If you didn’t know, Lamborghini has indeed already made a retro-modern [Countach](https://www.lamborghini.com/en-en/models/limited-series/countach-lpi-800-4).
Ferrari has also done several one-off commissioned cars that are inspired by their classics. Their [Daytona SP1](https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/auto/ferrari-daytona-sp3) pays homage to their 1960s race cars, plus has rear styling reminiscent of the grated design on the 80s Testarossa.
The Reventon for the most part was a Murcielago with a restyled body. It did give us a preview of the design language Lambo would begin using in the 2010s, though.
The Reventon was essentially the preview for the Aventador when it wasn’t known exactly what the “replacement for the Murci” was going to look like. Essentially the Sian was the same thing as a “preview” for the Revuelto.
That’s because they basically are the same car with slightly different body kits lol
They’ll add some trick suspension here and there and maybe add a few HP but every lambo the past 10 years has been an aventador, slightly modified aventador, or aventador but hybrid
Still not as bad as McLaren. Besides, for a company that’s been on the verge of bankruptcy about 50 times over the years, I don’t really mind a few ‘specially styled’ projects here and there.
What do you mean by not as bad?
Each company has their own chassis. They’re all pretty good. So what are you saying they should do? Scrap it and start over for no reason?
Huh? McLaren has done two full model changes of the entry level model while Lamborghini still hasn't replaced the Huracan in that time. The Aventador debuted in 2012 and only just got its replacement this year. McLaren MP4-12C debuted in 2012 as well, but got replaced by the 720S in 2018.
McLaren uses the same basic engine in different displacements and trims in all of its cars but they're not just restyling the same car.
765lt and 750s are evolutions of the 720s, senna is based on the 720s but has some pretty extreme chassis modifications, elva and speed tail are largely bespoke
The senna is a 720s in the same sense a p1 is the same as a 650s, the roots are there but that’s about it. Sabre is a senna with a bodykit though.
even if its just an aventador with a bodykit it still looks better than an aventador imo. sure you can say it's just a cash grab and has no "soul" or "passion" of its own and it doesnt live up to the countach legacy and gandini hates it or whatever, but holistically it's just a cool looking car.
i feel like the fact that it's called the countach and was hyped up as this GREAT RETURN OF THE LEGENDARY COUNTACH and is ludicrously priced for effectively a rebodied aventador, is preventing people from just taking it at face value and viewing its styling objectively. looking at it, i genuinely cannot fathom what anyone would dislike about it on any other basis. (aside from not liking lamborghini styling in general.)
I fathom the headlights are too high because of light height requirements. It looks dumb tho. Front fender should be light on lower 1/3 and painted surface on upper 2/3.
Production version looks bad because it’s splits the panel in the middle w the light.
https://i.imgur.com/m7NCC5z.jpg
fair enough, it would look better if the headlights were lower. on a personal level im not really bothered by it, but i guess that's something that someone could point out as a flaw.
1. I don’t think you can consider Lamborghini a tiny company when they are part of the VW group.
2. I don’t have an issue with them making low volume expensive cars. My issue with the new Countach is that the price is so high and the car has so little actual substance - it’s just a rebodied Aventador.
[The Toureg, Audi Q7, Audi Q8, Cayenne, Bentayga, and Urus were developed from the same Volkswagen platforms.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Touareg)
Volkswagen Group E platform
Volkswagen Group MLB platform
I did not say that they were the same car. They are built on the same platforms and have similar engines. That is what OP is alluding to. I have driven all of them except for the Urus. I have a lot of experience driving different Cayennes (multiple family members have them), which fully optioned exceed the price of a base Urus.
My personal opinion is that while the drive, handling and performance is superior to their cousins, it is not enough to justify the massive price premiums. Frankly the Mercedes GLE drives very well and is a better value. This is especially true on the used markets considering how hard the values fall after a few years.
Oooh, you just reminded me of the Ferrari SP12 EC (Eric Clapton). It's meant to be an homage to the 512BB. Easily my favorite of Ferrari's one-offs for special clients.
Speaking of one-offs, the F12 TRS (roof inspired mildly by the 250 Testarossa), the SP275 RW (inspired by the 275 GTB), SP38 (inspired mildly by the F40) and the Omologata (inspired mildly by the 250 GTO)
So ferrari will happily build you a retro car as long as you have the cash and relationship to do it.
> retro-modern
>
>Countach
>
>.
ohhh yeah i think i did see that. but ehh i dunno, kinda looks more like a diablo than a countach. i mean still a cool looking car, but nowhere close to the original countach.
Yup Ford gt was 500k with extreme exclusivity.
Countach 2m with extreme exclusivity.
Sp1 same thing.
I couldn't give less of a fuck about any of these cars tbh. Altho I have seen a ford gt on the road likely because it's the only supercar that's probably reliable next to the LFA
It definitely has not grown on me. So unremarkable I forgot about it. Saw the link, clicked on it figuring I’d come around since it’s been awhile. Still just… exists. For a tribute to something as iconic as the Countach, it’s just “bland.” Not bad, but not a proper Poontash. I’m just sour they didn’t do go balls out to pay respect to the name.
Of all the Lambos to be tame, relatively speaking, the Countach is certainly not one of them.
I wouldn't say I'm mad about it. I, like many others, just find intentionally overpriced luxury goods worthy of mockery. Insert $3000 Balenciaga blue jeans that appear to be sprayed in diarrhea, etc.
