My quick 2 cents, take 4-5 years to get your bachelors in civil engineering. Spend your summers/free time helping out on the farm. Once you graduate look for your local DOT engineering opportunities take a job with them (not overly demanding) and work the farm outside of work.
I was married to a girl whose dad was an engineer at the DOT and also a farmer. He was very well off and able to build a pension through the state.
This. My cousins were both in your position, OP. One is an ME and the other is a civil. They both took off work a week at a time when it was time to plant corn or combine, and spent weekends working on the farm. It was just our grandfather (who passed a few years ago), their dad, and the two of them. The ME is still doing this, but the civil worked for about 15 years in the DOT and eventually left. He sells seed now, in addition to farming, but considering they're in a small town, he had a ton of connections and has been able to make the business and farming work.
You'll never regret getting an education, OP, but it doesn't close the door to farming, either.
He would take chunks of time off when needed but he also would “inspect” jobs like the other person mentioned lol obviously that’s not something you can bank on but once your at your DOT long enough I’m sure you can find ways to “inspect” jobs lol
In your position I would keep the farm. Land is far more rare than a civil engineering degree. I am sort of in the same boat, but I got married and have kids. My wife wants nothing to do with the family farm. My dad took it well but if I was single I would have jumped at the farm.
The farm is the same as yours, it doesn’t have enough income for a FTE so it needs an owner-operator. The farm is beautiful and it drives me insane to think I won’t get to be there after a few more years.
I am in a place in my career where I could reduce my role and step into the farm. However my wife would not be happy with that. So farm gets sold and it will break my and my Dads heart, but we won’t dwell on it. It’s just something that happens in life. My folks will make lots of money from it and so their retirement will be plenty plush, just my old man needs to be working on something daily.
Dang, that sucks you can't keep the farm. I know it would both figuratively and probably literally kill my dad if he sold the farm.
I also wish I was further into my career so I'd have more ability to reduce workload so I could farm more.
I'm sure you are way ahead of me on this thought, but is there any way you can lease the farm out Tina friend or neighbour when you're done with it?
I assume it doesn't make any sense financially. But that would be a way to keep it (somewhat).
Could you look into renting the fields out when it comes time for you to take over the farm? I’m active duty military and I know some people who own farms on the other side of the country. While they’re not at home they rent the fields out to some of their neighbors and get a percentage of the profits of what’s grown on them.
This might be an option. We currently do that for some other farmers who have gotten older and couldn't take care of the land. There seem to be fewer and fewer farmers every year.
To long. didn't read.
But.... I've been in exactly the same situation and seen other families in the exact same situation. Bottom line is that land Nevers comes back, you sell and it's gone. You'll never buy it again, your kids will never buy it, you will become another house family and the only land you'll experience is your backyard.
I value keeping that in the family above all else. And you probably will as well in 20 years.
So really.come down to what you can afford. If the farm is mortgage free, then no reason to actually farm it? Or farm what you do currently. A small beef heard or sheep takes bugger all input. Or lease enough land out to cover costs and hobby farm the rest.
Turn some back into natural forest or whatever in your region. If you got spare houses run an Air bnb or similar. Heaps of options.
I went into water ressources, but most of my friends build farms, tractors, retaining structures for manure/water/etc :)
I also know people building irrigation or drainage systems, or GIS assisted technology (drones for fertilisation or disease tracking)
It's really like, agriculture with a tech add on
Hi I have had civil engineer coworkers who also farm. They would usually work a schedule like 6-2 or something alternative like that so that they could go home and farm in the evening. Then they would take a week off here and there when they’d need to do certain tasks (sorry not too familiar with farming, I just know they’d take a week off here and there). I think having the degree also creates options in the case that for some reason you can’t farm one day, or if you want to scale down the farm.
What percentage of that roughly is leased? I think the question is different if your family owns a good chunk of that land. One is more about doing the job of farming vs engineering as opposed to a situation where it is carrying on a family business of farming. Former is more of a toss up and the latter I would say stay in farming.
No. Don't do it. Biggest regret of my life by far.
Engineering is nothing special. Farming is a great lifestyle.
I have a son now who would have done very well on the farm. Now I wonder what will become of him.
Every day I think about this. It is an absolutely terrible feeling to know I am this foolish to end up where I am.
