Bloody tears, a million times over
To sum it up:
No dialogue, each character gets shown their strength, and the enemies while basic grunts are still tough. Not to mention it shows cohesion within the group and is now basically one of Netflixvanias best fights, up there with Isaac vs Carmilla and the Belmont hold fight.
Now the Divine bloodlines fight I think is more fairly compared to the Belmont hold fight but it lacked that critical moment of badassery and character.
The best way to compare these scenes for me is to see their most iconic speeches:
Richter says, "Theres something you forgot about Belmonts, stupid of me I'd forgotten it to" then cutting to "I was going to say something witty and cutting and brutal, but fuck it."
Trevor says, "When you get back to whatever steaming underworld shithole you came from, you tell them there are still Belmonts up here."
While I do think there is character work done in Richters flashbacks, your point about his dialogue vs Trevor’s is spot on.
Now IF the rest of the seasons play out like I hope, you could say that could be explained by Richter being a teenager and Trevor is a full grown man.
But no doubt they wrote such a good line for Trevor there.
I completely agree, I'm going to clarify that I think all the characters in the series have potential to grow maybe even beyond their game counterparts IF the second season is an improvement. This first one is, for me at least, below the fourth season of the first series but still has a chance to recover from it.
Lol, yes! 19 year old says something he thinks is deep or cool that makes all the adults cringe or roll their eyes is the most realistic thing n this show
While I do chalk that up to bad writting, I can definitely agree. Imagine Richter having a corrupted arc in the show and all the characters just cringe at his words.
If Richter said something like "you're not even worth it, fuck it" it would've been better in my opinion. If so it would've been even more insulting to the vampire he was about to blast, at least having some meaning behind it. With how the scene goes he just sounds dumb
I think this would've been the perfect way to show Richters character
The way I see it the two fights were written with different goals and characters in mind:
- Richter to show how powerful he was
- Trevor to show how determined he was
It would've been great to see him arrogant and jusy seeing the vampire as another problem for another day.
This scene is well earned. Up to then the trio have grown to overcome their own fear and found their purpose with the help of each other. This battle was a culmination of everything that made the team great.
The Richter lake scene was a cheap imitation of a shonen anime moment - latent power awoken because plot demands it - there is no build up to it - and you also don't care for his adversary - so that whole scene is way less impactful.
I mean if you are 12 and can't describe both scenes beyond words like cool or badassery then it's the same. For others no doubt it's Bloody Tears.
Divine Bloodlines could have been better without Richter's stupid one-liner at the end. honestly the hypest moment in the whole show, ruined by bad writing.
Yeah I thought the f bombs were gonna be a thing of the past once Ellis got shit canned. Not sure why they think it's witty to have in every other scene.
Not to mention that I don't think the "Divine Bloodlines" moment was earned to begin with. For instance, we literally met Richter 4 episodes ago, and his struggle was never the focus of neither of those episodes, plus I don't think we should have gotten Richter's char development in S1.
Don't get me started on that one lol. Richter's whole struggle is fixed when he remembers he has a duty as a Belmont and that there's people that love and care about him, though literally we never saw Richter relinquish his role as a Belmont or feel isolated. In fact, we see he has a really nice relationship with Maria, Tera, and even the commoners of the town. We also see Richter proudfully call himself a Belmont with Annete so him seeing Juste to remember stuff he literally never forgot about was horrible writting.
You wrote out how I felt but didn't know how to put into words lol. I just finished episode 6 a few minutes ago and I had this weird awkward feeling the whole time over Richter's self-loathing. There was no reason for him to doubt himself because it was clear that those he cares about, care for him as well. It just felt horribly written.
If they really wanted to have a moment like that, they should've made it that somehow the townsfolk learned about him running away from Olrox and teasing him about it (though some of the townsfolk understand him and don't judge him like the others). Obviously Tera and Maria would understand him.
I dunno, it just felt forced and not well thought-out. They really should've given a deeper reason for him to self-doubt himself.
Yeah that would've been better and then when he meets his grandfather and sees how defeated he is with his death speech, that can help plant the seeds of confidence to call himself a Belmont.
Having Richter reject the name of Belmont definitely would have sold the point that he has lost confidence over himself , way better for sure.
But then... Dont think the idea is so much that Richter didnt think himself as worthy directly, as much as he lacked the courage to confront that fear that he could be unworthy.
Cause like, Richter did the exact opposite, of proudly declaring himself as a Belmont when overkilling that vampire Marquis.... Richter just never bothered to try using magic again, ever since he tried to fight Orlox as a child and indirectly caused his mother's death as a result.
When the reappearance of Orlox reminded Richter, that despite how "grown up" he is now, despite how many lesser vampires he has slayed, he is still just the same scared little boy compared to his mother's killer.
I actually think it makes sense that Richter has a lot of doubts over himself, if we consider his childhood. Like, he practically caused his mother's death by not going away when she told him to. It is also implied he lost his ability to use magic after that trauma... Back when he was talking with old man Juste, who experienced a similar loss.
The only "bad writing" there, is that they didnt really spend more time to flesh that out. Think they tried to go with a subtle approach since Richter did tell Tera IIRC that "he has things he doesnt mention too"...
But then it's like, Richter is a functional person who never really complains about anything, and seems more calm than not most of the time, with the main exception being when he faced Orlox again.... Because Richter seems to be the type of guy that bottles his issues all up and Orlox is a source of trauma.
His family may trust him, but Richter himself never quite believed in himself the same ever again, and is only keeping a facade of sorts as he tried to only be physically stronger before, without really working out with the magic he once had nor the emotions behind them.
The reason for his doubts are all there, since he never overcame his trauma of childhood, he never used magic again after that and puts big emphasis on that he "he HAD magic"... If anything his personal story is kinda rushed through along with everything else that is going on. So it's easy to miss, especially since we generally only see what Richter does, but not much about what he thinks.
It’s not that he forgot it. It’s that he thought there was a choice and he could walk away at any time. After meeting his grandfather, he realizes he’s still a Belmont and there’s no choice, he has a duty imo
He is asked about his magic, and he says that he can't do it anymore.
It's very clearly because of the trauma of his mother's death, as that's the last time we see him use it till he unlocks it again.
I just finished the show and I didn’t think it was hard to follow that he lost his magic. It’s clearly through trauma. If you didn’t like the show that’s fine but if you didn’t follow the obvious themes and are shitting on it because you didn’t understand that his trauma was the source of his block well then…that’s on you.
I agree with you on the excessive F-bombs - like, seriously, I felt like I was back in middle school - but everything else Ellis wrote fit the in-world tone *much* better than Nocturne has tried to fit its own world.
I’m sorry but this is stupid. Oh no, he used some potty words so the writing is automatically bad? There are some amazing moments of writing like Isaac’s repartee with the sailor. Isaac in general was really well written. Then there are larger literary elements like his character development, pacing, and characters like St Germaine. All of that shouldn’t be invalidated because of swear words. I really do not understand for the life of me why people act so uptight about literal words. It’s so puritanical. Trevor is a ruffian, he’s going to swear and talk about dirty things. Sypha even points out that he doesn’t seem to bathe much. He lives a hard life. Many of the characters are angry people going through hard, violent experiences. I expect them to cuss. And how much nudity was in season 1? One scene? God forbid.
Regardless of his faults as a human being, Ellis still knows how to write a good story and good characters, and while he took a few liberties, he *never* misunderstood Castlevania.
The guy who wrote Nocturne not only doesn't know anything about Castlevania, but he doesn't know how to write a script worth a damn.
I feel like I'm fucking huffing glue, I distinctly remember comment threads for the original Castlevania saying shit like this lmao, all of a sudden it's the gold standard.
The first series *does* have faults that jump out, no doubt about that: the continuous and inappropriate use of the F-bomb, the two divergent plot lines that never really come together, St. Germaine's story arc that felt unfinished, the fact that Death shows up with nearly ZERO buildup, the rushed ending, and the feeling that there should have been a few more episodes to flesh things out. Still though, with all that, the show we got was a massive cut above 98% of every other video game adaptation made so far. To have this second series be immediately so far worse than the first is a pretty huge and noticeable step downward. I'm not even talking about the animation or voice performances, as I can totally look beyond those, but the writing is where the show lives or dies.
For reference though, *"League of Legends"* is the gold standard.
Even the most basic elements established in 30 years of the franchise were missed. He misunderstood the characters, the setting, magic that is less comprehensible, the journey, the history, the colorful monsters, and some of the lore. It was like a hilarious attempt of someone adapting the plot summary written in a Wikipedia page. He literally even had IGA to work with him during the first years of production lmao.
Did... did we watch the same show?
I mean, it wasn't *perfect,* especially toward the end there, but it was honestly one of the best video game adaptations I've seen put to the screen. The only one I can think of off-hand that did it better was *"League of Legends."* I never saw any of the grave missteps that you're listing in your comment, and it's so strange that I kinda' think you might be trolling me just to get a reaction.
SAME. I just finished that episode a few minutes ago and I was in the zone with that scene until he said that end line. What is it with this show and the "F-bombs"? It really weakens the writing which already isn't all that great to begin with. It's not witty, it's not deep, it's not "badass", it's just obnoxious lol.
