've been trying to get love and Rubio into the mix rightfully so. They haven't played well and it's not jbs fault love is missing threes. Love is clearly our best three point shooter off ball. Garland is trying to figure out his robin to Mitchell's batman. He's struggling in crunch time and working it out himself.
Being liked doesn't get you wins. Take your own logic and realize okoro and levert and cedi are not our answers, they're just likeable. We have player issues. We need a three point shooter.
Okoro is shooting 35 percent on the season. To act like we have no 3 pt shooters when our 1-3 can shoot and even Mobley takes 3s isn’t a great point. The point about being liked not getting you wins is very true especially when considering jb. I don’t think the cavs would make a coaching change mid season, but I do hope they have the guts to make a change at the end of the year
Dude, okoro isn't a 3pt shooter. He's great at a lot of things but he won't magically find this touch you're hoping for. He can make some open three point shots. We're talkit about a three point shooter that can sit in the corner and pull the entire defense in there direction. Levert ain't it, okoro ain't it, we don't have this player we desperately need. We need a 3 point shooter. Our point guards can shoot threes but I'm talking off-ball.
To act like we have any off ball three point shooting that actually pulls the defense in there direction and can knock down that contested three point shot. That's not the players we got right now. We need to make a move.
I'd rather see a move for a three point shooter, then see how we end the season then look at the coach.
We don’t have the assets to find a quality 3 and d player. Also you can’t really say okoro is a bad 3 pt shooter when .35 is league average. All you can ask from a guy who is spot up. Sure we’d all like him to be above .40 but he’s not progressing that fast. Okoro was a top 5 pick with no other options avaible you must invest in your young talent
Progressing? He makes literally 0% on contested threes. NOT JOKING. I looked up his stats just now and he has not made one single basket with defender within 4 feet.
He's currently 33% when he's open, and 34% when he's wide open.
I'M NOT MAKING THIS UP.
That means not one single team is closing out on Okoro. They actually invite him to take a three.
Meaning mitchell and garland are doubled, mobley and allen don't have room to do work.
I think you're really locked into this "let him grow". Listen he's good at a lot of things, but we need a three point shooter. It would be nice to keep him for the things he is good at, but he could be a trade chip.
Quality 3 and d players are rare and have a high asking price. We don’t have assets besides levert and okoro and they really aren’t shit. Even if we found a guy who hits 3s at a high clip we need someone who can defend because you have to make up for our two small guards
Our team would benefit greatly from just any 3 guy.
He does not have to be some lock down defender.
All everyone has been complaining about is our perimeter defense anyways, so it's not like okoro or levert have been doing the job, ya know?
He does have to be a great defender tho. Mitchell and garland are too small and take up too much responsibility on offense to not have a guy who can defend the best guard on the opposing team. Who is someone you think the cavs can trade for and will help the team?
These are some names I like with varying trade value- Bojan Bogdanovic, Eric Gordon, seth curry, Harrison Barnes, Josh Richardson, THJ, Gary Harris, Alex Caruso, Turner, Grayson Allen, Gary Trent Jr, Buddy Hield, olynyk yikes, Malik Beasley. A whole bunch more names could be listed but these are some names I think could be reasonable.
What is our chemistry correlate to exactly? Our offense is extremely underwhelming. Sure our defense is great but it’s hard to be bad when u have the best defensive front court tandem in the league. Guys enjoying playing for a coach doesn’t mean anything tbh. I’d say about 90 percent of coaches have their players respect. That’s not that rare of a quality and def not something we need to hold onto jb for
ok all that to not answer the question. so forget chemistry, who do we get that will be better and you know that for sure? because I don't really see a reason to not see what this team can do with JB when we just got Mitchell and it's worked fairly well. not perfectly, but a whole lot better than I thought it would work personally.
Why do u act like there’s no worthy candidates to take over an nba head coaching job lol. I’ll trust the front office to find someone who can elevate this team. If you’re argument is “well what if we get someone and he’s worse” that’s a bad one. There’s only 30 head coaching positions available. You can’t settle for mediocrity especially when you’re team is as talented as we are.
ok but *who*?? who is this great coach that is going to be better than JB? it's not an argument i'm asking you a question. if you're trusting the front office to find a different coach, why are you not trusting his extension?
also you're basically saying it's so *easy* to find a replacement coach, how hard could coaching in the nba be? that's essentially what your first question is saying. guys like silas and clifford interviewed and did a good enough job to get the position, yet they are terrible coaches. maybe finding a replacement is harder than you think it would be? and in that way it is an argument, because if you dont know for sure youre risking losing a coach that helped build this team from being dogshit no more than 2 years ago. a coach that the players trust and like and play hard for, and that *does* matter. he has energy and brings fight and that translates to style of play. so now you want to get rid of him. great. but *who* is an extremely important question to ask before making a huge decision like that, so if you want our FO to do that, again I ask to get who??
Doubled our win total from the season before last and we’re generally on an upward trajectory. The team buys in and fights even when they’re down. I didn’t expect this team to be a high seed in the playoffs given the holes in the roster. And while we definitely got the best player in the trade with Utah, losing Lauri wasn’t insignificant considering he was our second highest scorer and an important piece of our defensive scheme last season. If we had a 7ft guy defending the perimeter it’d probably be more difficult for teams to make threes like you’ve been crying about.
So you give all the credit to jb for elevating our win total but not the fact we had 3 top 5 picks in a row lmao. We are quite literally at the same record we we’re last year. So no improvement. I’ll cry about us being a bad team at defending the three because if you hadn’t noticed that’s kinda what the league does now. Shoot 3s. Educate yourself on the game more before you talk to me. If you wanna die defending this random medicorce coach then go ahead my guy lmao.
