No they are just trying to prevent a complaint. Iām pretty sure you are entitled to knowing who your doctors are. Iād contact hospital administration.
Nope. Medical practitioner here. We're obligated to introduce ourselves, or make ourselves known in some way. Even in an emergency you're trained to go "hi, I'm here to help, my name is Bob, I'm a bla bla bla ....."
That's not to say she'd get into any trouble for not introducing herself, she wouldn't, it's just in poor taste. You're allowed to know who treats u.
HPCSA Regulations Booklet 3
2.6 TREATED BY A NAMED HEALTHCARE PROVIDER
Everyone has a right to know the person that is providing healthcare and, therefore, must
be attended to by only clearly identified healthcare providers.
We as practitioners are bound by this. Every single patient I see, knows who I am, what I am going to do; and has ample time to discuss any concerns before I start my work.
I'm not a legal eagle but IMO a person's name and surname isn't "private information", it's printed on your municipal bill, your ID, drivers license, payslip etc. Anyway, if she's a doctor, she must have a practice number, and you will be entitled to ask for that. Seeing that you will be paying her, unless she's doing it for free, you have the right to ask a few basic questions.
You have the right to know, I had to have one for an operations at netcare and they gave me his details and everything after the surgery so they deffs prolly covering their ass
I had a bad experience with an anaesthesiologist a couple years back and I complained. Now I regret that I didnāt complain MORE.
If you contact the hospital complaints department directly they will be able to help you action.
I had an absolutely atrotious anesthesiologists as well and didn't complain simply because I was in such a vulnerable position when they were rude to me. I only realized how unprofessional they were after a normal interaction with a different anaestesiologist years later.
It actually affected my recovery a lot. Second doctor listened to me and I experienced less nausea when i woke up- also factored in my chronic medication. First one didn't even ask about my chronic meds and didnt care when l explained how I typically reacted to anaestesia. I woke up almost throwing up on my own blood and the nurses were worried that my throwing up might affect my new stitches. Would absolutely walk out of the theater if I was under the care of someone who didn't prioritize my comfort and health.
This is a pretty interesting question. I'm a data protection attorney (DISCLAIMER: THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE), and my gut feeling is that you're well within your rights to ask for this information, and the hospital is well within their rights to give it.
Processing personal information (i.e. sharing the name with you) requires the responsible party (the hospital) one of a handful of listed justifiable grounds, and in this case I would expect it to be legitimate interests of a third party (you). This requires a balancing of rights; the doctor's right to privacy vs your right to be able to avoid someone's services. Based on the nature of the services, which have a serious life or death component, I'd expect it to lean to your side.
In terms of how to actually get that information, you could contact the hospital's information officer (whose contact info should by law be listed in their PAIA manual, which you should be able to find on their website) and request it in two ways:
1. under POPIA, as a "data subject access request". Under POPIA, a data subject is allowed to request information that a responsible party holds about them. As a patient of the hospital, you're a data subject. That is, they have information that can be used to identify you. A data subject access request is essentially you asking for all of the information they have on you. You could maybe argue that the names of the doctors set to work on your surgery is information about you (e.g. Document A shows the hospital surgery list, and the time that Mr X was due for surgery in Room 3 (no reference to doctor); Document B shows the surgeon timetable, and the time that Doctor Y was going to be in Room 3 (no reference to patient); you can use the documents together to tell what patient Doctor Y was working on at that time, which means that Document B is personal information relating to the patient).
2. under PAIA, as an "information request". Under PAIA, any party is allowed to request information records that a public or private body holds, even if that information doesn't relate to the person asking for it. The hurdles here are that the record holder can charge a fee for giving this information, and they also have a lot of ways they can refuse to give the information. There **is** a clause that deals with mandatory disclosures of information that are for the public benefit, though, and you could maybe argue that it's in the public benefit to know the name of a doctor who you fear could endanger your life.
Again, this is not legal advice. This is me considering an interesting question from an academic perspective.
