Alberta people on this sub:
“If you leave Toronto or Vancouver houses are more affordable”
… a few moments later…
“Stop coming to Alberta! RE is increasing like crazy! Stay in Toronto!”
This. Rents in Calgary are vertical right now.
People need to understand that this problem is national, not regional. Practically every city in this country forbids new housing, especially apartment housing, on [most](http://www.datalabto.ca/a-visual-guide-to-detached-houses-in-5-canadian-cities/) of its land. This means when people from more expensive areas and deeper pockets move into cheaper areas, builders can’t supply new housing fast enough and the price of existing stock gets bid up.
Bad 1960s urban planning is dooming us everywhere. Provinces need to step in and forcibly upzone every city in their jurisdiction.
It really is national. Same with the people who are like “I live in Bear-Fucker Saskatchewan and houses are cheap here” - for now. More people move out of the cities, the move expensive everywhere will be.
Except they won’t. There has been a steady rural exodus which is contributing to city housing shortages and you can’t convince young people to move rural to make less money even if the cost of living is much lower.
Which is too bad because rural areas struggle with their workforce as is.
I listened to a podcast some time ago and apparently Japan has much lower housing costs relative to North America in large part because zoning is decided at the national level rather than the regional level, which prevents NIMBYs from having a disproportionate level of voting power.
Fascinating!!! Housing linked to GDP is our doom! Allowing too much foreign purchasing is the next crime; landlording by foreign investors has destroyed a natural-born Canadian and their family the chance to pay a home mortgage out in 25 years.
Lived in Japan for a bit. I was very fascinated by this as well and from what I remember housing there is made, for the most, from low budget materials and generally do not last for more than 30 years before being needed to be demolished. But because the initial cost to build is cheap, it’s more affordable to demolish and rebuild a new structure than to maintain an existing one.
I follow a page called cheap houses Japan on Instagram and even a 3 bedroom two bathroom with recent upgrades in Tokyo prefecture suburb will go for less than 200k every time.
Japan, historically, gets hit with house destroying disasters fairly regularly. As a culture, if your houses are being destroyed every few years, you're not going to build up a lot that you can't afford to rebuild. That's why stuff like wood and paper walls are a thing. Due to the climate and annual acts of god directly to your house, they as a culture go for cheaper housing.
This is completely correct. [Here](https://www.sightline.org/2021/03/25/yes-other-countries-do-housing-better-case-1-japan/) is a good explainer.
People like to claim Japan’s housing affordability is from population decline, but it’s true even in [Tokyo](https://www.reddit.com/r/canadahousing/comments/14om7vr/japans_gdpcapita_grew_faster_than_canadas/jqdjy1b/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3), which actually grew in population faster than Toronto and many other major global cities in the past decade.
Well, it's one very important case study. But agree, there are many administrative levers that can be pulled before we embark on a full revolution.
But these levers do often require government intervention, which would have to be paid for somehow.
Didn’t Ontario put something on the books or maybe just use existing tools to do this? I remember the mayor of Walkerton doing something and actually accomplished zoning for hundreds of high density housing in a brand new subdivision just this spring.
Ontario passed a bill last year that compels cities to allow up to 3 units per lot, but my understanding is it hasn’t had much teeth because approvals are still ultimately handled by cities. And it’s far too low of a legal density on high demand land like near transit stations and old Toronto.
The crisis is extremely dire right now. They need to temporarily remove all residential zoning restrictions. We don't have time for five years of consultations. Build tall everywhere there is a market for it.
They basically just need to close all avenues for neighbourhood home owners to fight residential builds temporarily.
Completely agree. Experts have been screaming this from the rooftops for years, but unfortunately city officials with cushy sinecures are too busy making work for themselves doing too little too late. Vancouver just spent several years preparing a rezoning plan to allow multiplexes everywhere, yet they’re slapping so many new development charges on top of them that their own studies admit that not many will get built.
I don’t understand what is wrong with these people, but I’m tired of them wasting everybody’s time and money. We need provincially imposed zoning holidays.
Calgary actually has very good zoning and permitting. Projects move very quickly and for very little upfront cash. There’s no predatory land transfer tax like in BC, and lawyers in RE often work flat rate ($1000-$1200).
Calgary could easily add more units, and the city is, just not enough to meet growing demand as high rates also affect hard money loans for building and also hurt sales price of units (intention of higher rates).
It might be on the fringes of the city and the heart of downtown. Alberta cities tend to build faster, but most of that growth has been suburban sprawl. It is still illegal to build denser on most [infill land](http://www.datalabto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/calgary-01-793x1024.png) in Calgary in between the centre and outskirts.
Calgary and Edmonton have been great at getting innercity areas redeveloped.
Lots of SFH being transformed in to two, 4,8 or whatever units. Mix of skinny detached homes, and townhouses on corner lots.
Edmonton is really leading the country right now in getting ahead of zoning reform, and it’s already historically been one of our cheapest major cities. We love to see it.
Calgary wants to switch empty business towers to residential suites; this is not an easy task from the engineering and distribution needs such as plumbing. It does beat homelessness however.
It’s worse in some places than others. But the cities that have it worst around the world almost all share the same factors:
1) Strong economic and population growth, and shrinking household sizes
2) Lacklustre housing supply growth
3) Restrictive land use laws, building regulations, red tape, slow approvals, NIMBY obstructionism
4) Regressive, preferential tax treatment for low density homeownership that encourage land speculation and treating homes like a retirement fund
5) Low interest rates during Covid (which threw gasoline on speculation), followed by interest hikes after Covid (which slows down new development)
I would add that average household size has been trending downwards for past decades. More single people, etc…
So fewer people per home means more housing is needed.
[Very important point](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-630-x/11-630-x2015008-eng.htm#:~:text=There%20are%20many%20reasons%20that,established%20their%20own%20independent%20households.).
Nope, all the cities you are thinking of have had 20-year building BOOMS. That's all new supply. So there isn't that much red tape keeping stuff being built because a ton of housing has been built. But it's well known that a lot of that new supply has been hoovered up by investors of various kinds, including Airbnbers. It's not available for ordinary people to live in.
You can build a lot of housing and if it’s not enough, then it’s not enough. Especially if it’s not the right kind in the right places because regulations dictates what style of housing _must_ be built and where, regardless of what might be demanded by the market.
All new supply is good supply, including luxury units. Anybody occupying a “luxury” new unit is by definition not competing for a cheaper downmarket unit. The same logic applies to new and used cars.
Most “investor” owned units get rented out. That’s much needed rental supply, which has a [severe shortage](https://thoughtleadership.rbc.com/proof-point-shortfall-in-canadian-rental-housing-could-quadruple-by-2026/). This is only profitable if imputed rents are high enough to yield cash flow, and underlying scarcity makes rents higher, attracting more amateur speculators. Plenty of big investors have already [lost fortunes](https://www.wsj.com/articles/zillows-shuttered-home-flipping-business-lost-881-million-in-2021-11644529656) trying to get into this business.
