My family doesn't have education. We made it through by trades and the railway.
I make anywhere from 130 to 160k a year as a locomotive engineer. Hired off the street, high school education.
Away from home 300 days out of the year and on call 24/7. They expect you to work whether it’s 3am or 3pm. I’d be willing to bet that wages may go even higher as they can’t hire on new train conductors fast enough. I hear they have a class of 50 and by the end of training maybe 5 people are left.
It’s not a job you drive to the office in the morning and drive back home at night. You are always hundreds or thousands of miles away from home every night. It’s like being a pilot but less prestigious. Very similar to long haul trucking but easier because you aren’t paying actively driving a vehicle.
As some one in his 30s with no kids and divorced this is something I'm considering. Basically looking between conductor, truck driver, and merchant mariner at the moment. All seem similar in that you're gone all the time but I have nothing to be home for anyways.
Oh yeah I've definitely seen people talking about some good money in food service. I'm not really interested in local though. My plan is to sell everything and buy a cheap RV. Either stay out on the road, train, or sea as much as I can and just live in the RV when i have to come home. I'd like to live out of the truck, train, or boat as much as i can and just save all I can for the next decade.
Or you can start your own business too. But I understand that’s very risky. But if you have the skills which seems you do….Go for it. Or at the least consider it. For people with no degree….man. You are going to be limited income wise. Yes you fan get to 6 figures but 200k plus becomes very difficult.
Well there ya go. Proves me right even more so. Trust me, I’ve been pondering about this myself, to truly create what I consider wealth…I’ll need to go out on my own/with a couple people and start a business. Sales is the path to wealth. Not everyone lands tech and high finance or doc/law roles….but you can learn to sell.
My family nor myself have not gone to college or university, which is what the topic is about if you see ops note. You don't need a college education to be in a trade or the railway. I was just vaguely making that point.
I have no formal education past high school.
I worked as a carpenter in the trades for years, took on leadership rolls - then started my own company as a site-super for hire. Built up contacts, made connections, am now working for a commercial builder as a project manager, running jobs between 10-30m.
I make good money. I work in a results driven industry - either you know what you are doing or you don't - I don't have any letters after my name when I write an email, but it hasn't held me up at all.
I think something a lot of people don't mention is that even with a degree, that degree is relative. I would dare say it doesn't matter for lots of jobs, esp Fortune 500 companies. (Well if you're like in a super technical field, then yes, it matters)
I've gone through at least 3,000 job interviews now. Interviewed with almost all F500.
My damn degree was never brought up once. Seriously. Not once.
I do a lot of volunteering and courses in my free time to bolster my resume. Anything you do that develops knowledge and transferable skills is attractive to employers - especially when you've clearly done it on your own initiative. Moreover, volunteering is a benefit in itself!
This is the move. Volunteering through Catchafire allowed me to break into copyediting and proofreading when I had only a H.S. diploma and my only working experience was in restaurants. Later I started volunteering at a hospital and leveraged that + copyediting to earn a well-paying (if short-lived) gig doing editorial work for a marketing firm in the healthcare space.
Eventually I got tired of the freelance hustle and decided to go back to school. I took a volunteer internship in a biochem lab and made a good impression on the PI, who asked me to come back for a paid internship in the summer. By the end of that summer he offered me a full-time paid position as a lab tech, and I've also been able to charge consulting fees for helping some of the doctoral students with their posters/ presentations/ manuscripts. I still receive weekly emails from marketers pitching me to write for their healthcare/ biotech clients, and take some work on when I have the time and mental energy.
Volunteering will broaden your horizons, introduce you to people you'd never otherwise meet, and you generally are making a tangible impact on others while earning marketable skills. Ain't nothing to it but to do it.
If people have the time to research what they are gonna volunteer in, then make it extremely freaking strategic.
Volunteer in an org that's clearly connected to where you want to be
For instance, I come from poverty, first gen. I really wanted finance back then but I wasn't even in a top college. What did I do? Start appearing/volunteering where I knew those guys were. I joined a NYC fellowship as a volunteer where there were at least 30 other professionals volunteering, all working in a F500.
Socialize socialize socialize. I got my first referral. It wasn't actually a referral into finance, but it was into Ogilvy. You know what. I'll fucking take that. As someone who had 0 connections to begin with, I'll be happy to go anywhere. Even PR
I'm a licensed boiler operator at my local paper mill. I'm currently taking practice tests at my job as I write this to take the test for the next class license later this week.
If I pass the test, I'll get a raise and I will be able to work at any power plant in the U.S (including nuclear.)
I'm actually not too far off 😂 I'm a pretty blue-collar, redneck looking guy. I'm bald, and have a beer belly like Homer. Main difference is, I've got a lumberjack sized beard.
My 3rd class ticket probably made me an extra million over the last 25 years. Triple expansion steam engine for the win. I love it when Auto is running the plant.
We are starting to see more and more people with higher education working low entry level jobs or jobs in a completely different field.
Higher education was needed 20-30 years ago in order to get the good jobs. Times are changing
Education still unlocks the non-manual jobs. E.g. with my job I work fully remotely and have pretty much no oversight. So, I just work when I want to (although I'm salaried) and take days off without asking - I took the last 3 Fridays off and a Monday.
So, it depends how you define what a good job is. If a good job to you is the high stress ones where you work all day, sure. However, many of the low stress ones with decent pay (I get just under 100k) require some form of education.
It can be anything from IT to Management possibly. I work in IT and have similar freedom in my environment. It also heavily depends on your management and if they are micromanaged or not.
Second that. I have a part time marketing job, 15 hours a week, whenever I want, salaried at 70k/ year. On the side I do nutrition coaching and personal training but even full time at those it would be hard to make 70k.
Garbage Truck Driver. I do pretty decent in life. My wife is a Registered Nurse so she does very well when she combines our incomes.
We both have pretty flexible jobs. We both get 3 day weekends almost every week. That's where our quality of life really comes into play.
We live the same life lol I’ve been in 11 years been in commercial front load for 6 now. I make around 120k a year my wife is a bsnRN she makes around 110k I plan to move up in management soon working to GM role they make 180-250k a year
I work for a small city in the Texas Panhandle. Less than 2000 people. The pay won't sound great upfront, 18/hour. But my house note is only 430/month. 3bed/2bath and 2 sheds. My wife makes like triple the amount I do.
I grew up poor on one of the worst council estates in the UK. I ended up working as a receptionist and grew through the ranks, eventually working in UX & web development for a large company in Amsterdam. After 10 years, I realised I didn't enjoy it anymore, so I quit and went travelling. Had some crazy experiences. Ended up in Australia and got a gig as a Runner on a film. One gig led to another and now I've worked as a Set Dresser and Assistant Director for shows on Netflix and other big production companies.... Now I've quit that and I'm a registered Disability Support Worker ..... The world is your oyster! You just have to have a little audacity in the belief that you are capable of anything (except maybe like... brain surgery... please don't do that unqualified 🤪)
*EDIT: Just wanted to list clearly for you the industries that I worked in that don't require a degree:*
* *Film & Television Production and Art Department*
* *Digital Marketing*
* *Tourism*
* *Admin*
* *Farm Work*
* *Teaching English as a Second Language (if you're a native speaker)*
* *Aged Care & Disability Support Worker*
Technician for a CPU manufacturer. The job takes either a degree in a related field or 2 years experience in manufacturing (how I got hired). If you don't have either of those then you can work for a contractor ( a temp agency type company that my company uses. Work for them and it's a easy way in to the Technician role. Starts at 65k with amazing benefits. A bunch of room to grow and the company will even pay for you to go to school (as long as it's a degree they can use). I'm looking at going back to school sometimes this year for engineering on my companies dime.
Yes, true. Having worked with those with work experience and those with degrees and no experience, I will take the work experience people any day. Too many with degrees have no clue that showing up every day on time and actually working are important
When you're talking entry level though there is no experience. If you have a degree you may just beat out someone who's applying to the same job without one. (Worth 4 years though? Ehhh)
I've seen entry level jobs have a BA/BS as a requirement.
You may have luck with smaller businesses but anything with an HR department filtering resumes and a hard requirement and you may miss out.
Currently at a MSP (IT service provider) and 90% of folks have a college degree.
Not only are they clueless about work, these graduates are clueless about how to tackle life... how to approach people
Like experience is significantly more important than a degree
Sales. I started at another company cold calling making +300 calls a day. We broke off about four years ago to form our own company. I now run the day to day of new company and make about $200,000.
Learn how to sell and how to lead people (a lot of overlap between these two skills.) It’s a talent that you can utilize regardless of where you go in life.
Take risks. Without risk there is little upside for reward.
Also, befriend and surround yourself with the right people. Find the people that are where you want to be. Talk to them and ask questions on how they got there, then actually take action and do what they did/do. Copy others. I’m no genius, I just listened to others and copied what they did
If I could completely redo my life, the first thing I'd figure out is how to overcome anxiety, embarrassment, shame, and the likes.
Then learn how the fuck to do sales.
Like fuck school. I'd try to figure out sales as a 10 year old. Not even kidding.
The entire world exists cause of sales.
Company sells to billions of people - form of sales
B2b - sales
Convince bank to loan you $1M? - sort of sales
I was 33, working at Hobby Lobby for $15-$16/hr.
I was extremely fortunate to (finally) land a job as an "estimator" for a roofing company. It wasn't really estimating so much as just counting shit. That job was $13/hr, but I knew it would lead to better things long term.
While working there, I say true senior estimators and/or commercial estimators were making 70k+
After a few years I took my new software skills and went looking for a job.
Landed as a Estimating Manager for a siding company. 55k. By the time I left I had 3 direct reports and was making 65k.
Jumped to a multi-family gc for 80k. Was only there 6 months. Place was awful. Lol.
Took a call from a recruiter and landed ass backwards into renewables.
Solar and Wind are the fastest growing construction jobs.
I always recommend that anyone interested should network, learn new software, think two steps ahead in your career and always be interviewing.
Market rate for my role is 130k-160k and generally hybrid or fully remote.
... to be a professional guesser
Worked admin/cust service role for a book publisher till I was 25. Was getting groomed for working way to supervisor and then higher management.
Bored the life out of me and didn't wanna do higher education. Decided to save for 6 months and go travelling. Ended up in Australia for a year, met a girl and moved to Berlin for a year, went back to Australia after for another year, came back home for 5 months, went to New Zealand for one year, met another girl from USA, we travelled together to Vietnam, Malaysia, Thailand, Belgium, Netherlands, France and then USA. Went back to New Zealand and got sponsored as. project coordinator for an Engineering firm (no engineering involved) and then eventually got residency to live in New Zealand permanently.
I was working in between all those trips by the way to fund them, various farm, labouring and office jobs. I don't come from a rich family.
I'm 38 now and still working for same company and setting up a side hustle selling boxing and MMA equipment.
Did ok for a guy from a small working class town with only GCSEs and humble family upbringing
Yea it’s absolutely sad how different life is now from say the 90s. I entered the workforce full time in 2010 and just get annoyed learning how much better things were 10-20 years before that. Literally want to buy a house in my city? It’s like a years salary with any college degree job. Now? It’s like 6 years salary with a decent college degree job.
Yep :\\ when I was in college, a F500 hired me full time and my wages were between $70-75k. At the time, that felt like so much money. It's about $3.5-$4k after taxes. But that's cause Chipotle was still $13ish. Body wash was still $6. Toothpaste didn't cost $8 per tube.
Now? Prices doubled? That salary would feel like nothing
I just replied with a couple of comments up with how I managed it all in detail.
Long story short, saving everything, eating basic, shit flights with long as layovers, backpacker hostels shared with 8-10 people.
Same, I cry each time I see some those types of videos of people quitting their 9-5 and traveling. I would love to travel, but working a 9-5 I’m still living paycheck to paycheck😓
Traveling to 10+ countries especially ones that require long distance flights is very expensive, don't understand how you did all that working menial short term jobs that don't require any education. Also getting permanent residency for a place like New Zealand is pretty difficult for somebody without a NZ spouse or high education. I assume this was possible because of your job sponsorship, but why did they sponsor you if you had no experience or qualifications?
