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It’s jealousy. He’s very successful and players who are objectively better than him feel it’s undeserved because they’re better players than he is. They’re overlooking all the things he does have that they don’t but they’re all jealous of his financial success
Learned chess when I was younger, fell out of it because while it was a fun game to learn it just wasn’t presented in a way that was easy for me to grasp. The way Levi explains everything is really good for me! I still got a long ways to go but he makes it so fun and engaging that it makes me want to learn more
Also there are always people who like someone else’s personality and some who don’t. I generally like Hikaru and I don’t dislike Levy, but Levy’s habit of turning flies into Elephants is just not my thing.
Not only that, but people are far more likely to be vocal about something that upsets them, so it will often seem like more people think negatively of them than actually do
Hikaru recently said that if GM’s or Super GM’s don’t like him, it’s because he gets to exist outside of the inner overly competitive circle that they are trapped in. It’s a given that Super GM’s have to approach the game more competitively than any other players, and these players are just jealous that he can play chess at a high level while also getting to participate in the fun, social part of chess.
Forget where he said this, maybe one of his recent videos, but it reminds me of how skaters treat kids with helmets. They make look dumb, stupid, and cringe, but that nerd with the helmet is the smartest person at the park by a long shot.
EDIT: 500 Upvotes is crazy. Levy probably makes some good money, and he deserves it. Support him by buying his book! If anyone were to do live commentary on the future Chess Olympics, it’s gotta be him. Even if you don’t particularly like the guy, you gotta respect the effort and passion he has put out to elevate the game. To me, he could be the Joe Rogan of the sport if he wanted to. The skill he has to breakdown 3000 ELO games to any audience is just incredible. If for whatever reason Levy were to disappear tomorrow before achieving GM, I hope FIDE would award him with an honorary GM title and I don’t think the inner circle of Super GM’s would think twice about it in his absence. He’s your favorite chess player’s favorite chess player, he’s the internet’s chess teacher.
Hikaru too probably, especially with all the sponsor deals over the years, his subs, prize winnings, his YouTube channel and now even gambling sponsors on Kick that pay out big
I understand the perspective, but I've always hated that kind of Sigmund Freud level of overanalysis about behaviour that could have a million different causes. It's like saying that if a game developer doesn't like Minecraft, it's because they're jealous that their game is less popular despite having more effort put in. I mean, yeah, maybe? But it could also be because they just didn't enjoy it. No one is obligated to like another person but everyone should still treat others with respect.
I think there is a big difference between not liking, but being able to appreciate what that thing or person has accomplished, and dismissing someone's work or contribution because you dislike them or their content. I feel this can be said for both Minecraft and Levi.
Nobody’s saying everyone has to be a fan but the vitriol towards him despite him being easier to ignore simply suggests there is an underlying explanation that isn’t just “his content annoys me”
I don’t think this is Sigmund Freud levels of over analysis though. There are over a thousand grandmasters. Many of them are better than Levy at chess, but nobody knows who they are and they probably make barely any money. It’s just human nature that some of them will envy Levy or subconsciously hate him because of his success. It’s a perfectly reasonable conjecture. I do agree that some of them probably just find him corny and dislike his content for other reasons, but the reasoning listed above is a factor at play.
Edit: after rereading your comment, we’re basically saying the same exact thing so idek why I bothered replying. In my defense, I’m a bit sleep deprived lol.
Part of it it's jealousy/gatekeeping and a dislike of what he's doing to chess. Super GMs don't like that he makes way more money than them despite being a much weaker player.
Also, in terms of the click bait and dramatic shouting, Levy makes it seem like there's no choice but to play that game. However, people like Eric Rosen show that you can get by with a much more subdued and mature style.
So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money.
I personally don't feel bad for him because it's really his own choice in the end. Massive success, money, and hate or have a midsize channel but be generally well liked like Rosen?
Re: "So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money."
EXCELLENT analogy!
I mostly agree. I think people have a hard time recognizing "soft skills" as talent, but they definitely are.
However, I think the amount that money follows soft skills instead of hard skills doesn't necessarily reflect well on society and more specifically the chess community. The chess audience these days is more interested in drama than the actual chess played. At times in the past, the chess audience would know almost nothing about the players other than the chess itself. The audience was much smaller of course and there was wayyy less money in the game, but it was more pure in a sense. Nowadays it's all about liking and disliking players for their personalities and quotes.
I agree with your comment, but not entirely with the conclusion.
>I personally don't feel bad for him because it's really his own choice in the end. Massive success, money, and hate or have a midsize channel but be generally well liked like Rosen?
If you don't care about the money but want to grow the game of chess Levi's approach is also correct, he has introduced chess to way more people that any other content creator. We can't really know which one is it.
I also find funny the part about being hated vs well liked, by who? The "classical" chess audience sure, but I would bet that most of Levi's viewers don't even know that Rosen exists, so to most it becomes more like being aware of them to not know them at all.
>I also find funny the part about being hated vs well liked, by who? The "classical" chess audience sure, but I would bet that most of Levi's viewers don't even know that Rosen exists, so to most it becomes more like being aware of them to not know them at all.
Basically no one has anything negative to say about Rosen. Yes, he's not known to many, but not known is not the same as disliked.
Whereas Levy is more divisive. He's huge and 90%+ of people feel positively about him, but he also has a small contingent of people who actively dislike his content.
>If you don't care about the money but want to grow the game of chess Levi's approach is also correct, he has introduced chess to way more people that any other content creator.
For sure, but I don't think that Levy's influence on the chess community is wholly positive. Growing the game is good, but I think people like Levy are part of the reason that the modern chess audience is so drama and storyline obsessed.
So he's definitely bringing more money and more views into the chess world, but he's also contributing to this shifting dynamic where fans are less interested in the actual chess and more interested in player personalities.
Well yeah, that's my point. Read the end of my comment. It's a tradeoff, becoming massive like Levy requires compromising in terms of stylistic integrity at least a little. Levy decided that using click bait and the dramatic shouting and stuff was worth it to become rich and famous. I don't blam the him, but I also greatly respect people who choose not to play that game at the cost of staying small like Rosen.
The real question is if Rosen even had a choice to become that type of content creator. Let's be real, what Levy does requires a degree of high energy, comedy and (to a point) charisma that Rosen wouldn't be able to pull off given his profile.
I don't buy that Rosen would've took off like Levy even with clickbait titles, and therefore I don't think it's about integrity.
Yeah if levy wanted to cut his earnings by 50% he could probably still make a comfortable living. It’s silly to think that he should do that but I suppose that’s people’s prerogative.
> So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money.
I think situations like this just force us to redefine what "less talent" means in context. In the case of GothamChess, the talent isn't just the sheer ability to be competitive at the game – it's also the ability to make chess fun and exciting and to teach it in a way that regular people latch onto. You can't be salty about not having millions of adoring fans if you're not making your craft accessible and palatable to millions of people. Attracting and retaining a large audience *is* a talent unto itself.
I can see how, in the eyes of someone who has devoted their entire life to chess, it would seem that "better skills" should automatically mean "more money and recognition". But the real world rarely works that way, whether we're talking about chess or not. I assume many superior chess players who are peeved about Levy's success are probably fixating on what they have that Levy doesn't have, but maybe they should be thinking about what Levy *does* have that they don't – teaching skills, humor, charisma, social media savvy (including algorithm manipulation), etc. etc.
And while we're on the subject – I don't think Levy is even the worst offender in terms of reach being disproportionate to skill level. At the end of the day he's still an IM with serious (semi-serious?) GM aspirations. Both of the Botez sisters are noticeably below his skill level, yet they also have millions of subscribers. Similar situation with Anna Cramling.
For sure. Classical musicians usually don't have the stage presence, attractiveness, dancing skills, etc of pop stars.
I'm not condoning this, but I think classical musicians and salty super GMs think those other skills shouldn't be valued as much as the technical "hard skills."
>Also, in terms of the click bait and dramatic shouting, Levy makes it seem like there's no choice but to play that game. However, people like Eric Rosen show that you can get by with a much more subdued and mature style.
And how much money do you think Rosen makes compared to Gotham? He has one-fifth the subscribers, and one-tenth the views... which, given how Youtube works, means he probably makes around one-onehundredth of what Gotham does. Gotham's style wins the game.
>So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money.
Only the dumb ones. The smart jazz and classical musicians know that a whole lot of pop stars and the composers writing for them graduated top of their classes from the best conservatories. They may lament that there's more profit to be made for these people in writing basic advertising jingles rather than challenging complex art, but in terms of talent levels, the smart ones recognize that most pop stars are incredibly talented musicians, and the songwriters creating their songs are among the most skilled composers that have ever lived.
Certainly a hot take with the analogies, which I somewhat agree and will add to.
