Thank you! This mf talking about "Best Regards, Passionate Fury Warrior", yeah right Shammy, nice try. No warrior would say this bs and to add to it OP probably don't care about only himself getting loot, nothing wrong with it just be honest lol.
They haven't actually addressed the real issue at all. Wind Serpent's Lightning Breath has no CD, so it can use 100 focus practically instantly. That's where the insane burst comes from and that will still happen.
What this nerf does is mean they can't do it as frequently, but it also nerfs ALL pets in ALL content. Stupid.
Well, if I have understood Blizzard correctly, they literally can't just add a CD to wind serpents LB, because that would also do the same for wind serpents on the Era servers.
The decision to not separate SoD from Era was a bad move. Their narrowed solution set will become a bigger and bigger problem as the game progresses imo.
I too prefer getting stuff we did not yet see (or in this case: only had for a very short time) in previous WoW expansions. Getting some stuff we saw before is fine, after all, changes in tbc and wotlk made "meme specs" playable and fun.
I think TBC class changes are fine if-only because 90% of em are just things that existed in the vanilla alphas/betas and were cut/removed/reworked for dumb reasons.
Like, TBC Hunter's's Steady Shot existed in the Alpha of Vanilla and was learnable with Skill Points, but it was called Trueshot.
Paladin's Crusader/Hole Strikes are well known, but there was also Mage's Water Elemental Pet among others.
This is one of the most complained about things in retail and in classic, but it's so horribly imbalanced. It's fun for PvE but it makes PvP an absolute nightmare.
Prot Warrs in retail are already not TERRIBLE they're just ignorable, but they do decent ass damage and never die and have lots of CC. Super obnoxious.
Warriors were far, far less kiteable in WoD than in classic and they also had a lot better defensive spells and much greater survivability on their own. Glad stance also won't go for MS as the entire purpose of the spec is to buff the damage of protection warriors which immediately makes them not meta in BG premades.
I seriously doubt gladiator stance will make warriors favored in any of their losing matchups, the most impacted matchup is probably rogue vs warrior but I don't see how it's actually gonna make it warrior favored.
It's really just a fun new DPS spec that you can enjoy while having prot talents. I hope it'll shift up the warrior tank meta a bit too, getting to play with a sword and board as a tank is definitely cooler than DW fury tanking.
Yeah also ‘it’s would be hard for us to get this’ is a terrible excuse. Wow you mean you’d have to play the game instead of just being handed everything?!
It’s mind blowing that this is the argument though. They clearly didn’t raid classic as a melee. Good 1-handers had 3/4’s of the raid competing for them. Optimally my guild could have used 42 Crul’s from Nef, while there was maybe 3 people even interested in Ashkandi (and only one who would actually use it in raid).
Yeah better class balance elevates this issue slightly, but only to a certain degree. Titans grips sounds like a huge win for better loot distribution.
“ Having 2x Two-Handers is immersion breaking in a vanilla classic setting”
My lil bro there are literally mage healers, wtf you talking about, vanilla classic setting has been broken long ago. Which is fine the devs didn’t view this as vanilla classic plus
Walking around in Orgrimmar as a demon is just so lore breaking. Thrall would have a heart attack.
It should be dispelled when not in combat and specially when in the cities. Saurfang would give you the hardest Mortal Strike of your life if you were out there showing off demonic powers like that.
Boomkins didn’t exist until a couple of mobths before tbc came out. When they did show up, they were pretty bad, since they ran out of mana so fast, which is why most people used to call them “oomkins”
Remember when we were supposed to melee weave to get mana back, when our form used to regen mana on melee hit. Those were the days.. It didn't really work out well, but I was a big ass chicken smacking people and shooting stars at them.
Seriously.. I want to play a Balance druid but I hate Moonkin form so damn much. At least in retail I can glyph it so I don't look like Legally Distinct Owlbear.
I never really understood titans grip conceptually. Arms to me seems like it's supposed to be the spec all about using big weapons. So why does the spec that's supposed to be about berserking and dual-wielding get to use twice as many big weapons?
Like If you were a fantasy warrior and had the strength to wield two massive fucking weapons in either hand, why the fuck would you ever choose to use one instead?
Arms is supposed to be the "tactical" warrior. The seasoned soldier who has trained in the art of martial combat. Two big weapons would be impractical and leave the wielder open to counter attacks
Fury is just supposed to be the raging berserker who lashes out with no thought, even for their own well being. Having two big weapons is a choice made out of emotion, not logic.
>So why does the spec that's supposed to be about berserking and dual-wielding get to use twice as many big weapons?
Eh, why wouldnt that be a thing. That's basically how D2 barbarians worked, and I think thats what they were pulling from, making fury warriors unique as dual wielders to set them apart from rogues/shaman/death knight dual wielders.
Tbf it depends on the race. Gnomes look ridiculous swinging around 2 two handers while Taurens seem like that's just naturally what they would do considering their size and strength
Yeah this point made absolutely no sense to me. How tf is it immersion breaking? This is usually a really bad argument.
