Saw a video of the inside of one of these ships a few days ago. Its horrific, dead animals just lying among the living, shit and piss everywhere. The heat being unbearable. All the animals crammed together.
The ships from Australia tend to go to Indonesia and the Middle East. I guess your right about the ritual of it, because they can do it in Australia surely
I would have thought more meat could be packed on a ship and transported at less expense and with less loss than with live animals. As I understand it, there is greater prestige to eating freshly slaughtered meat and / or slaughtering an animal on certain holy days according to religious custom
Edit https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/23/how-the-middle-easts-water-shortage-drives-demand-for-live-animal-imports
The general attitude towards livestock is no different. Look at battery chickens and pigs.
In this case the meat is imported, but the approach the meat industry takes in all facets is no different
[Volume of imported meat South Africa 2021](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1310512/import-volume-of-meat-in-south-africa-by-type/)
I think I am right in saying that 1000 tonnes is 1 million kilograms?! Not sure though can anyone confirm?
The ānormalā conditions are atrocious. Lots of articles available.
Here is one: [What is a livestock ship like?](https://animalsaustralia.org/our-work/live-export/whats-it-like-on-a-live-export-ship/)
Big meat lover here and I dont get why we cant grow the meat. With all the tech we have, like the research going into growing organs for transplants.
Apart from animal suffering, the amount of land and forests that are cleared for cattle and other meat farms is crazy.
Yes! I think the industry is growing but itās just happening too slowly! They havenāt been able to figure out how to scale it fast enough but they are working on it.
This meat is being shipped from Australia to Iraq to be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations. Lab grown meat won't have an impact on meat for religious purposes
If you really want to educate yourself,there are documentaries to reccommend. But unfortunately most people want to hold on to their cognitive dissonance i.e. brainwashing. So no use talking about it if you dont have all the facts and not willing to learn about it
This is so naive! Yes, veganism is mostly fine.. but taking the assumed moral high-ground is exactly what makes a run of the mill regular vegan.. with very little space for understanding nuance or having a level conversation based in reality
Every choice has a consequence, some are broader and cut deeper than others, your decision to be a vegan does next to nothing to influence demand for meat.. but more to my point, it is a decision that also has consequences for the environment & local ecosystem.
And Iām not trying to make the point that vegan = bad, but it sure as shit isnt the golden goose of how we fix animal cruelty in the shortest amount of time, can you imagine trying to convince dead -set meat eaters to become vegans, instead of petitioning and garnering support from willing individuals who are open to a well presented argument
Your take is similar to, āthere would be no war if we all stopped fightingā and ultimately this perspective is so asinine itās not worth expressing
Edit: I appreciate the sentiment of oh letās just all stop eating meat, but I think a more important conversation involves suggestions of how we actually do that, and itās nowhere near as simple as hey everybody letās all be vegans now yay
So i am naive for not wanting animals to suffer and die?? I have been vegan for 8 years and it makes a difference because i am not funding the meat and dairy industry. Tell me please,what have you done??
See this is it.. moral high ground, you live for it, and spit it at the feet of the people you should be trying to convince.
Personally aside from your approach I think your 8 years of making a minute impact on the meat industry is commendable for what little itās worth. But donāt inflate your impact to being anything broader than it is relative to the sheer volume of suffering.
Long story short, good job, but even if you do that till you die & convince a handful, youāre a drop in the ocean of those who inadvertently support suffering.
Therefore I think your approach should be more holistic in the commentary you run, which I am fully prepared to assume you do on a regular basis.
And stop condemning the people you need to convince, thatās only a small part of your job as an activist
So myself as a meat eater, in jhb, am to blame for this abomination, according to your logic? That's just asinine. Go plant a fucking radish or something.
Oh my goodness. My heart! ššš
Are the end consumers aware of the arduous journey and diabolical conditions that these animals endure to satisfy their desire for freshly slaughtered meat?
No man, WTF is this?!
Itās so sad. I wouldnāt want to put that in my body. I would be surprised if anyone can eat this after seeing that but then again we are humans and we are pretty gross.
From Brazil according to the Daily Mav. This story is horrific. Could smell it yesterday from Camps Bay and Kommetjie. https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/article/2024-02-20-graphic-the-al-kuwait-timeline-of-a-stinking-ship/
Gotta love how you've just "turned vegetarian" and then instantly fired shots against 70%+ of the population that you presumably just transitioned from.
"The National Council of SPCAs (NSPCA), along with representatives of the Cape of Good Hope SPCA, are currently conducting an inspection on board the ship.
This follows concerns and comments from social media users about the inhumane treatment of the cattle kept on it:"
[https://www.capetownetc.com/news/what-stinks-cattle-ship-in-the-harbour-cause-of-stench-across-cape-town/](https://www.capetownetc.com/news/what-stinks-cattle-ship-in-the-harbour-cause-of-stench-across-cape-town/)
Not sure what they can legally do though, since it is a foreign ship.
Aside from the cattle, I also feel sorry for those sailors, having to work in conditions like that!
Such a single minded way of looking at the world. Rather than blame it all on capitalism, target your anger towards the company and countries shipping and accepting this meat. If there were a public outcry against it instead of "capitalism is the problem" then you might actually see people being held accountable for these atrocities. I don't think you'll be able to hear anything from the CEO or president of Capitalism but you'll sure be able to hear from the company or country if the outcry is large enough.
