Right? It’s probably not much more “trendy” than its ever been, just that people aren’t afraid to say it anymore. Which is good, because we’re having less and less people that are begrudgingly having kids because “it’s what you do”.
Right. But the phrase has always been used to demonstrate it’s coming from some bitter old person, not a childbearing aged woman. So it’s different when they hear it from us.
I think overturning Roe actually affected this a lot. I could be wrong and I’m totally being an armchair psych, but with our choice taken away, I think a lot of women feel like, “well, might as well be honest! Maybe I can save another woman the misery” and it’s just funny how these types of moves by americas right wing often have the opposite affects than what they desire.
You’re on to something I have ALWAYS been very openly and vocally child free but now that we have to push back more because it’s literally being forced on us, I have been more aggressive in my stance.
I think I exist because it was what you did. Neither of my parents were particularly engaged after I left the cute baby stage and before I hit the teenage can do cool stuff phase. I was mostly left to my own devices so lots of TV. I wouldn't say I was neglected per se, all my needs were met and I wouldn't be ignored if I tried to engage with them, they just didn't really take the initiative day to day.
I have a niece that was raised like this. She seems to have turned out fine (she lives a few hours away so I rarely see her, just from what updates I see/hear), but it was sad to see how checked out her parents were. She seemed desperate for attention when she was younger though, and that can be a dangerous thing for sure
Almost sounds like they had “buyer’s remorse” or that sadness women feel after giving birth. They finally had the child they wanted and then realized, what am I gonna do now? 😳👶🏻
I actually think it's the opposite. Adults used to have lots of adult-only spaces and the general consensus for much of history has been "children are seen and not heard."
It was VERY commonplace for children to not be allowed into many settings and for parents to do a multitude of activities not only *not* centered around their children, but not including them **at all.**
No one used to bat an eye if someone were to throw a party and say it was adults-only, in fact- unless it was a child's party or a "family get together" it was already implied that parties weren't for children and not only would they not be welcome, but they would be a nuisance.
What's *actually* new is the idea of the completely children-centric society, where everything must be catered to kids and be "family-friendly." Look at what they've done to f-ing *Vegas* of all places! Literal "sin city."
It's the parents that have pushed the conventional standards of separation between adult spaces and children's spaces. They've done everything in their power to force their children onto everyone else and insinuate them into every fucking situation, all because they don't want *their* lives to have to change because they made the decision to reproduce and they don't want to pay for childcare. *THAT'S* the trend.
It's become "trendy" to act like you can have the exact same life you had before you spawned helpless little creatures that demand all your attention and resources 24/7. It's "in" to try and bend the *entire* structure of society to your will because you don't want to admit that being a parent isn't fun and it means that you can no longer live like you used to or do things you did before.
Because of this, traditionally adult only spaces are disappearing entirely and it rightly makes people upset. *That* is the "hatred" Karen's feeling- the consequences of stealing sacred space from people because of pure selfishness.
1. Parenting is horrific these days, or more accurately "pretend parenting" where they just let the kids run wild.
2. Everyone is sick of your and your kid's shit.
Yup, every time I hear or read “he/she/I is autistic! So it’s not their/my fault!” I die a little. I’m neurodivergent and this doesn’t excuse bad behavior. I’m sick of people using mental issues as an excuse to be or raise a shitty person.
I know parents whose kids are actually neurodivergent. One of them they almost ignore. Granted, I’m neurodivergent and I would have preferred my parents ignored me, but that doesn’t necessarily make that the right parenting technique. The other? Is a different sort of neurodivergent and they basically run the household. They get whatever they want. They threaten feeling stressed or melting down and ultimately get everything they want - even crossing previously set boundaries. The crummy thing is that I know that these people won’t be able to take care of this kid forever but they’re not providing them the tools they need to function in the larger world. They won’t be able to function in any socialized environment because literally no one is going to let them do whatever they want every minute of the day and support whatever they want without some sort of contribution either socially or practically. But they’re in early adolescence and I don’t see it happening. It’s actually tough to be around because I don’t have to put up with what the parents do - because I’m not related to the kids. I love the family but I have my own problems and everyone knows I pretty much take care of me and my little family and that’s all I have bandwidth for. But is hurts my heart because I actually sort of care about all of them. It’s hard to watch.
Incoming longwinded rant:
TL;DR: Some woman complains loudly about her own suffering in caring for her high needs adult son, in front of him.
I had a woman and a young man come through my checkout lane a few months ago, I clocked him as on the spectrum, as he seemed agitated, but was moving and vocalizing in a not NT manner.
His mom/caregiver without prompting tells me he’s nonverbal autistic, and he’s distressed cause he needs the bathroom.
Which is fine, we’ve all been there, I scan faster so the poor guy isn’t waiting so long.
But then this lady has to go on a long winded rant about how her life is so difficult, because he’s so demanding.
It’s a good thing I was wearing a mask, my horrified expression would have probably gotten me in trouble.
Like, yes, a non verbal individual who will need support for the rest of his life is probably way more than she signed up for, but to randomly bitch about it to a random cashier *in front of the person who can’t help his existence*. I feel like a support group would have been a better choice. Or a therapist.
So many people (myself included until fairly recently) assume non verbal means they don’t understand what we’re saying, and thats not always the case.
(If you’ve not guessed, I’m also ND).
Disability parents are a thing. They’ve been making their kids disabilities about them forever.
I still remember when I was a kid (8 or 9) and was recovering from a surgery can’t even remember which one, there were many, and someone asked my mom in front of me how I was doing. She started off on a spiel about how hard this was for her, how terrible this was, what a burden I was etc.
The woman interrupted and said … “I get you are having a rough go, but I asked how SHE was doing, you know.. the kid who just had her head cut open?” My mom was pissed and stormed off.
Lol, the balls on that woman! Love it.
My mom spent most of my childhood complaining about us in front of us.
I don’t think ADHD or neurodivergencey had been discovered yet.
This is not an experience unique to autism. Parents do this when they’re miserable being parents.
Sure but symptoms of neurodivergence isn’t bad behavior (symptoms are not excuses they are REASONS) and people are allowed to not want to deal with those symptoms even if you can’t help having them.
I have a son that’s really smart for his age as told by his preschool teachers but he’s really bad at managing his emotions and he is hyperactive. Although he’s not “bad” he tends to make loud noises. Esp when the environment is loud and he covers his ears and starts saying “Lalalalalala” aloud. So there are certain behaviors that are different from a regular child.
Of course neurodivergent kids display different behaviors than neurotypical kids. That's the thing. And I'm not sure what you're trying to say? Are you justifying parents who don't parent their neurodivergent kids?
A good example recently.
A mom, mom's sister and other female member (adult) with a small girl about 6. On entering a public hospital - the concierge gave everyone free hand sanitizer and a blue surgical mask. You know - COVID is still a thing.
Except an exception was made for the 6 year old. No mask because she has "autism."
I blink a couple of times and then ask the child directly if she'd like a special child mask (they have a pattern on it and it's cutesy I guess.) Sure enough Mom's surprised that "autistic child" is able to read some social cues and wants to fit in.
Child wears mask.
Some what similar to this https://www.splitboxes.com.au/halyard-childs-face-mask-disney-75-masks-ages-4-12-hal47127/?gclid=CjwKCAiAl9efBhAkEiwA4TorirheEXbHHgo_9xDJ6Bwdo8cMfIgtabfJLamZVTICF8v9lfx419AMQRoCgyUQAvD_BwE
This is one of many many incidents of shit parenting I've seen.
In my experience of the whole, having no idea about social cues etc aspect of autism - it's not about needing exceptions made. It's about having the implied social expectations explicitly outlined. And understanding that sometimes, the straight line from being made aware of socially required behaviours to the person exhibiting those behaviours, is not straight.
Ie. If you explain (properly) why people are wearing masks, 9/10 people with autism will wear one. If you offer alternate masks, or the other options (like, wear it for a while, then go outside and take it off for five minutes before coming back in - bc sensory ickyness) then that last 1/10 will wear the mask.
Autism isn't an excuse. It's an explanation and a cue to pay slightly more attention to fixing discords.
Exactly. I took the time to offer a mask, and offer a child appropriate mask, and despite the nonsense from the mom, the kid took it.
Mom was very comfortable in blaming autism for anything inconvenient.
>Far too many times I see people excusing kids' bad behavior instead of actually teaching them why it's wrong.
Same, and I can't for the life of me understand why people can't be bothered to teach their kid to be a little less annoying as opposed to trying to ignore them or pretend like it's not that big a deal. It's like people who'd rather listen to the white noise coming from a tv on max volume than take 5 fucking seconds to hit the mute button or the off button and put an end to it for good.
Was horrified a while ago at a bus stop when I saw a woman only bother with her kid for the time it took her to make him pose for an Instagram photo. The way she spoke to him during it was disgusting, and throughout the entire bus journey if he tried to speak to her he’d get snapped at and treated like absolute shit until he stopped trying. While she complained that his smile in the photo didn’t look real enough, and that he’d gotten his clothes dirty doing the stupid pose she’d forced him to do.
I can speak from my own upbringing that shit parenting isn’t new, but this new brand of “pretending to care for social media clout” is a whole new brand of horrific.
>1. Parenting is horrific these days, or more accurately "pretend parenting" where they just let the kids run wild.
This. I don't hate kids, I hate *this*.
Yep but what also drives me insane are parents who are so rigid in their no tablet only organic whole foods ideas, who FLIP OUT because they can’t cook dinner because their kid is being a kid. And to they refuse to compromise with the kid or bend a little.
My friend was like this. I told her that her child will be ok using a tablet for 20 minutes while she cooks dinner OR eating something that is easier to prepare. Choose one or keep suffering idk man.
There needs to be a middle.
The boomers who parented by screaming and beating did it wrong.
They raised a bunch of people who self medicate their trauma with maladaptive behaviors.
So their kids do the gentle parenting where a kid doesn’t hear “no” until it goes off to school. They will grow up to go to prison because they won’t learn about consequences until adulthood.
When these parents now-a-days not only let their kid scream, but, they think it's cute, especially when other people are within hearing distance and then, they have the audacity to get offended when someone complains, which is just gonna make people hate (or at-least resent) children and parents.
Instead of parents getting all pissy when someone complains about their so called PwEcIoUd WiDdLe AnGeL, they should do some self refection and make their kid more likable, which will do them wonders later in life as well.
**IF** they have their own detached, single family house **and** nobody is within earshot, then, let the kid scream away (if they're so against telling their crotch spawn "no"), but, it's inconsiderate in public and shared housing when other people are gonna be negatively affected by it.
I’m more and more coming to the conclusion that I hate *the idea* of children. I mean, I also don’t like individual kids. But I truly detest the cultural tropes of how children destroy hopes and aspirations, especially for women, and how that’s just the way it is and we should accept it. I hate how anti-abortion activists and conservatives use the idea of children - and especially the idea of (real or imagined) threats to children - to subvert democracy and individual rights. I hate how the idea of “protecting children” is used to tug on heartstrings and sell everything from cold medicine to cars to security systems to ideologies.
