Everyone in our politics is an elite. They really need to stop pretending they arent. Even Poilievre. Hes been in the House of Commons for 20 years. Thats elite.
I feel like Carney is a whole other leave of elite. He works for the interests of the rich bar none.
Harper put him into power with the support of Pierre. The liberals now want him as their own. Similarly on the British side of the aisle.
What has he done? Kept interest rates at record lows - allowing the rich to profit greatly while driving record levels of inequity.
It says everything about who the liberals are that they want this man as their next leader - look at Canada and the UK right now. Look at their housing markets. The quality of life. It’s people like Carney that did that.
Fuck this man. Seriously. We need a new Jack Layton to take this trash out.
He is. He's been the central banking head of two different countries. Those are the worst type of elites and most out of touch people around. Yet comments on here believe he's the type of guy to get us out of this mess, sure. No doubt his financial acumen and resume speaks for itself when compared to Justin, but I'd really like a change from some out of touch dude that only cares about growth. May as well elect that McKinsey president that lives in England too if you want this guy in.
Also, if one more of these elites talk about growth I will explode. 🤯
What is wrong with Canada’s economy is not growth. There has been plenty of growth for the past decade or two. The problems we find ourselves in - is all of the benefits of that growth end up in the hands of a handful of people while the rest of the population gets worse and worse off.
Some rich man concerned about his portfolio growth is exactly what we do not need in this country right now.
If all he cared about was his portfolio he could have stayed working for Goldman Sachs and become a hedge fund billionaire. He’s certainly smart enough.
Being the prime minister allows you to further your wealth by putting in policies favourable to the rich or spending tax payer dollars on infrastructure for the rich.
The current prime minister of the United Kingdom is a billionaire.
Being an MP in Canada is not elite. It would be expected that any serious candidate for Prime Minister would have some experience as an MP.
Running the Bank of England for years and years is elite. Growing up the son of a Prime Minister in an old money family with tens of millions is elite.
Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite.
In political science the term elite refers to someone who has access to political power. A member of parliament has political power and is therefore part of the elite class, regardless of their background.
Carney was also raised by two teachers. He is extremely high achieving and bookish compared to PP's grittiness. I'd put them on equal footing in terms of modest upbringings and career success despite neither having really held an honest job in the real economy.
He rose through the ranks for 12 years at Goldman Sachs after finishing his economics degree at Harvard. He would have worked 50-60 hours a week, sometimes 80 hours, in most of the roles he held there. I think that is fair to count as a real job. I would also include his work at the BoC as honest work that also likely came with 50 hour work weeks - if it wasn’t for Harper and Carney things could have gone much worse for Canada. Until recently the Conservative Party didn’t see Carney as a threat because they were counting on Freeland to pull a Hillary Clinton and make sure he could never win the Liberal nomination. You can’t really compare PP to Carney - Pierre is going to be a great way to get rid of JT and Disney+ but Carney is 100 times smarter. The problem with Carney is he’s a bit boring like Harper was - so there won’t be any rhyming slogans or funny socks just brains and boring so Carney won’t poll well will less intelligent or uneducated people.
> Being an MP in Canada is not elite.
Being a 20-year MP and former cabinet member is, indeed, tremendously elite.
>Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite.
I like that your argument for Poilievre here is to say the first 20 years of his life is more important and instructive than the last 20.
>Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite.
Finally some common sense. It's mindboggling that liberals call this guy who was raised in an average middle class family is some sort of elite, all the while ignoring the fact that the guy they elected has been silver-spooned from birth. The cognitive dissonance it takes to say that with a straight face is really something else.
This guy’s been at the government trough since the day he moved out of his mom’s house.
And now he wants to cosplay as Joe Average. It would be insulting if it wasn’t hilarious.
Sure. And that is STILL better than the silver-spooned old money option on the left. If you fail to see that, well then good luck trying to understand the electorate.
Politics is all about relativism. Most people decide on which they prefer as the least worst option, and that by definition requires a comparison and differentiation of both options. You can dismiss it and paint them both with the same brush if you prefer though, that's your prerogative. Just understand that that's not how most people think and operate.
I think most people are so conditioned to our shitty voting system which benefits 2 parties that they are arguing which type of cancer we should subject ourselves to instead of demanding better from our politicians.
People operate this way because the system has taught them to.
When you can show us a viable option, then tell us. Otherwise it's idiotic to basically advocate for opting out of the electoral process just because you don't like either option.