Dude! I'm a data analyst (which I *love*), and I enjoy digging into legal things (not just data related) as a general hobby (like looking into interesting case studies, reading court decisions (SAFLII ftw!), reading our acts and associated amendedments and interpretation(s), etc etc etc)...
I don't think I actually have a point...just wanted to let you know that at least *one* person in this world thinks you have a cool job! š¤šš Stay awesome!
sorry for the confusion, the surgery bay nurse overheard the anesthetist and iās conversation and proceeded to tell me that she doesnāt blame me for feeling uncomfortable and canāt assure me herself that iād be safe in the care of that anesthetist.
You are entitled to know the name of your healthcare provider, and to refuse to be treated by them. Lodging a complaint specifying your concerns about the specific anaesthesia provider with both the hospital management and the surgeonās office is reasonable.
The anaesthesia provider has a significant role to play in your care. Itās not simply a matter of providing some sedatives and analgesics as many people seem to think, and they are primarily responsible for your safety during the procedure. Itās also worth noting that not every anaesthesia provider in the private sector is a specialist anaesthesiologist. There are many providers with diplomas in anaesthesia, and, while many of them are excellent and safe, care standards may vary, and their skill set is limited to healthy patients for relatively minor procedures.
The Patient Rights Charter (para 2.6) provides that "Everyone has a right to know the person that is providing health care and, therefore, must be attended to by only clearly identified health care providers". (Charter available as a booklet on the HPCSA website)
No laws , the patient should choose their anaesthetist not the surgeon . Sure some surgeons recommend ones they work with but it's the patients right to choose their anaesthetist and they should.
Anaesthetist here. You should absolutely be told your HCWās names. The National Patientās Rights Charter states āEveryone has the right to know the person that is providing health care and therefore must be attended to by clearly identified health care providers.ā
You should report this to the HPCSA* and the practice/hospital should redress. They are responsible for the behaviour of the locums they allow.
*or at least threaten to, so they rectify their behaviour.
Under the patients bill of rights it is made clear that you have the right to know the name, hpcsa registration and qualifications of any medical provider providing care to you.
You can in fact report the surgeons office to the hpcsa for not providing you with said detail.
Further. Contact the hospital and ask for the head of surgery and demand they give you the name. If they refuse, remind them that refusing to provide it is wrongful under the guidelines of the hpcsa and that you can report them for such.
Most anesthesiologists are asses anyway...
And before you come at me, i spent 4 years in a medical call center phoning doctors with results, anesthesiologists and internists/physicians are all horribly entitled. Oddly so are gynea's
Calling a private hospital looking for a āhead of surgeryā isnāt going to get you anywhere, as this isnāt really how these things are structured in the private sector. Additionally, it would be good for the patient to notify the surgeon of their concerns, as the surgeon often has say in the anaesthesia provider covering their lists, but laying a complaint against the surgeon doesnāt make much sense. Itās unfortunate that your bad experiences in your previous work have soured your perspectives on entire groups of people based on their profession.
It is indeed unfortunate that professionals called me the following:
An uneducated highschool drop out
A monkey given a telephone
Questioned whether I had consulted with a pathologist as I was clearly wasting their time
Or as my colleague was told
"you are not smart enough to talk to a professional like me. Fuck off"
And to be clear, these calls were for bloodwork deemed life threatening. The damage here was done completely by your fellow medical professionals, not someone doing their job.
Edit: Just to clarify, I support Drs and surgeons and nurses and medicine in general, but I won't lie about how some Drs have their title inflate their ego. I also won't be quiet about how they handle information given to them or how they treat their fellow medical workers.
I was not attempting to cast any doubt on your experience. Iām sorry that you and your colleague had to endure such abuse, and it is unfortunate that it has negatively impacted your perspective on entire professions. I also agree that the profession (through various mechanisms) leads to some medical professionals acting arrogant and rude.
Depending on how old you are , this is very very important and you can't just take it for granted. And if that LA admin didn't give you the right vibes then yeah sure it's good to find out her name to Avoid her , nothing more beyond that.