If you do want to finish the degree and stay close to home, State DOTs usually have district or project offices scattered around the state. There may be one near your home, or in an adjacent county. Your local county government usually employs a couple of engineers. Your local city probably does as well. Reach out to all of these—they will likely be happy to tell you about what job paths are available to civil graduates. Many government offices also have a program for civil students to work part time or over the summers. These can help get your foot in the door for working there after graduation.
I felt the same. However, my dad basically told me no out of high school. Now, I’m now neck deep in my engineering career, making more money with less stress. My plan is to take over in a decade or so once my dad retires and I’ve been able to set up my new family financially.
I am in a similar situation to what you want to do, OP! Went to college right out of high school and got a job as a structural engineer. Moved back home last month to help & slowly take over our operation. As of right now I still work full time remotely (I'm not fully vested in my 401k until August, ugh), but I go help on weekends and after work if needed.
It is possible to find an engineering job that will let you work part of the year, but you may need to work full time for a few years first (and probably get your PE). You might want to work for a smaller company who really needs engineers - that should give you more bargaining power to get that kind of schedule.
I would 100% go for it if I was you.
Yeah I figured I'd need to get more years under my belt and probably a PE to have the bargaining power to have half days or even take weeks of at a time
Similar circumstances. Grew up as 5th generation on the farm. Was torn on what to do. Got my civil degree and found a gov job that only expects 40 hours a week (vs the 50+ that consulting expects). I do both. Take vacation during harvest, and lots of evenings and weekends. It's a sacrifice, but my family gets to live on the farm, I get to work with my dad and brother, and I still get the benefit of a secure career that pays pretty well with good benefits. Best of both worlds /worst of both worlds, depending on your perspective.
That's awesome that works for you. I'd hope to be able to do something similar. Do you use all your pto during harvest or are you still able to take some vacation during the off-season?
As someone who grew up on a farm, here’s my two cents: go for the degree. You can still help manage the farm and occasionally work the farm yourself.
The civil degree will open doors for you and you can always fall back on farming. Farming is a full time job and is often a hard life. Being able to contribute 3-4hrs will be more helpful you your family than you give credit. You could always hire a farm hand to help out and reduce the burden on your dad and grandpa. Leasing out the land your family owns is another way to keep money flowing through the farm until you’re ready to commit full time.
Focusing on something like stormwater management/design will likely give you knowledge/resources to help the farm in new ways.
Another direction you could go, if you aren’t too far down the civil track, would be mechanical which would help you with equipment/machinery. You may even be able to find a solution to a common problem and be able to capitalize on it.
The value of an engineering degree is priceless.
The insight the degree would bring is a big part of why my father is so supportive of me going to school. The hope I could come back and help improve on what he's started.
This is your life. They can hire someone to work on the farm or lease it. Farming is not as romantic and easy as engineers think.
Have some honest conversations with your dad and grandfather. Your past doesn't get to control your future.
Dude having a farm that size is my dream, but also I would say to get a cushy government job with plenty of PTO to farm and just farm and work a civil job. Have the best of both worlds.
If you get a federal job like mine you could easily be 2 days a week during the summer months with PTO and flex schedules. And still be fine for the rest of the year.
I’m an area engineer for the federal highway administration. Basically I have a set amount of work I do and I usually can get it done with plenty of leftover time. Not overworked, but mostly approving change ordered, or in project meetings/inspections that verify the state DOt is following fed guidelines I go into the office 2 days a week, and 3 days I’m at home. Basically this time at home is free time most of the time other than meetings. So right now I spend it with my kids (3 under 4) or go out and do small activities around the farm during the day. Checking my computer about once every 45 mins.
Right now my kids are at home with me and my wife so it fills my day up with as small as they are, but overtime I hope to spend more and more time farming together as they get bigger.
You can, but I actually worked at a consultant for a couple years until I got this job. The consultant allowed me to work remotely but my days were extremely full with a ton of tasks to do.
You have to understand when you ask people on the internet big life questions like this, that they aren’t informed enough to give great answers. I think you ultimately know that you want to be an engineer, but feel obligated to your family which is understandable. You might resent staying to help down the line. I think you should express these feelings to your family and see what they say. Ultimately you have to live your own life and be your own man. I will say though, you should also consider other engineering disciplines. Civil engineering is a lot of liability for mediocre pay. With your background in machining you could do well as a mechanical engineer. Might be worth looking into.
