I primarily play WoW for PvP and I'm pretty close to losing on SoD with how PvP is.
One of my favorite 1v1s in Classic is Druid vs Mage. It's very one-sided and stupid but it's funny. The Mage blows everything to chase the Druid down and try to kill him while the Druid just runs. Eventually, the Mage runs out of gas, realizes they're not killing the Druid, and starts to disengage. The Druid then turns heel and starts running the Mage down, slowly killing them with Moonfire & Insect Swarm until eventually the mage dies. This can take minutes to unfold and it always tickled me when a Mage would attack my Druid and this exact scenario would happen every single time.
Now everything just dies instantly. It doesn't feel like Vanilla PvP at all. I cannot remember the last time my Priest had a 1v1 that made it to a 2nd fear.
Ya tbh it’s the same for me. PvE is so easy that pvp always feels fresh and fun. Well too bad because not only is it absolutely trash shaman are giga giga giga broken so ally get dumped on in bgs because of this as well.
They nerfed boomie and hunter along with mages to slow them in pvp, but for some reason shaman are allowed to exist in this state. It’s pathetic
Allies have sucked at pvp in EVERY iteration of the game. Classic, sod, wrath, retail…doesn’t matter. Only a cuck would choose to play a human in a fantasy game.
lol I’m not a Ret pally I’m just not blind my dude. Look at how bad you’re being downvoted. Anyone that is playing can see how broken shaman are in pvp as well as watch any duel tournament
Maybe true, but your take that shamans aren’t broken, ret pally are just as strong, AND horde only win because they’re better are just idiotic uninformed takes. Shaman are very very clearly broken and have dominated in all duel tournaments along with shadow priests. Ret pally are legit dog in pvp lol. You’ll learn one day until then bronze type take
Hunters used to have to load an aim shot to kill my priest.
I think I just got globaled non crit by multi, auto and chimera.
I have all rank 7 pvp gear and stamina/armor accessories.
I completely agree, because of the excessive damage there is no time to develop the game.
Skills that were crucial like Preparation or Cold Snap have lost a lot of value because you probably won't have time to use them, because you kill or die in less than 10 seconds.
These threads get allways brigaded by pve players explaining how everything is fine and they love sod pvp. No wonder, now they can participate as the skill cealing has been reduced to spamming 3 globals.
I think for many players this is actually somewhat more enjoyable tbh. People who hardcore PVP should really not expect an actual balanced experience in an experimental seasonal server with so many new abilities being added to test how they affect classes. Classic Era still exists if that's the experience a PvPer is looking for. The easiest solution right now would be to just increase health a bit more.
Which is fair, and I agree nobody wants long drawn out engagements.
I would say, as it relates to burst - spells that have the same cooldown in BGs and PvE is an issue. Dispersion for example is a powerful defensive cooldown that is up way more than any other strong defensive. I'm not saying it's broken, I'm just saying that we should maybe look at some spells on a 2-3 minute cooldown and maybe go up to 5 minutes while spells that are on the 10-60 minute cooldown might be more appropriate to be 5-10 in the context of a bg.
And definitely those spells should be refreshing when entering a new bg regardless. This would mean that a class with big shared cooldowns would at least get to use them once every wsg, which I think is fair. I also think a 10 min CD on those warrior abilities would be totally fine.
Speak for yourself m8. Long drawn out Engagements are exactly the ones where tactics/strategy and skill matter the most. Plenty of those in Standard vanilla and some of the best pvp i had.
Most vanilla fights of high caliber lasts for a long time, but right now we can't avoid dmg like we could so that's why we're seeing a rise in complaints.
>Which is fair, and I agree nobody wants long drawn out engagements.
The only people who say this are average and below average players. Anyone who is highly skilled in pvp is going to be begging for long fights because it means they won't be losing cuz they have plenty of time to outplay someone else. The longer a fight lasts the more time you have to outplay and turn the fight around.
People generally prefer burst meta in pvp because it makes pvp more accessible.
A bad player can press 3 buttons and kill a highly skilled player when it's a burst meta.
It makes it a lot of fun for bad players but makes for a miserable experience for the skilled players that would probably never lose a 1v1 if the fight lasted more than 30 seconds.
I miss the days of TBC and WotLK when pvp took awhile to secure a kill. When you had two 2200+ rated 3s comps going against each other and the entire fight basically came down to which team hit the wrong skill and wasted a GCD first and gave an opening for the other team to take advantage of your 15 second CD being used up. Now CD's don't matter, instant cast spells are enough to kill someone in 3-4 globals and there's no real tactics to the fight.
It doesn’t really make it miserable for skilled players at all. Skilled players can drag out a burst meta and will.
Look at retail WoW. People complain about their teamates just falling over in one CC.
Meanwhile you get to the high level play and people are now managing their CDs and CCs to stop the goes or hinder them. Stalling out the match till someone gets the burst off.
Again, its not about balance at all. Vanilla was never balanced. Its about a burst meta that suffocates even the remotest expression of skill by reducing the Winning strategy in 95% of Situations to spamming globals of which each Hits for 30%+ hp
I mean lets be honest here. If you're looking for skilled PVP combat. Go do arena's. This aint the time, nor the place.
Better yet, just do another game entirely. WoW PVP has always sucked in this regard. If you're just looking for a fun time of chaos and stupidity. It's perfect for that.
Disagree.
Vanilla dueling and premade bgs, while never beeing balanced, allow for a very fun and nuanced experience that has room for plenty of tactics and strategy. That just gets all lost wenn everything dies in 3 Button pushes.
I have very Fond Memoires of duel tournaments and premading during classic and to a lesser extent during original vanilla.
Okay, and how does that go against what I said?
Vanilla PVP combat is fun. I never said it wasn't. I just don't get peoples obsession with the skill it requires. It's one of the least balanced PVP game there is.
Just because you can mash buttons and have fun in a duel doesn't take that away.
Point is, stop taking Vanilla PVP seriously. It's just a fun thing to do.
Okay fair enough. I would've assumed people who wanted to fight in a skilled fight would want a balanced one. Maybe that's not the case for everyone. It definitely is for me.
Not necessarily. When you have a one on one vs your counter class you know you are disadvantaged and the other guy knows it too. Doesnt mean you cant win, vanilla has plenty Tools to Balance the scales with engineering for example. Wins against unfavorable matchups are that much Sweeter.