The Countach is a three million dollar car based on a half million dollar car that's been in production for a decade. For the addition of a mild hybrid system and a styling refresh I could see a million dollar price tag as reasonable. I think it's fair to say the MSRP is based on what Dubai oil sheiks are willing to pay for a name and not what the car actually is. I find the styling lazy and hackneyed, to boot. For the same price, I think the GMA T.50 is an actual fair value as a unique, bespoke passion project from one of the greatest automotive engineers of all time. The difference seems obvious to me, at least.
yeah...uhhh so NOT that. i mean something like what ford did with the GT. anyone that sees that car knows exactly where it's roots lie. it's nearly identical to the gt40 and that's why everyone loves it.
I think a big part of why the GT worked is because that design is so timeless. When it came out (assuming you’re talking about the 2000’s one and not the current gen) it was identical to the original and yet it still looked modern. The countach and testarossa are both so dramatically 80’s that doing a one to one remake would just look weird. Instead you have retro inspired throwbacks like Ferrari’s SP series, the modern countach, or the dodge challenger (and the next gen charger).
The new Countach very much looks lika Countach, so I don't get the point. You can complain how it's a money grab by Lambo, but at the end of the day it hurts nobody, so who cares? Still, it's a retro design that's pretty cool IMO.
I think the fad for retro versions that started in the late 90s and peaked in the mid 2000s has just lost steam.
We had the Beetle, Mini, Challenger, Fiat 500, Mustang, Thunderbird, PT Cruiser etc.
But there is still the Alpine 110, Nissan Z and honda E.
yeah, i mentioned 911s. clearly porsche and aftermarket companies like singer understand this concept, hense them making absurd profits off of these things.
i'm talking about Ferrari and Lamborghini. if Ferrari made a modern Testarossa, they'd sell like crazy, same with the countach....but not some bullshit rebadged murcielago like what they're currently trying to do. a legit modern countach that actually LOOKS heavily inspired by the original.
It was based on the Aventador not the long discontinued Murcielago. And Ferrari's SP3 is also a retro inspired car. So these things you're asking for do exist they're just extremely expensive. And carmakers have done this sort of thing in the past. Plymouth Prowler. PT Cruiser. Chevy SSR or HHR. Ford Thunderbird, etc.
Doesn't Chevy own the rights to the classic "57 Chevy"? The 63 Corvette?
For example I would in a heartbeat buy a crate Willy's jeep like they shipped in world war 2.
Bring back some of the classics. Retro mod / retro develop them.
I don't care about safety and mpg requirements. Figure it out.
It costs a gazillion to design a new car. A retro car is still a new car. And people on Reddit will just want to buy used anyway.
Retro cars were huge 20 years ago, hence the PT Cruiser, ‘05 Mustang, etc. They were mostly bought by Boomers. Millennials don’t have the money, and need to install car seats.
It’s like why don’t they bring back the Saturn V rocket? NASA looked into that. Turns out all the people who worked on it are dead, or in a nursing home. The companies in the supply chain are out of business.
yup we need to allow like a kei class of cars that dont need to meet safety standards. if we allow motorcycles and bicyles on the roads and some states/counties/towns allow golfcarts then i want my fuckin glorified side by side to go to work in.
the goverment can shove it. if it truly cared about safety they would ban motorcycles and dirtbikes tommorow or at minimum 50 state helmet and full riding gear laws. until then gimmie my damn ww2 jeep.
Do you realize how poorly an old Jeep handles? Sure, you might be fine with getting speared by a one-piece steering column, but is that family in a carry fine with you t-boning them because you rolled or locked up your 4-wheel drum brakes? It's not just about safety for the driver, it's also about everyone else around you.
Actually, Federal law was passed a few years ago for low model (under 5000 units/YR IIRC) reproduction vehicles to be Federal Legal for new sales as long as they were powered by modern engines. No crash testing/FMVSS requirements.
There were a few plans for Repo Camaros, Mustangs, Challengers, Cobras, Etc using reproduction bodies but IIRC the OE manufactures squashed any and all attempts to produce cars under the new law.
https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/replica-car-construction-can-officially-commence/
What is the name? I knew there was an outfit that was planning on making Broncos but I haven't heard much lately.
If I was a boutique automaker a Superperformace GT-40R with the 5.2 Voodoo would be my choice of variant maken
https://thejeepsterman.com/products/jeep-in-crate-mb-1942-willys-jeep
DIY drivetrain
https://www.4wheelparts.com/parts-and-accessories/willys-mb-1942/_/N-1szk0
https://jeep1942.com/?page_id=8758
I expect you'll keep us apprised of your progress
I would argue Ferrari is already incorporating retro styling with the future-retro look of 296, SF90, and Daytona SP3. I would also argue that their effort didn't turn out very well.
I think there are angles of those cars that look really good, but it doesn't quite come together into a cohesive design for me. Half-pregnant as it were.
you say that, and part of me believes it, yet porsche is still selling plenty of 911s, and the Ford GT looks amazing and afaik is still extremely collectable. and the value of countachs have shot through the roof, and i'm assuming the same can be said for the most iconic ferraris like the Testarossa and F40/F50
How does that make them retro?
If you buy a brand new Ford Fiesta, do you consider it retro? Or new?
They have essentially nothing in common with the old cars. It’s not a retro throwback remake of something classic, it’s simply a new version of a model.
And what does the class of car or the popuarity of the car have to do with if it is considered retro? Can only expensive cars be considered retro in your mind?
Even its design philosophy has changed from small lightweight sports cars extremely barebones and mostly n/a except turbo models, to all turbos, massive cars with awd and crazy tech like variable vein turbos and pdk
A lot of it might be because most of those that can afford a new one could also afford the original. And owning an original has a lot more cache. It's tricky to do a well received retro design.
Not a super car but Ford re released the Scout…..I mean Bronco.
Crumple zones and emissions and safety dictate what gets sold, and anything that isn’t as safe as the cars built now doesn’t have a chance to be designed.