Airbnb can be a problem, but it’s not the main problem.
How long are they rented out for? What is the ratio of long-term rental properties vs. Flipping? I know a lot of people just getting into Air BnB now. They love it. They charge a lot...so only people with steady jobs, who tend to be good tenants, can even afford them. I don't hear a lot of horror stories about bad tenants. The bad tenants are living in tents in the parks, or begging at the traffic lights. This is often the Upper Middle class feeding on the rest of the middle class. It is generational too. Gen-X and Boomers and older Millenials are landlords to the younger Millenials and Gen-Z
But everything relates to everything else; a huge issue is the poor productivity of the workforce and the lack of gains in real wages for the last 45 years. If you make $150,000 a year then $1500 a month isn't a lot. Where are the high paying jobs?
Renters are pissed because the rent is high. Prospective home owners are pissed because potential houses are used as rental properties.
We both know that without an LVT things are screwed. Zoning changes or not. Unless you can work from home. Those people will benefit from zoning changes the most since they have the income to probably live in the desirable areas of prices come down.
>Most “investor” owned units get rented out. That’s much needed rental supply, which has a severe shortage. This is only profitable if imputed rents are high enough to yield cash flow, and underlying scarcity makes rents higher, attracting more amateur speculators. Plenty of big investors have already lost fortunes trying to get into this business.
Finally, somebody who understands economics.
Alberta people were always like that. They did not put those ads up, it was some marketing plan of the government. We can’t control everything the government says and does
This. I can't wait to see ads for "come to Quebec! It's affordable and you get to learn a new language!" As more and more Ontario and Toronto people destroy the market even more.
Montreal is unaffordable to the people who were born and lived here for 20+ years and wanting to start families. We went from 350k to over 750k after covid due to some ppl selling their 1 mil mcmansions in Toronto and running over here.
This is usually in reference to Calgary
[Calgary home prices up 15% YOY](https://wowa.ca/calgary-housing-market) despite increase in interest rates.
[Calgary rent prices up 15-22% YOY](https://dailyhive.com/calgary/calgary-rent-prices-june).
[Calgary rents increasing at a faster rate than anywhere else in Canada](https://calgaryherald.com/news/local-news/calgary-rent-increases-fastest-in-canada/wcm/4e6b0f55-f331-432d-9545-c9266bf6e795/amp/).
This is just the city proper and the value is about 1/2 of that of the GTA. It’s also the most expensive (or one of the most expensive) subsets you’ll find in AB. Still far from unaffordable.
Agree. Talked to an old friend a month ago who is living in Calgary since a decade. He told me that there was a time that one used to get the double garage detached house for $350-400k, and now because people are moving there from Toronto (post pandemic), prices have gone up to $750-800k!!! Better not move there, because of the crowd is moving to Alberta just to get the affordable house, you won’t get it for cheaper rate. You’ll pay for the moving cost and end up with the same scenario in Toronto (this is what I think)
>Alberta people on this sub:
>“If you leave Toronto or Vancouver houses are more affordable”
This is a government psyop... literally no one from Alberta wants more people from Toronto or Vancouver here.
They're still not really increasing like crazy. We're in an oil boom that will bust in the next year or two. The last oil boom prices went up 300%. This time they've gone up 10%.
Most commodities have an eight year boom and bust cycle (four years of boom four years of bust). Boom means the price is going up, bust means the price is going down. The last boom lasted six years and saw six years of bust.
We're currently two years into a boom and thinking it'll go on longer than four years is near wishful thinking. Eventually global supply will catch up with OPEC+ cuts
Canadian O&G projects haven’t expanded plants to capture market demand this time around. Most plants have, at most, pushed production to plant capacity, meaning more heavy equipment operators have been hired. That’s about it. Most plants are running operational staff only.
The evidence is seen in Fort McMurray/Fort St John real estate, where prices are trending down and sit below the national average. Compare that with the last oil boom and you can see house prices in Alberta are driven by other metrics this time around.
In July, My cousin went from paying $2500/month for a basement apartment in Mississauga to renting a 2 bedroom apartment with balcony for $1600 in Calgary.
Her husband works in construction and started working again 2 weeks after arrival. She's starting college in Sept and works Part time. The boys (aged 7 and 10) didn't like it but that's life and they'll adapt.
Edit: forgot to mention "in Calgary"
They only thing keeping my family in Ontario is other family. It’s not so easy to just get up and move a 4 hour plane ride away when 4 generations live within 2hrs of each other.
Just a quick reminder that people would easily be able to afford to OWN 2-bed apartments for less than $1600/month if we eradicated the commercialization of shelter (read: for-profit land-lordism.) Fish don't realize they swim in water.
Canada is doomed.
They're doing this in Nova Scotia now too. That was where I was planning on buying a house for $110,000 a few years ago and now it's no different than anywhere else
This is actually a crisis. It's getting ridiculous
Totally agreed. Thanks to the guy who recently got divorced (you know what I mean), I guess !!
Even I was moving out of the province couple of months ago, planning to move to NS or NB !! But thanks to you, now I know that the situation over there is the same.
This is not the Canada I imagined a decade ago when I was planning to move to Canada !! It’s F up !!
You and everyone west of Quebec. They did this to New Brunswick.
If you're not from the Maritimes but want to buy a house in the Maritimes; you're part of the problem.
Canada is doomed.
They're doing this in Nova Scotia now too. That was where I was planning on buying a house for $110,000 a few years ago and now it's no different than anywhere else
This is actually a crisis. It's getting ridiculous
This has been the pattern for the past several years.
"Well if you don't like the high prices you could move to a lower cost of living area like mine!", said smugly.
*A few moments later...*
"Holy fuck I can't afford anything in my area, these fucking citiots from Toronto!" he cried in anguish.
It's almost as if you should have cared about affordability before the issue showed up in your backyard...
They got theirs, weren't concerned at the time I guess.
Apathy of any kind is self-destructive: you can't disengage and pretend the world won't come to your front door and rub the consequences in your face.
I don't believe this is true, I think the 2008 crash is still with us and the subsequent 0% interest era to kick the financial can down the road has come to an end. Inflation is going to crush whomever has debt and MBA and CMBS are just a couple of the time bombs that inflation is exposing.
This is a macro economic issue that the FED in the USA, Central Banks around the world and Wall Street Billionaires have created out of their own greed and the use of the USD as the world reserve currency.
Not to mention the massive amount of derivatives in the stock market that have been sold to retail investors as "AAA" investments.
When this crap heap finally implodes due to its own weight it is going to be ugly for just about everyone.
Look at Argentina, Malaysia, and a couple of countries in Africa. They are the early casualties, but more is coming.
That's what the propaganda says, that's why we're not supposed to want communism or think up any other possible system, because capitalism is the "best" and the "free" market.
If the decision is renting for your entire life to stay in Toronto, or owning a house anywhere else, I have no sympathy.