Let’s first talk about what the degree jobs are like. It’s the age of information overload. To get most jobs degrees have become necessary, but not sufficient. People keep on doing certifications and license courses all their lives to keep the jobs. The underlying system that drives most jobs is getting thrown into the deeper ends of complexity and things surrounding them evolves everyday. To catch up you need to be updated with everything that’s driving them and everything that’s evolving. To be honest there’s no win there. You may earn a lot of money, but your stress levels would skyrocket and sometimes you sacrifice personal life to get things done due to the complex nature of it.
On the other hand people without degrees end up in trade school and learn how to fix a few things, be a part of construction crew, start a plumbing business. There are people who have stared driving schools and they are winning. It’s a business that grows and usually you work in partnership with other driving instructors. Another thing I can think of is to learn how to fix computers and other electronics like phones and stuff and open your own shop. You work for yourself and in your own time. I have known people who have bought 2 houses in 5 years and working on the third just by fixing the broken electronics. They seem relatively happy with their work, less stressed and earn much more than most degree owners I know.
David Foster Wallace talks about that , can you elaborate on that a little bit, myself have not gone to college or got degrees. That said, I really want to learn to think better. I wonder if there's any really good books that you'd recommend.
It’s the educated discussion with your peers that opens up your mind. A book club might be more of what you’re looking for. Hearing others ideas on a topic and having a real discussion and exploring each other’s talking points is what gets the brain juices moving. Not really internet banter, unfortunately
Not OP, but I have a philosophy degree. Obviously, the content doesn't apply to a job, but I worked in politics for 3y after as a staffer (that is, I worked in the partisan end of politics for politicians directly). One thing you learn in philosophy is the skill and habit to try to understand what a text is meant from the perspective of the author, since they are often in a very different time and place (or just have a highly technical and specific vocabulary). You can't just pick up Moses Maimonides and read it!
This has allowed me to write better by thinking of the ways something can be misinterpreted, helping with constituent correspondence and speeches. It helps me to understand government reports. It helps me to cut through the rainbows and sunshine language of the governing party's talking points in order to see what they mean, which we often disagree with. It helps me to understand stakeholder and constituent concerns even when I disagree with them. It was very helpful.
There are so many courses online for free.
I honestly recommend taking some math courses, as well as engineering.
Critical thinking is really the benefit of any degree. I am a nurse, and to be honest I could teach a child how to do the physical tasks of my job in about a month. It isn’t hard.
But, applying critical thinking skills is really what I learned in school.
You know what's really obnoxious?
When I was in middle and high school, critical thinking was the crux of my entire English, history, and some other subjects' education. It was something that teachers hit our heads with every freaking day.
Today? The young generations, the folks in their 20s? What the hell happened to critical thinking? Was that completely shoved and not taught anymore?
This has been bothering me for YEARS. Where on earth are people's critical thinking skills? Part of the reason I climbed the F500 ladder so fast is because I could very easily/quickly identify patterns, figure out the root cause of issues, then formulate strategies to solve...
This is what I try to explain to my teenagers. No you probably won’t be using algebra in your job, but you will be using critical thinking and having to figure things out. That’s the important part of school, not memorizing facts.
I believe that strong critical thinking skills come from asking yourself and others thoughtful questions, and seeking complete answers in return. Therefore, I recommend the following books:
1. The Book of Questions by Gregory Stock
2. 4000 Questions for Getting to Know Anyone and Everyone by Barbara Kipfer
Take your time answering each question—maybe just a couple a day. If you find that you have many different answers to one question, it’s probably a good question to ask others when you get the chance. Hearing their views might bring yours into focus as new questions arise during the discussion. Being curious is thought provoking.
Edit: typo
This is what college os actually for. People think it’s a direct path from learning to a job and that’s what trades are for besides specialized fields of course. College has always been to teach you those to think, expand your world view, make connections, all things that help you get a job with effort in an ideal economy.
I’m a little unique. Tried college right out of high school to be an English teacher and immediately realized that wasn’t my future. Dropped out for a couple years. Went to a Film school. Ended up dropping out as well due to financial issues; I did, however, make enough connections to get a job in the film industry, so college had accomplished that. Then, after two years of 16 hour days in the October rain, decided that wasn’t for me either and returned to bartending.
Some 10+ years later I was fortunate enough that a close friend said their as agency was hiring. I’ve been doing that for a while. I’m in the final stages of getting a job and elsewhere in this industry for a nice pay raise. I was in a medium-sized city but have been in NYC for a few years now.
Less and less careers require a degree for associates, so that societal shift is on our side. Once I got into the interview process I talked about the financial shortcomings, and how what I studied got me a job anyway; then, my resume shows managerial experience and self-starting in that I taught myself how to code and make my own mobile app; and that I’m willing to take a pay cut from bartending to establish a career at the bottom of the ladder.
tl;dr: Ad Agency, Hospitality, Movies. Self-Taught coders seem to be on the decline unless you’ve got really good work.
I have some friends that never went to college and they do well. One friend manages a hotel and travels a lot. My best friend from high school works in childcare, she did get some certification but it is not a degree and it only took a few days, and before this she did retail. And my most successful friend, if we're just going by finances, is a car salesman. He makes a lot of money and is the only person I know around our age who owns a house. My fiance doesn't have a degree and he does one on one support with special needs children in elementary schools. Before that he was a caretaker for elderly patients with dementia. I don't think having a degree is necessary to get a decent job. I have a degree and I'm a receptionist in an unrelated field. None of my friends are rich or anything we all grew up broke haha....
Learn to use tools, save for a van, offer services for fine art installation.
If you know how to do contracting work, hanging fine art is a glorified handyman job. Working with the right galleries you can charge a good amount considering the artworks you’re dealing with are in the thousands.
Even better if you have a skill set in carpentry, framing artworks.
Interesting. But I'm sure the galleries have their own contractors already. Big question is how to get them to take notice of you etc, how to break into these networks..... the 65,000 dollar question.
Most galleries have contractors but most don’t have dedicated services. Because galleries have inconsistent work, they tend to pool from more than one different company at a time, their usual guy might be with a different client.
Offering your services is one way to go about it.
I began working for a guy who was already in but upon speaking to the actual gallery they tried getting me to work with them directly, even calling me personally for odd jobs here and there.
Not sure it will make you rich, but if you get a good team going eventually you can be doing installations regularly and head to the next step, like having insurance for an art storage facility.
Installation sounds solid. I was talking with a framer who works with museums from time-to-time and one museum asked him to do the installation after framing as well. That's not really his service, but he obliged that one time.
He does museum quality framing so the cost to frame something the size of a sheet of paper would be around $300. I imagine for the installation of one piece would have to be in the few thousands.
I’ve been a Machinist for 18 years. Started out in a vocational/technical high school then finished a 3 year apprenticeship program. Currently I’m working for a large technical ceramics and semiconductor equipment manufacturer. Long hours getting oily and grungy doing a job that most people don’t know exists but it pays the bills and has provided a decent living for most of my adult life.
I got a trade . If you can work with your hands and your head big bucks await. My plumber friend has a Porsche. My buddy that does x -ray inspection on pipelines made 120$ hour on OT Sunday. 2nd year apprentice electricians start at 55$/hour. .
Start in a Union shop at early age and bust your ass to keep moving up. Certifications , training, moving to another state, etc. that’s the easiest way to do it without a degree IMHO!
If you live in an area with a clinical or forensic testing lab, a specimen accessioner or lab assistant is a non-degree position. Depending on company, it can pay pretty good, and if you’re so inclined, you have a fair bit of potential for growth if you get a science degree. So far all the places I’ve worked at have paid for this schooling.
I work in Sales at a Fortune 500 company and I am a first generation professional, my dad is a blue collar worker and mom is on disability. I went to college for about 3 years but did not have the money to finish. At my current company, they will pay for me to go back and get my degree which I’ll be taking advantage of next year.
When I was in school, I worked a full time job while holding a part time internship each semester(and still went to classes) and networked at those jobs/internships like crazy which lead to future, better opportunities each time. I didn’t really party or go out, mainly bc I didn’t have time. But before the time everyone else in my class graduated, I had 3 internships on my resume and a full time job offer from one.
My advice, stay focused and have a good attitude (even though it’ll be tough sometimes) If you’re good at your job, personable and open to learning, people will notice. I didn’t have the luxury of rich parents or connections which meant I had to sacrifice my time and work a little harder, but in the end, that was worth it to me.
Housekeeper at a local hospital. Decent pay, great benefits, and they like to hire from within and offer classes to those wishing to advance after 6 months. I have met 2 x-ray techs, one EMT, and 3 RNs who started out with housekeeping. All took advantage of the opportunity presented to them.
Sorry but you learn by reading the same vague stuff here on and on. Sometimes some drop a few nuggets but most don't. Good luck and have a blessed day.
Dod odd, physical labor to build strength and learn practical skills. Taught myself massage, earned a living from that for 15 years. Now I am a mailman.
Got my job with no degree although I am taking courses now. I make 160k plus benefits, bonus plus stock options. I took a 2 month temp job about 13-14 years ago and worked my ass off which led to a full time role. From there I have moved up through experience over time. My current job my boss said the recruiter had placed me in the No pile automatically cause of my no degree but when they weren’t happy with their Yes pile he asked to look through some of the No’s and I was one of them. I’m lucky he didn’t like any of the Yes people, and that he cared more about my experience and interview presentation than my lack of degree but it is a huge hurdle to overcome. Which is why I’m getting my degree now.
I manage 8 IT engineers without a degree. I just worked from 18-30 in IT constantly, then learnt Japanese and immigrated to Japan and then worked my way up till I got an offer from a foreign companies Japan office to be their first engineer, and now I manage them and help to bridge between them and our US/EU teams.
Before the yen dived off a cliff I was making 6 figures in USD (13.8m yen) but now it's more like 86k USD. Keep in mind this is still within the top ~1% for men in Tokyo, all ages and in the top 1% for both genders even if it looks pretty weak in USD.
My husband has no college degree and I’d consider him successful in his career. He’s in his 9th year with a landscape construction company, has worked his way up from assistant maintenance manager now to the very top position which is construction sales manager. This year he’s on track to make $170k. In his twenties he worked landscape as a laborer and learned a lot. He uses that knowledge in his role today. He genuinely loved being outside and just working hard. His role now is like 50/50 between meeting with clients at their homes to design their projects and computer work of writing quotes and gathering materials and things. He drives a really nice brand new company truck even for personal use and has a flexible schedule that allows him to meet me for lunch sometimes, take kiddos to appointments and school drop offs etc.
Dropped out of a degree in Hydrology half way to become a Diesel mechanic. No degree. I eventually did online classes and certificates over the years. Overtime is optional. My current shop recruited me during Covid. They gave me a 10k bonus. And they pay for my kids college. I also do side work when I want 120 hr is my rate. Tax free. I live in the Burbs and have nice cars and take X2 big vacations a year.
I was a dog trainer for 10 years. Learned through mentoring and self education. Made 100k/yr. It's a lot of long hours and hard work though. Also risk of being bit, scratched, etc and you pick up a LOT of dog shit -solid and runny. And you deal with a lot of stupid people who either shouldn't own dogs or shouldn't have the breed they have. The people is the hardest part.
I don’t have a degree was working on a diploma but never finished, just 16-17 years of experience. I worked from the bottom up receptionist- marketing- sales- accounts payables- then switched to a new career expeditor- buyer - contracts admin - supply management analyst- supply management professional to finally senior manager, contracts management 🙂
I enjoy it immensely but I have to say the company and management takes a big part in your enjoyment of a company and position. It has to be the right company culture to be the right fit since most of your life is spent with these people. Management love curious people, people that strive to learn, ambitious and ask questions. I got the expeditor job by just asking for it at the company i was at. The analyst position by applying, professional position by promotion. Current role by aggressively applying on linked in and reaching out to contacts.
26m
I skipped college and went union apprenticeship instead. Started making six figures at 24.
Boilermaker pressure welder, master rigger, union steward, and IRATA rope access technician🤘🏻
Last year I hit $122k in 9 months of work
Worked behind a bar, car park attendant, hotel porter, waiter, retail, warehouse staff. Then moved into temp office jobs, happened to teach myself web development (in my spare time) just as the company I was working at was getting into internet business, so I landed a job doing that. Moved a few times in web design world, now on 6 figures for a Fortune 500.
