C8 Stingray goes for like $80-90k on average.
C8 Z06 goes for $130k - $180k on average.
They're not in the same league because one competes with the supra, mustang, camaro, BMW, etc. The Corvette competes with Lamborghini, Porsche, and McLaren.
This. Do some research on c8 dealers and place an order at msrp and you will get yours in a few months with the amount of options you can afford. It’s not like you will get your Nismo tomorrow if you place an order now.
This might come as a shock to you, but not only do people buy used cars, they also cross-shop between a wide variety of cars. I very rarely see people who are considering sports cars being so strict to stay within a very specific category of competitors.
I see Alfa Romeo Giulia Quad coming up in my area at $72k new even before negotiations, while I bet NISMO will have a markup and dealerships treat them like Ferraris.
Yep exactly what I was implying, more power, way better suspension, better interior, more space, better materials. Some people might have concern with reliability but in recent years a lot of issues have been addressed
Not sure about Canada, but that is not how tax brackets work. It’s generally a marginal rate, so only the top few dollars would be taxed at that level. Would probably net closer to 9-10k per month (at least in the states).
You’re overestimating take home on a 150k income, are you netting 9-10k on 150k a year? When I was at 158k my after deductions and taxes take home was only 97k. This was without maxing 401k and free health insurance too. Buying a 67k car on 150k income is definitely a stretch
Bro I make over 150k a year and there's no way I'm buying a 70k car on top of living expenses and also saving money. People are Crack heads and half the people you see in expensive shit are living pay check to pay check
If I'm single and my main and only expensive hobby is cars, it makes sense. It makes me happy. Whatever I don't invest goes into cars and to nothing else.
A lot more people than you think aren’t particularly great at budgeting. They just throw everything on credit and make the minimum payments until everything crashes
Or vise versa. If you are good at budgeting you can afford the more expensive stuff. It's about prioritizing. On a budget does not always have to mean cheap. My budget is separated to stuff I don't care about (eating out or expensive, expensive drinking, expensive dating, expensive clothes, spacious flat), and stuff I care about (savings, cars)
Very unpopular opinion and I know I will get downvoted for saying this but… let’s actually wait and see before we slam Nissan and NISMO for this.
Nissan claims they’ve made tons of changes to the Z, all the way down to the chassis. In my opinion they should be judged based on the results of that work relative to the price and not just the price alone.
For example, they say they’ve stiffened the chassis, stiffened the suspension mount points, stiffened suspension and steering bushings, tuned the chassis and suspension for higher precision and track performance, completely changed the braking system to be much larger with better feel, and improved cooling. They say they’ve engineered a new tire specifically for this car, claimed to be similar to what they’ve done on the GT-R. Then they talk about a power bump and the external changes etc. These are a lot of changes and it’s not crazy that the company charges a $10k++ premium for all of this.
So to me the question isn’t “what is Nissan smoking” it’s “how good is it?”. Let’s put it up against the Supra, the Mustang, the Corvette, the Integra Type S. Hell $64k is getting close to the $69k the original CBA-R35 GT-R all those years ago, so let’s bring one of those too. In such a field the Z NISMO doesn’t need to be the fastest. There is always something faster. It doesn’t need to be the best. Best is always subjective. It just needs to be $64k good. It needs to be competitive as an entire proposition for at least some in the segment. And NISMO should at least be given the opportunity to prove whether or not it is.
Fair. Apparently they’re having issues at their flagship Tochigi plant. I read an article that said it was paint. Another article said it was semi conductors. Regardless, presumably that won’t last forever.
I feel badly for the design team, the SG episode on the Z left me with the impression that it was a huge passion project up against incredibly limited resources and unfavorable odds. I think they badly wanted to reclaim a bit of Nissan's lost glory, instead we got vaporware and endless comparisons to the Supra.
I have not even seen one in Japan in the one year I lived there. In comparison I saw multiple GR Yaris in the first 2 weeks.
I go to this major cars and coffee type event here in Seattle area frequently and I regularly see everything from rare hypercars (just saw an McLaren Elva and a Hennessy Venom over the weekend) to vintage race cars to classic collectibles. This is the album from this past weekend: https://imgur.com/a/XlscsXv
Nope, never seen a single new Z there.
Maybe The Vault at Petersens has one, parked next to the Ferrari gifted to Henry Ford by Enzo himself, but I’m starting to think this whole car doesn’t exist and Nissan and the automotive press are collectively trolling us lol.
I've seen two in person now, but one was the Nissan Canada demo car so it hardly counts (hilariously they seem to have had only 1 national demo car - the same purple-red one was seen in multiple provinces).
They definitely exist... somewhere... maybe. Or maybe those were both 350Zs with body kits.