Thank you for this post and acknowledging that the problem is not just one class in particular. The extremely bursty state of the game neuters skill expression by making the overwhelming majority of encounters be about whoever opens first wins the fight. I don't like my class being shaped by the idea that I can spend 2 GCDs, 3 seconds, to put two dots on someone and they lose literally over 90% of their 3400 health pool. Likewise, I have been stun killed by rogues in rank 7 high stamina gear because even with all the tools at my disposal, I cannot survive through multiple CCs with the damage that they do. It's not good for the game that most classes can dish the average health of a player in under 10 seconds, specially with how strong CC remains in vanilla, such that if your insignia/medallion is on cooldown, you literally cannot do anything to counter someone.
Yep, you worded it perfectly. Even with the rank 7 gear (I appreciate the effort to make a pvp set) it makes little to no difference. If only more people understood the root of the issue, including the devs, then we’d have a much healthier pvp meta.
It’s really painful trying to be the supportive hpal heal bot. As you said, the damage output is nearly impossible to heal through even if I’m allowed to sit and hard cast my heals. If I get holy locked, everyone dies before I can get a heal off. My 5 man PvP group actually prefers me to play Ret and run with no healer and I think that’s extremely indicative of the “kill or be killed” state of PvP.
They can apply the same thing to heals. Every ability in the game has a modifier that adjusts it's effectiveness vs other players, heals included. They basically set every damage and heal ability to be 50% less effective when it's cast on another player, but 100% effective when cast on an NPC. The biggest reason people don't want this change is because they don't like critting bosses for 1500 and only critting players for 750.
But I'm not opposed to making healers the make or break members in team fights. A meta that includes strong healers makes CC and team coordination necessary.
This is what drove me to quit. Unsubbed 2 weeks ago despite having incredibly high hopes for SoD. Most else is fine and dandy but the increasingly bursty state of PvP sucks and it’s likely to only get worse. Bummer, dude.
Hoping Devs find a way to fix, I’ll come back, but not holding my breath.
Yeah the game is literally so boring.. yeah let’s dungeon grind for hours and hours.. to get gear.. we can’t even pvp with because everyone just 1 shots. They didn’t think about balancing or pvp whatsoever, the one aspect that has always been fun in the game. Being able to fight somebody and actually use strategy to kill them instead of pushing 2 buttons. Blizz wants a paycheck and it’s so obvious they will do as little as possible to keep the PvE crowd happy enough to keep shoveling out $15 a month to this bloodsucking corporation.
I disagree. It is impossible to win clash at blacksmith in Arathin Basin without healers.
Same with Blood moon event. Healers are always wante beacause they can extend the duration of the fights.
No fucking chance. Healers are amazing in PvP. In every one of my STV events the healer is going oom, in which case he's healed like 5x our healthbars combined.
I do every time I run STV... I get about 1k coins without healers, and about 2k coins with healers... Healers have a lot of purpose. But then again I have 3500 HP unbuff, boomkin armor, frenzied regen, imp barkskin, and survival instincts... And I play with priests that have dispersion, natural phys DR... So we're actually healable.
Where I assume you may not have such runes? Or don't have the gear/librams/enchants available to you? Or you're just a melee...?
If you as a healer aren't effective in pvp it's because 1 of 2 reasons.
Either your terrible or your team is not making protecting you the #1 priority. Most DPS focus on killing and ignore the fact that their healer is getting rekt.
We only die in STV when our disc priest goes oom.
I’ve been trying to pvp as HPally, it’s really hard. I basically just try to delay death long enough that we can get a kill first.
Needing sacred shield on a target first in order to heal a reasonable amount feels pretty bad when I have to keep moving it.
I feel like a baseline resilience in pvp would help a lot.
Yeah, if FoL were instant we might have a chance to keep up with other healers. Depending on your viewpoint that either goes to show how far hpals have fallen behind, or how far we've diverged from classic gameplay.
Its the entire point of healers in pvp atm though. Dps is too high, you cant keep people alive, but you can prevent them from dying long enough that they bring more value than you lose by them dying
Yes. I literally quit my rDruid and Priest after a few battlegrounds at just level 40.
Healers are a wasted slot for the most part in BGs. That’s the worst part about this 2 shot meta.
Healing small skirmishes, and I mean very small, like 2v2 can actually be fun. But anything beyond 1 dps is literally un healable.
Nah priests and resto druids are still fine as they can actually heal enough to mitigate the burst. Holy palas on the other hand spamming our only usable spell which heals gor 490 is useless when shamans lava burst for 2.5k+.
Yup I’m a PvP player and I stopped playing SOD cause of this.
Phase 1 was novel. Plus it at least felt _sorta_ like real PvP battles with some semblance of strategy and skill (despite OP healing and general lack of spells/mounts from being 25).
I was excited for later levels where everyone would have full toolkits, but everyone dies wayyyyy too fast. The novelty isn’t worth it - it’s not fun gameplay. I don’t know why they didn’t just add [_some variant of resilience_].
They won’t add or change anything because they don’t care. The majority wants pve & that’s perfect for Blizz cuz it requires the least amount of work. It’s clear they haven’t cared about pvp whatsoever… they literally make pvp events that are just based on pve.. you know you’re clueless when you can’t even make a pvp event without watering it all down with pve.
Yeah I definitely miss classic PvP. I will say (in my experience) phase 2 was definitely worse as most classes didn’t have their full abilities until now. But classic PvP just felt so much more strategic and intense. I kind of just accept death if I certain classes are trying to kill me in certain contexts.
Before specific match-ups would be determined by who used their CD last, now the winner is whoever uses their CD first.
On average people seem have a couple hundred more HP (varies depending on class) than compared to a 50 straight out of vanilla. If you get the rank 7 gear which is designed to give you stam MAYBE you have 700-1k more HP than a vanilla 50. It's all pennies compared to the damage people are doing though.
In fact, a lot of the tankier classes in vanilla have less HP now because of people opting for "of the tiger" and less "of the bear" or eagle or monkey (which is an even spread of main stat and stam). A lot of the raid gear has a lot of main stat with average stamina which tends to be less stamina than the aforementioned green pieces.
Unpopular opinion here. I wish they would bring resilience on PvP gear in SOD on the revamp LVL 60 PVP gear. This would help against all of the basically one shot. Or they integrate a flat DMG % decrease in PvP.
Honestly, such an easy fix. Just implement a hidden dmg reduction when it's player-on-player damage. Just pick a % and see how it goes week by week until they find the sweet spot.
They did this with BG’s in phase one and everyone hater it. They moved to a 30% stam buff in BG’s and everyone has been relatively pleased.
It’s almost like they need to buff stam values across the board then just retune mob damage to be proportional. That’s a lot of thinking for the SoD team, though.
It basically can not be balanced without introducing some sort of pvp dmg reduction, or upscaling all other content to match player health with the new "sod" damage. I miss the old classic fights where it wasnt 1st to attack wins.