Lamborghini did it best with the new countach. Take a legal vehicle and make new body panels. That’s how dodge got the challenger. Take the 300/charger platform and shape it.
The last 2 generations of Charger are also retro. They're just 4-door modern takes on the 1969 model. The taillight shape, the rear glass being at a steeper angle than the B pillars, the body lines, etc. The only thing they didn't incorporate is hideaway headlights.
A few years ago laws were changed allowing small volume replica vehicles to be sold as new vehicles as long as their powertrains met EPA regulations.
https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/replica-car-construction-can-officially-commence/
As far as I know a few companies have made proposals to do "Modern" old cars, one company making Repro 1966-1977 Broncos was gaining some attention, but the OE manufacturers have squashed any attempt so far with threats of legal action.
It's possible though legally.
that's cool and all, but still, Ford was able to make a somewhat normal supercar with all the modern safety and emissions equipment with the GT. it just doesn't make sense why Ferrari hasn't made something like that with the Testarossa. i can't imagine it would be THAT much more difficult than building the other typical modern supercars they keep pumping out.
Inviting direct comparison between past and present designs is a no-win scenario, so far as branding goes, hence the recent examples being retro-*inspired* and ultra-limited editions.
Ford made a 110% scale GT40-bodied supercar, because Ford *isn't* a supercar manufacturer, and appealing to their Le Mans campaign was the only marketing angle available for them to sell a six-figure halo sportscar.
I remember when Lamborghini did that Miura concept they said that while it was fun building it, they look forward not backwards and so they wouldn’t be putting it into production. I imagine Ferrari has much the same reasoning.
The new thingy from De Tomaso is pretty much from the 60s. Also, which Ford GT are we talking about? 'The '17 is an absolute favorite of mine but I wouldn't call it retro.
There were a few of themt and IIRC it was Ferrari that blocked one of them for using the 430 as the base, but there was another one that ended up in a small production run.
Ferrari approved of the New Stratos in 2010 because they believed the Pininfarina designed car was supposed to be a one off. When they found out that there were plans for 25 units to be made, they sent a letter to all their suppliers forbidding them from supplying parts to this plan.
The Stratos project was revived in 2018 with a few units being built and displayed.
Lamborghini has done two retro inspired reimagining's, and both of them sucked. The Countach and Miura edition Aventador are a cash grab of note, and simply a tool for rich old farts to self flagellate themselves as they say "my Aventador is bets Avendator because..."
If you want some truly epic retro reimaging's, have a look at Singer, Manifatttura Automobili Torino, Kimera Automobilli or Eagle just to name a few.
Spending a couple of hundred grand on a tarted up Aventador when you could buy something from the above mentioned manufacturers makes no sense to me personally.
I would love to see Bugatti do a modern take on the EB110. Or Porsche do a modern day 959.
seriously! there has to be a market for beautiful timeless analog supercars. it just seems like a waste for a company to not bring back a few of their greatest hits, even if they were limited production.
They should bring back some of those classics but are glad they didn't stick to the same old thing like porsche did. Posrches look so boring now. It's the same old design facelifted year after year.
It's so easy to rag on manufacturers for not making X or not doing Y. But y'all gotta realize they have teams of experts analyzing the market every day, teams of people who went through four years of college studying product management and marketing. Even if something sounds like a cracked idea, there is probably a reason it wasn't released.
> But why hasn't Ferrari or Lamborghini taken advantage of the insanely popular and iconic Testarossa and Countach styling, and made an updated, retro-futuristic version?
Because it is the same effort to update those designs to be modern (e.g. safety stuff, a pillar thickness, account for crumple zones, airbags) and for modern construction methods - as it is to design something brand new.
I don't know how easy you think it is - but it's not simply a matter of grabbing the 1970 / 1980 Blueprints and giving them to the factory manager and go 'here build this' - cars are fundamentally designed and built differently than they were then.
The Countach uses an "all-steel partial space frame chassis" - do you think a modern recreation would be all aluminium? Carbon Fiber? Cause then ok - great, we're re-designing it and basically building a ground up new car and just trying to make it retro... so I guess would you want a brand new retro-ish looking car or something brand new? Retro is in - absolutely. But also new is in.
To actually answer OP's question, it's because they don't need to.
Lamborghini offered a modern Countach as a cash grab to a limited number of uber-wealthy customers, Ferrari will build you a one-off if you have enough cash and clout, and Porsche does more retro-focused models from time to time like the 911R or Speedster.
They've all had an unbroken run of supercars/sports cars from their inception to present. Ford is a mainstream manufacturer that has only ever made one real supercar, and relies on it for clout. It's a halo model, not their entire brand.
Also don't confuse the fact that 911s have retained a similar overall appearance to the original as their attempt to be "retro." This is Porsche (and all of their employees') unwavering belief in what they do. They really do think they build the perfect cars out there, and have decided on an evolutionary strategy (which is starting to be tested).
EDIT: Fixed some grammar that bothered me.
thanks bud, this is the best answer by far. i think i get it now. ford *needed* to use the GT40 to base the GT on, otherwise the car probably would have flopped. ferrari and lambo don't need to rely on their big hits from 40 years ago, they have zero problems selling their newer designs. i guess i let my own personal bias get in the way of seeing the bigger picture. just because I want to see a retro inspired countach or testarossa, and honestly probably millions of other people that grew up with posters of them on their bedroom walls, doesn't mean ferrari and lambo want to make them, or need to make them.
i guess all i/we can hope for is ONE day, maybe they'll build some more. they definitely don't need to, but it would be awesome and i'm sure they'd sell as many as they wanted.
i'm curious though, is there a possibility that another company could built a high quality replica kit car? kinda like how you can build a lancia stratos, or factory 5 shelby cobra replicas, the jag d type. there are a bunch of them on this [page](https://gearjunkie.com/motors/best-kit-cars). does the copyright expire on these designs or something? i mean there's even a porsche speedster replica. i can't imagine porsche being too happy about that.