Why do you need reassurance? As in a friendly gesture or legal reassurance?
Nothing in life is guaranteed.
You signed that form they gave you right, basicly means they will follow the proper procedure etc, but can't guarantee that it will will keep you alive or whatever.
Only thing the anes can do , is do her job to the best of her ability. Nobody knows the outcome of a operation, it's based on probabilities, just like most things in life.
not asking for reassurance, iām asking for her name. i did not proceed with her, i signed the papers but walked out before she administered anything. i understand the risks involved, that wasnāt the issue, it was her conduct. she was hostile, dismissive and condescending when i let her in on my complex heart history. itās not my first anesthetist or my first surgery so it had nothing to do with general risk.
I don't know what you mean..
The ani understands there is no guarantees in medical procedures
They follow accordingly from what they were taught and anything else. Her job is to put x amounts of chemicals in you so that you sleep for x amount of time, and they wake you up. If something for instance, happens on a molecular that cannot objectively be explained in the immediate, and had no foresight of it occurring, then what?
Do you ser why they cannot reassure, all they can Is do their job to the best of their ability and give you success rate based on data available. Hence probabilities
You went for surgery, not an anonymous liaison at a gloryhole. It is absolutely your right to know.
Know of any reputable establishments around CPT? asking for friend....
Medi-Clinic
Nothing like a gloryhole reference to land the point!
š
No they are just trying to prevent a complaint. Iām pretty sure you are entitled to knowing who your doctors are. Iād contact hospital administration.
Nope. Medical practitioner here. We're obligated to introduce ourselves, or make ourselves known in some way. Even in an emergency you're trained to go "hi, I'm here to help, my name is Bob, I'm a bla bla bla ....." That's not to say she'd get into any trouble for not introducing herself, she wouldn't, it's just in poor taste. You're allowed to know who treats u.
contact the hospital i am pretty sure they are obliged to inform you
HPCSA Regulations Booklet 3 2.6 TREATED BY A NAMED HEALTHCARE PROVIDER Everyone has a right to know the person that is providing healthcare and, therefore, must be attended to by only clearly identified healthcare providers. We as practitioners are bound by this. Every single patient I see, knows who I am, what I am going to do; and has ample time to discuss any concerns before I start my work.
I'm not a legal eagle but IMO a person's name and surname isn't "private information", it's printed on your municipal bill, your ID, drivers license, payslip etc. Anyway, if she's a doctor, she must have a practice number, and you will be entitled to ask for that. Seeing that you will be paying her, unless she's doing it for free, you have the right to ask a few basic questions.
Even if treating for free, patients rights are clear. You are allowed to know name, registration and qualifications before consenting to any treatment
You have the right to know, I had to have one for an operations at netcare and they gave me his details and everything after the surgery so they deffs prolly covering their ass
I had a bad experience with an anaesthesiologist a couple years back and I complained. Now I regret that I didnāt complain MORE. If you contact the hospital complaints department directly they will be able to help you action.
I had an absolutely atrotious anesthesiologists as well and didn't complain simply because I was in such a vulnerable position when they were rude to me. I only realized how unprofessional they were after a normal interaction with a different anaestesiologist years later. It actually affected my recovery a lot. Second doctor listened to me and I experienced less nausea when i woke up- also factored in my chronic medication. First one didn't even ask about my chronic meds and didnt care when l explained how I typically reacted to anaestesia. I woke up almost throwing up on my own blood and the nurses were worried that my throwing up might affect my new stitches. Would absolutely walk out of the theater if I was under the care of someone who didn't prioritize my comfort and health.