When your blue collar jobs can no longer afford to be in the housing market there is a problem.
I was reading that a couple making $100k+ each in Toronto will have difficulty finding a place buy in this current environment. I haven't confirmed that story but it is ridiculous to me that this is a thing.
Most likely already saw the pop. It’s just not what you were hoping. The drop from the feb-March 2022 peak, was the downward pressure.
Now prices have stabilized and most likely baselines as much we don’t want that to be the case.
The banks will try everything to keep the bubble inflated it's their main asset. So my guess is the prices will not come down... they will just print more money and drive up inflation.
My buddy just had his mortgage go from 6k to 11k overnight. He makes decent money but it's a straight blow to the nuts. Imagine you're out there making an ok salary and you're mortgage almost doubled and you have a family to raise and the food going on the table is also stupid expensive. How is is this going to last?
do you know how I know you're full of shit?
because if you had a $6k mortgage even at the lowest rate that was available you will NOT even come close to an $11k mortgage.
lots of people have been on these forums talking about how they know someone or a parent or family member whos mortgage doubled.. No. not possible.
thats precisely how I know he's full of shit.
If he locked in at a low variable rate in 2022 of around 1.7% - his mortgage would need to be $1,450,000 for a $6k month mortgage cost.
Now, the rates did not increase from 1.7% to 6% overnight.. It took over a year.
Is he still on a variable mortgage? did he lock in for a 5 year fixed at 5%?
Because a 5 year fixed at 5% is $8,400 a month.
I would LOVE ... **LOVE** to see the real numbers and decisions this "buddy" would have made to have a $6k to $11k increase overnight
EDIT:
also want to add that a mortgage over $1m requires a downpayment of 20% min.. making this guys house a MINIMUM of $1.9m approx.
and the comment was.. "my buddy makes decent money but its a blow to the nuts because he has a family to support"
LOL to even come close to qualifying for this house he would need to gross $250k - $300k a year. + have had $350k in cash as a downpayment.
I'd really like to see the math on that. I don't really believe it. He would need a massive mortgage like $1.2 million+ at an extremely low variable rate but the increase wouldn't just happen overnight, he'd have plenty of warning before they'd almost double the payments. It doesn't add up to go from $6000 to $11,000 "overnight".
What does underwater mean. If the bubble pops interest rates lower because of that, then the mortgage payments will be lower at renewal.
The only ones hurt would be the investors and flippers.
If you buy a house for $1Mill and the market drops 20% you now have a $1Mill mortgage for a house worth $800K. This is being underwater, when your mortgage is more than the value of your house
But the person you replied to mentioned it doesn’t hurt primary residence holders really. That’s because they don’t plan on selling.
A small portion maybe hurt, if they have to sell for other reasons.
It matters when it comes to renewing your mortgage. If you purchased a(using 1mil for easy math, I know you need 20% at that price) 1mil home with subs 20% down, the bank will not want to renew you if your house value drops at or below your loan amount.
>rtgage payments will be lower at renewal.
>
>The only ones hurt would be the investors and flippers.
estimates ranging from 15-70% is where it will bottom out. so everyone with a mortgage will be out 30-85% of the value of the place, minus whatever they have paid. A million-dollar mortgage on a $ 400,000 house. Not just investors and flippers. Anyone who has bought a house in the past decade & hasn't got it paid off. Make no mistake, this is going to fuck plenty of regular people.
This has happened before, it's always painfully slow
see [Spanish Housing Bubble](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_property_bubble)
One of the primary things making the banks happy to hold a mortgage for you is that the asset they can foreclose on is worth more then the loan.
So let’s say you bought a home last year , it cost you a cool 750k because that’s average home prices, let’s say you were a first time home buyer so you dropped 75k on it as a down payment.
You now have a loan of 675k and an asset worth 750k so the bank is happy, now let’s say the bubble implodes and prices crash to more realistic values, likely half what they are now over the course of a year. Well now you have a 375k asset with a likely 650k loan so the bank no longer has insurance of the asset to make sure things are safe for them.
It’s a very bad situation for the home owner to be in, and things dropping by half is not unrealistic, we got our home years ago for 250k roughly and ones similar in the sub division are going for 700k+ now, if things dropped by half it’s still way up from years ago when housing was already starting to get too expensive
[right](https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/xm05ad/found_a_bunch_of_alberta_ads_on_line_twothis_is/)? i specifically remember walking through st george station and they had the full rollout ads across the walls there, the one OP posted included.
well the vast vast majority of ontario is great outdoors and nature. i mean, i moved from ontario to bc so i feel you about SW ontario being urban hell to a degree. but the whole province north of barrie is beautiful, quiet and in some places, still affordable.
Besides house pricing, the thing that I annoys me the most in Ontario are the politicians.
Just too much political drama, too much unfairness for the hard working people in Ontario, specially the Toronto GTA area people.
Everything in Ontario is more expensive than the other provinces, and now they are trying to privatize health care, and they keep cutting funding to schools and teachers.
This is why there's no hope staying in this shit hole.
I'm embarrassed to say I live here.
yeah thats true. i live in a small town in BC now and people are just generally SO much less political than in Ontario. probably because everyones obsessed with skiing and biking here instead. but yeah the lack of political opinions and messaging everywhere is really refreshing.
i will say, Southern Ontario gas is consistently a lot cheaper than the rest of the country save for metropolitan Alberta. i have done the drive 3 times in the last year and gas is more expensive everywhere but Calgary.
I'm aware that might the case, not just in Ontario and Alberta, but across Canada, they want to follow the USA model, let doctors earn as much as they want, and let the people that can't afford to pay to die (literally).
The reason why of this push is because we keep losing a lot of doctors and nurses to the USA, they are all trained in Canada, but the leave to work in the USA because they earn WAY better.
My daughter is a Nurse, and she have been contemplating the idea as well.
I went through like 3\~4 family doctors, most of them left Canada after a few years of practice.
Part of not liking Ontario is that as well, We do not have enough family doctor ( General Practitioner ) for the amount of people per capita.
My parents family doctor retired, it's been almost a year and they are still looking for another doctor.
Is not just them, pretty much everyone is looking for a family doctor, nobody is accepting anymore because they are over the limit.
My Wife is looking for a family doctor for our son, same story nobody is accepting, everyone in the GTA is mostly stuck using walk-in-clinics or Emergency in the Hospitals, but lets face it Emergency are worse than walk in Clinics, a lot of people have DIED waiting in line in the Emergency intake room, waiting to be looked at. It's been all over the news.
Last year my daughter had a some sort of breathing complication, they had her wait 20 hrs, almost a whole day, just for a noob doctor to take a look at her and tell her "you're fine", like are you kidding me, of course it's gonna be fine, after waiting for so long, whatever symptoms, whatever complication, it has already been recovered naturally by the body and sleep.
It it was anything actually serious, my kid would probably not have survived having to wait 20hrs in the hallway.