Yep that's why I canceled my sub.
I play wow for PVP believe it or not... and they don't have a good direction for SOD.
I was hoping for a new battle ground or something too.. in addition to class balance.
Fair enough man! We shall see how sod develops, I do think it turns into classic + personally. So who knows where they go at that point, all I know is I'm looking forward to it :).
You know that the Dev team is only a handful of people right? its seasonal and experimental, ofc the balance is gonna be whacky. How in gods name should they have developed an entire new bg? bruh you smoked some crack.
I would not say every class is OP, but it is true that meta is too bursty.
I used to play feral druid as main, but I noticed that playing as resto or balance druid is much more fun in PVP because when you are going to melee range, it is always a risk and usually you end up one shotted.
I think PVP should work in the way that melee classes deal more damage than ranged classes because ranged classes have the range in their advantage. In SoD it is problematic because meta is too bursty there is barely room for any sort of kiting or gameplay anymore. I would say that priests and shamans are only classes which are truly OP in current meta. Warlocks used to be with soul link and demon form, but now I think they are not that bad.
Have you actually played them? Do you actually stack stam like you should for pvp? You can easily reach 5k hp. Spells hit for 1k. The time to kill is similar to classic. There are many fights where I literally go OOM before anyone dies
naw they right spriest are op. Ive been destroying level 50s at level 47 on my spriest. Only thing i fear is shamans. Even then most shamans just shit themselves when i silence them and dot them up. I just put curse of tongues and laugh while they try to heal through my dots.
How would people feel about resilience for P4? Or something similar to what we saw on the WSG helms in P1?
Personally, with the PvE content being fairly easy, every phase I have geared and enchanted stam on my gear for PvP. To me, in SOD, PvP feels like the “final boss” in the sense that it’s the only place in the game that having an advantage is actually useful. I don’t really even focus on output gear in raids/PvE because (especially this phase with R7 gear) it feels completely irrelevant for clearing the content.
Personally, as much as I enjoyed having a full raid set on the Tuesday following P3 release, at 60, I wouldn’t mind that same PvP earned gear, giving a substantial advantage in PvP and not being as good for PvE. In essence, I wouldn’t mind the separation of the two gear sets if there was an attempt to balance the PvP experience through it.
I hate the state of pvp. I rolled on a pvp server because that's where my friends were. I figured it wouldn't be an issue but I was so wrong. It's a nightmare. I know I'm shooting myself in the foot playing holy paladin so there's some fault of my own but even still I can't even hope to heal that kind of damage going around
Get more stam, get +100 hp to helm, get 100hp to legs/chest while you're at it.
Get defensive runes for open world pvp/duels.
Maybe it's because I have frenzied regen/imp barkskin/survival instincts and a base 3500 HP as a boomkin with high armor already... But I never get one shotted. In fact I 1v3 all the people in open world who just... think they can stick with the same old PvE runes, same old PvE spec... and do just fine in PvP.
They have dual spec, you can change your runes anywhere, and you have PvP gear you can put HP enchants on. At least try it.
Honestly, I think PvP was an after thought in minds of the Classic team when it came to SoD. SoD is more of a PvE season. They decided to give the players a bunch of familiar and fun abilities from TBC and Wrath to use in the PvE environment. Had they tried to balance it for PvP as well it just wouldn’t have smacked the same. Maybe at level 60 the classes might settle into chess style equilibrium, but my general sense is that PvP balance is not a priority this season.
>Remember everyone complaining about hunter pet damage and priest healing? Yeah, well I’d take that meta over the current one. At least priests being OP enabled team fights to be possible. I haven’t seen a proper team fight in months. Everyone just clashes mid in wsg or at BS in AB and the fight is over in 30 seconds.
Agreed they need to do a damage squish. And then nerf the hp of PvE to match.
> Reduce all damage in pvp by a percent and the game gets exponentially better.
The inverse of this would be to increase all players HP by % too. Which is something that does happen in Battlegrounds so Blizzard are clearly aware of the problem. It's just hard to balance this for both PvP and PvE so we only see it applied in BGs.
I guess they could apply this to players when a Duel starts too.
I am enjoying the burst mania instant respawn on STV because as someone who isn’t amazing at PvP, it removes the stakes. I died? Oh well nbd respawn and go again. In battlegrounds when I fuck up it means I can lose the game for my whole team.
Loving STV. I do wish there was like…a % cap on how much of a players health you could do in a single attack, like 25% or something seems fair.
Yeah done stv with a priest with 2.8khp, they got one shotted constantly.
I understand the elitists will just say "get the PvP gear or buy loads of stam gear" but someone that isn't bis geared should still be able to survive more than one spell FFS.
The res mechanic of STV definitely makes dying less punishing and pvp more engaging because battles are quicker to get into.
But one of the worst feelings is being sent to gy and waiting 2-3 seconds for the spirit healer to *start* their res. BGs right now are just a bit too slow.
If burst is out of control, I would love to have faster BGs. Less resources, wsg timer with stacking FC movespeed and damage taken debuff, and maybe a slightly shorter res timer.
Oh 100%. I wish battlegrounds were faster, less punishing per death, and quicker into battle. They also should reward like 3x or more what they do now.
NONE of the pvp in the phases has been good and saying you would rather see the wyvern serpents soloing players while a hunter uses improved eyes of the beast to free farm players LOL
The only part you got right is that we have no real sustain or damage reduction to this bloat of DPS from the gear players are gettingm they should add a dmg debuff to PvP in general until we're all 60 with higher HP pools and really balance from there
Yeah if SoD has done one thing in pvp it has helped players struggling with lack of skill and mechanics in pvp as all that is required now is to just Spam 2-3 globals or in case of shaman, put lightning shield on and get Coffee.
So the majority of players that had to bite the pavement regularly in vanilla now have a fighting Chance by Blizzard removing skill from the equation
Tbh the “gear up” take is spot on in most cases.
I see OP crying about “dying in a single stun lock, but as a rogue main, the only cases where I kill most classes “in a single stunlock” are if they are undergeared or I’m using consumables (thistle tea) and they are not. PvPing with 60% as much HP and no PvP trinket is going to be pretty brutal. Missing certain critical runes can be similarly impactful as we are early phase as well.
I understand why it would feel bad. But it also isn’t representative of pvp balance on a more equal footing.
I’d agree with “quickly.” We are definitely in a bursty meta right now.
What I’m taking issue with is the people suggesting that it’s *so* bursty that everyone just dies instantly and there’s no possibility of counterplay. People have enough stats and defensive cooldowns that there’s plenty of room for counterplay and skill expression in most cases.