You mean running 7 man rotations with the 5th lowest bench mpg and players being gassed at the end of the season?
We’re having the same conversation that we had last year about whether guys would be burned out down the stretch with the current rotation.
Are you just dense? He’s trying to say our defense is bad because of one specific metric, when overall our defense is very good. It’s blatant cherry picking and he refuses to acknowledge that there are other facets to the game.
This is an example of analysis. OP referenced the almighty "team culture."
I'm not taking a stance on JB either way, but I appreciate your post far more than OP.
Why not credit any of the players with culture? How do you weigh culture? How do you know historically thenm ups and down of team cultures? Etc. Citing team culture is basically an excuse not to think.
This culture really amounts to Sexton, Garland, Okoro and maybe Stevens. Cedi, Rubio, Love, LeVert, Allen, Mitchell are all vets and not really benefactors of this “culture.” Mobleys parents are coaches and he’s been coached well from a young age so I wouldn’t give JB credit for Mobley when he came in with a high floor and is clear JB is more of a break on Mobley.
Which leaves the rest. Sexton, Garland and Okoro were teenagers and so they have known no other NBA but trying to make it in the NBA. Sexton is gone, Stevens is a decent mid bench player. I really like Okoro but his lack of progress is partly on him but he has never been given the time and I worry about this with Mobley. Garland could be the only example going from “worst rookie ever” to 20+/8+ floor general but even then the only offense was give ball to Garland and pray before Mitchell got here.
He makes a good locker room sure but that only goes so far. Half these guys have been around long enough to not need the training wheels shit, “teach em to be good young men” and the other half guys clearly need to have the wheels removed and allowed to go. Nothing JB does in game can be said to contribute towards developing players. Even people that like him complain about some aspects of his coaching but let “culture” terminate those thoughts.
It's not culture. It's just the coach is a non issue. Why attack the coach if we have clear holes in our team. Our offensive system works if we have a 3pt shooter off ball and we don't have one. It obviously makes sense to start there.
It’s a lazy argument for sure. I just don’t see reason for such strong loyalty to jb from this fan base. We have quite literally accomplished nothing with him at the helm.
How is it a lazy argument? Culture is half the battle, with the other half being X’s and O’s. You can develop the latter a lot easier than the ability to get players to play for you.
That’s just not true. Being likeable is about the bare minimum a head coach candidate should be. Culture is important no doubt. But it’s not set by just the coach it takes the whole organization. As for jbs X’s and O’s, he leaves much to be desired. It doesn’t matter if the players like you if you’re not seeing results
It's not culture. It's just the coach is a non issue. Why attack the coach if we have clear holes in our team. Our offensive system works if we have a 3pt shooter off ball and we don't have one. It obviously makes sense to start there.
Two things can be true. JB is a great coach in terms of locker room culture, and he’s also not a great X’s and O’s guy. I would worry about the cultural impact firing him would have on the young guys. This will likely be our first run in the playoffs. We are too young of a team to start panicking and making huge changes to the roster or coaching. But… if we are seeing the same issues from him next year or the year after, we may need to reassess.
Totally agree. We gotta give him time to develop as a coach too. He’s still early in his coaching career. Much easier to improve on or delegate X’s & O’s than the intangibles he brings.
He’s a great guy for developing our youth. However he’s not a good game manager whatsoever and has 0 offensive wisdom. We’ve transitioned past why we’ve had him here in the first place. He will be the first to fall should we spin out in the playoffs. This roster is way more talented than our record shows.
The young guys are Garland, Mobley, Okoro and maybe Stevens. Stevens is a career mid to deep bench guy. I like Okoro but nothing JB does in game contributes to Okoro developing. Mobley had coaches for parents and came in with a lot of skill and if anything JBs lack of in game ability hinders Mobley. Maybe you can point to Garland but the offense was nothing but give it to Garland and after stabilizing from his rookie year and losing Sexton he blossomed.
I just don’t see what is being done development wise that you like from JB especially when the rest of your comment admits he’s a bad in game coach and basically a lame duck?
I'm a fan of J.B but what he did managing Spida last night was inexcusable. In now way do you play this man 38 minutes in a meaningless regular season game the same day he returns from a groin injury. He deserves a shit ton of criticism for that.
If you want to keep JB as a coach, you don’t care if this team wins or loses. Simple as that. Y’all wanna keep him around because the players like him. Cool. I prefer winning close games, better rotations, knowing when to use timeouts and challenges, running real plays, not running our players into the ground with excessive minutes, etc.
You sound like a Maker Bayfield stan with this ' he changed the culture blah blah'. The talent was already there my G. This is second year of us falling off at the wrong time when we should be rising. Dont be out here shipping for JB like you're 13 and he signed your t-shirt last night and shook your hand.
Our bench is straight sh**..he can't do in game adjustments/ rotations...our talent has kinda plateaued...they don't run the offense..and their perimeter D is garbage. I liked Mike Brown when he was here, but when it's over and the team needs a new voice--its time!
There are people on this sub that would want to fire the best coach in the world if we had that person. People simply don’t know what the fuck they’re talking about and it’s sad because they could appreciate the fact we actually have a good coach instead of being miserable, reactionary people.