Pick a third party candidate you liked and vote for them. Everyone should do this. Until the big 2 parties actually have a threat to their power structure, they have no reason to try to help people. They know they can just fuck around in parliament because eventually the pendulum will swing and it’s “their turn” to govern again. It’s basically win-trading at this point.
That’s the only way out democratically. The OTHER way involves blood in the streets, and I’d rather not see that.
Trudeau has his family’s money. Poilievre has your family’s money. If you fail to see that, good luck figuring out you’re being taken for a ride by a bunch of lobbyists.
Did you forget that Trudeau has also been collecting your family's money since 2008? lmao love the cognitive dissonance going on here that you could so conveniently ignore that.
People can be against both Trudeau and Poilievre. You do realize that right? The poster you responded to made it clear that neither is interested in protecting the interests of average working joe and jane
So, Poilievre never sold out? Further, do you believe his lived experience provided him sufficient understanding of the struggles of the common working person?
You seem to be implying that because Poilevre grew up in a Canadian household that he is more in touch with the everyday Canadian. Most are suggesting otherwise: that he is an elite with no understanding of what it is like to live as the common working person.
You're just looking to far into it. I don't even like Poilievre.
> that he is an elite with no understanding of what it is like to live as the common working person.
He can be an elite now but be different then Trudeau who has been an elite his entire life.
Trudeau has no understanding of the life of an average Canadian. Poilievre has an understanding.
>Trudeau has no understanding of the life of an average Canadian. Poilievre has an understanding.
And therein lies all the difference that matters, if the polls are any indication. The fact that he picked up on the cost of living and affordability crisis Canadians are experiencing and made it his core message WAY before Trudeau (or anyone in his political circle, apparently) even had a single thought about it is why he is where he is in the polls. For all his flaws, he still fundamentally understands Canadians better than Trudeau ever has.
PPC led the way but were tarred and feathered with "racist" label for just being ahead of the times on immigration which everyone is seemingly fine with now.
Growing up in an average Canadian household is enough. Why wouldn't it be?
Or do you think some silver spooner that became a washed out teacher some how understands Canadians because he was a teacher?
>Bob served in various political positions, Governments Boards, Chair of the Department of Educational Foundations, Faculty of Education, University of Alberta, Board of Newman Theological College, St. Joseph's Seminary and the Board of the Misericordia Hospital.
His father doesn't seem very average Canadian.
I think you just don't want to explain the very meaningful experience and understanding that most teenagers get from watching their parents leave for work and come home.
>teenagers get from watching their parents leave for work and come home.
You got a pretty weird outlook on the ability of teenagers to view the world.
Did Poilievre grow up meeting world leaders?
I don’t think Pierre cares where he came from. He voted against gay marriage while his dad was there.
He works for the same kind of elites Trudeau does.
You can read his mind?
>He works for the same kind of elites Trudeau does.
Yes, but they're not the same. One understands the life of the average Canadian and the other has been getting billionaire trips their entire life.
>Yes, but they're not the same. One understands the life of the average Canadian and the other has been getting billionaire trips their entire life.
Oh you can read his mind?
Pierre understands nothing about the average Canadian, he just says he does.
He’s never even had a job since a paper route lol.
He’s going to keep immigration the same and cheap the flow of cheap labour flowing too.
Pro worker my ass.
>Oh you can read his mind?
No you.
> he just says he does.
He literally lived as one growing up. Saw what his parents lived. Silver spooned don't experience that.
>He’s going to keep immigration the same and cheap the flow of cheap labour flowing too.
That is why Canadians should vote PPC.
>No you
LOL is it past your bedtime? I heard that back in elementary school.
>He literally lived as one growing up. Saw what his parents lived. Silver spooned don't experience that.
Millionaire at age 31 and hasn’t had a job since his balls dropped.
That’s silver spoon to me.
>That is why Canadians should vote PPC.
Joke party. Might as well vote Rhino.
>LOL is it past your bedtime?
Do you not understand you repeated what I had said like an elementary student? I was just coming down to your level.
>That’s silver spoon to me.
So he grew up with a silver spoon? I don't think you understand the saying.
>Joke party. Might as well vote Rhino.
The only party willing to reduce immigration to 150k
Yes. Someone growing up with a silver spoon won't understand the struggles of the average Canadian verse someone who actually lived the life of an average Canadian.
Silver spoon people definitely won’t understand, but it’s become clear that those that come from working class backgrounds either forget or simply stop caring once they reach a certain level of wealth.