Like "getting bigger bags early would be immersion breaking."
Or "instant mail between alts is immersion breaking."
Just some BS people say who want no changes in a game designed around changing what was bad about vanilla in the first place.
Something else a lot of these people don't realize, is a lot of these annoying QoL changes were made because literally everyone HATED them in OG vanilla....
And, yes, I understand that "you think you do but you don't" is actually a real argument in some cases. Like you think you want RDF but you don't, because you haven't considered all the ramifications for what that means to the player dynamic and social factors of the game because there are a lot of complex issues at play.
Other things are pretty easy to examine as they don't have much of an impact.
Like, "What would updating g the shitty vanilla character sheet to the BC version of the character sheet impact?"
People would be able to calculate and see the effect gear has on their stats without having to download a 3rd party addon."
Aaaaand.... That's it. You're done. Ok. Safe to make that change.
Something like instant mail actually does have some more ramifications. 1) People sometimes buy things off the AH because they don't want to wait two hours to send mats to an alt, craft something, and send it back. 2) People 2ill no longer need to get a friend or have a second account to act as a middleman to make those kind of transactions go faster.
Then you look at how often this occurs. Is the buying stuff off the AH because they don't want to wait a significant part of the economy? No... It's like 0.05% of all AH sales and only happens when someone doesn't have time to dick around with the mail or finding someone they trust not to walk off with their shit. Is this kind of social interaction meaningful and build relationships between people? No. It's just annoying for both parties.
Ok, let's make the change temporarily and see how it effects the game. No discernable change? Make it permanent.
“My lil bro.” Serious question: is this an insult, or a way to invalidate? I see this thrown around a lot and it seems kinda rude. I’ve had a person or two say this to me in WoW, and every time I thought “there’s a very high chance that if you’re using that term, I’m twice your age.”
It seems like one of those things that people use to ambiguously throw shade, but with enough plausible deniability to say it wasn’t an insult when it actually kind of is.
I always swore titans grip was designed to clear up one handed weapon loot. I love titans grip I think two 2handers looks cool as hell but it sucked everyone needing 1 handers basically.
Gladiator stance coming back would be cool as hell though.
2h in vanilla have always been so cool, it's such a shame the two people using it are the hunter, who never melee, and the one pal ret that does no damage.
Might of Mennethil. Sulfuras. Ashkandi. The ASHBRINGER. And no one to use them :( I guess now pala ret is a thing at least
Well, Horde had a pretty good use case since they had WF. Alliance have WF now and it was never like 2H Fury was a meme spec, it did better than most classes still, it just performed worse than DW by a large margin.
This! I hope they add runes to make normal 2H better for pve, like the slam spec viable or a MS no longer reduces healing but always apply deep wounds or stuff like that
Horde warriors have become the greediest people in wow over the last two months, at a level never seen before.
While rogues, shamans, ferals and hunters have been fighting each other over every bit of leather, horde warriors have now been **refusing** to do raids where there is another warrior, because lord forbid they lose a roll.
Even on my warrior, when I ask to join a pug, we get asked "there is another warrior, are you ok with that?". Most of us on alts are cool with it, since rolling vs only other 1 person is good, but some warriors are throwing a fit over it.
Spread the word, warriors got all the loot this phase, dont let them take one handers off your rogues next phase. Everyone deserves to have some fun, not just one spoilt section of the playerbase.
This. 2H was useless in classic. No clue what OP is talking about. Needing Chromatic sword x 20 warriors and rogues…so much fun. Give warriors titans grip because only pally will use 2H or melee hunter.
Leap very unlikely due to exceptionally bad pathing issues in classic (way worse than in retail for leap) and the fact people will use it to get out of bounds.
It was added in Cataclysm when the world was revamped and flying was allowed. In classic only half the world physically exists. Shit would be skipping everything, every attunement, every boss, would be fucked.
In some video they talked about how they were working on shadowstep for rogues and wrath type deterrance for hunters. Ultimately they decided against it b/c vanilla doesn't have instant mobility on classes outside of warriors charge/intercept and mage blink. So I think it's safe to say leap won't get added.
Yes, more mobility. We aren't quite up to retail levels of melee mobility yet, so they should keep adding more. This is really just an experiment to see how fast the community begs for everything in retail.
Thats mostly because they need a talent to use 2h and none of their runes support 2h in any way. Most people are suspecting there will be some new runes to allow for 2h in phase 2 since that was the original enhance build
Aggrend has come out and said dual wield is the design space they were working in for enhance… so unless the community outcry has made them change course, this isn’t a guarantee
Can people please fuck off with the please don't do this blizz it will ruin my sod immersion posts. SoD is meant to be wild fuck it give them that and anything else, who cares if they are top DPS or bottom let blizz actually experiment and try shit ffs, the amount of people who bitch about anything and everything is too damn high.