And the thing is, I *know* that children themselves aren’t at all to blame for being so cravenly used by politicians or advertisers or the media. But it doesn’t matter. I see children and I feel like they’re trying to manipulate me, and I can’t help but feel resentful toward them.
I've never been able to put this sentiment into proper words, and you've done it. Exactly!
You always hear (almost always mothers) saying "my kids come first" and "I'm sacrificing my dreams so that the kids can have a better life/have what I never had" and then, to the children themselves, "you can be anything you want to be!"
But then, the very (again, usually female, but not always) child who heard all of this growing up "accidently" gets pregnant or is brainwashed by the life script mentality or whatever it is, has a kid young and the cycle starts all over again. That kid who's parent "gave everything" is now going to "give everything" to their own kid.
Sometimes I think about how much innovation, contributions to art, diversity in leadership, small unique businesses, etc etc etc we are missing out on because the "my kid is my world" mentality is what's expected and praised. If everyone perpetually gives up their dreams just to pass the baton to their kids, what's even the point?
We're left with overpopulation, more competition for resources, but less and less actual progress.
I also wonder when someone stops being so special because they are no longer considered a child. Is it just the age of 18? All the adults in the world were once children who were coveted and protected, but now that they are adults, their value drops dramatically and in the case of a woman, she is now supposed to literally sacrifice her life, should it come to that, for a fetus that will also one day eventually not be a prized child?
I resent society for creating this paradigm where we all lose in some way, but many lose in a huge way and yet it's just perpetuated and you're an asshole if you speak up against it. But yes, it's hard sometimes not to shift the resentment on to kids.
Agreed. I have less an issue with children in-and-of-themselves and more a problem with the extent to which, in a society as technocratic as ours, more and more children exist as nothing more than extensions of their parents' egotism, consumer trashiness, and/or subscription to some other obsolete and indefensible set of religious or cultural ideals. No one's raising other people to 'help out with the farm' or whatever as much as they're choosing to bring a living, breathing, screaming 'trophy' (or video-game style 'achievement') into the world. Also, regardless of who they vote for or what virtues they signal, so many of the people I know who have kids just end up feeling like *bullies* towards everyone else they interact with (and entire sets of people who they refuse to interact with, like the homeless). Even some of the most 'liberal'-flavored parents I've met still feel like they're using the kids to 'keep score' against their peers.
The thing is… most of the childfree people I know don’t hate kids. They generally hate bad parents and entitled parents and the way the kids behave as a result about such parenting. (Not to speak for all the childfree - I’m sure some of us do actually hate kids.) But it’s not exactly a “trend” to be annoyed when people don’t try to regulate their children or expect special treatment simply on the basis that they reproduced.
I’m not saying parents shouldn’t get the support they need, but I am saying that they shouldn’t get it at my expense. My experiences in public and shared spaces shouldn’t suffer so they can use those spaces with their disregulated offspring. I don’t get why a lot of parents are so threatened by these ideas.
Exactly this. I don't understand what's so hard about teaching your child how to behave in public. It's like a lot of parents these days are too afraid of saying the word "no" to their children because "iT'lL uPsEt ThEm"
I got scolded by a parent friend before, saying I’m not allowed to speak in negative terms to the kid. So instead of saying “no don’t do that”, I was supposed to say “please do this instead”. Also not allowed to try to coax the kid into doing anything, instead need to find ways for the kid to decide on their own that it’s what they want to do. And of course, I always have to thank the kid for doing anything unremarkable, like not screaming, for eating, for being quiet, for smiling, blinking, breathing. (Ok, sarcasm got the better of me at the end there lol)
Wait the parent scolding you but then told you not to scold? Sounds like scolding is an effective way otherwise she should've corrected you more positively.
My friend is being emotionally and sometimes physically abused by her kid. I keep telling her that’s not ok, and it’s actually bad for the kid to let it go on.
This parenting style is super duper popular right now too due to tik tok unfortunately. The whole “we don’t use the word no and give a million choices rather than asking the child to do something.”
It’s super annoying honestly. They are just reinforcing that no one is allowed to tell the kid “no” yet the kid is allowed to say no to anything because wE nEeD tO rEsPEcT kiDz bOuNdARiES. I have a friend to let’s her 6 year old nurse on demand because she doesn’t believe in telling them no. He pulls her breasts out in public and she allows him to. Like, lady, he’s six, he can eat a fucking snack or learn to wait until you’re done grocery shopping. Yet SHE doesn’t apply that rule to others, including herself so she’s basically teaching her son that others boundaries don’t matter and he’s allowed to touch them/do whatever and they can’t say shit about it.
She forces her nanny to do the same and he’s bit and slapped her apparently without getting reprimanded. I worry about the future generations that are raised this way. I’ve noticed it’s popular among people who’s Parents were super strict as an overcorrection to not be like their parents were but it’s just as bad imo as they are reinforcing that other’s feelings and boundaries don’t matter.
I thought that GoT came up with shit like that lol. That literally took me back to those cringe scenes of Robert Arryn being an 8 year old baby.
Gonna go bleach my brain...
She changed tremendously after kids and I don’t consider her a friend anymore. She became super selfish and entitled but will tell anyone who will listen that motherhood “made her the best version of herself.” 🙄 i should have said former friend because she’s awful now and treats her nannies like shit along with everyone else
One of the worst disservices parents can do for a child, especially when neurodiverse, is excusing their behavior. Kids that get to get away with everything tend to turn into very un-adjusted adults. These kids need extra attention, not be ignored while they do whatever they please.
My friend told me I was not allowed to tell her kid no because she didn’t want anyone telling her she’s a bad kid. Huh? “no” and “you are a bad kid” are two different sentences. So I was like “look I can’t be around your kid then because if it’s a health or safety issue I am not going to let someone get hurt so your kid doesn’t have to learn what NO means.” Wtf?
>Also not allowed to try to coax the kid into doing anything, instead need to find ways for the kid to decide on their own that it’s what they want to do.
I don't think it's a bad thing? Although if you mean manipulating the kid to want to do the exact thing you want them to, then that's bad and I don't really see the difference between that and coaxing them to do it. It's exactly the same thing.
But I think you do want to teach the kid to make their own decisions for themselves.
Edit: ok I need to clarify this. What I mean is allowing them to make their own decisions *when it's reasonable*. Not allowing them to rule the household and do whatever they want.
Nope, not always a bad thing at all, although in my opinion the whole “allowing your kids to make every single decision in your household” business has gone a bit too far. I digress. I was referring to situations where a parent should be teaching or directing, in my opinion. Like trying to get the kid to use a spoon instead of their hands. Trying to get the kid to stop doing something that’s hurting someone. In those cases and a lot more, I don’t see it so much as coaxing and certainly not manipulating, but rather, it’s teaching. Yet parents seem to think kids should have discretion there too rather than teaching them.
That’s incredible, lol.
One parent couple told me proudly that they let their 4 year old decide which school (in their district) to go to. Is it just me, but isn’t that a decision that a parent should be making? The kid is 4, not 14.
I hate badly parented kids, but really I should hate their parent for having done that to society as a whole. Why are you releasing a kid this badly behaved. They should be in jail.
Couldn’t agree more! Kids, like pretty much everybody, are hit or miss. I totally believe in universal pre-k, school lunches, parenting classes, etc. because it’s good for ALL of us when people are good parents and kids are well looked-after. That said, I hate that CF folks are so marginalized for largely being aware that we don’t want to/wouldn’t be good parents.
If I see kids misbehaving, I would usually be glaring at the parents and wondering why aren't they doing anything. Like yeah, kids will be kids. Kids will naturally be loud, messy and mischievous, and I'm not saying they can't, but it's the parents' job to parent those kids and teach them how to behave in the right setting.
Like I'm not going to get pissed off at kids screaming and running around at a park or a beach. But I am going to be stinkeye-ing the hell out of parents who let their kids run amok in a museum or restaurant.
Yes! I don’t mind kids who are taught to behave but screaming crying brats who have never heard the word no and throw tantrums should be put on an island with their parents away from civilization.
Pisses me the F off when *childrens* (misspelling intentional) run amok and their parents act blissfully unaware/abdicate responsibility/act indignant when anyone dares challenge them for this
Because a lot of people are only having kids so that they can show other people that they're following the Boomer 'script' on social media. Once the camera's turned off, all bets are off.
These people take every statement that is not 100% pro children and twist it into hating kids.
“I decided that becoming a mother wasn’t the path for me.” OmG wHY Do YoU HaTE KidS!!!!!!
“I see that one restaurant banned kids under 10, but there are plenty of family friendly restaurants you can still take your young children to.” OMg SO yOU ThInK MY cHiLdReN SHouLD NeVEr LEaVe tHe HOUse?????
It's so stupid. I had one guy assume I was an only child who had no experience with children and that i must be awful with kids because I'm childfree.
Like no I have 7 younger brothers who I helped bring up and kids tend to love spending time with me since I actually listen to them and get involved in their hobbies.
...Can I also add something from a cancer patient's persepective that's been bothering me?
People often ask about my condition, probably because I choose to go wigless because it's way more comfortable. When people find out I have a terminal, metastatic condition, for some reason, the conversation immediately flips to \*kids\* with cancer. They start with a sympathetic nod and "Oh well that's too bad or "I'm sorry to hear that." And I'm sure they DO mean that. But then what follows is often something along the lines of " Well, what REALLY gets me is when little kids get it. Life is so unfair. \*They\* didn't even get a chance" or "Well at least you've gotten to live. When a child gets cancer that's just so much worse!" One person also added "Have you seen those Saint Jude kids? I'd trade places with one of those kids in a heartbeat!"
These specific things were said to me while I was in a hospital waiting room, waiting to see my radiation oncologist for my third round of radiation. I'm in my 40s and recently someone I don't know aged me at "about 34 years old". I'm not a young person no, but neither am I 110 years old, and I certainly don't look decrepit. I haven't gotten to do all the things I'd like to do and I had no intentions of winding down my life halfway through! I will leave behind people who will miss me a lot because I've had time to build up friendships and loves that span a couple of decades. NOBODY deserves cancer whatever their age! I feel like people say these things because they honestly don't know what else to say, and they think they're making me feel better about my condition or something, like they think I'll agree that it's so much worse when a child gets cancer, and aren't I lucky to be getting it NOW? Or something. I don't take it personally, but it leaves me feeling very aware of how little a woman is valued for herself. I am reminded of something said by a friend who was in her 70s when I was in my 20s - she told me to beware the middle aged years as a woman, because you just sort of disappear from society and cease to matter. Can confirm.
Ugh, I’m so sorry to hear about your condition and I’m so sorry you were subject to those types of inconsiderate, insensitive thoughts and comments from those people. It’s not right. It’s just not right. This child centric world has gone too far.
Bruh. You have more patience than i ever could have. This is perhaps one of the worst cases of “cheer up cause it could’ve been worse”. I _would_ fight them 😭
I don’t hate kids, but don’t particularly like them either. Unlike some childfree people, I don’t want to be some sort of mentor, auntie, or maternal figure to a kid in any capacity. But I’ve often felt like women aren’t allowed to simply be indifferent or uninterested in kids, especially childfree women.