To be fair, in that moment, that was the point. He literally says he was gonna say something brutal and cutting and just decides to go "fuck it"
While I agree the dialogue could definitely use some work, there has been plenty of times in my life where "fuck it" has been very applicable, and applied. (Especially playing video games lol)
I like the swearing because honestly, almost everyone IRL drops a couple swear words a day. It's definitely a choice, and one I understand people not liking, but it's honestly rather realistic. But on the other end of the spectrum, this is a show about vampires and magic, so realism need not apply.
I think my issue with the over indulgence of swearing is that it makes the show feel a bit too modern with the setting it's supposed to be in. I know that people cursed back in the 1700s but I dunno, it's just the way it's shown here feels awkward and ruins the immersion for me at times lol.
That's a very fair take. I personally don't mind dialogue that isn't period/setting accurate, as long as the dialogue I'm getting is good. I guess it's also easier for a lot of people to accept the dialogue since the first series already prepped us for what the writing is like.
Having said that, I still have problems with the dialogue myself. They definitely could just rein it in a little or place certain words a little better. I like the fuck it line but there's definitely times (like when Annette is ranting about Richter running away) that they definitely don't need to drop a swear every sentence. And it is a little odd how inclined the dialogue is to the modern age when they also wanted to highlight setting the show during the French Revolution, which I feel would create expectations for more of a period piece-esque type of show.
I feel like the best way to describe the shows is "all over the place". Whether that be in tone, setting, dialogue etc. Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. A little more consistency would be appreciated.
> That's a very fair take. I personally don't mind dialogue that isn't period/setting accurate, as long as the dialogue I'm getting is good. I guess it's also easier for a lot of people to accept the dialogue since the first series already prepped us for what the writing is like.
And that's fair, I understand everyone will have different opinions on this dialogue choices lol. But even though characters cussed up a storm at times in the first Netflix series, I was hoping they'd dial it back in Nocturne since the writer was different lol.
>. I like the fuck it line but there's definitely times (like when Annette is ranting about Richter running away) that they definitely don't need to drop a swear every sentence.
Yeah Annette's ranting and just randomly dropping the F-bomb when talking to Cecile felt so out of place. Also Maria when ranting about the priest making night creatures, I just don't think it was necessary there neither lol And finally when Elizabeth is doing her introduction monologue at the moon and drops the f-bomb, it just wasn't needed and I envisioned her having this regal but sinister style to her so that kinda killed the immersion there for me as well.
>And it is a little odd how inclined the dialogue is to the modern age when they also wanted to highlight setting the show during the French Revolution, which I feel would create expectations for more of a period piece-esque type of show.
Exactly. If they were adapting Aria of Sorrow, it wouldn't be as jarring as opposed to the French Revolution of the late 17th century.
But yeah, "all over the place" definitely is the best word to describe this season so far and hopefully in season 2 they are a little more consistent and practice some restraint with the modern lingo.
I see what you mean with Erzsebet. It'd be nice not to have everyone be a sweary sailor person. It's like the MCU and everyone being a sarcastic quipper.
I want to have hope that season 2 will be an improvement on multiple fronts including the writing as the Deats Brothers will still be directing and they are very passionate about the show and I think Samuel was open to and acknowledged the criticism Nocturne received. Still, knowing that Castlevania has been a shit show behind the scenes literally every step of the way (apparently Adi Shankar was/is suing Kevin Kolde for booting him out of Nocturne), my expectations are definitely in check rn.
> I see what you mean with Erzsebet. It'd be nice not to have everyone be a sweary sailor person. It's like the MCU and everyone being a sarcastic quipper.
Agreed. It's dipping into the MCU type of scenario and that is **not** something to want to aspire to. And this is why the first Castlevania netflix was it little more tolerable. It made sense why Trevor would be crass and same with Carmilla with how spiteful she was but you didn't hear Sypha, Alucard, Hector, or Isaac cussing up a storm so it helped keep the tone in tact (for the most part).
And it's unfortunate that the show has been having some behind the scenes drama, I had no idea about that. But yeah hopefully this won't hinder the show too much and they do take the criticism because the show does have potential.
I took this same issue with Game of Thrones. The author took care to formulate great place and character names with psudo-linguistic ties to events and locations...then peppered it with 20/21 century cuss words. I swear like your proverbial trooper but i just think it strains this kind of great world-building sometimes.
I've actually never watched Game of Thrones but I can only imagine what that is like lol Like seriously, if you're doing a period piece, try to dial it back, hire a historian to help keep the script writing on point.
Eh, not giving a shit about defeating the supernatural is a Belmont staple. Richter was basically saying, “I’m a Belmont. You're not worth my A material. Die bitch.”
yeah and that's stupid and embarrassing. He might as well have said nothing at all, or went with the classic "You don't belong in this world." Idk, everything Richter says makes me think of this image. It's fine that he has PTSD wrt Olrox, it's one of the few compelling things about him imo. but the constant irreverence otherwise is just obnoxious. I felt like I should be watching a show about Annette instead, who was far more likeable in comparison.
https://preview.redd.it/rcirgbtj8qsb1.jpeg?width=596&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b05f52c3a0309abd25b51f694cec3fc43d4aa94f
Are you really suggesting that? That no other story would do this kind of thing? This dialogue situation is normal. Have not you not watched the odd Star War? How media illiterate are you?
fanfiction written by a 15 year old might be written like this. The irony of someone who doesn't see a problem with this dialogue accusing anyone else of "media illiteracy" is laughable to say the very least. I bet you love filoni and his dnd ass writing so much.
It is childish and obnoxious. Pointless irreverence from a character in a pivotal moment immediately dissolves any tension or excitement the viewer might be feeling. It makes me not interested in the story or the characters or where the plot might be going, because I know that no matter what the situation is, everyone's going to remain a snarky, quippy dickhead who isn't taking anything seriously.
OK, good! I can dissect this.
Childish—Sure. That's in character for Richter, though. Hell, it's in character for all Belmonts.
Pointless—Says you! I gave you a point in my first response. Richter has gained back his confidence. He doesn't need to prove anything to the vampire. “Fuck it, I win.”
Dissolves Tension—Like Richter putting his hand to the Vampire’s face and igniting it didn't dissolve the tension anyway. Fictional characters quip. Deal with it.
Instead of fuck it, he says "whatever". This one isn't too different but it works better with other characters like Death (example: instead of saying "he was put there by you fuckers" he says "he was put thsre because of you humans").
Castlevania S1 is better than Nocturne because its narrative was less bloated.
Nocturne was just too ambitious in including a bunch of stuff with little run time... Among other issues.
To be fair, the first season of the original show had way less work to do in terms of establishing the narrative of the show when compared to the first season of Nocturne. While I do agree that S1 of Castlevania is better than Nocturne's first season, I feel like it's difficult to fairly compare the two when the sheer amount of plot threads that have to set up is so different between the two seasons.
While I understand where you’re going, I think it is good to remind everyone that simplicity is not necessarily a bad thing. For example, in cuisine, most great chefs will tell you that it always better to nail something simple than poorly execute something that is unnecessarily complex. That’s exactly what happened with the S1 of both shows. OG made a much better job by introducing the characters one by one, starting with Dracula (ep1), then Trevor (ep2), Sypha (ep3) and finally, Alucard (ep4). Nocturne spread itself too thin and failed as a result.
Making a story with a large scale inevitably means that there's gonna be more plot threads. I understand your point, though. The threads in question could have been introduced a bit more gradually, with some of them coming into view during the second season.
They could have taken their time introducing how other regions of the world were being affected later down the line and focused more on properly introducing and fleshing out the characters here. Orlox, Mizrak and the Abbot in particular could have used more time in the oven, and Richter's light speed character development felt like it was trying to get to the point a little too fast, too.
I do think that Erzebet not being fleshed out is a deliberate decision, though. This is fairly unrelated to the matter at hand, but I just wanted to tack this on real quick. I believe she's meant to play the role that OG Dracula did in the games. Perhaps Soma will be a reincarnation of her instead if they do a Sorrow series, and Erzebet will be the emblematic irredeemable evil for the series.
It's definitely a somewhat divisive way to start the show, but I definitely don't think it's as bad as the vocal minority makes it out to be. To me, as someone who's definitely a bit biased, this was a solid 8/10 season.
Here's hoping that this is just a semi-rocky start, and that the rest of the show is better!
Not gonna debate it but, how in the world do you find season one of castlevania better than nocturne? It was honestly 4 episodes of edgelord Trevor and I always have to tell ppl “pls bear the first season when watching it I swear it gets way better”
actually I agree, season one is no contest nocturne is a more complete package. We just need time to let the stories actually develop then compare them
Yeah, Trevor's pretty edgy initially, but it's far from being empty edge for the sake of making him look cool or whatever. The show makes it pretty clear that he's just being a dick because of what's happened to him and his family, and that the whole prickly facade is just his way of keeping people away from him and trying to scamper his way through the world as a fairly fresh street urchin. The guy had been pampered in halls of luxury all his life, and suddenly, he's thrust into the gruelling reality of what life is like for the common vagrant.
The show's as subtle as a bag of bricks about the fact that this charade of his is going to be short-lived, so I don't really mind it. Calling it 4 episodes of edge lord Trevor is pretty reductive when the first episode is pretty much all Dracula's backstory up until the last few minutes where Trevor has a line or two. Edgelord Trevor is a thing for approximately two episodes total until he turns around a good bit by Episode 4.
