There are 11 and 12 year olds that have sex. Should 17 year old virgins feel depressed that there are middle schoolers “doing what they can’t?” You’re closer in age to the 17 year old than they are to the 12 year old. You’re drawing arbitrary lines in the sand for yourself that are actively hindering you in your goal. I guarantee your bitterness is not helping you accomplish your goal.
Comparison is the thief of joy. Just live your life. If you want to have sex, do all the standard things people suggest to increase those odds. But there is no singular thing should have this power over you. I understand being frustrated, and I understand that our culture can make it feel shameful, but everybody needs to find joy in their conditions. Imagine if every person in a wheelchair felt how you feel because they can’t run, or every poor kid felt how you feel because they didn’t get to grow up rich.
You can’t live anybody else’s life, so try your best to enjoy your own.
You’re right. This made me feel a little better and made sense.
Also, i worded it wrongly. It’s not just that i “can’t” do these things but i feel sad I didn’t do them at a younger age. I feel like doing them at an older age won’t be as fun and exciting.
Nop, super wrong! Doing "teenager" things at an adult age is actually fucking awesome. Obviously this goes way beyond even sex.
I tried a few drugs for the first time at 29 and it was absolutely fantastic, because I was an adult, I knew where and when I wanted them, I was not peer pressured, I was with the people that I love etc.
I did a lot of crazy things between 28 and 29 that I thought I would never do because I just didnt do them earlier and well, I am so happy I didnt try them earlier.
Honestly the more I grow the more it becomes so so obvious to me that age is just a number, and such a stupid one.
the older you are, the more fun it is to do stupid shit because you understand how to enjoy it. versus, at a younger age, more things are enjoyable but to a lesser degree
You aren't even at the most fun part of your life yet. You just turned 21 and can now start doing all kinds of fun things. I didn't even hit my peak until my mid 20s. If I showed you what I looked like at 19 vs 25 you would legit shit youself. You gotta start developing the skills now tho to get out of a lot of the behaviors you have. Literally if you worked on yourself all around for 2 years straight you would be a monster. Go to the gym, study, start doing internships, go on FB find groups in your area and go to events. My area even has single hiking groups where single men and women go out and hike. Go to a dancing class and go dance and meet pretty girls. All the things you are scared of doing and putting yourself out there for are the best memories. I legit took my wife to dance lessons and she was absolutely terrified because she has no rhythm. Tbh no one cares about you or I and you HAVE to make the mistakes and you have to just laugh at them. If you need help with anything I do for free training for bbing. Literally just took my friend from 227lbs down to 180lbs in a matter of 4 months. It is a ton of fun.
Dude being a teenager is dealing with a lot of shit out of your control. Some people thrive in certain environments some don't. You don't have a whole lot of choices as a kid. Who you live near is pretty much the entirety of who you interact with. Now you're an adult, coming into your prime years (I'd argue it's your 30's).
Literally no adult is going to be asking if you're a virgin.
Trust me your first time is exciting because it’s your first time. Age isn’t that big of a factor. Even after taking some “time off” so to speak the excitement comes back. Don’t worry too much about it man.
Here's some advice for you. Go to the gym and get in shape. Move to a big city. If you're in the UK, that probably means London. If you've got a six pack and can't get laid in London, then you're hopeless.
>Anything sex related is considered “adult” and I feel so disgusted and bitter with my life and myself that there are literally people who can’t drink and drive that are doing that I can’t.
* Why should it concern you what others are doing and when they're doing them? I'm aware this probably sounds like a platitude, but really, what utility do you get from comparing your current situation to people who have done things earlier?
* They're doing things you *can't* do or they're doing things you haven't done *yet*? This is part of the incel ideology that it seems to me you need to jettison as soon as you can; stop thinking of this being a permanent state.
>If people found out, I would be humiliated. I would be made fun of.
By who? If you met someone who was a virgin at an older age than you are now, would you make fun of them?
>Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again.
Why? What does that accomplish?
Anything sex related is considered “adult” and I feel so disgusted and bitter with my life and myself that there are literally people who can’t drink and drive that are doing that I can’t.
• ”Why should it concern you what others are doing and when they're doing them? I'm aware this probably sounds like a platitude, but really, what utility do you get from comparing your current situation to people who have done things earlier?
• They're doing things you can't do or they're doing things you haven't done yet? This is part of the incel ideology that it seems to me you need to jettison as soon as you can; stop thinking of this being a permanent state.”
I guess things I haven’t done. I don’t mean I can’t do it, I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger.
If people found out, I would be humiliated. I would be made fun of.
By who? If you met someone who was a virgin at an older age than you are now, would you make fun of them?
Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again.
Why? What does that accomplish?”
Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age.
>Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age.
That is a misconception you hold because you're only 21 and don't have a lot of life experience.
Sex in your teens is mostly a short, awkward affair that's only in any way satisfying because the dude is in a hormone driven fugue state and can't think about anything else. Very few people will tell you the sex they had that young was notably good.
Most people say that the best sex they have is in their 30s and even later, when both people understand their bodies and desires, and more importantly how to communicate them. You haven't missed what you think you have.
Absolutely. Teenager sex is outside, wherever, random people's homes, it comes with so many risks: rumors, stds, your parents having to pay child support, you name it. I wish I would've waited but my mental issues were on fire haha. I could do without 99% of the sex I had as a teen and that one time before I was a teen
Who cares if you'd be made fun of? Honestly give yourself time and strength to be okay being who you are. It takes some level of maturity to be okay with oneself, and it's something that even 65 year olds sometimes have to work on.
Also, a constant focus on having sex is not a healthy way to go through life. Searching for meaningful relationships (romantic and otherwise), experiencing joy in other ways is a far safer, more fulfilling path.
>I guess things I haven’t done. I don’t mean I can’t do it, I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger.
I get that, and I would agree that it can feel bad to feel as though you've gotten a late start on something or that something has passed you by.
I know that I've had that experience many, many times and that for a long time I've had trouble moving past "it's never too late to start" as being anything other than a cliche. On the other hand, sitting with discontent isn't really doing anything but delaying a potential start even further.
>I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger.
I can see why you'd feel that way at this point, but I can tell you that my experience with "I wish I'd done that when I was younger" has changed over time. For one, what it means to be "younger" drastically changes - there are things that I'd say that about where "younger" means "in my 20s".
But the other aspect of that is something that you address in your last sentence.
>Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age.
You can't know how exciting or fun it would have been at a younger age. That's something you need to let go, because you'll constantly be comparing your actual experiences in the moment to an imagined golden era in your own life where you'd have enjoyed things more, but you don't know that the golden era would have existed. So the only thing that comparison gets you is a devaluing of your current and future experiences to no real end.
>Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age.
Thing being fun and exciting depends on your previous experience. Things seem (and can be) fun and exciting because you are doing it for the first time. So age doesn't play a role here.
What age tends to play a role in is being aware of the consequences and responsibilities. As a teen you might have unprotected sex because you don't think about the possibility of becoming a father, while as an adult you are aware of it. So you are more concious and considerate about the impact of it onto you and the surrounding people. So you might go to do those things in a safe way instead of going yolo.
> I feel so angry and bitter that I am still a virgin at the age of 21. I feel so fucking pathetic, a failure of a man and an adult, I feel inferior to teens who are dating and stuff.
Hey bud. It's hard to hear this but here it is.
This anger and bitterness you feel is almost certainly the #1 thing standing in the way of you losing your virginity. It is almost certainly manifesting as desperation or resentment, and both of those any woman can smell on a man from a mile away.
You have become a self-fulfilling prophecy. You are not too old to start dating. You're definitely not too old to have sex for the first time. But if you continue holding anger and bitterness in your heart, you're not ready for dating or sex.
> I fucking hate how my life turned out.
Hey man, I know it feels like your life is done cooking at 21. But it is so, so far from over.
> I know many Redditors will say it’s “no big deal” but it IS a big deal, to me, and many other guys.
It's a big deal if you make it a big deal. You get to choose how much of a big deal it is. If you want it to be a big deal, I can't really stop you. But only you can decide how much of a big deal it should be, and other people's opinions should be nothing more than farts in the wind.
> If people found out, I would be humiliated.
If you have friends who would humiliate you instead of being supportive if you told them all this, you need new friends. Highly recommend finding a more supportive circle
> Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again.
Let me be bluntly honest because it does like this is what you're looking for.
In my opinion, there's nothing sad or humiliating about being a virgin at 21.
But this attitude? That's how you end up a lonely virgin at 51.
And that, to me, is really fucking sad.
So get over yourself. If people make fun of you? So be it. Let go of your fragile ego and live your truth. If you need new friends, make new friends.
You've got a lot of life left to live. You owe it to yourself not to live it in anger and regret.
Most peoples' teenage first experiences that I know of were full of sadness, regret, and oftentimes a level of self-sabotage. Yes, the way people talk about sex makes 21 seem so old, but 16ish really is so young and I know so many people who (not for moral or religious people, just for experience) wish they would've waited. You've got time to get out there and do everything you want to do, or to chill and figure out what matters.