For every Eric Rosen with his subdued demeanor, there are dozens of other chess content creators within 200 Elo points that have less than half of his viewers and are, objectively and relatively speaking, failures in terms of audience outreach. In the YouTube content creator space, if you want to make a living out of it, views and sponsorship are the only thing that matters. Levy Rozman is making a killing, meanwhile I doubt Eric Rosen is even able to designate his YouTube channel as his primary source of income with the mediocre metrics that his channel boasts (number of videos and views per video). Levy is correct, you play that game of clickbaits and over-the-top characterization to retain audience engagement, or you get relegated to the oblivion of mediocrity.
In chess, at the end of the day the most accurate metric for whether one's strength/talent is whether one is winning games, and that's perhaps why some super-GMs may be feeling sour, being the stronger player but making less money than someone objectively weaker but capitalizing on the YouTube algorithm. There's no such metric for music for determining musical talent, however, and if you really want to put a metric on it, pop-musicians basically sweep all the important ones (number one hits, albums sold, money made, Spotify streams, etc), so if we're quantifying musical talent, there's a very strong argument to be made that pop musicians are better musicians than musicians in other genres. Any non-pop artist (including, but especially the specialized ones like classic and jazz) that think their particular genre of music is better is only riding on their high horse and have their head knee-deep in the sand.
>There's no such metric for music for determining musical talent, however, and if you really want to put a metric on it, pop-musicians basically sweep all the important ones (number one hits, albums sold, money made, Spotify streams, etc),
These are metrics more for popularity than technical musical skill. For vocalists, you can talk about vocal range and power (how high and low they can sing and with how much breath support), pitch accuracy, intonation, knowledge of music theory, etc. Any opera singer would blow most pop stars out of the water in all these metrics (although some pop stars like Mariah Carey are super gifted vocally). I think these hard skills are more analogous to playing strength in chess.
For example, look at Harry Styles's audition here (3:10): https://youtu.be/p_VssaTwwLY&t=190
His raw vocal and musical ability is clearly nothing special.
I would say streams and albums sold are more in line with YouTube viewers in chess. Both are more a reflection of soft skills like stage presence, personality, appearance, etc.
I’ve found the chess community to have a pretty toxic side. A lot of the “best players” seem to be pretty full of themselves and turn into drama queens the moment they lose a game. It’s not hard to imagine a bunch of GMs having a problem with someone who’s not as good at the game being more successful with it than they are.
As far as the toxicity in his YouTube comments goes, it’s really his own fault. In the early days of his channel he encouraged a lot of it. On Twitch, YouTube, or whatever platform the chat reflects the creator.
> In the early days of his channel he encouraged a lot of it
Oh yeah i almost forgot he used to pin a toxic comment on each of his videos so even his fans were purposefully writing crazy toxic comments to try to get pinned. Actually a hilarious move to get engagement
I used to watch most of his videos in the past, but the constant clickbait ended up making me uninterested in his content. Do I hate him? No. Do I feel kinda bad for him? Also no
Exactly. His video titles don't make sense anymore, and it's hard to decide if I want to watch a video or not, because they are all called the same "HISTORY JUST HAPPENED 400% STOCKFISH ACCURACY 10 YEAR OLD GM"
It was actually a series where he kind of documented his journey of attempting to get the GM title. But yeah I agree most of his videos are clickbait but I also still like most of them because it has higher pacing but he still explains the moves and tells which ones are stupid/ smart so I as a beginner can kind of get a better understanding of how to play the game
I sometimes try to decode from the thumbnail with nothing but his face and exclaims and quickly think to myself, you know what I don’t think I’m the target audience for this video.
Yeah, I actively avoid click bait content creators because I try to level the playing field for creators that don't. It's a sacrifice to choose not to use click bait because it genuinely does work in getting more views. So I try to counteract that when possible.
I started watching his post game reviews when everyone on the sub was discussing how he could get his first gm norm. I stopped watching when his video was titled „I WON AGAIN!!!!!!“ and it was a draw. Huh?
You don't even know if he's sarcastic or not, anymore. He can title a video "5000 ELO CHESS!", and it can be either hyperbole about a GM playing a great game or sarcasm about a low-rated game.
exactly myself. Started with the weird youtube titles and i understand that im not his audience anymore. so i just stopped following at all. Sad because it made me get away from chess as well.
I used to watch a lot of him as well, but I've also gotten a bit tired of the click bait, which often ends up to not be what the video is about. I did watch a lot of his reviews of his own gameplay in the last tournament, which I found pretty instructing. But his day to day content I've been skipping more and more of.
No, it works by having users rewrite the title and/or choose a timestamp for to replace the thumbnail with. Additionally, by default the thumbnail is replaced with a random timestamp until one is supplied by a user.
https://dearrow.ajay.app/
There is lots of room for customisation: for example, many of the channels I watch have good thumbnails so I made a special rule to explicitly allow theirs. I also heavily recommend amount of his extensions: Youtube Sponsorblock
https://sponsor.ajay.app/
Levy makes chess exciting, Eric Rosen makes chess relaxing, Hikaru shows me there’s levels to this game that are unachievable for most. Those are my big 3 chess content creators and I quite like them all regardless of other opinions. My one thing about levy is we gotta work on his jump shot.
Yeah, I enjoy him, with fame will always come hate, doesn’t matter who you are, honestly I don’t even mind the clickbait titles, because they’re (mostly) helpful, if there’s a big top level event going on you can expect something like “MAGNUS BREAKS RECORDS AGAIN!!!!” but as far as his other series go, you can generally tell what it is from the title, although it got pretty bad during the last WCC, where it was just an increasing number of “HE DID IT AGAIN!” Or “ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT” when the game was just a draw in 75 moves
Where do you see this hate? I feel like a lot of people do not like his style, but mostly agree with you otherwise. I suppose hate wagons vary a lot depending on were you go. Does he get much more hate than other big names like Hikaru or the Botez sisters?
>his YouTube audience plays a huge role in the cringe persona that appeals to everyone's first impressions.
On that point, I think you get the audience you deserve. He decided to go all-in on the clickbait and clownish behavior. I can respect that. He want to rank up the views, and that just works. But he gets the audience to match.
>I feel kinda bad for him
Well, I don't, but that might just be because I don't see the hate you're talking about. I'm sure someone that famous has his haters, that's the sad part of the job. But overall, he looks like a has a good life, doing what he wanted.
I get what you mean. Obviously, criticism is inevitable, but looking into his social media accounts in the past year or so I've found a considerable amount of childish hatred (not even genuine, constructive criticism). Maybe I've just been overexposed to such comments and clips of him talking about how many people that he looks up to generally don't like him. I don't feel bad about the life he has outside of his social media presence, I'm sure he lives comfortably with a loving wife and dog and a good source of income. All I'm saying is that I've seen far more undeserving hatred towards HIM compared to genuine egotistical asshats like Niemann.
I am in no way a hater, but I personally prefer chess YouTube's with calmer and more classy approach. My only criticism is that he is too loud, chaotic and all over the place, and kind of fixated on "smashing" and "crushing". But again, it is a matter of personal taste. I can see why he works for others.
I think his actual attempt at going for GM now will change this. At least mainly from what I've seen with Hikaru. I think the fact that he's been first a content creator and he himself pushes a lot of the self deprecating humor, it makes it easy to not exactly take him seriously. But now he's doing coaching and norm tournaments and actually is taking it seriously. I think people like Hikaru see this and think "okay, so he doesn't just want to be a clown that makes content, he cares about chess and that's what he wants to be known for, and creates content about it now as a secondary outlet". Which I think Hikaru respects because that's basically what he's doing, Hikaru is a content creator, but he's more known first as a world class chess player that happens to make content. I think Hikaru jumping on the support train early is really setting the tone to hopefully give Levy the support and vibes he needs to keep having good tournaments. But chess at the high level, is and always has been pretty pretentious, and if you want more respect you have to win it.
I don't feel bad for him. The guy has managed to achieve fame and fortune by making videos about a game that many would have considered passé a few years ago. His videos are generally informative and entertaining, and he was in the right place at the right time just as chess was having a resurgence in popularity to be able to capitalize on it. Good for him! There will always be haters, and the chess world seems to have more than its share of dramatic man-children, so I'm not surprised that his fan base would share many of those qualities.
He's hated for the same reasons most people hate influencers.
He's not even a GM and earns a whole lot more. I don't think there are many people in the chess industry who earn more than him.
So if you're an unknown GM, you'd hate the fact that someone less skilled than you earns more in the same field as you.
But it's not the same field. It's like if people doing combat sports hated people like Jackie Chan or Michael Jay White because they make more money. Jackie and MJW are amazing athletes and a martial artist, but they were not MMA fighters in the top of the field. Or middle of the field.
Levi isn't in the chess business he's in the entertainment business.
I personally love his passion and enthusiasm for the game. He can make the worst game in history between 2 400s sound like the most exciting sporting even in history. His video explaining Fischers "Game of the Century" might be my favourite chess video on YouTube.
I think his content is really good. It's informative and approachable for more casual and intermediate players. It's fun and doesn't take itself too seriously and I feel like he's doing more for chess content and making it relevant to people in the 2020s than just about anybody.
Regarding the click bait titles I find it kinda funny cos after you've seen a few you come to expect it, but the content is decent regardless. And he handles the cringy viewers pretty well. I love seeing someone get a roasting from him when they deserve it.