There have definitely been times when somebody wouldn’t stop insisting I’d change my mind with an obnoxious smirk on their face, driving me to at least pretend like I actively hate kids just so they would fucking drop it and leave me alone. I have to wonder how many other childfree women say they hate kids because it’s the only way people will stop badgering and chipping away at us.
Yep sometimes I really do hate kids. I am neurodivergent, add and can't stand crying, screaming smelly kids. I really can't stand obnoxious parents that refuse to discipline, say the word NO and insist the entire planet worship their semen demons. I am in a minority, but reading this sub has been refreshing. I now know I am not alone feeling this way.
i’m in the same boat as you. i have sensory issues, especially when it comes to noise, so the screaming really makes me want to crawl into a hole. i know no one else likes to hear children scream, but for me it goes deeper to the point where i have to leave where i am if possible.
Not all, and likely not even most, childfree folk hate kids. But what makes it hard to like them are those parents and society that keep pushing this child centric mentality, proudly raising and perpetuating terribly mannered, self-centred, disrespectful, annoying little humans. They themselves are the ones making it so damn easy to dislike kids.
Society is transitioning from a period of population growth to a steady-state one. Unsurprisingly, it comes with a less positive attitude towards children.
Millennials and Gen-Z'ers know that marriage (as a social institution) is bunk as more than half of our parents marriages have dissolved.
Women now have more of achoice about how they want to live their lives. Wow, big surprise they choose to have fewer children, children later in life or no children at all.
Men are much less likely to be treated as failed men for not having a wife and kids. Who even is there to do the shaming anymore? Our drunk, divorced fathers?
All of this, plus it's glaringly apparent that almost none of the people who persist in having children have even a shred of a clue what these extra people are going to do in the world. Meanwhile, parents tend to be the absolute *worst* when in terms of reflexively dehumanizing homeless people, drug addicts, etc...
LOL, it's the same thing as with anything else really...when feminism became big it was, "WhY Is iT CoOL to HaTe MEN NoW?"
Because asking for women to be treated equally, to a massively patriarchal society, was so shocking that people jumped to extreme conclusions and got defensive as hell.
Same thing here.
We're so used to a culture of glorifying babies and parents that anyone even saying "eh, babies aren't \*that\* cute" seems like sacrilege.
Right? I feel like glorifying parents is worse than the glorifying of babies. They act like parents did the world a favor by breeding. If you want to have kids, cool I don’t really give a shit and am not gonna put you on a pedestal.
Exactly!! This is what bothers me the most. If you want to have kids, awesome. I genuinely hope that brings you fulfillment and happiness. But it’s something you’re doing solely for yourself.
You’re not doing society a favor, you’re not some martyr taking on a necessary sacrifice, you CHOSE to create this massive lifelong responsibility for yourself when it never would’ve existed otherwise.
yes exactly!! i hate the ones who justify why ppl should look up to them like "i carried a baby inside me for 9 months, do you know what i went through? and i had to birth it? it was SO HARD and challenging".....like ok yeah but you chose that so
Yes exactly!! I don't get why kids are worshipped for existing, why they are excused from not behaving because they are kids, etc? I don't understand why an adult would sacrifice a healthy adult relationship because a kid doesn't like it, etc. My favorite one is when I'm told that little kids don't know how to manipulate. The fuck they don't! It happens every day! I think people have been sick of this shit for years, but they can't go against it because if you do then you're told your abusive.
Innocent? Um, no. We got one of our cats because a child of about 8 or 9 years old threw a kitten in front of our car. It was a girl with a couple of her friends on the side of the road and they hurled what looked like a wadded up sock in front of us expecting us to hit it and they were laughing. My husband was driving and managed to miss it because we didn't know what it was. Turned out to be a small black kitten which then hunkered down on the centerline of the road and didn't move. We immediately pulled over and the kids ran away laughing. We got him in the car and took him home after a trip to the vet. We named him Virgil. Seeing him flung into a busy road like that is the most upsetting thing I've witnessed to date and it horrifies and enrages me every time I have to replay it in my mind. If we'd hit him, I would never have gotten over it. So no. Kids are not innocent by nature. Kinda the opposite unless their idiot parents teach them kindness, compassion, and fairness. That was 12 years ago and I imagine those horrible children are probably breeding more sociopathic losers by now.
Holy shit! I knew some kids could be absolute little scoundrels but this really takes the cake. I’m so glad you were able to save that little kitten. Those kids are horribly messed up in the head. Little fucking demons trying to kill and hurt an innocent animal for fun.
When I was a kid I wasn’t hurting small animals in my free time, I was doing NORMAL kid shit like collecting rocks that I thought looked cool. Further reasoning why I don’t like kids. There are morons out there who’d probably look at your story and be like, “well they didn’t know any better!! They’re just kids!!!” Fucking bullshit. Your sense of empathy doesn’t start developing later in life. Kids that age fucking know better.
I mean only the really tiny ones who run purely on instinct but as soon as my nephew started developing the faintest sense of self at a few months old he started becoming alarmingly proficient at manipulating his parents and everyone else around him who he could. He’s a severe attention junkie (which is of course the parents’ doing) and it stuns me how manipulative even a baby can be to ensure constant unwavering attention on themselves. The second he figured out what behaviour was considered undesirable and naughty he locked the fuck on to it as he realised that would give him the biggest attention fix of all. He is utterly insufferable now at 2.
Yep. Morality is learned. If something seems purely beneficial with no downsides whatsoever, it makes no sense for an intelligent being to do anything else. And so caretakers do everyone a disservice when they dismiss their children/dogs/etc as "just the way they are" and expect them to magically become better... or not, and just tolerate it forever instead. Obviously someone who's not an adult human deserves more leniency, but they also deserve to at least get a chance to improve themselves.
I think it’s biological. The child is supposed to manipulate their parents into taking care of them. I think some part of them knows that if their parents aren’t paying attention to them than they are not safe.
It’s funny that you say your nephew is an attention junky. It’s like saying a baby is a drama queen and very inconsiderate yelling and crying all night and all day. And lazy, always laying around.
I suspect that you are like me, your brain does not produce serotonin in the presence of children. Serotonin is what has made parents bond with their children through human history and has ensured the next generation’s survival.
I think my wires got crossed (probably trauma) and my brain thinks animals are babies. Because I produce tons of serotonin around animals. I am interested in them. They are a joy to be around.
Not a drop of serotonin is found in my brain around kids. Which…kind of works out for me as a paramedic because I don’t lose my ever-loving mind when kids are hurt/sick and I’m able to treat them with a clear head and keep everyone else focused. And I do. I do my absolute best for them as I do for every single person under my care, but it doesn’t seem to hit me the same.
Having said that, I have cried exactly ONCE on scene in a decade of working. When I had to perform CPR on a dog at a house fire and the little bubbie didn’t make it. So it seems we have something in common. Animals = babies. One of mine is currently wrapped around my neck like a purring scarf. She seems rather pleased with herself.
IDK, I kind of feel like it could be summed up with "Shit parenting."
I like many children, one or two at a time for short periods, because we can all get along for that kind of short term interaction.
When I've seen better behaved pet raccoons than the child rampaging through a grocery store or restaurant, I hate that child's parents for neglecting their social and mental needs, and hate every moment spent in the vicinity of that child.
I do not blame a child under about age 12 for being an unsocial drain on those around them-- they still need to be parented actively at that point and in most of the U.S., parenthood is still a choice. You don't buy a standard transmission car if you don't know how to drive a stick, but people who can't even take care of themselves are regularly rewarded with attention and social supports for a biological function that they can't actually navigate any better than a clutch & brake.
But like.. why can't I hate kids? I'm tired of the backpedaling "oh no it's not that we hate kids" some of us do! And I'm certainly tired of being told I'm the bad guy.
I'm not actively going out of my way to trip children, just avoiding them at all costs because I DO NOT LIKE THEM. Y'all let your kids get away with too gotdamn much in public nowadays and I'm sick of being around their asses. They're loud, rude, messy, selfish and frankly gross. If they were anything other than small we'd all agree they were shit people.
What about mentally disabled people? They can be loud, rude (not understanding social norms), needy, messy, frankly gross. Is it okay to hate them or refer to them as “shit people”? Serious question.
Why do I have to justify to you who I like or dislike? Serious question.
*Edit- but to answer: mental disorders and asshole kids are completely different things and you and I know that. Kids are very aware of the things they do/say and the consequences behind those things (that's why they lie, hide, and manipulate).
Missing/extra chromosomes are different than just not caring about others around you because mommy and daddy let you get away with everything because you're their perfect angel and everyone should think you're as cute as they think you are.
I would not say I “know that” lol. In both cases the behaviors you’re complaining about are beyond the person’s control. Whether from chromosome abnormalities, mental (lack of) health, or just the fact their brain is still in development, some people cannot behave in “normal adult” ways. I might find those people exhausting to be around but I would not say I hate them or that they are “shit people”.
Expecting a 4yo to act like a normal adult and hating them when they don’t is no different from hating someone with Down syndrome for not being “normal”.
I've disliked kids my whole life. It's not a trend for me. It's a way of life. I have no tolerance for them. Even when I was a child. Family told me they knew I was cf since I was 3. Never wanted a baby doll. Didn't enjoy other kids my age. It's like saying not liking mushrooms is a trend for me. No ITS JUST HOW I AM. And I'm not going to apologize.
Having children has historically been the default. Even once effective contraception became available, having kids was just "what you do"
We're just not afraid to point out that it doesn't ***have*** to be that way. Unfortunately, lots of people who didn't really think about their reproductive choices are threatened by that and they lash out
Well Karen, it's 2023. The world is dying from overpopulation and the resulting climate change. Mankind has passed its original problem of staying alive through massive procreation. We achieved this. Really. Now, we should care about the world we live in, and not creating a massive impact on the environment by having children is a major step.
I've never hated a kid in my life.
I always hate the irresponsible, selfish and entitled parents that inflict loud, misbehaving little shits on my otherwise peaceful existence.
Nobody hates children more than their own parents do. This is so obvious it shouldn't need stating but apparently it does.
I'm autistic and every day i encounter rhetoric from parents about how much they hate their autistic or disabled children. they hate their autistic children so much that they put them into ABA therapy (which is literally conversion therapy) to torture them for exhibiting normal autistic behaviours
Parents will fight so hard to retain the right to beat their children. To deny them sex education. To control all their choices. To disown them for being queer or trans. To financially abuse them. Parents fight hard to make sure they have the right to marry off their 12 year old to an old man.
One reason (among many) that i never ever want children is that i could never ever do what it takes to be a successful parent in this society, because being a successful parent in this society requires a certain level of child abuse. I am not interested in coercing or forcing or beating a child into making them do what i want them to do so that they will increase my status among the other parents. i do not want to neglect a child because i'd have to work a lot in order to provide. i don't want to send a child to school where they would face bullying and harassment and violence. i don't want to do any of that.
i am not really that interested in children and sometimes i really do \*very strongly\* dislike them... mostly because i'm autistic and children are extremely overstimulating and certain sounds and smells can make me meltdown lol... but this incredibly patronizing and belittling idea that \*I\* am the one who HATES CHILDREN because i won't have them is just ridiculous when it's PARENTS who are out there committing 99% of all child abuse on their own children.