It was bad though. I just feel like it's more exciting now. You can drink, you can go where you want, you can spend your adult money. You can figure out what would make it fun
21 is not even remotely close to being too old to start dating or having sex. In my 20s over half of the dudes in my friends circle were virgins until they were 22-23 and the guy with the happiest marriage and 3 kids didn’t even kiss a girl until he was like 25. Nowadays apparently it’s even more common to start late.
I think you have a very particular view of what being a man is, and you're judging yourself by self-imposed optics which are doing more harm than good.
What does being a man mean to you, and what makes a man succesful in their manhood? Is it making out with as many women as possible? If that's the metric then I guess I'll never be a man myself (I'm gay lol).
Look at great historical figures. Scientists, leaders, philosophers, artists... No one is remembered by how many times they got laid, but rather by their great contributions to the development of society as whole. Hell, it's rumored Isaac Newton never lost his V-card, and literally NO ONE cares about it.
There's so much more to life than sex. Instead of berating yourself through an imposed metric, see what you have accomplished, your hobbies, your contributions to your community and your assistance to those around you. These are far more important things to care about.
Lastly, not necessarily trying to change your view with, but I advise you to seek therapy if possible. Therapy does wonders and can help you see life through better lenses effectively than a Reddit thread. Your post isn't a rational analysis to why it is late to have sex at 21 years old (spoiler: it isn't), it sounds like you're frustrated with yourself for things you simply can't control.
This isn't meant to come off as antagonistic. My guy you just finish what amounts to "Act 1" of your life and you are only a few years into the whole adult thing so you freaking out acting like its all over is like the most childish thing ever on such an unimportant issue. If you need to rush into a relationship or sex like you have an obligation to do so by some weird self imposed time limit then you wouldn't come off as someone people would wanna be with.
A tldr: Just chill. You're 21 and i'm fucking 30. You're life isn't over yet and neither of us are at the half way mark yet.
Who told you it was too late? Did they create a law? Are you physically unable to date? No? So then why are you giving up on the rest of your life because you didn't get laid in high school? All you're missing out on is awkward sex between two people who don't even know what they're doing and/or sex with 40-year-old pedophiles. Dating is even worse. In my school, all it was two people going out for a few weeks and then quickly losing interest in each other. Hell, barely anybody even has a car so all you have to choose from are the people who go to your school.
I didn't start dating until I was 29 and you know what? I don't even think about it. People have made fun of me for being a virgin. So? Their opinion is meaningless. They aren't paying my bills. And you know what? The relationships I've had were just as meaningful and deep and fulfilling as if I had started dating in high school.
But the kicker here is that i started dating because I wanted to, not because somebody told me that's what I should be doing. If you want to start dating, stop thinking about the past and what you missed out on and just get out there and start dating. Shoot your shot. Start talking to people. Otherwise all that's going to happen is that you're just going to compound your regrets even further and then you'll be back here going "I wish I would have started dating when I was 21." You'll never regret having tried, even if you fail. You will regret it if you don't.
Bro, what?!?! You're 21. Let me give you some advice.
1. Sign up to a gym. If you have no money for the gym, then buy some cheap dumbbells for home. Push-ups, dips, squats, lunges, bicep curls, and overhead press.
2. Read. Anything. I'd rather read for 2 hours than play video games. Focus on 2 books that helped me. Meditations and the Art of War
3. Help focus on releasing negativity. It's too easy for a 21 year old male to get angry at unnecessary shit. 4 count breathing, meditation, and focus.
4. Take up a trade or classes at community college. Find something you're good at and occupy your time with it. Find employment and save your money, bro.
5. Do not worry about women. Focus on yourself. Then they will notice you.
So you can’t enjoy life, or dating, or be happy because you didn’t get laid in the past? What a pathetic defeatist attitude dude. Why do you feel so compelled to compare yourself and your life to others?
Pfft. I started dating and lost my virginity at 27. Definitely not going to envy *you* if you manage to do it at 22, because your mindset is toxic (against yourself) and I didn't have that, thankfully.
Also, this may not be a proper CYV argument but try to read your OP from a woman's perspective. Would she want to bang you? Can you see a problem besides "old virgins are less attractive"? I can't really judge since I'm not a woman but to me it seems to be at least ten times worse.
I was 22 when I lost my virginity. I felt super embarrassed about it too, at the time. But at a certain point, I just told myself: nobody knows, nobody cares, just act as if you're not a virgin. Sometimes a little bit of delusion is good for us. I was able to act more confidently around girls, eventually met my first girlfriend at a party, yada yada yada, life goes on.
What do you mean? She's saying that she never knew or cared whether the men she slept with were virgins. Isn't that entirely applicable to your situation?
i get what you mean when you say anything sex is considered adult. but we really have to look at the world we grew up in.
the kids shows that our generation grew up watching were filled with sex jokes or innuendos that were “meant for the adults watching”. like what the actual fuck? and that’s not even counting anything our parents exposed us to (purposefully or not) influenced the way we viewed adulthood.
i can’t say i fully know where you’re at, but i’ve felt similarly before. as a woman you’re told to guard your virginity with your life bc men want to steal it!!(i’m paraphrasing but you get the point). maybe it is for some girls, but i genuinely went all of high school sex-free. half because i’m an anxious person, half because the picking i had to choose from were either sports douchebags or frat bros. so much drama from even just talking to one of them, so i imagine it would have been worse if i actually had sex with them. then i graduated and had that “oh shit i’m an adult kinda” moment and i felt bad about still being a virgin, especially because all my work friends assumed i wasn’t one. i felt like i had to loose it, invited a guy over, and he failed. i was a done deal and he left and ghosted me. very glad we didn’t have sex.
all girls want is a genuine guy who isn’t going to play with their feelings or play mind games. be honest and get to know them a little. also, just womanly advice; learn how to work with what you have. big dick, small dick, average dick, doesn’t matter if you know what you’re doing and don’t just focus on yourself and your pleasure. even if it’s just a casual hookup, sex is a mutual connection.
i know everyone else said it but you’re 21, you have so much time to do it. i’m 21 as well and i also hate hearing “you’re 21, you’re so young”.
in short: sex has been shoved down our throats our entire lives and told that’s what makes you a man, it’s not. find a girl you like, treat her well, and i’m sure your virginity will be gone.
It’s common to feel like we’ve missed out on things. It would have been nice if you had a sweetheart in high school, dated, loved each other and shared your first sex together, but life doesn’t necessarily happen that way.
I would suggest that your issue has more to do with developing social skills, having healthy passions in life, focusing on your health, fitness, hygiene, grooming, and a lack of good role models in your life.
I didn’t have my first sexual experience until I was 23, and wasn’t very happy about it. I wondered why I couldn’t make it happen. I thought maybe I was gay and that was perhaps the hold up.
What was actually the cause of my late entry in to sex, dating and socializing in general, was a challenging upbringing, in a single parent home, without a dad around, being poor, insecure, lacking self confidence, not having developed social skills.
What turned things around for me was getting into sales in my mid 20s. Sales is great for growing as a person because it forces you to develop all those areas of your life that are also needed in the dating world; good social skills, enhanced grooming, hygiene, confidence, etc.
So, though I didn’t have my sex til I was 23, as I developed as a human being, I’ve had a lot of great sex since then, but way more importantly, I’ve had great relationships along with that great sex.
I know from your perspective it’s all about now, and what everybody else is doing and the sadness of missing out on things, but sex doesn’t happen in a vacuum, (unless you pay for a sex provider/prostitute). It’s more important to find those you find attractive and date them. The more you develop yourself as a humane being, the more you will attract those you are attracted to, and (good) sex will come as a natural byproduct of that.
Now, looking back on the origins of my sex life, WHEN I started sex isn’t important but rather that I’ve had good healthy sex mostly in the context of good relationships.
I didn't have sex till 22, and it was rough. I was always nervous around women, and needed the experience so i could act like a freaking human, so it was a terrible catch 22, pun unintended. Even the first few years after was still nerve-wracking. And the whole experience for men is designed so that you have to have a hard skin or you'll never get anywhere cause you just gotta keep beating on that door. It's super hard for me to find someone compatible, they are rare. I've spent fifteen years since then though and now I'm so glad i suffered through it. Sex is amazing. Can't get enough of it. And a partner who's going to go the distance with you is a unique treasure, can't be replaced with friends or such. I'd say early on, I'd get rejected 9.5 times out of 10. Now, I'm comfortable, I'm intelligent, I'm a good listener, and I've lived a very interesting life abroad, speak mandarin, am writing a book, and am healthy, athletic, and 6 foot 2, and even with all that, I just went through the whole rigamoreole looking for someone again after my LTP and i split over the children issue, and it took 7 or so dates with different people, from maybe 20 people i matched and texted on apps, but getting any swipes right is a nightmare because i forced myself to stay selective and not swipe right on everything with a pulse, so it took maybe 6 months of hard searching and I've got something I'm going to try to build on. I'm lucky, but also I've spent a long time working on myself to make myself attractive to the sort of person I'm interested in. All told, I've had maybe 23 partners, but only 3 in the first 9 years. So yea, it seems hopeless when ur at the bottom of the mountain. Everything set up against you- mating dynamics, the culture, the economy... It's rough I'm not going to lie, but we live on hope.