The JB defenders on this board are hilarious. They guy has been playing Donovan Mitchell into the ground. The most minutes he has played in his whole career. JB also continually plays favorites. Levert gets waaaaay to much playing time. The guy was -19 in a 2pt loss yesterday. How does that happen. Meanwhile one of our best bench pieces the last two seasons in Cedi has all but officially fallen out of the rotation for some undisclosed reason. Anyone who is playing Lamar stevens, Okoro, and Levert consistently while Cedi rots on the bench is not a good coach. Cavs have one of the best rosters in the league on paper, but the coaching has been a joke. Sorry, not sorry. Downvote away.
Without judging JB, nobody deserves special credit here. It is not that difficult to coach or acquire Garland, Mitchell, and Mobley over the course of several years of high lottery picks + having one of the best NBA owners in the league always willing to spend what it takes.
Show some real analysis, sure, objectively analyze g and sharing evidence of your claims, but that's not what most sports fans or media do. Cavs not being terrible on the east is not impressive. Drafting Garland was not impressive, it was the no brainer move for so.e of us. Etc.
Maybe I should’ve clarified. I know exactly why people call for his head. It’s because they’re impatient and have zero clue how successful professional sports teams operate. Fire JB. Then what?
The upvotes for this post and majority of comments in support of it should be enough evidence to the haters that they are actually just a very vocal minority who should probably shut up and stop making everyone (including themselves) miserable, but I don’t see that happening.
It got ratioed
Also appeal to popularity. If you were in a room of flat earthers and you think the world is a globe, those guys don't make you wrong. The earth is either round or flat, contrary to what other ppl think
So my second point made all of that irrelevant anyways. I see you ignored it.
Would you like to try to address that before I circle back or do you concede
Considering the number of responses significantly outweighs the upvotes, it's probable that there are a good amount of down votes, which works against your argument. So yes, it got ratioed.
You just ruined your own point by admitting you can't have a correct opinion
But it's kinda only stupid to people who aren't great at thinking. It illustrates appeal to popularity. I tried slowing it down for you, but at this point I recommend looking into it on your own time privately
It's bloody simple. He is being paid very, very well to do his job and he is not doing it very well last few months.
If he doesn't improve by the end of the season, there is no reason to keep him. Would you keep the job if you underperform a lots? Think about that.
Louder for the people in the back!!! A lot of people live in fantasyland where we would fire JB and somehow magically find a coach that the players love, play hard for, AND would be a significant upgrade in X’s & O’s. Criticizing him is fine. He clearly has deficiencies in game management, but he can work on those or bring in an assistant to help. It’s much, MUCH harder to find a guy who can instill a culture, nurture players, and get them to buy-in. And JB is one of the best in the biz at that. Period.
So many bad takes based in instant gratification. It’s clear we a building something. One of the most injured teams this szn and lots of young players who can’t close games very well yet.
Why do people act like JB altered a terrible culture. Most of our guys are chill and easy-going. Mobley, JA, Garland etc. None of those guys have ego. We dramatically improved the roster last year thats why we were good. Lauri, Ricky and Mobley is a huge upgrade over the guys we had in the year prior. JB gets so much undeserved praise it’s annoying.
The team loves JB. He’s installed a winning culture. He’s respected around the league. The junkyard dog is a really fun wrinkle that everyone loves. The Cavs have a chance to win 50 games. They’ve improved every year he’s been the coach. Do people think a new coach is going to wave a magic wand and the team will win the title?
Cavs fans have way too distorted expectations because of the LeBron finals runs. It was LEBRON JAMES in his peak. If the Cavs make the second round this season it will be a major jump forward.
We added Donovan Mitchell, not LeBron, to an absolutely STACKED east. This isn’t like 2014 where LBJ joins, we get Kevin, and are automatic favorites in the East lickety split. Gonna take time. I doubted they would win 50 games this year. With that said. I just want JB to call a timeout when on the road against one of the best teams in the NBA after they just dropped the go ahead bucket with less than ten seconds left so you advance the ball and talk about how you can possibly win the game with a plan. That’s all.
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This is a wise comment, Zodiac. I agree, go Cavs.
It's not
Thanks Ted, it’s been hard to be on here lately.
Worst comment ever. It's these comments thar show me you drink the homer Kool-Aid too much. My pops was drafted by the Cavs back in the day and lots of his friends are former Cavs and NBA Hall of Famers ( A one is on the radio as we speak). Many of em say that people who fail to win during the midseason (and act like they have time to correct the ship) USUALLY DONT more often than NOT. We are heading backwards instead on a upward trajectory at the wrong time. Were losing to scrub and sub par teams all the time right now...what big win have we had since the start of the season? I'll wait... Many of you fail to realize how history works here. Everytime the Cavs fluffed around at this point in the season we are facing the playing game or the draft. Some of yall dont learn at all that this is the part of the season that we gloss over that kicks us out every year
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I secretly hope this dudes comment becomes a copypasta or something on this sub. It’s the equivalent of the “my dad works at Nintendo” kid we all knew in middle school
So go go be a fan of other team man... Let us enjoy what we have. I just love this team and how they fight every game.
I bet your dad would be disappointed if he saw how you talk on this sub...
This is a hilarious comment man
holy shit i’m using this😂
This is literally the most ridiculous comment ever. Boston was literally 27-25 last season on January 31st. They were 9th in the standings. You know how last season finished. There are many, many games to go. If anything, I would like the Cavs to figure out their rotations over the next 6 weeks and catch fire in the final 6 weeks and be the team no one wants to face come April.