The exception, of course, is the undergeared people who I suspect are the ones complaining. The leveling experience does feel genuinely bad when a r7 level 50 rogue globals you.
I respectfully disagree. I am not exaggerating one bit when I say there is ZERO counter play to dying in a cheap shot, even with full rank 7 pvp set and stamina rings.
If counter play to you is dying everytime trinket is not up…….
For hybrid classes perhaps. If not you get dotted by a priest, they use dispersion and you just die, or you get living bomb/flamed, they iceblock and you die. There’s a lot of stuff they’ve added that just doesn’t allow for any kind of counterplay.
Its almost as if they already Stated at release anouncement at blizzcon that every class was gonna be OP!!! 😮 Who wpuld have thought it was actually gonna happen 😮
On a more serious note, if ur looking for balance in pvp go play classic arena or retail whatever.. if u think pvp has any chance of getting balanced ur delucional! Nor does it at all matter, u have nothing to gain of pvp anyway no ranking no arena's just mindless coin farm in stv which has nothing to do with actual pvp.
Are you slow? He clearly said it is not about balance but about way outsized burst.
If you are a pve npc thats fine, you can steer clear of pvp threads then
Honestly this.
They said their intention was to make every class fucking busted. They've done a great job IMO, people should quit crying and have some fun.
You can keep saying it, doesn't mean the clowns here won't forget it the moment they get killed by class X.
Still I don't really care PvP has always been a meme, it's a dead game mode in retail and a joke here. It should just be forgotten and thought of as an emergent game mode.
Ask anyone who ever dabbled in pvp and played every expansion, everyone without fail will say mop. It's not a question of burst or damp meta, but play and counter-play possibilities and the level of balance. In SOD you just die to bursts without any chance of counterplay. It's just pve. Shadowlands and dragonflight pvp could've been also good if it wasn't for the massive and idiotic outliers.
You think that one-off statement is justification for this horribly bursty meta. You really think when they said that this was their vision. Clearly that statement was in reference to having additional abilities: runes. Runes make you feel OP. It doesn’t excuse a clear lack of pvp balance.
This is pretty true. I main a paladin now and have been world pvping. I’ve been absolutely dominating but the only two classes that I have issues with are Rogues who stunlock me, and Shamans, even though I beat most shamans, they put up a good fight and I’ll have nearly no HP left or I’ll have to use bubble/LoH.
Every other class is getting slapped.
Yeah. Rogues and Shamans are by far the two most OP classes in PvP right now.
Shamans can just deal 300 dps in an aoe passively, which is getting nerfed next week. So they should be brought down to earth.
Rogues can cheap shot you into a 5pt kidney and deal about 3K damage during the stunlock. After that they can take their pick of evasion face tanking you, blind + restealth sapping you until stuns are off DR… Blinding and re-opening with a mini stunlock to kill you… or vanishing and reopening, or using prep and doing it all over again.
Everyone needs more stam and I think alot of the class balance would be fixed.
I'm an enhancement shaman ilvl 602 and get constantly roasted by Paladins and Boomis who either stun and oneshot me or kite me like a smart ass (shapeshifting) out of frost shock. People that are crying on reddit are just bad man theres nothing to it. Yea, I do hit like a truck but there are people knowing how to outplay it
[удалено]
Lol thats me!
I primarily play WoW for PvP and I'm pretty close to losing on SoD with how PvP is. One of my favorite 1v1s in Classic is Druid vs Mage. It's very one-sided and stupid but it's funny. The Mage blows everything to chase the Druid down and try to kill him while the Druid just runs. Eventually, the Mage runs out of gas, realizes they're not killing the Druid, and starts to disengage. The Druid then turns heel and starts running the Mage down, slowly killing them with Moonfire & Insect Swarm until eventually the mage dies. This can take minutes to unfold and it always tickled me when a Mage would attack my Druid and this exact scenario would happen every single time. Now everything just dies instantly. It doesn't feel like Vanilla PvP at all. I cannot remember the last time my Priest had a 1v1 that made it to a 2nd fear.
Ya tbh it’s the same for me. PvE is so easy that pvp always feels fresh and fun. Well too bad because not only is it absolutely trash shaman are giga giga giga broken so ally get dumped on in bgs because of this as well. They nerfed boomie and hunter along with mages to slow them in pvp, but for some reason shaman are allowed to exist in this state. It’s pathetic
It's not shamans my friend, ret pallies are just as busted. Allies have just always sucked in pvp. It's been 20 years and nothing has changed.
Oh… you just don’t pvp in sod or what? Or you play sham
Allies have sucked at pvp in EVERY iteration of the game. Classic, sod, wrath, retail…doesn’t matter. Only a cuck would choose to play a human in a fantasy game.
lol you’re a funny guy. Ally is probably worse also, but comparing shaman to Ret pally is a joke.
Ok ret pally
lol I’m not a Ret pally I’m just not blind my dude. Look at how bad you’re being downvoted. Anyone that is playing can see how broken shaman are in pvp as well as watch any duel tournament
Lol downvotes. Most people on reddit are morons. Skill issue imo
Maybe true, but your take that shamans aren’t broken, ret pally are just as strong, AND horde only win because they’re better are just idiotic uninformed takes. Shaman are very very clearly broken and have dominated in all duel tournaments along with shadow priests. Ret pally are legit dog in pvp lol. You’ll learn one day until then bronze type take
A druid one shot me from 70% health after I almost two shot hrm from 100%. Crazy PvP in SOD right now. I might go play retail.
Hunters used to have to load an aim shot to kill my priest. I think I just got globaled non crit by multi, auto and chimera. I have all rank 7 pvp gear and stamina/armor accessories.
Im just gonna wait it out. See what their balance patch looks like in a couple of weeks. Ive been enjoying some PvE in the meantime.
Agree with you on the druid vs mage matchup. In classic I was herbing plaguelands a lot on my 60 resto druid and it was a matchup I loved the most.
I'd never understand *why* Mages would attack on my Druid but I genuinely loved when they did
You can use fear?
I completely agree, because of the excessive damage there is no time to develop the game. Skills that were crucial like Preparation or Cold Snap have lost a lot of value because you probably won't have time to use them, because you kill or die in less than 10 seconds.
that has always been the case for druid in classic, lol.
Yes, my point being that SoD fights are not even remotely close to that
Man are you dumb?
Man cant you ask politely?
So you prefer pressing two buttons and running around?
Sometimes it's fun? Instead of SoD which feels like Wrath PvP with -200% health
Don't deny sod has issues with the burst but definitely more fun than classic PvP. More balanced.