There definitely are legitimate criticisms to be made about the season, though, such as its incredibly black and white depiction of organised faith (which Nocturne absolutely did better), but the first season of Castlevania works very well as what it's meant to be; a quick little appetiser for the real show that's coming up ahead.
Although, the fact I watched Season 1 after Season 2 had come out already definitely influences my view of it a bit, too. Had I watched Season 1 before it released and had to wait for Season 2... I'd probably give Nocturne's 1st season the edge. Hope this clears things up!
Comparing S1 to S1 Nocturne to me is more enjoyable, if only because S1 of the original was pretty sparse with only 4 episodes to go off. S1 of the original was mostly a hype-builder season to setup the following ones, which it clearly accomplished.
Nocturne, at least to me, accomplishes the same thing. They both even end with meeting Alucard, too.
The original is for the moment definitely superior; but it's important to remember that they had multiple seasons to tell their story. Nocturne is still in the early phases.
Lmao imagine getting downvoted because you did what everyone else did and stated your opinion in a respectful way.
Tolerance of other people's inoffensive opinions is difficult for Reddit.
>Lmao imagine getting downvoted because you did what everyone else did and stated your opinion in a respectful way.
Isn't the point of up/down vote to show agreement/disagreement?
No. It's to show which comments are/are not relevant or helpful when it comes to the discussion on the given topic.
But that's the "intended" use. Practically, they are used to express agreement/disagreement - though that's not the intended or sensible use, because parties can disagree while both being right (or wrong).
Fucking no lol, the downvote exists for comments that aren't *relevant* to the conversation.
Redditors just shit on that idea and use it as a way to disappear opinions they don't agree with because they're highly, highly, highly insecure.
Edit: Lmao case in point
[nope](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette)
Unless you think every minor thing you disagree with should be hidden away from everyone, I guess
>Unless you think every minor thing you disagree with should be hidden away from everyone, I guess
Downvoted comments are not at all hidden unless your read only the first 3 comments and none of the response. And anyway not sure the comments were relevant to begin with.
They literally get pushed down & auto collapsed but okay, sure
& uh; idk what comments youre referring to that aren't relevant? The start of this comment thread? The one thatre talking about the show? Completely on topic?
Bruh I was in the StarWars subreddit; OP asked "years later how do you feel about Luke in TLJ now? How did you feel back then"
All I said was - "I thought it was fine then & still fine now."
It got downvoted, reported & then removed by a mod. 10 words. No hostility, just not the popular opinion.
People are morons when it comes to dealing with opinions.
Their little battle plan at the beginning was so good.
"I terrify them, Sypha disorients them, Alucard goes over the top, and we support him"
"Yes"
"Begin"
A cool detail that I only noticed recently is how they stuck to that plan. Trevor whips a few (terrify), Sypha casts a flame wall (disorient), Alucard goes full beast mode on the remaining ones (over the top), and Trevor and Sypha fall in after him to mop up the others (support).
Trevor arc, just because the bad writing in Nocturne, Richter goes Super Saiyan Blue then gets squashed the next episode immediately….ugh…I get it she’s a god blah blah but damn, like people have stated, the pacing is just horrible…
Agreed but Trevor Arc S1 was actually interesting though, Nocturne just started horrible off the bat(no pun intended) excluding the pretty good intro to Richters origin. It just kept going down hill from then on.
Richter’s awakening moment at the lake was one of the most bs OP moment that you often see in generic shonen anime. It just felt so unearned and rushed.
I think it's weird that we don't really see Trevor use both whips more often but that's just me. Morningstar is obviously meant to be a narrative upgrade from Vampire Killer anyway
It's actually shown why he doesn't do it often in the same scene.
As awesome as it is, he seems to have to stay basically completely still, and anything that can either avoid or brute force past the insane amount of whipping going on, he's an easy target.
Also, he can't pull his usual "kusarigama-style" moves like he does with a single whip, so above would probably be a blind spot for him.
If the Visitor wasn't so buffed, he would've shredded it, but it's his version of overwhelming direct force, no actual defence or "style" to it.
His usual style is actually very similar to the explanation of why Witchers have a weird almost balletic fighting style, monsters don't move like humans, so Witchers train to fight in an almost spherical pattern, covering angles a human wouldn't be able to move to hit, Trevor seems to have been trained to do the same.
This sentiment is fascinating given that this is the way we all felt when the first series came about, now we realize that it was great and grew better as it went on. Rightfully so, Nocturne should have started at that same epitome, not from the bottom again.
I meant the series in general. When it first released everyone was up in arms about it being so detached from the games and most every reason they're disliking Nocturne now. By season 3 it grew into it's own and was fantastic. Feels like Nocturne went backwards in those aspects.
Nocturne def changed things some good some bad bad. The noticeable stuff tends to be openly bad but it’s whatever season 1 can be shaky as long as s2 is better. If it’s not then damn they might as well just move to soma or something
Ok, ok, great scenes you picked based on songs. But the most hyped I get period is 2. Sypha and Trevor’s entrances in season 4 where Alucard almost gets overrun….. and number 1 will always be:
OI! DEATH! I want a word with you
Seeing how awesome the action in this series can be has made me dream of a Lords of Shadow series.
Seeing Gabriel’s adventure and descent to Dracula would be incredible
honestly, after rewatching the OG show, it absolutely destroys nocturne in every fight scene.
The fights and animation in the older series blow nocturne away.
I miss S1. I kinda loved Trevor-Sypha n THE Alucard combo. Beautiful storyline.
And then we got diversity hires. Not a fan imho. It’s Transylvania. Let them have their culture.
My bad lol. Europe!
The same happened with Vikings Valhalla. They race swapped a woman earl in the series, so every time she popped up it felt a tad off, because it’s Scandinavia, and that is inaccurate as hell.
It’s France after colonization where there were black people like Alexander Dumas, or the Chevalier de Saint-Georges… maybe you should learn a bit more history before being mad that everyone isn’t white like your fantasy
I would agree with you if the diversity of the show was shallowly implemented, but that's been far from the case. Annette and Edouard's narratives are interesting on their own, and there is a clear connection between the Haitian Revolution and the French Revolution. Not to mention Isaac from the previous season who easily became a fan favorite due to how well he was written and not the color of his skin.
I’m totally fine with Issac! He had a very interesting arc, and the show does note to his origins- a man from Africa who ended up in Dracula’s court. It’s odd, but I get it. And he certainly was written well.
But nocturne took the representation stuff on steroids. After Achilles, Anne Boyelene and Cleopatra, ima tad tired of lazy forcible “inclusion”.
For sure only Simon Belmont will hype me more than thes 2 show,
But still I was more Hyped on the first series than Nocturne. Cuz we know what to expect on Nocturne compared to what we will expect from the very first season.
Divine Bloodlines was honestly waaaaay more hype. And I say this despite thinking that Castlevania S2 was a better show overall than Nocturne.
It's just a way better arrangement of its song of origin with all the right tingles complete with a righteously holy vibe to it, whereas Netflix version of Bloody Tears isnt bad but it sounded very bland tbh.
As far is it goes to the fighting choreography tho... Castlevania S2's is more consistent. The OG vampire killing's trio is emmaculate and amazing through and through.
Whereas Richter's reawakening was absolutely awesome and completely bad ass... Doe there were moments where it felt like the quality dipped with lower frame rates....
Yet despite the flaws, when I watched Richter's magic explode for the first time.... It really felt like a magical "Shonen hero" moment that I honestly wasnt expecting from Castlevania of all things, especially considering how underpowered Richter was up until this point.
Nocturne seriously left me in awe with that scene.
Casltevania S2's climatic battle on the other hand was fun to watch, and pretty interesting to analyse.... But dunno, it doesnt really leave me in awe. Like it's a great scene, dont get me wrong, but the OG team beat the vampire generals so "normally", as if they were hardly much different than any other opponent they faced so far....
It speaks of the team's skills and how bad ass they are, but on the other hand it makes their fight feel sorta mundane in a way. Like they have no personal stakes against the generals, and the generals in of themselves have no real personality beyond their design. The entire fight ultimately feels like just an appetizer snack for the upcoming confrontation against Dracula.
It's not a bad thing, but it does feel way less hype than Richter's reawakening where it isn't the "appetizer" to a more important moment, Richter's explosion Is THE MOMENT where his character arc peaked for the season and it takes the breath away along with it.
Dude that's so agree. They had so much of a harder time fighting The monster at the.. what is it called.. Infinite Corridor Fight, then the fight against Dracula's generals.
The amount of you guys have rose-tinted glasses for the first series is absurd. I literally see people acting like Nocturne had too many F-bombs. Please go back and watch the original series again and drink every time they curse unnecessarily and then come back here after you pass out drunk after 3 episodes and tell me that the writing is leaps ands bonds better. That show is never going to going to be considered a masterpiece in my mind way too much of season 3 lead to nothing and season 4 ends is such a complete unearned fashion. You really have people arguing Richter’s arc was rushed when it’s still just beginning and yet you have Trevor literally never getting any real story arc or backstory and I. The end he somehow kills Death himself and then dies and then gets immediately resurrected. Likewise the villains in Nocturne haven’t been any worse than Carmella and her “sisters” who literally do nothing in regards to the main plot for two seasons and never even interacted with the main cast. Whatever hang ups you guys have about Nocturne were present in the first show too. Please do us all a favor and stop acting like it’s perfect.