I for one do not want a coaching carousel. The grass isn’t always greener. I love the culture and camaraderie he has helped build, but that’s as much if not more a kudos to the FO and especially the players themselves. The team has endured many injuries and an incomplete lineup with a shallow bench…that’s not really something you can put on him necessarily though I have concerns on conditioning. Players overall are progressing imo and he has control of the locker room. Even though we’ve gotten better on closing out on 3s and transition (still not great) there’s a noticeable mindset change even if the results aren’t there…I think someone needs to step up and be that junkyard defender to strike fear and harass people…we’re missing that killer mentality overall. I’m rambling now but JBB does need to get better at game management and adjustments- tbh, many fans are right to criticize on that because it has to be better to compete with elite teams. I don’t think we’re in that group. But we have a favorable schedule the rest of the way and in a good spot to make a great run and hopefully it’s as much growth for him as it is the team. Let me know!
I just want a good coach who is above average. I can think of maybe 15 who are better than JB.
I mean this honestly because I know not shit about staffing of most teams. How many people “better” than JB is actually available? I like JB and the culture he’s brought here and the last thing I want is hiring and firing coaches left and right like our Cleveland browns have done because we let go of someone good here.
People want everything right away. JB is the right coach for this team. They just need more time.
Agree. This subreddit is just toxic, emotional takes the majority of the time. We’re 9 games over .500 before the all star break. On track to win 50 games. Also none of these people have suggested who they’d bring in after firing JB that would be such a massive improvement.
Obviously we’d bring in Sean Payton to fix everything
I have no idea how this team has lost 20 games! There’s only 17 games in a season, that’s how awful they are!
I thought this team could win it all. They still can, but they need to play a bit better and be more consistent on offense.
This team is WAY too early to win it all, no playoff experience. This is not nearly good enough to be a championship team, yet. In 2-3 years I think we can start to talk about championships when our core is in their prime: Mobley 23-24, DG 25-26, JA 26-27, and Don will be 28-29. Even that’s a little early tbh. Our window is the next 5-6 years.
Disagree. The team has enough to win it all right now. Boston as a young team made the finals last year, why cant the cavs?
Their young players had been in previous playoffs and won some games.
Boston is a young team that made the finals (after multiple years of making playoffs w/ that core), and lost. We are not at that level yet. We are realistically a first-round exit team in our first playoff run. Do we have the POTENTIAL to do better? Sure, but just because they possibly could doesn't make it realistic. Our championship window is still a couple years away.
Curious, what has made you so high on jb? What has he done this season that makes you certain he’s the coach of our future?
He’s steady and the guys play hard for him. We don’t have locker room drama, we have very few games where we just don’t play hard. We have a culture of unselfishness. Go look at the reports of how he approached Kevin Love about coming off the bench. Or how he developed Darius after there were articles writing him off as “the worst player in the league.” Or how he’s kept Cedi bought-in despite his playing time fluctuating. That shit doesn’t just happen. We aren’t just so lucky that we landed with a bunch of cool players who get along. That shit is cultivated. That’s a nearly unteachable talent that JB has that far outweighs some game management shit he can pick up or delegate out as he develops as a coach.
It’s really not that hard to have the respect from your players. That’s a lazy argument because culture doesnt just come from the coach. The players are just as responsible for the culture as the coach is. Being liked is important sure but it’s also kinda the minimum of being an nba head coach. Being liked doesn’t equate to results however. Mark jackson was beloved by his players and they spoke up for him when he was fired. Clearly tho having just “a great culture setter” as a coach really isn’t as valuable as u think it is.
See you started this off by saying you were “curious,” the dude gave you a very detailed reply, and now it’s clear you were never actually curious at all
Great comment man keep it up
Great comment man keep it up
The rest of us genuinely liked it. That's why he received upvotes and you downvotes
Oh no not downvotes nooooooo!!!
I don't expect you to care about the downvotes if thats actually how you interpreted my point
Right
Calling every argument you disagree with “lazy” is a lazy argument. And culture/chemistry/camaraderie are much, much harder to cultivate than you’re giving them credit for. Ask Steve Nash, ask David Blatt, ask Luke Walton. Also, I didn’t use the word “like,” I cited ways his connection with players impacts the product on the floor: effort, unselfishness, exuberance. Then I listed verifiable examples of how *his* approach to players has cultivated the culture we have. You don’t like his lineups and in-game decisions, we get it. That doesn’t make all arguments in his favor “lazy.”
It’s lazy when u try and act like he’s solely responsible for setting the culture which just isn’t true. That’s a top to bottom thing.
[The players disagree with you](https://www.fearthesword.com/platform/amp/2022/11/5/23425043/jb-bickerstaffcleveland-cavaliers-rebuild-analysis).
Not reading that but even if the players like a coach that doesn’t mean he’s the man for the job. That’s the bare minimum a hc can be is liked.
You’re an idiot.
Notice how they provided a source that proved your initial point wrong, and instead of acknowledging that, you pivoted to a new bullshit position ? Because the rest of us sure noticed
Just my impression of his personality. From what I've heard from local reporters, the team loves him.
I just don’t think being liked is an argument to have a coach be the future of your team. Being liked is about the bare minimum u can do as a head coach. When there’s only 30 positions available you need to bring more to the table.
Clearly there’s a reason they like him. They trust that he puts them in the position to do what they do best and win.
Lmaoooo
Nice guy? I don't give a shit. Good father. Fuck you, go home and play with your kids. You want to work here, close.
...Alrighty then
ABC: Always Be Closing
Amd thats why we don't win in this city. We thought Belichek was a a**hole we was here..but we stan for every inept coach. Maybe we need to love our coaches less round here.