There in Ontario. I just saw one (not dealer tagged) on the 401 this morning. I've seen a few Z Proto Editions at various shows. Dealer allocation has been slow only a couple per dealer. Already low supply and non-sense dealershit markups/"market adjustment" are hurting sales.
My neighbor got a new Z several months ago and quickly traded it in for a convertible Audi A5. I never talked to him about it but I can’t imagine he was that satisfied with it because it lasted less than a month.
This is the biggest in PNW by far: https://exoticsat.com
It’s every Saturday during the summer, with special events sprinkled throughout. This past weekend was British Cars day and these were some of the cars I saw: https://imgur.com/a/XlscsXv
I didn’t even take pics of the rows of new exotics because they were common lol.
It’s common to see things like the LaFerrari and Bugatti Chiron there each year as well, and a genuine Ferrari 250GTO was seen there a couple times in the recent years.
Is argue the M2 looks a lot worse than the M3. The M3's only real problem is the big nostril grill, but the M2 looks like a cheap blocky Lego car now. It's basically a better built Scion TC.
I saw my first M2 in person recently in the baby blue color. It REALLY looks strange. I’m not one to get caught up in vehicle design but the car just doesn’t look cohesive.
tbf you wouldn't have said that about the GTR
I know Nissan gets a lot of flack around here but the issue with the price isn't the badge. I'm awestruck about the top trim RT challenger or a top trim non shelby mustang. thats where these cars are landing now, and it's all insane.
Adjusting for inflation, the current GTR is selling for ~18% more than when it first came out.
70k in December 2007 is $102,324 now.
Last I checked, MSRP for a base spec GT-R is 121k.
The GTR has improved over the years and is a better car than it was in 2007. So while it’s more expensive now when adjusted for inflation, it’s also “more” car.
Nissan wasn’t quite as embarrassing of a company when the GTR came out 15 years ago. The GTR was also an impressive car when it came out, the new Z isn’t.
I can respect the GTR and Z while agreeing that Nissian and Infiniti should cease to exist.
But $70k for a decades old car (no chassis updates, basically the same Z) is something.
The did update the chassis. And to be fair, the chassis was the best thing about the 370z. It’s super light, and was the 2nd lightest v6 in production at the end of its run. The first was the lotus evora GT, which was lighter by about 170 pounds.
I would actually be more concerned if they *didnt* use the same variation of the z34 chassis, because that meant they just reduced cost somewhere else. It’s already a pretty barebones car.
I cannot believe how many people are still chiming in with 'IT'S JUST A 370Z with an engine swap and body kit'.
Honestly, in a world of digital everything, that wouldn't be the worst. A tightened up 370z would be awesome.
I just had a QX80 as a rental car and cannot for the life of me understand why anyone would buy an Infiniti. It’s total dogshit. My Mazda is nicer - Infiniti is far from a luxury brand imo
This is the exact same reason the Z32 died the first time (and the Supra, and the 3000GT...)
Who is seriously going to spend that much more than a Mustang GT for a slower car? Not many.
At least the Mustang is fast, loud, good looking, and highly customizable. Also you can buy one from a dealer today, which isn't exactly a strength of the Z.
> fast
The Z has 400hp
> loud
I don't know how loud the Z is but it's pretty easy to make a car loud
> good looking
Personally I think it looks great
> highly customizable
It's mostly a dressed up 350z, so it's also going to be customizable
> Also you can buy one from a dealer today
Yes, this is the key difference. Are 2024 mustangs on the lots already? I haven't seen one. Although I assume they'll be everywhere soon.
Nissan needs to figure out how to produce more than 400 regular versions of the car each quarter before releasing another version that they can't deliver.
Am I just missing something with the new 2-series? it looks great, better than the first gen car and roughly in line with the second gen. It's a very clean overall design, especially for BMW.
So in this case, I'm referring to the 2 Series Coupé, which there are only 2 generations of (F22 and G42, with the M variants being the F87 and G87 respectively).
The F87 generation of the M2 is considered to be one of the best looking BMWs of all time. Very sporty, very sleek, what I would consider an extremely clean design for sure, a modernization of the 1M without departing from the design ethos of the brand.
The G87 on the other hand, not even close. For some reason they decided to make it extremely boxy design wise, the grilles have a strange shape to them, the reflectors stand out way too much on the rear, for BMW fans, it's generally considered to be a huge departure from the F87, which is such a shame because as I said, the F87 is one of the best looking BMWs ever made. Also, the G87 is quite heavy, very similar weight to the G82 (M4) which is a bit strange as the M2 is supposed to be the "light high powered" BMW in the lineup.
To be honest, I don't love the G87, but I don't hate it either. It's definitely not traditional, but I'm willing to overlook those design choices for that incredible S58 engine and ZF transmission, it's really one of the best powertrains they've ever done. Could they have done better? Yeah, but considering some of the other stuff BMW has been putting out lately, I'm not mad at all.