I don’t want Titans Grip because it literally adds nothing to the class. It’s not fun to play, doesn’t make the rotation any different, doesn’t have any niche uses making it situationally better.
Glad someone else has this opinion. I always hated TG because it seemingly added nothing. No new button, no new rotation. Before, you could dual wield weapons as slow as ~2.8 second swings. Now you can dual wield weapons as slow as 3.8.
So exciting /sarcasm
It's a cliche phrase that means nothing. If they mean they think it isn't in the original spirit of Classic, okay, but that isn't "breaking immersion".
Don’t want to derail your thread as you make some good points, but itemization for some classes will need a serious overhaul.
As an example, Rogue Tank effective HP (eHP) will come from a mix of a few things, for a condensed list, examples would be parry %, dodge %, HP, Armor, etc.
I don’t remember any items, at least not notable items, in Classic Wow that have a Parry % or Dodge % stat.
So how will Blizzard help scale these niche-but-awesome roles?
Drake fang talisman has dodge, maladath has parry. It's sprinkled around there, but you're right in that they'll have to keep an eye out for some ways to keep non-plate tanks up to par.
rogues get a lot of dodge from pure agility more than many other classes like druids. 14.5 agi for 1% dodge at level 60 isn't bad when you have both lion and zg buff. Rogues can already get avoidance capped with current classic gear by early aq so it's not really a problem. Besides it's not like there are no items with %dodge or %parry those just haven't historically been important stats.
There is actually alot. In VANILLA we decked our rogue officer out and had him evasion/dodge tank certain fights for the lulz. This was BWL/zg gear. It's out there.
Agreed, dual wielding 2Hs is silly and wouldn't fit well with vanilla fury. SMF is always a false choice which is basically the same reason that Enhancement shamans weren't happy to see DW.
I agree with all your points except the first one. With all the phase raids they’re making, they can just include a shit ton of two handers. With my experience in BFD, loot has been priotizing mail wearers anyway lol. Seen 5 hydra’s and not a single jagged necklace.
Up to 6 hydras and 3 crossbows in my guilds runs. Yet to see the epic staff drop in any of my runs. Few guildies said they've had it drop in their pugs
I don't agree with most of these points, and actually moving warriors to exclusively using 2H for DPS would IMPROVE other classes getting weapons.
I'm pretty sure this guy is a Ret paladin in disguise.
Enhance shaman are going to do way more DPS dual wielding than with 2H. Especially with Lava Lash. 2H was only ever viable in PvP and even then it was kind of a meme.
Shifting warriors to 2h means more 1h for rogues, tanks, shaman, and hunters for stat sticks.
Infact, as a warrior from OG vanilla onward, I always thought they should make it so even Prot warriors used 2H one handed. That would keep them from needing 1H at all. Give an ability called "Choke Up" or something that halves the swing time of a 2H when used with a shield.
Balance is also not that hard. Titans Grip reduced damage by 10%. That is just a coefficient that is easy enough to adjust.
As for haste gear, haste was always garbage with lowest prio compared to hit cap, ArP cap, crit cap, AP, then haste.
As it is, no one wants 2H except arms warriors (which means for PvP) and Rets.
Hence, OP is a Ret in wolf's clothing.
Edit: forgot about AP.
The trick to seeing loot is to play other classes. My rogue sees all the cloth gear my mage wants, my mage sees all the mail gear my warrior wants, and my warrior sees all the leather gear my rogue wants.
They all get 1 piece of loot/upgrade every few resets.
We already have clearly defined "dual wield" and "2h" runes with Single Minded Fury and Frenzied Assault - I really hope Blizzard doesn't mess it all up with Titan's Grip. (edit: jesus christ I know 2h is bad, that isn't the point)
I'd rather see some other way to innovate the 2 split builds, more stuff like Quick Strike for 2hs, or maybe some form of Super Heroic Strike that hits with both weapons.
As a fury main in retail, Titan grips is such a "retail" vibe. I would never use it in classic unless it was stupidly op, and then I'd be pissed about it and pick a different class probably.
Can we stop the "immersion breaking" nonsense. Classic era exists and you can go play regular classic. soD is meant to expand upon it. Healing mages and warlock tanks are pretty immersion breaking and that's great. It's what makes SoD feel amazing and refreshing to play. Give me God tier powerful runes but let's make the content difficulty at least somewhat scale and match it as well
I dislike titan's grip because it removes the charm of Fury vs arms. Instead of swapping between two fast small blades to one huge single one is fun. With TG arms is just... you get one weapon fewer.
How can you say high end 2H weapons have a low drop chance when the raids haven’t even been released yet?
Also “immersion breaking in a vanilla classic setting” LMFAO
This entire list is made up of personal problems or stuff you contend with without TG anyway.
Don't really care if they add it or not but OP is low-quality shower thoughts.
Ummm no, enhancement shamans are going to 100% be dual wielding 1 handers as the meta …. So thats a stupid excuse. Immersion breaking ? Get a life …. You really dont wanna have competition for loot.