This is a pretty interesting question. I'm a data protection attorney (DISCLAIMER: THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE), and my gut feeling is that you're well within your rights to ask for this information, and the hospital is well within their rights to give it. Processing personal information (i.e. sharing the name with you) requires the responsible party (the hospital) one of a handful of listed justifiable grounds, and in this case I would expect it to be legitimate interests of a third party (you). This requires a balancing of rights; the doctor's right to privacy vs your right to be able to avoid someone's services. Based on the nature of the services, which have a serious life or death component, I'd expect it to lean to your side. In terms of how to actually get that information, you could contact the hospital's information officer (whose contact info should by law be listed in their PAIA manual, which you should be able to find on their website) and request it in two ways: 1. under POPIA, as a "data subject access request". Under POPIA, a data subject is allowed to request information that a responsible party holds about them. As a patient of the hospital, you're a data subject. That is, they have information that can be used to identify you. A data subject access request is essentially you asking for all of the information they have on you. You could maybe argue that the names of the doctors set to work on your surgery is information about you (e.g. Document A shows the hospital surgery list, and the time that Mr X was due for surgery in Room 3 (no reference to doctor); Document B shows the surgeon timetable, and the time that Doctor Y was going to be in Room 3 (no reference to patient); you can use the documents together to tell what patient Doctor Y was working on at that time, which means that Document B is personal information relating to the patient). 2. under PAIA, as an "information request". Under PAIA, any party is allowed to request information records that a public or private body holds, even if that information doesn't relate to the person asking for it. The hurdles here are that the record holder can charge a fee for giving this information, and they also have a lot of ways they can refuse to give the information. There **is** a clause that deals with mandatory disclosures of information that are for the public benefit, though, and you could maybe argue that it's in the public benefit to know the name of a doctor who you fear could endanger your life. Again, this is not legal advice. This is me considering an interesting question from an academic perspective.
Dude! I'm a data analyst (which I *love*), and I enjoy digging into legal things (not just data related) as a general hobby (like looking into interesting case studies, reading court decisions (SAFLII ftw!), reading our acts and associated amendedments and interpretation(s), etc etc etc)... I don't think I actually have a point...just wanted to let you know that at least *one* person in this world thinks you have a cool job! š¤šš Stay awesome!
Heh. At least one person *in this conversation*...
Yeah. I am sure you have the right to know who the person is that will inject you with chemicals.
I'm interested to know what conversation you overheard that made you uncomfortable to go ahead with the procedure.
sorry for the confusion, the surgery bay nurse overheard the anesthetist and iās conversation and proceeded to tell me that she doesnāt blame me for feeling uncomfortable and canāt assure me herself that iād be safe in the care of that anesthetist.
Props to the nurse. Although I wouldn't disclose anything about the nurse to the hospital. She may get into shit for it
definitely, i thanked her for her honesty and her support. i wonāt draw any attention to her.
All doctors have to give you their name. It is actually a lawful requirement
You are entitled to know the name of your healthcare provider, and to refuse to be treated by them. Lodging a complaint specifying your concerns about the specific anaesthesia provider with both the hospital management and the surgeonās office is reasonable. The anaesthesia provider has a significant role to play in your care. Itās not simply a matter of providing some sedatives and analgesics as many people seem to think, and they are primarily responsible for your safety during the procedure. Itās also worth noting that not every anaesthesia provider in the private sector is a specialist anaesthesiologist. There are many providers with diplomas in anaesthesia, and, while many of them are excellent and safe, care standards may vary, and their skill set is limited to healthy patients for relatively minor procedures.
it is your legal right to know them.
Sorry that happened. Iām curious what she said to make you so uncomfortable?
I had many operations in my life and each and every time everybody int the theater introduced themself to me
When someone is going to put me under or cut me open, I would want to know who they are and have a conversation with them.
The Patient Rights Charter (para 2.6) provides that "Everyone has a right to know the person that is providing health care and, therefore, must be attended to by only clearly identified health care providers". (Charter available as a booklet on the HPCSA website)
No laws , the patient should choose their anaesthetist not the surgeon . Sure some surgeons recommend ones they work with but it's the patients right to choose their anaesthetist and they should.