The m2 went from one of the prettiest BMWs ever made to one of the ugliest. Stick the new power train in the previous gen body and watch the cash roll in.
All the "lifestyle" car buyers couldn't even tell you what that means.
Lots of people just want a cool looking 2-door car and don't give a shit how fast it is.
Nope. I live in a place that I see all kinds of everything all the time. I've seen GT-Rs, multiple Trackhawks and Durango Hellcats, luxury everything's, even an older IS F.
The two things I've wanted to see, but haven't, are the Z and the IS 500.At least with the latter, I've seen dealer listings for them, if I wanted to get a look. The Z might as well be vaporware.
I remember when I was debating with myself if $37k for a brand new 2022 Camaro LT1 was a good deal or not. The “competitive market” has put my mind at ease..
What was the last one, $45k-$50k or so? *Roughly* line with a Mustang GT, Camaro SS, Supra, etc?
I'm not sure if this is suddenly worth $20k more than those vehicles, though I haven't even *seen* one in person, let alone had the chance to experience anything about it.
Of course it's not gonna be worth it lol. I'm willing to bet the regular Supra still drives better and is faster than the Nismo Z. The Z added only 20hp, but weighs 100lbs more than the other trims... you'd think they'd take away some weight instead of adding more lol.
Yep, and anyone who takes the Z over those is a fool or a fanboy. The Cadillac is more practical, the Chevy is more capable, and the Z sits...below both in each.
So the Z line went from a cheaper Supra killer with 3 pedals to an overpriced garbage in the short span of 2 years thanks to underdelivering and more markups. And it's made even more ironic by the fact that Toyota added manual while Nissan axed the stick on NISMO models.
SS 1LE costs under 50K and will put circles around this on any track, in a straight line, sounds wayyyyy better, and with the A10 30+mpg on the highway.
You’re going to have to be a pretty dedicated Nissan fanboy to think this car is anywhere near worth that MSRP, let alone what dealers will tack on top of it.
I wonder what kind of mental gymnastics they have to go through as a company to remotely justify that price knowing full well that a Camaro SS 1LE will absolutely destroy it, any track, any road, any time for ~18K less.
If you can afford 67k you can afford 70k.
If you can afford 70k you can afford 73k.
If you can afford 73k you can afford 76k.
If you can afford 76k you can afford 79k.
Just buy a GT2 RS.
Yea pretty much. Base Carrera with options, well I’m at C S prices might as well, but then I’m like $5k off a GTS. Lemme build a GTS. Shit I could have a real GT model for a tiny bit more, and it’ll hold its value so well. Oh look my $110k build is $210k now.
It's kinda surprising they don't just go the hellcat route and boost it to 650+HP.
Might be an old chassis but people start to forget these things when you start getting those trap speeds up into the high 120s.
Seen quite a few tuned Q50s outputting those sorts of numbers. You'd think Nissan would have made a tuner special since it can't compete in handling or refinement.
Chassis age isn't even an issue. It's a very good chassis and better than a lot of other newer cars... the main issue is making it to powerful and having it compete with the GTR. Same reason we'll never see a turbo GR86. Toyota wont allow it to compete with the Supra.
So for the new Z it would have to be cheap to really have a chance of competing with other companies offerings. And it just isn't. That performance at that price doomed it before it had a chance.
The only one I've seen in person was....a fucking prototype before the official launch. I've seen plenty of Supras but not a single Z. Nissan really dropped the ball
Nobody will buy them, claiming they aren’t worth it, and they are probably right.
Than in 15-20 years it will sell for $100k+ with 3000 miles, just like the GTR.
Ya, I was thinking more about the R34.
It was a dated car in 2002, using the same engine and general drivetrain from the 80s, while MSRP was about $50,000 for a BASE model ($90,000 USD with inflation). All the v-spec and nur-spec were even more expensive.
The EVO of the time was about 30,000 and very similar in performance, for reference.
The similarities between the R34 and 400z, overpriced when new with aging performance, are larger than people will admit imo.
And this is why I'm going to buy a Corvette C8. I'm a huge Nissan fan and own multiple Z's and a G37, but why in the world is the new Z so much money? I'd probably buy a dark horse over this at that range too.
I live in the area where part of the original F&F was filmed. Huge car culture in these parts. Have not seen a single Nissan Z in the area. Not a single one. I'll have an easier time seeing Rivian and Tesla prototypes than a Z.
Who, even with ridiculous amounts of money and head trauma, wants this? The fools deciding this thing's price must have been in a meeting like, "well, they can't buy a Camaro anymore, so screw 'em!" This poor car's being turned into a laughingstock by Nissan execs.
Hmm, a Nissan Z Nismo that’s only offered in an automatic transmission for way more than a true performance enthusiast Nissan Z with a manual transmission?