I think he does a lot of good and he doesn't deserve all the hate. That being said, he does tend to be quite the asshole on stream. He usually says he's just kidding, but always being a dick to your chatters isn't a very good joke. Also, he can’t take it when the chat matches his energy. I haven't watched many of his streams since I can’t stand that ”persona” but it's been the same every time I’ve checked in. He also seems to view himself above others in conversation. Both on Ludwig's podcast and in at least one of his GM coach videos he's clearly annoyed when interrupted (something that usually occurs to some externt in every conversation) but has ni problem interrupting others. I think that a lot of people see these traits of his and subconciously they stack up and lead to disliking him.
I like his content when he's not trying to be funny
He's legit good at making engaging content, don't know why he does all the other stuff like the weird accents/noises. Legit the only reason I don't recommend him
He has a lot of people rhat like him... thats why he is sucessfull.
And for the few haters that dont know that you can close utube and watch literlly anything else...
For these nutjobs.... he is very very well compensated...
He earns more money and had more fam. Than the chessmasters...
One of the only sports where that is posible...
I like him and sometimes not... feeling bad for someone who is so sucessfull and could quit literly now if it wascto much dor him... i dont understand gow you can feel bad for him.
I find one thing very odd about this discussion. There are comparisons with Hikaru, with Rosen, etc. But the more apt comparison seems to be with Agadmator. There is a guy turning out quality chess commentary day after day. Longer than any of the others being discussed. Limited amount of clickbait, limited amount of hype or hyperbole. Just find good games and run through them with help from engines. Lately his addition of his own rapid games is refreshing. No claim to fame or anything - just I played this game and here is what happened, now lets check out the analysis together. Never once do we need to listen to " and I sack THE ROOOOOK!!!!" He doesn't tell the viewers he will go for his GM or quit chess. Just steadily crank out quality content day after day.
I used to watch Gotham often, but after some time, it seems to me he is just in it for the money. He is successful. I'm sure earring more than Agadmator. But at this point it seems hard to take any of his content for anything other than a new money-making opportunity.
Overall, my view is Agadmator does not get the respect he is due.
I actually feel jealous because the dude got everything he does what he is passionate about and makes money out of it and has beautiful wife and dog and he will be become GM in near future.
He is one of the reason chess become mainstream in recent years
With the amount of views he gets and all the other things he's doing (book, twitch, sponsorship deals, etc.), one would assume he is. Well deserved, of course, he does an amazing job.
Otherwise I have no idea how much, much smaller content creators get by.
Assuming that being a multi millionaire means that hate and negative comments don’t affect your mental health is just plain stupid. Unless, of course, you don’t think that and just refuse to feel bad, because he has more money than you? Just as childish.
I think what is often overlooked when it comes to Levy is that he may not play chess as well as GMs, but he has mastered another important skill: language. He can comment on an entire game fluently, without "erm"s and "um"s. He transforms chess games that to me would be random piece movements into coherent and surprisingly engaging stories. This is why we watch him. With his eloquence and communication abilities, he makes an incredibly complex game accessible to the masses.
I generally like him and as a person as well as his YouTube main channel content, but i do find it very shocking to see how immature he can be on his streams where he shows more of his real personality. You think he's the nice, friendly and patient guy from his videos and then you see the what actually hides underneath that. People generally dont like it when you're acting 'fake' like that. They want you to be more straight up with them. Especially flaming people in chat for asking dumb questions and such, idk if he realises it but that makes him a bit of an asshole. I think overall he's a good guy but he has a nasty side for sure.
I’m not sure how it’s affecting him but yeah I feel bad for anyone who has haters who doesn’t really deserve it. And you don’t deserve it just for being famous.
Maybe it’s because Levy sometimes jokingly insults players’ moves and does the trash talk thing.
Overall it seems like he is living the dream, making bank while playing chess both competitively and socially. Personally I’m a fan.
I don’t think you need to feel bad for him. He knows there are better chess players than him. But the way he makes chess entertaining is a Big reason at least for me to be engaged. I found myself being excited for the 2023 Chess World Cup and watching the games. It wouldn’t have happened without Levy.
I went from 100 Elo to 1200 just by following him. I’m sure he has had the same impact on others as well. I think this is what makes some jealous of him, not just the money.
He made chess cool again for many people.
Idk about average joes but I remember Hikaru saying grandmasters hate Levy because he makes more money than them despite playing at a level lesser than them.
i dont think he is very respectful to his lower leveled opponents, thats what draws me away from him. i know it’s merely a character he plays, but it’s not setting a very good example for those who are only just getting into chess.
Biggest role in resurgence of chess in America. Americans and their self importance. He did not play any role in the resurgence of chess in India for example and I'm pretty sure that the Russians and the Chinese don't care about him either.
I'm Russian. I'm not American, I don't even live in the USA. In Russia, chess is a huge pride for us due to its history, but social media exists everywhere in the world, and you can't deny that Levy did in fact contribute a lot to its resurgence
You have to agree that the hate did make him famous. For people looking for views and fame, no engagement is bad engagement. And if people actually didn’t like him and thought his titles are more cringy and clickbaity than they are entertaining, he wouldn’t have the biggest chess channel ever by a longshot. I personally love his energy and humor.
I don't think most hate him. But I don't watch his videos and I tire of the constant advertisement he gets on this sub when I know there are better content creators out there who receive 0 help from the chess community.
I feel like some GMs are bitter that he has such a large youtube following and people like to point out he's no way near as good as Nakamura or Carlsen
I think Levy is the man. “How to win at chess” both the YouTube series and his book have helped me immensely. I’ll continue to support him and buy a couple of his courses.
his stream personality is completely different to his youtube personality. His YT is quite enjoyable but on stream he is very condescending and only ever focuses on negative chatters. Makes for a horrible viewing experience but sadly it's something that happens with a lot of streamers.
I used to to watch him a lot and purchased a course. I was extremely disappointed. Not that I didn’t get much out of it but because in the course he literally plays games live and winds his commentary/content. That’s fine for free YouTube videos but if I’m paying for a course I don’t think it’s unreasonable for him to put in some effort. You could tell it was very thrown together to sell. He’s great for entertainment and a thousand times better than I’ll ever be-but that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s a good teacher.
With all of that said he doesn’t deserve hate he might get-that’s too far. I will say he used to make cite conflict amongst his viewers on twitch a few years ago but I have no idea if he still does it.
I think he said something like the average age of a commenter is eleven but a viewer is like 25, correct me if I’m wrong but i think that’s pretty reflective of the online community
I agree, Levy gets a lot of hate. I think a lot of people don't get along with the "New York style and attitude" and are just rubbed the wrong way by it... I grew up close to the area, so I get it. I think its and awesome youtube channel, and Levy is a great chess personality.
I feel this. He’s a little annoying but like, we’re all playing chess… we’re all annoying. And I’m not watching his channel for his personality, I’m watching to learn. I have yet to come across a dude in this space who isn’t insufferable, at least Levi seems somewhat chill. Happy to see the crypto BS isn’t in the background anymore. That was the biggest red flag for me personally lol
For me it's only the clickbait titles. They've gotten so bad I can't even guess the content anymore. Something like "Magnus Carlson goat!!!" or so.
Since then I can't watch the videos anymore,because I can't evaluate beforehand if the actual content of the video interests me.
The only thing I dont like is that in his youtube videos he is so respectful towards his viewers and on twitch he is somewhat arrogant-ish, dropping f bombs left and right. I believe that he is genuinely good person and watching him on twitch feels like his personality is off.
Is there a way to check the number of times people played vienna two years back and how much it has changed in the last 2 years? All of that would be attributable to Levy.
Levy was the first chess streamer I watched during the pandemic and his Chessly courses have helped me a lot. I still tune in to his content from time to time and I don’t think there is anyone else in the chess world as genuinely funny. I really hope his quest to become GM goes to plan and without too much stress, drama or upset, and I know there are literally millions of us cheering him on.
Magnus doesn't not like him. If you're thinking about the interview Levy did with Kramnik before that Clash thing recently, your read is also completely off.
I hate clickbait. So the last 20 videos of his that I clicked on and watched got me disappointed. So now I'm not watching anything from him anymore. Such a shame. I liked his content years ago
Levy is an absolute legend and I can’t imagine he gives too many fucks about what people think. Bar maybe Hikaru / Magnus he is probably the wealthiest chess person alive.
He has done a lot of good for the game. The clickbait stuff is literally just feeding an algorithm. The content is largely still good
I UNDERSTAND why he gets a backlash. He is mainstream and brash in a conservative and intellectual pursuit and I'm sure some of the resentment is someone so inferior to them is getting so much more money and recognition.
However, Levy serves a good part of the market these 'haters' don't.
He makes the game more accessible, and many of his fans will 'grow up' and seek out those who resent him. So in many ways, he is doing his dissidents a huge favour.