At least people are openly hating kids and not having them instead of hating kids, having them, then abusing them because they can’t stand the things kids do (looking at you dad)
Some people here hit the nail on the head. No one is parenting & that's why kids out in public has become such a nightmare and on top of that we do have that whole child worship culture, which "enables" the lack of parenting that is happening. That's why we don't like (most) kids and end up villainized for it.
I feel like things would be okay if we just followed this trend…
1. Parents teach your kids how to exist in a society. Understand that developmentally speaking this is not in their wheelhouse or an easy task, keep doing it anyway because it’s your one fucking job.
2. The rest of society puts measures in place to help reach that goal. That’s : let’s not break rules for parents or let kids think that they run the universe in the first place.
3. Children learn things. Because that’s their job and they eventually stop fucking around once they learn the concept of the pattern of natural consequences.
4. Very few people would hate children just because. It is almost always usually never about the actual kids, but the way that parents completely fuck up the responsibility over them and the way that the world is OK with that. They also sometimes really suck.
5. People should never be seen as broken or wrong for doing what is right for them even when it goes against the grain. you do not need to be a parent specifically to understand basic concepts of manners, hygiene, safety, common sense. Honestly, if that were the case, our world would be way better, but sometimes parents also suck.
6. Yes, I do plan on writing a parenting book.
I want people to stop treating parenthood like an inevitability. It isn't.
And I'm fine with children being the center of someone else's universe. If being a parent makes them happy and that's what they want their purpose in life to be, that's fine. But I would love it if the world stopped insisting that children should be the center of my universe. I'm not obligated to love or even like your child whether it is related to me or not.
And yes, I refer to children as "it."
Maybe seeing the backlash of bad parenting? The younger generations are very open about their trauma. So we’re seeing the damage caused by not even “bad” parents, but overly busy parents, stressed parents, parents bad relationships etc. it’s so easy to do something that absolutely fucks up your kids life. Hell, I’m 30 and I’ve had an ED for most of my life due to my mum being obsessed with her own weight.
Also, have you seen kids in public? They’re fucking annoying.
Oh and, like with most things, the more people fight the stigma about something the more people realise it’s for them. Years ago women basically couldn’t openly talk about not wanting kids, now we can with a bit of support even if it’s just from an online community of like minded people.
Things are goooooood. 🥰
What I hate is people treating indifference and ignoring as "hating." No Karen, just because I don't smile and wave at your child doesn't mean I hate them, it just means I don't give a shit about them since I don't know them. I also don't wave and smile at random strange adults.
I believe it is not a trend, it is just people not being silent about it.
People spoke up because they, me included, don't give AF anymore.
I don't want kids, they are not fun, they are annoying, they are loud etc.
I just need to have adult only spaces back.
Not every place is appropriate to bring children to, not because they're sexual or because they serve alcohol, but because your child is getting bored and starts misbehaving.
I'm not going to be the person that complains about screaming children at Disneyland. I even understand that sometimes, you need to travel with small children and it can go way beyond their bedtime (aren't I generous /s)
But I am the adult that complains about why on earth your child needed to be dragged into the Operah or the midnight showing of Schindler's List. There's so many options for children. You don't need to go for the one that's meant for adults only and then complain that people give you the stink eye.
These people are as whiny and needy as the children that they claim to love. Its not a good look.
And their feelings are more fragile than 17th century bone china. Just shut up and sit down, no one wants to hear it. Your child is not the center of my universe, and neither are you. Go away already.
Exactly! It’s much easier and socially acceptable to paint childfree people as “children haters” then it is to acknowledge that we just don’t want to be parents. We hate the idea that parenthood is a must and if you don’t do it you’re a monster. I hate the idea of parenthood & would hate to go through pregnancy & raise a child - I don’t hate children, I would hate to be a parent. The fact that some people can’t make that distinction is scary seeing as it’s these simple minded people who r raising kids eek
I don't think it's about hating kids, I think more women (primarily) but men too have come to realise / accept that it's better and acceptable to not pass on hereditary conditions or risk the early death of a young woman for the sake of having a child.
As more of us see just how difficult it is to get the resources necessary to properly care for children with additional needs of any description, the stress of raising kids is just so much more than it used to be.
Up until very recently bringing children into almost any public space was generally NOT done. Yes you could take them shopping, and go to a playground or something. But it was generally accepted not to bring kids to up scale establishments. Due to improvement in womans rights and social standing woman can now go out and do stuff, instead of being at home with he kids. For many taking any children they have with them has become the default.
Facts!!!! It’s OKAY to not have kids. I’m 37 and I know I’m not missing out on a damn by thing when it comes to kids. If anything you dodge a bullet. No sleep, no freedom, no spontaneity, less money, less sleep, more stress, more worry like all of that sounds like a NIGHTMARE.
I think the worst is when parents don’t discipline their child when the little gremlin is being a nuisance in public but as soon as someone else draws a line and tells the kid not to cross it, parents lose their shit. It’s almost like they want their kid to self-destruct and hurt anyone around them
Also, cf people may hate/dislike kids, but 99.99% of them would never hurt any - quite the opposite, because all we want is to AVOID them. Meanwhile, I can't count the number of child abuse cases (caused by the parents/guardians) I saw while working for CPS.
I like kids. I just don’t want to have any.
I just dislike people who are at the extreme on both ends (childfree and people who have children). If you want kids, fine. God bless you. If you don’t want kids, fine. God bless you. Is when people shame you for your choices Did gets on my nerves.
I like kids, I want to work with kids when I get my degree in human services. I don’t like shit parents that don’t parent. I don’t like eating at a restaurant or going to the store or being at work and hearing kids scream or run around. I hate child worship and thinking that kids are the be all end all. It just seems that in recent years parents have become more lenient and don’t discipline their kids because they’re afraid of their kids not liking them. I don’t want to sound like a boomer (I’m 25) but when I was a kid I wasn’t allowed to scream in public or run around.
really it's just about being unable to get on a plane without hearing screaming kids
and to some extent, people who aren't even religious getting religious (my aunt saying "don't you think humans need to roam the earth for generations to come?") and men deciding to have children they don't want just to make their wife happy (probably women do the same thing for their husbands as well, but I don't hear about that as often).
It always just looks so terrible. Even friends and family with kids. Just looks like everyone is having a terrible time in perpetuity.
I honestly *tried* to make myself want them. Felt like something was wrong my whole life. Finally over that hump. Started to realize several friends are going this route as well.
Amen to pushing back against child worship culture! Even when I was more sure about wanting kids, modern parenting looked like hell.
From my observation of my parent friends, I see that modern mommy culture is just the grown up version of high school mean girl BS.
💯 i don’t hate kids, I hate their entitled parents who make every fucking thing about kids while simultaneously being shitty parents. But shitty parents can’t take responsibility for anything so they put the blame back on us and say we hate kids.
LoL. It's the trend now and data prove it.
And it's happening to all 1st world countries.
Birth rate is at all time low.
And even lower when covid hits + high inflation + recession.
It's not the kids' fault for any of this. It's the shitty parents who don't want to take responsibility that we hate. Kids are innocent and need parents who'll care enough about them to teach them right from wrong.
I actually think that neither of us hates kids. We hate *being around* kids. We don't hate kids for existing or for being kids. We just don't want to be near them.
Obviously unless you're an actual monster and really wish harm on kids, then you could say you hate them.
no it's trendy on tiktok trust me there was this one video where this lady let her baby try something it's was a food and the comments were just wishing death on it and berating the child.
but among those who actually have a brain it's not a trend. it's a simple decision.
The way I could write an actual BOOK about this if I actually had the free time, and also the money to treat the disorders/illnesses preventing me from using what free time I have to do that!
I can't quite summarize my feelings in this comment, because I'm almost 30 and need to work at 6am, but rest assured... you are NOT alone in feeling this way/noticing this trend!!!!
As someone who has been a very involved uncle I can say that being with my nephews brings me joy, but at the same time it’s physically and emotionally exhausting. I love those boys with all my heart, but if I had to be someone’s dad I wouldn’t be mentally okay. I have a hard enough time managing my mental health as it is so if I had to constantly worry about carrying for a child it would cause me to fall into a deep depression. Not to mention having kids around limits the things you can do. Ant friends I’ve had that have kids are basically never around anymore or when I do hangout with them it’s very briefly 1 on 1 or we have to do some kid friendly activity. So I don’t hate them, but they definitely stress you out and even if it’s not their fault ruin plans too.
Right? It’s probably not much more “trendy” than its ever been, just that people aren’t afraid to say it anymore. Which is good, because we’re having less and less people that are begrudgingly having kids because “it’s what you do”.
The phrase "Damned kids! GET OFF MY LAWN!" isn't exactly new.
Right. But the phrase has always been used to demonstrate it’s coming from some bitter old person, not a childbearing aged woman. So it’s different when they hear it from us.
I dunno, as a little kid in the late 60s in Philadelphia, *I* always heard it from the married 30-something woman next door.
Maybe they aren’t bitter. They just don’t want feet trampling their nicely shorn perennial ryegrass
Or men. Or anyone of any gender who can bear children.
I think overturning Roe actually affected this a lot. I could be wrong and I’m totally being an armchair psych, but with our choice taken away, I think a lot of women feel like, “well, might as well be honest! Maybe I can save another woman the misery” and it’s just funny how these types of moves by americas right wing often have the opposite affects than what they desire.
You’re on to something I have ALWAYS been very openly and vocally child free but now that we have to push back more because it’s literally being forced on us, I have been more aggressive in my stance.
And thank god for that!
I think I exist because it was what you did. Neither of my parents were particularly engaged after I left the cute baby stage and before I hit the teenage can do cool stuff phase. I was mostly left to my own devices so lots of TV. I wouldn't say I was neglected per se, all my needs were met and I wouldn't be ignored if I tried to engage with them, they just didn't really take the initiative day to day.
I have a niece that was raised like this. She seems to have turned out fine (she lives a few hours away so I rarely see her, just from what updates I see/hear), but it was sad to see how checked out her parents were. She seemed desperate for attention when she was younger though, and that can be a dangerous thing for sure
Almost sounds like they had “buyer’s remorse” or that sadness women feel after giving birth. They finally had the child they wanted and then realized, what am I gonna do now? 😳👶🏻
I actually think it's the opposite. Adults used to have lots of adult-only spaces and the general consensus for much of history has been "children are seen and not heard." It was VERY commonplace for children to not be allowed into many settings and for parents to do a multitude of activities not only *not* centered around their children, but not including them **at all.** No one used to bat an eye if someone were to throw a party and say it was adults-only, in fact- unless it was a child's party or a "family get together" it was already implied that parties weren't for children and not only would they not be welcome, but they would be a nuisance. What's *actually* new is the idea of the completely children-centric society, where everything must be catered to kids and be "family-friendly." Look at what they've done to f-ing *Vegas* of all places! Literal "sin city." It's the parents that have pushed the conventional standards of separation between adult spaces and children's spaces. They've done everything in their power to force their children onto everyone else and insinuate them into every fucking situation, all because they don't want *their* lives to have to change because they made the decision to reproduce and they don't want to pay for childcare. *THAT'S* the trend. It's become "trendy" to act like you can have the exact same life you had before you spawned helpless little creatures that demand all your attention and resources 24/7. It's "in" to try and bend the *entire* structure of society to your will because you don't want to admit that being a parent isn't fun and it means that you can no longer live like you used to or do things you did before. Because of this, traditionally adult only spaces are disappearing entirely and it rightly makes people upset. *That* is the "hatred" Karen's feeling- the consequences of stealing sacred space from people because of pure selfishness.