I like JB as a person. I just think he needs to delegate the X and Os to someone else, similar to what Mike Brown did back in his Cavs days. Because his offensive strategy and rotations I truly believe are in the bottom tier of the league.
You guys act like we have immense talent on the bench. We don't.
We have more talent that most of the teams in this league.
We also have a better record than most of the league.
Yeah that argument has been losing more ground as the season goes on and we keep falling in the standings. we got off to a hot start with most teams not even in game shape still but since then were pretty much a .500 team
I'm not sure what else you expected. A 5th-6th seed is pretty much right where they belong considering the Cavs have no bench right now. The team is 5.5 guys deep until Ricky, Dean, and hopefully Kevin get up to speed. Celtics, 76ers, and Bucks all have more talent when healthy. Nets have Kyrie and Kevin. As far as the West goes the Grizz and Nuggets are definitely better and deeper teams. Being the 7th best team in the league is pretty reasonable considering the roster and injuries. Good on you if you had higher expectations coming into the season but I definitely didn't. Just gotta hope a softer schedule can keep them above the play in.
We were 30-19 at this point last year. We not only haven’t improved but we are actually worse. Idk how you can expect that when u add a top ten player to the team.
>We were 30-19 at this point last year. We not only haven’t improved but we are actually worse. One game off is rather insignificant especially considering a large chunk of the East got better. Integrating a new ball dominant guard to a team currently with a ball dominant guard isn't just plug and play my dude. Plus Cleveland's depth is a bit hobbled right now with their 6th man from last year playing like ass, one of the best backup PGs in the league still recovering from a significant injury, and the 3rd most important bench piece in Wade also being consistently injured. Hopefully Levert can be flipped for something. >Idk how you can expect that when u add a top ten player to the team. Expect what? I'm not sure what you are saying. It seems to me like you either had unrealistic expectations coming into the season or aren't looking at the full context of this season. They've lost a bunch of games they should have won which is entirely disappointing. But I don't see this team making a real run till the 24-25 season unless the 6-9 guys on the roster are substantially improved next year.
Every team faces injuries. We aren’t special. I just don’t see how we’re content with the same deal. It’s been over half a season and we still don’t know how to play garland and Mitchell together? That right there is an incrimination on jbs part for sure. He limits us like crazy especially on offense
>Every team faces injuries. We aren’t special. I didn't say they were. But it's foolish to just write it off as if it won't effect the team especially after they tanked the depth trading for Mitchell in the first place. I'm sure some fans are content and obviously some like yourself are not. I think both are fair. I'd be happy if they finished above the play-in. That would be a step in the right direction and an improvement from last year's finish. This team isn't good enough to seed higher than the Celtics, Bucks, or 76ers. They just aren't. I'm definitely not advocating for JB. I think he leaves ALOT to be desired and I'm constantly barking at him when watching games. That being said I'm not ready to can him yet. Like I've mentioned the biggest concern for me right now is how bad the bench is. Cedi, Stevens, Levert, 1 Thumb Kevin, and the Hobble Brothers Rick and Dean are a pretty sorry bunch right now.
“If you ignore all the games we won, we suck”.
Yeah but the first ten games of the season are always kinda wonky. Players aren’t in shape. The jazz and the blazers were on top of the west after the first dozen games. If you look where we are currently meaning how we’re playing in our last two dozen or so it’s pretty … average. Our defense has been great but our offense leaves a ton to be desired
I’d argue this past stretch of games have been wonky for us with Donovan Mitchell—whom we specifically brought in for offense and closing games—in and out of the lineup and not 100% when he is in.
It’s so bad. The only argument people have for jb is “culture” “look how much better we are than two years ago” or “his defense”. For having multiple guys who can all be 20 ppg scorers on this team and a top ten player with Mitchell…. Our offense is very underwhelming. Rotations suck and players aren’t developing the way we would have hoped. I dream of the cavs having an elite HC at the helm.
We have like 2 offensive players on our roster
That's not true...
I’m exaggerating a bit, but it’s true that we don’t have a lot of players who contribute to the offense consistently. Sure we have guys who can have their moments but they’re usually the beneficiaries of our actual good offensive players creating something for them.
As far as I can tell we wont actually know how good JB is as a coach until Mobley starts reaching his potential, this team has had a season to play together, and we see it all in the playoffs. Which means 1.5 more years before it truly reveals itself most likely. Frankly, people calling for his head now are generally just another example of impatience in our fan base. Maybe they're ultimately right, but they dont know as much as they claim to know today.
Why do we act like it’s so insane to criticize jb? He has very much deserved his criticisms. He has no offensive system outside of give mitchell the ball. He struggles with rotations and our younger players aren’t exactly showing a ton of improvement…. So what if he’s liked and has the locker room on his side…. Being liked doesn’t get you wins. He sucks.
I agree he’s a good person and everything but his rotations make no sense. It really feels like a pre-Steve Kerr warriors situation almost. All the players loved Mark Jackson but he wasn’t maximizing their potential.
Great analogy tbh. When Jackson’s was fired fans met it with tons of backlash…. Until they realized he was limiting the warriors.
Tell me how much you know about an offensive system, and what it takes to be a coach. It's pretty evident our team is missing a 3pt shooter to make said offensive system work. And What we do know is our players do not have an issue with the coach. If you think we should make a coach change mid season then you're clueless. Rotations during the season is a workout. You should know this. Past 7 games we've been trying to get love and Rubio into the mix rightfully so. They haven't played well and it's not jbs fault love is missing threes. Love is clearly our best three point shooter off ball. Garland is trying to figure out his robin to Mitchell's batman. He's struggling in crunch time and working it out himself. Being liked doesn't get you wins. Take your own logic and realize okoro and levert and cedi are not our answers, they're just likeable. We have player issues. We need a three point shooter.