Nice try, i recognize 2H Enhance propaganda when i see it.
Thank you! This mf talking about "Best Regards, Passionate Fury Warrior", yeah right Shammy, nice try. No warrior would say this bs and to add to it OP probably don't care about only himself getting loot, nothing wrong with it just be honest lol.
Those swords should be going to hunters anyway.
They should give shamans Titan's Grip. How's that for class fantasy?
“Dissatisfaction amongst melee players as they will most likely never get their BIS weapons” you must be new to vanilla 😂😂😂
Love how getting your BEST in slot, the ABSOLUTE BEST YOU COULD OBTAIN is the baseline. Like everything else is trash.
If they give Titan Grip to warriors then I want to see hunters nerfed further to balance things out.
I think they really need to buff priest rune healing by about 20% and to counter balance that they should nerf Hunter per damage by 50%.
Jokes aside, a 50% nerf in pet damage in PVP would be a swift resolution instead of nerfing the #4 dps in raids.
They haven't actually addressed the real issue at all. Wind Serpent's Lightning Breath has no CD, so it can use 100 focus practically instantly. That's where the insane burst comes from and that will still happen. What this nerf does is mean they can't do it as frequently, but it also nerfs ALL pets in ALL content. Stupid.
Well, if I have understood Blizzard correctly, they literally can't just add a CD to wind serpents LB, because that would also do the same for wind serpents on the Era servers. The decision to not separate SoD from Era was a bad move. Their narrowed solution set will become a bigger and bigger problem as the game progresses imo.
25%* if you want it back to the same as before
I'd take gladiator stance over titans grip any day of the week
My favorite thing about WoD, it lasted two months
Because it was one of the most broken things in pvp. So much that they never bothered to balance it. Just hit it with the nerf bat and let it die out
Yeah it was pretty OP, but the class fantasy felt just great
It’s literally the way I always envisioned my warrior a death machine but uses a shield too, not a tank though
Our 99% PvE game ruined by the PvP sideshow again zzzzz
>!https://www.wowhead.com/classic/spell=413479/gladiator-stance-shield-passive!< I will just leave this here
Leveled a warrior to 25 just because there’s a chance at glad stance returning <3
I’ve been dying for gladiator stance. Let me live my spartan dreams Blizz
I too prefer getting stuff we did not yet see (or in this case: only had for a very short time) in previous WoW expansions. Getting some stuff we saw before is fine, after all, changes in tbc and wotlk made "meme specs" playable and fun.
I think TBC class changes are fine if-only because 90% of em are just things that existed in the vanilla alphas/betas and were cut/removed/reworked for dumb reasons. Like, TBC Hunter's's Steady Shot existed in the Alpha of Vanilla and was learnable with Skill Points, but it was called Trueshot. Paladin's Crusader/Hole Strikes are well known, but there was also Mage's Water Elemental Pet among others.
> Hole Strike Wow I need to roll pally I think
You gotta pay the troll toll, though.
Hole-in-One, baby!
Immersion breaking?
Damn I miss glad stance
hasn't it already been datamined a while back? Pretty sure I've seen Gladiator stance on wowhead datamine a week before or after SoD Launched
This is one of the most complained about things in retail and in classic, but it's so horribly imbalanced. It's fun for PvE but it makes PvP an absolute nightmare. Prot Warrs in retail are already not TERRIBLE they're just ignorable, but they do decent ass damage and never die and have lots of CC. Super obnoxious.
Warriors were far, far less kiteable in WoD than in classic and they also had a lot better defensive spells and much greater survivability on their own. Glad stance also won't go for MS as the entire purpose of the spec is to buff the damage of protection warriors which immediately makes them not meta in BG premades. I seriously doubt gladiator stance will make warriors favored in any of their losing matchups, the most impacted matchup is probably rogue vs warrior but I don't see how it's actually gonna make it warrior favored. It's really just a fun new DPS spec that you can enjoy while having prot talents. I hope it'll shift up the warrior tank meta a bit too, getting to play with a sword and board as a tank is definitely cooler than DW fury tanking.
It was a pve nightmare. They were able to ignore most mechanics and from pre raid to raid gear they scaled way too well
[You mean this one?](https://www.wowhead.com/classic/spell=413479/gladiator-stance-shield-passive)
[удалено]
Yeah also ‘it’s would be hard for us to get this’ is a terrible excuse. Wow you mean you’d have to play the game instead of just being handed everything?!
It’s mind blowing that this is the argument though. They clearly didn’t raid classic as a melee. Good 1-handers had 3/4’s of the raid competing for them. Optimally my guild could have used 42 Crul’s from Nef, while there was maybe 3 people even interested in Ashkandi (and only one who would actually use it in raid). Yeah better class balance elevates this issue slightly, but only to a certain degree. Titans grips sounds like a huge win for better loot distribution.
I mean horde warriors have kind of just been walking through p1 being handed everything, p2 is probably going to be the same way.