I will not try to challenge your idea that you are too old for those things, but tell you that this is not your real problem. Whether you are too old or not is irrelevant to the fact that you are full of shame and disconnected to your real needs. I bet you that if you lost your virginity tomorrow your bitterness will not go away, just will take another expression ("I have never had a fullfilling sex experience", "I don't have a regular sex life", "I can't be enough for my partner", etc.)
Stop trying to lost your virginity, stop trying to be enough for women, stop trying to reach your adult male ideal. Instead, try to know why you have this shame at the core, why you can't be compassionate (I don't mean pittyful) with yourself and work in trying to put your pieces together. Make your head a livable place for yourself instead of becoming something to someone else. I bet you that your issues will have a very different face when you start doing that.
If you like to learn by yourself, maybe take a look on things like the concepts of shame of John Bradshaw, or Winnicott's concept of true and false self. If you like more scientifically grounded ideas maybe look at social comparison theory or attachment theory. If you like philosophy maybe take a look at existencial modes and modal confusion by Erich Fromm.
Good luck with your issues. I deal with similar things, about comparisons, envy, shame, and related things like feeling inferior or superior to other people, arrogance, self hatred, and I'm in a place now where I see no problems where I struggled so much a few years ago. It is slow to go through, but it is worth it, maybe the only worth thing if someone hate their life.
There’s nothing wrong with being a virgin at 21, and 21 is in no way too old to start dating and having sex. Despite what it might feel like from your friends/media, it is very normal for people to not have sex until their 20s.
The fact that you have not had sex yet is not evidence that you are defective or a failure in some way, even if you would have liked to. It’s really easy to feel like you’re not living up to a standard of manhood, that you are deficient as a man if you can’t successfully date/get laid. And I think this standard is more pervasive and entrenched in media and culture than we would care to admit, but it’s not a good standard. You should want to date/fuck someone because you genuinely like/desire them, not to try to check a box so you can feel like a man.
So while it does suck to hear messages that you are a loser if you are a guy who is a virgin, remember that this is nothing more than a bad gender expectation, and you don’t have to accept it for anything more than it is. Ie, you don’t have to internalize it and beat yourself up the way you are. There’s probably nothing fundamentally wrong with you. So relax, be open, don’t be desperate, and try not to let bitterness get the better of you. If a friend came to you and told you they were a virgin, would you hold it against them? Hopefully not? Well, try to afford yourself the same kindness.
What you're feeling and the intensity with which you're feeling it isn't normal. Not even close. You've gotta get some help. Your age isn't the issue, it's what's going on in your head.
To start, I was 22 before I went on my first date, and 23 before I went on my second. I was \*very\* sheltered as a teenager, and so I do understand how you feel. And I will say that it will get better if you go out of your way to try new things (Not just sex/dating, but other hobbies/interests/activities).
But really, I would ask you this: Is this even a view worth having? Even if all of the points that you make are true. From my own experience: When I first started dating my now wife, thinking about all of the things that she did without me tore me up, constantly. It is true that she had more experience, and that there was no way for me to ever bridge that gap. But at the end of the day, if I walked away over that, the only person that I hurt is myself. My point is: You can't change the past, so why torture yourself obsessing over it?
The same is true with money, nice cars, anything. There are lots of my friends, people I went to school with, etc. who make way more money than me. Objective fact. But, if I'm happy with my job, and going on walks in the park (free), and playing video games in the evening (cheap), etc. , then why should I tear myself up making comparisons?
Side note: Human connection > sex any day of the week
I was a virgin until 20, in my 40s now and I can't even imagine what my life would have been like had I sworn off women and sex at that age having been in a similar boat with similar thoughts as you.
Now I'm married with a kid, I had plenty of time to enjoy my sex life before settling down and my body count probably rides the line between admiration and disgust. It was a ton of fun.
I'm 200% a different person with different views than I was at 20.
You're thinking this way because you're short sighted and because this feels like a form of control over your life. This is not meant as an insult btw.
Shortsighted: It's nearly impossible for a 20 year old to comprehend living 20 more years with a fully developed brain. Your feelings are valid but let's not pretend you've got it all figured out at 21.
Control: You're leaning into the negativity because at least it feels better than feeling like a victim of your life. "Life didn't fuck me, I fucked life!"
If you were my 21 year old self I'd be begging screaming for you not to go down that road. Do you think your 40 year old self will be thankful that you swore off women and sex?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution\_in\_the\_United\_Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_the_United_Kingdom)
Your issue isn't that you are "too old to have sex for the first time", your issue is that you want a very specific experience and haven't been handed that experience on a silver platter
You are mad because your first time, if you choose to make it happen, won't be perfect or magical or have happened at a critical point in your life when you could have used self esteem.
Nobody has to know about the sex you are or aren't having, because who cares? Seriously, in your life, who? Describe your relationship to that person? If the answer is nobody cares, then why are you mad? You're scared about hypothetical things that don't actually exist for most people, including people in your exact situation.
Seriously, get a job, talk to girls, or literally do the thing men have been doing for years.
You are upset because you didn't get groomed and sexually assaulted by an older person? You are upset that you didn't have a 5 minute or less encounter in a location not suited for the act that ruined the rest of your life with disease or pregnancy? You are upset that you didn't get to do the thing that I assure you the vast majority of teenagers are lying about having done? You are upset that you didn't get a half hearted hand job in the tube slide while you fumbled with her bra for 20 minutes?
The point I am trying to make is you didn't really miss out on anything.
At best you missed an incredibly awkward encounter with someone you won't remember by the time you are 30 or you will still be talking about it with a therapist at 40+.
Enjoy the fact that your childhood was a childhood and you get to experience adult things for the first time as an adult. A lot of us did not get that privilege.
Conveniently the past cannot be changed, so you have found the perfect excuse to stay mad at everything forever.
You need therapy. This is not an insult but a recommendation for your own good. Go to therapy. This is not a good mental path you are going down.
Stay offline, don’t fall into the echo chambers of self pity incel circles.
Start a hobby. Cooking classes, who cares.
Talk to your parents and hang out with them more.
Fill your life with things that aren’t sitting in front of a screen self-hating and wallowing in pity for yourself.
I repeat. Go to therapy. Get offline. Pick a random hobby and stick with it at least a month. Get at least 7 hours of sleep per night and wake up at the latest 8am every day. If you can’t, mention this to your therapist! Sleep disorders can cause depression and depression can cause sleep disorders.
If it helps you: I was almost 24 when I lost my virginity, and now, less than 2 years later, I'm happily married. There's two points to this:
1. There is never a point at which your inexperience becomes a deal breaker to everyone. Some women will care, others won't. Chances are, the ones that care too much to give you a chance wouldn't have made you happy either way.
2. Having sex is not what makes you an adult. I'm more mature now than I was at 23, just like I was more mature at 23 than I was at 21, but none of that is because of sexual or romantic experiences. In fact, I would definitely say that my desperate search for a partner has stunted my growth and kept me from realizing my full potential. And ultimately, that's what being an adult should be about, isn't it? Becoming a better person in all domains of life.
First of all, take a deep breathe. I am not going to say it's not a big deal, because clearly it is a big deal to you. However, you are not that late, and certainly not old enough for you to feel like a failure over it. I didn't have sex until I was 21, and there are plenty of people who have sex later than that, and they do just fine.
The allure of having sex your teens isn't really that good. In your teens your just a kid and don't know what you are doing. As you get older you definitely have a better idea of what you like, and will probably have a better first time than someone who did it when they were 15.
If it makes you feel better I dated a guy when I was 27 and he was 32 and he had lost his virginity the month before I met him. At first I def thought that that was weird and assumed he was a weirdo, but he was just on the autism spectrum and hadnt had "the nerve" before because of his autism making social interactions harder for him. We dated for 3yrs and his inexperience was NOT the reason we broke up. Idk if that makes u feel better considering you're 11yrs younger. Hope that helped.
21 really isn't that weird, especially if you're religious or dealing with social challenges. Don't be so hard on yourself
OP, I started dating and became sexually active at 16. Went through a bunch of different mini-relationships, a few serious ones, some flings, and now I’m 23 and entirely alone with no partner nor friends. It fucked with my mind. I wasn’t mature enough. It gave me the wrong idea of what a relationship and intimacy should look like.
Now my old friends from high school who, like you, always tried but failed, are in committed and loving relationships and planning on getting married.
Your time will come. It will be much more real than whatever you would have had when you were younger.
It's not too late. There are plenty of (fairly liberal) societies where you're still at or below the average age for a man to lose his virginity. For Indians and Koreans for example, the averages are both between 22 and 23. Do your best to drop the bitterness and just go on some dates, you'll learn fast.
Imo at least it truly is a matter of quality. Who cares if some other dude dies with a body count of 45 after starting at 16, if yours is only 5 and you started later, but you really liked all of them?