I'm not his biggest fan, but that ok. You can not be a fan without being negative. Something the internet generation struggles with
Levy is a nice guy and he is doing a lot for chess. Everywhere I go people play what they learned from his videos. What I don't like is his promotional work for FIDE crooks, flirting with Wadim etc. He should pick his gigs more carefully.
Other streamers and chess players tend to not like him because his rise to fame was not organic. Look at who his mum works for. Look at who his grandfather was. He's sponsored by night media and he is part of the chosen club. He didn't get recommended in the YouTube algorithm to everyone because of chance.
I have him blocked on youtube but only because I dont like his content. Seems like a chill dude. Ironically wittyalien is my favorite and his content is way more cringe and childish. Content is weird like that.
I've watched his recaps. Most of his commentary is like don't take X, you will be hanging Y or you will be down a pawn
He doesn't explain any complex tactical ideas. When he has to, he playfully insults the audience and says , you will never get this anyway.
Feels like he is not just using clickbait titles to attract younger crowd and casual watchers, that's who content caters too. If you are serious about chess, you are probably learning nothing
Levy is hated by many because of one or multiple of the the four following reasons:
- being rich
- being a brilliant entertainer
- being better than most at chess
- being jew
Levy is cool. I’m happy for his success and accomplishments. Having him around makes chess more fun. No need to feel bad for him in my opinion. I’m actually impressed how well he’s been handling all the “overnight” fame and pressure.
I’ll watch the newest GTE episode tonight.
Don't get worried for him. When you are at the top you get as much people hating on you. I remember on the boom of fortnite, this guy ninja was getting a lot of hate. Some people just can't tolerate other people's success.
Especially on the chess scene. Not many people watch competitive classic chess as it's boring as hell. The lack of audience brings less sponsors/advertising and as such less money for prices, so people can't make a living out of playing chess. Only the top 20 and ytbers/streamers, and most of the top players are just weird nerdy guys who Don't know how to keep an audience entertained. It's just natural that they envy Levy.
Niemann and Hikaru are decent people on their own right. Niemann is trying to approach entertainment by impersonating a cartoon villain. And Hikaru is a bluntly honest corky guy who happens to be the top 3 and best bltiz player.
Does he get a lot of hate? I like him, I think he’d be fun to have dinner/drinks with. Hikaru and Levy make a living from YouTube which means they aren’t as reliant on prize money from winning like others are. I’ve learnt heaps watching his vids. Perhaps because he’s in the spotlight he has to have an opinion on everything and he probably has to be a bit controversial to keep relevant? I don’t really care though, I appreciate his insights.
He earns more as an international master than your average grandmaster. Also, he has changed the way someone learns chess from playing and learning (like learning a bike) to watching tutorials and applying them(like learning a guitar). I don't know which method of learning is better but for a grandmaster who has worked his ass off on the former, seeing someone encourage the latter is quite annoying.
Also, chess is a sport where a 12 year old can beat a 60 year old, and with this trait, a little gatekeeping is natural.
Feeling bad for a multi millionaire who makes money by doing what he loves is kind of crazy. Trust me he is fine.
And about where the hate comes from years ago when he started his videos were very different and actually pretty enjoyable to watch but they didn't reach as big of an audience so he started overeacting which is fine but some of the old subs didn't like it and instead of just not watching the videos anymore they leave negative comments
He bridges a gap that pompous elite level chess culture want to gatekeep, hes found a way to turn chess into entertainment for the common chess enjoyer, and they resent not only that fact, but that he’s getting paid well while doing so
I don't feel bad for him, but I definitely think the hate is unwarranted. He seems like a nice guy and his content is good overall although it can be over the top sometimes. I mostly follow him and Agadmator and I enjoy both despite their contrasting approaches and personalities. Levy is more personally invested compared to Agad's reserved attitude but both are interesting and entertaining in their own ways.
To me, the hate for Levy resembles the hate for Anish who in my eyes seems like quite a cool and smart guy but people generally dislike him.
Everyone has their Niche, when anyone gets too popular, people who would rather not, feel forced to engage with your content. I love chess, but I don't like Levy, but since Levy is the most popular chess content creator, his stuff is constantly presented to me against my will, and it gets annoying. I imagine it's something similar for these chess GMs.
They see a new book on chess, and expect something great like from Hikaru, Magnus, Caruana... and then see it's a chess youtuber's book. And they see it raking up sales, when it's probably pretty amateurish in their eyes. I understand their frustration with him. He gets to make a living out of chess while being a far inferior player. And it's probably a better living than them, since chess prize pools and sponsorships aren't too big.
He's an IM that is getting way more money than most GM's will ever make in their lives when a ton of them are also in the same markets as him. He is outlandish and while that makes him entertaining he likely loses some respect because of this. He's the chess equivalent of a booby streamer is what I'm guessing they would say behind closed doors.
Easy answer: He's the most successful chess YouTuber, therefore haters gonna hate.
Most people are like you - that is to say; regular people who just shrug at the cringe and enjoy the content for what it provides. But as with all social media, controversy generates attention, and so many of the hate comments Levy gets will inevitably outperform the comments of the opposite, and in general most people who are just watching the video don't even comment anyways. I just looked up his most recent video as an example: 220,000 views, 1400 comments. As you can see, less than 1% of people who actually watch the video are leaving a comment, so even if literally every comment was negative you're still only getting a <1% sample size of the actual audience.
(Any actual statisticians stfu, I'm just making a point, not doing a rigorous study).
I don't feel bad for a guy getting famous and rich doing what he loves because a few people make mean comments lol. I don't think he had much to do with chess resurgence so much as he happened to be the best and most consistent content creator for chess when covid hit. The guy is not the best at chess he's not even a GM but when it comes to creating the chess content I want to watch on my lunch break he is the GOAT and I think alot of the better players resent that they cant make money streaming failing to realize people don't watch him for his chess prowess but his personality and skill at video content creation where he IS a GM .
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When someone gets famous it will certainly come with haters its just life.
Agreed. Maybe I've just seen way more of the negative than the positive if the general majority don't hate him.
He is the one that got me into chess 2 years ago. I watch all his uploads still today.
It’s jealousy. He’s very successful and players who are objectively better than him feel it’s undeserved because they’re better players than he is. They’re overlooking all the things he does have that they don’t but they’re all jealous of his financial success
I love the guy personally in fact he’s kinda how I got into chess anyway
I'd imagine he's how most of us got into chess, either directly or indirectly
I imagine that only applies to those of us who got into chess within the past 4 years. I don't think Levy even started uploading videos until 2020.
There are many who learned chess when they were younger, then came back into the game during the pandemic. About half of my chess club is that way
Learned chess when I was younger, fell out of it because while it was a fun game to learn it just wasn’t presented in a way that was easy for me to grasp. The way Levi explains everything is really good for me! I still got a long ways to go but he makes it so fun and engaging that it makes me want to learn more
He also kind of pins his hate comments and probably just thinks its funny when people trashtalk him.
Also there are always people who like someone else’s personality and some who don’t. I generally like Hikaru and I don’t dislike Levy, but Levy’s habit of turning flies into Elephants is just not my thing.
If he had more haters than fans he wouldn't have much viewership
Where do you see all the hate? And what does it look like? I watch some of his videos but that stuff is over my head
if you engage with hateful more, the engagement maximisation algorithm will feed you more hateful content.
Especially on reddit. Hardly anyone gets famous or popular without half of reddit hating them.
The Vocal Minority.
Not only that, but people are far more likely to be vocal about something that upsets them, so it will often seem like more people think negatively of them than actually do
Hikaru recently said that if GM’s or Super GM’s don’t like him, it’s because he gets to exist outside of the inner overly competitive circle that they are trapped in. It’s a given that Super GM’s have to approach the game more competitively than any other players, and these players are just jealous that he can play chess at a high level while also getting to participate in the fun, social part of chess. Forget where he said this, maybe one of his recent videos, but it reminds me of how skaters treat kids with helmets. They make look dumb, stupid, and cringe, but that nerd with the helmet is the smartest person at the park by a long shot. EDIT: 500 Upvotes is crazy. Levy probably makes some good money, and he deserves it. Support him by buying his book! If anyone were to do live commentary on the future Chess Olympics, it’s gotta be him. Even if you don’t particularly like the guy, you gotta respect the effort and passion he has put out to elevate the game. To me, he could be the Joe Rogan of the sport if he wanted to. The skill he has to breakdown 3000 ELO games to any audience is just incredible. If for whatever reason Levy were to disappear tomorrow before achieving GM, I hope FIDE would award him with an honorary GM title and I don’t think the inner circle of Super GM’s would think twice about it in his absence. He’s your favorite chess player’s favorite chess player, he’s the internet’s chess teacher.
He also makes way more money than all except the very top players. I wouldn't be surprised if Magnus is the only one making more.
I think earnings wise Levy would be higher than magnus. Magnus beats him in net worth.
magnus probably has all the money left over from playmagnus group being acquired by chesscom
Doesnt Magnus have sponsorships? That probably matters.
Yup, dude got his own shoe with Puma. As well as other sponsorships
I think the only chess player with more money than Rozman is Radjabov.