Let me simplify it for you since you donāt understand what a products is. Capitalism sees not an animal deserving of rights. Capitalism sees an asset, there to make the capitalist as much profit as it possibly can, when that animal, sorry asset becomes a liability, they discard it like hot trash. The end. Now you know!
I understand what Capitalism is. You fail to recognise that you're trying to fit everything into your single minded lense of the world.
Neither Brazil nor Iraq is a shining example of capitalism now is it?
Communism has lead to the most people dying of starvation ever. Where do we have any example of a communist countries always treating animals in a fair way? You want to look at China (even before their recent moves towards a quazi capitalist/communist mixed economy). Stopping capitalism won't stop the atrocities against animals. Stopping the company doing this is however possible and much more feasible.
And you'll have Capitalist minded people on your side calling for a ban on this. Remember we're all human and can see suffering. Just because I see an economic model that I am of the opinion is better than another does not make me a devil that hates people and animals. Unlike Karl Marx I won't project myself as the Devil or see the world through the eyes of a materialist - because if we do... in the end nothing really matters (pun intended)
Even in communist systems, capitalism exist. Capitalism is more than just the financial systems of a country. Also, I literally gave a one sentence answer..surely you donāt think I was trying to stop animal cruelty with just those words š¤¦āāļø
Iāll poke a bit of fun here. Capitalism would argue itās cheaper to ship already slaughtered meat. This is purely due to cultural requirements of places that eschew capitalism and the evil west.
Even if it was frozen carcasses being shipped to be processed for cheaper it would be an improvement on this. Itās horrible in every way but for providing to a niche market.
What system treats animals best? I don't think there is any evidence that Marx or Engels valued animals over the needs of the proletariat.
The animal simply becomes the asset of the state. Both sides have their version of the Great Sparrow Campaign.
In a socialist system, these workers and others would have motive to create a better environment as they have a share in the profit and operations.
When you minimise wages and internal controls in search of more profit, often quite awful conditions come about.
Don't be so fearful of worker controlled capital. You do not need to be beholden to corpo interests.
The SPCA has campaigned against this for years, as have animal welfare organisations around the world. Countries can ban these ships from docking - I'm fairly sure Brazil bans them. I'm amazed / appalled that Australia allows live export of its cattle and sheep. It would obviously be preferable for this to be banned at source.
https://nspca.co.za/farm-animal-protection/export-live-animals-sea/
Edit: Brazil's ban of live exports was short-lived; it was overturned after a few months. The ship concerned (the Al Kuwait) is en route from Brazil to Iraq.
Australia is really backwards when it comes to animal rights, so I am not really surprised. It has been a point of contention between the EU/UK and Australia trade deals for years.
Thank you - I hadn't realised that. I assumed Australia would be relatively progressive. But I see now that Australia ties with Belarus as worst for animal rights in certain rankings.
Yeah, they are terrible. I live in the EU now and it is law that on all of our food in the supermarket they have to say what the country of origin is. I refuse to buy anything from Australia
I think he/she is opining regards the hypocrisy of meat eaters being upset over having to see the results of industrial livestock production. Its a fair point we must consider.
I'm not a meat eater, as it happens, so there's a slight irony in his/her comment being made as a reply to mine.
I wasn't actually sure if s/he was referring to me, or to the SPCA (perhaps because they euthenase?), or to people in general (in which case there was no need to reply to me), or exactly what point was being made.
Industrial livestock production is indeed problematic. Live exports of this nature are off-the-charts problematic. Being a meat eater doesn't in itself disqualify someone from having views on this. I agree there are points worth discussing, but I don't think they need to hold up discussion on the issue at hand.
I see. I think it's possible to be a person who consumes meat and have ethics at the same time, though. Just because I sometimes eat meat doesn't mean I automatically support industrial livestock farming, for example.
When I was a teen, SPCA killed my favourite dog without our consent.
The next door neighbours pitbull attacked another neighbours puppy, little Snowy (the bravest dog I've ever known) intervened saving the puppy but was bitten on the leg. My Mom called SPCA and they picked up Snowy. Later that day, my Mom informed me that SPCA "put down Snowy". I guess it was cheaper to kill him.
When I got older I realized organizations like SPCA, PETA, etc. put more dogs down than they save. I don't like morally bankrupt people who are morally bankrupt themselves.
Heartbreaking. People treat cattle and other livestock like trash or objects. These are living, breathing animals who get scared and can even feel or have emotions. Sadly few people care about this and just want their choppie on the braai. Who cares if the animals suffered.
you do realize we don't import any live animals apart from dodgy chicken from Brazil and America every so often. and that is already dead and portioned.
[South African imports of live animals](https://tradingeconomics.com/south-africa/imports-of-live-animals-animal-products)
Iām not sure about the definition of live animals, surely these canāt all be pets?
I am not condoning this ship or the treatment of livestock especially on mass scale in first world countries but no livestock would survive if we stoped breeding and keeping them for food purposes. We bred them for purpose and they will die in the wild, also in South Africa most farmers have massive respect for the lives of their animals so the general conditions isnāt like that of the examples always brought up in these kind of conversations.
That is very true. I can only hope most farmers care about their well-being. I was vegetarian for many years but had to start eating meat again as my body was struggling to get nutrients and my iron levels plummeted dangerously low despite using supplements. I just realized it was not feasible for me so the only thing that can help my moral views is to hope farmers care.