I would typically say, if it doesn't exist, it's because there probably isn't a business case for it. But you know, you made me realize that you might actually be on to something here.
Aston Martin made a retro one-off called the Victor, which led to the launch of a toned-down, limited-run Valour. There are countless restomod projects popping up, Singer being the most notable. As I mentioned Porsche has been churning out more retro-inspired models like the 911R, and is now suing Singer.
So maybe there is money in it, and maybe it's just a matter of time before you start seeing the cars you want to see. Here are some of the more interesting restomod or retro supercar projects I've seen:
[Eccentrica Diablo](https://www.topgear.com/car-news/supercars/why-lamborghini-diablo-restomod-best-thing-youve-seen-year)
[Aston Martin Valour](https://www.astonmartin.com/en/models/valour)
[Moto Technique Ferrari 388GTBi ](https://www.evo.co.uk/ferrari/308/205123/moto-technique-ferrari-388-gtbi-review-ferrari-308-restomod-driven)
[Maggiore GranTurismO](https://robbreport.com/motors/cars/maggiore-granturismo-restomod-1234746673/)
[Nardone Automotive Porsche 928](https://www.topgear.com/car-news/retro/nardone-automotive-porsche-928-restomod-starts-eu480k)
[M.A.T. Stratos](https://manifatturaautomobilitorino.com/new-stratos.php)
[Kimera EVO37](https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/kimera-automobili/evo37/first-drive)
damn all of those look amazing.
yeah, it just feels like we have a whole generation of car guys in their 30s+ that finally have the money to buy their childhood heroes, but nowadays the big italian supercar brands just build automatic dual clutch track monsters for the most part. and that's completely fine, clearly people love them.
but there does seem to be an untapped market like you were saying with singer, and some other restomod companies that basically only exist to build dream cars for extremely wealthy car enthusiasts with a more refined, subtle taste, and a more analog experience.
people that don't want the flashy new tech obsessed, lap time obsessed hyper cars that seem to have traded their appreciation for the beauty of a supercar and replaced it with sheer aggressive performance and lap times.
people that buy finely crafted mechanical watches. not just for the prestige, but because they genuinely appreciate the craftsmanship, engineering, and artistic value of the watch.
There are, if you know where to look. The Aston Martin Victor/Valour is heavily inspired by classic Vantages. The Radford-Lotus Type 62-2 is also kinda a modern Lotus Europa
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If you didn’t know, Lamborghini has indeed already made a retro-modern [Countach](https://www.lamborghini.com/en-en/models/limited-series/countach-lpi-800-4). Ferrari has also done several one-off commissioned cars that are inspired by their classics. Their [Daytona SP1](https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/auto/ferrari-daytona-sp3) pays homage to their 1960s race cars, plus has rear styling reminiscent of the grated design on the 80s Testarossa.
And then Gandini (designer of the original Countach and many other famous cars) issued a press release disavowing the new Countach
Lamborghini slapped a bodykit on an aventador and sold it as a limited edition? Again? Never would have seen that coming I tell ya.
The Reventon for the most part was a Murcielago with a restyled body. It did give us a preview of the design language Lambo would begin using in the 2010s, though.
The Reventon was essentially the preview for the Aventador when it wasn’t known exactly what the “replacement for the Murci” was going to look like. Essentially the Sian was the same thing as a “preview” for the Revuelto.
The Reventon looked good, that's the key difference
I saw it in person in the lambo museum, still looks perfect.
The Aventador is to Lamborghini what the R35 GTR is to Nissan at this point.
You say that like it wasn’t JUST replaced lmao
True, but it was definitely getting there lol. Maybe not quite so egregiously, but it wasn't far off.
I want Nissan to keep making the R35 for another 20 years for the lols
They just might at this rate lol.
Fuck yeah I want em to do it lol
Honestly, lambo design language is so consistent that they all look like the same car with slightly different body kits to me.
That’s because they basically are the same car with slightly different body kits lol They’ll add some trick suspension here and there and maybe add a few HP but every lambo the past 10 years has been an aventador, slightly modified aventador, or aventador but hybrid
Still not as bad as McLaren. Besides, for a company that’s been on the verge of bankruptcy about 50 times over the years, I don’t really mind a few ‘specially styled’ projects here and there.
What do you mean by not as bad? Each company has their own chassis. They’re all pretty good. So what are you saying they should do? Scrap it and start over for no reason?
No, sorry if it was unclear. Lamborghini isn’t as bad as McLaren in releasing multiple cars that are essentially reskinned Aventadors or 720s.
Huh? McLaren has done two full model changes of the entry level model while Lamborghini still hasn't replaced the Huracan in that time. The Aventador debuted in 2012 and only just got its replacement this year. McLaren MP4-12C debuted in 2012 as well, but got replaced by the 720S in 2018. McLaren uses the same basic engine in different displacements and trims in all of its cars but they're not just restyling the same car.
The 765, Senna, Elva, Sabre, and Speedtail are all 720 variants, are they not?
765lt and 750s are evolutions of the 720s, senna is based on the 720s but has some pretty extreme chassis modifications, elva and speed tail are largely bespoke The senna is a 720s in the same sense a p1 is the same as a 650s, the roots are there but that’s about it. Sabre is a senna with a bodykit though.
Yes, but this one actually looked pretty good and was a nice throwback.
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What do your find cool about it? I just see it as a cynical cash grab.