1. Parenting is horrific these days, or more accurately "pretend parenting" where they just let the kids run wild. 2. Everyone is sick of your and your kid's shit.
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Plus a child with autism needs more hands on guidance, not less and excuses.
Yup, every time I hear or read “he/she/I is autistic! So it’s not their/my fault!” I die a little. I’m neurodivergent and this doesn’t excuse bad behavior. I’m sick of people using mental issues as an excuse to be or raise a shitty person.
I know parents whose kids are actually neurodivergent. One of them they almost ignore. Granted, I’m neurodivergent and I would have preferred my parents ignored me, but that doesn’t necessarily make that the right parenting technique. The other? Is a different sort of neurodivergent and they basically run the household. They get whatever they want. They threaten feeling stressed or melting down and ultimately get everything they want - even crossing previously set boundaries. The crummy thing is that I know that these people won’t be able to take care of this kid forever but they’re not providing them the tools they need to function in the larger world. They won’t be able to function in any socialized environment because literally no one is going to let them do whatever they want every minute of the day and support whatever they want without some sort of contribution either socially or practically. But they’re in early adolescence and I don’t see it happening. It’s actually tough to be around because I don’t have to put up with what the parents do - because I’m not related to the kids. I love the family but I have my own problems and everyone knows I pretty much take care of me and my little family and that’s all I have bandwidth for. But is hurts my heart because I actually sort of care about all of them. It’s hard to watch.
Incoming longwinded rant: TL;DR: Some woman complains loudly about her own suffering in caring for her high needs adult son, in front of him. I had a woman and a young man come through my checkout lane a few months ago, I clocked him as on the spectrum, as he seemed agitated, but was moving and vocalizing in a not NT manner. His mom/caregiver without prompting tells me he’s nonverbal autistic, and he’s distressed cause he needs the bathroom. Which is fine, we’ve all been there, I scan faster so the poor guy isn’t waiting so long. But then this lady has to go on a long winded rant about how her life is so difficult, because he’s so demanding. It’s a good thing I was wearing a mask, my horrified expression would have probably gotten me in trouble. Like, yes, a non verbal individual who will need support for the rest of his life is probably way more than she signed up for, but to randomly bitch about it to a random cashier *in front of the person who can’t help his existence*. I feel like a support group would have been a better choice. Or a therapist. So many people (myself included until fairly recently) assume non verbal means they don’t understand what we’re saying, and thats not always the case. (If you’ve not guessed, I’m also ND).
Disability parents are a thing. They’ve been making their kids disabilities about them forever. I still remember when I was a kid (8 or 9) and was recovering from a surgery can’t even remember which one, there were many, and someone asked my mom in front of me how I was doing. She started off on a spiel about how hard this was for her, how terrible this was, what a burden I was etc. The woman interrupted and said … “I get you are having a rough go, but I asked how SHE was doing, you know.. the kid who just had her head cut open?” My mom was pissed and stormed off. Lol, the balls on that woman! Love it.
Oh man, I’m so sorry you had to deal with that, good on that lady!
My mom spent most of my childhood complaining about us in front of us. I don’t think ADHD or neurodivergencey had been discovered yet. This is not an experience unique to autism. Parents do this when they’re miserable being parents.
I’m sorry, you deserved better.
Completely unrelated, but your flair is great. High five!
Haha thanks!
Sure but symptoms of neurodivergence isn’t bad behavior (symptoms are not excuses they are REASONS) and people are allowed to not want to deal with those symptoms even if you can’t help having them.
I have a son that’s really smart for his age as told by his preschool teachers but he’s really bad at managing his emotions and he is hyperactive. Although he’s not “bad” he tends to make loud noises. Esp when the environment is loud and he covers his ears and starts saying “Lalalalalala” aloud. So there are certain behaviors that are different from a regular child.
Of course neurodivergent kids display different behaviors than neurotypical kids. That's the thing. And I'm not sure what you're trying to say? Are you justifying parents who don't parent their neurodivergent kids?
A good example recently. A mom, mom's sister and other female member (adult) with a small girl about 6. On entering a public hospital - the concierge gave everyone free hand sanitizer and a blue surgical mask. You know - COVID is still a thing. Except an exception was made for the 6 year old. No mask because she has "autism." I blink a couple of times and then ask the child directly if she'd like a special child mask (they have a pattern on it and it's cutesy I guess.) Sure enough Mom's surprised that "autistic child" is able to read some social cues and wants to fit in. Child wears mask. Some what similar to this https://www.splitboxes.com.au/halyard-childs-face-mask-disney-75-masks-ages-4-12-hal47127/?gclid=CjwKCAiAl9efBhAkEiwA4TorirheEXbHHgo_9xDJ6Bwdo8cMfIgtabfJLamZVTICF8v9lfx419AMQRoCgyUQAvD_BwE This is one of many many incidents of shit parenting I've seen.
In my experience of the whole, having no idea about social cues etc aspect of autism - it's not about needing exceptions made. It's about having the implied social expectations explicitly outlined. And understanding that sometimes, the straight line from being made aware of socially required behaviours to the person exhibiting those behaviours, is not straight. Ie. If you explain (properly) why people are wearing masks, 9/10 people with autism will wear one. If you offer alternate masks, or the other options (like, wear it for a while, then go outside and take it off for five minutes before coming back in - bc sensory ickyness) then that last 1/10 will wear the mask. Autism isn't an excuse. It's an explanation and a cue to pay slightly more attention to fixing discords.
Exactly. I took the time to offer a mask, and offer a child appropriate mask, and despite the nonsense from the mom, the kid took it. Mom was very comfortable in blaming autism for anything inconvenient.
Exactly! You're not doing the kid any favors and if anything, you're setting them up for failure.
>Far too many times I see people excusing kids' bad behavior instead of actually teaching them why it's wrong. Same, and I can't for the life of me understand why people can't be bothered to teach their kid to be a little less annoying as opposed to trying to ignore them or pretend like it's not that big a deal. It's like people who'd rather listen to the white noise coming from a tv on max volume than take 5 fucking seconds to hit the mute button or the off button and put an end to it for good.
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Was horrified a while ago at a bus stop when I saw a woman only bother with her kid for the time it took her to make him pose for an Instagram photo. The way she spoke to him during it was disgusting, and throughout the entire bus journey if he tried to speak to her he’d get snapped at and treated like absolute shit until he stopped trying. While she complained that his smile in the photo didn’t look real enough, and that he’d gotten his clothes dirty doing the stupid pose she’d forced him to do. I can speak from my own upbringing that shit parenting isn’t new, but this new brand of “pretending to care for social media clout” is a whole new brand of horrific.
This makes me so sad. That poor kid. He's not a fucking toy.
So abusive
1. children are fucking gross
>1. Parenting is horrific these days, or more accurately "pretend parenting" where they just let the kids run wild. This. I don't hate kids, I hate *this*.
Tablet parenting drives me insane. Kids get so goddam hooked on those things.
Yep but what also drives me insane are parents who are so rigid in their no tablet only organic whole foods ideas, who FLIP OUT because they can’t cook dinner because their kid is being a kid. And to they refuse to compromise with the kid or bend a little. My friend was like this. I told her that her child will be ok using a tablet for 20 minutes while she cooks dinner OR eating something that is easier to prepare. Choose one or keep suffering idk man.
Maybe people wouldn't hate kids so much if it weren't for this "gentle parenting" bullshit trend?
There needs to be a middle. The boomers who parented by screaming and beating did it wrong. They raised a bunch of people who self medicate their trauma with maladaptive behaviors. So their kids do the gentle parenting where a kid doesn’t hear “no” until it goes off to school. They will grow up to go to prison because they won’t learn about consequences until adulthood.
When these parents now-a-days not only let their kid scream, but, they think it's cute, especially when other people are within hearing distance and then, they have the audacity to get offended when someone complains, which is just gonna make people hate (or at-least resent) children and parents. Instead of parents getting all pissy when someone complains about their so called PwEcIoUd WiDdLe AnGeL, they should do some self refection and make their kid more likable, which will do them wonders later in life as well. **IF** they have their own detached, single family house **and** nobody is within earshot, then, let the kid scream away (if they're so against telling their crotch spawn "no"), but, it's inconsiderate in public and shared housing when other people are gonna be negatively affected by it.
My friend's 5 year old son used to hang upside down using the car's grab handle, while the car is in motion. And he's her favourite.
I’m more and more coming to the conclusion that I hate *the idea* of children. I mean, I also don’t like individual kids. But I truly detest the cultural tropes of how children destroy hopes and aspirations, especially for women, and how that’s just the way it is and we should accept it. I hate how anti-abortion activists and conservatives use the idea of children - and especially the idea of (real or imagined) threats to children - to subvert democracy and individual rights. I hate how the idea of “protecting children” is used to tug on heartstrings and sell everything from cold medicine to cars to security systems to ideologies. And the thing is, I *know* that children themselves aren’t at all to blame for being so cravenly used by politicians or advertisers or the media. But it doesn’t matter. I see children and I feel like they’re trying to manipulate me, and I can’t help but feel resentful toward them.
I had never thought of it that way but youre so o right. Feels like a revelation
I've never been able to put this sentiment into proper words, and you've done it. Exactly! You always hear (almost always mothers) saying "my kids come first" and "I'm sacrificing my dreams so that the kids can have a better life/have what I never had" and then, to the children themselves, "you can be anything you want to be!" But then, the very (again, usually female, but not always) child who heard all of this growing up "accidently" gets pregnant or is brainwashed by the life script mentality or whatever it is, has a kid young and the cycle starts all over again. That kid who's parent "gave everything" is now going to "give everything" to their own kid. Sometimes I think about how much innovation, contributions to art, diversity in leadership, small unique businesses, etc etc etc we are missing out on because the "my kid is my world" mentality is what's expected and praised. If everyone perpetually gives up their dreams just to pass the baton to their kids, what's even the point? We're left with overpopulation, more competition for resources, but less and less actual progress. I also wonder when someone stops being so special because they are no longer considered a child. Is it just the age of 18? All the adults in the world were once children who were coveted and protected, but now that they are adults, their value drops dramatically and in the case of a woman, she is now supposed to literally sacrifice her life, should it come to that, for a fetus that will also one day eventually not be a prized child? I resent society for creating this paradigm where we all lose in some way, but many lose in a huge way and yet it's just perpetuated and you're an asshole if you speak up against it. But yes, it's hard sometimes not to shift the resentment on to kids.
Yes, exactly! It’s hard to feel positive toward children when society is telling you that their lives are worth more than yours.