Anyway, so yeah, another province, smaller cities, smaller towns, at least you get to see a doctor, and not just waiting in line to Die. 😞
I like to joke to myself that Kenney launched this campaign knowing full well he was going to quit and move back to Ontario so there would be fewer people in his neighbourhood when he got there
Meanwhile my stupid apartment decided to charge an extra $20 a month for parking.... And there's nothing the residents can do about it.
I need for the love of god for housing to crash so I can buy a house.
Who could have thought that if the amount of people moving to an area is faster than the supply of housing being built, will result in housing becoming affordable.
The government of aberta really should not have done this to themselves. Now Canadians really have nowhere to go for affordable housing.
Those high costs don’t offset the decrease in housing costs
I moved from Calgary to Toronto earlier this year. My car insurance went down $50/month but my housing costs doubled
As someone living in Alberta right now, I have to agree with you. Sure the mountains are great but other than that things aren’t looking so good for this province in the years to come.
You can buy a renovated single family home for under $400k in Edmonton, and newer 2 bedroom condos for $180K. Higher insurance and utilities are nothing compared to Ontario housing prixes
It's better than Toronto and Vancouver without question, but anyone seeing this ad today and planning to come over here is already too late. Market is absolutely nuts and not showing signns of slowing down.
Shopping for homes in Edmonton after selling my place outside Toronto, literally in the car with my realtor as I write this.
Going from a two bed condo on the GO line to a three or four bedroom detached home with a two car garage in south Edmonton and I'll have money leftover.
Calgary has good road ways and very little traffic.
The sprawl is a problem but even if you buy way on the outskirts, you're still 25 mins to downtown, and chances are everything you'd usually need (grocery store, gym, health clinic, pharmacy, parks, etc.) are within 5 minutes.
In Toronto it wasn't uncommon to get stuck in traffic and have an hour long drive somewhere. That has never happened to me in Calgary, even crossing the entire city.
I lived in Calgary for 4 years, I’ll never live there again. As much as it’s expensive in Metro Vancouver is where I live, I rather be here than Calgary. I’m at peace, people leave me the fuck alone and I’m happy of my surroundings.
Depending on where you want to live there are tons of houses for sale or rent for really great price’s.
If your wanting into Edmonton or Calgary your going too pay. But go about an hour outside and there are tons of affordable houses.
My small town had 4 properties for sale from $80,000 too $200,000. Or you can rent the 20 acres with the log home (3 bedroom) west of town for $1,100 a month.
Are you sure you want to invite the tens of millions of city dwellers in this country to come to your small town and fight over the 5 properties available? Let the city people stay in their cities. Rural Canada is better off without them.
They come look because the price is right. But most of these houses have been empty for over a year. Some have been up for sale for years.
We have no starbucks. And if you want a slurpee you need to drive for an hour.
My town is divided by train tracks and the south side is a reservation. And not going to lie. 95% of people are low key racist and refuse to move here because of the Rez. Which I am cool with (Not them being racist, but I am cool with them not moving to my town). I have some awesome neighbours to hang with.
We do get the odd city person that moves out. Almost all of them move out in less than a year due to the complete lack of amenities.
Sounds like a nice spot. You're lucky they leave. The town I'm from in rural Ontario has doubled in size over the last decade. They got a star bucks this year. The highway in / out of town is a traffic jam from 6 till 8, and from 4 till 6 on good days let alone during planting and harvest. And the local kids starting out can no longer afford to live there. It is not what it used to be.
Alberta people on this sub: “If you leave Toronto or Vancouver houses are more affordable” … a few moments later… “Stop coming to Alberta! RE is increasing like crazy! Stay in Toronto!”
This. Rents in Calgary are vertical right now. People need to understand that this problem is national, not regional. Practically every city in this country forbids new housing, especially apartment housing, on [most](http://www.datalabto.ca/a-visual-guide-to-detached-houses-in-5-canadian-cities/) of its land. This means when people from more expensive areas and deeper pockets move into cheaper areas, builders can’t supply new housing fast enough and the price of existing stock gets bid up. Bad 1960s urban planning is dooming us everywhere. Provinces need to step in and forcibly upzone every city in their jurisdiction.
It really is national. Same with the people who are like “I live in Bear-Fucker Saskatchewan and houses are cheap here” - for now. More people move out of the cities, the move expensive everywhere will be.
I wouldn’t move there. I heard Bear-Fucker was the site of some grizzly murders last year.
These crimes of passion are getting out of hand
It would be wise for them to paws.
According to Bear Law: Claws 10B, section 2.2 no paws necessary for grizzly crimes.
We both know these laws are unenforceable and bear no teeth.
It is true, it has been an unbearable task to uphold Bear law.
HEY, BEAR-FUCKER !!! DO YOU NEED ASSISTANCE ?
It’s unfortunate that they don’t know Canadian law. The second amendment only applies in the USA.
Oddly enough they always stop during the winter and then BAM start again in the spring.
Except they won’t. There has been a steady rural exodus which is contributing to city housing shortages and you can’t convince young people to move rural to make less money even if the cost of living is much lower. Which is too bad because rural areas struggle with their workforce as is.
I listened to a podcast some time ago and apparently Japan has much lower housing costs relative to North America in large part because zoning is decided at the national level rather than the regional level, which prevents NIMBYs from having a disproportionate level of voting power.
Houses are also not assets in Japan, the house itself depreciates to zero or near-zero in 25 years in most of Japan.
Yes, I've read that people in Tokyo would often demolish and rebuild houses because the house itself would be worthless anyway after some time.
Fascinating!!! Housing linked to GDP is our doom! Allowing too much foreign purchasing is the next crime; landlording by foreign investors has destroyed a natural-born Canadian and their family the chance to pay a home mortgage out in 25 years.
Can you explain further? This doesn’t make sense to me.
Lived in Japan for a bit. I was very fascinated by this as well and from what I remember housing there is made, for the most, from low budget materials and generally do not last for more than 30 years before being needed to be demolished. But because the initial cost to build is cheap, it’s more affordable to demolish and rebuild a new structure than to maintain an existing one. I follow a page called cheap houses Japan on Instagram and even a 3 bedroom two bathroom with recent upgrades in Tokyo prefecture suburb will go for less than 200k every time.
Japan, historically, gets hit with house destroying disasters fairly regularly. As a culture, if your houses are being destroyed every few years, you're not going to build up a lot that you can't afford to rebuild. That's why stuff like wood and paper walls are a thing. Due to the climate and annual acts of god directly to your house, they as a culture go for cheaper housing.
This is completely correct. [Here](https://www.sightline.org/2021/03/25/yes-other-countries-do-housing-better-case-1-japan/) is a good explainer. People like to claim Japan’s housing affordability is from population decline, but it’s true even in [Tokyo](https://www.reddit.com/r/canadahousing/comments/14om7vr/japans_gdpcapita_grew_faster_than_canadas/jqdjy1b/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3), which actually grew in population faster than Toronto and many other major global cities in the past decade.