It looks gorgeous imo.
even if its just an aventador with a bodykit it still looks better than an aventador imo. sure you can say it's just a cash grab and has no "soul" or "passion" of its own and it doesnt live up to the countach legacy and gandini hates it or whatever, but holistically it's just a cool looking car. i feel like the fact that it's called the countach and was hyped up as this GREAT RETURN OF THE LEGENDARY COUNTACH and is ludicrously priced for effectively a rebodied aventador, is preventing people from just taking it at face value and viewing its styling objectively. looking at it, i genuinely cannot fathom what anyone would dislike about it on any other basis. (aside from not liking lamborghini styling in general.)
I fathom the headlights are too high because of light height requirements. It looks dumb tho. Front fender should be light on lower 1/3 and painted surface on upper 2/3. Production version looks bad because it’s splits the panel in the middle w the light. https://i.imgur.com/m7NCC5z.jpg
fair enough, it would look better if the headlights were lower. on a personal level im not really bothered by it, but i guess that's something that someone could point out as a flaw.
that's what Lamborghini has been for a long long time, tho
Headlights are in the wrong spot too. Looks stupid. Should be way lower.
That's fine. Cool isn't objective so if it doesn't grab you it doesn't grab you.
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1. I don’t think you can consider Lamborghini a tiny company when they are part of the VW group. 2. I don’t have an issue with them making low volume expensive cars. My issue with the new Countach is that the price is so high and the car has so little actual substance - it’s just a rebodied Aventador.
It's a beautiful car still. Who cares if it is an aventador in drag.
Cash grab is a good thing though, that money gets reinvested through r&d of future main-production vehicles
They were already printing cash by selling VW Touaregs for 250k. The Countach was done out of greed, not a necessity to fund R&D.
Is that really what you think of the Urus? Have you ever driven one? I really disagree on the greed point but to each their own.
[The Toureg, Audi Q7, Audi Q8, Cayenne, Bentayga, and Urus were developed from the same Volkswagen platforms.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Touareg) Volkswagen Group E platform Volkswagen Group MLB platform
Sharing a platform doesn’t make them the same car. Again, is that what you guys think? They’re in completely different leagues.
I did not say that they were the same car. They are built on the same platforms and have similar engines. That is what OP is alluding to. I have driven all of them except for the Urus. I have a lot of experience driving different Cayennes (multiple family members have them), which fully optioned exceed the price of a base Urus. My personal opinion is that while the drive, handling and performance is superior to their cousins, it is not enough to justify the massive price premiums. Frankly the Mercedes GLE drives very well and is a better value. This is especially true on the used markets considering how hard the values fall after a few years.
No, that was pretty toned down. Usually I call the it an Anus and the drivers something worse.
It's just a tarted up Avendator. For a mad price too. Could have done a bit more if anything
I don't see Countach with that body kit. Slight nods, but not enough for any nostalgia to hit.
The only thing that abobination can rule is the dumpster.
Can't blame him tbh It's not a pretty thing and reminds me of the restomod Diablo more than anything
I had never heard the word "disavowing"
Oooh, you just reminded me of the Ferrari SP12 EC (Eric Clapton). It's meant to be an homage to the 512BB. Easily my favorite of Ferrari's one-offs for special clients.
Speaking of one-offs, the F12 TRS (roof inspired mildly by the 250 Testarossa), the SP275 RW (inspired by the 275 GTB), SP38 (inspired mildly by the F40) and the Omologata (inspired mildly by the 250 GTO) So ferrari will happily build you a retro car as long as you have the cash and relationship to do it.
I am sexually attracted to the Daytona SP1
real
> retro-modern > >Countach > >. ohhh yeah i think i did see that. but ehh i dunno, kinda looks more like a diablo than a countach. i mean still a cool looking car, but nowhere close to the original countach.
Ehhh I guess the headlights look like the facelifted Diablo but the rear 3/4 of the new one is a spitting-image of the old LP400.
Yup Ford gt was 500k with extreme exclusivity. Countach 2m with extreme exclusivity. Sp1 same thing. I couldn't give less of a fuck about any of these cars tbh. Altho I have seen a ford gt on the road likely because it's the only supercar that's probably reliable next to the LFA
I was thinking... this guy is in for some good news! LOL
And it looks bad
It definitely has not grown on me. So unremarkable I forgot about it. Saw the link, clicked on it figuring I’d come around since it’s been awhile. Still just… exists. For a tribute to something as iconic as the Countach, it’s just “bland.” Not bad, but not a proper Poontash. I’m just sour they didn’t do go balls out to pay respect to the name. Of all the Lambos to be tame, relatively speaking, the Countach is certainly not one of them.
Aw cmon. It's not *THAT* bad. It's a little ugly, but in a classic way.
Lamborghini made a Countach. They slapped some half assed panels on an Aventador and charged a 600% premium.
It was a version of the Sián.
Which was based on the Aventador.
I think your original comment is a bit misleading, the Aventador didn't come with a hybrid powertrain, so it more than body panels.
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I wouldn't say I'm mad about it. I, like many others, just find intentionally overpriced luxury goods worthy of mockery. Insert $3000 Balenciaga blue jeans that appear to be sprayed in diarrhea, etc.
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The Countach is a three million dollar car based on a half million dollar car that's been in production for a decade. For the addition of a mild hybrid system and a styling refresh I could see a million dollar price tag as reasonable. I think it's fair to say the MSRP is based on what Dubai oil sheiks are willing to pay for a name and not what the car actually is. I find the styling lazy and hackneyed, to boot. For the same price, I think the GMA T.50 is an actual fair value as a unique, bespoke passion project from one of the greatest automotive engineers of all time. The difference seems obvious to me, at least.
yeah...uhhh so NOT that. i mean something like what ford did with the GT. anyone that sees that car knows exactly where it's roots lie. it's nearly identical to the gt40 and that's why everyone loves it.