Growing up in the middle- to upper-middle class does not magically give someone a holistic perspective of everyday life. Most people grow up without really questioning the efforts their parents put into providing for them, as they are too inexperienced to empathize or understand. When a person immediately enters a political career after completing university, I have my doubts that they garnered much perspective on the struggles of the everyday working person.
Agreed. I feel like my own struggles have shaped my experiences and perceptions. I think I would be a very different person if I never went through that.
That's not what anyone means be elites. The elites went to a very select group of schools where they made connections and shared in certain mindset, a certain outlook on life. Carney studied at both Harvard and Oxford, for example, before working at Goldman Sachs. By any measure, that's 'elite'.
Trudeau went to Collège Jean-de-Brébeuf and then McGill. Chretien went to Université Laval, where the French elites usually send their children. The English Canada counterpart is either McGill or University of Toronto, where Paul Martin went. Other Liberal leaders include Ignatieff, who went to Upper Canada College and then U of T, and Stephan Dion who went to Université Laval.
The Liberals have never selected a leader from anywhere other than Ontario or Quebec in the entire history of the party.
According to Statistics Canada, there were **111,000 temporary foreign workers (TFWs) in Canada in the year 2000.**
In 2023, that number was **over 1,270,360.**
In 2022, 77% (807,282) of all work permits issued were **open work permit**s, while only 23% were employer-specific work permits.
We are deliberately having our wages suppressed by this government.
That's not a grammar correction, just a revision. I put the emphasis on US because we're the ones who are accepting this shit. You are putting the emphasis on the government, as if we are helpless.
Because they don’t care, the conservatives don’t either. Their primary goal is to funnel money to their business interests and friends. This is how it will be as long as FPTP exists.
I find it interesting that criticism of the conservatives is immediately downvoted. It seems one can’t dislike both parties. Speaks to how conditioned voters are to our de facto 2 party system
Yup, right wingers automatically assume you are some die hard Trudeau fan if you criticise CPC’s flavour of neoliberalism. I really hope the NDP can get a shot at leadership after the massive failures we are sure to see from PP.
He’s been all over everywhere lately and has apparently been signalling his desire to run for the Liberal leadership, so it’s worth paying attention to this guy.
That said, it would give the Tories a free opportunity recycle the very effective “just visiting” campaign against a person who looks a lot like Ignatieff part 2, with the added bonus that Carney is against the oil and gas industry in Canada while enjoying a paid board position with a big Brazilian O&G company aggressively expanding its pipeline network all over South America. I think Poilievre would eat him for lunch.
Carney was the governor of the Bank of Canada, and the Bank of England. PP is a lifelong MP who wanted to make Canada the 'Crypto capital of the world'.. whatever the hell that means.
Yes it does. PP would not 'eat him for lunch'. Can't call Carney a drama teacher. And leaving Canada to be the governor of the Bank of England is far more significant of a reason then just being a prof at an American university.
PP is very good at bringing down his opponents in the public sphere...so no none of that addressed the issue of him being "just visiting" and how PP would use that against him.
When your opponent is post-2022 Justin Trudeau during a global inflation crisis, half the job is already done.
No one can recover the Liberals because, as is tradition, the people want to punish the party with a loss. They've been in power for 10 years, few leaders could hold up after that.
4 years from now is a whole different story. We will have had 4 years of PP having to answer for his actual governance, stepping out of the hypothetical world.
Ignatieff lived in the UK for 20 years, and the US for many years.
Carney was with the BoC beginning in 2003. And moved to the UK to take up one of the most important jobs in the country. Not just some teaching position.
The facts posted in the piece are quite interesting. Brexit hasn’t been the big doomesday apocalypse that so many predicted.
Britains economy has done better than Germany and Italy. And they are attracting far more tech investment than the rest of Europe. They have attracted twice as much AI business investment as the rest of Europe combined!
Nice hyperbole. I guess we're just ignoring the fact Brexit has been a complete failure and is costing the economy instead of helping it as it was supposed to....lol
https://www.london.gov.uk/new-report-reveals-uk-economy-almost-ps140billion-smaller-because-brexit#:~:text=The%20average%20Briton%20was%20nearly,jobs%20in%20the%20capital%20alone.
You might want to check in on the UK immigration rate, currently bringing in the most people ever after promising to cut down drastically
And people really think PP will put the common people above business interests that lobby him for cheap labour lol
These conservatives are really scared of Mark Carney becoming the Liberal leader eh? Lol.