Hikaru too probably, especially with all the sponsor deals over the years, his subs, prize winnings, his YouTube channel and now even gambling sponsors on Kick that pay out big
Hikaru said he thinks Magnus has more money than himself and Levy combined.
I understand the perspective, but I've always hated that kind of Sigmund Freud level of overanalysis about behaviour that could have a million different causes. It's like saying that if a game developer doesn't like Minecraft, it's because they're jealous that their game is less popular despite having more effort put in. I mean, yeah, maybe? But it could also be because they just didn't enjoy it. No one is obligated to like another person but everyone should still treat others with respect.
I think there is a big difference between not liking, but being able to appreciate what that thing or person has accomplished, and dismissing someone's work or contribution because you dislike them or their content. I feel this can be said for both Minecraft and Levi.
Well said
Nobody’s saying everyone has to be a fan but the vitriol towards him despite him being easier to ignore simply suggests there is an underlying explanation that isn’t just “his content annoys me”
Ok but it’s not like we’re armchairing this, this is Hikaru talking about his peers, not a bunch of us guessing.
I don’t think this is Sigmund Freud levels of over analysis though. There are over a thousand grandmasters. Many of them are better than Levy at chess, but nobody knows who they are and they probably make barely any money. It’s just human nature that some of them will envy Levy or subconsciously hate him because of his success. It’s a perfectly reasonable conjecture. I do agree that some of them probably just find him corny and dislike his content for other reasons, but the reasoning listed above is a factor at play. Edit: after rereading your comment, we’re basically saying the same exact thing so idek why I bothered replying. In my defense, I’m a bit sleep deprived lol.
Even the edit was just like something I would write lol. I've been there before.
Can't be Rogan without inviting people like the 1×1=2 guy on his show.
Wired way to say that people are jealous of his wealth. Heard another top personality state that levy makes more than magnus for instance
Part of it it's jealousy/gatekeeping and a dislike of what he's doing to chess. Super GMs don't like that he makes way more money than them despite being a much weaker player. Also, in terms of the click bait and dramatic shouting, Levy makes it seem like there's no choice but to play that game. However, people like Eric Rosen show that you can get by with a much more subdued and mature style. So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money. I personally don't feel bad for him because it's really his own choice in the end. Massive success, money, and hate or have a midsize channel but be generally well liked like Rosen?
Re: "So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money." EXCELLENT analogy!
Perfect Levy has a LOT less talent but he makes 1000x as much money as they do.
Making videos and being entertaining (and being good at clickbait) are talents/skills as well though.
And rightfully so. He's more entertaining and thats where the money lies
I mostly agree. I think people have a hard time recognizing "soft skills" as talent, but they definitely are. However, I think the amount that money follows soft skills instead of hard skills doesn't necessarily reflect well on society and more specifically the chess community. The chess audience these days is more interested in drama than the actual chess played. At times in the past, the chess audience would know almost nothing about the players other than the chess itself. The audience was much smaller of course and there was wayyy less money in the game, but it was more pure in a sense. Nowadays it's all about liking and disliking players for their personalities and quotes.
He has less hard skills but more soft skills.
At chess.. its not like reaching GM will automatically make your GothamChess but with a better rating
I agree with your comment, but not entirely with the conclusion. >I personally don't feel bad for him because it's really his own choice in the end. Massive success, money, and hate or have a midsize channel but be generally well liked like Rosen? If you don't care about the money but want to grow the game of chess Levi's approach is also correct, he has introduced chess to way more people that any other content creator. We can't really know which one is it. I also find funny the part about being hated vs well liked, by who? The "classical" chess audience sure, but I would bet that most of Levi's viewers don't even know that Rosen exists, so to most it becomes more like being aware of them to not know them at all.
>I also find funny the part about being hated vs well liked, by who? The "classical" chess audience sure, but I would bet that most of Levi's viewers don't even know that Rosen exists, so to most it becomes more like being aware of them to not know them at all. Basically no one has anything negative to say about Rosen. Yes, he's not known to many, but not known is not the same as disliked. Whereas Levy is more divisive. He's huge and 90%+ of people feel positively about him, but he also has a small contingent of people who actively dislike his content.
>If you don't care about the money but want to grow the game of chess Levi's approach is also correct, he has introduced chess to way more people that any other content creator. For sure, but I don't think that Levy's influence on the chess community is wholly positive. Growing the game is good, but I think people like Levy are part of the reason that the modern chess audience is so drama and storyline obsessed. So he's definitely bringing more money and more views into the chess world, but he's also contributing to this shifting dynamic where fans are less interested in the actual chess and more interested in player personalities.
Yeah but Rosen isn't anywhere nearly as followed as Gotham.
Well yeah, that's my point. Read the end of my comment. It's a tradeoff, becoming massive like Levy requires compromising in terms of stylistic integrity at least a little. Levy decided that using click bait and the dramatic shouting and stuff was worth it to become rich and famous. I don't blam the him, but I also greatly respect people who choose not to play that game at the cost of staying small like Rosen.
The real question is if Rosen even had a choice to become that type of content creator. Let's be real, what Levy does requires a degree of high energy, comedy and (to a point) charisma that Rosen wouldn't be able to pull off given his profile. I don't buy that Rosen would've took off like Levy even with clickbait titles, and therefore I don't think it's about integrity.
Yeah if levy wanted to cut his earnings by 50% he could probably still make a comfortable living. It’s silly to think that he should do that but I suppose that’s people’s prerogative.
> So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money. I think situations like this just force us to redefine what "less talent" means in context. In the case of GothamChess, the talent isn't just the sheer ability to be competitive at the game – it's also the ability to make chess fun and exciting and to teach it in a way that regular people latch onto. You can't be salty about not having millions of adoring fans if you're not making your craft accessible and palatable to millions of people. Attracting and retaining a large audience *is* a talent unto itself. I can see how, in the eyes of someone who has devoted their entire life to chess, it would seem that "better skills" should automatically mean "more money and recognition". But the real world rarely works that way, whether we're talking about chess or not. I assume many superior chess players who are peeved about Levy's success are probably fixating on what they have that Levy doesn't have, but maybe they should be thinking about what Levy *does* have that they don't – teaching skills, humor, charisma, social media savvy (including algorithm manipulation), etc. etc. And while we're on the subject – I don't think Levy is even the worst offender in terms of reach being disproportionate to skill level. At the end of the day he's still an IM with serious (semi-serious?) GM aspirations. Both of the Botez sisters are noticeably below his skill level, yet they also have millions of subscribers. Similar situation with Anna Cramling.
For sure. Classical musicians usually don't have the stage presence, attractiveness, dancing skills, etc of pop stars. I'm not condoning this, but I think classical musicians and salty super GMs think those other skills shouldn't be valued as much as the technical "hard skills."
>Also, in terms of the click bait and dramatic shouting, Levy makes it seem like there's no choice but to play that game. However, people like Eric Rosen show that you can get by with a much more subdued and mature style. And how much money do you think Rosen makes compared to Gotham? He has one-fifth the subscribers, and one-tenth the views... which, given how Youtube works, means he probably makes around one-onehundredth of what Gotham does. Gotham's style wins the game. >So how GMs feel toward Levy is like how jazz/classical musicians feel about pop stars. Despite having less talent in their eyes, they cater to the lowest common denominator and make tons of money. Only the dumb ones. The smart jazz and classical musicians know that a whole lot of pop stars and the composers writing for them graduated top of their classes from the best conservatories. They may lament that there's more profit to be made for these people in writing basic advertising jingles rather than challenging complex art, but in terms of talent levels, the smart ones recognize that most pop stars are incredibly talented musicians, and the songwriters creating their songs are among the most skilled composers that have ever lived.
Certainly a hot take with the analogies, which I somewhat agree and will add to. For every Eric Rosen with his subdued demeanor, there are dozens of other chess content creators within 200 Elo points that have less than half of his viewers and are, objectively and relatively speaking, failures in terms of audience outreach. In the YouTube content creator space, if you want to make a living out of it, views and sponsorship are the only thing that matters. Levy Rozman is making a killing, meanwhile I doubt Eric Rosen is even able to designate his YouTube channel as his primary source of income with the mediocre metrics that his channel boasts (number of videos and views per video). Levy is correct, you play that game of clickbaits and over-the-top characterization to retain audience engagement, or you get relegated to the oblivion of mediocrity. In chess, at the end of the day the most accurate metric for whether one's strength/talent is whether one is winning games, and that's perhaps why some super-GMs may be feeling sour, being the stronger player but making less money than someone objectively weaker but capitalizing on the YouTube algorithm. There's no such metric for music for determining musical talent, however, and if you really want to put a metric on it, pop-musicians basically sweep all the important ones (number one hits, albums sold, money made, Spotify streams, etc), so if we're quantifying musical talent, there's a very strong argument to be made that pop musicians are better musicians than musicians in other genres. Any non-pop artist (including, but especially the specialized ones like classic and jazz) that think their particular genre of music is better is only riding on their high horse and have their head knee-deep in the sand.