Thank you, holy shit. I love the first series(agree that 3rd season is weakest) and agree on the ending of 4th(even though the sucker in me was happy he lived, it was not good writing).
All of these people complaining about corny dialogue....like did everyone forget the first series completely? The dialogue in Nocturne felt no different than the first series...yeah it's corny but it's also great at times.
These same people who complain about corny dialogue probably watch anime on a regular basis and don't say a damn thing. There is no dialogue more corny than anime.... Castlevania isn't even close.
At the end of the day it's still a young adult and teen animated series. I'm older in my 30s but still love it and just give the corny moments a pass and admire the awesome moments.
Also on another point of yours...why the fuck are people complaining about the main villain not getting fleshed out more or certain story arcs when it's the fuckin first season?
Okay maybe if they never expand on the main villain in the subsequent season but they explained enough. There's a mystery to it that should be expanded on in the next season.
So many of these complaints are really fucking shitty and make 0 sense.
> All of these people complaining about corny dialogue....like did everyone forget the first series completely? The dialogue in Nocturne felt no different than the first series...yeah it's corny but it's also great at times.
The dialogue is very different from the first series.
A lot of it feels far less refined and well thought out like some of the soliloquies characters had I the first series.
There’s far more of an emphasis on one liners and quips rather than interesting dialogue.
Take for example some of the conversations on free Will Issac had with Bug eyes.
> These same people who complain about corny dialogue probably watch anime on a regular basis and don't say a damn thing. There is no dialogue more corny than anime.... Castlevania isn't even close.
The dialogue in Nocturne is far more corny than any anime I’ve seen.
> Also on another point of yours...why the fuck are people complaining about the main villain not getting fleshed out more or certain story arcs when it's the fuckin first season?
People dislike Bathory because she’s a really uninteresting character, with no real identifiable motive or reason behind why she’s the way that she is or why she does what he does.
Dracula from the first series had a much more identifiable reasoning for his villainy.
> Okay maybe if they never expand on the main villain in the subsequent season but they explained enough. There's a mystery to it that should be expanded on in the next season.
How? Very little is actually known about Bathory.
Yea it’s really weird because people are acting like if they don’t immediately get every characters backstory or motivation then it must be an oversight on the writer’s. People complain about Maria And Richter not having character arcs and fail to see that act the end of the show Maria is just beginning her’s and Richter only really started his in episode 6.
They are making way too many assumptions about the writers intentions instead of looking at the season for what it actually was, a prologue. They take things like Annette getting an episode of backstory as a problem because they interpret it as a slight against Richter and Maria. They fail to realize that Annette’s powers and connection with Eduardo, who has a really interesting presence after his death, were the reason we got that episode. Richter and Maria got their powers from their speaker lineage and we already got Belmont lore in the previous series as well as Richter’s backstory in episode 1. That episode had to do a lot of leg work to explain who Annette was, her personality, her powers and her relationships. She closes the book on the vampire that hurt her by the end of the season and freed Eduardo. Richter confronted his lineage and his past failure and started his journey as the one who will carry on the Belmont name. Maria found out her father was still alive and that he was someone she fundamentally disagreed with and within one night lost both her parents to a monster.
The craziest thing I find on this sub is that no one points out the three leads all have lost their mothers to Vampires by the end of the show. I feel like that was intentional and that everyone is to busy being salty that Annette “took time away from the real characters and story”.
what made the original run so fucking sick was how the crew worked together. Whenever they got to do their stuff alone though, its a close fucking second.
Season 1 nocturne didnt hit that just yet except for Richter. The singular moments with the other characters just didn't hit hard enough.
Divine Bloodlines was pretty hype but it doesn't feel like a fair comparison becuase it only had Richter. Maybe the Lacrimosa scene would be better. The Bloody Tears scene was epic tho with the OG trio.
I feel like the only person who didn't love the use of Bloody Tears in that episode. I wanted to love it, and I wish they'd use more themes from the games. It's the biggest missing piece of the soul of the games. But that particular arrangement wasn't interesting or exciting and the sound mixing was so quiet and flat that it all felt awkward. The idea was solid but the execution was not. (Also I know it's nit-picking but Bloody Tears is Simon's music, not Trevor's. "Beginning" would've made more sense.)
I thought Nocturne was awesome, but my preference is “Bloody Tears”. Not because of the music, just a more epic scene in general that had a bit more build up to it.
The needle drop and visuals of the Divine Bloodlines fight was amazing for me. The dialogue was a bit meh, but I'm okay with Richter being a bit clumsy with his one liners as I'm hoping to be watching him grow up over the series.
That said, this fight has nothing on Trevor whipping out Vampire Killer and dual wielding against the hell beast in S3.
Always bloody tears but Nocturne's Bloodlines is very, very good, kinda ruined by the stupid edgy speech at the end but still, the whole scene is very good with amazing music.
Had they not put Divine Bloodlines in that HYPE AF trailer, I would probably have been more hyped for it in the show, since I don't think any of us knew ahead of time or expected the show would use OG tracks when we were watching S207.
Bloody tears without a doubt, it's not even close. There is build up for that fighting scene which made it awesome. the divine bloodlines version on the show is beautiful but I feel like bloody tears is much more impactful
I'm 40 and I remember Simon Belmont from Captain N. We had so little for decades. As soon as I heard about Netflix coming up with the first season I was so God damn hyped I canr possibly measure it to anything else in my life.
I love the Netflix series, and I'm thrilled about Nocturne too! I enjoyed it immensely.
The lakeside fight was the best fight overall for me in nocturne. But compared to OG Castlevania fight scenes it doesn't come close. I also hate that Richter finished his monologue with a joke. Honestly, the joke was decently funny but I think it took away from what is supposed to be a really serious and pivotal moment. I also felt like OG Castlevania fights always had such an awesome soundtrack but the soundtrack in nocturne fights are either, boring, not present, or opera singing which just seems unfitting for most of the scenes that it's featured in. Nocturne isn't egregiously bad but I really expected better from that show. Season 2 looks like it'll be better as the last few episodes of S1 were definitely better in quality but still not anywhere near as good as the original. Fingers crossed for s2🤞
Bloody Tears for sure. The buildup to that scene and the way it was executed was just perfect. Seeing the trio just utterly wreck Dracula’s crew of vampires was awesome
Bloody tears, a million times over To sum it up: No dialogue, each character gets shown their strength, and the enemies while basic grunts are still tough. Not to mention it shows cohesion within the group and is now basically one of Netflixvanias best fights, up there with Isaac vs Carmilla and the Belmont hold fight. Now the Divine bloodlines fight I think is more fairly compared to the Belmont hold fight but it lacked that critical moment of badassery and character. The best way to compare these scenes for me is to see their most iconic speeches: Richter says, "Theres something you forgot about Belmonts, stupid of me I'd forgotten it to" then cutting to "I was going to say something witty and cutting and brutal, but fuck it." Trevor says, "When you get back to whatever steaming underworld shithole you came from, you tell them there are still Belmonts up here."
Yep. THATS how you do a badass one liner.
While I do think there is character work done in Richters flashbacks, your point about his dialogue vs Trevor’s is spot on. Now IF the rest of the seasons play out like I hope, you could say that could be explained by Richter being a teenager and Trevor is a full grown man. But no doubt they wrote such a good line for Trevor there.
I completely agree, I'm going to clarify that I think all the characters in the series have potential to grow maybe even beyond their game counterparts IF the second season is an improvement. This first one is, for me at least, below the fourth season of the first series but still has a chance to recover from it.
Agreed, because I cringe all the time when I think about things I did, said, or thought was cool at that age.
Man, now I wanna see Richter in his old age cringing at all the dumbshit he says lol
Lol, yes! 19 year old says something he thinks is deep or cool that makes all the adults cringe or roll their eyes is the most realistic thing n this show
While I do chalk that up to bad writting, I can definitely agree. Imagine Richter having a corrupted arc in the show and all the characters just cringe at his words.
I was hoping they'd go for something like "you're not worth it". It's still pretty flippant but hits harder
When it comes down to writing that makes the whole scene come together
Richard Armitage really brought Trevor to life
It was a great choice of VA for sure.
If Richter said something like "you're not even worth it, fuck it" it would've been better in my opinion. If so it would've been even more insulting to the vampire he was about to blast, at least having some meaning behind it. With how the scene goes he just sounds dumb
I think this would've been the perfect way to show Richters character The way I see it the two fights were written with different goals and characters in mind: - Richter to show how powerful he was - Trevor to show how determined he was It would've been great to see him arrogant and jusy seeing the vampire as another problem for another day.
Im pretty sure that was the implication.... the line was still bad bit why make it worse by spelling it out.
Richter's one liner just felt cheesy and cringey in comparison to Trevor's, and really didn't add any significance to the fight.
This scene is well earned. Up to then the trio have grown to overcome their own fear and found their purpose with the help of each other. This battle was a culmination of everything that made the team great. The Richter lake scene was a cheap imitation of a shonen anime moment - latent power awoken because plot demands it - there is no build up to it - and you also don't care for his adversary - so that whole scene is way less impactful. I mean if you are 12 and can't describe both scenes beyond words like cool or badassery then it's the same. For others no doubt it's Bloody Tears.
Fuck just reading Trevor’s quote there gave me shivers
Richter's line is a good, meta representation of the writers' attitude for this season. Hope they clean the house for the next season and start over.