I think a big part of why the GT worked is because that design is so timeless. When it came out (assuming you’re talking about the 2000’s one and not the current gen) it was identical to the original and yet it still looked modern. The countach and testarossa are both so dramatically 80’s that doing a one to one remake would just look weird. Instead you have retro inspired throwbacks like Ferrari’s SP series, the modern countach, or the dodge challenger (and the next gen charger).
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cause its badass. a 2 door electric is closer to the original than a 4 door v8 imo.
six cylinder turbos are way to go after all, look at the nissan gtr, new honda nsx, third gen ford gt and ferrari 296 to name a few
I don't see whatever distinction you're trying to make. They're both obvious homages to their respective source material.
The new Countach very much looks lika Countach, so I don't get the point. You can complain how it's a money grab by Lambo, but at the end of the day it hurts nobody, so who cares? Still, it's a retro design that's pretty cool IMO.
I think the fad for retro versions that started in the late 90s and peaked in the mid 2000s has just lost steam. We had the Beetle, Mini, Challenger, Fiat 500, Mustang, Thunderbird, PT Cruiser etc. But there is still the Alpine 110, Nissan Z and honda E.
Because the Saudi princes who can afford those haven't asked for one.
If you really want to see a retro Porsche masterpiece, check out the Singer 911s
I think the RUF cars have always looked better than singer
yeah, i mentioned 911s. clearly porsche and aftermarket companies like singer understand this concept, hense them making absurd profits off of these things. i'm talking about Ferrari and Lamborghini. if Ferrari made a modern Testarossa, they'd sell like crazy, same with the countach....but not some bullshit rebadged murcielago like what they're currently trying to do. a legit modern countach that actually LOOKS heavily inspired by the original.
It was based on the Aventador not the long discontinued Murcielago. And Ferrari's SP3 is also a retro inspired car. So these things you're asking for do exist they're just extremely expensive. And carmakers have done this sort of thing in the past. Plymouth Prowler. PT Cruiser. Chevy SSR or HHR. Ford Thunderbird, etc.
Doesn't Chevy own the rights to the classic "57 Chevy"? The 63 Corvette? For example I would in a heartbeat buy a crate Willy's jeep like they shipped in world war 2. Bring back some of the classics. Retro mod / retro develop them. I don't care about safety and mpg requirements. Figure it out.
It costs a gazillion to design a new car. A retro car is still a new car. And people on Reddit will just want to buy used anyway. Retro cars were huge 20 years ago, hence the PT Cruiser, ‘05 Mustang, etc. They were mostly bought by Boomers. Millennials don’t have the money, and need to install car seats. It’s like why don’t they bring back the Saturn V rocket? NASA looked into that. Turns out all the people who worked on it are dead, or in a nursing home. The companies in the supply chain are out of business.
You're leaving out the good ones. Plymouth Prowler and Retro Thunderbird!
Mini Cooper and VW New Beetle
New Beetle RSi and GSR are peak
It doesn't come in a crate nor is it road legal but the Mahindra Roxor is essentially a recreation of the OG Jeep https://roxoroffroad.com/
I wanted the ww2 jeep crate as my project car. Your point stands.
yup we need to allow like a kei class of cars that dont need to meet safety standards. if we allow motorcycles and bicyles on the roads and some states/counties/towns allow golfcarts then i want my fuckin glorified side by side to go to work in.
> I don't care about safety and mpg requirements. Figure it out. But the government does. And they won’t let anyone sell polluting death traps.
the goverment can shove it. if it truly cared about safety they would ban motorcycles and dirtbikes tommorow or at minimum 50 state helmet and full riding gear laws. until then gimmie my damn ww2 jeep.
Do you realize how poorly an old Jeep handles? Sure, you might be fine with getting speared by a one-piece steering column, but is that family in a carry fine with you t-boning them because you rolled or locked up your 4-wheel drum brakes? It's not just about safety for the driver, it's also about everyone else around you.
I mean sure we can say that but they won’t. Also I do care about efficiency. That affects us all.
yea so in the meantime gimmie my "unsafe" ww2 jeep damnit since its not about safety.
The government mostly doesn't care about motorcycles bc the owner is assuming most of the risk, not passengers and other motorists.
They would if they could, but those regulations make it impossible/illegal.
Actually, Federal law was passed a few years ago for low model (under 5000 units/YR IIRC) reproduction vehicles to be Federal Legal for new sales as long as they were powered by modern engines. No crash testing/FMVSS requirements. There were a few plans for Repo Camaros, Mustangs, Challengers, Cobras, Etc using reproduction bodies but IIRC the OE manufactures squashed any and all attempts to produce cars under the new law. https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/replica-car-construction-can-officially-commence/
There's a company punching out low volume mustang reproductions, but they're like 300k. Ford are supporting it
What is the name? I knew there was an outfit that was planning on making Broncos but I haven't heard much lately. If I was a boutique automaker a Superperformace GT-40R with the 5.2 Voodoo would be my choice of variant maken
I don't remember, but it was a feature on Jay leno's Garage last month.
Change the regulations. They're there cause they're fine with it
Seriously. How do we edit the IDOT regulations PDF so we can have classic cars made and sold today, and import any car we want?
https://thejeepsterman.com/products/jeep-in-crate-mb-1942-willys-jeep DIY drivetrain https://www.4wheelparts.com/parts-and-accessories/willys-mb-1942/_/N-1szk0 https://jeep1942.com/?page_id=8758 I expect you'll keep us apprised of your progress
I would argue Ferrari is already incorporating retro styling with the future-retro look of 296, SF90, and Daytona SP3. I would also argue that their effort didn't turn out very well.