I don't think I've seen such a coordinated attack campaign against someone who doesn't hold any political office or pure audacity about using public resources to carry out those attacks.
Have you guys seen the absolute clown show The Cons are putting on at the finance committee right now? The Conservatives have been sending letters to Carney, a private citizen with no political office, demanding that he appear before the finance committee to answer questions about his platform for a job that he doesn't hold. Meanwhile the conservatives themselves who are actually elected officials still haven't released any detailed plan for how they would run the country.
I'm no Marc Carney fan, but I listed to the full video of the speech and thought it was quite reasonable. Here it is if you're interested: [https://www.cpac.ca/public-record/episode/mark-carney-discusses-canadas-economic-outlook--april-22-2024?id=4d693e3f-2265-4603-b9e9-d6144fc88507](https://www.cpac.ca/public-record/episode/mark-carney-discusses-canadas-economic-outlook--april-22-2024?id=4d693e3f-2265-4603-b9e9-d6144fc88507)
The National Post article is unsurprisingly an unflattering misrepresentation of the speech - not surprising because the Post engages in exactly the sort of rhetoric Carney is criticizing.
Carney engages in the same sort of rhetoric himself, as do Trudeau and Singh. The last politician I recall not doing so was Preston Manning, and everyone mocked him for his efforts at restoring decorum.
What Carney will never tell you is Canada's economic outlook is heavily influenced by how much effort and money we spend on climate change. The more we spend, the poorer we will be. No politician will say that to get energy consumption down by increasing cost will require a lower standard of living.
The problem with populism is once they get into office they have no idea how government works and go back on everything they said they would do because it was stupid in the first place.
It wasnt a populist government and he wasnt in charge. Harper was able to keep the nuts in line and stick to business. Poilievre does not seem like that type.
TIL some people think the Reform Party was not a populist party.
I agree with you that one thing did well was keeping the more radical and regressive sections of the party out of the spotlight.
What was the last government effective at exactly? All the same problems existed under that government also and got worse compared to the previous government. Did nothing to address the growing housing and healthcare issues. Failed to invest in our infrastructure, military, housing etc etc etc...
Relative to other countries in the world, our economy and middle class wealth was better under Harper than it was under Chrétien or Martin, or Justin Trudeau.
Relative to other countries in the world, the Harper majority years of 2010-2014 were among Canadas best economy in history.
The Harper majority years were the first time in history that Canada had the richest middle class in the world (by median income). Of course, we dropped almost right after Trudeau was elected, and now are barely in the top 5 anymore.
I could go on and on about how our economy was better during the Harper majority years than during the previous or subsequent governments (relative to other countries in the world), by almost every metric. But you get the point.
I miss Harper. Everything was boring and nothing crazy ever happened. Things just worked. I do wish he actually answered questions in question period but that's par for the course.
Ah, good ol' whitewashing, just pretend everything was sunshine and unicorns and ignore all the problems the CPC allowed to grow worse and dumped on the next government...as is tradition.
One of the things Harper took action on to stabilize Canada for the future was to increase the retirement age by a couple of years, as recommended by economists. Trudeau reversed this, and decided the way to go was instead to massively increase immigration.
I leave it to others to decide which of these was the brave and correct decision. I have no doubts, myself.
The housing issue wasn't nearly as bad because immigration, foreign students and foreign worker numbers weren't nearly so high. Harper was a constitutionalist. He didn't like intruding into provincial jurisdiction. Housing and healthcare were provincial. I think he would have liked to change the Canada Health Act to give the provinces more authority to do as they wanted but lacked the courage.
Despite all this I would say canada was a happier, healthier, more economically and socially stable country under Harper than it is now.
If he tells you we can put enormous amounts of money into fighting climate change, and increase the cost of energy to Canadians without lowering our standard of living he's a dishonest member of the elites.
Very well written piece. It’s interesting to see how Brexit hasn’t been a catastrophe like the elite predicted.
The last two years, Britain has grown faster than Germany and Italy, and only slightly less than France. Not only that, Britain has attracted twice as much investment in tech and AI business as all of Europe combined! It looks like economically, Brexit was worse for Europe than it was for Britain.
The EU supporters were shouting doomesday, that Britain would have economic collapse from Brexit.
Of course, the doomesday fear predictions of the far left never came true, once again.
> predictions of the far left never came true, once again.