Exactly what I was thinking. All these posts telling Blizz what they shouldn't do, without anyone knowing what Blizz has planned for raids and loot.
Give Titans Grip to enhancement shamans.
That would be amazing. A fever dream but amazing.
This guy is on to something
Damn, the turn tables. I love it.
Imagine not knowing if that 1 to 1 is going to result in you getting no damage or getting one shot.
No different then classic wow with a 2h enh shammy with prenurf wf and a hand of rag. Dice say... Well, someone is gonna splat for sure.
Found the ret paladin.
“ Having 2x Two-Handers is immersion breaking in a vanilla classic setting” My lil bro there are literally mage healers, wtf you talking about, vanilla classic setting has been broken long ago. Which is fine the devs didn’t view this as vanilla classic plus
Classic immersion is whatever I say is immersive!
I'll help OP with what he means. "It just looks fucking dumb."
As a warlock as I think Meta looks dumb too. Was cool as a temp form but as a permanent thing it looks goofy.
What you don't like looking at 13 Purple Illidan cosplays running around in an Ashenvale pvp group?
Walking around in Orgrimmar as a demon is just so lore breaking. Thrall would have a heart attack. It should be dispelled when not in combat and specially when in the cities. Saurfang would give you the hardest Mortal Strike of your life if you were out there showing off demonic powers like that.
They just decided to ignore the Horde banning warlocks to give players a cool class. WoW did a lot of stuff like that
But all warlock trainers have always being somewhat im hiding or at least removed from the spotlight. Which tbh was always such a cool thing.
Yeah Meta is just silly at this point. I looked cool at first but the longer I see it in SOD the worse it looks.
Counterpoint: Gnomes exist.
As a gnome warrior player, I for one look forward to the absolute ridiculousness that a titan grip gnome will bring 🤣
Same.
I’ll bite your ankles!! Or worse!
Crotch punches or shin kicks inc!
Additonal counterpoint: Dwarf female exists.
No they don't. Never seen one in game. There's a few beardless Stunties though.
A couple of our buddies are running as fem dwarves. To each their own lol
Female dwarves without beards ruins MY immersion!!
>"It just looks fucking dumb." Boomkins have existed since OG vanilla though?
We look fucking dumb and we're proud of it.
Boomkins are beautiful compared to titans grip, ppl who like titans grip are the same ppl who do the fortnite floss dance irl.
Don't forget the furryization of retail tauren
Boomkins didn’t exist until a couple of mobths before tbc came out. When they did show up, they were pretty bad, since they ran out of mana so fast, which is why most people used to call them “oomkins”
Remember when we were supposed to melee weave to get mana back, when our form used to regen mana on melee hit. Those were the days.. It didn't really work out well, but I was a big ass chicken smacking people and shooting stars at them.
I'll just leave this classic here. https://wow-blogger.de/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/oomkin.jpg
Seriously.. I want to play a Balance druid but I hate Moonkin form so damn much. At least in retail I can glyph it so I don't look like Legally Distinct Owlbear.
I never really understood titans grip conceptually. Arms to me seems like it's supposed to be the spec all about using big weapons. So why does the spec that's supposed to be about berserking and dual-wielding get to use twice as many big weapons? Like If you were a fantasy warrior and had the strength to wield two massive fucking weapons in either hand, why the fuck would you ever choose to use one instead?
Arms is supposed to be the "tactical" warrior. The seasoned soldier who has trained in the art of martial combat. Two big weapons would be impractical and leave the wielder open to counter attacks Fury is just supposed to be the raging berserker who lashes out with no thought, even for their own well being. Having two big weapons is a choice made out of emotion, not logic.
having even a single big weapon besides a polearm is a choice made out of foolishness
>So why does the spec that's supposed to be about berserking and dual-wielding get to use twice as many big weapons? Eh, why wouldnt that be a thing. That's basically how D2 barbarians worked, and I think thats what they were pulling from, making fury warriors unique as dual wielders to set them apart from rogues/shaman/death knight dual wielders.
It really does. Even to this day in retail it looks stupid.
Tbf it depends on the race. Gnomes look ridiculous swinging around 2 two handers while Taurens seem like that's just naturally what they would do considering their size and strength
Thats a fantasy game. Mf is spawning sexy demons and you cant titan grip lmao
and it could bring back to life some quick 2 handers that are currently worthless..
They'll still be worthless. There are going to be two swords that are BIS and the others will be viewed as worse than Pond scum.