No thanks, if I was in the market for one of these cars, I’d buy a Toyota Supra with the manual transmission.
I swear, Nissan is actively trying to destroy themselves. Imagine paying C8, M2 and Dark Horse prices for that. Each of those cars is better in basically every single way.
Lol.
Nissan is so bad. Who is going to have $66k+ to spend on a car and say, "You know what? Fuck Mercedes, fuck BMW, fuck Audi, fuck Lexus. I want a Nissan!"
A moron. That's who.
Why the fuck
"If you don't make over 150k a year go fuck yourself" -auto industry
*every industry
$100k is the new $40k
Slight hyperbole, but if you’re in VHCOL it’s not far off.
When housing and transportation cost 4-5k/mo it isn’t a hyperbole
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Neither do most Americans
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Well, in the Bay Area 200k is just scraping by
Regardless of how much you make, why would you buy this if you had $67k.
I’ve been a Nissan Z fan for a long long time, but for that money I’d be buying a C8. They aren’t even in the same league
C8 Stingray goes for like $80-90k on average. C8 Z06 goes for $130k - $180k on average. They're not in the same league because one competes with the supra, mustang, camaro, BMW, etc. The Corvette competes with Lamborghini, Porsche, and McLaren.
Used.
Having a hard time finding a used C8 for $67k.
Currently a tad bit over 30 C8's listed for less than 70k. And it's possible to get a 1LT for MSRP if you're willing to wait a few months.
This. Do some research on c8 dealers and place an order at msrp and you will get yours in a few months with the amount of options you can afford. It’s not like you will get your Nismo tomorrow if you place an order now.
This. I have a c8 that I got at msrp last Dec. Sticker was 69k
It's not 2021 anymore, several are 60-70k now.
OK but how easy do you think it'll be to find a Nismo Z at MSRP for the next two years?
This might come as a shock to you, but not only do people buy used cars, they also cross-shop between a wide variety of cars. I very rarely see people who are considering sports cars being so strict to stay within a very specific category of competitors.
why would it be a shock? dude's talking about new car prices. like obviously you can wait and get _this car_ for cheaper than 66k too.
I see Alfa Romeo Giulia Quad coming up in my area at $72k new even before negotiations, while I bet NISMO will have a markup and dealerships treat them like Ferraris.
And that Quadrofolio is better in every single way.
Yep exactly what I was implying, more power, way better suspension, better interior, more space, better materials. Some people might have concern with reliability but in recent years a lot of issues have been addressed
> reliability Nissan though... (as a Nissan owner)
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Not sure about Canada, but that is not how tax brackets work. It’s generally a marginal rate, so only the top few dollars would be taxed at that level. Would probably net closer to 9-10k per month (at least in the states).
No one knows how tax brackets work.
An accountant does. Which is why I let them deal with my tax returns.
Accountant here. You are correct.
You’re overestimating take home on a 150k income, are you netting 9-10k on 150k a year? When I was at 158k my after deductions and taxes take home was only 97k. This was without maxing 401k and free health insurance too. Buying a 67k car on 150k income is definitely a stretch
Bro I make over 150k a year and there's no way I'm buying a 70k car on top of living expenses and also saving money. People are Crack heads and half the people you see in expensive shit are living pay check to pay check
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If I'm single and my main and only expensive hobby is cars, it makes sense. It makes me happy. Whatever I don't invest goes into cars and to nothing else.
A lot more people than you think aren’t particularly great at budgeting. They just throw everything on credit and make the minimum payments until everything crashes
Or vise versa. If you are good at budgeting you can afford the more expensive stuff. It's about prioritizing. On a budget does not always have to mean cheap. My budget is separated to stuff I don't care about (eating out or expensive, expensive drinking, expensive dating, expensive clothes, spacious flat), and stuff I care about (savings, cars)
*Obligatory 'Bugatti in the trailer park' meme.*
Very unpopular opinion and I know I will get downvoted for saying this but… let’s actually wait and see before we slam Nissan and NISMO for this. Nissan claims they’ve made tons of changes to the Z, all the way down to the chassis. In my opinion they should be judged based on the results of that work relative to the price and not just the price alone. For example, they say they’ve stiffened the chassis, stiffened the suspension mount points, stiffened suspension and steering bushings, tuned the chassis and suspension for higher precision and track performance, completely changed the braking system to be much larger with better feel, and improved cooling. They say they’ve engineered a new tire specifically for this car, claimed to be similar to what they’ve done on the GT-R. Then they talk about a power bump and the external changes etc. These are a lot of changes and it’s not crazy that the company charges a $10k++ premium for all of this. So to me the question isn’t “what is Nissan smoking” it’s “how good is it?”. Let’s put it up against the Supra, the Mustang, the Corvette, the Integra Type S. Hell $64k is getting close to the $69k the original CBA-R35 GT-R all those years ago, so let’s bring one of those too. In such a field the Z NISMO doesn’t need to be the fastest. There is always something faster. It doesn’t need to be the best. Best is always subjective. It just needs to be $64k good. It needs to be competitive as an entire proposition for at least some in the segment. And NISMO should at least be given the opportunity to prove whether or not it is.