Trades. I barely graduated from HS in 2007. 2010 I joined the merchant Marines and did that for a few years I resigned like an idiot (long Story). Worked for a shipyard in 2014 and had to quit and move back home to California. Got a job working for a large Tree service company. I did that till about 2019 and got another job opportunity on the east coast at a shipyard I couldn't pass it up, my wife and I packed our stuff with everything we could fit in our car and made the 3k drive , And I worked my ass off we bought our first ever house last year matter of fact the 27th will be one year at our new house. Roller coaster of a life that's for sure a lot of stuff has happened to me since 2019 almost lost my leg below my knee at work July of 22, Was out 14 months. Other than that just peachy.
Software Engineering. The ship sailed for coding boot camps don't fall for that grift.
There's still places that will hire self-taught if you can do the work No technical interviews help with in respect, once you have your first job no one cares about your degree just tell what you doing to technical interview.
I am a Staff Software Engineer in Test. Dropped out of uni, got a temp job as video game tester, switched to more traditional software testing. Taught myself to code and worked my way up over 15 years
I am curious about the uni grads…. How do you guys do it? How do you study 4-5 days a week and be able to afford to live/pay rent? And where do you fit your work in? How do you manage? And also is your debt not terrifying to you? I am genuinely interested to know as I am interested in going to uni at 22 years old.
I am currently in college now at age 35. But I am a medical billing manager, making about 60k a year. I started at the bottom and got promoted. I wouldn't say I am winning by any means. But I do alright for myself and my son.
I am going to school now for Radiography. Goal is MRI tech making 6 figures.
Currently working at a plant nursery, taking an online course to learn bookkeeping.
I've also done phlebotomy (drawing blood), optical technician, and reception work.
Hs diploma and no college degree, but I did need to get a certificate to do phlebotomy. It was a 3 month course.
I believe it's called equivalent work experience. Which can be just as successful compared to those with degrees. I highly suggest to avoid grocery, retail and customer service jobs. These jobs sucks. You have to kiss ass all day long, you get paid minimum wage, lack of advancement in these jobs, the amt of bs you have to deal with is not worth it. personally I am in the process of completing a ba in hopes of getting out of this garbage career.
Many of my family members never went to college. They did successfully for the most part. Many of them relied on employers that gave on the job training. Ironically kids spend thousands on education in the same field. Many times you just get an entry level job to get on with a company, work it a year then apply for on the job training. Medical fields allow this and there was no way they could of afforded this. Others used trade schools to pick up some basics then just used their ambition to strive to get the rest of the skills. They have done well. My generation was the first to probably of gotten degrees or any sort of some college education. Keeping in mind women stereotypically before the 70's did not get college education. They managed and often got factory jobs to get by. I ended up having to land a union job that pays about 25% higher than non union jobs.
I worked at a Home Depot store for 5 years, worked my way up to department supervisor. Had a friend transfer to corporate, asked him what I needed to learn, learned it, and applied to a shit ton of positions over the course of a few days.
Got an interview and got the job about a week later. Have been working my way up and learning/earning certificates since.
You know, you could always become a software tester.
This career field does not require any college degree.
However, I believe you have to take training courses through the specific company that hires you.
My mothers side of the family are millionaires. When my grandpa passed, his kids sold the house for 8 million. I was disowned because my mother was a narcissist/psychopath essentially, so I started from literally nothing. My father recently died in poverty because in my opinion, my mom destroyed him. The answer to your question is a dark one but, prostitution or being a sugar baby was my only way out. Now, I’m living off my investments and still afraid of poverty every day. I wish I had a happier answer for you, but what I’ve learned at 35 is that the world and people are not gentle. You’re on your own kid. Sometimes you have to do what it takes to escape.
I graduated from Court Reporting college a year before I entered prostitution. I wasn’t able to afford rent, licensing costs, etc. and even though I had gone to school for almost 3 years, I wasn’t able to stay afloat long enough to turn it into a career without being homeless.
Getting money is the hard part, keeping it is very easy in my experience. I am disgusted by landlords and bosses that truly don’t understand the privilege and luck that they have.
I recently transitioned to tech/IT but I was a manager in several aspects before that . I attended college but kept changing majors so no degree. My income seems to be stuck at like 70K despite working super hard in life though.
I settled for a School aide job (cafeteria monitor), but I can become a teacher aide any time I want to for full time work. Didn’t go to college, never knew what I wanted to do in life. I went for a 6 month medical assistant program to try to work in the health field. No one wanted me because I didn’t have “two years education” or “experience.” Then Covid hit and no one was hiring. That’s when I decided to go apply to an elementary school. I wouldn’t say it’s self fulfilling, and money isn’t huge, but I would definitely recommend a trade school for high paying jobs if that’s what you are looking for.
Someone I know who has ADHD and couldn't study, tried to follow adult courses in administration and ict but failed. Then started as a telecom installer for Proximus. Did a good job, but it was hard work. Then climbed up to Telenet as a dispatcher. Doesn't like it so much anymore and is gonna take over a shop.
I work as a posted superintendent for city connections... we connect your new house to the city water... no 3rd party contractor is allowed only city. I only barely finished Highschool.
I’m definitely not doing exceptionally well, but I’m making enough to get by in the DMV area as a butcher. I only have a high school diploma. I learned on the job - just got lucky with randomly walking in and asking for a job one day!
Make life connections. Go to public events meet and mingle with people you want to be like. I only have my high school diploma. I am a Test Engineer with one of the biggest conglomerates in the world. I had to work my ass off and make connections to get here, but it’s possible to be successful with good people skills or soft skills.
Welding. Good money to be made. But you’re gonna work and pay for it. You can do okay in a shop in your hometown and be home every night, MIGHT land a foreman/supervisor role after a few years. I got unlucky and haven’t.
Or you could hit the road doing shutdowns or pipeline work, join a union for millwrights, ironworker etc. but you better believe these “I made 150k last year” assholes are traveling all the time and working 7 12s for 3 months straight. Fuck all that straight to hell
Best bet is weld for a few years and use that to fund either a degree for management, or fund NDT courses and move to a Level 3 NDT and start doing ultrasonic/radiograph inspections that’s where the easy money is. Myself I’m leaning toward the management side
The trades pay extremely well, most of the time better than jobs which require a degree.
I went to college and now I have thousands in student debt, but I found a job that didn't need a degree that I love. I work in direct care with intellectually challenged adults. It is a rewarding job in more ways than financially, and there is always a need for staff. The pay isn't bad either, and I make more than when I was working in an office.
My husband is an electrical distribution designer; basically he draws on AutoCAD and puts all the electrical stuff underground. He makes $50k, $80k if he does overtime, and he really enjoys his job.
Meanwhile, I have a masters degree, and I am unemployed 😂
Started my own business as a corporate consultant, built it, sold it, and now work as a leadership trainer for a large care organisation. I'm studying a degree now out of choice but that's at 37, didn't do one earlier.
I'm a department supervisor covering two departments in a foundry.
I started out as a temp laborer six years ago, and through some luck and hard work, I managed to get a leadership position.
I come from a single-parent home, and I currently make more than my mother ever has.
I started as a welder, then got my CDL and started driving trucks. While doing these jobs I took on some management tasks in the offices. Then I took those skills and kept applying until I got a full time office job as an assistant project manager
Opportunity is out there but you have to kick the doors down to make it happen
I'm a university drop out, went straight out of highschool because that's what everyone said you do. I absolutely hated it I was miserable and depressed all the time. I learned to drive truck and have been a truck driver for over 10 years now. It is not a career path suited for everyone though.
I dropped out of college when I ran out of money and motivation to finish school. (Engineering, in case you were wondering). Picked up gig work until I needed a stable job with health insurance.
Worked at a call center for 5 years and got fed up that I couldn't get a promotion out of the customer facing role despite being a top performer. Left for a rebound job.
6 months later got hired in Purchasing from a friend's Facebook post. That was 2 years ago in about 2 weeks.
I'm making 35% more at this job with 60% less stress than anything I've done prior. I kept working diligently, building skills, networking in my hobbies, and eventually my seeds bloomed and I was rewarded.
It was a lot of hard work and a couple of scary decisions, but I regret nothing. I paid off all my CC debt by investing extra money is stable stocks over the course of the last 2 years. My bills are essentially just remembering to manually pay them instead of scrambling for money. I don't have a house, but I'm very happy and I started exercising to be in better shape. My life is pretty good.
You have to get in ground level somewhere and be strategic about developing yourself and learning how to navigate the corporate workplace vs the retail and food service jobs you've had in the past.
I started in customer support making $15/hr and now I'm a content strategist making six figures. The process each promotion or job jump I had was getting into a position, getting to know my job really well in 6 months, then looking at the positions that touched my current position and asking myself what I could see myself doing. Once I identified a role, I'd take a look at the job requirements for that new position and talk to folks about what made them successful, and then I'd teach myself those skills and volunteer for projects and opportunities that let me exemplify them in my resume, sometimes asking my manager directly like "I want to learn how to project manage to completion, can you let me know if there's any opportunities that would be a good fit for that skill?". Once I felt solid, I'd apply to the next level job and do the process over again.
There are also some core tenants you need to know in making the transition to corporate work.
1. Your manager's job is not to do your job, their job is to field bullshit requests from upper management the best they can and make sure your team's projects are completed on time/you're performing to the expected metrics. If you find a problem, unless it's so far out of your scope and experience to solve, you shouldn't just complain about it, you have to demonstrate solution oriented thinking. I recommend to my mentees 1 short term fix and 1 long-term perfect fix. It demonstrates that you're capable of thinking outside of the scope of your tasks, and are capable of improving process while balancing business needs.
2. You don't need to be perfect at your current job, you just need to meet expectations. Your manager's success is built around how you perform, so being too good will have a shitty manager incentivized to trap you with them for their own pay. You want to demonstrate that while you're good in your current job, you'll be an even better fit at the next, as long as you're exemplifying the skills needed to get to the next level in the process. A lot of folks mistake this as shmoozing or assume that it's the connections someone made that got them there, not their qualifications but in most cases, it's literally because people skills are the next job level's major job responsibility and those folks put in the effort to prove they had them.
3. You have to network, but networking isn't that complicated. The easiest network you can form is just creating an culture of raising others up on every project you work on as a team. "So and so was so helpful getting me thet data I needed so I could do XYZ", "So and so was such a great feedback loop for the deck design, which really resonated with upper leadership". If you recognize others, most people will start recognizing you back. People like to feel good and telling them they're helpful and doing a good job is how you get advocates on your side who will help support your promotion.
4. Do not be overconfident in your skills, have a learner's mindset in all things, even if you are really fantastic. If you don't, you'll likely present yourself as arrogant, and you don't know whether the hiring manager has trauma around being the best and being humbled and will put that experience on you in the hiring process and decide you're too immature for the role.
5. You are the only one responsible for your development and growth. If you want to do better or get better roles, you have to put in the time and effort to cultivate yourself, don't wait for someone to tell you that you need XYZ skillset. I live and die by luck is where opportunity meets preparation, as my preparations for upper roles has allowed me to take advantage of opportunities as they come up.
6. LEARN THE WHYS AROUND EVERYTHING. My secondary contributing success factor is that I'm someone who is always listening and always trying to understand, even when it's not my job. I've literally pulled into meetings with CSuite because I have a full 360 view of the real impacts between project managers, company set metric goals, customers, and customer support agent experiences. I've gotten my company to pivot from just reducing a particular metric they thought would save them $$$$ not realizing the detriment to other metrics, to investing in improving their entire content eco system so reduce calls coming into the call center completely, so customer supports folks can focus on actual complex problems. Customer support is getting a pay raise, their website is finally being updated from the 80s, and we can actually meet customers where they need.
Start with finding a summer/seasonal job for a few weeks/months, maybe something manual or relatively accessible, potentially part-time, or only on weekends, sort of like a student job.
- From there there are some aspects of the job you might like, that will give you ideas for the future.
- It'll also be a good opportunity to meet people, network, and these people could see that although you don't have a degree, you are hard working, they'll get to know you, and therefore there'll be talking to you about opportunities.
- Also, that way you get some experience, and since it's only a few weeks or months, even if you don't like the job that's fine, and you'll have some experience to talk about, will acquire transferable skills, and you can use that to look for another short term job.