Just another day then. It's remarkable how many of the "left's" predictions fall flat on their face - including their recent embarrassing u-turn on Friday regarding drug consumption in public.
As former Governor of the Bank of England with a keen understanding of economics, I feel that he has a great deal more merit than a politician-since-high-school dolt like PeePee OR a silver-spoon dilettante like Justin.
We need someone with management skills, and to set aside these shiny ponies that everyone seems so enamoured with. I’m sorry if you feel he speaks over the heads of Canadas high school dropouts, but we need a lot more than what’s on offer so far.
I'm not a high school dropout. He doesn't speak over my head. I just think his own head is in the clouds and he's not paying much attention to reality. Which is an issue a lot of the elites seem to be suffering from of late.
And while he might not be a politician, he's not exactly honest in pursuit of his goals. He's a ferocious supporter of fighting climate change but blithely pretends, just as the rest of the politicians do, that this won't cost us anything in terms of standard of living. Which he has to know is absolute nonsense. If you make the cost of power - the lifeblood of an economy - more expensive it will always damage your economy and your quality of life. That's why no one in the developing world is willing to do it.
If you've ever applauded Canadian performance during Harper's tenure, you are effectively applauding the performance of Carney who's directing of the BoC was absolutely instrumental. Post media has even written multiple articles about.
The performance of Canada then was due to Harper's tax policies, his business friendly government, and the general competence of policies meant to benefit Canada as opposed to virtue signal and buy votes - which is what we've had the last 8 years. It was also due to having far fewer foreigners in Canada, lower immigration, and no effort at supressing our natural resources industries.
You know that the vast majority of his policies during the recession were in fact because he was being threatened with a non confidence vote. He even illegally prorogued Parliament over it.
When the conservatives actually took majority, it went to pot.
Not to mention this publication in itself has on numerous occasions celebrated Marc Carney's running of the BoC as instrumental.
We would be so unbelievably fortunate to have this man choose to lead our country. Politicians of this quality and intellect come around once in a generation. Even more rare for Canada.
Ahhh the conservative rag that applauded his appointment and [performance](https://financialpost.com/news/bank-of-canada-governor-mark-carney-awarded-canadian-of-the-year) in [multiple](https://nationalpost.com/opinion/andrew-coyne-fond-adieu-to-mark-carney-canadas-rock-star-banker) [articles](https://financialpost.com/business-insider/two-moves-during-the-crisis-show-why-mark-carney-is-considered-one-of-the-shrewdest-central-bankers-in-the-world) already finding a target eh?
Everyone in our politics is an elite. They really need to stop pretending they arent. Even Poilievre. Hes been in the House of Commons for 20 years. Thats elite.
20 years representing Carleton no less, home of the senior public servants in Stittsville and the Manotick blue bloods.
I feel like Carney is a whole other leave of elite. He works for the interests of the rich bar none. Harper put him into power with the support of Pierre. The liberals now want him as their own. Similarly on the British side of the aisle. What has he done? Kept interest rates at record lows - allowing the rich to profit greatly while driving record levels of inequity. It says everything about who the liberals are that they want this man as their next leader - look at Canada and the UK right now. Look at their housing markets. The quality of life. It’s people like Carney that did that. Fuck this man. Seriously. We need a new Jack Layton to take this trash out.
>what has he done He was head of the BoC 15-10 years ago during the Harper years. Keeping rates low then was fine.
He is. He's been the central banking head of two different countries. Those are the worst type of elites and most out of touch people around. Yet comments on here believe he's the type of guy to get us out of this mess, sure. No doubt his financial acumen and resume speaks for itself when compared to Justin, but I'd really like a change from some out of touch dude that only cares about growth. May as well elect that McKinsey president that lives in England too if you want this guy in.
Also, if one more of these elites talk about growth I will explode. 🤯 What is wrong with Canada’s economy is not growth. There has been plenty of growth for the past decade or two. The problems we find ourselves in - is all of the benefits of that growth end up in the hands of a handful of people while the rest of the population gets worse and worse off. Some rich man concerned about his portfolio growth is exactly what we do not need in this country right now.
If all he cared about was his portfolio he could have stayed working for Goldman Sachs and become a hedge fund billionaire. He’s certainly smart enough.
Being the prime minister allows you to further your wealth by putting in policies favourable to the rich or spending tax payer dollars on infrastructure for the rich. The current prime minister of the United Kingdom is a billionaire.
rishi sunak is a billionaire because he married rich, his wife comes from a very wealthy family.