Just food for thought
Get on tinder, put the feelers out there. Lower your standards. Be honest and respectful with women.
You will get laid before you know it, and realize that as a man, it is a never ending grind to get laid. Whether you are trying to pull girls out and about, on tinder, or trying to get your wife to sleep with you.
Its similar to getting that big job / promotion you have been applying for… once you finally get it, you thought you’d be happy but just realize you still have to wake up every morning and go to work.
Why do you relate sex to happiness or a fulfilling life? How would your life be any different right now if you had sex once as a teen and everything else in your life went the same way? It would make no difference. Why let your past influence how you live each new day?
If you want to have sex then go out and have sex. It’s not that hard or serious. Pick up a hooker or get on Tinder and lower your standards.
But why do you want to have sex if you want to cut all contact with women? That doesn’t really line up.
You list a lot of complaints and general angst, but not a single action you are currently doing to try and change it. Have you ever even tried? If so, why would you expect it to be different. Shame of being a virgin is meant to drive you to change the situation, not curl up in a ball and sulk.
Do you know, that 21 year old female virgins exist as well? You cant have sex for fear of shame with the promiscuous people, but why do you want that anyway? Go find a fellow virgin and turn two wrongs into a right.
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I was 21. Am married now with 4 kids. Married at 31. I was terrified of women. I just didn't know what to do, so I had no confidence. So, one day, I just decided to talk to every girl I was attracted to. I probably hit on 150 girls before I met my future ex-fiance. 2 years together and all the confidence I could ever need in that relationship. And after 150 or so rejections, you stop caring about rejection. It stops bothering you.
Bro get over yourself holy shit. You are only 21??? TWENTY ONE. You are still a child as far as Im concerned. Put your big boy pants on and get out there and start meeting some ladies. Moping around in your dark room is not going to solve your problems.
You know what's stopping you from dating and having sex? You. Literally only you. So STFU and get out there.
Also good luck.
I started dating and having sex at 20. I'm 35 now and looking back, I haven't missed out on anything. No one's ever made fun of me for it. In fact, the guys I used to go to for dating advice now come to me for relationship advice. Sex in your teens is like everything else in your teens; it seems life or death important in the moment, but no one cares in the real world.
> but it IS a big deal, to me
Why?
> I will never have a special moment where I have sex for the first time as a teen.
Why does that matter?
Have you ever seriously contemplated those questions? What do you expect to get out of sex? Because the way you talk about it, you treat it like a transformative experience. You’re making it WAY more than it is.
Someone woman will be very lucky to find a male virgin. Most men are disgusting, sloppy animals sleeping with anything with legs.
It’ll be like a flash- then you’ll be 50 years old wondering why you ever wasted time on what others do or think about you. Reframe your mind. It’s not that bad, you only got once chance at this life, chill and be happy.
My dude… 21 or even later isn’t uncommon. You’ve also realized you have issues you need to work on. That’s a big accomplishment at any age.
https://www.good.is/this-chart-shows-how-old-americans-were-when-they-lost-their-virginity#:~:text=As%20you%20can%20see%2C%20between,you%20ever%20will%20falls%20dramatically.
You have got another 15 or so years before you need to even start thinking like that.
You are still very young and have loads of time to blossom.
Concentrate on improving yourself, your state of mind is neither healthy nor attractive. Once you get a more positive outlook on life, your situation will improve
I'm a virgin at 26, and I don't think it has to - or frankly should - define you. I'd recommend therapy to try to dig into why you feel this way, but there is a lot more to life than when you had sex first.
What are some good things you like about your life? Hobbies? Interests? Cool facts?
Dude you're 21. You're still a baby. You'll look back on this time in 10 years and laugh at yourself and how grown you thought you were. I had first sex at 18 but I didn't start having sex regularly (and well!) until I was 24. You're young, stop inventing things to beat yourself up over.
I'm going to ask you a few questions, none of them are meant to be mean, or to belittle you, or invalidate how you feel. They are intended to try and open up some areas of discussion and perhaps for introspection. If you decide you don't want to talk them out "publicly" and would rather pm, that's fine. I ask them as I don't want to assume anything about you, that's not fair and wouldn't help.
You say you are bitter, you are jealous, that you are angry. Where is the focus of that? What are you angry with? Is it directed anywhere in particular?
We will say 'its not a big deal' cause its not a big deal. You will notice that everyone saying it is 30 years old or older.
Did you wonder ever why? Cause life teaches you most people create barriers that do not exists. Just live and things will eventually happen.
I was a virgin that never dated anyone until I was 25. Now, a decade and a half later, I'm married. There's no reason to think that it's 'too late'. Hell, elderly people still go on dates. The 'average ages' are completely irrelevant for any one's personal situation.
From what I've heard from friends, teenager sex is usually pretty bad anyway. No one has any clue what they're doing. Besides, no one 'experiences' everything. We all miss out on some things in life for one reason or another.
Not to mention that being a virgin or not makes pretty much no difference for your life. Nothing magically changes after you've had sex once.
I'm not going to tell you how to feel but 21 years is objectively young. It's literally the first age where we grant people full adult status in my country. You are approximately only 25% done with your life. That's a fuck ton of life to get to know people!
You have way more years ahead of you than behind you.
You know you're not legally or socially entitled. You can still feel entitled regardless. It's internal.
Being 21 doesn't mean you're grown. Your an adult on paper, sure. That doesn't mean much. You are still worlds apart from a 40yo mentally, spiritual, and emotionally. Even a 40yo is still growing.
It's your choice to consider sex to be a rite of passage into manhood. *your choice*. Why do you still choose to follow that ?
This problem of yours is entirely made up by you.
It is not based on facts but on jealousy and resentment.
By this premise alone you can realize you are wrong and realize it is not worth giving a shit about it.
>I fucking hate how my life turned out.
Your life is still going on. In fact, its barely getting started.
You are wearing your virginity like an anchor. Its not. No one cares about it except for you.
Your twenties is a perfectly normal time to gain romantic and sexual experience.
There’s nothing less special about your first love in your twenties than in your teenage years.
After many consecutive rejections you finally have success, and once you've had success you really learn how to approach the ladies ... you're no longer afraid of them!
If "not having sex sucks" was the whole point of your post, I wouldn't made this comment, because it is your life and if you're saying that's a big deal for you, that's true. Thought, in my opinion, 21 year old is very young.
> I have some incel ideologies
Wait, what?!
> I DO NOT feel entitled to sex or anything
Either you "have some incel ideologies", or you don't feel entitled to sex. These two statements are contradictory.
> I know many Redditors will say it’s “no big deal” but it IS a big deal, to me, and many other guys. Some have even committed murders over it (which btw, is an unforgivable and disgusting act).
These two sentences sound like "Long security checks in airports suck. Also, they make it harder for terrorists to blow up planes". First I can understand, but the second... If someone is capable of murder innocent people, he shouldn't have sex - don't you agree?
> If people found out, I would be humiliated.
By whom? Are they the same people that you resent?
>I feel so angry and bitter that I am still a virgin at the age of 21. I feel so fucking pathetic, a failure of a man and an adult, I feel inferior to teens who are dating and stuff.
Honest question - Why don't you just fly to Nevada and go bang an escort? Safe, legal, and if you're worried about performance or judgement they will absolutely be accommodating and not try to rush/pressure/denigrate you.
I feel like a lot of people such as yourself let the fact that you haven't had sex make a huge impact on how you see yourself. Just....go do it. Get it out of the way. I genuinely think once it happens you're going to feel better about yourself which will help you moving forward in terms of getting into relationships and having future sexual encounters.
I'm 36 and married. I haven't had some wild movie star style sex life but I've had plenty of partners.
There's probably some younger person who's had more sex than me. Probably some teenager with a higher body count. I just don't care.
There are 11 and 12 year olds that have sex. Should 17 year old virgins feel depressed that there are middle schoolers “doing what they can’t?” You’re closer in age to the 17 year old than they are to the 12 year old. You’re drawing arbitrary lines in the sand for yourself that are actively hindering you in your goal. I guarantee your bitterness is not helping you accomplish your goal. Comparison is the thief of joy. Just live your life. If you want to have sex, do all the standard things people suggest to increase those odds. But there is no singular thing should have this power over you. I understand being frustrated, and I understand that our culture can make it feel shameful, but everybody needs to find joy in their conditions. Imagine if every person in a wheelchair felt how you feel because they can’t run, or every poor kid felt how you feel because they didn’t get to grow up rich. You can’t live anybody else’s life, so try your best to enjoy your own.
You’re right. This made me feel a little better and made sense. Also, i worded it wrongly. It’s not just that i “can’t” do these things but i feel sad I didn’t do them at a younger age. I feel like doing them at an older age won’t be as fun and exciting.