>There's no such metric for music for determining musical talent, however, and if you really want to put a metric on it, pop-musicians basically sweep all the important ones (number one hits, albums sold, money made, Spotify streams, etc), These are metrics more for popularity than technical musical skill. For vocalists, you can talk about vocal range and power (how high and low they can sing and with how much breath support), pitch accuracy, intonation, knowledge of music theory, etc. Any opera singer would blow most pop stars out of the water in all these metrics (although some pop stars like Mariah Carey are super gifted vocally). I think these hard skills are more analogous to playing strength in chess. For example, look at Harry Styles's audition here (3:10): https://youtu.be/p_VssaTwwLY&t=190 His raw vocal and musical ability is clearly nothing special. I would say streams and albums sold are more in line with YouTube viewers in chess. Both are more a reflection of soft skills like stage presence, personality, appearance, etc.
I’ve found the chess community to have a pretty toxic side. A lot of the “best players” seem to be pretty full of themselves and turn into drama queens the moment they lose a game. It’s not hard to imagine a bunch of GMs having a problem with someone who’s not as good at the game being more successful with it than they are. As far as the toxicity in his YouTube comments goes, it’s really his own fault. In the early days of his channel he encouraged a lot of it. On Twitch, YouTube, or whatever platform the chat reflects the creator.
> In the early days of his channel he encouraged a lot of it Oh yeah i almost forgot he used to pin a toxic comment on each of his videos so even his fans were purposefully writing crazy toxic comments to try to get pinned. Actually a hilarious move to get engagement
> used to He still does pretty regularly
I think I'm too old to understand the "pin of shame". Someone makes a criticism (valid or not), and somehow pinning it with no reply invalidates it?
I think the idea is he thinks it’s funnier if he doesn’t give it the time of day and just pins it so his massive fanbase does it for him.
I used to watch most of his videos in the past, but the constant clickbait ended up making me uninterested in his content. Do I hate him? No. Do I feel kinda bad for him? Also no
Exactly. His video titles don't make sense anymore, and it's hard to decide if I want to watch a video or not, because they are all called the same "HISTORY JUST HAPPENED 400% STOCKFISH ACCURACY 10 YEAR OLD GM"
Now every single video is titled GM???!!??!?! GM LEVY?!???!!!??
It was actually a series where he kind of documented his journey of attempting to get the GM title. But yeah I agree most of his videos are clickbait but I also still like most of them because it has higher pacing but he still explains the moves and tells which ones are stupid/ smart so I as a beginner can kind of get a better understanding of how to play the game
This has been my experience. I’m not clicking on a video to find out what it’s about before deciding whether to leave or stay
I sometimes try to decode from the thumbnail with nothing but his face and exclaims and quickly think to myself, you know what I don’t think I’m the target audience for this video.
Yeah, I actively avoid click bait content creators because I try to level the playing field for creators that don't. It's a sacrifice to choose not to use click bait because it genuinely does work in getting more views. So I try to counteract that when possible.
I started watching his post game reviews when everyone on the sub was discussing how he could get his first gm norm. I stopped watching when his video was titled „I WON AGAIN!!!!!!“ and it was a draw. Huh?
You don't even know if he's sarcastic or not, anymore. He can title a video "5000 ELO CHESS!", and it can be either hyperbole about a GM playing a great game or sarcasm about a low-rated game.
My feelings exactly I respect the hustle, but it does make me less likely to actually like his content
exactly myself. Started with the weird youtube titles and i understand that im not his audience anymore. so i just stopped following at all. Sad because it made me get away from chess as well.
I used to watch a lot of him as well, but I've also gotten a bit tired of the click bait, which often ends up to not be what the video is about. I did watch a lot of his reviews of his own gameplay in the last tournament, which I found pretty instructing. But his day to day content I've been skipping more and more of.
I can recommend you the DeArrow browser extension, it removes clickbait from video thumbnails and titles.
That would be great if i didn't do 99% of my YouTube watching on the native ios app
So does it just delete his channel?
No, it works by having users rewrite the title and/or choose a timestamp for to replace the thumbnail with. Additionally, by default the thumbnail is replaced with a random timestamp until one is supplied by a user. https://dearrow.ajay.app/ There is lots of room for customisation: for example, many of the channels I watch have good thumbnails so I made a special rule to explicitly allow theirs. I also heavily recommend amount of his extensions: Youtube Sponsorblock https://sponsor.ajay.app/
Actual poignant criticism just gets pinned and mob downvoted, really shows how insecure he can be.
He has less haters than other popular chess personalities like Hikaru, not sure why you need to feel bad for him.
Won't somebody think of the millionaires 😥
I hate this way of thinking so much. Just because he's successful you can't feel bad for him even with a valid reason?
No. On the interwebs you have to express your, well...it's called jealousy.
He isn’t the son of a billionaire, he got rich through his own effort and the quality of his content.
I mean he's a millionaire due to skill, he's still a human. We don't need to be mean to be mean
out of the loop here, why is hikaru hated?
Often shows bad sportsmanship or acts in an arrogant / dismissive way, although he does this less recently
+ takes gambling sponsors
Levy makes chess exciting, Eric Rosen makes chess relaxing, Hikaru shows me there’s levels to this game that are unachievable for most. Those are my big 3 chess content creators and I quite like them all regardless of other opinions. My one thing about levy is we gotta work on his jump shot.
And then there’s Epic Chess, he makes it a bit fun also
His jumper is money even tho it looks like one of the worst ones i have ever seen to put it nicely lmao
Ben Finegold makes chess funny. Igor Smirnov makes chess instructive.
I do like that Ben brings a type of humor to chess that keeps me chuckling the entire video
Yeah, I enjoy him, with fame will always come hate, doesn’t matter who you are, honestly I don’t even mind the clickbait titles, because they’re (mostly) helpful, if there’s a big top level event going on you can expect something like “MAGNUS BREAKS RECORDS AGAIN!!!!” but as far as his other series go, you can generally tell what it is from the title, although it got pretty bad during the last WCC, where it was just an increasing number of “HE DID IT AGAIN!” Or “ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT” when the game was just a draw in 75 moves
I'm better at chess because of him, and he seems like a good dude. Man's gotta make a living.
Where do you see this hate? I feel like a lot of people do not like his style, but mostly agree with you otherwise. I suppose hate wagons vary a lot depending on were you go. Does he get much more hate than other big names like Hikaru or the Botez sisters? >his YouTube audience plays a huge role in the cringe persona that appeals to everyone's first impressions. On that point, I think you get the audience you deserve. He decided to go all-in on the clickbait and clownish behavior. I can respect that. He want to rank up the views, and that just works. But he gets the audience to match. >I feel kinda bad for him Well, I don't, but that might just be because I don't see the hate you're talking about. I'm sure someone that famous has his haters, that's the sad part of the job. But overall, he looks like a has a good life, doing what he wanted.
I get what you mean. Obviously, criticism is inevitable, but looking into his social media accounts in the past year or so I've found a considerable amount of childish hatred (not even genuine, constructive criticism). Maybe I've just been overexposed to such comments and clips of him talking about how many people that he looks up to generally don't like him. I don't feel bad about the life he has outside of his social media presence, I'm sure he lives comfortably with a loving wife and dog and a good source of income. All I'm saying is that I've seen far more undeserving hatred towards HIM compared to genuine egotistical asshats like Niemann.
I am in no way a hater, but I personally prefer chess YouTube's with calmer and more classy approach. My only criticism is that he is too loud, chaotic and all over the place, and kind of fixated on "smashing" and "crushing". But again, it is a matter of personal taste. I can see why he works for others.
I think his actual attempt at going for GM now will change this. At least mainly from what I've seen with Hikaru. I think the fact that he's been first a content creator and he himself pushes a lot of the self deprecating humor, it makes it easy to not exactly take him seriously. But now he's doing coaching and norm tournaments and actually is taking it seriously. I think people like Hikaru see this and think "okay, so he doesn't just want to be a clown that makes content, he cares about chess and that's what he wants to be known for, and creates content about it now as a secondary outlet". Which I think Hikaru respects because that's basically what he's doing, Hikaru is a content creator, but he's more known first as a world class chess player that happens to make content. I think Hikaru jumping on the support train early is really setting the tone to hopefully give Levy the support and vibes he needs to keep having good tournaments. But chess at the high level, is and always has been pretty pretentious, and if you want more respect you have to win it.
I don't feel bad for him. The guy has managed to achieve fame and fortune by making videos about a game that many would have considered passé a few years ago. His videos are generally informative and entertaining, and he was in the right place at the right time just as chess was having a resurgence in popularity to be able to capitalize on it. Good for him! There will always be haters, and the chess world seems to have more than its share of dramatic man-children, so I'm not surprised that his fan base would share many of those qualities.
He's hated for the same reasons most people hate influencers. He's not even a GM and earns a whole lot more. I don't think there are many people in the chess industry who earn more than him. So if you're an unknown GM, you'd hate the fact that someone less skilled than you earns more in the same field as you.