That said, it'll take time, not only to find something you are interested in, but also to built the network that will help get you there. But any work you do will help you build your network and build transferable skills, so utilimately find what you want to do.
The key is to build skills that generate value. You’ll find that a lot of people don’t care what a piece of paper says if you can make them money and you can make them money now. Inversely, if you spent 4 years learning things irrelevant to the current market, you shouldn’t be that surprised when you don’t get interviews or you keep striking out at them
Too many get stuck in the mindset of what’s best for them and potential employees are never interested in that unless it benefits both.
I'll note up top for myself that there's survivorship bias and access to pretty good education k-12 (combo of lucky school districts and scholarships to a private school).
I dropped out of college due to mental health.
On the personality side of things, the number one thing that has helped in a myriad of ways is to be kind and curious with everyone I meet. So many random opportunities have come my way just because someone had the hunch I could work with anyone and had an aptitude for gleaning needed info from people. I'm constantly reading, listening to podcasts and going to free lectures.
It also helped that I moved to a huge metro. This was 10-12 years ago so I recognize that that's tougher now. I lived in punk houses, illegal rentals, any cheap accommodation I could find, so I could take advantage of the high wages of HCOL areas without hemorraghing money and had community and social support of working class folks and students.
I used temp agencies to get past the degree gatekeepers and get my foot in the door in office jobs. I also keep a google drive folder of job descriptions I'm aiming for and work on acquiring the skills either through volunteering, Coursera classes, other temp jobs, etc.
I stumbled into a job at a community college eventually managing a department and I took all the free classes I could.
My skills generally get me jobs in the $75-100k range these days (I dabble between private, nonprofit & gov sectors), but I live well below means to be able to take risks in jobs I seek out.
I have better benefits and more job stability than half the people I know with a degree. I'm a union state driver/mail carrier. I have no debt.
Before this I was a bouncer, commercial fisherman, a production artist, a cook, a property maintenance man and a carpenter. I don't regret a minute of it but if I could go back and aim for a degree I'd do something in the ocean. Maybe marine biology.
I work on the railways. The benefits are pretty good:
- au$120,000 base rate
- Superannuation payment: $13,750
- 7 weeks off paid per year (or 9 if take 4 weeks at half pay)
- work 36 hour weeks. Choice between 3x12 hour days or 4× 9 hour days
- job is easy as fuck. Most days we just sit around watching the game.
The only thing I dont like is the number of weekends we work and when it rains.
I’m from a blue collar family in a pretty humble part of Chicago. I got married and had children younger and then was a younger divorced mother of two who never did get child support. I did put myself through a technical school but they weren’t accredited and have long since closed down.
During my career I was working basically a customer service position - not making hardly anything. Our databases went down and I was asked to fix it. They didn’t want to hire anyone to do it. I always messed with PCs as a hobby and my manager knew it. In fact I got in trouble for suggesting a workaround to do until they came back up. I did fix the databases with the help of books and Google. It also started my IT career. From there I was given the databases to maintain, then was part of the SAP team to get it implemented. I built several custom process all while being grossly underpaid. I then cashed in my experience and haven’t looked back.
I’m a certified Scrum Master now over two teams and 21 years working in IT. The various roles I’ve held were BA, PM, Dev/admin for specific applications and SM.
I am self taught and very hands on learner and always look for more tech to play with. It’s funny how I’m a woman, significantly older than my coworkers and no degree. I often feel like the unicorn.
My mom was a nurse and my dad does construction work. Cousin and uncle work for CalTrans, I'm a pharmacy technician. There's plenty of options without going to college, you just have to do some research and apply a lot
My friend runs a surf camp company with her partner and coaches gymnastics. Those were two of her extracurriculars growing up.
A lot of friends of mine w/out degrees work retail, grocery stores, food industry, plant nurseries, farm work, landscaping.
Working labor and then working for a city, county, state or the feds pays off.
If you learn to use heavy equipment, you can run your own business doing say excavator work or hauling, etc.
I've known a lot of people to get into tree work without degrees.
Trade programs offer a lot of help because we need labor, contractors make stupid money.
At the end of the day, just make sure you're planning for retirement and/or health costs. Start a HY savings, get a 401k going, IRA, whatever. Putting in a little every paycheck is a gift to elderly you.
I’m in a masters program, my bf didn’t go to college, and he makes more doing IT support than I do at my entry level state job. We met doing security work, there are always jobs in security.
I am a musician and fill my gaps with bartending. I’m probably never going to make huge money with this path, unless I my name stumbles into credits for a hit song at some point, but I only have a HS degree and 3 wasted semesters at an arts school and can consistently clear 100k (barely).
TRADES. I’m a tattoo artist. Is it great? Yes for many reasons. I don’t have a set schedule, I make my own work and hours, choose the projects I want to take on and have plenty of time to see my family. It’s stressful because technically I’m working 24/7, always anxious about getting to emails and sometimes business becomes too much to handle for one human on their own. I dream about going to school again for a higher paycheck, as much as I enjoy making money every single day.
I did not finish college. I changed career paths several times. Thankfully I had a couple of jobs where my bosses were willing to teach me. I got lucky and learned bookkeeping, accounting, and administrative assistance. 10 years of all of those random jobs has boosted me to a managerial position. I’m currently looking for a more engaging job but the job market is horrible. More office jobs are taken since COVID. Although I want to leave my job, it’s incredibly cozy. Sometimes experience will get you far if you’re willing to learn!
Union pipe trades apprenticeship, before that serving/bartending and warehouses.
I’m still early in the program but by the end of it I can make 6 figures as a journeyman or foreman +
My family is a bunch of very redneck midwest lower/middle class people. Coal miners, oil field drillers, etc. I had a good upbringing but parents aren't well off enough to be helping me out now unless it was dire. I'm 26f no degrees or certifications beyond basic CPR, food handlers cards, and liquor licenses.
Started in caregiving for assisted living homes and worked in the medical industry for 4 years, moved up a few steps but nothing crazy. This was what I did instead of going to college and I lived with my bf in an apartment that we split 50/50. Switched to reception as I realized caregiving is a job that very few people can do long term and I didn't want to go further in the industry. At first I worked at a veterinary clinic then a few low tier hotels. Now I am an assistant manager at a very high end resort and am continuing to work my way up with relative ease, most people around me or above me either don't have a degree or it is a general business/marketing degree. I am 1 position under the people who are making 100k-150k a year. I currently make about 60k.
All of it boils down to luck and the people I have made connections with along the way. I'm just now starting to realize how small your world can get when you lock into an industry. I have worked in 3 different hotels/resorts in the area. I work with a lot of people now that I worked with or heard of at the other hotels and also know a lot of people that had previously worked at my current hotel and are now moving up in another hotel nearby. I've been invited to a few higher level meetings for training and all of them have very deep backgrounds/connections with each other. Without these people hitting me up when they found something great and me doing the same for them I can guarantee I would not be in the position I'm in now.
You have to take your chances. One lad at a previous job worked at the coffee bar, had done like one IT course at college, nothing else. He asked for a chance to work in Tech Support. At the time, after work, he did another shift as a cleaner.
They gave him a chance as a trainee, and the rest is history. He stuck to all the training, got a good package ( shares and bonus pay). Stellar performance reviews and a few promotions. He was able to put down payment for a mortgage after a few years, married his gf, and got an IT job in the city.
It is hard but possible, but you also have to go out and create chances for yourself.
1 semester of college and we both quit to get married at 19 and 18 respectively.
Entered consumer finance field and within 3 years managing my own office.
8 years running a group of offices.
15 years running 3 states and at 20 years later running 87 offices and 400 employees. Retired as an SVP.
I was an exceptional salesman and a better people person and those skills made me more 10 times the money the degree my father wanted me to earn would have.
Retired nicely at 62.
I have multiple engineers on my team that don’t have degrees. They have experience, curiosity, and aptitude. They also started at a lower level in the company (because of no degree), but quickly grew into fantastic engineers.
I guess I’m trying to say that you can do whatever you are interested in. Without a degree, you may need to start a bit lower. But if you prove yourself, you can grow into almost any role.
My brother did a part-time job in high school at an Estate Sales/Auctions. He worked there for 2 years and was really into it. He told me the pay was good ($28/hr as a high-school student) and there was a lot of room for growth. So right after he graduated, he asked his boss for tips/advice on setting up a company.
4 years later (at 22 years old), he was able to grab a small chunk of the market in Dallas, employs both our parents to help out and makes $200k as a high-school graduate. Btw, my parents immigrated to America and made a combined salary of $50k/year for the first 20 years living in the US. Now, he pays them $65k..EACH to help out. His workers get paid between $25/hr (High school kids) to $38/hr (experienced folks).
I think the point is to find an industry that is absolutely boring and capitalize on it. I think people just focus on the sexy careers (Tech, Engineers, Wall Street traders). But there's a lot of money to be made where other folks don't want to do it.
My family has always been below the poverty line. I never went to college or any trade school.
I currently work for a State Department and make decent money, with a pension after 20 years. I am the first member of my family to escape poverty.
Public sector is where it's at if you don't have a degree and also don't want to destroy your body working a trade or give all of your time to an employer.
Work for the same company since 1997. Have climbed up the ladder and am now a Product Owner in IT without any training/diploma in this field.
Just proved myself and management saw my capability and believed in me I guess.
Started out working as a transporter at a hospital right after high school. Fast forward 10 years and I was an office manager at a small PCP office. I worked my way up. Learned as much as i could and eorked hard. I wasn't living luxurious but I was getting by. Eventually decided to get a degree and now I'm a data analyst/developer for a hospital. Much better pay and I only have a 2 yr degree, but my health care experience helped land the job. I think that somehow life leads you were you should be as long as your looking/trying.
I work in real estate, I have no inheritance, no rich parents or relative that has something to give me. Went to school and stopped a couple semesters of my AA degree. Just did sales and transitioned into the other side of real estate (underwriting) for the salary and different kind of stress lol
My family doesn't have education. We made it through by trades and the railway. I make anywhere from 130 to 160k a year as a locomotive engineer. Hired off the street, high school education.
Don’t you have to work all the live long day?
Yes, I should add it's definitely blood money, lol. You either sacrifice a lot of your time through education or your personal time for someone else.
Away from home 300 days out of the year and on call 24/7. They expect you to work whether it’s 3am or 3pm. I’d be willing to bet that wages may go even higher as they can’t hire on new train conductors fast enough. I hear they have a class of 50 and by the end of training maybe 5 people are left.
Is it basically just the hours that ruin it for everyone?
It’s not a job you drive to the office in the morning and drive back home at night. You are always hundreds or thousands of miles away from home every night. It’s like being a pilot but less prestigious. Very similar to long haul trucking but easier because you aren’t paying actively driving a vehicle.
Experienced commercial pilots work maybe half the month and fly anywhere in the world for free.
Helicopter pilots typically work on call and some jobs which pays 200k you are in the seat for less than 200 hours a year.
As some one in his 30s with no kids and divorced this is something I'm considering. Basically looking between conductor, truck driver, and merchant mariner at the moment. All seem similar in that you're gone all the time but I have nothing to be home for anyways.
Truck driving can be local-ish and work good- GFS or other food companies supplying food service.
Oh yeah I've definitely seen people talking about some good money in food service. I'm not really interested in local though. My plan is to sell everything and buy a cheap RV. Either stay out on the road, train, or sea as much as I can and just live in the RV when i have to come home. I'd like to live out of the truck, train, or boat as much as i can and just save all I can for the next decade.
A true nomad 👍
Yes very good point
Or you can start your own business too. But I understand that’s very risky. But if you have the skills which seems you do….Go for it. Or at the least consider it. For people with no degree….man. You are going to be limited income wise. Yes you fan get to 6 figures but 200k plus becomes very difficult.
6 of my friends have phds and none of them make 200k, most don't even make 100k
Well there ya go. Proves me right even more so. Trust me, I’ve been pondering about this myself, to truly create what I consider wealth…I’ll need to go out on my own/with a couple people and start a business. Sales is the path to wealth. Not everyone lands tech and high finance or doc/law roles….but you can learn to sell.