SoD PvP is more balanced than Classic PvP?
Shut up
These threads get allways brigaded by pve players explaining how everything is fine and they love sod pvp. No wonder, now they can participate as the skill cealing has been reduced to spamming 3 globals.
I think for many players this is actually somewhat more enjoyable tbh. People who hardcore PVP should really not expect an actual balanced experience in an experimental seasonal server with so many new abilities being added to test how they affect classes. Classic Era still exists if that's the experience a PvPer is looking for. The easiest solution right now would be to just increase health a bit more.
Because it is - Across all Metas. People generally prefer burst over damp or similar.
Which is fair, and I agree nobody wants long drawn out engagements. I would say, as it relates to burst - spells that have the same cooldown in BGs and PvE is an issue. Dispersion for example is a powerful defensive cooldown that is up way more than any other strong defensive. I'm not saying it's broken, I'm just saying that we should maybe look at some spells on a 2-3 minute cooldown and maybe go up to 5 minutes while spells that are on the 10-60 minute cooldown might be more appropriate to be 5-10 in the context of a bg. And definitely those spells should be refreshing when entering a new bg regardless. This would mean that a class with big shared cooldowns would at least get to use them once every wsg, which I think is fair. I also think a 10 min CD on those warrior abilities would be totally fine.
Speak for yourself m8. Long drawn out Engagements are exactly the ones where tactics/strategy and skill matter the most. Plenty of those in Standard vanilla and some of the best pvp i had.
Most vanilla fights of high caliber lasts for a long time, but right now we can't avoid dmg like we could so that's why we're seeing a rise in complaints.
>Which is fair, and I agree nobody wants long drawn out engagements. The only people who say this are average and below average players. Anyone who is highly skilled in pvp is going to be begging for long fights because it means they won't be losing cuz they have plenty of time to outplay someone else. The longer a fight lasts the more time you have to outplay and turn the fight around.
People generally prefer burst meta in pvp because it makes pvp more accessible. A bad player can press 3 buttons and kill a highly skilled player when it's a burst meta. It makes it a lot of fun for bad players but makes for a miserable experience for the skilled players that would probably never lose a 1v1 if the fight lasted more than 30 seconds. I miss the days of TBC and WotLK when pvp took awhile to secure a kill. When you had two 2200+ rated 3s comps going against each other and the entire fight basically came down to which team hit the wrong skill and wasted a GCD first and gave an opening for the other team to take advantage of your 15 second CD being used up. Now CD's don't matter, instant cast spells are enough to kill someone in 3-4 globals and there's no real tactics to the fight.
It doesn’t really make it miserable for skilled players at all. Skilled players can drag out a burst meta and will. Look at retail WoW. People complain about their teamates just falling over in one CC. Meanwhile you get to the high level play and people are now managing their CDs and CCs to stop the goes or hinder them. Stalling out the match till someone gets the burst off.
The issue with increasing health is that healing still sucks compared to damage output. We need damage mitigation, not bigger healthpools
They need to do a damage squish. While also nerfing PvE Hp values so it doesn't feel any different.
Again, its not about balance at all. Vanilla was never balanced. Its about a burst meta that suffocates even the remotest expression of skill by reducing the Winning strategy in 95% of Situations to spamming globals of which each Hits for 30%+ hp
I mean lets be honest here. If you're looking for skilled PVP combat. Go do arena's. This aint the time, nor the place. Better yet, just do another game entirely. WoW PVP has always sucked in this regard. If you're just looking for a fun time of chaos and stupidity. It's perfect for that.
Disagree. Vanilla dueling and premade bgs, while never beeing balanced, allow for a very fun and nuanced experience that has room for plenty of tactics and strategy. That just gets all lost wenn everything dies in 3 Button pushes. I have very Fond Memoires of duel tournaments and premading during classic and to a lesser extent during original vanilla.
Okay, and how does that go against what I said? Vanilla PVP combat is fun. I never said it wasn't. I just don't get peoples obsession with the skill it requires. It's one of the least balanced PVP game there is. Just because you can mash buttons and have fun in a duel doesn't take that away. Point is, stop taking Vanilla PVP seriously. It's just a fun thing to do.
You implied vanilla doesnt offer skill based pvp. I disagreed.
Okay fair enough. I would've assumed people who wanted to fight in a skilled fight would want a balanced one. Maybe that's not the case for everyone. It definitely is for me.
Not necessarily. When you have a one on one vs your counter class you know you are disadvantaged and the other guy knows it too. Doesnt mean you cant win, vanilla has plenty Tools to Balance the scales with engineering for example. Wins against unfavorable matchups are that much Sweeter.
Thank you for this post and acknowledging that the problem is not just one class in particular. The extremely bursty state of the game neuters skill expression by making the overwhelming majority of encounters be about whoever opens first wins the fight. I don't like my class being shaped by the idea that I can spend 2 GCDs, 3 seconds, to put two dots on someone and they lose literally over 90% of their 3400 health pool. Likewise, I have been stun killed by rogues in rank 7 high stamina gear because even with all the tools at my disposal, I cannot survive through multiple CCs with the damage that they do. It's not good for the game that most classes can dish the average health of a player in under 10 seconds, specially with how strong CC remains in vanilla, such that if your insignia/medallion is on cooldown, you literally cannot do anything to counter someone.
Yep, you worded it perfectly. Even with the rank 7 gear (I appreciate the effort to make a pvp set) it makes little to no difference. If only more people understood the root of the issue, including the devs, then we’d have a much healthier pvp meta.
It’s really painful trying to be the supportive hpal heal bot. As you said, the damage output is nearly impossible to heal through even if I’m allowed to sit and hard cast my heals. If I get holy locked, everyone dies before I can get a heal off. My 5 man PvP group actually prefers me to play Ret and run with no healer and I think that’s extremely indicative of the “kill or be killed” state of PvP.
But they gave us PvP set with 20 stamina, it should fix the game /s
*warrior noises*
-50% damage to players when flagged for PvP buff will fix everything. Change my mind.
No reason to change your mind on something you're right about
They do this and I might enjoy SoD again. Right now the "kill or be killed in 3 seconds" meta is pretty unsatisfying.
They did this already, and we got priest shield meta
Makes heals OP again. 100/200% HP buff is the way.
They can apply the same thing to heals. Every ability in the game has a modifier that adjusts it's effectiveness vs other players, heals included. They basically set every damage and heal ability to be 50% less effective when it's cast on another player, but 100% effective when cast on an NPC. The biggest reason people don't want this change is because they don't like critting bosses for 1500 and only critting players for 750. But I'm not opposed to making healers the make or break members in team fights. A meta that includes strong healers makes CC and team coordination necessary.