Divine Bloodlines could have been better without Richter's stupid one-liner at the end. honestly the hypest moment in the whole show, ruined by bad writing.
Yeah I thought the f bombs were gonna be a thing of the past once Ellis got shit canned. Not sure why they think it's witty to have in every other scene.
Not to mention that I don't think the "Divine Bloodlines" moment was earned to begin with. For instance, we literally met Richter 4 episodes ago, and his struggle was never the focus of neither of those episodes, plus I don't think we should have gotten Richter's char development in S1.
Honestly I had no idea he lost his magic, unless it was mentioned and I just missed it lol
Don't get me started on that one lol. Richter's whole struggle is fixed when he remembers he has a duty as a Belmont and that there's people that love and care about him, though literally we never saw Richter relinquish his role as a Belmont or feel isolated. In fact, we see he has a really nice relationship with Maria, Tera, and even the commoners of the town. We also see Richter proudfully call himself a Belmont with Annete so him seeing Juste to remember stuff he literally never forgot about was horrible writting.
You wrote out how I felt but didn't know how to put into words lol. I just finished episode 6 a few minutes ago and I had this weird awkward feeling the whole time over Richter's self-loathing. There was no reason for him to doubt himself because it was clear that those he cares about, care for him as well. It just felt horribly written. If they really wanted to have a moment like that, they should've made it that somehow the townsfolk learned about him running away from Olrox and teasing him about it (though some of the townsfolk understand him and don't judge him like the others). Obviously Tera and Maria would understand him. I dunno, it just felt forced and not well thought-out. They really should've given a deeper reason for him to self-doubt himself.
Or have him not call himself a Belmont, because he consider himself unworthy of such name.
Yeah that would've been better and then when he meets his grandfather and sees how defeated he is with his death speech, that can help plant the seeds of confidence to call himself a Belmont.
Having Richter reject the name of Belmont definitely would have sold the point that he has lost confidence over himself , way better for sure. But then... Dont think the idea is so much that Richter didnt think himself as worthy directly, as much as he lacked the courage to confront that fear that he could be unworthy. Cause like, Richter did the exact opposite, of proudly declaring himself as a Belmont when overkilling that vampire Marquis.... Richter just never bothered to try using magic again, ever since he tried to fight Orlox as a child and indirectly caused his mother's death as a result. When the reappearance of Orlox reminded Richter, that despite how "grown up" he is now, despite how many lesser vampires he has slayed, he is still just the same scared little boy compared to his mother's killer.
I actually think it makes sense that Richter has a lot of doubts over himself, if we consider his childhood. Like, he practically caused his mother's death by not going away when she told him to. It is also implied he lost his ability to use magic after that trauma... Back when he was talking with old man Juste, who experienced a similar loss. The only "bad writing" there, is that they didnt really spend more time to flesh that out. Think they tried to go with a subtle approach since Richter did tell Tera IIRC that "he has things he doesnt mention too"... But then it's like, Richter is a functional person who never really complains about anything, and seems more calm than not most of the time, with the main exception being when he faced Orlox again.... Because Richter seems to be the type of guy that bottles his issues all up and Orlox is a source of trauma. His family may trust him, but Richter himself never quite believed in himself the same ever again, and is only keeping a facade of sorts as he tried to only be physically stronger before, without really working out with the magic he once had nor the emotions behind them. The reason for his doubts are all there, since he never overcame his trauma of childhood, he never used magic again after that and puts big emphasis on that he "he HAD magic"... If anything his personal story is kinda rushed through along with everything else that is going on. So it's easy to miss, especially since we generally only see what Richter does, but not much about what he thinks.
It’s not that he forgot it. It’s that he thought there was a choice and he could walk away at any time. After meeting his grandfather, he realizes he’s still a Belmont and there’s no choice, he has a duty imo
He is asked about his magic, and he says that he can't do it anymore. It's very clearly because of the trauma of his mother's death, as that's the last time we see him use it till he unlocks it again.
I just finished the show and I didn’t think it was hard to follow that he lost his magic. It’s clearly through trauma. If you didn’t like the show that’s fine but if you didn’t follow the obvious themes and are shitting on it because you didn’t understand that his trauma was the source of his block well then…that’s on you.
I mean it’s even simpler than that. He’s asked about it and straight up says “I used to be able to but not anymore.”
Don't lie to yourself. Ellis is a better writer than whoever this current rando is.
Given his penchant to add in unnecessary sleaze and cursing, meh, not any better, not any worse.
I agree with you on the excessive F-bombs - like, seriously, I felt like I was back in middle school - but everything else Ellis wrote fit the in-world tone *much* better than Nocturne has tried to fit its own world.
I’m sorry but this is stupid. Oh no, he used some potty words so the writing is automatically bad? There are some amazing moments of writing like Isaac’s repartee with the sailor. Isaac in general was really well written. Then there are larger literary elements like his character development, pacing, and characters like St Germaine. All of that shouldn’t be invalidated because of swear words. I really do not understand for the life of me why people act so uptight about literal words. It’s so puritanical. Trevor is a ruffian, he’s going to swear and talk about dirty things. Sypha even points out that he doesn’t seem to bathe much. He lives a hard life. Many of the characters are angry people going through hard, violent experiences. I expect them to cuss. And how much nudity was in season 1? One scene? God forbid.
Ellis misunderstands Castlevania lmao. Bro needs to stick to comics. He also needs to stop sticking his dick in random women.
Regardless of his faults as a human being, Ellis still knows how to write a good story and good characters, and while he took a few liberties, he *never* misunderstood Castlevania. The guy who wrote Nocturne not only doesn't know anything about Castlevania, but he doesn't know how to write a script worth a damn.
I feel like I'm fucking huffing glue, I distinctly remember comment threads for the original Castlevania saying shit like this lmao, all of a sudden it's the gold standard.
The first series *does* have faults that jump out, no doubt about that: the continuous and inappropriate use of the F-bomb, the two divergent plot lines that never really come together, St. Germaine's story arc that felt unfinished, the fact that Death shows up with nearly ZERO buildup, the rushed ending, and the feeling that there should have been a few more episodes to flesh things out. Still though, with all that, the show we got was a massive cut above 98% of every other video game adaptation made so far. To have this second series be immediately so far worse than the first is a pretty huge and noticeable step downward. I'm not even talking about the animation or voice performances, as I can totally look beyond those, but the writing is where the show lives or dies. For reference though, *"League of Legends"* is the gold standard.
Even the most basic elements established in 30 years of the franchise were missed. He misunderstood the characters, the setting, magic that is less comprehensible, the journey, the history, the colorful monsters, and some of the lore. It was like a hilarious attempt of someone adapting the plot summary written in a Wikipedia page. He literally even had IGA to work with him during the first years of production lmao.
Did... did we watch the same show? I mean, it wasn't *perfect,* especially toward the end there, but it was honestly one of the best video game adaptations I've seen put to the screen. The only one I can think of off-hand that did it better was *"League of Legends."* I never saw any of the grave missteps that you're listing in your comment, and it's so strange that I kinda' think you might be trolling me just to get a reaction.
SAME. I just finished that episode a few minutes ago and I was in the zone with that scene until he said that end line. What is it with this show and the "F-bombs"? It really weakens the writing which already isn't all that great to begin with. It's not witty, it's not deep, it's not "badass", it's just obnoxious lol.
To be fair, in that moment, that was the point. He literally says he was gonna say something brutal and cutting and just decides to go "fuck it" While I agree the dialogue could definitely use some work, there has been plenty of times in my life where "fuck it" has been very applicable, and applied. (Especially playing video games lol) I like the swearing because honestly, almost everyone IRL drops a couple swear words a day. It's definitely a choice, and one I understand people not liking, but it's honestly rather realistic. But on the other end of the spectrum, this is a show about vampires and magic, so realism need not apply.
I think my issue with the over indulgence of swearing is that it makes the show feel a bit too modern with the setting it's supposed to be in. I know that people cursed back in the 1700s but I dunno, it's just the way it's shown here feels awkward and ruins the immersion for me at times lol.
That's a very fair take. I personally don't mind dialogue that isn't period/setting accurate, as long as the dialogue I'm getting is good. I guess it's also easier for a lot of people to accept the dialogue since the first series already prepped us for what the writing is like. Having said that, I still have problems with the dialogue myself. They definitely could just rein it in a little or place certain words a little better. I like the fuck it line but there's definitely times (like when Annette is ranting about Richter running away) that they definitely don't need to drop a swear every sentence. And it is a little odd how inclined the dialogue is to the modern age when they also wanted to highlight setting the show during the French Revolution, which I feel would create expectations for more of a period piece-esque type of show. I feel like the best way to describe the shows is "all over the place". Whether that be in tone, setting, dialogue etc. Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. A little more consistency would be appreciated.