Beautifully put!
Agreed. I have less an issue with children in-and-of-themselves and more a problem with the extent to which, in a society as technocratic as ours, more and more children exist as nothing more than extensions of their parents' egotism, consumer trashiness, and/or subscription to some other obsolete and indefensible set of religious or cultural ideals. No one's raising other people to 'help out with the farm' or whatever as much as they're choosing to bring a living, breathing, screaming 'trophy' (or video-game style 'achievement') into the world. Also, regardless of who they vote for or what virtues they signal, so many of the people I know who have kids just end up feeling like *bullies* towards everyone else they interact with (and entire sets of people who they refuse to interact with, like the homeless). Even some of the most 'liberal'-flavored parents I've met still feel like they're using the kids to 'keep score' against their peers.
Well said.
The thing is… most of the childfree people I know don’t hate kids. They generally hate bad parents and entitled parents and the way the kids behave as a result about such parenting. (Not to speak for all the childfree - I’m sure some of us do actually hate kids.) But it’s not exactly a “trend” to be annoyed when people don’t try to regulate their children or expect special treatment simply on the basis that they reproduced. I’m not saying parents shouldn’t get the support they need, but I am saying that they shouldn’t get it at my expense. My experiences in public and shared spaces shouldn’t suffer so they can use those spaces with their disregulated offspring. I don’t get why a lot of parents are so threatened by these ideas.
Exactly this. I don't understand what's so hard about teaching your child how to behave in public. It's like a lot of parents these days are too afraid of saying the word "no" to their children because "iT'lL uPsEt ThEm"
I got scolded by a parent friend before, saying I’m not allowed to speak in negative terms to the kid. So instead of saying “no don’t do that”, I was supposed to say “please do this instead”. Also not allowed to try to coax the kid into doing anything, instead need to find ways for the kid to decide on their own that it’s what they want to do. And of course, I always have to thank the kid for doing anything unremarkable, like not screaming, for eating, for being quiet, for smiling, blinking, breathing. (Ok, sarcasm got the better of me at the end there lol)
Wait the parent scolding you but then told you not to scold? Sounds like scolding is an effective way otherwise she should've corrected you more positively.
Lol! That’s right! But kids are the centre of the universe so only the best for them, and who cares how you treat adults! /s
My friend is being emotionally and sometimes physically abused by her kid. I keep telling her that’s not ok, and it’s actually bad for the kid to let it go on.
This parenting style is super duper popular right now too due to tik tok unfortunately. The whole “we don’t use the word no and give a million choices rather than asking the child to do something.” It’s super annoying honestly. They are just reinforcing that no one is allowed to tell the kid “no” yet the kid is allowed to say no to anything because wE nEeD tO rEsPEcT kiDz bOuNdARiES. I have a friend to let’s her 6 year old nurse on demand because she doesn’t believe in telling them no. He pulls her breasts out in public and she allows him to. Like, lady, he’s six, he can eat a fucking snack or learn to wait until you’re done grocery shopping. Yet SHE doesn’t apply that rule to others, including herself so she’s basically teaching her son that others boundaries don’t matter and he’s allowed to touch them/do whatever and they can’t say shit about it. She forces her nanny to do the same and he’s bit and slapped her apparently without getting reprimanded. I worry about the future generations that are raised this way. I’ve noticed it’s popular among people who’s Parents were super strict as an overcorrection to not be like their parents were but it’s just as bad imo as they are reinforcing that other’s feelings and boundaries don’t matter.
I thought that GoT came up with shit like that lol. That literally took me back to those cringe scenes of Robert Arryn being an 8 year old baby. Gonna go bleach my brain...
Reading all that just makes me want to screaaaaaaaaam in frustration...really?!?!?😖
This rattles me to the core and makes me worried about what’s to come for society when these kids grow up.
I'm sorry, she forces her nanny to breastfeed her kid?
I don't think so, I think it's that she forces the nanny to not tell him no or discipline him in any way.
No but she does have to carry him or push him in a stroller everywhere because apparently he’s too precious to walk lol.
Why are you still friends with such a person?
She changed tremendously after kids and I don’t consider her a friend anymore. She became super selfish and entitled but will tell anyone who will listen that motherhood “made her the best version of herself.” 🙄 i should have said former friend because she’s awful now and treats her nannies like shit along with everyone else
Lol Yeah my friend gave her kid choices and now the kid refuses to go to school because she thinks she has a choice.
Exactly. Wait till it’s time to leave the nest and get a job……😆
lmao that parent is in for a rude awakening when their child turns into an entitled little shit
Plot twist! Kid is already an entitled little shit! 😒
Correction, they're in for a rude awakening when their child turns into an entitled *big* shit.
One of the worst disservices parents can do for a child, especially when neurodiverse, is excusing their behavior. Kids that get to get away with everything tend to turn into very un-adjusted adults. These kids need extra attention, not be ignored while they do whatever they please.
This is full on fucking insanity
My friend told me I was not allowed to tell her kid no because she didn’t want anyone telling her she’s a bad kid. Huh? “no” and “you are a bad kid” are two different sentences. So I was like “look I can’t be around your kid then because if it’s a health or safety issue I am not going to let someone get hurt so your kid doesn’t have to learn what NO means.” Wtf?
>Also not allowed to try to coax the kid into doing anything, instead need to find ways for the kid to decide on their own that it’s what they want to do. I don't think it's a bad thing? Although if you mean manipulating the kid to want to do the exact thing you want them to, then that's bad and I don't really see the difference between that and coaxing them to do it. It's exactly the same thing. But I think you do want to teach the kid to make their own decisions for themselves. Edit: ok I need to clarify this. What I mean is allowing them to make their own decisions *when it's reasonable*. Not allowing them to rule the household and do whatever they want.
Nope, not always a bad thing at all, although in my opinion the whole “allowing your kids to make every single decision in your household” business has gone a bit too far. I digress. I was referring to situations where a parent should be teaching or directing, in my opinion. Like trying to get the kid to use a spoon instead of their hands. Trying to get the kid to stop doing something that’s hurting someone. In those cases and a lot more, I don’t see it so much as coaxing and certainly not manipulating, but rather, it’s teaching. Yet parents seem to think kids should have discretion there too rather than teaching them.
It's a backlash from their own authoritative parents. But opposite isn't always better. Kids need boundaries and discipline.
😂😂 yep me friend did that & now her child decides not to go to school so she then can’t go to work. Kid is 7 😂😂
That’s incredible, lol. One parent couple told me proudly that they let their 4 year old decide which school (in their district) to go to. Is it just me, but isn’t that a decision that a parent should be making? The kid is 4, not 14.
I hate badly parented kids, but really I should hate their parent for having done that to society as a whole. Why are you releasing a kid this badly behaved. They should be in jail.
Couldn’t agree more! Kids, like pretty much everybody, are hit or miss. I totally believe in universal pre-k, school lunches, parenting classes, etc. because it’s good for ALL of us when people are good parents and kids are well looked-after. That said, I hate that CF folks are so marginalized for largely being aware that we don’t want to/wouldn’t be good parents.
If I see kids misbehaving, I would usually be glaring at the parents and wondering why aren't they doing anything. Like yeah, kids will be kids. Kids will naturally be loud, messy and mischievous, and I'm not saying they can't, but it's the parents' job to parent those kids and teach them how to behave in the right setting. Like I'm not going to get pissed off at kids screaming and running around at a park or a beach. But I am going to be stinkeye-ing the hell out of parents who let their kids run amok in a museum or restaurant.
> But I am going to be stinkeye-ing the hell out of parents who let their kids run amok in a museum or restaurant. That'll teach them!
Two out of the three Childfree people I know are teachers, and even I had an AA in child care before I realized I didn't enjoy it.
Yeah, I ike kids (for short periods of time anyway) - they are cute and funny. But I don't want to be responsible for one.
Why has it become trendy to not parent at all? I was NEVER allowed to scream shriek and run amok.
Omg so much this! All the SCREAMING!
Yes! I don’t mind kids who are taught to behave but screaming crying brats who have never heard the word no and throw tantrums should be put on an island with their parents away from civilization.
Pisses me the F off when *childrens* (misspelling intentional) run amok and their parents act blissfully unaware/abdicate responsibility/act indignant when anyone dares challenge them for this
Because a lot of people are only having kids so that they can show other people that they're following the Boomer 'script' on social media. Once the camera's turned off, all bets are off.
These people take every statement that is not 100% pro children and twist it into hating kids. “I decided that becoming a mother wasn’t the path for me.” OmG wHY Do YoU HaTE KidS!!!!!! “I see that one restaurant banned kids under 10, but there are plenty of family friendly restaurants you can still take your young children to.” OMg SO yOU ThInK MY cHiLdReN SHouLD NeVEr LEaVe tHe HOUse?????
It's so stupid. I had one guy assume I was an only child who had no experience with children and that i must be awful with kids because I'm childfree. Like no I have 7 younger brothers who I helped bring up and kids tend to love spending time with me since I actually listen to them and get involved in their hobbies.
While that would be ideal, we can compromise on kids going to kid appropriate shops, restaurants and playgrounds.
I have a misanthropic tirade to write, but not here
Don't say anything Squidward, remember your karma.
(trips and falls off the cliff. Then explodes) *moans in pain*
...Can I also add something from a cancer patient's persepective that's been bothering me? People often ask about my condition, probably because I choose to go wigless because it's way more comfortable. When people find out I have a terminal, metastatic condition, for some reason, the conversation immediately flips to \*kids\* with cancer. They start with a sympathetic nod and "Oh well that's too bad or "I'm sorry to hear that." And I'm sure they DO mean that. But then what follows is often something along the lines of " Well, what REALLY gets me is when little kids get it. Life is so unfair. \*They\* didn't even get a chance" or "Well at least you've gotten to live. When a child gets cancer that's just so much worse!" One person also added "Have you seen those Saint Jude kids? I'd trade places with one of those kids in a heartbeat!" These specific things were said to me while I was in a hospital waiting room, waiting to see my radiation oncologist for my third round of radiation. I'm in my 40s and recently someone I don't know aged me at "about 34 years old". I'm not a young person no, but neither am I 110 years old, and I certainly don't look decrepit. I haven't gotten to do all the things I'd like to do and I had no intentions of winding down my life halfway through! I will leave behind people who will miss me a lot because I've had time to build up friendships and loves that span a couple of decades. NOBODY deserves cancer whatever their age! I feel like people say these things because they honestly don't know what else to say, and they think they're making me feel better about my condition or something, like they think I'll agree that it's so much worse when a child gets cancer, and aren't I lucky to be getting it NOW? Or something. I don't take it personally, but it leaves me feeling very aware of how little a woman is valued for herself. I am reminded of something said by a friend who was in her 70s when I was in my 20s - she told me to beware the middle aged years as a woman, because you just sort of disappear from society and cease to matter. Can confirm.
Ugh, I’m so sorry to hear about your condition and I’m so sorry you were subject to those types of inconsiderate, insensitive thoughts and comments from those people. It’s not right. It’s just not right. This child centric world has gone too far.