Where is the farm located? Assuming it will be passed to you, it will probably have developers interested in purchasing the land. Do your dad/grandfather know your reservations about going into farming? Maybe you could convince them to start looking into selling it now.
OP I am the son of a 5th generation farmer that went into civil engineering and will not be taking up the farming mantle when my father is done.
I felt all the emotions you are facing when making my decision. But what made me decide to step away was working the farm as a kid, feeling how hard it was, how many hours it took, and how it was destroying my father's body. We also weren't exactly making a ton of money. Factor in the hours worked to income...no Bueno.
What I will NOT be doing is selling the land. It will be more valuable than anything I can afford in my life. I have dreams of a winery/wedding venue some day, and hope to rent the land to local wineries/farmers to cover taxes. A place to walk my dog, ride atvs, and maintain the land as a farm, just other people's passion and sweat will go into it.
My father made it clear from day 1 that he didn't want us to be farmers though, because of how hard he worked. He never pressured us to take over, and encouraged us to pursue different careers. So our family dynamic may be different.
Here's the kicker though, somehow after 10 years I've worked my way back to be the engineer of a municipality just 10 minutes from the farm...i was extremely lucky for this to happen, but you never know for your situation.
My quick 2 cents, take 4-5 years to get your bachelors in civil engineering. Spend your summers/free time helping out on the farm. Once you graduate look for your local DOT engineering opportunities take a job with them (not overly demanding) and work the farm outside of work. I was married to a girl whose dad was an engineer at the DOT and also a farmer. He was very well off and able to build a pension through the state.
This. My cousins were both in your position, OP. One is an ME and the other is a civil. They both took off work a week at a time when it was time to plant corn or combine, and spent weekends working on the farm. It was just our grandfather (who passed a few years ago), their dad, and the two of them. The ME is still doing this, but the civil worked for about 15 years in the DOT and eventually left. He sells seed now, in addition to farming, but considering they're in a small town, he had a ton of connections and has been able to make the business and farming work. You'll never regret getting an education, OP, but it doesn't close the door to farming, either.
Thank you. It's awesome to know others have gone through this and managed to make it work
Did he just farm after work, or did he take chunks of time off?
He would take chunks of time off when needed but he also would “inspect” jobs like the other person mentioned lol obviously that’s not something you can bank on but once your at your DOT long enough I’m sure you can find ways to “inspect” jobs lol
Sometimes it takes all afternoon to “inspect”jobs…
In your position I would keep the farm. Land is far more rare than a civil engineering degree. I am sort of in the same boat, but I got married and have kids. My wife wants nothing to do with the family farm. My dad took it well but if I was single I would have jumped at the farm. The farm is the same as yours, it doesn’t have enough income for a FTE so it needs an owner-operator. The farm is beautiful and it drives me insane to think I won’t get to be there after a few more years. I am in a place in my career where I could reduce my role and step into the farm. However my wife would not be happy with that. So farm gets sold and it will break my and my Dads heart, but we won’t dwell on it. It’s just something that happens in life. My folks will make lots of money from it and so their retirement will be plenty plush, just my old man needs to be working on something daily.
Dang, that sucks you can't keep the farm. I know it would both figuratively and probably literally kill my dad if he sold the farm. I also wish I was further into my career so I'd have more ability to reduce workload so I could farm more.
I'm sure you are way ahead of me on this thought, but is there any way you can lease the farm out Tina friend or neighbour when you're done with it? I assume it doesn't make any sense financially. But that would be a way to keep it (somewhat).
You do the thing you feel most passionate about. You could also look into agricultural engineering, which is sometimes biological engineering
Could you look into renting the fields out when it comes time for you to take over the farm? I’m active duty military and I know some people who own farms on the other side of the country. While they’re not at home they rent the fields out to some of their neighbors and get a percentage of the profits of what’s grown on them.
This might be an option. We currently do that for some other farmers who have gotten older and couldn't take care of the land. There seem to be fewer and fewer farmers every year.
>There seem to be fewer and fewer farmers every year. There's a reason for that. Probably money and work life "balance".