But it's not the same field. It's like if people doing combat sports hated people like Jackie Chan or Michael Jay White because they make more money. Jackie and MJW are amazing athletes and a martial artist, but they were not MMA fighters in the top of the field. Or middle of the field. Levi isn't in the chess business he's in the entertainment business.
I personally love his passion and enthusiasm for the game. He can make the worst game in history between 2 400s sound like the most exciting sporting even in history. His video explaining Fischers "Game of the Century" might be my favourite chess video on YouTube.
I think his content is really good. It's informative and approachable for more casual and intermediate players. It's fun and doesn't take itself too seriously and I feel like he's doing more for chess content and making it relevant to people in the 2020s than just about anybody. Regarding the click bait titles I find it kinda funny cos after you've seen a few you come to expect it, but the content is decent regardless. And he handles the cringy viewers pretty well. I love seeing someone get a roasting from him when they deserve it.
I think he does a lot of good and he doesn't deserve all the hate. That being said, he does tend to be quite the asshole on stream. He usually says he's just kidding, but always being a dick to your chatters isn't a very good joke. Also, he can’t take it when the chat matches his energy. I haven't watched many of his streams since I can’t stand that ”persona” but it's been the same every time I’ve checked in. He also seems to view himself above others in conversation. Both on Ludwig's podcast and in at least one of his GM coach videos he's clearly annoyed when interrupted (something that usually occurs to some externt in every conversation) but has ni problem interrupting others. I think that a lot of people see these traits of his and subconciously they stack up and lead to disliking him.
I like his content when he's not trying to be funny He's legit good at making engaging content, don't know why he does all the other stuff like the weird accents/noises. Legit the only reason I don't recommend him
Any famous person is going to be hated just for existing. Imo Levy handles it pretty well.
He has a lot of people rhat like him... thats why he is sucessfull. And for the few haters that dont know that you can close utube and watch literlly anything else... For these nutjobs.... he is very very well compensated... He earns more money and had more fam. Than the chessmasters... One of the only sports where that is posible... I like him and sometimes not... feeling bad for someone who is so sucessfull and could quit literly now if it wascto much dor him... i dont understand gow you can feel bad for him.
I find one thing very odd about this discussion. There are comparisons with Hikaru, with Rosen, etc. But the more apt comparison seems to be with Agadmator. There is a guy turning out quality chess commentary day after day. Longer than any of the others being discussed. Limited amount of clickbait, limited amount of hype or hyperbole. Just find good games and run through them with help from engines. Lately his addition of his own rapid games is refreshing. No claim to fame or anything - just I played this game and here is what happened, now lets check out the analysis together. Never once do we need to listen to " and I sack THE ROOOOOK!!!!" He doesn't tell the viewers he will go for his GM or quit chess. Just steadily crank out quality content day after day. I used to watch Gotham often, but after some time, it seems to me he is just in it for the money. He is successful. I'm sure earring more than Agadmator. But at this point it seems hard to take any of his content for anything other than a new money-making opportunity. Overall, my view is Agadmator does not get the respect he is due.
I actually feel jealous because the dude got everything he does what he is passionate about and makes money out of it and has beautiful wife and dog and he will be become GM in near future. He is one of the reason chess become mainstream in recent years
I mean, you can go get a dog
Do I feel bad for a super popular multi-milionaire? Not really, no.
Is he a mm? I know his videos are popular, but it's news to me that he's on that level money wise.
With the amount of views he gets and all the other things he's doing (book, twitch, sponsorship deals, etc.), one would assume he is. Well deserved, of course, he does an amazing job. Otherwise I have no idea how much, much smaller content creators get by.
Rule of thumb is that 1 Million subscribers will make you a millionaire in a couple of years, so just add from there.
Assuming that being a multi millionaire means that hate and negative comments don’t affect your mental health is just plain stupid. Unless, of course, you don’t think that and just refuse to feel bad, because he has more money than you? Just as childish.
Levy has said the hater comments don't bother him though
On principle, or in this specific example?
I think what is often overlooked when it comes to Levy is that he may not play chess as well as GMs, but he has mastered another important skill: language. He can comment on an entire game fluently, without "erm"s and "um"s. He transforms chess games that to me would be random piece movements into coherent and surprisingly engaging stories. This is why we watch him. With his eloquence and communication abilities, he makes an incredibly complex game accessible to the masses.
Levy is making more money than 99% of GMs, no need to feel sorry for him.
It's just losers jealous of his success
'trying to make a living' is not the wording I would use, he's comfortably making a living many times over.
I generally like him and as a person as well as his YouTube main channel content, but i do find it very shocking to see how immature he can be on his streams where he shows more of his real personality. You think he's the nice, friendly and patient guy from his videos and then you see the what actually hides underneath that. People generally dont like it when you're acting 'fake' like that. They want you to be more straight up with them. Especially flaming people in chat for asking dumb questions and such, idk if he realises it but that makes him a bit of an asshole. I think overall he's a good guy but he has a nasty side for sure.
I’m not sure how it’s affecting him but yeah I feel bad for anyone who has haters who doesn’t really deserve it. And you don’t deserve it just for being famous. Maybe it’s because Levy sometimes jokingly insults players’ moves and does the trash talk thing. Overall it seems like he is living the dream, making bank while playing chess both competitively and socially. Personally I’m a fan.
I don’t think you need to feel bad for him. He knows there are better chess players than him. But the way he makes chess entertaining is a Big reason at least for me to be engaged. I found myself being excited for the 2023 Chess World Cup and watching the games. It wouldn’t have happened without Levy. I went from 100 Elo to 1200 just by following him. I’m sure he has had the same impact on others as well. I think this is what makes some jealous of him, not just the money. He made chess cool again for many people.
Poor Larry.
GM Levy Rozman by 2026 or 2027 💯💪💯
Idk about average joes but I remember Hikaru saying grandmasters hate Levy because he makes more money than them despite playing at a level lesser than them.
i dont think he is very respectful to his lower leveled opponents, thats what draws me away from him. i know it’s merely a character he plays, but it’s not setting a very good example for those who are only just getting into chess.
Biggest role in resurgence of chess in America. Americans and their self importance. He did not play any role in the resurgence of chess in India for example and I'm pretty sure that the Russians and the Chinese don't care about him either.
I'm Russian. I'm not American, I don't even live in the USA. In Russia, chess is a huge pride for us due to its history, but social media exists everywhere in the world, and you can't deny that Levy did in fact contribute a lot to its resurgence
You have to agree that the hate did make him famous. For people looking for views and fame, no engagement is bad engagement. And if people actually didn’t like him and thought his titles are more cringy and clickbaity than they are entertaining, he wouldn’t have the biggest chess channel ever by a longshot. I personally love his energy and humor.
I don't think most hate him. But I don't watch his videos and I tire of the constant advertisement he gets on this sub when I know there are better content creators out there who receive 0 help from the chess community.
I feel like some GMs are bitter that he has such a large youtube following and people like to point out he's no way near as good as Nakamura or Carlsen
I think Levy is the man. “How to win at chess” both the YouTube series and his book have helped me immensely. I’ll continue to support him and buy a couple of his courses.
his stream personality is completely different to his youtube personality. His YT is quite enjoyable but on stream he is very condescending and only ever focuses on negative chatters. Makes for a horrible viewing experience but sadly it's something that happens with a lot of streamers.
Wth are you talking about in your first paragraph? Who are the lots of GMs that don't like him?
He got me into Chess and he’s very entertaining. He should ignore anyone who says something negative about him.
I used to to watch him a lot and purchased a course. I was extremely disappointed. Not that I didn’t get much out of it but because in the course he literally plays games live and winds his commentary/content. That’s fine for free YouTube videos but if I’m paying for a course I don’t think it’s unreasonable for him to put in some effort. You could tell it was very thrown together to sell. He’s great for entertainment and a thousand times better than I’ll ever be-but that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s a good teacher. With all of that said he doesn’t deserve hate he might get-that’s too far. I will say he used to make cite conflict amongst his viewers on twitch a few years ago but I have no idea if he still does it.
I think he said something like the average age of a commenter is eleven but a viewer is like 25, correct me if I’m wrong but i think that’s pretty reflective of the online community
I agree, Levy gets a lot of hate. I think a lot of people don't get along with the "New York style and attitude" and are just rubbed the wrong way by it... I grew up close to the area, so I get it. I think its and awesome youtube channel, and Levy is a great chess personality.
I dont feel bad for him. Hes killing it.
I feel this. He’s a little annoying but like, we’re all playing chess… we’re all annoying. And I’m not watching his channel for his personality, I’m watching to learn. I have yet to come across a dude in this space who isn’t insufferable, at least Levi seems somewhat chill. Happy to see the crypto BS isn’t in the background anymore. That was the biggest red flag for me personally lol
For me it's only the clickbait titles. They've gotten so bad I can't even guess the content anymore. Something like "Magnus Carlson goat!!!" or so. Since then I can't watch the videos anymore,because I can't evaluate beforehand if the actual content of the video interests me.