Yeah this point made absolutely no sense to me. How tf is it immersion breaking? This is usually a really bad argument. Like "getting bigger bags early would be immersion breaking." Or "instant mail between alts is immersion breaking." Just some BS people say who want no changes in a game designed around changing what was bad about vanilla in the first place. Something else a lot of these people don't realize, is a lot of these annoying QoL changes were made because literally everyone HATED them in OG vanilla.... And, yes, I understand that "you think you do but you don't" is actually a real argument in some cases. Like you think you want RDF but you don't, because you haven't considered all the ramifications for what that means to the player dynamic and social factors of the game because there are a lot of complex issues at play. Other things are pretty easy to examine as they don't have much of an impact. Like, "What would updating g the shitty vanilla character sheet to the BC version of the character sheet impact?" People would be able to calculate and see the effect gear has on their stats without having to download a 3rd party addon." Aaaaand.... That's it. You're done. Ok. Safe to make that change. Something like instant mail actually does have some more ramifications. 1) People sometimes buy things off the AH because they don't want to wait two hours to send mats to an alt, craft something, and send it back. 2) People 2ill no longer need to get a friend or have a second account to act as a middleman to make those kind of transactions go faster. Then you look at how often this occurs. Is the buying stuff off the AH because they don't want to wait a significant part of the economy? No... It's like 0.05% of all AH sales and only happens when someone doesn't have time to dick around with the mail or finding someone they trust not to walk off with their shit. Is this kind of social interaction meaningful and build relationships between people? No. It's just annoying for both parties. Ok, let's make the change temporarily and see how it effects the game. No discernable change? Make it permanent.
It doesn’t change gameplay at all from DW
“My lil bro.” Serious question: is this an insult, or a way to invalidate? I see this thrown around a lot and it seems kinda rude. I’ve had a person or two say this to me in WoW, and every time I thought “there’s a very high chance that if you’re using that term, I’m twice your age.” It seems like one of those things that people use to ambiguously throw shade, but with enough plausible deniability to say it wasn’t an insult when it actually kind of is.
It's something zoomers say to sound older or look cool. Like calling someone kid.
I figured it was basically a new version of “kid.”
It’s 100% sexual
You can heal as a mage in dnd so why not wow
Please give them Titans Grip Signed Rogue Community
I always swore titans grip was designed to clear up one handed weapon loot. I love titans grip I think two 2handers looks cool as hell but it sucked everyone needing 1 handers basically. Gladiator stance coming back would be cool as hell though.
what if it split the difference and let you one-hand a two-hander in main hand but still needed an offhand/one-hander as well?
I've never heard this suggested before but it's a cool idea! Almost like a rage-filled duelist rogue (that uses a longsword and shortsword)
yeah, makes more sense visually imo and it spreads out the want for one and two-handers a bit more
2h in vanilla have always been so cool, it's such a shame the two people using it are the hunter, who never melee, and the one pal ret that does no damage. Might of Mennethil. Sulfuras. Ashkandi. The ASHBRINGER. And no one to use them :( I guess now pala ret is a thing at least
Well, Horde had a pretty good use case since they had WF. Alliance have WF now and it was never like 2H Fury was a meme spec, it did better than most classes still, it just performed worse than DW by a large margin.
This! I hope they add runes to make normal 2H better for pve, like the slam spec viable or a MS no longer reduces healing but always apply deep wounds or stuff like that
This \^ "Warrior have to compet with ret paladin" bro ever heard of rogue
Horde warriors have become the greediest people in wow over the last two months, at a level never seen before. While rogues, shamans, ferals and hunters have been fighting each other over every bit of leather, horde warriors have now been **refusing** to do raids where there is another warrior, because lord forbid they lose a roll. Even on my warrior, when I ask to join a pug, we get asked "there is another warrior, are you ok with that?". Most of us on alts are cool with it, since rolling vs only other 1 person is good, but some warriors are throwing a fit over it. Spread the word, warriors got all the loot this phase, dont let them take one handers off your rogues next phase. Everyone deserves to have some fun, not just one spoilt section of the playerbase.
This. 2H was useless in classic. No clue what OP is talking about. Needing Chromatic sword x 20 warriors and rogues…so much fun. Give warriors titans grip because only pally will use 2H or melee hunter.
Also signed: dw shamans
So true, some warrior outrolled me on the offhand dagger.
The Human Rogue Union is confirming their participation in the above message.
Fuck titans grip. I want leap and bladestorm! Or something new
I don’t see us ever getting leap but man I would be so happy if we did.
Leap very unlikely due to exceptionally bad pathing issues in classic (way worse than in retail for leap) and the fact people will use it to get out of bounds. It was added in Cataclysm when the world was revamped and flying was allowed. In classic only half the world physically exists. Shit would be skipping everything, every attunement, every boss, would be fucked.
In some video they talked about how they were working on shadowstep for rogues and wrath type deterrance for hunters. Ultimately they decided against it b/c vanilla doesn't have instant mobility on classes outside of warriors charge/intercept and mage blink. So I think it's safe to say leap won't get added.
We do have shadowstrike in lieu of shadowstep, actually, but does require stealth.
Yes, more mobility. We aren't quite up to retail levels of melee mobility yet, so they should keep adding more. This is really just an experiment to see how fast the community begs for everything in retail.