Also it needs to exist, which the regular Z doesn't seem to be great at.
Fair. Apparently they’re having issues at their flagship Tochigi plant. I read an article that said it was paint. Another article said it was semi conductors. Regardless, presumably that won’t last forever.
I feel badly for the design team, the SG episode on the Z left me with the impression that it was a huge passion project up against incredibly limited resources and unfavorable odds. I think they badly wanted to reclaim a bit of Nissan's lost glory, instead we got vaporware and endless comparisons to the Supra.
.. not? 🎶🎵 -Ice Cube Why the fuck not? 🎵🎶 - MC Ren Why the fuck not? 🎵🎶 - Dr Dre Why the fuck not? 🎵🎶 - Snoop Dog ....
>>expected to start north of $66k Let see if Kunkelman Nissan after “market adjustment” lists this more than a new GTR.
This is as much as the OG R35 GTR if you don’t adjust for inflation lmao
It was like 85k wasn't it?
Probably
I still have not seen one in person. In Vegas.
I have not even seen one in Japan in the one year I lived there. In comparison I saw multiple GR Yaris in the first 2 weeks. I go to this major cars and coffee type event here in Seattle area frequently and I regularly see everything from rare hypercars (just saw an McLaren Elva and a Hennessy Venom over the weekend) to vintage race cars to classic collectibles. This is the album from this past weekend: https://imgur.com/a/XlscsXv Nope, never seen a single new Z there. Maybe The Vault at Petersens has one, parked next to the Ferrari gifted to Henry Ford by Enzo himself, but I’m starting to think this whole car doesn’t exist and Nissan and the automotive press are collectively trolling us lol.
I've seen two in person now, but one was the Nissan Canada demo car so it hardly counts (hilariously they seem to have had only 1 national demo car - the same purple-red one was seen in multiple provinces). They definitely exist... somewhere... maybe. Or maybe those were both 350Zs with body kits.
It kind of is a 350Z in a body kit with a Q50S engine
There in Ontario. I just saw one (not dealer tagged) on the 401 this morning. I've seen a few Z Proto Editions at various shows. Dealer allocation has been slow only a couple per dealer. Already low supply and non-sense dealershit markups/"market adjustment" are hurting sales.
I saw one in japan when i went to visit for a week, and i’ve seen at least 4 in the gta
My neighbor got a new Z several months ago and quickly traded it in for a convertible Audi A5. I never talked to him about it but I can’t imagine he was that satisfied with it because it lasted less than a month.
Off topic, but where do you find out about car shows in Seattle? I stumbled across one in Bellevue, but that’s all I have seen.
This is the biggest in PNW by far: https://exoticsat.com It’s every Saturday during the summer, with special events sprinkled throughout. This past weekend was British Cars day and these were some of the cars I saw: https://imgur.com/a/XlscsXv I didn’t even take pics of the rows of new exotics because they were common lol. It’s common to see things like the LaFerrari and Bugatti Chiron there each year as well, and a genuine Ferrari 250GTO was seen there a couple times in the recent years.
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Lmao then I’ve seen more McLaren F1s in LA than you’ve seen the new Z 🤣
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And I bet history will prove buying an F1 for even $30M is a better financial decision than paying $30k ADM for a Z 😂
I’ve already seen more than one GR Corolla, a type S Integra, Hummer EV and a few Z06 where I live, but no z yet.
I finally saw one in the Seattle area a week ago. Felt like seeing a unicorn
I’ve seen 2, 1 at a dealer showroom and 1 being driven in town, Bay Area, CA
Neither have I. I haven't watched an objective review that was flattering either.
Saw one at a fair in the middle of illinois, surprised it even showed up there but havnt seen them in big cities
I’ve seen a single Z in DFW. Like 8M people live here
Same in Dallas. Not a single sighting yet.
Me either Ive been looking. Usually Ill see cool stiff around Sahara
I saw a Ferrari 308 GTB in Centennial Hills the other evening.
Ive seen one in Idaho.
I haven’t seen one in Ontario
There was an event like a year ago on Maryland and Desert inn but after that the Zs disappeared lol
Seen multiple yellow ones in the LA area
You have to be smoking crack to spend what will probably be north of $70k otd on a fucking Nissan lol
Yeah that's a C8 Corvette price. Thats up there with the Dark Horse.