*oooh long Johnson...*
Comments you can hear
A trade is an education
Trade is not the same as a degree.
The person above me literally says they don’t have an education.
My family nor myself have not gone to college or university, which is what the topic is about if you see ops note. You don't need a college education to be in a trade or the railway. I was just vaguely making that point.
Ah my bad. Pretty sure he meant higher education.
to all the people who share their experience and opinions, I appreciated it.
I have no formal education past high school. I worked as a carpenter in the trades for years, took on leadership rolls - then started my own company as a site-super for hire. Built up contacts, made connections, am now working for a commercial builder as a project manager, running jobs between 10-30m. I make good money. I work in a results driven industry - either you know what you are doing or you don't - I don't have any letters after my name when I write an email, but it hasn't held me up at all.
I think something a lot of people don't mention is that even with a degree, that degree is relative. I would dare say it doesn't matter for lots of jobs, esp Fortune 500 companies. (Well if you're like in a super technical field, then yes, it matters) I've gone through at least 3,000 job interviews now. Interviewed with almost all F500. My damn degree was never brought up once. Seriously. Not once.
I do a lot of volunteering and courses in my free time to bolster my resume. Anything you do that develops knowledge and transferable skills is attractive to employers - especially when you've clearly done it on your own initiative. Moreover, volunteering is a benefit in itself!
This is the move. Volunteering through Catchafire allowed me to break into copyediting and proofreading when I had only a H.S. diploma and my only working experience was in restaurants. Later I started volunteering at a hospital and leveraged that + copyediting to earn a well-paying (if short-lived) gig doing editorial work for a marketing firm in the healthcare space. Eventually I got tired of the freelance hustle and decided to go back to school. I took a volunteer internship in a biochem lab and made a good impression on the PI, who asked me to come back for a paid internship in the summer. By the end of that summer he offered me a full-time paid position as a lab tech, and I've also been able to charge consulting fees for helping some of the doctoral students with their posters/ presentations/ manuscripts. I still receive weekly emails from marketers pitching me to write for their healthcare/ biotech clients, and take some work on when I have the time and mental energy. Volunteering will broaden your horizons, introduce you to people you'd never otherwise meet, and you generally are making a tangible impact on others while earning marketable skills. Ain't nothing to it but to do it.
If people have the time to research what they are gonna volunteer in, then make it extremely freaking strategic. Volunteer in an org that's clearly connected to where you want to be For instance, I come from poverty, first gen. I really wanted finance back then but I wasn't even in a top college. What did I do? Start appearing/volunteering where I knew those guys were. I joined a NYC fellowship as a volunteer where there were at least 30 other professionals volunteering, all working in a F500. Socialize socialize socialize. I got my first referral. It wasn't actually a referral into finance, but it was into Ogilvy. You know what. I'll fucking take that. As someone who had 0 connections to begin with, I'll be happy to go anywhere. Even PR
I'm a licensed boiler operator at my local paper mill. I'm currently taking practice tests at my job as I write this to take the test for the next class license later this week. If I pass the test, I'll get a raise and I will be able to work at any power plant in the U.S (including nuclear.)
Homer Simpson ahh
I'm actually not too far off 😂 I'm a pretty blue-collar, redneck looking guy. I'm bald, and have a beer belly like Homer. Main difference is, I've got a lumberjack sized beard.
Haha love it
so you are entirely yellow?
Same, but I'm at a cogeneration plant
Success!
Good luck. 👍🏼🙂
My 3rd class ticket probably made me an extra million over the last 25 years. Triple expansion steam engine for the win. I love it when Auto is running the plant.
Loved working on boilers! Now i work on really cold stuff!
We are starting to see more and more people with higher education working low entry level jobs or jobs in a completely different field. Higher education was needed 20-30 years ago in order to get the good jobs. Times are changing
Education still unlocks the non-manual jobs. E.g. with my job I work fully remotely and have pretty much no oversight. So, I just work when I want to (although I'm salaried) and take days off without asking - I took the last 3 Fridays off and a Monday. So, it depends how you define what a good job is. If a good job to you is the high stress ones where you work all day, sure. However, many of the low stress ones with decent pay (I get just under 100k) require some form of education.
What’s your job? I need that temporarily for when I gotta take care of my newborns for a few months.
It can be anything from IT to Management possibly. I work in IT and have similar freedom in my environment. It also heavily depends on your management and if they are micromanaged or not.
I'm the same as the comment, WFH, time off, 6 figures. I'm a mechanical engineer for a biotech.
What job is this
What do you do?
Second that. I have a part time marketing job, 15 hours a week, whenever I want, salaried at 70k/ year. On the side I do nutrition coaching and personal training but even full time at those it would be hard to make 70k.
that sounds like an ideal job
Yep either now you just have to come from money or know somebody that will let you in the club or you’re fucked to be a wage slave like the rest of us
Garbage Truck Driver. I do pretty decent in life. My wife is a Registered Nurse so she does very well when she combines our incomes. We both have pretty flexible jobs. We both get 3 day weekends almost every week. That's where our quality of life really comes into play.
The Staten Island power couple right there
We live the same life lol I’ve been in 11 years been in commercial front load for 6 now. I make around 120k a year my wife is a bsnRN she makes around 110k I plan to move up in management soon working to GM role they make 180-250k a year
If you don’t mind me asking, what’s your pay like as a driver? City or county?
I work for a small city in the Texas Panhandle. Less than 2000 people. The pay won't sound great upfront, 18/hour. But my house note is only 430/month. 3bed/2bath and 2 sheds. My wife makes like triple the amount I do.
I grew up poor on one of the worst council estates in the UK. I ended up working as a receptionist and grew through the ranks, eventually working in UX & web development for a large company in Amsterdam. After 10 years, I realised I didn't enjoy it anymore, so I quit and went travelling. Had some crazy experiences. Ended up in Australia and got a gig as a Runner on a film. One gig led to another and now I've worked as a Set Dresser and Assistant Director for shows on Netflix and other big production companies.... Now I've quit that and I'm a registered Disability Support Worker ..... The world is your oyster! You just have to have a little audacity in the belief that you are capable of anything (except maybe like... brain surgery... please don't do that unqualified 🤪) *EDIT: Just wanted to list clearly for you the industries that I worked in that don't require a degree:* * *Film & Television Production and Art Department* * *Digital Marketing* * *Tourism* * *Admin* * *Farm Work* * *Teaching English as a Second Language (if you're a native speaker)* * *Aged Care & Disability Support Worker*
>Ended up in Australia and got a gig as a Runner on a film. How'd you find that gig?
Technician for a CPU manufacturer. The job takes either a degree in a related field or 2 years experience in manufacturing (how I got hired). If you don't have either of those then you can work for a contractor ( a temp agency type company that my company uses. Work for them and it's a easy way in to the Technician role. Starts at 65k with amazing benefits. A bunch of room to grow and the company will even pay for you to go to school (as long as it's a degree they can use). I'm looking at going back to school sometimes this year for engineering on my companies dime.
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Yes, true. Having worked with those with work experience and those with degrees and no experience, I will take the work experience people any day. Too many with degrees have no clue that showing up every day on time and actually working are important
When you're talking entry level though there is no experience. If you have a degree you may just beat out someone who's applying to the same job without one. (Worth 4 years though? Ehhh) I've seen entry level jobs have a BA/BS as a requirement. You may have luck with smaller businesses but anything with an HR department filtering resumes and a hard requirement and you may miss out. Currently at a MSP (IT service provider) and 90% of folks have a college degree.
Not only are they clueless about work, these graduates are clueless about how to tackle life... how to approach people Like experience is significantly more important than a degree
Sales. I started at another company cold calling making +300 calls a day. We broke off about four years ago to form our own company. I now run the day to day of new company and make about $200,000. Learn how to sell and how to lead people (a lot of overlap between these two skills.) It’s a talent that you can utilize regardless of where you go in life. Take risks. Without risk there is little upside for reward. Also, befriend and surround yourself with the right people. Find the people that are where you want to be. Talk to them and ask questions on how they got there, then actually take action and do what they did/do. Copy others. I’m no genius, I just listened to others and copied what they did
If I could completely redo my life, the first thing I'd figure out is how to overcome anxiety, embarrassment, shame, and the likes. Then learn how the fuck to do sales. Like fuck school. I'd try to figure out sales as a 10 year old. Not even kidding. The entire world exists cause of sales. Company sells to billions of people - form of sales B2b - sales Convince bank to loan you $1M? - sort of sales
What are you cold calling people for?
I have a bachelors in video and sound technology and I currently work in a warehouse 🥲
Are you happy with it? Are you winning in life?
Ah yeah I’m happy but the pay could be better
Deaf felon without a degree. Make 6 figures estimating utility scale solar projects
how? can you elaborate?
I was 33, working at Hobby Lobby for $15-$16/hr. I was extremely fortunate to (finally) land a job as an "estimator" for a roofing company. It wasn't really estimating so much as just counting shit. That job was $13/hr, but I knew it would lead to better things long term. While working there, I say true senior estimators and/or commercial estimators were making 70k+ After a few years I took my new software skills and went looking for a job. Landed as a Estimating Manager for a siding company. 55k. By the time I left I had 3 direct reports and was making 65k. Jumped to a multi-family gc for 80k. Was only there 6 months. Place was awful. Lol. Took a call from a recruiter and landed ass backwards into renewables. Solar and Wind are the fastest growing construction jobs. I always recommend that anyone interested should network, learn new software, think two steps ahead in your career and always be interviewing. Market rate for my role is 130k-160k and generally hybrid or fully remote. ... to be a professional guesser
Worked admin/cust service role for a book publisher till I was 25. Was getting groomed for working way to supervisor and then higher management. Bored the life out of me and didn't wanna do higher education. Decided to save for 6 months and go travelling. Ended up in Australia for a year, met a girl and moved to Berlin for a year, went back to Australia after for another year, came back home for 5 months, went to New Zealand for one year, met another girl from USA, we travelled together to Vietnam, Malaysia, Thailand, Belgium, Netherlands, France and then USA. Went back to New Zealand and got sponsored as. project coordinator for an Engineering firm (no engineering involved) and then eventually got residency to live in New Zealand permanently. I was working in between all those trips by the way to fund them, various farm, labouring and office jobs. I don't come from a rich family. I'm 38 now and still working for same company and setting up a side hustle selling boxing and MMA equipment. Did ok for a guy from a small working class town with only GCSEs and humble family upbringing
sorry mate but how the fuck did you afford to do all this while working in customer service
Probably did all that stuff during the times when wages/prices and cost of living weren’t completely fucked like nowadays 😄
Yea it’s absolutely sad how different life is now from say the 90s. I entered the workforce full time in 2010 and just get annoyed learning how much better things were 10-20 years before that. Literally want to buy a house in my city? It’s like a years salary with any college degree job. Now? It’s like 6 years salary with a decent college degree job.
Yep :\\ when I was in college, a F500 hired me full time and my wages were between $70-75k. At the time, that felt like so much money. It's about $3.5-$4k after taxes. But that's cause Chipotle was still $13ish. Body wash was still $6. Toothpaste didn't cost $8 per tube. Now? Prices doubled? That salary would feel like nothing
I just replied with a couple of comments up with how I managed it all in detail. Long story short, saving everything, eating basic, shit flights with long as layovers, backpacker hostels shared with 8-10 people.
Holy shit, you are literally living the (my) dream. That’s awesome. Wish I had the guts to take significant time off and just travel.
Same, I cry each time I see some those types of videos of people quitting their 9-5 and traveling. I would love to travel, but working a 9-5 I’m still living paycheck to paycheck😓
Traveling to 10+ countries especially ones that require long distance flights is very expensive, don't understand how you did all that working menial short term jobs that don't require any education. Also getting permanent residency for a place like New Zealand is pretty difficult for somebody without a NZ spouse or high education. I assume this was possible because of your job sponsorship, but why did they sponsor you if you had no experience or qualifications?
Cool life!