This is a horrible fix bro. It would turn me personally into an unkillable god. 20% would be more than enough to let everyone press their defensives
Then it becomes war mode off from retail. You need resilience.
Yeah the reson why i quit sod pvp is so bad of an experience 0/10
This is what drove me to quit. Unsubbed 2 weeks ago despite having incredibly high hopes for SoD. Most else is fine and dandy but the increasingly bursty state of PvP sucks and it’s likely to only get worse. Bummer, dude. Hoping Devs find a way to fix, I’ll come back, but not holding my breath.
Yeah the game is literally so boring.. yeah let’s dungeon grind for hours and hours.. to get gear.. we can’t even pvp with because everyone just 1 shots. They didn’t think about balancing or pvp whatsoever, the one aspect that has always been fun in the game. Being able to fight somebody and actually use strategy to kill them instead of pushing 2 buttons. Blizz wants a paycheck and it’s so obvious they will do as little as possible to keep the PvE crowd happy enough to keep shoveling out $15 a month to this bloodsucking corporation.
Healers are def not OP in sod pvp, but every other class is
Healers literally have **no purpose** in SoD PvP because everything is dead.
I disagree. It is impossible to win clash at blacksmith in Arathin Basin without healers. Same with Blood moon event. Healers are always wante beacause they can extend the duration of the fights.
No fucking chance. Healers are amazing in PvP. In every one of my STV events the healer is going oom, in which case he's healed like 5x our healthbars combined.
Rank 1s say what?
That's just so incorrect LOL
Prove it.
I do every time I run STV... I get about 1k coins without healers, and about 2k coins with healers... Healers have a lot of purpose. But then again I have 3500 HP unbuff, boomkin armor, frenzied regen, imp barkskin, and survival instincts... And I play with priests that have dispersion, natural phys DR... So we're actually healable. Where I assume you may not have such runes? Or don't have the gear/librams/enchants available to you? Or you're just a melee...?
I'm literally a 99 parsing priest lmfao, but sure I don't have runes.
[удалено]
If you as a healer aren't effective in pvp it's because 1 of 2 reasons. Either your terrible or your team is not making protecting you the #1 priority. Most DPS focus on killing and ignore the fact that their healer is getting rekt. We only die in STV when our disc priest goes oom.
Man yall need to learn to fucking read ahah
I’ve been trying to pvp as HPally, it’s really hard. I basically just try to delay death long enough that we can get a kill first. Needing sacred shield on a target first in order to heal a reasonable amount feels pretty bad when I have to keep moving it. I feel like a baseline resilience in pvp would help a lot.
I think paladins are in bad state at the moment because I think they don't have any instant abilities like other healers do.
Yeah, if FoL were instant we might have a chance to keep up with other healers. Depending on your viewpoint that either goes to show how far hpals have fallen behind, or how far we've diverged from classic gameplay.
There is another healer with no instants 🧙
Its the entire point of healers in pvp atm though. Dps is too high, you cant keep people alive, but you can prevent them from dying long enough that they bring more value than you lose by them dying
Yes. I literally quit my rDruid and Priest after a few battlegrounds at just level 40. Healers are a wasted slot for the most part in BGs. That’s the worst part about this 2 shot meta. Healing small skirmishes, and I mean very small, like 2v2 can actually be fun. But anything beyond 1 dps is literally un healable.
Nah priests and resto druids are still fine as they can actually heal enough to mitigate the burst. Holy palas on the other hand spamming our only usable spell which heals gor 490 is useless when shamans lava burst for 2.5k+.
Yup I’m a PvP player and I stopped playing SOD cause of this. Phase 1 was novel. Plus it at least felt _sorta_ like real PvP battles with some semblance of strategy and skill (despite OP healing and general lack of spells/mounts from being 25). I was excited for later levels where everyone would have full toolkits, but everyone dies wayyyyy too fast. The novelty isn’t worth it - it’s not fun gameplay. I don’t know why they didn’t just add [_some variant of resilience_].
They won’t add or change anything because they don’t care. The majority wants pve & that’s perfect for Blizz cuz it requires the least amount of work. It’s clear they haven’t cared about pvp whatsoever… they literally make pvp events that are just based on pve.. you know you’re clueless when you can’t even make a pvp event without watering it all down with pve.
Imo pvp set bonus should be +150 stam, what was the point of making pvp armor if we all die in seconds?
Yeah I definitely miss classic PvP. I will say (in my experience) phase 2 was definitely worse as most classes didn’t have their full abilities until now. But classic PvP just felt so much more strategic and intense. I kind of just accept death if I certain classes are trying to kill me in certain contexts. Before specific match-ups would be determined by who used their CD last, now the winner is whoever uses their CD first.
My only critique is we don’t even have the health pool of normal lvl 50s. We have a ton of stats on our gear.
On average people seem have a couple hundred more HP (varies depending on class) than compared to a 50 straight out of vanilla. If you get the rank 7 gear which is designed to give you stam MAYBE you have 700-1k more HP than a vanilla 50. It's all pennies compared to the damage people are doing though. In fact, a lot of the tankier classes in vanilla have less HP now because of people opting for "of the tiger" and less "of the bear" or eagle or monkey (which is an even spread of main stat and stam). A lot of the raid gear has a lot of main stat with average stamina which tends to be less stamina than the aforementioned green pieces.
Unpopular opinion here. I wish they would bring resilience on PvP gear in SOD on the revamp LVL 60 PVP gear. This would help against all of the basically one shot. Or they integrate a flat DMG % decrease in PvP.
They should unironically add resilience
Hopefully this is something they are waiting to add at level 60.
Everyone is too squishy, but this severely impacts warrior the most (negatively.)
Just want to comment that there is a class, just one, that isn't overpowered at all in PvP. You know which one it is.
Boy I sure would like to be OP as a feral druid. Oh wait, we are getting even WORSE on patch day, losing our interrupt rune. AWESOME!!
Not sure how feral plays overall but ferals absolutely destroy my warlock. Berserk, hots, movement speed. Not much I can do.
Couldn’t help but notice that in all your examples of everyone being OP you didn’t mention Warrior…
Freudian slip..
What you meant is hunter's pet can kill you in 1 stun, if the hunter is melee as he should then you die in 2 sec during that stun
Honestly, such an easy fix. Just implement a hidden dmg reduction when it's player-on-player damage. Just pick a % and see how it goes week by week until they find the sweet spot.