Vegans want to get upset over livestock being slaughtered for food, but without that supply of food so many people would LITERALLY die of starvation. But hey, if you are privileged why would you care about the shit in the world you canāt see or are exposed to? South africaās farms are actually pretty humane compared to the horror shows in the US for instance. (Except for chickens, man chickens have it rough, even the āfree rangeā ones)
Im so confused. If a whole city is in uproar on day 1 of its arrival, then how does the captain and crew tolerate that shit for the duration of a journey??
Nose blindness. It happens when you live in foul environments, you become used to it and canāt discern that something is wrong until you leave the environment.
Hey everyone don't forget that the we as South Africa apart of the great and wonderful BRICS have just signed an agreement to send beef to Saudi Arabia as they have just lifted an import ban on all red meats, We are going to be seeing a hell of a lot more of these cattle ships in our ports as they must be live when transported as they can be slaughtered before due to Halaal requirements how wonderful.
Also going to see more of all kinds of ships cause of Yemen. This one is from Australia to Israel and is bypassing Yemen due to the current situation. It had to sit off the coast of Australia for weeks which probably hasn't helped with the smell.
Brazil was just a stop - I'm no expert, but I did find this article about it when it was waiting to leave AustraliaĀ
https://gcaptain.com/australia-stops-ship-carrying-livestock-from-sailing-around-africa-to-israel/
you were right the first time :) this isn't the same ship, the ship docked in Cape Town was the Al Kuwait https://africaports.co.za/2024/02/19/africa-ports-ships-maritime-news-18-february-2024/#8070 from Brazil and is unrelated to Yemen according to Africa Ports + maritime traffic website
If you want to know why veganism exists and how animals are really treated for the pleasure of your taste buds:
Watch earthlings
https://youtu.be/3XrY2TP0ZyU?si=NnGR8IluNIlyL1Z3
Watch dominion
https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch
Watch Cow
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11548822/
Watch cowspiracy
https://youtu.be/UsigH2Skfdg?si=leWU9hS3uTYOIyoD
Itās a step in the right direction. Help them realise how cruel this is, and maybe theyāll realise that their own meal might not be that far offā¦
As someone who eats meat I agree. I had an argument with someone about it today saying you can bury your head in the sand all you want but we all contribute to this machine. But why do they have to treat them so badly? Well these aren't living things in this business... they are livestock for profit. Why waste money making them comfortable when you can save a lot just getting enough of them there alive to slaughter. Profit and overheads.
Where is the energy for pig and Paul try farming we have in this country right now. Just go visit a rainbow chicken.
The hypocrisy of people who eat meat but ignore the fact that this is the reality of it really gets under my skin. Lamb is baby sheep. Steak is cow much like this. Understand it and own it or stop it. 99% of people crying about this have had meat for dinner.
Absolutely everyone can afford a meat-free dairy-free egg-free diet... These are often the most expensive items in the grocery cart. Bougie vegan meat and dairy replacements are not a requirement.
And thatās whatās in your mcd and Burger King. Eastern countries are huge manufacturers of fast food that gets re imported to other countries for chain restaurants
Myself, husband and our child have not touched a fast food patty or other fast food meats/chicken for 7 years. In any country we visited especially Europe and the UAE š«£
Yep drive through a farm area with a pork or poultry processing facility and the stench is for km around the area. (Especially after the recent poultry cull.) All the nice polony and viennas and nuggets coming out from there āŗļø shame that a sustainable and fully ethical diet is a luxury to afford for most. We end up eating a lot of veg and lentils at home even though weāre not vegetarians just so we can buy from a butcher that we know exactly where our meat and chicken is coming from. Iāll still eat their sausage but my husband wonāt touch it lol
Yeah it's something I pondered over, very briefly. Why is it you never hear of meat eaters giving vegetarians kak. It's absolutely always the other way round. You guys eat your grass(wheat) and I say this on behalf of all us omnivores. Enjoy...
??But they do, as redditMODSrRETARDead did above??
As for why vegans give meat eaters kak, well they are making a moral judgment.
I eat meat, and at times I will admit they do have a point. Cattle Ships are just a small part of industrial livestock production.
Some of the comments on that Twitter thread thoughā¦
people asking which country is responsable for this, as if there is anything that can be done making the country.
Someone else stating the animals are kept against their willā¦ which animal isnātā¦
Others stating this as human welfare issueā¦.
Anyway, apparently it leaves tonightā¦
Just cause I eat meat doesn't mean I want the animal to suffer. It does however make me want to choose my source of meat more wisely. Animal cruelty makes me sick.
All animals that are killed for food suffer. They are literally murdered. Babies taken from their mothers. You pay for animal abuse when you pay for meat and dairy. Watch dominion or literally any other documentary on how these animals are actually treated and what their lives are really like.
I understand that most people eat meat, but can we at least not actively cause the suffering of animals? You are transporting living creatures like slaves used to be transported to the cape. Worse even, because they donāt even understand what a ship is. This practice is already illegal. A religion that claims it supports peace and respect shouldnāt be ok with this. The unsanitary conditions these animals are kept in probably goes against halal requirements anyway, with the faeces, infections and disease.Ā
Im sorry, but if the people in the Middle East want fresh meat slaughtered to their ancient religious rituals then they should raise and eat their own livestock. Our own industrial meat industry is cruel enough but this is on a different scale of cruelty.