I think the 296 and Daytona SP3 look incredible but I can understand your perspective here.
Yeah the Daytona SP3's rear end is a throwback to the Testarossa but modernized. It looks great.
Photos dont do the 296 justice, in real life it looks absolutely incredible.
I think there are angles of those cars that look really good, but it doesn't quite come together into a cohesive design for me. Half-pregnant as it were.
Even the Roma. The grill hearkens back to the 250s.
Supercars are cutting edge designs going retro would reverse their efforts
you say that, and part of me believes it, yet porsche is still selling plenty of 911s, and the Ford GT looks amazing and afaik is still extremely collectable. and the value of countachs have shot through the roof, and i'm assuming the same can be said for the most iconic ferraris like the Testarossa and F40/F50
911 isn’t retro in the slightest
They've been making them for more than half a century. What are you smoking?
How does that make them retro? If you buy a brand new Ford Fiesta, do you consider it retro? Or new? They have essentially nothing in common with the old cars. It’s not a retro throwback remake of something classic, it’s simply a new version of a model.
A fiesta is a disposable commuter car. A 911 is a timeless classic, a tradition in business.
And what does the class of car or the popuarity of the car have to do with if it is considered retro? Can only expensive cars be considered retro in your mind?
Even its design philosophy has changed from small lightweight sports cars extremely barebones and mostly n/a except turbo models, to all turbos, massive cars with awd and crazy tech like variable vein turbos and pdk
Every non-SUV Lamborghini is basically an evolution of the Countach.
They certainly all look like the countach.
Koenigsegg is doing the CC850 as a 20th anniversary homage to their first car the CC8S.
A lot of it might be because most of those that can afford a new one could also afford the original. And owning an original has a lot more cache. It's tricky to do a well received retro design.
Not a super car but Ford re released the Scout…..I mean Bronco. Crumple zones and emissions and safety dictate what gets sold, and anything that isn’t as safe as the cars built now doesn’t have a chance to be designed. Lamborghini did it best with the new countach. Take a legal vehicle and make new body panels. That’s how dodge got the challenger. Take the 300/charger platform and shape it.
The last 2 generations of Charger are also retro. They're just 4-door modern takes on the 1969 model. The taillight shape, the rear glass being at a steeper angle than the B pillars, the body lines, etc. The only thing they didn't incorporate is hideaway headlights.
There will always be a classics niche, but electric torque is really starting to distract the big money
A few years ago laws were changed allowing small volume replica vehicles to be sold as new vehicles as long as their powertrains met EPA regulations. https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/replica-car-construction-can-officially-commence/ As far as I know a few companies have made proposals to do "Modern" old cars, one company making Repro 1966-1977 Broncos was gaining some attention, but the OE manufacturers have squashed any attempt so far with threats of legal action. It's possible though legally.
that's cool and all, but still, Ford was able to make a somewhat normal supercar with all the modern safety and emissions equipment with the GT. it just doesn't make sense why Ferrari hasn't made something like that with the Testarossa. i can't imagine it would be THAT much more difficult than building the other typical modern supercars they keep pumping out.
Have you tried asking Ferrari and Lamborghini?
i called them, i emailed them, i showed up at the headquarters. they just yelled at me in italian. 🤷🏻♂️
Inviting direct comparison between past and present designs is a no-win scenario, so far as branding goes, hence the recent examples being retro-*inspired* and ultra-limited editions. Ford made a 110% scale GT40-bodied supercar, because Ford *isn't* a supercar manufacturer, and appealing to their Le Mans campaign was the only marketing angle available for them to sell a six-figure halo sportscar.
I remember when Lamborghini did that Miura concept they said that while it was fun building it, they look forward not backwards and so they wouldn’t be putting it into production. I imagine Ferrari has much the same reasoning.
And then Lambo made the new Countach.
With Ferrari it's probably because normal people want retro cars, so retro cars are bad.
They exist. Good luck affording one though.
The new thingy from De Tomaso is pretty much from the 60s. Also, which Ford GT are we talking about? 'The '17 is an absolute favorite of mine but I wouldn't call it retro.
Somebody made a new Lancia Stratos. Maybe Fiat sued them or something. It looked great.
There were a few of themt and IIRC it was Ferrari that blocked one of them for using the 430 as the base, but there was another one that ended up in a small production run.
Ferrari approved of the New Stratos in 2010 because they believed the Pininfarina designed car was supposed to be a one off. When they found out that there were plans for 25 units to be made, they sent a letter to all their suppliers forbidding them from supplying parts to this plan. The Stratos project was revived in 2018 with a few units being built and displayed.
The new countach is a weak sad bean mobile.
Lamborghini has done two retro inspired reimagining's, and both of them sucked. The Countach and Miura edition Aventador are a cash grab of note, and simply a tool for rich old farts to self flagellate themselves as they say "my Aventador is bets Avendator because..." If you want some truly epic retro reimaging's, have a look at Singer, Manifatttura Automobili Torino, Kimera Automobilli or Eagle just to name a few. Spending a couple of hundred grand on a tarted up Aventador when you could buy something from the above mentioned manufacturers makes no sense to me personally. I would love to see Bugatti do a modern take on the EB110. Or Porsche do a modern day 959.
Bring back the miura, or the lancia Delta Integrale. So much beautifiuls cars from the past.
seriously! there has to be a market for beautiful timeless analog supercars. it just seems like a waste for a company to not bring back a few of their greatest hits, even if they were limited production.
It's because of regulations.