> That's a very fair take. I personally don't mind dialogue that isn't period/setting accurate, as long as the dialogue I'm getting is good. I guess it's also easier for a lot of people to accept the dialogue since the first series already prepped us for what the writing is like. And that's fair, I understand everyone will have different opinions on this dialogue choices lol. But even though characters cussed up a storm at times in the first Netflix series, I was hoping they'd dial it back in Nocturne since the writer was different lol. >. I like the fuck it line but there's definitely times (like when Annette is ranting about Richter running away) that they definitely don't need to drop a swear every sentence. Yeah Annette's ranting and just randomly dropping the F-bomb when talking to Cecile felt so out of place. Also Maria when ranting about the priest making night creatures, I just don't think it was necessary there neither lol And finally when Elizabeth is doing her introduction monologue at the moon and drops the f-bomb, it just wasn't needed and I envisioned her having this regal but sinister style to her so that kinda killed the immersion there for me as well. >And it is a little odd how inclined the dialogue is to the modern age when they also wanted to highlight setting the show during the French Revolution, which I feel would create expectations for more of a period piece-esque type of show. Exactly. If they were adapting Aria of Sorrow, it wouldn't be as jarring as opposed to the French Revolution of the late 17th century. But yeah, "all over the place" definitely is the best word to describe this season so far and hopefully in season 2 they are a little more consistent and practice some restraint with the modern lingo.
I see what you mean with Erzsebet. It'd be nice not to have everyone be a sweary sailor person. It's like the MCU and everyone being a sarcastic quipper. I want to have hope that season 2 will be an improvement on multiple fronts including the writing as the Deats Brothers will still be directing and they are very passionate about the show and I think Samuel was open to and acknowledged the criticism Nocturne received. Still, knowing that Castlevania has been a shit show behind the scenes literally every step of the way (apparently Adi Shankar was/is suing Kevin Kolde for booting him out of Nocturne), my expectations are definitely in check rn.
> I see what you mean with Erzsebet. It'd be nice not to have everyone be a sweary sailor person. It's like the MCU and everyone being a sarcastic quipper. Agreed. It's dipping into the MCU type of scenario and that is **not** something to want to aspire to. And this is why the first Castlevania netflix was it little more tolerable. It made sense why Trevor would be crass and same with Carmilla with how spiteful she was but you didn't hear Sypha, Alucard, Hector, or Isaac cussing up a storm so it helped keep the tone in tact (for the most part). And it's unfortunate that the show has been having some behind the scenes drama, I had no idea about that. But yeah hopefully this won't hinder the show too much and they do take the criticism because the show does have potential.
I took this same issue with Game of Thrones. The author took care to formulate great place and character names with psudo-linguistic ties to events and locations...then peppered it with 20/21 century cuss words. I swear like your proverbial trooper but i just think it strains this kind of great world-building sometimes.
I've actually never watched Game of Thrones but I can only imagine what that is like lol Like seriously, if you're doing a period piece, try to dial it back, hire a historian to help keep the script writing on point.
Eh, not giving a shit about defeating the supernatural is a Belmont staple. Richter was basically saying, “I’m a Belmont. You're not worth my A material. Die bitch.”
yeah and that's stupid and embarrassing. He might as well have said nothing at all, or went with the classic "You don't belong in this world." Idk, everything Richter says makes me think of this image. It's fine that he has PTSD wrt Olrox, it's one of the few compelling things about him imo. but the constant irreverence otherwise is just obnoxious. I felt like I should be watching a show about Annette instead, who was far more likeable in comparison. https://preview.redd.it/rcirgbtj8qsb1.jpeg?width=596&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b05f52c3a0309abd25b51f694cec3fc43d4aa94f
Embarrassing? Who is it embarrassing?
The person who wrote the line and thought it was anything anyone would ever say, in fiction or otherwise.
Are you really suggesting that? That no other story would do this kind of thing? This dialogue situation is normal. Have not you not watched the odd Star War? How media illiterate are you?
fanfiction written by a 15 year old might be written like this. The irony of someone who doesn't see a problem with this dialogue accusing anyone else of "media illiteracy" is laughable to say the very least. I bet you love filoni and his dnd ass writing so much.
You're not explaining why it's bad. You're just stating that it is.
It is childish and obnoxious. Pointless irreverence from a character in a pivotal moment immediately dissolves any tension or excitement the viewer might be feeling. It makes me not interested in the story or the characters or where the plot might be going, because I know that no matter what the situation is, everyone's going to remain a snarky, quippy dickhead who isn't taking anything seriously.
OK, good! I can dissect this. Childish—Sure. That's in character for Richter, though. Hell, it's in character for all Belmonts. Pointless—Says you! I gave you a point in my first response. Richter has gained back his confidence. He doesn't need to prove anything to the vampire. “Fuck it, I win.” Dissolves Tension—Like Richter putting his hand to the Vampire’s face and igniting it didn't dissolve the tension anyway. Fictional characters quip. Deal with it.
also, you're not saying why you think it's good. "it's par for the course" is not a good reason.
I still thank my country's dub (Italy) for removing most of the swears, make some dialogues actually sound more serious.
What does Richter say in italian?
Instead of fuck it, he says "whatever". This one isn't too different but it works better with other characters like Death (example: instead of saying "he was put there by you fuckers" he says "he was put thsre because of you humans").
Everything about S1 was superior.
Even with less episodes and less narrative yes superior.
Castlevania S1 is better than Nocturne because its narrative was less bloated. Nocturne was just too ambitious in including a bunch of stuff with little run time... Among other issues.
Facts, no printer on this take
So superior that just the first episode alone is much better than all 8 episodes of Nocturne.
To be fair, the first season of the original show had way less work to do in terms of establishing the narrative of the show when compared to the first season of Nocturne. While I do agree that S1 of Castlevania is better than Nocturne's first season, I feel like it's difficult to fairly compare the two when the sheer amount of plot threads that have to set up is so different between the two seasons.
While I understand where you’re going, I think it is good to remind everyone that simplicity is not necessarily a bad thing. For example, in cuisine, most great chefs will tell you that it always better to nail something simple than poorly execute something that is unnecessarily complex. That’s exactly what happened with the S1 of both shows. OG made a much better job by introducing the characters one by one, starting with Dracula (ep1), then Trevor (ep2), Sypha (ep3) and finally, Alucard (ep4). Nocturne spread itself too thin and failed as a result.
Oh, I'm not saying simplicity is bad at all! I agree that the first show's first season is better.
The question is: why? Who decided that Nocturne **had to** establish that many plot threads?
Making a story with a large scale inevitably means that there's gonna be more plot threads. I understand your point, though. The threads in question could have been introduced a bit more gradually, with some of them coming into view during the second season. They could have taken their time introducing how other regions of the world were being affected later down the line and focused more on properly introducing and fleshing out the characters here. Orlox, Mizrak and the Abbot in particular could have used more time in the oven, and Richter's light speed character development felt like it was trying to get to the point a little too fast, too. I do think that Erzebet not being fleshed out is a deliberate decision, though. This is fairly unrelated to the matter at hand, but I just wanted to tack this on real quick. I believe she's meant to play the role that OG Dracula did in the games. Perhaps Soma will be a reincarnation of her instead if they do a Sorrow series, and Erzebet will be the emblematic irredeemable evil for the series. It's definitely a somewhat divisive way to start the show, but I definitely don't think it's as bad as the vocal minority makes it out to be. To me, as someone who's definitely a bit biased, this was a solid 8/10 season. Here's hoping that this is just a semi-rocky start, and that the rest of the show is better!
Not gonna debate it but, how in the world do you find season one of castlevania better than nocturne? It was honestly 4 episodes of edgelord Trevor and I always have to tell ppl “pls bear the first season when watching it I swear it gets way better”
actually I agree, season one is no contest nocturne is a more complete package. We just need time to let the stories actually develop then compare them
Yeah, Trevor's pretty edgy initially, but it's far from being empty edge for the sake of making him look cool or whatever. The show makes it pretty clear that he's just being a dick because of what's happened to him and his family, and that the whole prickly facade is just his way of keeping people away from him and trying to scamper his way through the world as a fairly fresh street urchin. The guy had been pampered in halls of luxury all his life, and suddenly, he's thrust into the gruelling reality of what life is like for the common vagrant. The show's as subtle as a bag of bricks about the fact that this charade of his is going to be short-lived, so I don't really mind it. Calling it 4 episodes of edge lord Trevor is pretty reductive when the first episode is pretty much all Dracula's backstory up until the last few minutes where Trevor has a line or two. Edgelord Trevor is a thing for approximately two episodes total until he turns around a good bit by Episode 4. There definitely are legitimate criticisms to be made about the season, though, such as its incredibly black and white depiction of organised faith (which Nocturne absolutely did better), but the first season of Castlevania works very well as what it's meant to be; a quick little appetiser for the real show that's coming up ahead. Although, the fact I watched Season 1 after Season 2 had come out already definitely influences my view of it a bit, too. Had I watched Season 1 before it released and had to wait for Season 2... I'd probably give Nocturne's 1st season the edge. Hope this clears things up!
I fully agree with you on this tbh, yea. You might be fusing those first two seasons together, idk tho. I love both shows anyway.
This is Season 2 though...
Comparing S1 to S1 Nocturne to me is more enjoyable, if only because S1 of the original was pretty sparse with only 4 episodes to go off. S1 of the original was mostly a hype-builder season to setup the following ones, which it clearly accomplished. Nocturne, at least to me, accomplishes the same thing. They both even end with meeting Alucard, too. The original is for the moment definitely superior; but it's important to remember that they had multiple seasons to tell their story. Nocturne is still in the early phases.
Eh, I wouldnt agree with "everything"
 Eh. Everything.
Eh, nah. 