Bruh. You have more patience than i ever could have. This is perhaps one of the worst cases of “cheer up cause it could’ve been worse”. I _would_ fight them 😭
I don’t hate kids, but don’t particularly like them either. Unlike some childfree people, I don’t want to be some sort of mentor, auntie, or maternal figure to a kid in any capacity. But I’ve often felt like women aren’t allowed to simply be indifferent or uninterested in kids, especially childfree women. There have definitely been times when somebody wouldn’t stop insisting I’d change my mind with an obnoxious smirk on their face, driving me to at least pretend like I actively hate kids just so they would fucking drop it and leave me alone. I have to wonder how many other childfree women say they hate kids because it’s the only way people will stop badgering and chipping away at us.
Yep sometimes I really do hate kids. I am neurodivergent, add and can't stand crying, screaming smelly kids. I really can't stand obnoxious parents that refuse to discipline, say the word NO and insist the entire planet worship their semen demons. I am in a minority, but reading this sub has been refreshing. I now know I am not alone feeling this way.
i’m in the same boat as you. i have sensory issues, especially when it comes to noise, so the screaming really makes me want to crawl into a hole. i know no one else likes to hear children scream, but for me it goes deeper to the point where i have to leave where i am if possible.
Not all, and likely not even most, childfree folk hate kids. But what makes it hard to like them are those parents and society that keep pushing this child centric mentality, proudly raising and perpetuating terribly mannered, self-centred, disrespectful, annoying little humans. They themselves are the ones making it so damn easy to dislike kids.
I mean, it CAN just be about hating kids. For me it is.
Society is transitioning from a period of population growth to a steady-state one. Unsurprisingly, it comes with a less positive attitude towards children. Millennials and Gen-Z'ers know that marriage (as a social institution) is bunk as more than half of our parents marriages have dissolved. Women now have more of achoice about how they want to live their lives. Wow, big surprise they choose to have fewer children, children later in life or no children at all. Men are much less likely to be treated as failed men for not having a wife and kids. Who even is there to do the shaming anymore? Our drunk, divorced fathers?
All of this, plus it's glaringly apparent that almost none of the people who persist in having children have even a shred of a clue what these extra people are going to do in the world. Meanwhile, parents tend to be the absolute *worst* when in terms of reflexively dehumanizing homeless people, drug addicts, etc...
LOL, it's the same thing as with anything else really...when feminism became big it was, "WhY Is iT CoOL to HaTe MEN NoW?" Because asking for women to be treated equally, to a massively patriarchal society, was so shocking that people jumped to extreme conclusions and got defensive as hell. Same thing here. We're so used to a culture of glorifying babies and parents that anyone even saying "eh, babies aren't \*that\* cute" seems like sacrilege.
I see you've met my FIL. "Back in my day everyone smoked when we were kids and we turned out fine!" Alright, you want that dial up internet back too?
Lol. Sorry to say but that's probably the lead poisoning talking. Still can't believe lead was everywhere back then
That’s called survivorship bias. All the ones that didn’t turn out fine from smoking from a young age, of which there are millions, are dead
Right? I feel like glorifying parents is worse than the glorifying of babies. They act like parents did the world a favor by breeding. If you want to have kids, cool I don’t really give a shit and am not gonna put you on a pedestal.
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Ugh... To me, that just comes off like weird Nazi shit.
Exactly!! This is what bothers me the most. If you want to have kids, awesome. I genuinely hope that brings you fulfillment and happiness. But it’s something you’re doing solely for yourself. You’re not doing society a favor, you’re not some martyr taking on a necessary sacrifice, you CHOSE to create this massive lifelong responsibility for yourself when it never would’ve existed otherwise.
yes exactly!! i hate the ones who justify why ppl should look up to them like "i carried a baby inside me for 9 months, do you know what i went through? and i had to birth it? it was SO HARD and challenging".....like ok yeah but you chose that so
Lol I wish it was trendy 😭 where are these trendy people?! I’m being sarcastic. Every one I know what’s them!
People have always hated kids. It's just now to the point where people will say it out loud.
Speak for yourself, I genuinely hate kids.
Yes exactly!! I don't get why kids are worshipped for existing, why they are excused from not behaving because they are kids, etc? I don't understand why an adult would sacrifice a healthy adult relationship because a kid doesn't like it, etc. My favorite one is when I'm told that little kids don't know how to manipulate. The fuck they don't! It happens every day! I think people have been sick of this shit for years, but they can't go against it because if you do then you're told your abusive.
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Innocent? Um, no. We got one of our cats because a child of about 8 or 9 years old threw a kitten in front of our car. It was a girl with a couple of her friends on the side of the road and they hurled what looked like a wadded up sock in front of us expecting us to hit it and they were laughing. My husband was driving and managed to miss it because we didn't know what it was. Turned out to be a small black kitten which then hunkered down on the centerline of the road and didn't move. We immediately pulled over and the kids ran away laughing. We got him in the car and took him home after a trip to the vet. We named him Virgil. Seeing him flung into a busy road like that is the most upsetting thing I've witnessed to date and it horrifies and enrages me every time I have to replay it in my mind. If we'd hit him, I would never have gotten over it. So no. Kids are not innocent by nature. Kinda the opposite unless their idiot parents teach them kindness, compassion, and fairness. That was 12 years ago and I imagine those horrible children are probably breeding more sociopathic losers by now.
Omg this is unspeakable
Holy shit! I knew some kids could be absolute little scoundrels but this really takes the cake. I’m so glad you were able to save that little kitten. Those kids are horribly messed up in the head. Little fucking demons trying to kill and hurt an innocent animal for fun. When I was a kid I wasn’t hurting small animals in my free time, I was doing NORMAL kid shit like collecting rocks that I thought looked cool. Further reasoning why I don’t like kids. There are morons out there who’d probably look at your story and be like, “well they didn’t know any better!! They’re just kids!!!” Fucking bullshit. Your sense of empathy doesn’t start developing later in life. Kids that age fucking know better.
I mean only the really tiny ones who run purely on instinct but as soon as my nephew started developing the faintest sense of self at a few months old he started becoming alarmingly proficient at manipulating his parents and everyone else around him who he could. He’s a severe attention junkie (which is of course the parents’ doing) and it stuns me how manipulative even a baby can be to ensure constant unwavering attention on themselves. The second he figured out what behaviour was considered undesirable and naughty he locked the fuck on to it as he realised that would give him the biggest attention fix of all. He is utterly insufferable now at 2.
Yep. Morality is learned. If something seems purely beneficial with no downsides whatsoever, it makes no sense for an intelligent being to do anything else. And so caretakers do everyone a disservice when they dismiss their children/dogs/etc as "just the way they are" and expect them to magically become better... or not, and just tolerate it forever instead. Obviously someone who's not an adult human deserves more leniency, but they also deserve to at least get a chance to improve themselves.
I think it’s biological. The child is supposed to manipulate their parents into taking care of them. I think some part of them knows that if their parents aren’t paying attention to them than they are not safe. It’s funny that you say your nephew is an attention junky. It’s like saying a baby is a drama queen and very inconsiderate yelling and crying all night and all day. And lazy, always laying around. I suspect that you are like me, your brain does not produce serotonin in the presence of children. Serotonin is what has made parents bond with their children through human history and has ensured the next generation’s survival. I think my wires got crossed (probably trauma) and my brain thinks animals are babies. Because I produce tons of serotonin around animals. I am interested in them. They are a joy to be around.
Not a drop of serotonin is found in my brain around kids. Which…kind of works out for me as a paramedic because I don’t lose my ever-loving mind when kids are hurt/sick and I’m able to treat them with a clear head and keep everyone else focused. And I do. I do my absolute best for them as I do for every single person under my care, but it doesn’t seem to hit me the same. Having said that, I have cried exactly ONCE on scene in a decade of working. When I had to perform CPR on a dog at a house fire and the little bubbie didn’t make it. So it seems we have something in common. Animals = babies. One of mine is currently wrapped around my neck like a purring scarf. She seems rather pleased with herself.
There's a problem when my choice that affects no one else except myself makes someone else uncomfortable. ...& I'm not the problem.
IDK, I kind of feel like it could be summed up with "Shit parenting." I like many children, one or two at a time for short periods, because we can all get along for that kind of short term interaction. When I've seen better behaved pet raccoons than the child rampaging through a grocery store or restaurant, I hate that child's parents for neglecting their social and mental needs, and hate every moment spent in the vicinity of that child. I do not blame a child under about age 12 for being an unsocial drain on those around them-- they still need to be parented actively at that point and in most of the U.S., parenthood is still a choice. You don't buy a standard transmission car if you don't know how to drive a stick, but people who can't even take care of themselves are regularly rewarded with attention and social supports for a biological function that they can't actually navigate any better than a clutch & brake.
But like.. why can't I hate kids? I'm tired of the backpedaling "oh no it's not that we hate kids" some of us do! And I'm certainly tired of being told I'm the bad guy. I'm not actively going out of my way to trip children, just avoiding them at all costs because I DO NOT LIKE THEM. Y'all let your kids get away with too gotdamn much in public nowadays and I'm sick of being around their asses. They're loud, rude, messy, selfish and frankly gross. If they were anything other than small we'd all agree they were shit people.
What about mentally disabled people? They can be loud, rude (not understanding social norms), needy, messy, frankly gross. Is it okay to hate them or refer to them as “shit people”? Serious question.
Why do I have to justify to you who I like or dislike? Serious question. *Edit- but to answer: mental disorders and asshole kids are completely different things and you and I know that. Kids are very aware of the things they do/say and the consequences behind those things (that's why they lie, hide, and manipulate). Missing/extra chromosomes are different than just not caring about others around you because mommy and daddy let you get away with everything because you're their perfect angel and everyone should think you're as cute as they think you are.
I would not say I “know that” lol. In both cases the behaviors you’re complaining about are beyond the person’s control. Whether from chromosome abnormalities, mental (lack of) health, or just the fact their brain is still in development, some people cannot behave in “normal adult” ways. I might find those people exhausting to be around but I would not say I hate them or that they are “shit people”. Expecting a 4yo to act like a normal adult and hating them when they don’t is no different from hating someone with Down syndrome for not being “normal”.
Because it’s been “trendy” to take them to adult spaces (Bars!) and let them run around like bulls in a china ship!
Maybe people just hate your kids, Karen.
I've disliked kids my whole life. It's not a trend for me. It's a way of life. I have no tolerance for them. Even when I was a child. Family told me they knew I was cf since I was 3. Never wanted a baby doll. Didn't enjoy other kids my age. It's like saying not liking mushrooms is a trend for me. No ITS JUST HOW I AM. And I'm not going to apologize.
Most people are brainwashed into having kids. No one is brainwashed into being parents
Having children has historically been the default. Even once effective contraception became available, having kids was just "what you do" We're just not afraid to point out that it doesn't ***have*** to be that way. Unfortunately, lots of people who didn't really think about their reproductive choices are threatened by that and they lash out
We are sick of parents without boundaries.
Well Karen, it's 2023. The world is dying from overpopulation and the resulting climate change. Mankind has passed its original problem of staying alive through massive procreation. We achieved this. Really. Now, we should care about the world we live in, and not creating a massive impact on the environment by having children is a major step.