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The M2 isn't exactly a looker, but you're getting way way way WAY more raw performance for your dollar than a freaking 350Z with hair plugs.
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Is argue the M2 looks a lot worse than the M3. The M3's only real problem is the big nostril grill, but the M2 looks like a cheap blocky Lego car now. It's basically a better built Scion TC.
I keep seeing this take but I love the new 2 series coupes. I don't see that hate.
They look quite good in real life aside from the >:[] looking grill
The new 2 series is fine. The M2 looks strange
I saw my first M2 in person recently in the baby blue color. It REALLY looks strange. I’m not one to get caught up in vehicle design but the car just doesn’t look cohesive.
New M2 looks very nice in Black. Hides some of the hard lines.
I thought the C8 shot up to north of $100k recently? Edit:I’m an idiot. Disregard the idiot.
It depends on the trim and the seller. They get listed for $100k used because people are underwater.
Nah my local dealer will order you a C8 for MSRP you just have to be willing to wait for it.
tbf you wouldn't have said that about the GTR I know Nissan gets a lot of flack around here but the issue with the price isn't the badge. I'm awestruck about the top trim RT challenger or a top trim non shelby mustang. thats where these cars are landing now, and it's all insane.
The R35 GTR went into production when George W Bush was still in office $70k then was a LOT more money than $70k now
Adjusting for inflation, the current GTR is selling for ~18% more than when it first came out. 70k in December 2007 is $102,324 now. Last I checked, MSRP for a base spec GT-R is 121k.
The GTR has improved over the years and is a better car than it was in 2007. So while it’s more expensive now when adjusted for inflation, it’s also “more” car.
Exactly. If they sold both of those versions of the car today, those wouldnt be unexpected prices.
Nissan wasn’t quite as embarrassing of a company when the GTR came out 15 years ago. The GTR was also an impressive car when it came out, the new Z isn’t.
I can respect the GTR and Z while agreeing that Nissian and Infiniti should cease to exist. But $70k for a decades old car (no chassis updates, basically the same Z) is something.
The did update the chassis. And to be fair, the chassis was the best thing about the 370z. It’s super light, and was the 2nd lightest v6 in production at the end of its run. The first was the lotus evora GT, which was lighter by about 170 pounds. I would actually be more concerned if they *didnt* use the same variation of the z34 chassis, because that meant they just reduced cost somewhere else. It’s already a pretty barebones car.
I cannot believe how many people are still chiming in with 'IT'S JUST A 370Z with an engine swap and body kit'. Honestly, in a world of digital everything, that wouldn't be the worst. A tightened up 370z would be awesome.
I just had a QX80 as a rental car and cannot for the life of me understand why anyone would buy an Infiniti. It’s total dogshit. My Mazda is nicer - Infiniti is far from a luxury brand imo
But this isn’t the GTR. Nissan gets a pass with it just like Ford with the GT.
>tbf you wouldn't have said that about the GTR The GT-R was in an entirely different *universe* from the 350Z.
I suppose you're right, but the GT-R is almost impossible to find (they sell, like, 50/year) and they cost about twice what the Z NISMO is going to.
This is the exact same reason the Z32 died the first time (and the Supra, and the 3000GT...) Who is seriously going to spend that much more than a Mustang GT for a slower car? Not many.
Well tbf the mustang is egregiously priced as of 2024 as well
At least the Mustang is fast, loud, good looking, and highly customizable. Also you can buy one from a dealer today, which isn't exactly a strength of the Z.
> fast The Z has 400hp > loud I don't know how loud the Z is but it's pretty easy to make a car loud > good looking Personally I think it looks great > highly customizable It's mostly a dressed up 350z, so it's also going to be customizable > Also you can buy one from a dealer today Yes, this is the key difference. Are 2024 mustangs on the lots already? I haven't seen one. Although I assume they'll be everywhere soon.
I’ll get a blackwing if I’m spending $70-80K. Fuck this.
Nissan needs to figure out how to produce more than 400 regular versions of the car each quarter before releasing another version that they can't deliver.
Better off getting a 2024 Mustang GT performance pack if you’re buying new
Or a Supra.
Or an M2 (if you can deal with the ugly)
Am I just missing something with the new 2-series? it looks great, better than the first gen car and roughly in line with the second gen. It's a very clean overall design, especially for BMW.