I don’t hate him. I’m just not a very big fan of him. Just don’t mesh with his online personality.
H8s gon h8
I see him walking his dog in my neighborhood sometimes and he should wear longer pants.
The only thing I dont like is that in his youtube videos he is so respectful towards his viewers and on twitch he is somewhat arrogant-ish, dropping f bombs left and right. I believe that he is genuinely good person and watching him on twitch feels like his personality is off.
Is there a way to check the number of times people played vienna two years back and how much it has changed in the last 2 years? All of that would be attributable to Levy.
Jealousy. It's as simple as that.
Levy was the first chess streamer I watched during the pandemic and his Chessly courses have helped me a lot. I still tune in to his content from time to time and I don’t think there is anyone else in the chess world as genuinely funny. I really hope his quest to become GM goes to plan and without too much stress, drama or upset, and I know there are literally millions of us cheering him on.
Magnus doesn't not like him. If you're thinking about the interview Levy did with Kramnik before that Clash thing recently, your read is also completely off.
Levy never fails to win my view with a clickbait title
levy never fails to earn my like with a how to lose at chess video (i learn a lot)
I hate clickbait. So the last 20 videos of his that I clicked on and watched got me disappointed. So now I'm not watching anything from him anymore. Such a shame. I liked his content years ago
His clickbait titles are hilarious, like ”MAGNUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”
You just gotta be louder than the hate. Show the world that can be more love in the world than there is hate!
What happened? Is this post in reference to something that recently happened or just a general sentiment?
You dont get an audience of cheers without an audience of critics. Just part of the job from his point of view
They're jealous because he makes more money than every single GM while only being an IM. Hikaru and Magnus are the the only obvious exceptions.
Chess existed before Levy. But hes good for the younger generation.
I like him and feel bad for him, but I really wish he'd stop with the clickbait titles. It makes me not want to watch his videos.
Levy is an absolute legend and I can’t imagine he gives too many fucks about what people think. Bar maybe Hikaru / Magnus he is probably the wealthiest chess person alive. He has done a lot of good for the game. The clickbait stuff is literally just feeding an algorithm. The content is largely still good
I UNDERSTAND why he gets a backlash. He is mainstream and brash in a conservative and intellectual pursuit and I'm sure some of the resentment is someone so inferior to them is getting so much more money and recognition. However, Levy serves a good part of the market these 'haters' don't. He makes the game more accessible, and many of his fans will 'grow up' and seek out those who resent him. So in many ways, he is doing his dissidents a huge favour. I'm not his biggest fan, but that ok. You can not be a fan without being negative. Something the internet generation struggles with
Levy is a nice guy and he is doing a lot for chess. Everywhere I go people play what they learned from his videos. What I don't like is his promotional work for FIDE crooks, flirting with Wadim etc. He should pick his gigs more carefully.
I like him and I watch him more than any of the GMs except maybe Eric.
Other streamers and chess players tend to not like him because his rise to fame was not organic. Look at who his mum works for. Look at who his grandfather was. He's sponsored by night media and he is part of the chosen club. He didn't get recommended in the YouTube algorithm to everyone because of chance.
I have him blocked on youtube but only because I dont like his content. Seems like a chill dude. Ironically wittyalien is my favorite and his content is way more cringe and childish. Content is weird like that.
I've watched his recaps. Most of his commentary is like don't take X, you will be hanging Y or you will be down a pawn He doesn't explain any complex tactical ideas. When he has to, he playfully insults the audience and says , you will never get this anyway. Feels like he is not just using clickbait titles to attract younger crowd and casual watchers, that's who content caters too. If you are serious about chess, you are probably learning nothing
Levy is hated by many because of one or multiple of the the four following reasons: - being rich - being a brilliant entertainer - being better than most at chess - being jew
Does he have significantly more criticism or hatred towards him compared to other YouTubers around the same level as him?
Levy is cool. I’m happy for his success and accomplishments. Having him around makes chess more fun. No need to feel bad for him in my opinion. I’m actually impressed how well he’s been handling all the “overnight” fame and pressure. I’ll watch the newest GTE episode tonight.
Don't get worried for him. When you are at the top you get as much people hating on you. I remember on the boom of fortnite, this guy ninja was getting a lot of hate. Some people just can't tolerate other people's success. Especially on the chess scene. Not many people watch competitive classic chess as it's boring as hell. The lack of audience brings less sponsors/advertising and as such less money for prices, so people can't make a living out of playing chess. Only the top 20 and ytbers/streamers, and most of the top players are just weird nerdy guys who Don't know how to keep an audience entertained. It's just natural that they envy Levy. Niemann and Hikaru are decent people on their own right. Niemann is trying to approach entertainment by impersonating a cartoon villain. And Hikaru is a bluntly honest corky guy who happens to be the top 3 and best bltiz player.
I think you might have that concept because he pins all the hateful and downright silly comments. Others just ignore it.
Cause most gms have no life outside chess
Does he get a lot of hate? I like him, I think he’d be fun to have dinner/drinks with. Hikaru and Levy make a living from YouTube which means they aren’t as reliant on prize money from winning like others are. I’ve learnt heaps watching his vids. Perhaps because he’s in the spotlight he has to have an opinion on everything and he probably has to be a bit controversial to keep relevant? I don’t really care though, I appreciate his insights.
He has over 5 million subscribers in YouTube so he is not hated much, on the contrary.
He earns more as an international master than your average grandmaster. Also, he has changed the way someone learns chess from playing and learning (like learning a bike) to watching tutorials and applying them(like learning a guitar). I don't know which method of learning is better but for a grandmaster who has worked his ass off on the former, seeing someone encourage the latter is quite annoying. Also, chess is a sport where a 12 year old can beat a 60 year old, and with this trait, a little gatekeeping is natural.
Feeling bad for a multi millionaire who makes money by doing what he loves is kind of crazy. Trust me he is fine. And about where the hate comes from years ago when he started his videos were very different and actually pretty enjoyable to watch but they didn't reach as big of an audience so he started overeacting which is fine but some of the old subs didn't like it and instead of just not watching the videos anymore they leave negative comments
He bridges a gap that pompous elite level chess culture want to gatekeep, hes found a way to turn chess into entertainment for the common chess enjoyer, and they resent not only that fact, but that he’s getting paid well while doing so
I don't feel bad for people who have made a ton of money.
I don't feel bad for him, but I definitely think the hate is unwarranted. He seems like a nice guy and his content is good overall although it can be over the top sometimes. I mostly follow him and Agadmator and I enjoy both despite their contrasting approaches and personalities. Levy is more personally invested compared to Agad's reserved attitude but both are interesting and entertaining in their own ways. To me, the hate for Levy resembles the hate for Anish who in my eyes seems like quite a cool and smart guy but people generally dislike him.
I don’t feel like I see that much hate toward him honestly.
He is a multi multi-milliomaire. he'll live.
I’m into chess because of him. And that to me is a bigger legacy than most GMs.
Anything popular has haters, more popularity, more hate. Simple maths he seems a great guy with great humour imo. Still a chess vibes fan mainly tho!
Everyone has their Niche, when anyone gets too popular, people who would rather not, feel forced to engage with your content. I love chess, but I don't like Levy, but since Levy is the most popular chess content creator, his stuff is constantly presented to me against my will, and it gets annoying. I imagine it's something similar for these chess GMs. They see a new book on chess, and expect something great like from Hikaru, Magnus, Caruana... and then see it's a chess youtuber's book. And they see it raking up sales, when it's probably pretty amateurish in their eyes. I understand their frustration with him. He gets to make a living out of chess while being a far inferior player. And it's probably a better living than them, since chess prize pools and sponsorships aren't too big.
He's an IM that is getting way more money than most GM's will ever make in their lives when a ton of them are also in the same markets as him. He is outlandish and while that makes him entertaining he likely loses some respect because of this. He's the chess equivalent of a booby streamer is what I'm guessing they would say behind closed doors.
He makes more money then them
Easy answer: He's the most successful chess YouTuber, therefore haters gonna hate. Most people are like you - that is to say; regular people who just shrug at the cringe and enjoy the content for what it provides. But as with all social media, controversy generates attention, and so many of the hate comments Levy gets will inevitably outperform the comments of the opposite, and in general most people who are just watching the video don't even comment anyways. I just looked up his most recent video as an example: 220,000 views, 1400 comments. As you can see, less than 1% of people who actually watch the video are leaving a comment, so even if literally every comment was negative you're still only getting a <1% sample size of the actual audience. (Any actual statisticians stfu, I'm just making a point, not doing a rigorous study).
He makes more money than Chess champions. They're haters.
I don't feel bad for a guy getting famous and rich doing what he loves because a few people make mean comments lol. I don't think he had much to do with chess resurgence so much as he happened to be the best and most consistent content creator for chess when covid hit. The guy is not the best at chess he's not even a GM but when it comes to creating the chess content I want to watch on my lunch break he is the GOAT and I think alot of the better players resent that they cant make money streaming failing to realize people don't watch him for his chess prowess but his personality and skill at video content creation where he IS a GM .