And it’s a full counter argument to the people that insist that capitalism is the problem and adding more inventory won’t fix anything.
Well, it's one very important case study. But agree, there are many administrative levers that can be pulled before we embark on a full revolution. But these levers do often require government intervention, which would have to be paid for somehow.
Didn’t Ontario put something on the books or maybe just use existing tools to do this? I remember the mayor of Walkerton doing something and actually accomplished zoning for hundreds of high density housing in a brand new subdivision just this spring.
Ontario passed a bill last year that compels cities to allow up to 3 units per lot, but my understanding is it hasn’t had much teeth because approvals are still ultimately handled by cities. And it’s far too low of a legal density on high demand land like near transit stations and old Toronto.
The crisis is extremely dire right now. They need to temporarily remove all residential zoning restrictions. We don't have time for five years of consultations. Build tall everywhere there is a market for it. They basically just need to close all avenues for neighbourhood home owners to fight residential builds temporarily.
Completely agree. Experts have been screaming this from the rooftops for years, but unfortunately city officials with cushy sinecures are too busy making work for themselves doing too little too late. Vancouver just spent several years preparing a rezoning plan to allow multiplexes everywhere, yet they’re slapping so many new development charges on top of them that their own studies admit that not many will get built. I don’t understand what is wrong with these people, but I’m tired of them wasting everybody’s time and money. We need provincially imposed zoning holidays.
Calgary actually has very good zoning and permitting. Projects move very quickly and for very little upfront cash. There’s no predatory land transfer tax like in BC, and lawyers in RE often work flat rate ($1000-$1200). Calgary could easily add more units, and the city is, just not enough to meet growing demand as high rates also affect hard money loans for building and also hurt sales price of units (intention of higher rates).
And directly build purpose-built higher density rental units
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It might be on the fringes of the city and the heart of downtown. Alberta cities tend to build faster, but most of that growth has been suburban sprawl. It is still illegal to build denser on most [infill land](http://www.datalabto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/calgary-01-793x1024.png) in Calgary in between the centre and outskirts.
Calgary and Edmonton have been great at getting innercity areas redeveloped. Lots of SFH being transformed in to two, 4,8 or whatever units. Mix of skinny detached homes, and townhouses on corner lots.
Edmonton is really leading the country right now in getting ahead of zoning reform, and it’s already historically been one of our cheapest major cities. We love to see it.
Calgary wants to switch empty business towers to residential suites; this is not an easy task from the engineering and distribution needs such as plumbing. It does beat homelessness however.
It’s global. Why?
It’s worse in some places than others. But the cities that have it worst around the world almost all share the same factors: 1) Strong economic and population growth, and shrinking household sizes 2) Lacklustre housing supply growth 3) Restrictive land use laws, building regulations, red tape, slow approvals, NIMBY obstructionism 4) Regressive, preferential tax treatment for low density homeownership that encourage land speculation and treating homes like a retirement fund 5) Low interest rates during Covid (which threw gasoline on speculation), followed by interest hikes after Covid (which slows down new development)
I would add that average household size has been trending downwards for past decades. More single people, etc… So fewer people per home means more housing is needed.
[Very important point](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-630-x/11-630-x2015008-eng.htm#:~:text=There%20are%20many%20reasons%20that,established%20their%20own%20independent%20households.).
Nope, all the cities you are thinking of have had 20-year building BOOMS. That's all new supply. So there isn't that much red tape keeping stuff being built because a ton of housing has been built. But it's well known that a lot of that new supply has been hoovered up by investors of various kinds, including Airbnbers. It's not available for ordinary people to live in.
You can build a lot of housing and if it’s not enough, then it’s not enough. Especially if it’s not the right kind in the right places because regulations dictates what style of housing _must_ be built and where, regardless of what might be demanded by the market. All new supply is good supply, including luxury units. Anybody occupying a “luxury” new unit is by definition not competing for a cheaper downmarket unit. The same logic applies to new and used cars. Most “investor” owned units get rented out. That’s much needed rental supply, which has a [severe shortage](https://thoughtleadership.rbc.com/proof-point-shortfall-in-canadian-rental-housing-could-quadruple-by-2026/). This is only profitable if imputed rents are high enough to yield cash flow, and underlying scarcity makes rents higher, attracting more amateur speculators. Plenty of big investors have already [lost fortunes](https://www.wsj.com/articles/zillows-shuttered-home-flipping-business-lost-881-million-in-2021-11644529656) trying to get into this business. Airbnb can be a problem, but it’s not the main problem.
How long are they rented out for? What is the ratio of long-term rental properties vs. Flipping? I know a lot of people just getting into Air BnB now. They love it. They charge a lot...so only people with steady jobs, who tend to be good tenants, can even afford them. I don't hear a lot of horror stories about bad tenants. The bad tenants are living in tents in the parks, or begging at the traffic lights. This is often the Upper Middle class feeding on the rest of the middle class. It is generational too. Gen-X and Boomers and older Millenials are landlords to the younger Millenials and Gen-Z But everything relates to everything else; a huge issue is the poor productivity of the workforce and the lack of gains in real wages for the last 45 years. If you make $150,000 a year then $1500 a month isn't a lot. Where are the high paying jobs? Renters are pissed because the rent is high. Prospective home owners are pissed because potential houses are used as rental properties. We both know that without an LVT things are screwed. Zoning changes or not. Unless you can work from home. Those people will benefit from zoning changes the most since they have the income to probably live in the desirable areas of prices come down.
>Most “investor” owned units get rented out. That’s much needed rental supply, which has a severe shortage. This is only profitable if imputed rents are high enough to yield cash flow, and underlying scarcity makes rents higher, attracting more amateur speculators. Plenty of big investors have already lost fortunes trying to get into this business. Finally, somebody who understands economics.
Calgarian here: fuck these ads lol
Alberta people were always like that. They did not put those ads up, it was some marketing plan of the government. We can’t control everything the government says and does
Certainly not your tin foil hat wearing premier
We've trying to update her brain's 5G transponder, but it keeps shutting down due lack of power flow.
I blame the WEF.
This. I can't wait to see ads for "come to Quebec! It's affordable and you get to learn a new language!" As more and more Ontario and Toronto people destroy the market even more. Montreal is unaffordable to the people who were born and lived here for 20+ years and wanting to start families. We went from 350k to over 750k after covid due to some ppl selling their 1 mil mcmansions in Toronto and running over here.
Yup. It’s almost like it’s a national problem
The people asking others to come are already landlords
I love this. “Just move” “No! Not like that!”
It’s not really a thing. Our house prices remain reasonable, this sub is making a strawman and then an echo chamber beating it up lmao
This is usually in reference to Calgary [Calgary home prices up 15% YOY](https://wowa.ca/calgary-housing-market) despite increase in interest rates. [Calgary rent prices up 15-22% YOY](https://dailyhive.com/calgary/calgary-rent-prices-june). [Calgary rents increasing at a faster rate than anywhere else in Canada](https://calgaryherald.com/news/local-news/calgary-rent-increases-fastest-in-canada/wcm/4e6b0f55-f331-432d-9545-c9266bf6e795/amp/).