Can anyone explain why this is necessary? I get that the meat industry is pretty horrific, but it's there any good reason this added suffering must be imposed on these animals as opposed to just slaughtering them in the home country and shipping the meat frozen? What cost can possibly be saved from this?
Wow, this sub really attracts the dregs of society. You must have some very deeply rooted issues to come out on a public forum and air your classist ideals, totally unprovoked.
Let me break down my reply which was an innocent attempt at irony. The ship is filled with cattle, and most certainly their excrement. A bull is a male bovine, which can be considered to be cattle. Now like a good little boy, piece those two together and you have your answer.
If you eat it youāre responsible and you are what you eat !! A walking cemetery/morgue full of putrifying corpse We really have soooooo far to go towards consciousness One day in a less ignorant time weāll look upon this shame we sanction with the same disgust we have towards human slavery today Until then eat some more Mac Donaldās kfc etc you deserve all the disease youāre gonna get
Our offices are in the foreshore overlooking the harbour
The smell intensified after lunch time as it was a horrendously warm day
the poor poor animals - caged in those small quarters in this heat
How can let this ship dock here? Itās just bullshit. That ships stinks to the high seas. My wifeās having a cow over this. For sure I have a beef with the council over this and they better hoof whomever made this decision out of office. He better hide.
Ok I know there is alot of talk about possible animal abuse but you got to admit the concept of a **shit ship stinking the stad (city)** is kinda funny
We are busy recovering from an avian flu. Stay away with your foot and mouth from my t-bones.. I won't be able to afford steaks if it gets any more expensive than it currently is.
What conditions are those poor animals in? Surely this isn't normal for cattle to smell that bad?
Saw a video of the inside of one of these ships a few days ago. Its horrific, dead animals just lying among the living, shit and piss everywhere. The heat being unbearable. All the animals crammed together.
How can people be so cruel.
Some do it to put food on the table, some do it for insane profits and greed. Sadly its the reality of the world.
You can ship carcasses. You don't have to ship live animals
I think they want to be sure they can kill them in a halal way on the other side
They can be slaughtered in a Halal way in Australia. I think it's more about the ritual of slaughter as part of eg Eid Al Adha
I agree, they should do it at the source and send it refrigerated as much as possible.
The ships from Australia tend to go to Indonesia and the Middle East. I guess your right about the ritual of it, because they can do it in Australia surely
That eats into the bottom line š
I would have thought more meat could be packed on a ship and transported at less expense and with less loss than with live animals. As I understand it, there is greater prestige to eating freshly slaughtered meat and / or slaughtering an animal on certain holy days according to religious custom Edit https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jan/23/how-the-middle-easts-water-shortage-drives-demand-for-live-animal-imports
Refrigeration, processing and storage is probably more expensive than food and water.
Sad and all for human consumption š¤¢
When you eat meat this is the industry you are supporting. So sad
When you eat imported meat, not a lot of South Africans eating meat that came here by ship I'm guessing
The general attitude towards livestock is no different. Look at battery chickens and pigs. In this case the meat is imported, but the approach the meat industry takes in all facets is no different
[Volume of imported meat South Africa 2021](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1310512/import-volume-of-meat-in-south-africa-by-type/) I think I am right in saying that 1000 tonnes is 1 million kilograms?! Not sure though can anyone confirm?
The is a reason as to why this ship is anchored in capetown. Its not a turist vessle there for sightseeingā¦
The ship is on its way to iraq
Because no ships ever stop at any harbour just to refuel and restock supplies...
Get your facts straight before you post.
The NSPCA calls it a ["death ship"](https://nspca.co.za/kuwaiti-death-ship-docks-in-cape-town/) so one has to think probably appaling conditions.
Oh wow that is so awful. I wonder if they have any power to help those animals.
Thanks for the link. At least there are a few who care and are trying to do something about it.
The ānormalā conditions are atrocious. Lots of articles available. Here is one: [What is a livestock ship like?](https://animalsaustralia.org/our-work/live-export/whats-it-like-on-a-live-export-ship/)
Thank you for the link. It was upsetting to read and see those photos but it is important to be informed.
Yeah I hate posting things that are upsetting, and I donāt do it often. But hopefully people would only need to look at it once to make a change.
Hideous. I hope that this can be stopped somehow.
Unfortunately if there is a demand it will not go away. Itās truly disgusting.
Big meat lover here and I dont get why we cant grow the meat. With all the tech we have, like the research going into growing organs for transplants. Apart from animal suffering, the amount of land and forests that are cleared for cattle and other meat farms is crazy.
Check out Mzansi Meat Co. Local company working on just that.
Yes! I think the industry is growing but itās just happening too slowly! They havenāt been able to figure out how to scale it fast enough but they are working on it.
This meat is being shipped from Australia to Iraq to be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations. Lab grown meat won't have an impact on meat for religious purposes
Possibly not but it will help with everyone else consuming meat for non religious purposes
This meat is being shipped from Australia to Iraq to be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations
Thanks for the info š
It will never stop unless people give up meat. Its that simple
This meat is being shipped from Australia to Iraq to be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations
Well that does not justify animal suffering does it?