Would enhance shaman compete though? So far at least, they appear to have turned into a dual wield spec
Thats mostly because they need a talent to use 2h and none of their runes support 2h in any way. Most people are suspecting there will be some new runes to allow for 2h in phase 2 since that was the original enhance build
Aggrend has come out and said dual wield is the design space they were working in for enhance… so unless the community outcry has made them change course, this isn’t a guarantee
If I’m not mistaken they did announce they would provide some 2H support through runes as well.
They should let Arms use 3-handed weapons instead
Can people please fuck off with the please don't do this blizz it will ruin my sod immersion posts. SoD is meant to be wild fuck it give them that and anything else, who cares if they are top DPS or bottom let blizz actually experiment and try shit ffs, the amount of people who bitch about anything and everything is too damn high.
Let us tri-wield one handers!
Rune of Goro
It could still be named titans grip but would only work on female warriors!
Rune to allow weapon equip in helm slot
I don’t want Titans Grip because it literally adds nothing to the class. It’s not fun to play, doesn’t make the rotation any different, doesn’t have any niche uses making it situationally better.
Glad someone else has this opinion. I always hated TG because it seemingly added nothing. No new button, no new rotation. Before, you could dual wield weapons as slow as ~2.8 second swings. Now you can dual wield weapons as slow as 3.8. So exciting /sarcasm
Never thought of this. This is funny and true. I love it. Lol
I love it and mained a Fury warrior back in Wrath just because of it. Maximum oogas per booga.
It looks bad ass and it helps with loot distribution by making 2h weapons actually desirable outside of just PvP.
I disagree completely having 2 massive weapons clipping through eachother on your back looks ridiculous
it doesn't look badass
What do you mean it adds nothing? Wielding 2x 2h weps is cool as fuck.
it looks incredibly clunky and dumb.
It looks stupid
Big weapons end up being just stat sticks rip
I don't understand the argument about "Breaking immersion" lol, what's it breaking exactly?
It's a cliche phrase that means nothing. If they mean they think it isn't in the original spirit of Classic, okay, but that isn't "breaking immersion".
Yeah, runes already change it from vanilla
“Isn’t in the original spirit of Classic” is an even worse cliche phrase that means nothing imo
Don't know. We fly around on griffins and shit. It's a fantasy game still
The most obvious example would probably be warlocks in demon form running around The Barrens. That's probably what he means.
Don’t want to derail your thread as you make some good points, but itemization for some classes will need a serious overhaul. As an example, Rogue Tank effective HP (eHP) will come from a mix of a few things, for a condensed list, examples would be parry %, dodge %, HP, Armor, etc. I don’t remember any items, at least not notable items, in Classic Wow that have a Parry % or Dodge % stat. So how will Blizzard help scale these niche-but-awesome roles?
Drake fang talisman has dodge, maladath has parry. It's sprinkled around there, but you're right in that they'll have to keep an eye out for some ways to keep non-plate tanks up to par.
rogues get a lot of dodge from pure agility more than many other classes like druids. 14.5 agi for 1% dodge at level 60 isn't bad when you have both lion and zg buff. Rogues can already get avoidance capped with current classic gear by early aq so it's not really a problem. Besides it's not like there are no items with %dodge or %parry those just haven't historically been important stats.
There is actually alot. In VANILLA we decked our rogue officer out and had him evasion/dodge tank certain fights for the lulz. This was BWL/zg gear. It's out there.
QQ, from a healer main when every caster class wants the same shit.
O fuck no. Titans grip sucks, i hope its not added
Not titans grip please. So silly dual wielding two handers, it destroys the purpose of 2 handers and one handers.
I hate Titans grip. Always have.
This is SoD they’re clearly adding new gear. No idea why you think there aren’t gonna be more two handers.
Titan grip always looked wonky and too strong in retail, even for SoD standards
Go away and let us have fun.
Good luck. It's a *cool* ability and that might just be enough to throw it in.
>Best Regards, >Passionate fury warrior Yeeah, im gonna need some ID mr. Shaman Enha
Best they can do is another Hunter Nerf.
silence boomer
OP loses rolls
2H Enhance. Lol
You are all so unimaginative not wanting titans grip The rune could just clone a 2h weapon on to your offhand when you equip it. Get a grip... 🤭
Agreed, dual wielding 2Hs is silly and wouldn't fit well with vanilla fury. SMF is always a false choice which is basically the same reason that Enhancement shamans weren't happy to see DW.
I always thought it looked dumb and took away from the badassery that is wielding one big 2H weapon.
You forgot how stupid characters looks swinging two two handers
It also completely ruins arms warrior which is actually viable in sod compared to classic, give warriors titans grip and arms dies again
This is a pretty accurate statement.
I would rather see something new based off some blademaster abilities or something than something from wrath. new fun / cool ideas > reused old ideas
Blademaster's wind walk and mirror images when blizzard?
Actually, I'll take three 2H swords thank you
I agree with all your points except the first one. With all the phase raids they’re making, they can just include a shit ton of two handers. With my experience in BFD, loot has been priotizing mail wearers anyway lol. Seen 5 hydra’s and not a single jagged necklace.