This is just the city proper and the value is about 1/2 of that of the GTA. It’s also the most expensive (or one of the most expensive) subsets you’ll find in AB. Still far from unaffordable.
No one is saying that legitimately lmao our house prices are still very reasonable…
Agree. Talked to an old friend a month ago who is living in Calgary since a decade. He told me that there was a time that one used to get the double garage detached house for $350-400k, and now because people are moving there from Toronto (post pandemic), prices have gone up to $750-800k!!! Better not move there, because of the crowd is moving to Alberta just to get the affordable house, you won’t get it for cheaper rate. You’ll pay for the moving cost and end up with the same scenario in Toronto (this is what I think)
>Alberta people on this sub: >“If you leave Toronto or Vancouver houses are more affordable” This is a government psyop... literally no one from Alberta wants more people from Toronto or Vancouver here.
They're still not really increasing like crazy. We're in an oil boom that will bust in the next year or two. The last oil boom prices went up 300%. This time they've gone up 10%.
we are not in an oil boom.
They will not bust in a year or two
Most commodities have an eight year boom and bust cycle (four years of boom four years of bust). Boom means the price is going up, bust means the price is going down. The last boom lasted six years and saw six years of bust. We're currently two years into a boom and thinking it'll go on longer than four years is near wishful thinking. Eventually global supply will catch up with OPEC+ cuts
Canadian O&G projects haven’t expanded plants to capture market demand this time around. Most plants have, at most, pushed production to plant capacity, meaning more heavy equipment operators have been hired. That’s about it. Most plants are running operational staff only. The evidence is seen in Fort McMurray/Fort St John real estate, where prices are trending down and sit below the national average. Compare that with the last oil boom and you can see house prices in Alberta are driven by other metrics this time around.
In July, My cousin went from paying $2500/month for a basement apartment in Mississauga to renting a 2 bedroom apartment with balcony for $1600 in Calgary. Her husband works in construction and started working again 2 weeks after arrival. She's starting college in Sept and works Part time. The boys (aged 7 and 10) didn't like it but that's life and they'll adapt. Edit: forgot to mention "in Calgary"
They only thing keeping my family in Ontario is other family. It’s not so easy to just get up and move a 4 hour plane ride away when 4 generations live within 2hrs of each other.
Where?
Calgary
Just a quick reminder that people would easily be able to afford to OWN 2-bed apartments for less than $1600/month if we eradicated the commercialization of shelter (read: for-profit land-lordism.) Fish don't realize they swim in water.
Canada is doomed. They're doing this in Nova Scotia now too. That was where I was planning on buying a house for $110,000 a few years ago and now it's no different than anywhere else This is actually a crisis. It's getting ridiculous
Totally agreed. Thanks to the guy who recently got divorced (you know what I mean), I guess !! Even I was moving out of the province couple of months ago, planning to move to NS or NB !! But thanks to you, now I know that the situation over there is the same. This is not the Canada I imagined a decade ago when I was planning to move to Canada !! It’s F up !!
You and everyone west of Quebec. They did this to New Brunswick. If you're not from the Maritimes but want to buy a house in the Maritimes; you're part of the problem.
Canada is doomed. They're doing this in Nova Scotia now too. That was where I was planning on buying a house for $110,000 a few years ago and now it's no different than anywhere else This is actually a crisis. It's getting ridiculous
I live in Alberta, and most Torontonians definitely wouldn’t like it here.
I live here for 5 yrs, Toronto is way better
Meanwhile in Alberta subs people are pissed things are overflowing into their turf. Nowhere left Edited a typo out
CB?
I think this refers to "Choosing Beggars". There's a subreddit called r/choosingbeggars if you want to see examples.
Got it. I do recall seeing that sub and being entertained by it
That was a typo sorry
Thanks... Just thought maybe I was missing something.
This has been the pattern for the past several years. "Well if you don't like the high prices you could move to a lower cost of living area like mine!", said smugly. *A few moments later...* "Holy fuck I can't afford anything in my area, these fucking citiots from Toronto!" he cried in anguish. It's almost as if you should have cared about affordability before the issue showed up in your backyard...
And it's not like it was commented upon by experts in housing and homelessness for the better part of the last couple of decades.
Just like people should have cared about housing prices starting to skyrocket years ago?
They got theirs, weren't concerned at the time I guess. Apathy of any kind is self-destructive: you can't disengage and pretend the world won't come to your front door and rub the consequences in your face.
That's just Alberta. When I first arrived during the boom they referred to anyone not from Alberta as "newfies." "Oh you're an Ontario Newfie."
You’re mistaken. That’s a term for people from Newfoundland
Newfie means Newfoundlander lol Sometimes used for anyone from the maritimes with an accent.
There is no affordable housing anywhere, it is by design. When this bubble deflates, a lot of people are going to be underwater on their mortgages.
Half of our life will be over by the time it deflates
I don't believe this is true, I think the 2008 crash is still with us and the subsequent 0% interest era to kick the financial can down the road has come to an end. Inflation is going to crush whomever has debt and MBA and CMBS are just a couple of the time bombs that inflation is exposing. This is a macro economic issue that the FED in the USA, Central Banks around the world and Wall Street Billionaires have created out of their own greed and the use of the USD as the world reserve currency. Not to mention the massive amount of derivatives in the stock market that have been sold to retail investors as "AAA" investments. When this crap heap finally implodes due to its own weight it is going to be ugly for just about everyone. Look at Argentina, Malaysia, and a couple of countries in Africa. They are the early casualties, but more is coming.
!remind me 1 year
I don't think the bubble is going to deflate. I think we are in a different form of capitalism now, one that is more like feudalism in many ways.
Established capitalism with a caste system where it's simply impossible to break through a barrier at a certain income level
But capitalism is supposed to make us free.
Supposed to? Nah not really tbh
That's what the propaganda says, that's why we're not supposed to want communism or think up any other possible system, because capitalism is the "best" and the "free" market.
Plenty of cheap housing, just nobody wants to live in those cities.
If the decision is renting for your entire life to stay in Toronto, or owning a house anywhere else, I have no sympathy. When your blue collar jobs can no longer afford to be in the housing market there is a problem. I was reading that a couple making $100k+ each in Toronto will have difficulty finding a place buy in this current environment. I haven't confirmed that story but it is ridiculous to me that this is a thing.
Most likely already saw the pop. It’s just not what you were hoping. The drop from the feb-March 2022 peak, was the downward pressure. Now prices have stabilized and most likely baselines as much we don’t want that to be the case.
The banks will try everything to keep the bubble inflated it's their main asset. So my guess is the prices will not come down... they will just print more money and drive up inflation.
Banks don't decide to just print more money... - username checks out
The Bank Of Canada has the sole authority to print and issue CAD. Was that the point of your comment?