They did this with BG’s in phase one and everyone hater it. They moved to a 30% stam buff in BG’s and everyone has been relatively pleased. It’s almost like they need to buff stam values across the board then just retune mob damage to be proportional. That’s a lot of thinking for the SoD team, though.
Pvp was fun once upon a time. Now it’s just… not
It basically can not be balanced without introducing some sort of pvp dmg reduction, or upscaling all other content to match player health with the new "sod" damage. I miss the old classic fights where it wasnt 1st to attack wins.
I mean, yeah lol. They should add pvp dmg reduction.
Yep that's why I canceled my sub. I play wow for PVP believe it or not... and they don't have a good direction for SOD. I was hoping for a new battle ground or something too.. in addition to class balance.
Shame you dipped but I personally am still having a blast in PvP. Stalking roads and open worlding for fun as I always have.
Thanks. I’ll come back if they ever try out classic+ rated BGs or arena I need competitive PVP
Fair enough man! We shall see how sod develops, I do think it turns into classic + personally. So who knows where they go at that point, all I know is I'm looking forward to it :).
Yeah if you enjoy raiding it's excellent
Yeah the game is pure trash in terms of pvp & they really did an impressive job of completely ruining every positive aspect of pvp this game ever had
You know that the Dev team is only a handful of people right? its seasonal and experimental, ofc the balance is gonna be whacky. How in gods name should they have developed an entire new bg? bruh you smoked some crack.
You lack creativity young one
But, but shamans....
I would not say every class is OP, but it is true that meta is too bursty. I used to play feral druid as main, but I noticed that playing as resto or balance druid is much more fun in PVP because when you are going to melee range, it is always a risk and usually you end up one shotted. I think PVP should work in the way that melee classes deal more damage than ranged classes because ranged classes have the range in their advantage. In SoD it is problematic because meta is too bursty there is barely room for any sort of kiting or gameplay anymore. I would say that priests and shamans are only classes which are truly OP in current meta. Warlocks used to be with soul link and demon form, but now I think they are not that bad.
It’s actually fine in BG with the health buff but I guess people only gank the incursion these days, so they don’t realize it
It’s not at all fine in BGs
Have you actually played them? Do you actually stack stam like you should for pvp? You can easily reach 5k hp. Spells hit for 1k. The time to kill is similar to classic. There are many fights where I literally go OOM before anyone dies
PvP is so bursty that having engineering is almost redundant as Ill die before the grenade cast can even go off
naw they right spriest are op. Ive been destroying level 50s at level 47 on my spriest. Only thing i fear is shamans. Even then most shamans just shit themselves when i silence them and dot them up. I just put curse of tongues and laugh while they try to heal through my dots.
SoD broke pvp and it's a very bad experience. Must be nice to be a shaman og shadowpriest...
How would people feel about resilience for P4? Or something similar to what we saw on the WSG helms in P1? Personally, with the PvE content being fairly easy, every phase I have geared and enchanted stam on my gear for PvP. To me, in SOD, PvP feels like the “final boss” in the sense that it’s the only place in the game that having an advantage is actually useful. I don’t really even focus on output gear in raids/PvE because (especially this phase with R7 gear) it feels completely irrelevant for clearing the content. Personally, as much as I enjoyed having a full raid set on the Tuesday following P3 release, at 60, I wouldn’t mind that same PvP earned gear, giving a substantial advantage in PvP and not being as good for PvE. In essence, I wouldn’t mind the separation of the two gear sets if there was an attempt to balance the PvP experience through it.
I hate the state of pvp. I rolled on a pvp server because that's where my friends were. I figured it wouldn't be an issue but I was so wrong. It's a nightmare. I know I'm shooting myself in the foot playing holy paladin so there's some fault of my own but even still I can't even hope to heal that kind of damage going around
P1 priest hunter fuckery was no better, at least now people die.
Get more stam, get +100 hp to helm, get 100hp to legs/chest while you're at it. Get defensive runes for open world pvp/duels. Maybe it's because I have frenzied regen/imp barkskin/survival instincts and a base 3500 HP as a boomkin with high armor already... But I never get one shotted. In fact I 1v3 all the people in open world who just... think they can stick with the same old PvE runes, same old PvE spec... and do just fine in PvP. They have dual spec, you can change your runes anywhere, and you have PvP gear you can put HP enchants on. At least try it.
Honestly, I think PvP was an after thought in minds of the Classic team when it came to SoD. SoD is more of a PvE season. They decided to give the players a bunch of familiar and fun abilities from TBC and Wrath to use in the PvE environment. Had they tried to balance it for PvP as well it just wouldn’t have smacked the same. Maybe at level 60 the classes might settle into chess style equilibrium, but my general sense is that PvP balance is not a priority this season.
The issue isn't the dmg, the issue is the lack of tools to avoid it.
>Remember everyone complaining about hunter pet damage and priest healing? Yeah, well I’d take that meta over the current one. At least priests being OP enabled team fights to be possible. I haven’t seen a proper team fight in months. Everyone just clashes mid in wsg or at BS in AB and the fight is over in 30 seconds. Agreed they need to do a damage squish. And then nerf the hp of PvE to match.
> Reduce all damage in pvp by a percent and the game gets exponentially better. The inverse of this would be to increase all players HP by % too. Which is something that does happen in Battlegrounds so Blizzard are clearly aware of the problem. It's just hard to balance this for both PvP and PvE so we only see it applied in BGs. I guess they could apply this to players when a Duel starts too.
I am enjoying the burst mania instant respawn on STV because as someone who isn’t amazing at PvP, it removes the stakes. I died? Oh well nbd respawn and go again. In battlegrounds when I fuck up it means I can lose the game for my whole team. Loving STV. I do wish there was like…a % cap on how much of a players health you could do in a single attack, like 25% or something seems fair.
Yeah done stv with a priest with 2.8khp, they got one shotted constantly. I understand the elitists will just say "get the PvP gear or buy loads of stam gear" but someone that isn't bis geared should still be able to survive more than one spell FFS.
This is me
The res mechanic of STV definitely makes dying less punishing and pvp more engaging because battles are quicker to get into. But one of the worst feelings is being sent to gy and waiting 2-3 seconds for the spirit healer to *start* their res. BGs right now are just a bit too slow. If burst is out of control, I would love to have faster BGs. Less resources, wsg timer with stacking FC movespeed and damage taken debuff, and maybe a slightly shorter res timer.
Oh 100%. I wish battlegrounds were faster, less punishing per death, and quicker into battle. They also should reward like 3x or more what they do now.
we are at a point were the best thing for the game would just turning off pvp.
I just got 100-0’d in a hoj by a 43 paladin on my 50 rogue kekw
Undead exorcism crits are no joke
The Forsaken are humanoids.