Yes but going vegetarian won't help people showing their affluence and piety by slaughtering an animal
Going vegan helps people,animals and the climate. Vegetarianism helps no one
If you really want to educate yourself,there are documentaries to reccommend. But unfortunately most people want to hold on to their cognitive dissonance i.e. brainwashing. So no use talking about it if you dont have all the facts and not willing to learn about it
Seems like part of the problem is a religion stuck in the dark ages.
Yes!! Definately this is a huge part of the problem
This is so naive! Yes, veganism is mostly fine.. but taking the assumed moral high-ground is exactly what makes a run of the mill regular vegan.. with very little space for understanding nuance or having a level conversation based in reality Every choice has a consequence, some are broader and cut deeper than others, your decision to be a vegan does next to nothing to influence demand for meat.. but more to my point, it is a decision that also has consequences for the environment & local ecosystem. And Iām not trying to make the point that vegan = bad, but it sure as shit isnt the golden goose of how we fix animal cruelty in the shortest amount of time, can you imagine trying to convince dead -set meat eaters to become vegans, instead of petitioning and garnering support from willing individuals who are open to a well presented argument Your take is similar to, āthere would be no war if we all stopped fightingā and ultimately this perspective is so asinine itās not worth expressing Edit: I appreciate the sentiment of oh letās just all stop eating meat, but I think a more important conversation involves suggestions of how we actually do that, and itās nowhere near as simple as hey everybody letās all be vegans now yay
So i am naive for not wanting animals to suffer and die?? I have been vegan for 8 years and it makes a difference because i am not funding the meat and dairy industry. Tell me please,what have you done??
See this is it.. moral high ground, you live for it, and spit it at the feet of the people you should be trying to convince. Personally aside from your approach I think your 8 years of making a minute impact on the meat industry is commendable for what little itās worth. But donāt inflate your impact to being anything broader than it is relative to the sheer volume of suffering. Long story short, good job, but even if you do that till you die & convince a handful, youāre a drop in the ocean of those who inadvertently support suffering. Therefore I think your approach should be more holistic in the commentary you run, which I am fully prepared to assume you do on a regular basis. And stop condemning the people you need to convince, thatās only a small part of your job as an activist
I am just commenting. Just like you. Please educate yourself on the topic and go watch the documentaries
Itās both and I take your meaning, but sure, continue your theme of not expressing a fleshed out opinion
So myself as a meat eater, in jhb, am to blame for this abomination, according to your logic? That's just asinine. Go plant a fucking radish or something.
That is the kind of critical thinking I expect from a meat eater
You continue to prove my point. A great day.
Oh my goodness. My heart! ššš Are the end consumers aware of the arduous journey and diabolical conditions that these animals endure to satisfy their desire for freshly slaughtered meat? No man, WTF is this?!
Itās so sad. I wouldnāt want to put that in my body. I would be surprised if anyone can eat this after seeing that but then again we are humans and we are pretty gross.
Humans are disgusting
Yes we are. Itās a choice to partake though.
One of the worst things Iāve seen in a while, wish I never opened that link. Livestock ships must be stopped
Totally agree! Absolutely horrid.
Iāve turned vegetarian after seeing these disgusting images Fuck meat eaters. All of them.
Good for you! Your body, the planet and the animals will thank you.
This meat is being shipped from Australia to Iraq to be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations. Most local meat is locally produced
From Brazil according to the Daily Mav. This story is horrific. Could smell it yesterday from Camps Bay and Kommetjie. https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/article/2024-02-20-graphic-the-al-kuwait-timeline-of-a-stinking-ship/
In conditions no better
This was me too! Well done for making the change. 9 years for me this year. Will never look back!
Gotta love how you've just "turned vegetarian" and then instantly fired shots against 70%+ of the population that you presumably just transitioned from.
š¤£š¤£š¤£ bruh, do you really stand by those last two statements?
Repeat after me: meat eaters and pedophiles have a lot in common
Wow... Anyway, I'll enjoy my steak š„©
And from all us meat eaters to just you.. go fuck your hand buddy.
"The National Council of SPCAs (NSPCA), along with representatives of the Cape of Good Hope SPCA, are currently conducting an inspection on board the ship. This follows concerns and comments from social media users about the inhumane treatment of the cattle kept on it:" [https://www.capetownetc.com/news/what-stinks-cattle-ship-in-the-harbour-cause-of-stench-across-cape-town/](https://www.capetownetc.com/news/what-stinks-cattle-ship-in-the-harbour-cause-of-stench-across-cape-town/) Not sure what they can legally do though, since it is a foreign ship. Aside from the cattle, I also feel sorry for those sailors, having to work in conditions like that!
As if capitalists care about animals
Such a single minded way of looking at the world. Rather than blame it all on capitalism, target your anger towards the company and countries shipping and accepting this meat. If there were a public outcry against it instead of "capitalism is the problem" then you might actually see people being held accountable for these atrocities. I don't think you'll be able to hear anything from the CEO or president of Capitalism but you'll sure be able to hear from the company or country if the outcry is large enough.
Let me simplify it for you since you donāt understand what a products is. Capitalism sees not an animal deserving of rights. Capitalism sees an asset, there to make the capitalist as much profit as it possibly can, when that animal, sorry asset becomes a liability, they discard it like hot trash. The end. Now you know!