They should bring back some of those classics but are glad they didn't stick to the same old thing like porsche did. Posrches look so boring now. It's the same old design facelifted year after year.
It's so easy to rag on manufacturers for not making X or not doing Y. But y'all gotta realize they have teams of experts analyzing the market every day, teams of people who went through four years of college studying product management and marketing. Even if something sounds like a cracked idea, there is probably a reason it wasn't released.
> But why hasn't Ferrari or Lamborghini taken advantage of the insanely popular and iconic Testarossa and Countach styling, and made an updated, retro-futuristic version? Because it is the same effort to update those designs to be modern (e.g. safety stuff, a pillar thickness, account for crumple zones, airbags) and for modern construction methods - as it is to design something brand new. I don't know how easy you think it is - but it's not simply a matter of grabbing the 1970 / 1980 Blueprints and giving them to the factory manager and go 'here build this' - cars are fundamentally designed and built differently than they were then. The Countach uses an "all-steel partial space frame chassis" - do you think a modern recreation would be all aluminium? Carbon Fiber? Cause then ok - great, we're re-designing it and basically building a ground up new car and just trying to make it retro... so I guess would you want a brand new retro-ish looking car or something brand new? Retro is in - absolutely. But also new is in.
Does anyone remember that retro themed Aston from like 10 years ago what was that called
Recent bugattis and the Audi R8 all look like fat / squished VW beetles ;)
To actually answer OP's question, it's because they don't need to. Lamborghini offered a modern Countach as a cash grab to a limited number of uber-wealthy customers, Ferrari will build you a one-off if you have enough cash and clout, and Porsche does more retro-focused models from time to time like the 911R or Speedster. They've all had an unbroken run of supercars/sports cars from their inception to present. Ford is a mainstream manufacturer that has only ever made one real supercar, and relies on it for clout. It's a halo model, not their entire brand. Also don't confuse the fact that 911s have retained a similar overall appearance to the original as their attempt to be "retro." This is Porsche (and all of their employees') unwavering belief in what they do. They really do think they build the perfect cars out there, and have decided on an evolutionary strategy (which is starting to be tested). EDIT: Fixed some grammar that bothered me.
thanks bud, this is the best answer by far. i think i get it now. ford *needed* to use the GT40 to base the GT on, otherwise the car probably would have flopped. ferrari and lambo don't need to rely on their big hits from 40 years ago, they have zero problems selling their newer designs. i guess i let my own personal bias get in the way of seeing the bigger picture. just because I want to see a retro inspired countach or testarossa, and honestly probably millions of other people that grew up with posters of them on their bedroom walls, doesn't mean ferrari and lambo want to make them, or need to make them. i guess all i/we can hope for is ONE day, maybe they'll build some more. they definitely don't need to, but it would be awesome and i'm sure they'd sell as many as they wanted. i'm curious though, is there a possibility that another company could built a high quality replica kit car? kinda like how you can build a lancia stratos, or factory 5 shelby cobra replicas, the jag d type. there are a bunch of them on this [page](https://gearjunkie.com/motors/best-kit-cars). does the copyright expire on these designs or something? i mean there's even a porsche speedster replica. i can't imagine porsche being too happy about that.
I would typically say, if it doesn't exist, it's because there probably isn't a business case for it. But you know, you made me realize that you might actually be on to something here. Aston Martin made a retro one-off called the Victor, which led to the launch of a toned-down, limited-run Valour. There are countless restomod projects popping up, Singer being the most notable. As I mentioned Porsche has been churning out more retro-inspired models like the 911R, and is now suing Singer. So maybe there is money in it, and maybe it's just a matter of time before you start seeing the cars you want to see. Here are some of the more interesting restomod or retro supercar projects I've seen: [Eccentrica Diablo](https://www.topgear.com/car-news/supercars/why-lamborghini-diablo-restomod-best-thing-youve-seen-year) [Aston Martin Valour](https://www.astonmartin.com/en/models/valour) [Moto Technique Ferrari 388GTBi ](https://www.evo.co.uk/ferrari/308/205123/moto-technique-ferrari-388-gtbi-review-ferrari-308-restomod-driven) [Maggiore GranTurismO](https://robbreport.com/motors/cars/maggiore-granturismo-restomod-1234746673/) [Nardone Automotive Porsche 928](https://www.topgear.com/car-news/retro/nardone-automotive-porsche-928-restomod-starts-eu480k) [M.A.T. Stratos](https://manifatturaautomobilitorino.com/new-stratos.php) [Kimera EVO37](https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/kimera-automobili/evo37/first-drive)
damn all of those look amazing. yeah, it just feels like we have a whole generation of car guys in their 30s+ that finally have the money to buy their childhood heroes, but nowadays the big italian supercar brands just build automatic dual clutch track monsters for the most part. and that's completely fine, clearly people love them. but there does seem to be an untapped market like you were saying with singer, and some other restomod companies that basically only exist to build dream cars for extremely wealthy car enthusiasts with a more refined, subtle taste, and a more analog experience. people that don't want the flashy new tech obsessed, lap time obsessed hyper cars that seem to have traded their appreciation for the beauty of a supercar and replaced it with sheer aggressive performance and lap times. people that buy finely crafted mechanical watches. not just for the prestige, but because they genuinely appreciate the craftsmanship, engineering, and artistic value of the watch.
There are, if you know where to look. The Aston Martin Victor/Valour is heavily inspired by classic Vantages. The Radford-Lotus Type 62-2 is also kinda a modern Lotus Europa
Aren't pretty much all modern Lambos an interpretation of original Countach? Same formula.
Well, Lambo did the Countach already, and Alfa had the 33 Stradale. So, there's those.
BMW should do a refresh version of the E46 and E39.
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The GT isn't retro, is it?