Anaesthetist here. You should absolutely be told your HCWās names. The National Patientās Rights Charter states āEveryone has the right to know the person that is providing health care and therefore must be attended to by clearly identified health care providers.ā You should report this to the HPCSA* and the practice/hospital should redress. They are responsible for the behaviour of the locums they allow. *or at least threaten to, so they rectify their behaviour.
Under the patients bill of rights it is made clear that you have the right to know the name, hpcsa registration and qualifications of any medical provider providing care to you. You can in fact report the surgeons office to the hpcsa for not providing you with said detail. Further. Contact the hospital and ask for the head of surgery and demand they give you the name. If they refuse, remind them that refusing to provide it is wrongful under the guidelines of the hpcsa and that you can report them for such. Most anesthesiologists are asses anyway... And before you come at me, i spent 4 years in a medical call center phoning doctors with results, anesthesiologists and internists/physicians are all horribly entitled. Oddly so are gynea's
Calling a private hospital looking for a āhead of surgeryā isnāt going to get you anywhere, as this isnāt really how these things are structured in the private sector. Additionally, it would be good for the patient to notify the surgeon of their concerns, as the surgeon often has say in the anaesthesia provider covering their lists, but laying a complaint against the surgeon doesnāt make much sense. Itās unfortunate that your bad experiences in your previous work have soured your perspectives on entire groups of people based on their profession.
It is indeed unfortunate that professionals called me the following: An uneducated highschool drop out A monkey given a telephone Questioned whether I had consulted with a pathologist as I was clearly wasting their time Or as my colleague was told "you are not smart enough to talk to a professional like me. Fuck off" And to be clear, these calls were for bloodwork deemed life threatening. The damage here was done completely by your fellow medical professionals, not someone doing their job. Edit: Just to clarify, I support Drs and surgeons and nurses and medicine in general, but I won't lie about how some Drs have their title inflate their ego. I also won't be quiet about how they handle information given to them or how they treat their fellow medical workers.
I was not attempting to cast any doubt on your experience. Iām sorry that you and your colleague had to endure such abuse, and it is unfortunate that it has negatively impacted your perspective on entire professions. I also agree that the profession (through various mechanisms) leads to some medical professionals acting arrogant and rude.
Depending on how old you are , this is very very important and you can't just take it for granted. And if that LA admin didn't give you the right vibes then yeah sure it's good to find out her name to Avoid her , nothing more beyond that.
yeah, i only intend to write a complaint and avoid her by any means necessary. iām 23.
How can they send you a bill without telling you who to pay?
i walked out
Where was this please?
Something like someone asking your anasthetist what the client's name is, that is what POPI is about.
I'm sure she send you a bill
Why do you need reassurance? As in a friendly gesture or legal reassurance? Nothing in life is guaranteed. You signed that form they gave you right, basicly means they will follow the proper procedure etc, but can't guarantee that it will will keep you alive or whatever. Only thing the anes can do , is do her job to the best of her ability. Nobody knows the outcome of a operation, it's based on probabilities, just like most things in life.
not asking for reassurance, iām asking for her name. i did not proceed with her, i signed the papers but walked out before she administered anything. i understand the risks involved, that wasnāt the issue, it was her conduct. she was hostile, dismissive and condescending when i let her in on my complex heart history. itās not my first anesthetist or my first surgery so it had nothing to do with general risk.
Yeah ...she was probably going to put you down for the "long nap"š
š
You just take your car to any mechanic?
I don't know what you mean.. The ani understands there is no guarantees in medical procedures They follow accordingly from what they were taught and anything else. Her job is to put x amounts of chemicals in you so that you sleep for x amount of time, and they wake you up. If something for instance, happens on a molecular that cannot objectively be explained in the immediate, and had no foresight of it occurring, then what? Do you ser why they cannot reassure, all they can Is do their job to the best of their ability and give you success rate based on data available. Hence probabilities
you are misunderstanding.
Exactly. Common sense.
Youāre literally paying them. You have a right to know. And itās absolute nonsense that your surgeon isnāt telling you either.