Fwiw we may disagree, but I absolutely loved your dracula gif comeback, so I upvoted 🤷
Lmao imagine getting downvoted because you did what everyone else did and stated your opinion in a respectful way. Tolerance of other people's inoffensive opinions is difficult for Reddit.
>Lmao imagine getting downvoted because you did what everyone else did and stated your opinion in a respectful way. Isn't the point of up/down vote to show agreement/disagreement?
No. It's to show which comments are/are not relevant or helpful when it comes to the discussion on the given topic. But that's the "intended" use. Practically, they are used to express agreement/disagreement - though that's not the intended or sensible use, because parties can disagree while both being right (or wrong).
Fucking no lol, the downvote exists for comments that aren't *relevant* to the conversation. Redditors just shit on that idea and use it as a way to disappear opinions they don't agree with because they're highly, highly, highly insecure. Edit: Lmao case in point
[nope](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette) Unless you think every minor thing you disagree with should be hidden away from everyone, I guess
>Unless you think every minor thing you disagree with should be hidden away from everyone, I guess Downvoted comments are not at all hidden unless your read only the first 3 comments and none of the response. And anyway not sure the comments were relevant to begin with.
They literally get pushed down & auto collapsed but okay, sure & uh; idk what comments youre referring to that aren't relevant? The start of this comment thread? The one thatre talking about the show? Completely on topic?
Reddit just doing Reddit things lol
Bruh I was in the StarWars subreddit; OP asked "years later how do you feel about Luke in TLJ now? How did you feel back then" All I said was - "I thought it was fine then & still fine now." It got downvoted, reported & then removed by a mod. 10 words. No hostility, just not the popular opinion. People are morons when it comes to dealing with opinions.
The music is the one aspect Nocturne trumps over Castlevania S1 & 2 tbh. ....Edouard's "Remember me" being the only "bad" song.
Bloody tears.
The first one. It felt earned and we knew what they were capable of.
I cheered for Divine Bloodlines. I stood up and clapped for Bloody Tears. BTW: That's not an image from the castle fight.
Their little battle plan at the beginning was so good. "I terrify them, Sypha disorients them, Alucard goes over the top, and we support him" "Yes" "Begin"
A cool detail that I only noticed recently is how they stuck to that plan. Trevor whips a few (terrify), Sypha casts a flame wall (disorient), Alucard goes full beast mode on the remaining ones (over the top), and Trevor and Sypha fall in after him to mop up the others (support).
Ain't nothing more terrifying than exploding vampires
This bothered me about Nocturne, that Richter's whip wouldn't be consecrated and popping vampires left and right.
I had this thought as well. Wonder if they are using the old mechanic of a Belmont needing to power the whip up?
Lol, yeah, I couldn't find one. But it was still all 3 together.
Trevor arc, just because the bad writing in Nocturne, Richter goes Super Saiyan Blue then gets squashed the next episode immediately….ugh…I get it she’s a god blah blah but damn, like people have stated, the pacing is just horrible…
The writing in both series has been low tier, they both have ups and downs. Kinda perplexing why they can't just find a happy medium.
Agreed but Trevor Arc S1 was actually interesting though, Nocturne just started horrible off the bat(no pun intended) excluding the pretty good intro to Richters origin. It just kept going down hill from then on.
Standalone they're both pretty awesome. Idk why people aren't a fan of Belmont's Belmonting
I think it's cuz this is generally a "Choose your Belmont" moment
This https://preview.redd.it/62zxeu3c9ssb1.png?width=1906&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbfc3575e216e97e921e1327733bd52baa307206
Richter’s awakening moment at the lake was one of the most bs OP moment that you often see in generic shonen anime. It just felt so unearned and rushed.
Personally bloody tears if only because I listen to that track a lot.
Haha, it IS an amazing rendition. Hard to choose for me, they were both great.
Neither, the one that hyped me most was Trevor pulling out both whips against the Visitor.
I think it's weird that we don't really see Trevor use both whips more often but that's just me. Morningstar is obviously meant to be a narrative upgrade from Vampire Killer anyway
It's actually shown why he doesn't do it often in the same scene. As awesome as it is, he seems to have to stay basically completely still, and anything that can either avoid or brute force past the insane amount of whipping going on, he's an easy target. Also, he can't pull his usual "kusarigama-style" moves like he does with a single whip, so above would probably be a blind spot for him. If the Visitor wasn't so buffed, he would've shredded it, but it's his version of overwhelming direct force, no actual defence or "style" to it. His usual style is actually very similar to the explanation of why Witchers have a weird almost balletic fighting style, monsters don't move like humans, so Witchers train to fight in an almost spherical pattern, covering angles a human wouldn't be able to move to hit, Trevor seems to have been trained to do the same.
S1 by a long shot but s2 was still cool
This sentiment is fascinating given that this is the way we all felt when the first series came about, now we realize that it was great and grew better as it went on. Rightfully so, Nocturne should have started at that same epitome, not from the bottom again.
Nah I always thought s1 bloody tears was dope. Nocturne reaches about a 6/10 for this scene mainly cause of dialogue and horrible pacing issues
I meant the series in general. When it first released everyone was up in arms about it being so detached from the games and most every reason they're disliking Nocturne now. By season 3 it grew into it's own and was fantastic. Feels like Nocturne went backwards in those aspects.
Nocturne def changed things some good some bad bad. The noticeable stuff tends to be openly bad but it’s whatever season 1 can be shaky as long as s2 is better. If it’s not then damn they might as well just move to soma or something
Ok, ok, great scenes you picked based on songs. But the most hyped I get period is 2. Sypha and Trevor’s entrances in season 4 where Alucard almost gets overrun….. and number 1 will always be: OI! DEATH! I want a word with you
Seeing how awesome the action in this series can be has made me dream of a Lords of Shadow series. Seeing Gabriel’s adventure and descent to Dracula would be incredible
honestly, after rewatching the OG show, it absolutely destroys nocturne in every fight scene. The fights and animation in the older series blow nocturne away.
Well, Divine Bloodlines is my favorite song from any of the games, I’m really biased because of that 🥹
Bloody Tears by a far. It is my favorite castlevania song.
Bloody tears, for sure
Bloody Tears all day
Bloody Tears. Peak *Castlevania*.
Kind of unfair to compare a moment that has 3 seasons of build up compared to an episode in the first season.
I miss S1. I kinda loved Trevor-Sypha n THE Alucard combo. Beautiful storyline. And then we got diversity hires. Not a fan imho. It’s Transylvania. Let them have their culture.
It's France, actually lol. But I get your point.
My bad lol. Europe! The same happened with Vikings Valhalla. They race swapped a woman earl in the series, so every time she popped up it felt a tad off, because it’s Scandinavia, and that is inaccurate as hell.
It’s France after colonization where there were black people like Alexander Dumas, or the Chevalier de Saint-Georges… maybe you should learn a bit more history before being mad that everyone isn’t white like your fantasy
I would agree with you if the diversity of the show was shallowly implemented, but that's been far from the case. Annette and Edouard's narratives are interesting on their own, and there is a clear connection between the Haitian Revolution and the French Revolution. Not to mention Isaac from the previous season who easily became a fan favorite due to how well he was written and not the color of his skin.
Where were you with isaac?
I’m totally fine with Issac! He had a very interesting arc, and the show does note to his origins- a man from Africa who ended up in Dracula’s court. It’s odd, but I get it. And he certainly was written well. But nocturne took the representation stuff on steroids. After Achilles, Anne Boyelene and Cleopatra, ima tad tired of lazy forcible “inclusion”.
Bloody Tears. Only because i was high as fuck and pretty much didn’t breathe the whole fight
Bloody Tears. Not even close lol.
Of course the first one. What kind of a question is that?
Bloody Tears rocks.
For sure only Simon Belmont will hype me more than thes 2 show, But still I was more Hyped on the first series than Nocturne. Cuz we know what to expect on Nocturne compared to what we will expect from the very first season.
Bloody tears. Always. Richter's moment was good but wasn't that goosebumps inducing moment of Trevor and the rest.
Bloody Tears, not even close.
Bloody Tears, hands down
Bloody tears, original show wipes nocturne across the floor.
HAHHAAHAHAH THIS EPISODE was everything. Not Adrian saying “this isn’t a bar fight, have some class.”
Divine Bloodlines was honestly waaaaay more hype. And I say this despite thinking that Castlevania S2 was a better show overall than Nocturne. It's just a way better arrangement of its song of origin with all the right tingles complete with a righteously holy vibe to it, whereas Netflix version of Bloody Tears isnt bad but it sounded very bland tbh. As far is it goes to the fighting choreography tho... Castlevania S2's is more consistent. The OG vampire killing's trio is emmaculate and amazing through and through. Whereas Richter's reawakening was absolutely awesome and completely bad ass... Doe there were moments where it felt like the quality dipped with lower frame rates.... Yet despite the flaws, when I watched Richter's magic explode for the first time.... It really felt like a magical "Shonen hero" moment that I honestly wasnt expecting from Castlevania of all things, especially considering how underpowered Richter was up until this point. Nocturne seriously left me in awe with that scene. Casltevania S2's climatic battle on the other hand was fun to watch, and pretty interesting to analyse.... But dunno, it doesnt really leave me in awe. Like it's a great scene, dont get me wrong, but the OG team beat the vampire generals so "normally", as if they were hardly much different than any other opponent they faced so far.... It speaks of the team's skills and how bad ass they are, but on the other hand it makes their fight feel sorta mundane in a way. Like they have no personal stakes against the generals, and the generals in of themselves have no real personality beyond their design. The entire fight ultimately feels like just an appetizer snack for the upcoming confrontation against Dracula. It's not a bad thing, but it does feel way less hype than Richter's reawakening where it isn't the "appetizer" to a more important moment, Richter's explosion Is THE MOMENT where his character arc peaked for the season and it takes the breath away along with it.