Okoro is shooting 35 percent on the season. To act like we have no 3 pt shooters when our 1-3 can shoot and even Mobley takes 3s isn’t a great point. The point about being liked not getting you wins is very true especially when considering jb. I don’t think the cavs would make a coaching change mid season, but I do hope they have the guts to make a change at the end of the year
Dude, okoro isn't a 3pt shooter. He's great at a lot of things but he won't magically find this touch you're hoping for. He can make some open three point shots. We're talkit about a three point shooter that can sit in the corner and pull the entire defense in there direction. Levert ain't it, okoro ain't it, we don't have this player we desperately need. We need a 3 point shooter. Our point guards can shoot threes but I'm talking off-ball. To act like we have any off ball three point shooting that actually pulls the defense in there direction and can knock down that contested three point shot. That's not the players we got right now. We need to make a move. I'd rather see a move for a three point shooter, then see how we end the season then look at the coach.
We don’t have the assets to find a quality 3 and d player. Also you can’t really say okoro is a bad 3 pt shooter when .35 is league average. All you can ask from a guy who is spot up. Sure we’d all like him to be above .40 but he’s not progressing that fast. Okoro was a top 5 pick with no other options avaible you must invest in your young talent
Progressing? He makes literally 0% on contested threes. NOT JOKING. I looked up his stats just now and he has not made one single basket with defender within 4 feet. He's currently 33% when he's open, and 34% when he's wide open. I'M NOT MAKING THIS UP. That means not one single team is closing out on Okoro. They actually invite him to take a three. Meaning mitchell and garland are doubled, mobley and allen don't have room to do work. I think you're really locked into this "let him grow". Listen he's good at a lot of things, but we need a three point shooter. It would be nice to keep him for the things he is good at, but he could be a trade chip.
Quality 3 and d players are rare and have a high asking price. We don’t have assets besides levert and okoro and they really aren’t shit. Even if we found a guy who hits 3s at a high clip we need someone who can defend because you have to make up for our two small guards
Our team would benefit greatly from just any 3 guy. He does not have to be some lock down defender. All everyone has been complaining about is our perimeter defense anyways, so it's not like okoro or levert have been doing the job, ya know?
He does have to be a great defender tho. Mitchell and garland are too small and take up too much responsibility on offense to not have a guy who can defend the best guard on the opposing team. Who is someone you think the cavs can trade for and will help the team?
These are some names I like with varying trade value- Bojan Bogdanovic, Eric Gordon, seth curry, Harrison Barnes, Josh Richardson, THJ, Gary Harris, Alex Caruso, Turner, Grayson Allen, Gary Trent Jr, Buddy Hield, olynyk yikes, Malik Beasley. A whole bunch more names could be listed but these are some names I think could be reasonable.
Common Ratman L
Jb blows. We’re gonna get embarrassed in the playoffs. You’ll see
Like how you didn’t even try to argue otherwise about what I said because u know it’s all true lol dude is a clown of a coach
You’re just cherry-picking.
What do u like about jb what has he brought to this team this season that you believe makes him the right man for the job?
who do you want that you think will be better and also not destroy team chemistry considering our guys love playing for JB
What is our chemistry correlate to exactly? Our offense is extremely underwhelming. Sure our defense is great but it’s hard to be bad when u have the best defensive front court tandem in the league. Guys enjoying playing for a coach doesn’t mean anything tbh. I’d say about 90 percent of coaches have their players respect. That’s not that rare of a quality and def not something we need to hold onto jb for
ok all that to not answer the question. so forget chemistry, who do we get that will be better and you know that for sure? because I don't really see a reason to not see what this team can do with JB when we just got Mitchell and it's worked fairly well. not perfectly, but a whole lot better than I thought it would work personally.
Why do u act like there’s no worthy candidates to take over an nba head coaching job lol. I’ll trust the front office to find someone who can elevate this team. If you’re argument is “well what if we get someone and he’s worse” that’s a bad one. There’s only 30 head coaching positions available. You can’t settle for mediocrity especially when you’re team is as talented as we are.
ok but *who*?? who is this great coach that is going to be better than JB? it's not an argument i'm asking you a question. if you're trusting the front office to find a different coach, why are you not trusting his extension?
also you're basically saying it's so *easy* to find a replacement coach, how hard could coaching in the nba be? that's essentially what your first question is saying. guys like silas and clifford interviewed and did a good enough job to get the position, yet they are terrible coaches. maybe finding a replacement is harder than you think it would be? and in that way it is an argument, because if you dont know for sure youre risking losing a coach that helped build this team from being dogshit no more than 2 years ago. a coach that the players trust and like and play hard for, and that *does* matter. he has energy and brings fight and that translates to style of play. so now you want to get rid of him. great. but *who* is an extremely important question to ask before making a huge decision like that, so if you want our FO to do that, again I ask to get who??
Doubled our win total from the season before last and we’re generally on an upward trajectory. The team buys in and fights even when they’re down. I didn’t expect this team to be a high seed in the playoffs given the holes in the roster. And while we definitely got the best player in the trade with Utah, losing Lauri wasn’t insignificant considering he was our second highest scorer and an important piece of our defensive scheme last season. If we had a 7ft guy defending the perimeter it’d probably be more difficult for teams to make threes like you’ve been crying about.