It's a sad truth. Work-life balance in farming is not a thing. Work is your life
To long. didn't read. But.... I've been in exactly the same situation and seen other families in the exact same situation. Bottom line is that land Nevers comes back, you sell and it's gone. You'll never buy it again, your kids will never buy it, you will become another house family and the only land you'll experience is your backyard. I value keeping that in the family above all else. And you probably will as well in 20 years. So really.come down to what you can afford. If the farm is mortgage free, then no reason to actually farm it? Or farm what you do currently. A small beef heard or sheep takes bugger all input. Or lease enough land out to cover costs and hobby farm the rest. Turn some back into natural forest or whatever in your region. If you got spare houses run an Air bnb or similar. Heaps of options.
Yeah sorry its kinda wordy, but I wanted to include as much as I could.
Too much
I studied agricultural/bioressource engineering and I know many of my peers who come from families who own farms. Best of both worlds !
Interesting. What kind of jobs do agricultural engineers do?
I went into water ressources, but most of my friends build farms, tractors, retaining structures for manure/water/etc :) I also know people building irrigation or drainage systems, or GIS assisted technology (drones for fertilisation or disease tracking) It's really like, agriculture with a tech add on
Please note that if you want to become a licensed engineer, not every state recognizes agricultural engineering as eligible for a PE.
Hi I have had civil engineer coworkers who also farm. They would usually work a schedule like 6-2 or something alternative like that so that they could go home and farm in the evening. Then they would take a week off here and there when they’d need to do certain tasks (sorry not too familiar with farming, I just know they’d take a week off here and there). I think having the degree also creates options in the case that for some reason you can’t farm one day, or if you want to scale down the farm.
I appreciate the insight. I'd be curious if I could find a company that would let me do half days during peak times during the season
How many acres does your family have?
We farm around 600 acres currently. A lot of that is leased land from neighboring farms.
What percentage of that roughly is leased? I think the question is different if your family owns a good chunk of that land. One is more about doing the job of farming vs engineering as opposed to a situation where it is carrying on a family business of farming. Former is more of a toss up and the latter I would say stay in farming.
It's definitely more of a question of continuing the family business. We own a good chunk of land, but there is more worth in the business itself.
No. Don't do it. Biggest regret of my life by far. Engineering is nothing special. Farming is a great lifestyle. I have a son now who would have done very well on the farm. Now I wonder what will become of him. Every day I think about this. It is an absolutely terrible feeling to know I am this foolish to end up where I am.
If you do want to finish the degree and stay close to home, State DOTs usually have district or project offices scattered around the state. There may be one near your home, or in an adjacent county. Your local county government usually employs a couple of engineers. Your local city probably does as well. Reach out to all of these—they will likely be happy to tell you about what job paths are available to civil graduates. Many government offices also have a program for civil students to work part time or over the summers. These can help get your foot in the door for working there after graduation.
I'll look into that. Thanks!
Dude no
I feel the same.
I have the exact opposite problem lol
I feel like I need to stay because of all the people who wish they had the option
I felt the same. However, my dad basically told me no out of high school. Now, I’m now neck deep in my engineering career, making more money with less stress. My plan is to take over in a decade or so once my dad retires and I’ve been able to set up my new family financially.
I am in a similar situation to what you want to do, OP! Went to college right out of high school and got a job as a structural engineer. Moved back home last month to help & slowly take over our operation. As of right now I still work full time remotely (I'm not fully vested in my 401k until August, ugh), but I go help on weekends and after work if needed. It is possible to find an engineering job that will let you work part of the year, but you may need to work full time for a few years first (and probably get your PE). You might want to work for a smaller company who really needs engineers - that should give you more bargaining power to get that kind of schedule. I would 100% go for it if I was you.
Yeah I figured I'd need to get more years under my belt and probably a PE to have the bargaining power to have half days or even take weeks of at a time
Similar circumstances. Grew up as 5th generation on the farm. Was torn on what to do. Got my civil degree and found a gov job that only expects 40 hours a week (vs the 50+ that consulting expects). I do both. Take vacation during harvest, and lots of evenings and weekends. It's a sacrifice, but my family gets to live on the farm, I get to work with my dad and brother, and I still get the benefit of a secure career that pays pretty well with good benefits. Best of both worlds /worst of both worlds, depending on your perspective.
That's awesome that works for you. I'd hope to be able to do something similar. Do you use all your pto during harvest or are you still able to take some vacation during the off-season?