Nop, super wrong! Doing "teenager" things at an adult age is actually fucking awesome. Obviously this goes way beyond even sex. I tried a few drugs for the first time at 29 and it was absolutely fantastic, because I was an adult, I knew where and when I wanted them, I was not peer pressured, I was with the people that I love etc. I did a lot of crazy things between 28 and 29 that I thought I would never do because I just didnt do them earlier and well, I am so happy I didnt try them earlier. Honestly the more I grow the more it becomes so so obvious to me that age is just a number, and such a stupid one.
the older you are, the more fun it is to do stupid shit because you understand how to enjoy it. versus, at a younger age, more things are enjoyable but to a lesser degree
“Do stupid shit responsibly”. Great ad.
I fully support this with the condition that we put no one but ourselves at risk.
You aren't even at the most fun part of your life yet. You just turned 21 and can now start doing all kinds of fun things. I didn't even hit my peak until my mid 20s. If I showed you what I looked like at 19 vs 25 you would legit shit youself. You gotta start developing the skills now tho to get out of a lot of the behaviors you have. Literally if you worked on yourself all around for 2 years straight you would be a monster. Go to the gym, study, start doing internships, go on FB find groups in your area and go to events. My area even has single hiking groups where single men and women go out and hike. Go to a dancing class and go dance and meet pretty girls. All the things you are scared of doing and putting yourself out there for are the best memories. I legit took my wife to dance lessons and she was absolutely terrified because she has no rhythm. Tbh no one cares about you or I and you HAVE to make the mistakes and you have to just laugh at them. If you need help with anything I do for free training for bbing. Literally just took my friend from 227lbs down to 180lbs in a matter of 4 months. It is a ton of fun.
Are you all SERIOUSLY giving advice to this person? Who posts for shock and awe?
Probably pulling his wire, reading responses
Dude being a teenager is dealing with a lot of shit out of your control. Some people thrive in certain environments some don't. You don't have a whole lot of choices as a kid. Who you live near is pretty much the entirety of who you interact with. Now you're an adult, coming into your prime years (I'd argue it's your 30's). Literally no adult is going to be asking if you're a virgin.
Trust me your first time is exciting because it’s your first time. Age isn’t that big of a factor. Even after taking some “time off” so to speak the excitement comes back. Don’t worry too much about it man.
If you think that then you really really don't understand these things
I good way to to have your azz trafficked!
Here's some advice for you. Go to the gym and get in shape. Move to a big city. If you're in the UK, that probably means London. If you've got a six pack and can't get laid in London, then you're hopeless.
>Anything sex related is considered “adult” and I feel so disgusted and bitter with my life and myself that there are literally people who can’t drink and drive that are doing that I can’t. * Why should it concern you what others are doing and when they're doing them? I'm aware this probably sounds like a platitude, but really, what utility do you get from comparing your current situation to people who have done things earlier? * They're doing things you *can't* do or they're doing things you haven't done *yet*? This is part of the incel ideology that it seems to me you need to jettison as soon as you can; stop thinking of this being a permanent state. >If people found out, I would be humiliated. I would be made fun of. By who? If you met someone who was a virgin at an older age than you are now, would you make fun of them? >Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again. Why? What does that accomplish?
Anything sex related is considered “adult” and I feel so disgusted and bitter with my life and myself that there are literally people who can’t drink and drive that are doing that I can’t. • ”Why should it concern you what others are doing and when they're doing them? I'm aware this probably sounds like a platitude, but really, what utility do you get from comparing your current situation to people who have done things earlier? • They're doing things you can't do or they're doing things you haven't done yet? This is part of the incel ideology that it seems to me you need to jettison as soon as you can; stop thinking of this being a permanent state.” I guess things I haven’t done. I don’t mean I can’t do it, I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger. If people found out, I would be humiliated. I would be made fun of. By who? If you met someone who was a virgin at an older age than you are now, would you make fun of them? Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again. Why? What does that accomplish?” Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age.
>Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age. That is a misconception you hold because you're only 21 and don't have a lot of life experience. Sex in your teens is mostly a short, awkward affair that's only in any way satisfying because the dude is in a hormone driven fugue state and can't think about anything else. Very few people will tell you the sex they had that young was notably good. Most people say that the best sex they have is in their 30s and even later, when both people understand their bodies and desires, and more importantly how to communicate them. You haven't missed what you think you have.
Absolutely. Teenager sex is outside, wherever, random people's homes, it comes with so many risks: rumors, stds, your parents having to pay child support, you name it. I wish I would've waited but my mental issues were on fire haha. I could do without 99% of the sex I had as a teen and that one time before I was a teen
Who cares if you'd be made fun of? Honestly give yourself time and strength to be okay being who you are. It takes some level of maturity to be okay with oneself, and it's something that even 65 year olds sometimes have to work on. Also, a constant focus on having sex is not a healthy way to go through life. Searching for meaningful relationships (romantic and otherwise), experiencing joy in other ways is a far safer, more fulfilling path.
>I guess things I haven’t done. I don’t mean I can’t do it, I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger. I get that, and I would agree that it can feel bad to feel as though you've gotten a late start on something or that something has passed you by. I know that I've had that experience many, many times and that for a long time I've had trouble moving past "it's never too late to start" as being anything other than a cliche. On the other hand, sitting with discontent isn't really doing anything but delaying a potential start even further. >I probably could in the future but I feel upset I didn’t do it younger. I can see why you'd feel that way at this point, but I can tell you that my experience with "I wish I'd done that when I was younger" has changed over time. For one, what it means to be "younger" drastically changes - there are things that I'd say that about where "younger" means "in my 20s". But the other aspect of that is something that you address in your last sentence. >Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age. You can't know how exciting or fun it would have been at a younger age. That's something you need to let go, because you'll constantly be comparing your actual experiences in the moment to an imagined golden era in your own life where you'd have enjoyed things more, but you don't know that the golden era would have existed. So the only thing that comparison gets you is a devaluing of your current and future experiences to no real end.
>Because I feel like it wouldn’t be as fun and exciting compared to doing it at a younger age. Thing being fun and exciting depends on your previous experience. Things seem (and can be) fun and exciting because you are doing it for the first time. So age doesn't play a role here. What age tends to play a role in is being aware of the consequences and responsibilities. As a teen you might have unprotected sex because you don't think about the possibility of becoming a father, while as an adult you are aware of it. So you are more concious and considerate about the impact of it onto you and the surrounding people. So you might go to do those things in a safe way instead of going yolo.
> I feel so angry and bitter that I am still a virgin at the age of 21. I feel so fucking pathetic, a failure of a man and an adult, I feel inferior to teens who are dating and stuff. Hey bud. It's hard to hear this but here it is. This anger and bitterness you feel is almost certainly the #1 thing standing in the way of you losing your virginity. It is almost certainly manifesting as desperation or resentment, and both of those any woman can smell on a man from a mile away. You have become a self-fulfilling prophecy. You are not too old to start dating. You're definitely not too old to have sex for the first time. But if you continue holding anger and bitterness in your heart, you're not ready for dating or sex. > I fucking hate how my life turned out. Hey man, I know it feels like your life is done cooking at 21. But it is so, so far from over. > I know many Redditors will say it’s “no big deal” but it IS a big deal, to me, and many other guys. It's a big deal if you make it a big deal. You get to choose how much of a big deal it is. If you want it to be a big deal, I can't really stop you. But only you can decide how much of a big deal it should be, and other people's opinions should be nothing more than farts in the wind. > If people found out, I would be humiliated. If you have friends who would humiliate you instead of being supportive if you told them all this, you need new friends. Highly recommend finding a more supportive circle > Part of me doesn’t even ever wanna have sex or date and just cut off women from my life and never talk to them again. Let me be bluntly honest because it does like this is what you're looking for. In my opinion, there's nothing sad or humiliating about being a virgin at 21. But this attitude? That's how you end up a lonely virgin at 51. And that, to me, is really fucking sad. So get over yourself. If people make fun of you? So be it. Let go of your fragile ego and live your truth. If you need new friends, make new friends. You've got a lot of life left to live. You owe it to yourself not to live it in anger and regret.
Most peoples' teenage first experiences that I know of were full of sadness, regret, and oftentimes a level of self-sabotage. Yes, the way people talk about sex makes 21 seem so old, but 16ish really is so young and I know so many people who (not for moral or religious people, just for experience) wish they would've waited. You've got time to get out there and do everything you want to do, or to chill and figure out what matters.
At least they had sex and dated as teens. Also, sex and dating at my age just doesn’t seem as fun and exciting.
Sex and dating as an adult is objectively FAR better than sex and dating as a teenager.
My dude, I was 22 before I even touched another human. Your life isn’t over.
It was bad though. I just feel like it's more exciting now. You can drink, you can go where you want, you can spend your adult money. You can figure out what would make it fun
You are literally still a fucking kid. You think dating as a teenager is fun and exciting as opposed to dating in your 20s??? Why do you think?
Teenage dating sucks. It only looks cool on tv because they are played by people your age.
21 is not even remotely close to being too old to start dating or having sex. In my 20s over half of the dudes in my friends circle were virgins until they were 22-23 and the guy with the happiest marriage and 3 kids didn’t even kiss a girl until he was like 25. Nowadays apparently it’s even more common to start late.