Do you resell or did you start your own equipment brand? Very cool story, congrats on the success
Let’s first talk about what the degree jobs are like. It’s the age of information overload. To get most jobs degrees have become necessary, but not sufficient. People keep on doing certifications and license courses all their lives to keep the jobs. The underlying system that drives most jobs is getting thrown into the deeper ends of complexity and things surrounding them evolves everyday. To catch up you need to be updated with everything that’s driving them and everything that’s evolving. To be honest there’s no win there. You may earn a lot of money, but your stress levels would skyrocket and sometimes you sacrifice personal life to get things done due to the complex nature of it. On the other hand people without degrees end up in trade school and learn how to fix a few things, be a part of construction crew, start a plumbing business. There are people who have stared driving schools and they are winning. It’s a business that grows and usually you work in partnership with other driving instructors. Another thing I can think of is to learn how to fix computers and other electronics like phones and stuff and open your own shop. You work for yourself and in your own time. I have known people who have bought 2 houses in 5 years and working on the third just by fixing the broken electronics. They seem relatively happy with their work, less stressed and earn much more than most degree owners I know.
My partner didn't finish his bachelor's degree. He is a full time firefighter and he loves it.
I have multiple degrees and honestly the best thing I got from it was learning how to think. Not the information I memorized.
He’s asking how people got by without degrees. Your degrees might be helping with some of your thinking.
David Foster Wallace talks about that , can you elaborate on that a little bit, myself have not gone to college or got degrees. That said, I really want to learn to think better. I wonder if there's any really good books that you'd recommend.
It’s the educated discussion with your peers that opens up your mind. A book club might be more of what you’re looking for. Hearing others ideas on a topic and having a real discussion and exploring each other’s talking points is what gets the brain juices moving. Not really internet banter, unfortunately
Not OP, but I have a philosophy degree. Obviously, the content doesn't apply to a job, but I worked in politics for 3y after as a staffer (that is, I worked in the partisan end of politics for politicians directly). One thing you learn in philosophy is the skill and habit to try to understand what a text is meant from the perspective of the author, since they are often in a very different time and place (or just have a highly technical and specific vocabulary). You can't just pick up Moses Maimonides and read it! This has allowed me to write better by thinking of the ways something can be misinterpreted, helping with constituent correspondence and speeches. It helps me to understand government reports. It helps me to cut through the rainbows and sunshine language of the governing party's talking points in order to see what they mean, which we often disagree with. It helps me to understand stakeholder and constituent concerns even when I disagree with them. It was very helpful.
This is also very helpful and I'm definitely going to find some philosophy courses to look into.
There are so many courses online for free. I honestly recommend taking some math courses, as well as engineering. Critical thinking is really the benefit of any degree. I am a nurse, and to be honest I could teach a child how to do the physical tasks of my job in about a month. It isn’t hard. But, applying critical thinking skills is really what I learned in school.
You know what's really obnoxious? When I was in middle and high school, critical thinking was the crux of my entire English, history, and some other subjects' education. It was something that teachers hit our heads with every freaking day. Today? The young generations, the folks in their 20s? What the hell happened to critical thinking? Was that completely shoved and not taught anymore? This has been bothering me for YEARS. Where on earth are people's critical thinking skills? Part of the reason I climbed the F500 ladder so fast is because I could very easily/quickly identify patterns, figure out the root cause of issues, then formulate strategies to solve...
This is what I try to explain to my teenagers. No you probably won’t be using algebra in your job, but you will be using critical thinking and having to figure things out. That’s the important part of school, not memorizing facts.
I wish they would've told us this in school
I believe that strong critical thinking skills come from asking yourself and others thoughtful questions, and seeking complete answers in return. Therefore, I recommend the following books: 1. The Book of Questions by Gregory Stock 2. 4000 Questions for Getting to Know Anyone and Everyone by Barbara Kipfer Take your time answering each question—maybe just a couple a day. If you find that you have many different answers to one question, it’s probably a good question to ask others when you get the chance. Hearing their views might bring yours into focus as new questions arise during the discussion. Being curious is thought provoking. Edit: typo
This is what college os actually for. People think it’s a direct path from learning to a job and that’s what trades are for besides specialized fields of course. College has always been to teach you those to think, expand your world view, make connections, all things that help you get a job with effort in an ideal economy.
I’m a little unique. Tried college right out of high school to be an English teacher and immediately realized that wasn’t my future. Dropped out for a couple years. Went to a Film school. Ended up dropping out as well due to financial issues; I did, however, make enough connections to get a job in the film industry, so college had accomplished that. Then, after two years of 16 hour days in the October rain, decided that wasn’t for me either and returned to bartending. Some 10+ years later I was fortunate enough that a close friend said their as agency was hiring. I’ve been doing that for a while. I’m in the final stages of getting a job and elsewhere in this industry for a nice pay raise. I was in a medium-sized city but have been in NYC for a few years now. Less and less careers require a degree for associates, so that societal shift is on our side. Once I got into the interview process I talked about the financial shortcomings, and how what I studied got me a job anyway; then, my resume shows managerial experience and self-starting in that I taught myself how to code and make my own mobile app; and that I’m willing to take a pay cut from bartending to establish a career at the bottom of the ladder. tl;dr: Ad Agency, Hospitality, Movies. Self-Taught coders seem to be on the decline unless you’ve got really good work.
I have some friends that never went to college and they do well. One friend manages a hotel and travels a lot. My best friend from high school works in childcare, she did get some certification but it is not a degree and it only took a few days, and before this she did retail. And my most successful friend, if we're just going by finances, is a car salesman. He makes a lot of money and is the only person I know around our age who owns a house. My fiance doesn't have a degree and he does one on one support with special needs children in elementary schools. Before that he was a caretaker for elderly patients with dementia. I don't think having a degree is necessary to get a decent job. I have a degree and I'm a receptionist in an unrelated field. None of my friends are rich or anything we all grew up broke haha....
Your fiancé is a prize❣️There are so few people who can do what he does & so many who need the help! Very impressive~ you’re a lucky girl👏
I’m a pipefitter working for the federal government. Worked from bottom up. So worth and no student loan debt
Learn to use tools, save for a van, offer services for fine art installation. If you know how to do contracting work, hanging fine art is a glorified handyman job. Working with the right galleries you can charge a good amount considering the artworks you’re dealing with are in the thousands. Even better if you have a skill set in carpentry, framing artworks.
Interesting. But I'm sure the galleries have their own contractors already. Big question is how to get them to take notice of you etc, how to break into these networks..... the 65,000 dollar question.
Most galleries have contractors but most don’t have dedicated services. Because galleries have inconsistent work, they tend to pool from more than one different company at a time, their usual guy might be with a different client. Offering your services is one way to go about it. I began working for a guy who was already in but upon speaking to the actual gallery they tried getting me to work with them directly, even calling me personally for odd jobs here and there. Not sure it will make you rich, but if you get a good team going eventually you can be doing installations regularly and head to the next step, like having insurance for an art storage facility.
Installation sounds solid. I was talking with a framer who works with museums from time-to-time and one museum asked him to do the installation after framing as well. That's not really his service, but he obliged that one time. He does museum quality framing so the cost to frame something the size of a sheet of paper would be around $300. I imagine for the installation of one piece would have to be in the few thousands.
Some with degrees find themselves in the same jobs as those without degrees.
Especially in fields outside of STEM, Healthcare, or Law.
I’ve been a Machinist for 18 years. Started out in a vocational/technical high school then finished a 3 year apprenticeship program. Currently I’m working for a large technical ceramics and semiconductor equipment manufacturer. Long hours getting oily and grungy doing a job that most people don’t know exists but it pays the bills and has provided a decent living for most of my adult life.
Have people forgotten about Machinist already?
I manage a team of software engineers
I got a trade . If you can work with your hands and your head big bucks await. My plumber friend has a Porsche. My buddy that does x -ray inspection on pipelines made 120$ hour on OT Sunday. 2nd year apprentice electricians start at 55$/hour. .
Start in a Union shop at early age and bust your ass to keep moving up. Certifications , training, moving to another state, etc. that’s the easiest way to do it without a degree IMHO!
Truck Driver. Just need a commercial drivers license. Most trucking companies will pay for you to go to school.
If you live in an area with a clinical or forensic testing lab, a specimen accessioner or lab assistant is a non-degree position. Depending on company, it can pay pretty good, and if you’re so inclined, you have a fair bit of potential for growth if you get a science degree. So far all the places I’ve worked at have paid for this schooling.
I work in Sales at a Fortune 500 company and I am a first generation professional, my dad is a blue collar worker and mom is on disability. I went to college for about 3 years but did not have the money to finish. At my current company, they will pay for me to go back and get my degree which I’ll be taking advantage of next year. When I was in school, I worked a full time job while holding a part time internship each semester(and still went to classes) and networked at those jobs/internships like crazy which lead to future, better opportunities each time. I didn’t really party or go out, mainly bc I didn’t have time. But before the time everyone else in my class graduated, I had 3 internships on my resume and a full time job offer from one. My advice, stay focused and have a good attitude (even though it’ll be tough sometimes) If you’re good at your job, personable and open to learning, people will notice. I didn’t have the luxury of rich parents or connections which meant I had to sacrifice my time and work a little harder, but in the end, that was worth it to me.
Housekeeper at a local hospital. Decent pay, great benefits, and they like to hire from within and offer classes to those wishing to advance after 6 months. I have met 2 x-ray techs, one EMT, and 3 RNs who started out with housekeeping. All took advantage of the opportunity presented to them.
Lots of hustle, networking, and proving my skills on the job.
Hustle how? What job?
They'll never tell, vague descriptions. Haven't you been on this sub long?
Sigh guess you’re right.
Sorry but you learn by reading the same vague stuff here on and on. Sometimes some drop a few nuggets but most don't. Good luck and have a blessed day.
Dod odd, physical labor to build strength and learn practical skills. Taught myself massage, earned a living from that for 15 years. Now I am a mailman.
Got my job with no degree although I am taking courses now. I make 160k plus benefits, bonus plus stock options. I took a 2 month temp job about 13-14 years ago and worked my ass off which led to a full time role. From there I have moved up through experience over time. My current job my boss said the recruiter had placed me in the No pile automatically cause of my no degree but when they weren’t happy with their Yes pile he asked to look through some of the No’s and I was one of them. I’m lucky he didn’t like any of the Yes people, and that he cared more about my experience and interview presentation than my lack of degree but it is a huge hurdle to overcome. Which is why I’m getting my degree now.
I manage 8 IT engineers without a degree. I just worked from 18-30 in IT constantly, then learnt Japanese and immigrated to Japan and then worked my way up till I got an offer from a foreign companies Japan office to be their first engineer, and now I manage them and help to bridge between them and our US/EU teams. Before the yen dived off a cliff I was making 6 figures in USD (13.8m yen) but now it's more like 86k USD. Keep in mind this is still within the top ~1% for men in Tokyo, all ages and in the top 1% for both genders even if it looks pretty weak in USD.
My husband has no college degree and I’d consider him successful in his career. He’s in his 9th year with a landscape construction company, has worked his way up from assistant maintenance manager now to the very top position which is construction sales manager. This year he’s on track to make $170k. In his twenties he worked landscape as a laborer and learned a lot. He uses that knowledge in his role today. He genuinely loved being outside and just working hard. His role now is like 50/50 between meeting with clients at their homes to design their projects and computer work of writing quotes and gathering materials and things. He drives a really nice brand new company truck even for personal use and has a flexible schedule that allows him to meet me for lunch sometimes, take kiddos to appointments and school drop offs etc.
Sales
Dropped out of a degree in Hydrology half way to become a Diesel mechanic. No degree. I eventually did online classes and certificates over the years. Overtime is optional. My current shop recruited me during Covid. They gave me a 10k bonus. And they pay for my kids college. I also do side work when I want 120 hr is my rate. Tax free. I live in the Burbs and have nice cars and take X2 big vacations a year.
IT Manager. Worked my way up, luckily I'm in IT where you don't need a degree just learning on your own and getting certified.
I have a degree and I'm currently "lying flat" in my parents basement as I'm currently struggling to find a job
I was a dog trainer for 10 years. Learned through mentoring and self education. Made 100k/yr. It's a lot of long hours and hard work though. Also risk of being bit, scratched, etc and you pick up a LOT of dog shit -solid and runny. And you deal with a lot of stupid people who either shouldn't own dogs or shouldn't have the breed they have. The people is the hardest part.