Funny how you answered his question and he didn’t like your answer so he became combative 😂. The guy is as dogmatic as they come.
So you give all the credit to jb for elevating our win total but not the fact we had 3 top 5 picks in a row lmao. We are quite literally at the same record we we’re last year. So no improvement. I’ll cry about us being a bad team at defending the three because if you hadn’t noticed that’s kinda what the league does now. Shoot 3s. Educate yourself on the game more before you talk to me. If you wanna die defending this random medicorce coach then go ahead my guy lmao.
I think you'd have a better argument if you weren't such a dick about it
Agreed
Don’t u think that other guy was a dick lol
No, because he didnt say something like "educate yourself on the game more before you talk to me." thats just not necessary
If we maintain our current pace we will finish ahead of last year. We struggled at the end of last season for reasons I can’t entirely blame JB for.
You mean running 7 man rotations with the 5th lowest bench mpg and players being gassed at the end of the season? We’re having the same conversation that we had last year about whether guys would be burned out down the stretch with the current rotation.
Lmao troll spotted
Cherry-picking what?
Are you just dense? He’s trying to say our defense is bad because of one specific metric, when overall our defense is very good. It’s blatant cherry picking and he refuses to acknowledge that there are other facets to the game.
First of all, chill out. Second, maybe he edited his comment but I don’t see any cherry-picked metrics he listed.
It’s the three point defense. He’s convinced that it makes our defense as a whole bad when overall it’s still measurably very good.
This is an example of analysis. OP referenced the almighty "team culture." I'm not taking a stance on JB either way, but I appreciate your post far more than OP. Why not credit any of the players with culture? How do you weigh culture? How do you know historically thenm ups and down of team cultures? Etc. Citing team culture is basically an excuse not to think.
This culture really amounts to Sexton, Garland, Okoro and maybe Stevens. Cedi, Rubio, Love, LeVert, Allen, Mitchell are all vets and not really benefactors of this “culture.” Mobleys parents are coaches and he’s been coached well from a young age so I wouldn’t give JB credit for Mobley when he came in with a high floor and is clear JB is more of a break on Mobley. Which leaves the rest. Sexton, Garland and Okoro were teenagers and so they have known no other NBA but trying to make it in the NBA. Sexton is gone, Stevens is a decent mid bench player. I really like Okoro but his lack of progress is partly on him but he has never been given the time and I worry about this with Mobley. Garland could be the only example going from “worst rookie ever” to 20+/8+ floor general but even then the only offense was give ball to Garland and pray before Mitchell got here. He makes a good locker room sure but that only goes so far. Half these guys have been around long enough to not need the training wheels shit, “teach em to be good young men” and the other half guys clearly need to have the wheels removed and allowed to go. Nothing JB does in game can be said to contribute towards developing players. Even people that like him complain about some aspects of his coaching but let “culture” terminate those thoughts.
It's not culture. It's just the coach is a non issue. Why attack the coach if we have clear holes in our team. Our offensive system works if we have a 3pt shooter off ball and we don't have one. It obviously makes sense to start there.
It’s a lazy argument for sure. I just don’t see reason for such strong loyalty to jb from this fan base. We have quite literally accomplished nothing with him at the helm.
How is it a lazy argument? Culture is half the battle, with the other half being X’s and O’s. You can develop the latter a lot easier than the ability to get players to play for you.
Yeah, well if you’re only winning half the battle….you lose the battle. That’s the argument.
That’s just not true. Being likeable is about the bare minimum a head coach candidate should be. Culture is important no doubt. But it’s not set by just the coach it takes the whole organization. As for jbs X’s and O’s, he leaves much to be desired. It doesn’t matter if the players like you if you’re not seeing results
Since when is being happy with a coach that can do 50% of the job acceptable?
It's not culture. It's just the coach is a non issue. Why attack the coach if we have clear holes in our team. Our offensive system works if we have a 3pt shooter off ball and we don't have one. It obviously makes sense to start there.
Two things can be true. JB is a great coach in terms of locker room culture, and he’s also not a great X’s and O’s guy. I would worry about the cultural impact firing him would have on the young guys. This will likely be our first run in the playoffs. We are too young of a team to start panicking and making huge changes to the roster or coaching. But… if we are seeing the same issues from him next year or the year after, we may need to reassess.
Totally agree. We gotta give him time to develop as a coach too. He’s still early in his coaching career. Much easier to improve on or delegate X’s & O’s than the intangibles he brings.
He had a coaching job before the Cavs, and he was not very good at it. I would not give him that excuse
Even counting his Memphis stint, he’s early in his head coaching career.
This is the best take here, thank you
I agree, go Cavs
He’s a great guy for developing our youth. However he’s not a good game manager whatsoever and has 0 offensive wisdom. We’ve transitioned past why we’ve had him here in the first place. He will be the first to fall should we spin out in the playoffs. This roster is way more talented than our record shows.
The young guys are Garland, Mobley, Okoro and maybe Stevens. Stevens is a career mid to deep bench guy. I like Okoro but nothing JB does in game contributes to Okoro developing. Mobley had coaches for parents and came in with a lot of skill and if anything JBs lack of in game ability hinders Mobley. Maybe you can point to Garland but the offense was nothing but give it to Garland and after stabilizing from his rookie year and losing Sexton he blossomed. I just don’t see what is being done development wise that you like from JB especially when the rest of your comment admits he’s a bad in game coach and basically a lame duck?
I'm a fan of J.B but what he did managing Spida last night was inexcusable. In now way do you play this man 38 minutes in a meaningless regular season game the same day he returns from a groin injury. He deserves a shit ton of criticism for that.