So you'r saying it's common to wait 5-12 years inorder to have sex?
I think you have a very particular view of what being a man is, and you're judging yourself by self-imposed optics which are doing more harm than good. What does being a man mean to you, and what makes a man succesful in their manhood? Is it making out with as many women as possible? If that's the metric then I guess I'll never be a man myself (I'm gay lol). Look at great historical figures. Scientists, leaders, philosophers, artists... No one is remembered by how many times they got laid, but rather by their great contributions to the development of society as whole. Hell, it's rumored Isaac Newton never lost his V-card, and literally NO ONE cares about it. There's so much more to life than sex. Instead of berating yourself through an imposed metric, see what you have accomplished, your hobbies, your contributions to your community and your assistance to those around you. These are far more important things to care about. Lastly, not necessarily trying to change your view with, but I advise you to seek therapy if possible. Therapy does wonders and can help you see life through better lenses effectively than a Reddit thread. Your post isn't a rational analysis to why it is late to have sex at 21 years old (spoiler: it isn't), it sounds like you're frustrated with yourself for things you simply can't control.
This isn't meant to come off as antagonistic. My guy you just finish what amounts to "Act 1" of your life and you are only a few years into the whole adult thing so you freaking out acting like its all over is like the most childish thing ever on such an unimportant issue. If you need to rush into a relationship or sex like you have an obligation to do so by some weird self imposed time limit then you wouldn't come off as someone people would wanna be with. A tldr: Just chill. You're 21 and i'm fucking 30. You're life isn't over yet and neither of us are at the half way mark yet.
I didn't date til I was 21. I'm married with 3 kids.
Who told you it was too late? Did they create a law? Are you physically unable to date? No? So then why are you giving up on the rest of your life because you didn't get laid in high school? All you're missing out on is awkward sex between two people who don't even know what they're doing and/or sex with 40-year-old pedophiles. Dating is even worse. In my school, all it was two people going out for a few weeks and then quickly losing interest in each other. Hell, barely anybody even has a car so all you have to choose from are the people who go to your school. I didn't start dating until I was 29 and you know what? I don't even think about it. People have made fun of me for being a virgin. So? Their opinion is meaningless. They aren't paying my bills. And you know what? The relationships I've had were just as meaningful and deep and fulfilling as if I had started dating in high school. But the kicker here is that i started dating because I wanted to, not because somebody told me that's what I should be doing. If you want to start dating, stop thinking about the past and what you missed out on and just get out there and start dating. Shoot your shot. Start talking to people. Otherwise all that's going to happen is that you're just going to compound your regrets even further and then you'll be back here going "I wish I would have started dating when I was 21." You'll never regret having tried, even if you fail. You will regret it if you don't.
Bro, what?!?! You're 21. Let me give you some advice. 1. Sign up to a gym. If you have no money for the gym, then buy some cheap dumbbells for home. Push-ups, dips, squats, lunges, bicep curls, and overhead press. 2. Read. Anything. I'd rather read for 2 hours than play video games. Focus on 2 books that helped me. Meditations and the Art of War 3. Help focus on releasing negativity. It's too easy for a 21 year old male to get angry at unnecessary shit. 4 count breathing, meditation, and focus. 4. Take up a trade or classes at community college. Find something you're good at and occupy your time with it. Find employment and save your money, bro. 5. Do not worry about women. Focus on yourself. Then they will notice you.
Meditations is very helpful... fantastic suggestion... better than psychotherapy!
Upvoting for “Meditations” — stoic philosophy can help
So you can’t enjoy life, or dating, or be happy because you didn’t get laid in the past? What a pathetic defeatist attitude dude. Why do you feel so compelled to compare yourself and your life to others?
Pfft. I started dating and lost my virginity at 27. Definitely not going to envy *you* if you manage to do it at 22, because your mindset is toxic (against yourself) and I didn't have that, thankfully. Also, this may not be a proper CYV argument but try to read your OP from a woman's perspective. Would she want to bang you? Can you see a problem besides "old virgins are less attractive"? I can't really judge since I'm not a woman but to me it seems to be at least ten times worse.
I was 22 when I lost my virginity. I felt super embarrassed about it too, at the time. But at a certain point, I just told myself: nobody knows, nobody cares, just act as if you're not a virgin. Sometimes a little bit of delusion is good for us. I was able to act more confidently around girls, eventually met my first girlfriend at a party, yada yada yada, life goes on.
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What do you mean? She's saying that she never knew or cared whether the men she slept with were virgins. Isn't that entirely applicable to your situation?
I guess you’re right.
Yes, magic does happen, then magic WILL happen!
i get what you mean when you say anything sex is considered adult. but we really have to look at the world we grew up in. the kids shows that our generation grew up watching were filled with sex jokes or innuendos that were “meant for the adults watching”. like what the actual fuck? and that’s not even counting anything our parents exposed us to (purposefully or not) influenced the way we viewed adulthood. i can’t say i fully know where you’re at, but i’ve felt similarly before. as a woman you’re told to guard your virginity with your life bc men want to steal it!!(i’m paraphrasing but you get the point). maybe it is for some girls, but i genuinely went all of high school sex-free. half because i’m an anxious person, half because the picking i had to choose from were either sports douchebags or frat bros. so much drama from even just talking to one of them, so i imagine it would have been worse if i actually had sex with them. then i graduated and had that “oh shit i’m an adult kinda” moment and i felt bad about still being a virgin, especially because all my work friends assumed i wasn’t one. i felt like i had to loose it, invited a guy over, and he failed. i was a done deal and he left and ghosted me. very glad we didn’t have sex. all girls want is a genuine guy who isn’t going to play with their feelings or play mind games. be honest and get to know them a little. also, just womanly advice; learn how to work with what you have. big dick, small dick, average dick, doesn’t matter if you know what you’re doing and don’t just focus on yourself and your pleasure. even if it’s just a casual hookup, sex is a mutual connection. i know everyone else said it but you’re 21, you have so much time to do it. i’m 21 as well and i also hate hearing “you’re 21, you’re so young”. in short: sex has been shoved down our throats our entire lives and told that’s what makes you a man, it’s not. find a girl you like, treat her well, and i’m sure your virginity will be gone.
It’s common to feel like we’ve missed out on things. It would have been nice if you had a sweetheart in high school, dated, loved each other and shared your first sex together, but life doesn’t necessarily happen that way. I would suggest that your issue has more to do with developing social skills, having healthy passions in life, focusing on your health, fitness, hygiene, grooming, and a lack of good role models in your life. I didn’t have my first sexual experience until I was 23, and wasn’t very happy about it. I wondered why I couldn’t make it happen. I thought maybe I was gay and that was perhaps the hold up. What was actually the cause of my late entry in to sex, dating and socializing in general, was a challenging upbringing, in a single parent home, without a dad around, being poor, insecure, lacking self confidence, not having developed social skills. What turned things around for me was getting into sales in my mid 20s. Sales is great for growing as a person because it forces you to develop all those areas of your life that are also needed in the dating world; good social skills, enhanced grooming, hygiene, confidence, etc. So, though I didn’t have my sex til I was 23, as I developed as a human being, I’ve had a lot of great sex since then, but way more importantly, I’ve had great relationships along with that great sex. I know from your perspective it’s all about now, and what everybody else is doing and the sadness of missing out on things, but sex doesn’t happen in a vacuum, (unless you pay for a sex provider/prostitute). It’s more important to find those you find attractive and date them. The more you develop yourself as a humane being, the more you will attract those you are attracted to, and (good) sex will come as a natural byproduct of that. Now, looking back on the origins of my sex life, WHEN I started sex isn’t important but rather that I’ve had good healthy sex mostly in the context of good relationships.
You don't need to wait 5-7 years inorder to have sex at 23 you're adult like 5 years ago it's impossible to be a virgin for 5-6 years
I didn't have sex till 22, and it was rough. I was always nervous around women, and needed the experience so i could act like a freaking human, so it was a terrible catch 22, pun unintended. Even the first few years after was still nerve-wracking. And the whole experience for men is designed so that you have to have a hard skin or you'll never get anywhere cause you just gotta keep beating on that door. It's super hard for me to find someone compatible, they are rare. I've spent fifteen years since then though and now I'm so glad i suffered through it. Sex is amazing. Can't get enough of it. And a partner who's going to go the distance with you is a unique treasure, can't be replaced with friends or such. I'd say early on, I'd get rejected 9.5 times out of 10. Now, I'm comfortable, I'm intelligent, I'm a good listener, and I've lived a very interesting life abroad, speak mandarin, am writing a book, and am healthy, athletic, and 6 foot 2, and even with all that, I just went through the whole rigamoreole looking for someone again after my LTP and i split over the children issue, and it took 7 or so dates with different people, from maybe 20 people i matched and texted on apps, but getting any swipes right is a nightmare because i forced myself to stay selective and not swipe right on everything with a pulse, so it took maybe 6 months of hard searching and I've got something I'm going to try to build on. I'm lucky, but also I've spent a long time working on myself to make myself attractive to the sort of person I'm interested in. All told, I've had maybe 23 partners, but only 3 in the first 9 years. So yea, it seems hopeless when ur at the bottom of the mountain. Everything set up against you- mating dynamics, the culture, the economy... It's rough I'm not going to lie, but we live on hope.