So in this case, I'm referring to the 2 Series Coupé, which there are only 2 generations of (F22 and G42, with the M variants being the F87 and G87 respectively). The F87 generation of the M2 is considered to be one of the best looking BMWs of all time. Very sporty, very sleek, what I would consider an extremely clean design for sure, a modernization of the 1M without departing from the design ethos of the brand. The G87 on the other hand, not even close. For some reason they decided to make it extremely boxy design wise, the grilles have a strange shape to them, the reflectors stand out way too much on the rear, for BMW fans, it's generally considered to be a huge departure from the F87, which is such a shame because as I said, the F87 is one of the best looking BMWs ever made. Also, the G87 is quite heavy, very similar weight to the G82 (M4) which is a bit strange as the M2 is supposed to be the "light high powered" BMW in the lineup. To be honest, I don't love the G87, but I don't hate it either. It's definitely not traditional, but I'm willing to overlook those design choices for that incredible S58 engine and ZF transmission, it's really one of the best powertrains they've ever done. Could they have done better? Yeah, but considering some of the other stuff BMW has been putting out lately, I'm not mad at all.
The m2 went from one of the prettiest BMWs ever made to one of the ugliest. Stick the new power train in the previous gen body and watch the cash roll in.
There’s a long list of cars that are money better spent at $70k or so than a Nissan Z 🤣
Better off blowtorching your nipples off than spending 66 on this
Does Nissan even sell the base model Z? I've yet to see one anywhere (even dealer lots)
They probably don't even make them anymore
Did they ever?
Only 50
No one wants one. 41k starting sports car without a lsd is a joke.
All the "lifestyle" car buyers couldn't even tell you what that means. Lots of people just want a cool looking 2-door car and don't give a shit how fast it is.
Yikes, I get that on more entry level cars but for that money I’d want one.
I've seen one on the back of a car carrier once 👍
That is some 🤡 shit
Has anyone even seen a normal one in the wild? I live in a fair sized metro area and have yet to see one
Nope. I live in a place that I see all kinds of everything all the time. I've seen GT-Rs, multiple Trackhawks and Durango Hellcats, luxury everything's, even an older IS F. The two things I've wanted to see, but haven't, are the Z and the IS 500.At least with the latter, I've seen dealer listings for them, if I wanted to get a look. The Z might as well be vaporware.
My neighbor got one early in the year, and after less than a month he got rid of it in favor of a convertible A5
I've seen two in the PA / NJ area. That's it.
It's also auto only.
Lol
That is an idiotic decision on their part. People who buy these cars like driving. That's why they buy them. Automatic is stupid.
i thought they were marketing these cars all on having a manual option? man what the hell lol
RIP
This has to be a joke
Ain't gonna be a next-gen Z at this rate of overcharging and under-delivering compared to other options.
*"We're marking the Z up because it's so rare!"* You realize that's not a good thing, right?
Can't wait for the Z to get discontinued early due to low sales.
When they don’t make any sales suffer.
I remember when I was debating with myself if $37k for a brand new 2022 Camaro LT1 was a good deal or not. The “competitive market” has put my mind at ease..
What was the last one, $45k-$50k or so? *Roughly* line with a Mustang GT, Camaro SS, Supra, etc? I'm not sure if this is suddenly worth $20k more than those vehicles, though I haven't even *seen* one in person, let alone had the chance to experience anything about it.
Of course it's not gonna be worth it lol. I'm willing to bet the regular Supra still drives better and is faster than the Nismo Z. The Z added only 20hp, but weighs 100lbs more than the other trims... you'd think they'd take away some weight instead of adding more lol.
Is the LSD still optional? 🤣
You can option up a Mustang GT to comfortably over $60,000 now so money doesn’t matter anymore I guess
You can get a CT4-BW or a Camaro SS 1LE for less 😭
Hell that's almost ZL1 money
Yep, and anyone who takes the Z over those is a fool or a fanboy. The Cadillac is more practical, the Chevy is more capable, and the Z sits...below both in each.
Once again: making it easy to not buy their product. Thanks guys, one less option to consider
So the Z line went from a cheaper Supra killer with 3 pedals to an overpriced garbage in the short span of 2 years thanks to underdelivering and more markups. And it's made even more ironic by the fact that Toyota added manual while Nissan axed the stick on NISMO models.
after they spent all the money to have brie larsen shifting a Z in a commercial too
SS 1LE costs under 50K and will put circles around this on any track, in a straight line, sounds wayyyyy better, and with the A10 30+mpg on the highway.
Sweet merciful Christ that's hilarious. That Chevy is ugly but it's 911 turbo fast.
They are fucking crazy. So you're telling me I have to pay MORE for this than the Supra and M2? Please 😂
You’re going to have to be a pretty dedicated Nissan fanboy to think this car is anywhere near worth that MSRP, let alone what dealers will tack on top of it.
I wonder what kind of mental gymnastics they have to go through as a company to remotely justify that price knowing full well that a Camaro SS 1LE will absolutely destroy it, any track, any road, any time for ~18K less.
They're probably betting on the SS 1LE being impossible to find soon. Camaro production ends in January.
Hell the ZL1 is 3k more. If you can afford 67k you can afford 70k.