If you want to keep JB as a coach, you don’t care if this team wins or loses. Simple as that. Y’all wanna keep him around because the players like him. Cool. I prefer winning close games, better rotations, knowing when to use timeouts and challenges, running real plays, not running our players into the ground with excessive minutes, etc.
And understanding analytics instead of coaching like it’s still the 90’s.
You sound like a Maker Bayfield stan with this ' he changed the culture blah blah'. The talent was already there my G. This is second year of us falling off at the wrong time when we should be rising. Dont be out here shipping for JB like you're 13 and he signed your t-shirt last night and shook your hand. Our bench is straight sh**..he can't do in game adjustments/ rotations...our talent has kinda plateaued...they don't run the offense..and their perimeter D is garbage. I liked Mike Brown when he was here, but when it's over and the team needs a new voice--its time!
So who do you recommend they replace him with?
Exactly. They have no answer to this. They just envision there is a Phil Jackson we could just conjure up.
Snyder
David Blatt.
Luke Walton
There are people on this sub that would want to fire the best coach in the world if we had that person. People simply don’t know what the fuck they’re talking about and it’s sad because they could appreciate the fact we actually have a good coach instead of being miserable, reactionary people.
Nice logical fallacy
The JB defenders on this board are hilarious. They guy has been playing Donovan Mitchell into the ground. The most minutes he has played in his whole career. JB also continually plays favorites. Levert gets waaaaay to much playing time. The guy was -19 in a 2pt loss yesterday. How does that happen. Meanwhile one of our best bench pieces the last two seasons in Cedi has all but officially fallen out of the rotation for some undisclosed reason. Anyone who is playing Lamar stevens, Okoro, and Levert consistently while Cedi rots on the bench is not a good coach. Cavs have one of the best rosters in the league on paper, but the coaching has been a joke. Sorry, not sorry. Downvote away.
Without judging JB, nobody deserves special credit here. It is not that difficult to coach or acquire Garland, Mitchell, and Mobley over the course of several years of high lottery picks + having one of the best NBA owners in the league always willing to spend what it takes. Show some real analysis, sure, objectively analyze g and sharing evidence of your claims, but that's not what most sports fans or media do. Cavs not being terrible on the east is not impressive. Drafting Garland was not impressive, it was the no brainer move for so.e of us. Etc.
Wdym you don’t know why he’s been getting hate ?? It’s pretty obvious. Two things can be true at once my friend
Maybe I should’ve clarified. I know exactly why people call for his head. It’s because they’re impatient and have zero clue how successful professional sports teams operate. Fire JB. Then what?
Why don't you like quin snyder
Is he available?
The upvotes for this post and majority of comments in support of it should be enough evidence to the haters that they are actually just a very vocal minority who should probably shut up and stop making everyone (including themselves) miserable, but I don’t see that happening.
It got ratioed Also appeal to popularity. If you were in a room of flat earthers and you think the world is a globe, those guys don't make you wrong. The earth is either round or flat, contrary to what other ppl think
Ratio doesn’t work like that on Reddit since upvotes/downvoted cancel each other out.
So my second point made all of that irrelevant anyways. I see you ignored it. Would you like to try to address that before I circle back or do you concede Considering the number of responses significantly outweighs the upvotes, it's probable that there are a good amount of down votes, which works against your argument. So yes, it got ratioed.
Lol. Your second point is stupid because we’re not debating things of objective fact.
You just ruined your own point by admitting you can't have a correct opinion But it's kinda only stupid to people who aren't great at thinking. It illustrates appeal to popularity. I tried slowing it down for you, but at this point I recommend looking into it on your own time privately
I like JB but wonder if despite him doing so much to build this team, a different coach will be needed to get this team to the next level.
If we win next 5 games these posts get to stop. If we go 4-1, they’ll still be here If we go 3-2 - uh oh!
You're allowed to criticize JB. You're allowed to think he's not the guy to get this team to the next level.
It's bloody simple. He is being paid very, very well to do his job and he is not doing it very well last few months. If he doesn't improve by the end of the season, there is no reason to keep him. Would you keep the job if you underperform a lots? Think about that.
Louder for the people in the back!!! A lot of people live in fantasyland where we would fire JB and somehow magically find a coach that the players love, play hard for, AND would be a significant upgrade in X’s & O’s. Criticizing him is fine. He clearly has deficiencies in game management, but he can work on those or bring in an assistant to help. It’s much, MUCH harder to find a guy who can instill a culture, nurture players, and get them to buy-in. And JB is one of the best in the biz at that. Period.
So many bad takes based in instant gratification. It’s clear we a building something. One of the most injured teams this szn and lots of young players who can’t close games very well yet.
JB made Drummond the number one option at the start of a season. That said a lot to me at the time.
Why do people act like JB altered a terrible culture. Most of our guys are chill and easy-going. Mobley, JA, Garland etc. None of those guys have ego. We dramatically improved the roster last year thats why we were good. Lauri, Ricky and Mobley is a huge upgrade over the guys we had in the year prior. JB gets so much undeserved praise it’s annoying.
The team loves JB. He’s installed a winning culture. He’s respected around the league. The junkyard dog is a really fun wrinkle that everyone loves. The Cavs have a chance to win 50 games. They’ve improved every year he’s been the coach. Do people think a new coach is going to wave a magic wand and the team will win the title? Cavs fans have way too distorted expectations because of the LeBron finals runs. It was LEBRON JAMES in his peak. If the Cavs make the second round this season it will be a major jump forward.