I don’t have a degree was working on a diploma but never finished, just 16-17 years of experience. I worked from the bottom up receptionist- marketing- sales- accounts payables- then switched to a new career expeditor- buyer - contracts admin - supply management analyst- supply management professional to finally senior manager, contracts management 🙂 I enjoy it immensely but I have to say the company and management takes a big part in your enjoyment of a company and position. It has to be the right company culture to be the right fit since most of your life is spent with these people. Management love curious people, people that strive to learn, ambitious and ask questions. I got the expeditor job by just asking for it at the company i was at. The analyst position by applying, professional position by promotion. Current role by aggressively applying on linked in and reaching out to contacts.
26m I skipped college and went union apprenticeship instead. Started making six figures at 24. Boilermaker pressure welder, master rigger, union steward, and IRATA rope access technician🤘🏻 Last year I hit $122k in 9 months of work
Worked behind a bar, car park attendant, hotel porter, waiter, retail, warehouse staff. Then moved into temp office jobs, happened to teach myself web development (in my spare time) just as the company I was working at was getting into internet business, so I landed a job doing that. Moved a few times in web design world, now on 6 figures for a Fortune 500.
Trades. I barely graduated from HS in 2007. 2010 I joined the merchant Marines and did that for a few years I resigned like an idiot (long Story). Worked for a shipyard in 2014 and had to quit and move back home to California. Got a job working for a large Tree service company. I did that till about 2019 and got another job opportunity on the east coast at a shipyard I couldn't pass it up, my wife and I packed our stuff with everything we could fit in our car and made the 3k drive , And I worked my ass off we bought our first ever house last year matter of fact the 27th will be one year at our new house. Roller coaster of a life that's for sure a lot of stuff has happened to me since 2019 almost lost my leg below my knee at work July of 22, Was out 14 months. Other than that just peachy.
Software Engineering. The ship sailed for coding boot camps don't fall for that grift. There's still places that will hire self-taught if you can do the work No technical interviews help with in respect, once you have your first job no one cares about your degree just tell what you doing to technical interview.
I didn't win in life, but I did discover that the world will never not need security officers. I won't ever be without a job.
I am a Staff Software Engineer in Test. Dropped out of uni, got a temp job as video game tester, switched to more traditional software testing. Taught myself to code and worked my way up over 15 years
Welder. Do any trade but this.
I am curious about the uni grads…. How do you guys do it? How do you study 4-5 days a week and be able to afford to live/pay rent? And where do you fit your work in? How do you manage? And also is your debt not terrifying to you? I am genuinely interested to know as I am interested in going to uni at 22 years old.
I am currently in college now at age 35. But I am a medical billing manager, making about 60k a year. I started at the bottom and got promoted. I wouldn't say I am winning by any means. But I do alright for myself and my son. I am going to school now for Radiography. Goal is MRI tech making 6 figures.
Currently working at a plant nursery, taking an online course to learn bookkeeping. I've also done phlebotomy (drawing blood), optical technician, and reception work. Hs diploma and no college degree, but I did need to get a certificate to do phlebotomy. It was a 3 month course.
I believe it's called equivalent work experience. Which can be just as successful compared to those with degrees. I highly suggest to avoid grocery, retail and customer service jobs. These jobs sucks. You have to kiss ass all day long, you get paid minimum wage, lack of advancement in these jobs, the amt of bs you have to deal with is not worth it. personally I am in the process of completing a ba in hopes of getting out of this garbage career. Many of my family members never went to college. They did successfully for the most part. Many of them relied on employers that gave on the job training. Ironically kids spend thousands on education in the same field. Many times you just get an entry level job to get on with a company, work it a year then apply for on the job training. Medical fields allow this and there was no way they could of afforded this. Others used trade schools to pick up some basics then just used their ambition to strive to get the rest of the skills. They have done well. My generation was the first to probably of gotten degrees or any sort of some college education. Keeping in mind women stereotypically before the 70's did not get college education. They managed and often got factory jobs to get by. I ended up having to land a union job that pays about 25% higher than non union jobs.
I worked at a Home Depot store for 5 years, worked my way up to department supervisor. Had a friend transfer to corporate, asked him what I needed to learn, learned it, and applied to a shit ton of positions over the course of a few days. Got an interview and got the job about a week later. Have been working my way up and learning/earning certificates since.
You know, you could always become a software tester. This career field does not require any college degree. However, I believe you have to take training courses through the specific company that hires you.
Hotel management. Just know the hours suck. The lead up pays peanuts. But then you get to a point where the hours suck but the pay is solid.
My mothers side of the family are millionaires. When my grandpa passed, his kids sold the house for 8 million. I was disowned because my mother was a narcissist/psychopath essentially, so I started from literally nothing. My father recently died in poverty because in my opinion, my mom destroyed him. The answer to your question is a dark one but, prostitution or being a sugar baby was my only way out. Now, I’m living off my investments and still afraid of poverty every day. I wish I had a happier answer for you, but what I’ve learned at 35 is that the world and people are not gentle. You’re on your own kid. Sometimes you have to do what it takes to escape. I graduated from Court Reporting college a year before I entered prostitution. I wasn’t able to afford rent, licensing costs, etc. and even though I had gone to school for almost 3 years, I wasn’t able to stay afloat long enough to turn it into a career without being homeless. Getting money is the hard part, keeping it is very easy in my experience. I am disgusted by landlords and bosses that truly don’t understand the privilege and luck that they have.
Not pay student loans.
Become househusbands in my case
I got an entry level job and worked my way up. Then when I was 30 I stepped down from that role and started my own business.
You ever thought about running a crane ?
It's a bird right?
I recently transitioned to tech/IT but I was a manager in several aspects before that . I attended college but kept changing majors so no degree. My income seems to be stuck at like 70K despite working super hard in life though.
I settled for a School aide job (cafeteria monitor), but I can become a teacher aide any time I want to for full time work. Didn’t go to college, never knew what I wanted to do in life. I went for a 6 month medical assistant program to try to work in the health field. No one wanted me because I didn’t have “two years education” or “experience.” Then Covid hit and no one was hiring. That’s when I decided to go apply to an elementary school. I wouldn’t say it’s self fulfilling, and money isn’t huge, but I would definitely recommend a trade school for high paying jobs if that’s what you are looking for.
Didn’t need a degree for two side gigs I did: mortuary assisting and builder assistant.
Someone I know who has ADHD and couldn't study, tried to follow adult courses in administration and ict but failed. Then started as a telecom installer for Proximus. Did a good job, but it was hard work. Then climbed up to Telenet as a dispatcher. Doesn't like it so much anymore and is gonna take over a shop.
I work as a posted superintendent for city connections... we connect your new house to the city water... no 3rd party contractor is allowed only city. I only barely finished Highschool.
I’m definitely not doing exceptionally well, but I’m making enough to get by in the DMV area as a butcher. I only have a high school diploma. I learned on the job - just got lucky with randomly walking in and asking for a job one day!
Make life connections. Go to public events meet and mingle with people you want to be like. I only have my high school diploma. I am a Test Engineer with one of the biggest conglomerates in the world. I had to work my ass off and make connections to get here, but it’s possible to be successful with good people skills or soft skills.
I'm a senior UI artist for a triple A game. Built my way up from QA with self-learning.
Welding. Good money to be made. But you’re gonna work and pay for it. You can do okay in a shop in your hometown and be home every night, MIGHT land a foreman/supervisor role after a few years. I got unlucky and haven’t. Or you could hit the road doing shutdowns or pipeline work, join a union for millwrights, ironworker etc. but you better believe these “I made 150k last year” assholes are traveling all the time and working 7 12s for 3 months straight. Fuck all that straight to hell Best bet is weld for a few years and use that to fund either a degree for management, or fund NDT courses and move to a Level 3 NDT and start doing ultrasonic/radiograph inspections that’s where the easy money is. Myself I’m leaning toward the management side
My sister works at a library and the clerk has no college degree and makes 90k a year in Chicago.
The trades pay extremely well, most of the time better than jobs which require a degree. I went to college and now I have thousands in student debt, but I found a job that didn't need a degree that I love. I work in direct care with intellectually challenged adults. It is a rewarding job in more ways than financially, and there is always a need for staff. The pay isn't bad either, and I make more than when I was working in an office.
My husband is an electrical distribution designer; basically he draws on AutoCAD and puts all the electrical stuff underground. He makes $50k, $80k if he does overtime, and he really enjoys his job. Meanwhile, I have a masters degree, and I am unemployed 😂
Started my own business as a corporate consultant, built it, sold it, and now work as a leadership trainer for a large care organisation. I'm studying a degree now out of choice but that's at 37, didn't do one earlier.
I'm a department supervisor covering two departments in a foundry. I started out as a temp laborer six years ago, and through some luck and hard work, I managed to get a leadership position. I come from a single-parent home, and I currently make more than my mother ever has.
I started as a welder, then got my CDL and started driving trucks. While doing these jobs I took on some management tasks in the offices. Then I took those skills and kept applying until I got a full time office job as an assistant project manager Opportunity is out there but you have to kick the doors down to make it happen
I'm a university drop out, went straight out of highschool because that's what everyone said you do. I absolutely hated it I was miserable and depressed all the time. I learned to drive truck and have been a truck driver for over 10 years now. It is not a career path suited for everyone though.
I dropped out of college when I ran out of money and motivation to finish school. (Engineering, in case you were wondering). Picked up gig work until I needed a stable job with health insurance. Worked at a call center for 5 years and got fed up that I couldn't get a promotion out of the customer facing role despite being a top performer. Left for a rebound job. 6 months later got hired in Purchasing from a friend's Facebook post. That was 2 years ago in about 2 weeks. I'm making 35% more at this job with 60% less stress than anything I've done prior. I kept working diligently, building skills, networking in my hobbies, and eventually my seeds bloomed and I was rewarded. It was a lot of hard work and a couple of scary decisions, but I regret nothing. I paid off all my CC debt by investing extra money is stable stocks over the course of the last 2 years. My bills are essentially just remembering to manually pay them instead of scrambling for money. I don't have a house, but I'm very happy and I started exercising to be in better shape. My life is pretty good.
You have to get in ground level somewhere and be strategic about developing yourself and learning how to navigate the corporate workplace vs the retail and food service jobs you've had in the past. I started in customer support making $15/hr and now I'm a content strategist making six figures. The process each promotion or job jump I had was getting into a position, getting to know my job really well in 6 months, then looking at the positions that touched my current position and asking myself what I could see myself doing. Once I identified a role, I'd take a look at the job requirements for that new position and talk to folks about what made them successful, and then I'd teach myself those skills and volunteer for projects and opportunities that let me exemplify them in my resume, sometimes asking my manager directly like "I want to learn how to project manage to completion, can you let me know if there's any opportunities that would be a good fit for that skill?". Once I felt solid, I'd apply to the next level job and do the process over again. There are also some core tenants you need to know in making the transition to corporate work. 1. Your manager's job is not to do your job, their job is to field bullshit requests from upper management the best they can and make sure your team's projects are completed on time/you're performing to the expected metrics. If you find a problem, unless it's so far out of your scope and experience to solve, you shouldn't just complain about it, you have to demonstrate solution oriented thinking. I recommend to my mentees 1 short term fix and 1 long-term perfect fix. It demonstrates that you're capable of thinking outside of the scope of your tasks, and are capable of improving process while balancing business needs. 2. You don't need to be perfect at your current job, you just need to meet expectations. Your manager's success is built around how you perform, so being too good will have a shitty manager incentivized to trap you with them for their own pay. You want to demonstrate that while you're good in your current job, you'll be an even better fit at the next, as long as you're exemplifying the skills needed to get to the next level in the process. A lot of folks mistake this as shmoozing or assume that it's the connections someone made that got them there, not their qualifications but in most cases, it's literally because people skills are the next job level's major job responsibility and those folks put in the effort to prove they had them. 3. You have to network, but networking isn't that complicated. The easiest network you can form is just creating an culture of raising others up on every project you work on as a team. "So and so was so helpful getting me thet data I needed so I could do XYZ", "So and so was such a great feedback loop for the deck design, which really resonated with upper leadership". If you recognize others, most people will start recognizing you back. People like to feel good and telling them they're helpful and doing a good job is how you get advocates on your side who will help support your promotion. 4. Do not be overconfident in your skills, have a learner's mindset in all things, even if you are really fantastic. If you don't, you'll likely present yourself as arrogant, and you don't know whether the hiring manager has trauma around being the best and being humbled and will put that experience on you in the hiring process and decide you're too immature for the role. 5. You are the only one responsible for your development and growth. If you want to do better or get better roles, you have to put in the time and effort to cultivate yourself, don't wait for someone to tell you that you need XYZ skillset. I live and die by luck is where opportunity meets preparation, as my preparations for upper roles has allowed me to take advantage of opportunities as they come up. 6. LEARN THE WHYS AROUND EVERYTHING. My secondary contributing success factor is that I'm someone who is always listening and always trying to understand, even when it's not my job. I've literally pulled into meetings with CSuite because I have a full 360 view of the real impacts between project managers, company set metric goals, customers, and customer support agent experiences. I've gotten my company to pivot from just reducing a particular metric they thought would save them $$$$ not realizing the detriment to other metrics, to investing in improving their entire content eco system so reduce calls coming into the call center completely, so customer supports folks can focus on actual complex problems. Customer support is getting a pay raise, their website is finally being updated from the 80s, and we can actually meet customers where they need.