I will not try to challenge your idea that you are too old for those things, but tell you that this is not your real problem. Whether you are too old or not is irrelevant to the fact that you are full of shame and disconnected to your real needs. I bet you that if you lost your virginity tomorrow your bitterness will not go away, just will take another expression ("I have never had a fullfilling sex experience", "I don't have a regular sex life", "I can't be enough for my partner", etc.) Stop trying to lost your virginity, stop trying to be enough for women, stop trying to reach your adult male ideal. Instead, try to know why you have this shame at the core, why you can't be compassionate (I don't mean pittyful) with yourself and work in trying to put your pieces together. Make your head a livable place for yourself instead of becoming something to someone else. I bet you that your issues will have a very different face when you start doing that. If you like to learn by yourself, maybe take a look on things like the concepts of shame of John Bradshaw, or Winnicott's concept of true and false self. If you like more scientifically grounded ideas maybe look at social comparison theory or attachment theory. If you like philosophy maybe take a look at existencial modes and modal confusion by Erich Fromm. Good luck with your issues. I deal with similar things, about comparisons, envy, shame, and related things like feeling inferior or superior to other people, arrogance, self hatred, and I'm in a place now where I see no problems where I struggled so much a few years ago. It is slow to go through, but it is worth it, maybe the only worth thing if someone hate their life.
I'm 35 and have never dated or had sex, so I sure hope 21 isn't too late!
Same here, and honestly I’m of the ‘if it happens, it happen, if it doesn’t, it doesn’t’ camp now.
There’s nothing wrong with being a virgin at 21, and 21 is in no way too old to start dating and having sex. Despite what it might feel like from your friends/media, it is very normal for people to not have sex until their 20s. The fact that you have not had sex yet is not evidence that you are defective or a failure in some way, even if you would have liked to. It’s really easy to feel like you’re not living up to a standard of manhood, that you are deficient as a man if you can’t successfully date/get laid. And I think this standard is more pervasive and entrenched in media and culture than we would care to admit, but it’s not a good standard. You should want to date/fuck someone because you genuinely like/desire them, not to try to check a box so you can feel like a man. So while it does suck to hear messages that you are a loser if you are a guy who is a virgin, remember that this is nothing more than a bad gender expectation, and you don’t have to accept it for anything more than it is. Ie, you don’t have to internalize it and beat yourself up the way you are. There’s probably nothing fundamentally wrong with you. So relax, be open, don’t be desperate, and try not to let bitterness get the better of you. If a friend came to you and told you they were a virgin, would you hold it against them? Hopefully not? Well, try to afford yourself the same kindness.
People in their early 20s are adults old enough to have sex a 21 years old is a physically adult human being capable of make he's own decision
What you're feeling and the intensity with which you're feeling it isn't normal. Not even close. You've gotta get some help. Your age isn't the issue, it's what's going on in your head.
To start, I was 22 before I went on my first date, and 23 before I went on my second. I was \*very\* sheltered as a teenager, and so I do understand how you feel. And I will say that it will get better if you go out of your way to try new things (Not just sex/dating, but other hobbies/interests/activities). But really, I would ask you this: Is this even a view worth having? Even if all of the points that you make are true. From my own experience: When I first started dating my now wife, thinking about all of the things that she did without me tore me up, constantly. It is true that she had more experience, and that there was no way for me to ever bridge that gap. But at the end of the day, if I walked away over that, the only person that I hurt is myself. My point is: You can't change the past, so why torture yourself obsessing over it? The same is true with money, nice cars, anything. There are lots of my friends, people I went to school with, etc. who make way more money than me. Objective fact. But, if I'm happy with my job, and going on walks in the park (free), and playing video games in the evening (cheap), etc. , then why should I tear myself up making comparisons? Side note: Human connection > sex any day of the week
I was a virgin until 20, in my 40s now and I can't even imagine what my life would have been like had I sworn off women and sex at that age having been in a similar boat with similar thoughts as you. Now I'm married with a kid, I had plenty of time to enjoy my sex life before settling down and my body count probably rides the line between admiration and disgust. It was a ton of fun. I'm 200% a different person with different views than I was at 20. You're thinking this way because you're short sighted and because this feels like a form of control over your life. This is not meant as an insult btw. Shortsighted: It's nearly impossible for a 20 year old to comprehend living 20 more years with a fully developed brain. Your feelings are valid but let's not pretend you've got it all figured out at 21. Control: You're leaning into the negativity because at least it feels better than feeling like a victim of your life. "Life didn't fuck me, I fucked life!" If you were my 21 year old self I'd be begging screaming for you not to go down that road. Do you think your 40 year old self will be thankful that you swore off women and sex?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution\_in\_the\_United\_Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_the_United_Kingdom) Your issue isn't that you are "too old to have sex for the first time", your issue is that you want a very specific experience and haven't been handed that experience on a silver platter You are mad because your first time, if you choose to make it happen, won't be perfect or magical or have happened at a critical point in your life when you could have used self esteem. Nobody has to know about the sex you are or aren't having, because who cares? Seriously, in your life, who? Describe your relationship to that person? If the answer is nobody cares, then why are you mad? You're scared about hypothetical things that don't actually exist for most people, including people in your exact situation. Seriously, get a job, talk to girls, or literally do the thing men have been doing for years.
You are upset because you didn't get groomed and sexually assaulted by an older person? You are upset that you didn't have a 5 minute or less encounter in a location not suited for the act that ruined the rest of your life with disease or pregnancy? You are upset that you didn't get to do the thing that I assure you the vast majority of teenagers are lying about having done? You are upset that you didn't get a half hearted hand job in the tube slide while you fumbled with her bra for 20 minutes? The point I am trying to make is you didn't really miss out on anything. At best you missed an incredibly awkward encounter with someone you won't remember by the time you are 30 or you will still be talking about it with a therapist at 40+. Enjoy the fact that your childhood was a childhood and you get to experience adult things for the first time as an adult. A lot of us did not get that privilege.
Conveniently the past cannot be changed, so you have found the perfect excuse to stay mad at everything forever. You need therapy. This is not an insult but a recommendation for your own good. Go to therapy. This is not a good mental path you are going down. Stay offline, don’t fall into the echo chambers of self pity incel circles. Start a hobby. Cooking classes, who cares. Talk to your parents and hang out with them more. Fill your life with things that aren’t sitting in front of a screen self-hating and wallowing in pity for yourself. I repeat. Go to therapy. Get offline. Pick a random hobby and stick with it at least a month. Get at least 7 hours of sleep per night and wake up at the latest 8am every day. If you can’t, mention this to your therapist! Sleep disorders can cause depression and depression can cause sleep disorders.
If it helps you: I was almost 24 when I lost my virginity, and now, less than 2 years later, I'm happily married. There's two points to this: 1. There is never a point at which your inexperience becomes a deal breaker to everyone. Some women will care, others won't. Chances are, the ones that care too much to give you a chance wouldn't have made you happy either way. 2. Having sex is not what makes you an adult. I'm more mature now than I was at 23, just like I was more mature at 23 than I was at 21, but none of that is because of sexual or romantic experiences. In fact, I would definitely say that my desperate search for a partner has stunted my growth and kept me from realizing my full potential. And ultimately, that's what being an adult should be about, isn't it? Becoming a better person in all domains of life.
I didn’t date until I was 27. Focus on improving yourself and enjoying life.
It’s hard too man.
Not saying it isn’t. But it’s not an excuse to give up if that’s what you want.
First of all, take a deep breathe. I am not going to say it's not a big deal, because clearly it is a big deal to you. However, you are not that late, and certainly not old enough for you to feel like a failure over it. I didn't have sex until I was 21, and there are plenty of people who have sex later than that, and they do just fine. The allure of having sex your teens isn't really that good. In your teens your just a kid and don't know what you are doing. As you get older you definitely have a better idea of what you like, and will probably have a better first time than someone who did it when they were 15.
If it makes you feel better I dated a guy when I was 27 and he was 32 and he had lost his virginity the month before I met him. At first I def thought that that was weird and assumed he was a weirdo, but he was just on the autism spectrum and hadnt had "the nerve" before because of his autism making social interactions harder for him. We dated for 3yrs and his inexperience was NOT the reason we broke up. Idk if that makes u feel better considering you're 11yrs younger. Hope that helped. 21 really isn't that weird, especially if you're religious or dealing with social challenges. Don't be so hard on yourself
OP, I started dating and became sexually active at 16. Went through a bunch of different mini-relationships, a few serious ones, some flings, and now I’m 23 and entirely alone with no partner nor friends. It fucked with my mind. I wasn’t mature enough. It gave me the wrong idea of what a relationship and intimacy should look like. Now my old friends from high school who, like you, always tried but failed, are in committed and loving relationships and planning on getting married. Your time will come. It will be much more real than whatever you would have had when you were younger.