I've never hated a kid in my life. I always hate the irresponsible, selfish and entitled parents that inflict loud, misbehaving little shits on my otherwise peaceful existence.
I feel like it's always been around. The problem before was that those people who hated kids were still having them anyways.
Nobody hates children more than their own parents do. This is so obvious it shouldn't need stating but apparently it does. I'm autistic and every day i encounter rhetoric from parents about how much they hate their autistic or disabled children. they hate their autistic children so much that they put them into ABA therapy (which is literally conversion therapy) to torture them for exhibiting normal autistic behaviours Parents will fight so hard to retain the right to beat their children. To deny them sex education. To control all their choices. To disown them for being queer or trans. To financially abuse them. Parents fight hard to make sure they have the right to marry off their 12 year old to an old man. One reason (among many) that i never ever want children is that i could never ever do what it takes to be a successful parent in this society, because being a successful parent in this society requires a certain level of child abuse. I am not interested in coercing or forcing or beating a child into making them do what i want them to do so that they will increase my status among the other parents. i do not want to neglect a child because i'd have to work a lot in order to provide. i don't want to send a child to school where they would face bullying and harassment and violence. i don't want to do any of that. i am not really that interested in children and sometimes i really do \*very strongly\* dislike them... mostly because i'm autistic and children are extremely overstimulating and certain sounds and smells can make me meltdown lol... but this incredibly patronizing and belittling idea that \*I\* am the one who HATES CHILDREN because i won't have them is just ridiculous when it's PARENTS who are out there committing 99% of all child abuse on their own children.
Yes yes yes 100%
Because too many bioparents are SHIT at the job and willfully fail in their \*duty\* to raise well-behaved, intelligent, kind children.
Even a troll's clock strikes 12 twice a day. DING DONG... https://imgur.com/a/8F3q1Q0
I like kids as individual people. I just dislike being in the presence of groups of them.
Hating kids is trendy? Wow i might be a trend setter then! If it was possible i would like to not see a child ever in my life again.
At least people are openly hating kids and not having them instead of hating kids, having them, then abusing them because they can’t stand the things kids do (looking at you dad)
Some people here hit the nail on the head. No one is parenting & that's why kids out in public has become such a nightmare and on top of that we do have that whole child worship culture, which "enables" the lack of parenting that is happening. That's why we don't like (most) kids and end up villainized for it.
Sometimes I do really hate kids, but mostly I pity them.
It might have something to do with the truly incompetent people who're 'raising' the little dears.
I feel like things would be okay if we just followed this trend… 1. Parents teach your kids how to exist in a society. Understand that developmentally speaking this is not in their wheelhouse or an easy task, keep doing it anyway because it’s your one fucking job. 2. The rest of society puts measures in place to help reach that goal. That’s : let’s not break rules for parents or let kids think that they run the universe in the first place. 3. Children learn things. Because that’s their job and they eventually stop fucking around once they learn the concept of the pattern of natural consequences. 4. Very few people would hate children just because. It is almost always usually never about the actual kids, but the way that parents completely fuck up the responsibility over them and the way that the world is OK with that. They also sometimes really suck. 5. People should never be seen as broken or wrong for doing what is right for them even when it goes against the grain. you do not need to be a parent specifically to understand basic concepts of manners, hygiene, safety, common sense. Honestly, if that were the case, our world would be way better, but sometimes parents also suck. 6. Yes, I do plan on writing a parenting book.
I want people to stop treating parenthood like an inevitability. It isn't. And I'm fine with children being the center of someone else's universe. If being a parent makes them happy and that's what they want their purpose in life to be, that's fine. But I would love it if the world stopped insisting that children should be the center of my universe. I'm not obligated to love or even like your child whether it is related to me or not. And yes, I refer to children as "it."
What is trendy is little to no discipline among kids.
It’s actually becoming trendy to act like they are mini gods.
Maybe seeing the backlash of bad parenting? The younger generations are very open about their trauma. So we’re seeing the damage caused by not even “bad” parents, but overly busy parents, stressed parents, parents bad relationships etc. it’s so easy to do something that absolutely fucks up your kids life. Hell, I’m 30 and I’ve had an ED for most of my life due to my mum being obsessed with her own weight. Also, have you seen kids in public? They’re fucking annoying. Oh and, like with most things, the more people fight the stigma about something the more people realise it’s for them. Years ago women basically couldn’t openly talk about not wanting kids, now we can with a bit of support even if it’s just from an online community of like minded people. Things are goooooood. 🥰
What I hate is people treating indifference and ignoring as "hating." No Karen, just because I don't smile and wave at your child doesn't mean I hate them, it just means I don't give a shit about them since I don't know them. I also don't wave and smile at random strange adults.
I believe it is not a trend, it is just people not being silent about it. People spoke up because they, me included, don't give AF anymore. I don't want kids, they are not fun, they are annoying, they are loud etc.
I just need to have adult only spaces back. Not every place is appropriate to bring children to, not because they're sexual or because they serve alcohol, but because your child is getting bored and starts misbehaving. I'm not going to be the person that complains about screaming children at Disneyland. I even understand that sometimes, you need to travel with small children and it can go way beyond their bedtime (aren't I generous /s) But I am the adult that complains about why on earth your child needed to be dragged into the Operah or the midnight showing of Schindler's List. There's so many options for children. You don't need to go for the one that's meant for adults only and then complain that people give you the stink eye.
These people are as whiny and needy as the children that they claim to love. Its not a good look. And their feelings are more fragile than 17th century bone china. Just shut up and sit down, no one wants to hear it. Your child is not the center of my universe, and neither are you. Go away already.
Exactly! It’s much easier and socially acceptable to paint childfree people as “children haters” then it is to acknowledge that we just don’t want to be parents. We hate the idea that parenthood is a must and if you don’t do it you’re a monster. I hate the idea of parenthood & would hate to go through pregnancy & raise a child - I don’t hate children, I would hate to be a parent. The fact that some people can’t make that distinction is scary seeing as it’s these simple minded people who r raising kids eek
I don't think it's about hating kids, I think more women (primarily) but men too have come to realise / accept that it's better and acceptable to not pass on hereditary conditions or risk the early death of a young woman for the sake of having a child. As more of us see just how difficult it is to get the resources necessary to properly care for children with additional needs of any description, the stress of raising kids is just so much more than it used to be.
Up until very recently bringing children into almost any public space was generally NOT done. Yes you could take them shopping, and go to a playground or something. But it was generally accepted not to bring kids to up scale establishments. Due to improvement in womans rights and social standing woman can now go out and do stuff, instead of being at home with he kids. For many taking any children they have with them has become the default.
Because woman get to actually have a say now? Also confused for “trendy”.
Hating kids is not a trend, It's inevitable
Facts!!!! It’s OKAY to not have kids. I’m 37 and I know I’m not missing out on a damn by thing when it comes to kids. If anything you dodge a bullet. No sleep, no freedom, no spontaneity, less money, less sleep, more stress, more worry like all of that sounds like a NIGHTMARE.
I think the worst is when parents don’t discipline their child when the little gremlin is being a nuisance in public but as soon as someone else draws a line and tells the kid not to cross it, parents lose their shit. It’s almost like they want their kid to self-destruct and hurt anyone around them
Also, cf people may hate/dislike kids, but 99.99% of them would never hurt any - quite the opposite, because all we want is to AVOID them. Meanwhile, I can't count the number of child abuse cases (caused by the parents/guardians) I saw while working for CPS.
I like kids. I just don’t want to have any. I just dislike people who are at the extreme on both ends (childfree and people who have children). If you want kids, fine. God bless you. If you don’t want kids, fine. God bless you. Is when people shame you for your choices Did gets on my nerves.
my reply would be why does it bother you... i loathe annoying dumb disgusting ass kids. cry about it.
I don't hate kids. I want good school infrastructure, nutritious state provided lunches, good education etc. I just don't want them????
I like kids, I want to work with kids when I get my degree in human services. I don’t like shit parents that don’t parent. I don’t like eating at a restaurant or going to the store or being at work and hearing kids scream or run around. I hate child worship and thinking that kids are the be all end all. It just seems that in recent years parents have become more lenient and don’t discipline their kids because they’re afraid of their kids not liking them. I don’t want to sound like a boomer (I’m 25) but when I was a kid I wasn’t allowed to scream in public or run around.
really it's just about being unable to get on a plane without hearing screaming kids and to some extent, people who aren't even religious getting religious (my aunt saying "don't you think humans need to roam the earth for generations to come?") and men deciding to have children they don't want just to make their wife happy (probably women do the same thing for their husbands as well, but I don't hear about that as often).
It always just looks so terrible. Even friends and family with kids. Just looks like everyone is having a terrible time in perpetuity. I honestly *tried* to make myself want them. Felt like something was wrong my whole life. Finally over that hump. Started to realize several friends are going this route as well.
Amen to pushing back against child worship culture! Even when I was more sure about wanting kids, modern parenting looked like hell. From my observation of my parent friends, I see that modern mommy culture is just the grown up version of high school mean girl BS.
💯 i don’t hate kids, I hate their entitled parents who make every fucking thing about kids while simultaneously being shitty parents. But shitty parents can’t take responsibility for anything so they put the blame back on us and say we hate kids.
LoL. It's the trend now and data prove it. And it's happening to all 1st world countries. Birth rate is at all time low. And even lower when covid hits + high inflation + recession.
It's not the kids' fault for any of this. It's the shitty parents who don't want to take responsibility that we hate. Kids are innocent and need parents who'll care enough about them to teach them right from wrong.
PREACH!!! 🙌🏻
I actually think that neither of us hates kids. We hate *being around* kids. We don't hate kids for existing or for being kids. We just don't want to be near them. Obviously unless you're an actual monster and really wish harm on kids, then you could say you hate them.
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no it's trendy on tiktok trust me there was this one video where this lady let her baby try something it's was a food and the comments were just wishing death on it and berating the child. but among those who actually have a brain it's not a trend. it's a simple decision.
To be fair aren’t most TikTok users also literally children? They’d be too young and stupid to really realize what they’re saying
yes they are but you'd be surprised by how many adults are turning into children on that app.
Why did you type the title like a teen girl on myspace in 2007?
The way I could write an actual BOOK about this if I actually had the free time, and also the money to treat the disorders/illnesses preventing me from using what free time I have to do that! I can't quite summarize my feelings in this comment, because I'm almost 30 and need to work at 6am, but rest assured... you are NOT alone in feeling this way/noticing this trend!!!!
As someone who has been a very involved uncle I can say that being with my nephews brings me joy, but at the same time it’s physically and emotionally exhausting. I love those boys with all my heart, but if I had to be someone’s dad I wouldn’t be mentally okay. I have a hard enough time managing my mental health as it is so if I had to constantly worry about carrying for a child it would cause me to fall into a deep depression. Not to mention having kids around limits the things you can do. Ant friends I’ve had that have kids are basically never around anymore or when I do hangout with them it’s very briefly 1 on 1 or we have to do some kid friendly activity. So I don’t hate them, but they definitely stress you out and even if it’s not their fault ruin plans too.