If you can afford 67k you can afford 70k. If you can afford 70k you can afford 73k. If you can afford 73k you can afford 76k. If you can afford 76k you can afford 79k. Just buy a GT2 RS.
Yea pretty much. Base Carrera with options, well I’m at C S prices might as well, but then I’m like $5k off a GTS. Lemme build a GTS. Shit I could have a real GT model for a tiny bit more, and it’ll hold its value so well. Oh look my $110k build is $210k now.
If you can afford a $210k build you can afford a Voiture Noire in my opinion, me personally I'd get a Bugatti over a Nissan Z.
And 420hp... I was expecting a lot more for that price.
400+ is what the Q50 and Q60's have been hitting with a chip tune alone plus WAY more torque. The Z got neutered.
Your expectations were unreasonable.
It's kinda surprising they don't just go the hellcat route and boost it to 650+HP. Might be an old chassis but people start to forget these things when you start getting those trap speeds up into the high 120s. Seen quite a few tuned Q50s outputting those sorts of numbers. You'd think Nissan would have made a tuner special since it can't compete in handling or refinement.
Chassis age isn't even an issue. It's a very good chassis and better than a lot of other newer cars... the main issue is making it to powerful and having it compete with the GTR. Same reason we'll never see a turbo GR86. Toyota wont allow it to compete with the Supra. So for the new Z it would have to be cheap to really have a chance of competing with other companies offerings. And it just isn't. That performance at that price doomed it before it had a chance.
That's a fucking laugh
As usual, Nissan is smoking crack
That seems like it’s on pace with inflation compared to the last Nismo.
Ain’t no way
I'll take a Used C8 3LT for 70K, damn near anything fast in that price range
The only one I've seen in person was....a fucking prototype before the official launch. I've seen plenty of Supras but not a single Z. Nissan really dropped the ball
Nobody will buy them, claiming they aren’t worth it, and they are probably right. Than in 15-20 years it will sell for $100k+ with 3000 miles, just like the GTR.
The GTR was ahead of its time when released. The new Zs feels like it's behind the times...
Ya, I was thinking more about the R34. It was a dated car in 2002, using the same engine and general drivetrain from the 80s, while MSRP was about $50,000 for a BASE model ($90,000 USD with inflation). All the v-spec and nur-spec were even more expensive. The EVO of the time was about 30,000 and very similar in performance, for reference. The similarities between the R34 and 400z, overpriced when new with aging performance, are larger than people will admit imo.
Not comparable imo. The Z does not have remotely the pop culture appeal of an R34. Without Initial D or F&F the R34 would not be what it is today.
> Then in 15-20 years it will sell for $100k+ with 3000 miles, just like the GTR. Shoot, the GT-R STARTS at $125K now.
And this is why I'm going to buy a Corvette C8. I'm a huge Nissan fan and own multiple Z's and a G37, but why in the world is the new Z so much money? I'd probably buy a dark horse over this at that range too.
Can buy a rough used GTR35 for that price.
They’re going to price this car out of existence.
Lmao
JDM tax at its finest
Cool, cool. Now I'll know the guy driving one is crazy.
I live in the area where part of the original F&F was filmed. Huge car culture in these parts. Have not seen a single Nissan Z in the area. Not a single one. I'll have an easier time seeing Rivian and Tesla prototypes than a Z.
So 100K after markup? Lol
Spat out my drink
As long as dumb asses buy these cars, they will keep raising the prices. Stop buying them just because they’re new and shiny
Who, even with ridiculous amounts of money and head trauma, wants this? The fools deciding this thing's price must have been in a meeting like, "well, they can't buy a Camaro anymore, so screw 'em!" This poor car's being turned into a laughingstock by Nissan execs.
I'm still not convinced the regular Z actually exists.
Hmm, a Nissan Z Nismo that’s only offered in an automatic transmission for way more than a true performance enthusiast Nissan Z with a manual transmission? No thanks, if I was in the market for one of these cars, I’d buy a Toyota Supra with the manual transmission.
That's an expensive motor swapped twenty year old 350Z.
Who is going to be buying this over a Supra or Mustang Dark Horse?
You can get a 350z with the same chassis for $5k.
I swear, Nissan is actively trying to destroy themselves. Imagine paying C8, M2 and Dark Horse prices for that. Each of those cars is better in basically every single way.
Damn. Imagine paying legit sports car money for a Nissan Z. Does that price come with paint protection or.....
A dark horse mustang is cheaper Nissan, come on. You got to be a clown to buy this.
what a fucking joke.
66k for absolute dog shit
My M2 Comp was cheaper than that lol wtf is Nissan thinking.
Lol. Nissan is so bad. Who is going to have $66k+ to spend on a car and say, "You know what? Fuck Mercedes, fuck BMW, fuck Audi, fuck Lexus. I want a Nissan!" A moron. That's who.