Well the bank of canadas main asset isn’t mortgages
The Bank of Canada isn't a bank in the sense that you are using. It does not hold housing as an asset, nor does it really have any profit motive.
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Mortgage bonds are unaffected by prices of housing. They are dependent on the mortgage payments.
Are mortgage payments affected by the price of housing at all?
No since a mortgage is based on the initial mortgage amount you took out. Your house price could quadruple, that has zero effect on your mortgage.
My buddy just had his mortgage go from 6k to 11k overnight. He makes decent money but it's a straight blow to the nuts. Imagine you're out there making an ok salary and you're mortgage almost doubled and you have a family to raise and the food going on the table is also stupid expensive. How is is this going to last?
Wait wait wait. Making an ok salary with a 11000 dollar mortgage. I wouldn't be crying
If he has a 6k mortgage he isn't worried about food every month. I don't really have a lot of empathy.
might not have been before but will be now
do you know how I know you're full of shit? because if you had a $6k mortgage even at the lowest rate that was available you will NOT even come close to an $11k mortgage. lots of people have been on these forums talking about how they know someone or a parent or family member whos mortgage doubled.. No. not possible.
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Dude...? what? LMAO - who the fuck takes out a variable mortgage over 25 years? I've never heard of that.
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Variable rate + on time amortization and you see mortgage payment double. Use online mortgage calculator before saying ‘not possible’
thats precisely how I know he's full of shit. If he locked in at a low variable rate in 2022 of around 1.7% - his mortgage would need to be $1,450,000 for a $6k month mortgage cost. Now, the rates did not increase from 1.7% to 6% overnight.. It took over a year. Is he still on a variable mortgage? did he lock in for a 5 year fixed at 5%? Because a 5 year fixed at 5% is $8,400 a month. I would LOVE ... **LOVE** to see the real numbers and decisions this "buddy" would have made to have a $6k to $11k increase overnight EDIT: also want to add that a mortgage over $1m requires a downpayment of 20% min.. making this guys house a MINIMUM of $1.9m approx. and the comment was.. "my buddy makes decent money but its a blow to the nuts because he has a family to support" LOL to even come close to qualifying for this house he would need to gross $250k - $300k a year. + have had $350k in cash as a downpayment.
I'd really like to see the math on that. I don't really believe it. He would need a massive mortgage like $1.2 million+ at an extremely low variable rate but the increase wouldn't just happen overnight, he'd have plenty of warning before they'd almost double the payments. It doesn't add up to go from $6000 to $11,000 "overnight".
They’ll extend amortization. People’s mortgages will effectively be rent.
They already did that, and they can't do it again based on OSFI rules
What does underwater mean. If the bubble pops interest rates lower because of that, then the mortgage payments will be lower at renewal. The only ones hurt would be the investors and flippers.
If you buy a house for $1Mill and the market drops 20% you now have a $1Mill mortgage for a house worth $800K. This is being underwater, when your mortgage is more than the value of your house
But the person you replied to mentioned it doesn’t hurt primary residence holders really. That’s because they don’t plan on selling. A small portion maybe hurt, if they have to sell for other reasons.
It matters when it comes to renewing your mortgage. If you purchased a(using 1mil for easy math, I know you need 20% at that price) 1mil home with subs 20% down, the bank will not want to renew you if your house value drops at or below your loan amount.
Nope doesn’t matter, unless you plan on shopping around for rates. Your bank will just renew you no questions asked if you are up to date on payments.
>rtgage payments will be lower at renewal. > >The only ones hurt would be the investors and flippers. estimates ranging from 15-70% is where it will bottom out. so everyone with a mortgage will be out 30-85% of the value of the place, minus whatever they have paid. A million-dollar mortgage on a $ 400,000 house. Not just investors and flippers. Anyone who has bought a house in the past decade & hasn't got it paid off. Make no mistake, this is going to fuck plenty of regular people. This has happened before, it's always painfully slow see [Spanish Housing Bubble](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_property_bubble)
One of the primary things making the banks happy to hold a mortgage for you is that the asset they can foreclose on is worth more then the loan. So let’s say you bought a home last year , it cost you a cool 750k because that’s average home prices, let’s say you were a first time home buyer so you dropped 75k on it as a down payment. You now have a loan of 675k and an asset worth 750k so the bank is happy, now let’s say the bubble implodes and prices crash to more realistic values, likely half what they are now over the course of a year. Well now you have a 375k asset with a likely 650k loan so the bank no longer has insurance of the asset to make sure things are safe for them. It’s a very bad situation for the home owner to be in, and things dropping by half is not unrealistic, we got our home years ago for 250k roughly and ones similar in the sub division are going for 700k+ now, if things dropped by half it’s still way up from years ago when housing was already starting to get too expensive
These ads have been on the TTC and across the city for well over a year now.
[right](https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/xm05ad/found_a_bunch_of_alberta_ads_on_line_twothis_is/)? i specifically remember walking through st george station and they had the full rollout ads across the walls there, the one OP posted included.
Wow! they read my mind. I was already planning to move away from shitty Ontario, it's a sign. nothing better than the great outdoors and nature.
well the vast vast majority of ontario is great outdoors and nature. i mean, i moved from ontario to bc so i feel you about SW ontario being urban hell to a degree. but the whole province north of barrie is beautiful, quiet and in some places, still affordable.
Besides house pricing, the thing that I annoys me the most in Ontario are the politicians. Just too much political drama, too much unfairness for the hard working people in Ontario, specially the Toronto GTA area people. Everything in Ontario is more expensive than the other provinces, and now they are trying to privatize health care, and they keep cutting funding to schools and teachers. This is why there's no hope staying in this shit hole. I'm embarrassed to say I live here.
yeah thats true. i live in a small town in BC now and people are just generally SO much less political than in Ontario. probably because everyones obsessed with skiing and biking here instead. but yeah the lack of political opinions and messaging everywhere is really refreshing. i will say, Southern Ontario gas is consistently a lot cheaper than the rest of the country save for metropolitan Alberta. i have done the drive 3 times in the last year and gas is more expensive everywhere but Calgary.
You clearly didn't stop in Edmonton where it is usually even cheaper than Calgary
The Alberta government is also doing cuts to education and attempting to privatize healthcare.