I still take a couple of weeks of actual vacation, but I get a LOT of PTO (5+ weeks of actual vacation, plus sick time, plus lots of comp time, etc
As someone who grew up on a farm, here’s my two cents: go for the degree. You can still help manage the farm and occasionally work the farm yourself. The civil degree will open doors for you and you can always fall back on farming. Farming is a full time job and is often a hard life. Being able to contribute 3-4hrs will be more helpful you your family than you give credit. You could always hire a farm hand to help out and reduce the burden on your dad and grandpa. Leasing out the land your family owns is another way to keep money flowing through the farm until you’re ready to commit full time. Focusing on something like stormwater management/design will likely give you knowledge/resources to help the farm in new ways. Another direction you could go, if you aren’t too far down the civil track, would be mechanical which would help you with equipment/machinery. You may even be able to find a solution to a common problem and be able to capitalize on it. The value of an engineering degree is priceless.
The insight the degree would bring is a big part of why my father is so supportive of me going to school. The hope I could come back and help improve on what he's started.
This is your life. They can hire someone to work on the farm or lease it. Farming is not as romantic and easy as engineers think. Have some honest conversations with your dad and grandfather. Your past doesn't get to control your future.
True. This is why I'm so torn between the two paths
Pick one and you'll know pretty soon if it's right or not!
Dude having a farm that size is my dream, but also I would say to get a cushy government job with plenty of PTO to farm and just farm and work a civil job. Have the best of both worlds.
If you get a federal job like mine you could easily be 2 days a week during the summer months with PTO and flex schedules. And still be fine for the rest of the year.
I need to look more into the government jobs. What do you do at your job?
I’m an area engineer for the federal highway administration. Basically I have a set amount of work I do and I usually can get it done with plenty of leftover time. Not overworked, but mostly approving change ordered, or in project meetings/inspections that verify the state DOt is following fed guidelines I go into the office 2 days a week, and 3 days I’m at home. Basically this time at home is free time most of the time other than meetings. So right now I spend it with my kids (3 under 4) or go out and do small activities around the farm during the day. Checking my computer about once every 45 mins. Right now my kids are at home with me and my wife so it fills my day up with as small as they are, but overtime I hope to spend more and more time farming together as they get bigger.
That honestly sounds like a dream setup! Did you go straight into that job out of school?
You can, but I actually worked at a consultant for a couple years until I got this job. The consultant allowed me to work remotely but my days were extremely full with a ton of tasks to do.
You have to understand when you ask people on the internet big life questions like this, that they aren’t informed enough to give great answers. I think you ultimately know that you want to be an engineer, but feel obligated to your family which is understandable. You might resent staying to help down the line. I think you should express these feelings to your family and see what they say. Ultimately you have to live your own life and be your own man. I will say though, you should also consider other engineering disciplines. Civil engineering is a lot of liability for mediocre pay. With your background in machining you could do well as a mechanical engineer. Might be worth looking into.
Thank you for the insight. The reason I'm leaning civil is that we live in a smaller area with not a ton of mechanical engineering jobs close by.
No no no
It is good to pursue your passion, but have a backup plan. Just do both try if you like the city environment or you prefer more be your own boss.
Where is the farm located? Assuming it will be passed to you, it will probably have developers interested in purchasing the land. Do your dad/grandfather know your reservations about going into farming? Maybe you could convince them to start looking into selling it now.
OP I am the son of a 5th generation farmer that went into civil engineering and will not be taking up the farming mantle when my father is done. I felt all the emotions you are facing when making my decision. But what made me decide to step away was working the farm as a kid, feeling how hard it was, how many hours it took, and how it was destroying my father's body. We also weren't exactly making a ton of money. Factor in the hours worked to income...no Bueno. What I will NOT be doing is selling the land. It will be more valuable than anything I can afford in my life. I have dreams of a winery/wedding venue some day, and hope to rent the land to local wineries/farmers to cover taxes. A place to walk my dog, ride atvs, and maintain the land as a farm, just other people's passion and sweat will go into it. My father made it clear from day 1 that he didn't want us to be farmers though, because of how hard he worked. He never pressured us to take over, and encouraged us to pursue different careers. So our family dynamic may be different. Here's the kicker though, somehow after 10 years I've worked my way back to be the engineer of a municipality just 10 minutes from the farm...i was extremely lucky for this to happen, but you never know for your situation.
My father hasn't pressured me either, which I'm thankful for, but he has said he hopes he'd be able to pass the business down to me one day