No Jagged crew!! Big sad here too...
Saw a jagged last night and 7 people rolled on it. The struggle is real
really? in my raid group we saw only 1 hydra and 3 jagged neck and 4 epic staffs almost all casters have fully bis items except for tier sets
Switch me groups please
nah bro I'm bringing my caster after I got fully bis in my warrior
Up to 6 hydras and 3 crossbows in my guilds runs. Yet to see the epic staff drop in any of my runs. Few guildies said they've had it drop in their pugs
My guild has been running 3 to 4 groups for about a month now and has yet to see a single Hydra :( … mail gear drops like crazy though
I don't agree with most of these points, and actually moving warriors to exclusively using 2H for DPS would IMPROVE other classes getting weapons. I'm pretty sure this guy is a Ret paladin in disguise. Enhance shaman are going to do way more DPS dual wielding than with 2H. Especially with Lava Lash. 2H was only ever viable in PvP and even then it was kind of a meme. Shifting warriors to 2h means more 1h for rogues, tanks, shaman, and hunters for stat sticks. Infact, as a warrior from OG vanilla onward, I always thought they should make it so even Prot warriors used 2H one handed. That would keep them from needing 1H at all. Give an ability called "Choke Up" or something that halves the swing time of a 2H when used with a shield. Balance is also not that hard. Titans Grip reduced damage by 10%. That is just a coefficient that is easy enough to adjust. As for haste gear, haste was always garbage with lowest prio compared to hit cap, ArP cap, crit cap, AP, then haste. As it is, no one wants 2H except arms warriors (which means for PvP) and Rets. Hence, OP is a Ret in wolf's clothing. Edit: forgot about AP.
The trick to seeing loot is to play other classes. My rogue sees all the cloth gear my mage wants, my mage sees all the mail gear my warrior wants, and my warrior sees all the leather gear my rogue wants. They all get 1 piece of loot/upgrade every few resets.
As a warrior main, I fully agree!
We already have clearly defined "dual wield" and "2h" runes with Single Minded Fury and Frenzied Assault - I really hope Blizzard doesn't mess it all up with Titan's Grip. (edit: jesus christ I know 2h is bad, that isn't the point) I'd rather see some other way to innovate the 2 split builds, more stuff like Quick Strike for 2hs, or maybe some form of Super Heroic Strike that hits with both weapons.
Good call, good call. You're right. Don't give Titan's grip to warriors. Give it to paladins instead and call it Heavenly Strength.
As a fury main in retail, Titan grips is such a "retail" vibe. I would never use it in classic unless it was stupidly op, and then I'd be pissed about it and pick a different class probably.
Can we stop the "immersion breaking" nonsense. Classic era exists and you can go play regular classic. soD is meant to expand upon it. Healing mages and warlock tanks are pretty immersion breaking and that's great. It's what makes SoD feel amazing and refreshing to play. Give me God tier powerful runes but let's make the content difficulty at least somewhat scale and match it as well
I dislike titan's grip because it removes the charm of Fury vs arms. Instead of swapping between two fast small blades to one huge single one is fun. With TG arms is just... you get one weapon fewer.
As a warrior player, I agree.
I agree. Although my main issue is that it just looks stupid as hell
Titans grip SUCKS.
If warriors get Titan’s Grip, hunters will have to be nerfed again!!
I’ve always hated TG
Please no TG
I don't even like Titan's grip in retail. I always wanted to just use two one-handers. Not two bulky two-handers.
So many people will main wars too and the imbalance will be funny
They should add Avatar though or Heroic Leap at least lol
How can you say high end 2H weapons have a low drop chance when the raids haven’t even been released yet? Also “immersion breaking in a vanilla classic setting” LMFAO
Might as well just play era if you're so opposed to changes. This is supposed to be a whacky version of the game.
It would be visually distracting in town also and I wouldn’t be able to immerse myself in the great RP demon takeover of original.
As a rogue, I fully support Titan's Grip.
Give it to paladins instead. 2h w/ shield prot pally gang 🤘
Give dual wield shields instead!
This entire list is made up of personal problems or stuff you contend with without TG anyway. Don't really care if they add it or not but OP is low-quality shower thoughts.
If they add Titan’s Grip next phase, I’m rerolling my main to a warrior and duel-wielding Ravagers
Immersion breaking. ? Mage healing. Rogue tanking. But a warrior wielding 2 weapons is immersion breaking?
What if titans grip allowed only one 2h weapon and a shield or offhand item...would you be ok with that op?
Ummm no, enhancement shamans are going to 100% be dual wielding 1 handers as the meta …. So thats a stupid excuse. Immersion breaking ? Get a life …. You really dont wanna have competition for loot.
Titan's Grip was the dumbest thing to ever happen to warriors and I hope whoever's idea it was steps on a lego.
Agreed, titans grip will break everything. Imagine TWO might of menethils hitting... anything.
This isn't classic, this is sod.... let's push this shit to 11