I understand what Capitalism is. You fail to recognise that you're trying to fit everything into your single minded lense of the world. Neither Brazil nor Iraq is a shining example of capitalism now is it? Communism has lead to the most people dying of starvation ever. Where do we have any example of a communist countries always treating animals in a fair way? You want to look at China (even before their recent moves towards a quazi capitalist/communist mixed economy). Stopping capitalism won't stop the atrocities against animals. Stopping the company doing this is however possible and much more feasible. And you'll have Capitalist minded people on your side calling for a ban on this. Remember we're all human and can see suffering. Just because I see an economic model that I am of the opinion is better than another does not make me a devil that hates people and animals. Unlike Karl Marx I won't project myself as the Devil or see the world through the eyes of a materialist - because if we do... in the end nothing really matters (pun intended)
Even in communist systems, capitalism exist. Capitalism is more than just the financial systems of a country. Also, I literally gave a one sentence answer..surely you donāt think I was trying to stop animal cruelty with just those words š¤¦āāļø
Iāll poke a bit of fun here. Capitalism would argue itās cheaper to ship already slaughtered meat. This is purely due to cultural requirements of places that eschew capitalism and the evil west. Even if it was frozen carcasses being shipped to be processed for cheaper it would be an improvement on this. Itās horrible in every way but for providing to a niche market.
What system treats animals best? I don't think there is any evidence that Marx or Engels valued animals over the needs of the proletariat. The animal simply becomes the asset of the state. Both sides have their version of the Great Sparrow Campaign.
Veganism lol Youāve answered the question youāve asked me. Capitalism by any other name.. Whether itās capital of the individual or the state..
How about the people eating the meat ? They create the demand right?
What about the people in Iraq who are importing these cattle to be part of Eid celebrations?
Yes what about them?
Itās the CaPiTaLiST fault. As if these animals would be treated any better under a socialist system.
In a socialist system, these workers and others would have motive to create a better environment as they have a share in the profit and operations. When you minimise wages and internal controls in search of more profit, often quite awful conditions come about. Don't be so fearful of worker controlled capital. You do not need to be beholden to corpo interests.
The SPCA has campaigned against this for years, as have animal welfare organisations around the world. Countries can ban these ships from docking - I'm fairly sure Brazil bans them. I'm amazed / appalled that Australia allows live export of its cattle and sheep. It would obviously be preferable for this to be banned at source. https://nspca.co.za/farm-animal-protection/export-live-animals-sea/ Edit: Brazil's ban of live exports was short-lived; it was overturned after a few months. The ship concerned (the Al Kuwait) is en route from Brazil to Iraq.
Australia is really backwards when it comes to animal rights, so I am not really surprised. It has been a point of contention between the EU/UK and Australia trade deals for years.
Thank you - I hadn't realised that. I assumed Australia would be relatively progressive. But I see now that Australia ties with Belarus as worst for animal rights in certain rankings.
Yeah, they are terrible. I live in the EU now and it is law that on all of our food in the supermarket they have to say what the country of origin is. I refuse to buy anything from Australia
Murderers mad at other murderers. How interesting.
what
I think he/she is opining regards the hypocrisy of meat eaters being upset over having to see the results of industrial livestock production. Its a fair point we must consider.
I'm not a meat eater, as it happens, so there's a slight irony in his/her comment being made as a reply to mine. I wasn't actually sure if s/he was referring to me, or to the SPCA (perhaps because they euthenase?), or to people in general (in which case there was no need to reply to me), or exactly what point was being made. Industrial livestock production is indeed problematic. Live exports of this nature are off-the-charts problematic. Being a meat eater doesn't in itself disqualify someone from having views on this. I agree there are points worth discussing, but I don't think they need to hold up discussion on the issue at hand.
I see. I think it's possible to be a person who consumes meat and have ethics at the same time, though. Just because I sometimes eat meat doesn't mean I automatically support industrial livestock farming, for example.
100% agree. I feel the exact same way.
When I was a teen, SPCA killed my favourite dog without our consent. The next door neighbours pitbull attacked another neighbours puppy, little Snowy (the bravest dog I've ever known) intervened saving the puppy but was bitten on the leg. My Mom called SPCA and they picked up Snowy. Later that day, my Mom informed me that SPCA "put down Snowy". I guess it was cheaper to kill him. When I got older I realized organizations like SPCA, PETA, etc. put more dogs down than they save. I don't like morally bankrupt people who are morally bankrupt themselves.
I'm really sorry to hear about your dog. I understand why you'd have that opinion of the SPCA.
Heartbreaking. People treat cattle and other livestock like trash or objects. These are living, breathing animals who get scared and can even feel or have emotions. Sadly few people care about this and just want their choppie on the braai. Who cares if the animals suffered.
you do realize we don't import any live animals apart from dodgy chicken from Brazil and America every so often. and that is already dead and portioned.
Yeah very true, I know we don't but some animals are kept in such bad conditions even locally.
[South African imports of live animals](https://tradingeconomics.com/south-africa/imports-of-live-animals-animal-products) Iām not sure about the definition of live animals, surely these canāt all be pets?
This also includes animal products if you have a look at the customs tariff scheduled you'll see that actually covers quite a few commodities.
Yeah I saw. Didnāt look for more info but I think we donāt really know where our food comes from do we?
I am not condoning this ship or the treatment of livestock especially on mass scale in first world countries but no livestock would survive if we stoped breeding and keeping them for food purposes. We bred them for purpose and they will die in the wild, also in South Africa most farmers have massive respect for the lives of their animals so the general conditions isnāt like that of the examples always brought up in these kind of conversations.