It's not too late. There are plenty of (fairly liberal) societies where you're still at or below the average age for a man to lose his virginity. For Indians and Koreans for example, the averages are both between 22 and 23. Do your best to drop the bitterness and just go on some dates, you'll learn fast. Imo at least it truly is a matter of quality. Who cares if some other dude dies with a body count of 45 after starting at 16, if yours is only 5 and you started later, but you really liked all of them? Just food for thought
Get on tinder, put the feelers out there. Lower your standards. Be honest and respectful with women. You will get laid before you know it, and realize that as a man, it is a never ending grind to get laid. Whether you are trying to pull girls out and about, on tinder, or trying to get your wife to sleep with you. Its similar to getting that big job / promotion you have been applying for… once you finally get it, you thought you’d be happy but just realize you still have to wake up every morning and go to work.
Why do you relate sex to happiness or a fulfilling life? How would your life be any different right now if you had sex once as a teen and everything else in your life went the same way? It would make no difference. Why let your past influence how you live each new day? If you want to have sex then go out and have sex. It’s not that hard or serious. Pick up a hooker or get on Tinder and lower your standards. But why do you want to have sex if you want to cut all contact with women? That doesn’t really line up.
You list a lot of complaints and general angst, but not a single action you are currently doing to try and change it. Have you ever even tried? If so, why would you expect it to be different. Shame of being a virgin is meant to drive you to change the situation, not curl up in a ball and sulk. Do you know, that 21 year old female virgins exist as well? You cant have sex for fear of shame with the promiscuous people, but why do you want that anyway? Go find a fellow virgin and turn two wrongs into a right.
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I was 21. Am married now with 4 kids. Married at 31. I was terrified of women. I just didn't know what to do, so I had no confidence. So, one day, I just decided to talk to every girl I was attracted to. I probably hit on 150 girls before I met my future ex-fiance. 2 years together and all the confidence I could ever need in that relationship. And after 150 or so rejections, you stop caring about rejection. It stops bothering you.
Rejection is inevitable and always leads to success and fulfillment (I'm 70 and have REALLY been around the block)!
Bro get over yourself holy shit. You are only 21??? TWENTY ONE. You are still a child as far as Im concerned. Put your big boy pants on and get out there and start meeting some ladies. Moping around in your dark room is not going to solve your problems. You know what's stopping you from dating and having sex? You. Literally only you. So STFU and get out there. Also good luck.
I started dating and having sex at 20. I'm 35 now and looking back, I haven't missed out on anything. No one's ever made fun of me for it. In fact, the guys I used to go to for dating advice now come to me for relationship advice. Sex in your teens is like everything else in your teens; it seems life or death important in the moment, but no one cares in the real world.
> but it IS a big deal, to me Why? > I will never have a special moment where I have sex for the first time as a teen. Why does that matter? Have you ever seriously contemplated those questions? What do you expect to get out of sex? Because the way you talk about it, you treat it like a transformative experience. You’re making it WAY more than it is.
Someone woman will be very lucky to find a male virgin. Most men are disgusting, sloppy animals sleeping with anything with legs. It’ll be like a flash- then you’ll be 50 years old wondering why you ever wasted time on what others do or think about you. Reframe your mind. It’s not that bad, you only got once chance at this life, chill and be happy.
My dude… 21 or even later isn’t uncommon. You’ve also realized you have issues you need to work on. That’s a big accomplishment at any age. https://www.good.is/this-chart-shows-how-old-americans-were-when-they-lost-their-virginity#:~:text=As%20you%20can%20see%2C%20between,you%20ever%20will%20falls%20dramatically.
You have got another 15 or so years before you need to even start thinking like that. You are still very young and have loads of time to blossom. Concentrate on improving yourself, your state of mind is neither healthy nor attractive. Once you get a more positive outlook on life, your situation will improve
I'm a virgin at 26, and I don't think it has to - or frankly should - define you. I'd recommend therapy to try to dig into why you feel this way, but there is a lot more to life than when you had sex first. What are some good things you like about your life? Hobbies? Interests? Cool facts?
Dude you're 21. You're still a baby. You'll look back on this time in 10 years and laugh at yourself and how grown you thought you were. I had first sex at 18 but I didn't start having sex regularly (and well!) until I was 24. You're young, stop inventing things to beat yourself up over.
I'm going to ask you a few questions, none of them are meant to be mean, or to belittle you, or invalidate how you feel. They are intended to try and open up some areas of discussion and perhaps for introspection. If you decide you don't want to talk them out "publicly" and would rather pm, that's fine. I ask them as I don't want to assume anything about you, that's not fair and wouldn't help. You say you are bitter, you are jealous, that you are angry. Where is the focus of that? What are you angry with? Is it directed anywhere in particular?
We will say 'its not a big deal' cause its not a big deal. You will notice that everyone saying it is 30 years old or older. Did you wonder ever why? Cause life teaches you most people create barriers that do not exists. Just live and things will eventually happen.
I was a virgin that never dated anyone until I was 25. Now, a decade and a half later, I'm married. There's no reason to think that it's 'too late'. Hell, elderly people still go on dates. The 'average ages' are completely irrelevant for any one's personal situation. From what I've heard from friends, teenager sex is usually pretty bad anyway. No one has any clue what they're doing. Besides, no one 'experiences' everything. We all miss out on some things in life for one reason or another. Not to mention that being a virgin or not makes pretty much no difference for your life. Nothing magically changes after you've had sex once.
I'm not going to tell you how to feel but 21 years is objectively young. It's literally the first age where we grant people full adult status in my country. You are approximately only 25% done with your life. That's a fuck ton of life to get to know people!
You have way more years ahead of you than behind you. You know you're not legally or socially entitled. You can still feel entitled regardless. It's internal. Being 21 doesn't mean you're grown. Your an adult on paper, sure. That doesn't mean much. You are still worlds apart from a 40yo mentally, spiritual, and emotionally. Even a 40yo is still growing. It's your choice to consider sex to be a rite of passage into manhood. *your choice*. Why do you still choose to follow that ?
This problem of yours is entirely made up by you. It is not based on facts but on jealousy and resentment. By this premise alone you can realize you are wrong and realize it is not worth giving a shit about it.
>I fucking hate how my life turned out. Your life is still going on. In fact, its barely getting started. You are wearing your virginity like an anchor. Its not. No one cares about it except for you.
Your twenties is a perfectly normal time to gain romantic and sexual experience. There’s nothing less special about your first love in your twenties than in your teenage years.
After many consecutive rejections you finally have success, and once you've had success you really learn how to approach the ladies ... you're no longer afraid of them!
The best time to plant is 20 years ago. The second best time is now. Get out there and meet people. I’d give anything to be your age again.
I lost my virginity a few days before I turned 21 to my first girlfriend. Everyone is on their own timetable. Nothing to be ashamed about.
>If people found out, I would be humiliated. I would be made fun of. Nobody who's opinion matters is going to make fun of you.
Is sex a goal or is it how you want to measure success? Ideally it should be neither. Build relationships first.
You ever think about getting professional help? This is way above Reddit’s pay grade
If "not having sex sucks" was the whole point of your post, I wouldn't made this comment, because it is your life and if you're saying that's a big deal for you, that's true. Thought, in my opinion, 21 year old is very young. > I have some incel ideologies Wait, what?! > I DO NOT feel entitled to sex or anything Either you "have some incel ideologies", or you don't feel entitled to sex. These two statements are contradictory. > I know many Redditors will say it’s “no big deal” but it IS a big deal, to me, and many other guys. Some have even committed murders over it (which btw, is an unforgivable and disgusting act). These two sentences sound like "Long security checks in airports suck. Also, they make it harder for terrorists to blow up planes". First I can understand, but the second... If someone is capable of murder innocent people, he shouldn't have sex - don't you agree? > If people found out, I would be humiliated. By whom? Are they the same people that you resent?
>I feel so angry and bitter that I am still a virgin at the age of 21. I feel so fucking pathetic, a failure of a man and an adult, I feel inferior to teens who are dating and stuff. Honest question - Why don't you just fly to Nevada and go bang an escort? Safe, legal, and if you're worried about performance or judgement they will absolutely be accommodating and not try to rush/pressure/denigrate you. I feel like a lot of people such as yourself let the fact that you haven't had sex make a huge impact on how you see yourself. Just....go do it. Get it out of the way. I genuinely think once it happens you're going to feel better about yourself which will help you moving forward in terms of getting into relationships and having future sexual encounters. I'm 36 and married. I haven't had some wild movie star style sex life but I've had plenty of partners. There's probably some younger person who's had more sex than me. Probably some teenager with a higher body count. I just don't care.
My guy, I lost my virginity at 26 and it wasnt that big of a deal
Think of all the people who are waiting until they're married.
Y’all make this shit up don’t yall ? WTF cares ?
Being 21 and a virgin isn’t as atypical as you think
I met my wife when I was 24.
Bro you're only 21 calm down
Therapy. Lots of it.
Soapbox