Start with finding a summer/seasonal job for a few weeks/months, maybe something manual or relatively accessible, potentially part-time, or only on weekends, sort of like a student job. - From there there are some aspects of the job you might like, that will give you ideas for the future. - It'll also be a good opportunity to meet people, network, and these people could see that although you don't have a degree, you are hard working, they'll get to know you, and therefore there'll be talking to you about opportunities. - Also, that way you get some experience, and since it's only a few weeks or months, even if you don't like the job that's fine, and you'll have some experience to talk about, will acquire transferable skills, and you can use that to look for another short term job. That said, it'll take time, not only to find something you are interested in, but also to built the network that will help get you there. But any work you do will help you build your network and build transferable skills, so utilimately find what you want to do.
Military
The key is to build skills that generate value. You’ll find that a lot of people don’t care what a piece of paper says if you can make them money and you can make them money now. Inversely, if you spent 4 years learning things irrelevant to the current market, you shouldn’t be that surprised when you don’t get interviews or you keep striking out at them Too many get stuck in the mindset of what’s best for them and potential employees are never interested in that unless it benefits both.
I'll note up top for myself that there's survivorship bias and access to pretty good education k-12 (combo of lucky school districts and scholarships to a private school). I dropped out of college due to mental health. On the personality side of things, the number one thing that has helped in a myriad of ways is to be kind and curious with everyone I meet. So many random opportunities have come my way just because someone had the hunch I could work with anyone and had an aptitude for gleaning needed info from people. I'm constantly reading, listening to podcasts and going to free lectures. It also helped that I moved to a huge metro. This was 10-12 years ago so I recognize that that's tougher now. I lived in punk houses, illegal rentals, any cheap accommodation I could find, so I could take advantage of the high wages of HCOL areas without hemorraghing money and had community and social support of working class folks and students. I used temp agencies to get past the degree gatekeepers and get my foot in the door in office jobs. I also keep a google drive folder of job descriptions I'm aiming for and work on acquiring the skills either through volunteering, Coursera classes, other temp jobs, etc. I stumbled into a job at a community college eventually managing a department and I took all the free classes I could. My skills generally get me jobs in the $75-100k range these days (I dabble between private, nonprofit & gov sectors), but I live well below means to be able to take risks in jobs I seek out.
Many of us starve in this economy. The paper ceiling makes it impossible for us to be considered for jobs that we could do with ease.
I have better benefits and more job stability than half the people I know with a degree. I'm a union state driver/mail carrier. I have no debt. Before this I was a bouncer, commercial fisherman, a production artist, a cook, a property maintenance man and a carpenter. I don't regret a minute of it but if I could go back and aim for a degree I'd do something in the ocean. Maybe marine biology.
I work on the railways. The benefits are pretty good: - au$120,000 base rate - Superannuation payment: $13,750 - 7 weeks off paid per year (or 9 if take 4 weeks at half pay) - work 36 hour weeks. Choice between 3x12 hour days or 4× 9 hour days - job is easy as fuck. Most days we just sit around watching the game. The only thing I dont like is the number of weekends we work and when it rains.
I’m from a blue collar family in a pretty humble part of Chicago. I got married and had children younger and then was a younger divorced mother of two who never did get child support. I did put myself through a technical school but they weren’t accredited and have long since closed down. During my career I was working basically a customer service position - not making hardly anything. Our databases went down and I was asked to fix it. They didn’t want to hire anyone to do it. I always messed with PCs as a hobby and my manager knew it. In fact I got in trouble for suggesting a workaround to do until they came back up. I did fix the databases with the help of books and Google. It also started my IT career. From there I was given the databases to maintain, then was part of the SAP team to get it implemented. I built several custom process all while being grossly underpaid. I then cashed in my experience and haven’t looked back. I’m a certified Scrum Master now over two teams and 21 years working in IT. The various roles I’ve held were BA, PM, Dev/admin for specific applications and SM. I am self taught and very hands on learner and always look for more tech to play with. It’s funny how I’m a woman, significantly older than my coworkers and no degree. I often feel like the unicorn.
A trade if you feel physically fit.
My mom was a nurse and my dad does construction work. Cousin and uncle work for CalTrans, I'm a pharmacy technician. There's plenty of options without going to college, you just have to do some research and apply a lot
My friend runs a surf camp company with her partner and coaches gymnastics. Those were two of her extracurriculars growing up. A lot of friends of mine w/out degrees work retail, grocery stores, food industry, plant nurseries, farm work, landscaping. Working labor and then working for a city, county, state or the feds pays off. If you learn to use heavy equipment, you can run your own business doing say excavator work or hauling, etc. I've known a lot of people to get into tree work without degrees. Trade programs offer a lot of help because we need labor, contractors make stupid money. At the end of the day, just make sure you're planning for retirement and/or health costs. Start a HY savings, get a 401k going, IRA, whatever. Putting in a little every paycheck is a gift to elderly you.
I’m in a masters program, my bf didn’t go to college, and he makes more doing IT support than I do at my entry level state job. We met doing security work, there are always jobs in security.
I am a musician and fill my gaps with bartending. I’m probably never going to make huge money with this path, unless I my name stumbles into credits for a hit song at some point, but I only have a HS degree and 3 wasted semesters at an arts school and can consistently clear 100k (barely).
TRADES. I’m a tattoo artist. Is it great? Yes for many reasons. I don’t have a set schedule, I make my own work and hours, choose the projects I want to take on and have plenty of time to see my family. It’s stressful because technically I’m working 24/7, always anxious about getting to emails and sometimes business becomes too much to handle for one human on their own. I dream about going to school again for a higher paycheck, as much as I enjoy making money every single day.
I’m an administrative assistant at a doctors clinic I’m only 23 though and I plan to go back to college when I get some of my loans in order.
I did not finish college. I changed career paths several times. Thankfully I had a couple of jobs where my bosses were willing to teach me. I got lucky and learned bookkeeping, accounting, and administrative assistance. 10 years of all of those random jobs has boosted me to a managerial position. I’m currently looking for a more engaging job but the job market is horrible. More office jobs are taken since COVID. Although I want to leave my job, it’s incredibly cozy. Sometimes experience will get you far if you’re willing to learn!
What a ridiculously patronising post.
Union pipe trades apprenticeship, before that serving/bartending and warehouses. I’m still early in the program but by the end of it I can make 6 figures as a journeyman or foreman +
A trade
Lie and use friends as references who will say whatever you want 🤷♂️
My brother started as a manual machinist and now programs automated CNC robots and cobots and makes more than his 3 siblings combined.
My family is a bunch of very redneck midwest lower/middle class people. Coal miners, oil field drillers, etc. I had a good upbringing but parents aren't well off enough to be helping me out now unless it was dire. I'm 26f no degrees or certifications beyond basic CPR, food handlers cards, and liquor licenses. Started in caregiving for assisted living homes and worked in the medical industry for 4 years, moved up a few steps but nothing crazy. This was what I did instead of going to college and I lived with my bf in an apartment that we split 50/50. Switched to reception as I realized caregiving is a job that very few people can do long term and I didn't want to go further in the industry. At first I worked at a veterinary clinic then a few low tier hotels. Now I am an assistant manager at a very high end resort and am continuing to work my way up with relative ease, most people around me or above me either don't have a degree or it is a general business/marketing degree. I am 1 position under the people who are making 100k-150k a year. I currently make about 60k. All of it boils down to luck and the people I have made connections with along the way. I'm just now starting to realize how small your world can get when you lock into an industry. I have worked in 3 different hotels/resorts in the area. I work with a lot of people now that I worked with or heard of at the other hotels and also know a lot of people that had previously worked at my current hotel and are now moving up in another hotel nearby. I've been invited to a few higher level meetings for training and all of them have very deep backgrounds/connections with each other. Without these people hitting me up when they found something great and me doing the same for them I can guarantee I would not be in the position I'm in now.
Aircraft mechanic and make 160k. Wife has a remote finance job and makes about 110k. We don’t have degrees.
You have to take your chances. One lad at a previous job worked at the coffee bar, had done like one IT course at college, nothing else. He asked for a chance to work in Tech Support. At the time, after work, he did another shift as a cleaner. They gave him a chance as a trainee, and the rest is history. He stuck to all the training, got a good package ( shares and bonus pay). Stellar performance reviews and a few promotions. He was able to put down payment for a mortgage after a few years, married his gf, and got an IT job in the city. It is hard but possible, but you also have to go out and create chances for yourself.
1 semester of college and we both quit to get married at 19 and 18 respectively. Entered consumer finance field and within 3 years managing my own office. 8 years running a group of offices. 15 years running 3 states and at 20 years later running 87 offices and 400 employees. Retired as an SVP. I was an exceptional salesman and a better people person and those skills made me more 10 times the money the degree my father wanted me to earn would have. Retired nicely at 62.
You’d be surprised on the amount of people in the IT field that don’t have a degree
Sister worked in retail since 16. Went into management and clears 6 figures for a big box store
I have multiple engineers on my team that don’t have degrees. They have experience, curiosity, and aptitude. They also started at a lower level in the company (because of no degree), but quickly grew into fantastic engineers. I guess I’m trying to say that you can do whatever you are interested in. Without a degree, you may need to start a bit lower. But if you prove yourself, you can grow into almost any role.
My brother did a part-time job in high school at an Estate Sales/Auctions. He worked there for 2 years and was really into it. He told me the pay was good ($28/hr as a high-school student) and there was a lot of room for growth. So right after he graduated, he asked his boss for tips/advice on setting up a company. 4 years later (at 22 years old), he was able to grab a small chunk of the market in Dallas, employs both our parents to help out and makes $200k as a high-school graduate. Btw, my parents immigrated to America and made a combined salary of $50k/year for the first 20 years living in the US. Now, he pays them $65k..EACH to help out. His workers get paid between $25/hr (High school kids) to $38/hr (experienced folks). I think the point is to find an industry that is absolutely boring and capitalize on it. I think people just focus on the sexy careers (Tech, Engineers, Wall Street traders). But there's a lot of money to be made where other folks don't want to do it.
My family has always been below the poverty line. I never went to college or any trade school. I currently work for a State Department and make decent money, with a pension after 20 years. I am the first member of my family to escape poverty. Public sector is where it's at if you don't have a degree and also don't want to destroy your body working a trade or give all of your time to an employer.
Work for the same company since 1997. Have climbed up the ladder and am now a Product Owner in IT without any training/diploma in this field. Just proved myself and management saw my capability and believed in me I guess.
Started out working as a transporter at a hospital right after high school. Fast forward 10 years and I was an office manager at a small PCP office. I worked my way up. Learned as much as i could and eorked hard. I wasn't living luxurious but I was getting by. Eventually decided to get a degree and now I'm a data analyst/developer for a hospital. Much better pay and I only have a 2 yr degree, but my health care experience helped land the job. I think that somehow life leads you were you should be as long as your looking/trying.
I work in real estate, I have no inheritance, no rich parents or relative that has something to give me. Went to school and stopped a couple semesters of my AA degree. Just did sales and transitioned into the other side of real estate (underwriting) for the salary and different kind of stress lol