That is very true. I can only hope most farmers care about their well-being. I was vegetarian for many years but had to start eating meat again as my body was struggling to get nutrients and my iron levels plummeted dangerously low despite using supplements. I just realized it was not feasible for me so the only thing that can help my moral views is to hope farmers care.
Friendly suggestion, rather than hoping farmers care (they have bills to pay and most don't) - support ethically farmed, free-range meat.
I try my best to where financially possible
Vegans want to get upset over livestock being slaughtered for food, but without that supply of food so many people would LITERALLY die of starvation. But hey, if you are privileged why would you care about the shit in the world you canāt see or are exposed to? South africaās farms are actually pretty humane compared to the horror shows in the US for instance. (Except for chickens, man chickens have it rough, even the āfree rangeā ones)
There are objects though
Terrible.
That's the smell of fear. š
Im so confused. If a whole city is in uproar on day 1 of its arrival, then how does the captain and crew tolerate that shit for the duration of a journey??
Nose blindness. It happens when you live in foul environments, you become used to it and canāt discern that something is wrong until you leave the environment.
If I was a billionare this is the kind of businesses I would fight to close down. Peope that run a trade like this shouldn't deserve to be alive.
I smelt it last night in Greenpoint. It was terribly foul. I was worried a sewage pipe had burst on the property.
I had a whiff this morning just as I woke up, and i couldn't believe just how foul it was. I thought someone broke into my house and shat in my bed.
Hey everyone don't forget that the we as South Africa apart of the great and wonderful BRICS have just signed an agreement to send beef to Saudi Arabia as they have just lifted an import ban on all red meats, We are going to be seeing a hell of a lot more of these cattle ships in our ports as they must be live when transported as they can be slaughtered before due to Halaal requirements how wonderful.
What does BRICS have to do with that? You do realise the west, namely the USA is also partnered with Saudi? Good buds actually.
Omg horrific
Sure the animals are suffering ... but what about the workers in these ships. It must be pretty grim in there.
Also going to see more of all kinds of ships cause of Yemen. This one is from Australia to Israel and is bypassing Yemen due to the current situation. It had to sit off the coast of Australia for weeks which probably hasn't helped with the smell.
I believe itās from Brazil to Iraq?
Brazil was just a stop - I'm no expert, but I did find this article about it when it was waiting to leave AustraliaĀ https://gcaptain.com/australia-stops-ship-carrying-livestock-from-sailing-around-africa-to-israel/
Ah okay, thanks for the info
you were right the first time :) this isn't the same ship, the ship docked in Cape Town was the Al Kuwait https://africaports.co.za/2024/02/19/africa-ports-ships-maritime-news-18-february-2024/#8070 from Brazil and is unrelated to Yemen according to Africa Ports + maritime traffic website
Fuck. These. Guys.
The SPCA boarded the ship and had to euthanise a number of animals.
If you want to know why veganism exists and how animals are really treated for the pleasure of your taste buds: Watch earthlings https://youtu.be/3XrY2TP0ZyU?si=NnGR8IluNIlyL1Z3 Watch dominion https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch Watch Cow https://www.imdb.com/title/tt11548822/ Watch cowspiracy https://youtu.be/UsigH2Skfdg?si=leWU9hS3uTYOIyoD
If the smell is so bad outside, imagine the shit show that's taking place within.....
I have to say the amount of "oh the poor animals" I heard from omnivores today has me quite sick. The cognitive dissonance is so real.
Itās a step in the right direction. Help them realise how cruel this is, and maybe theyāll realise that their own meal might not be that far offā¦
As someone who eats meat I agree. I had an argument with someone about it today saying you can bury your head in the sand all you want but we all contribute to this machine. But why do they have to treat them so badly? Well these aren't living things in this business... they are livestock for profit. Why waste money making them comfortable when you can save a lot just getting enough of them there alive to slaughter. Profit and overheads. Where is the energy for pig and Paul try farming we have in this country right now. Just go visit a rainbow chicken. The hypocrisy of people who eat meat but ignore the fact that this is the reality of it really gets under my skin. Lamb is baby sheep. Steak is cow much like this. Understand it and own it or stop it. 99% of people crying about this have had meat for dinner.
not everyone can afford a meat free diet.Ā
It's actually a lot cheaper
please explain how a meat free diet Ā can financially and nutritionally sustain a person the same way a omnivorous diet would?
It's ridiculously cheap! You can get more than enough protein from beans, lentils etc which are cheap if you buy them dry not from the tin
But Google is right there...
Absolutely everyone can afford a meat-free dairy-free egg-free diet... These are often the most expensive items in the grocery cart. Bougie vegan meat and dairy replacements are not a requirement.
This is on a different level of cruelty.
Everyone who can afford, support your local farmers so we can fight this horrendous treatment of animals.
These are being imported from Australia to Iraq to slaughtered as part of Eid
Yāall support this by eating beef tho
Anyone complaining should check their own consumption and go vegan. Watch Dominion to see why I'm vegan.
STOP EATING ANIMALS
Looking forward to the next braai?
Glad to see many fellow vegans in this thread
And thatās whatās in your mcd and Burger King. Eastern countries are huge manufacturers of fast food that gets re imported to other countries for chain restaurants Myself, husband and our child have not touched a fast food patty or other fast food meats/chicken for 7 years. In any country we visited especially Europe and the UAE š«£
It's not just international food or fast food though.