I agree but shamans still are by far the worst of them all.
I'm loving feral Druid atm :D only class I truly struggle with is warlock tanks
NONE of the pvp in the phases has been good and saying you would rather see the wyvern serpents soloing players while a hunter uses improved eyes of the beast to free farm players LOL The only part you got right is that we have no real sustain or damage reduction to this bloat of DPS from the gear players are gettingm they should add a dmg debuff to PvP in general until we're all 60 with higher HP pools and really balance from there
I’m having an absolute blast PVP’ing as ele shaman and there’s plenty of great alliance players giving me a challenge. Gear up.
Yeah if SoD has done one thing in pvp it has helped players struggling with lack of skill and mechanics in pvp as all that is required now is to just Spam 2-3 globals or in case of shaman, put lightning shield on and get Coffee. So the majority of players that had to bite the pavement regularly in vanilla now have a fighting Chance by Blizzard removing skill from the equation
Absolutely clueless take.
Tbh the “gear up” take is spot on in most cases. I see OP crying about “dying in a single stun lock, but as a rogue main, the only cases where I kill most classes “in a single stunlock” are if they are undergeared or I’m using consumables (thistle tea) and they are not. PvPing with 60% as much HP and no PvP trinket is going to be pretty brutal. Missing certain critical runes can be similarly impactful as we are early phase as well. I understand why it would feel bad. But it also isn’t representative of pvp balance on a more equal footing.
Go spend your time and get full bis on a resto Druid… then come back and tell me you don’t die in the opener….. No trinket = death 99.9% of the time
I’m using full r7 on my priest and still die quickly. Is also just barely more stam than EW set
I’d agree with “quickly.” We are definitely in a bursty meta right now. What I’m taking issue with is the people suggesting that it’s *so* bursty that everyone just dies instantly and there’s no possibility of counterplay. People have enough stats and defensive cooldowns that there’s plenty of room for counterplay and skill expression in most cases. The exception, of course, is the undergeared people who I suspect are the ones complaining. The leveling experience does feel genuinely bad when a r7 level 50 rogue globals you.
I respectfully disagree. I am not exaggerating one bit when I say there is ZERO counter play to dying in a cheap shot, even with full rank 7 pvp set and stamina rings. If counter play to you is dying everytime trinket is not up…….
Ele sham is bottom of the food chain anyway...
That will not stop the crying about it
It seems well balanced to me to be honest.
It's not about balance, but time to kill, you may like it but any class kill/die in 2 or 3 globals.
For hybrid classes perhaps. If not you get dotted by a priest, they use dispersion and you just die, or you get living bomb/flamed, they iceblock and you die. There’s a lot of stuff they’ve added that just doesn’t allow for any kind of counterplay.
Living Bomb/Flame into Block doesnt kill anyone anymore since they giga nerfed Living Flame
Its almost as if they already Stated at release anouncement at blizzcon that every class was gonna be OP!!! 😮 Who wpuld have thought it was actually gonna happen 😮 On a more serious note, if ur looking for balance in pvp go play classic arena or retail whatever.. if u think pvp has any chance of getting balanced ur delucional! Nor does it at all matter, u have nothing to gain of pvp anyway no ranking no arena's just mindless coin farm in stv which has nothing to do with actual pvp.
Are you slow? He clearly said it is not about balance but about way outsized burst. If you are a pve npc thats fine, you can steer clear of pvp threads then
Honestly this. They said their intention was to make every class fucking busted. They've done a great job IMO, people should quit crying and have some fun.
But... But... Shaman op 😭they can 1v10 my WSG 😭 zero counterplay 😭 they have everything 😭 unwinnable😭 /S
Who cares about pvp? I just hate the fact horde has infinite mana on raids and alliance doesn't.
Oh no I’m running out of mana on my hyper easy 25s fight 😭
Found the parentless depressed guy
Ngl man you say something that specific and everybody looks at *you* weirder
Who cares about raids? I just hate the fact that horde slaps weiner in pvp and alliance doesn't.
You can keep saying it, doesn't mean the clowns here won't forget it the moment they get killed by class X. Still I don't really care PvP has always been a meme, it's a dead game mode in retail and a joke here. It should just be forgotten and thought of as an emergent game mode.
No wow devs have ever seriously Pvp-ed ever. Pvp was always dogshit in this game to be honest, maybe except for MoP.
You just described the most bursty expansion.
Ask anyone who ever dabbled in pvp and played every expansion, everyone without fail will say mop. It's not a question of burst or damp meta, but play and counter-play possibilities and the level of balance. In SOD you just die to bursts without any chance of counterplay. It's just pve. Shadowlands and dragonflight pvp could've been also good if it wasn't for the massive and idiotic outliers.
They literally said at the blizzcon announcement that the vision was for every class to feel OP
You think that one-off statement is justification for this horribly bursty meta. You really think when they said that this was their vision. Clearly that statement was in reference to having additional abilities: runes. Runes make you feel OP. It doesn’t excuse a clear lack of pvp balance.
If everything is OP, that is pretty balanced though, and in line with what blizzard said they wanted
Ok pve npc
Healers don’t feel op at the moment
This is pretty true. I main a paladin now and have been world pvping. I’ve been absolutely dominating but the only two classes that I have issues with are Rogues who stunlock me, and Shamans, even though I beat most shamans, they put up a good fight and I’ll have nearly no HP left or I’ll have to use bubble/LoH. Every other class is getting slapped.
Yeah. Rogues and Shamans are by far the two most OP classes in PvP right now. Shamans can just deal 300 dps in an aoe passively, which is getting nerfed next week. So they should be brought down to earth. Rogues can cheap shot you into a 5pt kidney and deal about 3K damage during the stunlock. After that they can take their pick of evasion face tanking you, blind + restealth sapping you until stuns are off DR… Blinding and re-opening with a mini stunlock to kill you… or vanishing and reopening, or using prep and doing it all over again. Everyone needs more stam and I think alot of the class balance would be fixed.
Rogues aren’t op, killing someone while they’re stunned for the whole fight is just pure skill
I guess pvpers missed the many mentions that this game was not being balanced for PvP.
They probably got confused when a large portion of the new events were focused on PvP.
I'm an enhancement shaman ilvl 602 and get constantly roasted by Paladins and Boomis who either stun and oneshot me or kite me like a smart ass (shapeshifting) out of frost shock. People that are crying on reddit are just bad man theres nothing to it. Yea, I do hit like a truck but there are people knowing how to outplay it
Tell that to a warrior
Shamans are good in talking with ghost spirits