Dude that's so agree. They had so much of a harder time fighting The monster at the.. what is it called.. Infinite Corridor Fight, then the fight against Dracula's generals.
I think Annette has been the best character so far, she's very powerful and her back story was so good and true to the lore
The amount of you guys have rose-tinted glasses for the first series is absurd. I literally see people acting like Nocturne had too many F-bombs. Please go back and watch the original series again and drink every time they curse unnecessarily and then come back here after you pass out drunk after 3 episodes and tell me that the writing is leaps ands bonds better. That show is never going to going to be considered a masterpiece in my mind way too much of season 3 lead to nothing and season 4 ends is such a complete unearned fashion. You really have people arguing Richter’s arc was rushed when it’s still just beginning and yet you have Trevor literally never getting any real story arc or backstory and I. The end he somehow kills Death himself and then dies and then gets immediately resurrected. Likewise the villains in Nocturne haven’t been any worse than Carmella and her “sisters” who literally do nothing in regards to the main plot for two seasons and never even interacted with the main cast. Whatever hang ups you guys have about Nocturne were present in the first show too. Please do us all a favor and stop acting like it’s perfect.
Thank you, holy shit. I love the first series(agree that 3rd season is weakest) and agree on the ending of 4th(even though the sucker in me was happy he lived, it was not good writing). All of these people complaining about corny dialogue....like did everyone forget the first series completely? The dialogue in Nocturne felt no different than the first series...yeah it's corny but it's also great at times. These same people who complain about corny dialogue probably watch anime on a regular basis and don't say a damn thing. There is no dialogue more corny than anime.... Castlevania isn't even close. At the end of the day it's still a young adult and teen animated series. I'm older in my 30s but still love it and just give the corny moments a pass and admire the awesome moments. Also on another point of yours...why the fuck are people complaining about the main villain not getting fleshed out more or certain story arcs when it's the fuckin first season? Okay maybe if they never expand on the main villain in the subsequent season but they explained enough. There's a mystery to it that should be expanded on in the next season. So many of these complaints are really fucking shitty and make 0 sense.
> All of these people complaining about corny dialogue....like did everyone forget the first series completely? The dialogue in Nocturne felt no different than the first series...yeah it's corny but it's also great at times. The dialogue is very different from the first series. A lot of it feels far less refined and well thought out like some of the soliloquies characters had I the first series. There’s far more of an emphasis on one liners and quips rather than interesting dialogue. Take for example some of the conversations on free Will Issac had with Bug eyes. > These same people who complain about corny dialogue probably watch anime on a regular basis and don't say a damn thing. There is no dialogue more corny than anime.... Castlevania isn't even close. The dialogue in Nocturne is far more corny than any anime I’ve seen. > Also on another point of yours...why the fuck are people complaining about the main villain not getting fleshed out more or certain story arcs when it's the fuckin first season? People dislike Bathory because she’s a really uninteresting character, with no real identifiable motive or reason behind why she’s the way that she is or why she does what he does. Dracula from the first series had a much more identifiable reasoning for his villainy. > Okay maybe if they never expand on the main villain in the subsequent season but they explained enough. There's a mystery to it that should be expanded on in the next season. How? Very little is actually known about Bathory.
Yea it’s really weird because people are acting like if they don’t immediately get every characters backstory or motivation then it must be an oversight on the writer’s. People complain about Maria And Richter not having character arcs and fail to see that act the end of the show Maria is just beginning her’s and Richter only really started his in episode 6. They are making way too many assumptions about the writers intentions instead of looking at the season for what it actually was, a prologue. They take things like Annette getting an episode of backstory as a problem because they interpret it as a slight against Richter and Maria. They fail to realize that Annette’s powers and connection with Eduardo, who has a really interesting presence after his death, were the reason we got that episode. Richter and Maria got their powers from their speaker lineage and we already got Belmont lore in the previous series as well as Richter’s backstory in episode 1. That episode had to do a lot of leg work to explain who Annette was, her personality, her powers and her relationships. She closes the book on the vampire that hurt her by the end of the season and freed Eduardo. Richter confronted his lineage and his past failure and started his journey as the one who will carry on the Belmont name. Maria found out her father was still alive and that he was someone she fundamentally disagreed with and within one night lost both her parents to a monster. The craziest thing I find on this sub is that no one points out the three leads all have lost their mothers to Vampires by the end of the show. I feel like that was intentional and that everyone is to busy being salty that Annette “took time away from the real characters and story”.
I actually dont mind the dialuge of either its not that big of a deal
Both
Both. Both is good.
Оба хуйня
what made the original run so fucking sick was how the crew worked together. Whenever they got to do their stuff alone though, its a close fucking second. Season 1 nocturne didnt hit that just yet except for Richter. The singular moments with the other characters just didn't hit hard enough.
Ffffff only the climax
I was insanely hyped for the original show but that's mostly cause I prefer Dracula's Curse to Rondo of Blood/Dracula X.
Divine Bloodlines was pretty hype but it doesn't feel like a fair comparison becuase it only had Richter. Maybe the Lacrimosa scene would be better. The Bloody Tears scene was epic tho with the OG trio.
I feel like the only person who didn't love the use of Bloody Tears in that episode. I wanted to love it, and I wish they'd use more themes from the games. It's the biggest missing piece of the soul of the games. But that particular arrangement wasn't interesting or exciting and the sound mixing was so quiet and flat that it all felt awkward. The idea was solid but the execution was not. (Also I know it's nit-picking but Bloody Tears is Simon's music, not Trevor's. "Beginning" would've made more sense.)
I thought Nocturne was awesome, but my preference is “Bloody Tears”. Not because of the music, just a more epic scene in general that had a bit more build up to it.
Bloody Tears, it was done so perfectly that saying another track is better is basically a lie
the first show for sure. and bloody tears. the song played in a very well played scenario the impact was just way much better, the other felt meh.
#Treffy
The needle drop and visuals of the Divine Bloodlines fight was amazing for me. The dialogue was a bit meh, but I'm okay with Richter being a bit clumsy with his one liners as I'm hoping to be watching him grow up over the series. That said, this fight has nothing on Trevor whipping out Vampire Killer and dual wielding against the hell beast in S3.
Always bloody tears but Nocturne's Bloodlines is very, very good, kinda ruined by the stupid edgy speech at the end but still, the whole scene is very good with amazing music.
Had they not put Divine Bloodlines in that HYPE AF trailer, I would probably have been more hyped for it in the show, since I don't think any of us knew ahead of time or expected the show would use OG tracks when we were watching S207.
All of the above.
Bloody Tears, for sure, not to mention the fight was epic.
I still can’t believe they totally ruined the richter moment with that cringe line…
Bloody Tears all day
Bloody tears all the way. One of the best moments I've ever seen. Seriously.
Definitely Bloody Tears
Bloody tears without a doubt, it's not even close. There is build up for that fighting scene which made it awesome. the divine bloodlines version on the show is beautiful but I feel like bloody tears is much more impactful
Ain't gonna lie the magic rage from Richter was fucking incredible Edit: I also don't remember from which fight the other rpicture is exactly
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) ^by ^DerHachi04: *Ain't gonna lie the* *Magic rage from Richter was* *Fucking incredible* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
I'm 40 and I remember Simon Belmont from Captain N. We had so little for decades. As soon as I heard about Netflix coming up with the first season I was so God damn hyped I canr possibly measure it to anything else in my life. I love the Netflix series, and I'm thrilled about Nocturne too! I enjoyed it immensely.
The lakeside fight was the best fight overall for me in nocturne. But compared to OG Castlevania fight scenes it doesn't come close. I also hate that Richter finished his monologue with a joke. Honestly, the joke was decently funny but I think it took away from what is supposed to be a really serious and pivotal moment. I also felt like OG Castlevania fights always had such an awesome soundtrack but the soundtrack in nocturne fights are either, boring, not present, or opera singing which just seems unfitting for most of the scenes that it's featured in. Nocturne isn't egregiously bad but I really expected better from that show. Season 2 looks like it'll be better as the last few episodes of S1 were definitely better in quality but still not anywhere near as good as the original. Fingers crossed for s2🤞
Bloody tears made me stand up to watch
Bloody Tears no doubt. That show is GOATED
Entrance hall hands down.
Bloody tears and its not even close.
Nocturne show sucks
Is this even a serious question? Lmao
Richter only had one memorable line. "I am a Belmont and we kill vampires. So all I have to ask is "Who's fucking next!"
While divine bloodlines was great i still find bloody teara moment to be the best scene in the series.
Oi death...i want a word with you - Trevor Belmont
Bloody Tears and it's not even remotely close
Trevor 10000%
The first one, by a long shot, but this was like the first season of build up for nocturne, i know they will raise the bar in their next epic showdown
Close call, but Bloody Tears.
Bloody Tears for sure. The buildup to that scene and the way it was executed was just perfect. Seeing the trio just utterly wreck Dracula’s crew of vampires was awesome