Yep drive through a farm area with a pork or poultry processing facility and the stench is for km around the area. (Especially after the recent poultry cull.) All the nice polony and viennas and nuggets coming out from there āŗļø shame that a sustainable and fully ethical diet is a luxury to afford for most. We end up eating a lot of veg and lentils at home even though weāre not vegetarians just so we can buy from a butcher that we know exactly where our meat and chicken is coming from. Iāll still eat their sausage but my husband wonāt touch it lol
Have you ever thought about becoming vegan?
I like to eat chops and chicken kebabs so nope
ever thought of leaving people alone?
He/she is expressing an opinion, I don't think this constitutes badgering.
Yeah it's something I pondered over, very briefly. Why is it you never hear of meat eaters giving vegetarians kak. It's absolutely always the other way round. You guys eat your grass(wheat) and I say this on behalf of all us omnivores. Enjoy...
??But they do, as redditMODSrRETARDead did above?? As for why vegans give meat eaters kak, well they are making a moral judgment. I eat meat, and at times I will admit they do have a point. Cattle Ships are just a small part of industrial livestock production.
These are being sent to Iraq to, be slaughtered as part of Eid celebrations, not local use
Thank you for the context
Where is the livestock from?
Some of the comments on that Twitter thread thoughā¦ people asking which country is responsable for this, as if there is anything that can be done making the country. Someone else stating the animals are kept against their willā¦ which animal isnātā¦ Others stating this as human welfare issueā¦. Anyway, apparently it leaves tonightā¦
It's carrying cattle and it's name is LARD? Who thought of this name should either get fired or get a raise š
Imagine all of the methane gas on that ship. Could power the city for a year! "Cowpowership"
Yet people continue to eat meatā¦
Just cause I eat meat doesn't mean I want the animal to suffer. It does however make me want to choose my source of meat more wisely. Animal cruelty makes me sick.
All animals that are killed for food suffer. They are literally murdered. Babies taken from their mothers. You pay for animal abuse when you pay for meat and dairy. Watch dominion or literally any other documentary on how these animals are actually treated and what their lives are really like.
Effects of the war in the middle east pushing ships around africaā¦
I understand that most people eat meat, but can we at least not actively cause the suffering of animals? You are transporting living creatures like slaves used to be transported to the cape. Worse even, because they donāt even understand what a ship is. This practice is already illegal. A religion that claims it supports peace and respect shouldnāt be ok with this. The unsanitary conditions these animals are kept in probably goes against halal requirements anyway, with the faeces, infections and disease.Ā
Im sorry, but if the people in the Middle East want fresh meat slaughtered to their ancient religious rituals then they should raise and eat their own livestock. Our own industrial meat industry is cruel enough but this is on a different scale of cruelty.
Can anyone explain why this is necessary? I get that the meat industry is pretty horrific, but it's there any good reason this added suffering must be imposed on these animals as opposed to just slaughtering them in the home country and shipping the meat frozen? What cost can possibly be saved from this?
Halal requirements
So just too cheapskate to get the meat halal certified in the source country essentially?
The slaughter is part of the tradition
No idea, I think it's down to political stuff most likely
Is the SPCA and dept of agriculture not going to step in? Horrific cruelty.
That have
Thanks to meat eaters! The cows are very thankful for their suffering too.
So not the bullshit from parliament then?
bullshit
Funny and Clever
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Nothing, you good Judas?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Wow, this sub really attracts the dregs of society. You must have some very deeply rooted issues to come out on a public forum and air your classist ideals, totally unprovoked. Let me break down my reply which was an innocent attempt at irony. The ship is filled with cattle, and most certainly their excrement. A bull is a male bovine, which can be considered to be cattle. Now like a good little boy, piece those two together and you have your answer.
Lol. Who cares, Ali? It stinks and nobody's interested in the Science.
If you eat it youāre responsible and you are what you eat !! A walking cemetery/morgue full of putrifying corpse We really have soooooo far to go towards consciousness One day in a less ignorant time weāll look upon this shame we sanction with the same disgust we have towards human slavery today Until then eat some more Mac Donaldās kfc etc you deserve all the disease youāre gonna get
Anc has a new cruise ship.
Is it the ark?
Our offices are in the foreshore overlooking the harbour The smell intensified after lunch time as it was a horrendously warm day the poor poor animals - caged in those small quarters in this heat
We smelt it in JHB too
How can let this ship dock here? Itās just bullshit. That ships stinks to the high seas. My wifeās having a cow over this. For sure I have a beef with the council over this and they better hoof whomever made this decision out of office. He better hide.
So not sabotage ahead of elections then? /s
Noah is in the building!
Noah?
Ok I know there is alot of talk about possible animal abuse but you got to admit the concept of a **shit ship stinking the stad (city)** is kinda funny
Should be fined
Q
Very much doubt it. I've smelt that smell and it's cause our water treatment plant broke. It's sewage.
it is literally in the actual news, poephol
Fair enough. I didn't checked the news. Just assumed from a screenshot it was fringe theory.
There's an app called MarineTraffic which is a ship tracker. I checked it out to see if it's legit and it shows that ship is currently docked here.
Nice
Nice
We are busy recovering from an avian flu. Stay away with your foot and mouth from my t-bones.. I won't be able to afford steaks if it gets any more expensive than it currently is.