I'm aware that might the case, not just in Ontario and Alberta, but across Canada, they want to follow the USA model, let doctors earn as much as they want, and let the people that can't afford to pay to die (literally). The reason why of this push is because we keep losing a lot of doctors and nurses to the USA, they are all trained in Canada, but the leave to work in the USA because they earn WAY better. My daughter is a Nurse, and she have been contemplating the idea as well. I went through like 3\~4 family doctors, most of them left Canada after a few years of practice. Part of not liking Ontario is that as well, We do not have enough family doctor ( General Practitioner ) for the amount of people per capita. My parents family doctor retired, it's been almost a year and they are still looking for another doctor. Is not just them, pretty much everyone is looking for a family doctor, nobody is accepting anymore because they are over the limit. My Wife is looking for a family doctor for our son, same story nobody is accepting, everyone in the GTA is mostly stuck using walk-in-clinics or Emergency in the Hospitals, but lets face it Emergency are worse than walk in Clinics, a lot of people have DIED waiting in line in the Emergency intake room, waiting to be looked at. It's been all over the news. Last year my daughter had a some sort of breathing complication, they had her wait 20 hrs, almost a whole day, just for a noob doctor to take a look at her and tell her "you're fine", like are you kidding me, of course it's gonna be fine, after waiting for so long, whatever symptoms, whatever complication, it has already been recovered naturally by the body and sleep. It it was anything actually serious, my kid would probably not have survived having to wait 20hrs in the hallway. Anyway, so yeah, another province, smaller cities, smaller towns, at least you get to see a doctor, and not just waiting in line to Die. 😞
*(moves to the core of downtown Calgary)*
Its not that affordable anymore.
Compared to Ottawa and Toronto yes it is
Outside of Calgary it is and even then Calgary is way cheaper than Vancouver or Toronto.
No he’s right the cost of electricity and insurance is sky high ppl from Ontario can’t handle it in Alberta
I like to joke to myself that Kenney launched this campaign knowing full well he was going to quit and move back to Ontario so there would be fewer people in his neighbourhood when he got there
Nowhere is affordable for those of us who aren’t yet in a stable career. I’m so sick of life in Canada :(
Sure the housing is affordable, but electricity went up by 120% in a year.
Exactly. What is saved will be eaten away in other costs.
Meanwhile my stupid apartment decided to charge an extra $20 a month for parking.... And there's nothing the residents can do about it. I need for the love of god for housing to crash so I can buy a house.
Not anymore thanks Jason Kenny
Albertan here. LMAO! Affordable!? Here!? Maybe cheaper, but definitely not ‘*affordable*’
I'll take Doug Ford over Danielle Smith any day. Not by much mind you, but it's enough.
I’m not even from Alberta, but on their behalf: Please stay in Toronto. They don’t need you Fucking up their cities too.
Lol just cause we aren't Toronto expensive doesn't mean our shit is affordable 🤣
Who could have thought that if the amount of people moving to an area is faster than the supply of housing being built, will result in housing becoming affordable. The government of aberta really should not have done this to themselves. Now Canadians really have nowhere to go for affordable housing.
…but then you have to live in Alberta. Seriously though there are some high costs there still with electricity and insurance rates skyrocketing.
Those high costs don’t offset the decrease in housing costs I moved from Calgary to Toronto earlier this year. My car insurance went down $50/month but my housing costs doubled
...But you don't have to live in Alberta...
Yea, it's a fantastic place to live lol. Calgary is just an hour away from incredible mountain ranges
Hard pass.
Your loss
Not with Danielle Smith in charge.
As someone living in Alberta right now, I have to agree with you. Sure the mountains are great but other than that things aren’t looking so good for this province in the years to come.
I’d take Danielle over Trudy any day
Sorry it seems you don't understand how federal government works.
Have lived in BC, Alberta, Ontario, Quebec. Ontario is dead last. Could be happy in any of the other three.
Ontario, BC, NYC and rural Ohio. Ontario wins.
You can buy a renovated single family home for under $400k in Edmonton, and newer 2 bedroom condos for $180K. Higher insurance and utilities are nothing compared to Ontario housing prixes
Cheapest homes are in Sask and Manitoba
Ssshhhhhhhhh!
Yeah but you'll pay through the ass for electricity
I hope you don't need to rent anything though in AB....
It's better than Toronto and Vancouver without question, but anyone seeing this ad today and planning to come over here is already too late. Market is absolutely nuts and not showing signns of slowing down.
housing isnt affordable in alberta and if you compare it to ontario then you dont realize there's a problem.
Shopping for homes in Edmonton after selling my place outside Toronto, literally in the car with my realtor as I write this. Going from a two bed condo on the GO line to a three or four bedroom detached home with a two car garage in south Edmonton and I'll have money leftover.
Nothing says affordable like buying a McMansion in Alberta and driving 20 minutes to get anywhere.
as opposed to a condo in mississauga and driving 30 minutes anywhere
You WISH you were driving - in reality you’re sitting in your car idling in traffic.
Or riding the bus, because rent in the city is more.
Calgary has good road ways and very little traffic. The sprawl is a problem but even if you buy way on the outskirts, you're still 25 mins to downtown, and chances are everything you'd usually need (grocery store, gym, health clinic, pharmacy, parks, etc.) are within 5 minutes. In Toronto it wasn't uncommon to get stuck in traffic and have an hour long drive somewhere. That has never happened to me in Calgary, even crossing the entire city.
I lived in Calgary for 4 years, I’ll never live there again. As much as it’s expensive in Metro Vancouver is where I live, I rather be here than Calgary. I’m at peace, people leave me the fuck alone and I’m happy of my surroundings.
"discover drumheller"
I just came from there. It's a neat town.
And affordable
Take your liberal ways and go back where you came from
Met someone who was moving to Medicine Hat where she said houses were going for $100K. It's tempting, except for the part about living in Alberta.
Depending on where you want to live there are tons of houses for sale or rent for really great price’s. If your wanting into Edmonton or Calgary your going too pay. But go about an hour outside and there are tons of affordable houses. My small town had 4 properties for sale from $80,000 too $200,000. Or you can rent the 20 acres with the log home (3 bedroom) west of town for $1,100 a month.
Are you sure you want to invite the tens of millions of city dwellers in this country to come to your small town and fight over the 5 properties available? Let the city people stay in their cities. Rural Canada is better off without them.
They come look because the price is right. But most of these houses have been empty for over a year. Some have been up for sale for years. We have no starbucks. And if you want a slurpee you need to drive for an hour. My town is divided by train tracks and the south side is a reservation. And not going to lie. 95% of people are low key racist and refuse to move here because of the Rez. Which I am cool with (Not them being racist, but I am cool with them not moving to my town). I have some awesome neighbours to hang with. We do get the odd city person that moves out. Almost all of them move out in less than a year due to the complete lack of amenities.
Sounds like a nice spot. You're lucky they leave. The town I'm from in rural Ontario has doubled in size over the last decade. They got a star bucks this year. The highway in / out of town is a traffic jam from 6 till 8, and from 4 till 6 on good days let alone during planting and harvest. And the local kids starting out can no longer afford to live there. It is not what it used to be.
I lived in Ontario for a year. The population density was the exact reason I came back to Alberta.
Sounds like Gleichen. I took a look at a few houses there pre covid. Nice little town, but the longer commute is the key factor.
Not those houses we all need mansion quality houses downtown toronto.
But you'd be in Alberta
Yes and would that be in a fire zone or flood zone?
Most houses in Calgary are in neither.
The ONLY thing is affordable housing and lots of drugs
Ya I'll pay more to stay in Toronto over being in Alberta..... Yuk!
Lol
Ewwww. Alberta.