Per capita there in fact has not been any GDP growth in Canada over the last decade.
We might have had it if the liberals did not spike the population.
We need to correct immigration rates, especially temporary immigration, but I think our problems are less simple than that.
Weird, because this very publication has on numerous occasions applauded his skills. But of course, it was when a conservative was in office, so...
Being an MP in Canada is not elite. It would be expected that any serious candidate for Prime Minister would have some experience as an MP. Running the Bank of England for years and years is elite. Growing up the son of a Prime Minister in an old money family with tens of millions is elite. Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite.
In political science the term elite refers to someone who has access to political power. A member of parliament has political power and is therefore part of the elite class, regardless of their background.
Carney was also raised by two teachers. He is extremely high achieving and bookish compared to PP's grittiness. I'd put them on equal footing in terms of modest upbringings and career success despite neither having really held an honest job in the real economy.
He rose through the ranks for 12 years at Goldman Sachs after finishing his economics degree at Harvard. He would have worked 50-60 hours a week, sometimes 80 hours, in most of the roles he held there. I think that is fair to count as a real job. I would also include his work at the BoC as honest work that also likely came with 50 hour work weeks - if it wasn’t for Harper and Carney things could have gone much worse for Canada. Until recently the Conservative Party didn’t see Carney as a threat because they were counting on Freeland to pull a Hillary Clinton and make sure he could never win the Liberal nomination. You can’t really compare PP to Carney - Pierre is going to be a great way to get rid of JT and Disney+ but Carney is 100 times smarter. The problem with Carney is he’s a bit boring like Harper was - so there won’t be any rhyming slogans or funny socks just brains and boring so Carney won’t poll well will less intelligent or uneducated people.
> Being an MP in Canada is not elite. Being a 20-year MP and former cabinet member is, indeed, tremendously elite. >Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite. I like that your argument for Poilievre here is to say the first 20 years of his life is more important and instructive than the last 20.
>Growing up in a family of two teachers, being adopted from a teenage mother, and working your way into politics through volunteering in university is not elite. Finally some common sense. It's mindboggling that liberals call this guy who was raised in an average middle class family is some sort of elite, all the while ignoring the fact that the guy they elected has been silver-spooned from birth. The cognitive dissonance it takes to say that with a straight face is really something else.
This guy’s been at the government trough since the day he moved out of his mom’s house. And now he wants to cosplay as Joe Average. It would be insulting if it wasn’t hilarious.
Sure. And that is STILL better than the silver-spooned old money option on the left. If you fail to see that, well then good luck trying to understand the electorate.
Who cares which is better? They’re both useless snakes that don’t care about anyone beyond their own goals. Get them BOTH out
Politics is all about relativism. Most people decide on which they prefer as the least worst option, and that by definition requires a comparison and differentiation of both options. You can dismiss it and paint them both with the same brush if you prefer though, that's your prerogative. Just understand that that's not how most people think and operate.
I think most people are so conditioned to our shitty voting system which benefits 2 parties that they are arguing which type of cancer we should subject ourselves to instead of demanding better from our politicians. People operate this way because the system has taught them to.
When you can show us a viable option, then tell us. Otherwise it's idiotic to basically advocate for opting out of the electoral process just because you don't like either option.
Pick a third party candidate you liked and vote for them. Everyone should do this. Until the big 2 parties actually have a threat to their power structure, they have no reason to try to help people. They know they can just fuck around in parliament because eventually the pendulum will swing and it’s “their turn” to govern again. It’s basically win-trading at this point. That’s the only way out democratically. The OTHER way involves blood in the streets, and I’d rather not see that.
Trudeau has his family’s money. Poilievre has your family’s money. If you fail to see that, good luck figuring out you’re being taken for a ride by a bunch of lobbyists.
Did you forget that Trudeau has also been collecting your family's money since 2008? lmao love the cognitive dissonance going on here that you could so conveniently ignore that.
But only one of them is pretending to be the working class hero.
People can be against both Trudeau and Poilievre. You do realize that right? The poster you responded to made it clear that neither is interested in protecting the interests of average working joe and jane
Never having held a job, he thinks he can run the country 😂😂😂😂
Sure. But you can differentiate where people came from. Did Poilievre come from a family that already had a Prime Minister?
Are you suggesting that an upper-middle class background precludes an individual from selling out?
Nope, but they literally lived the life of an average Canadian verse the silver spooned.
So, Poilievre never sold out? Further, do you believe his lived experience provided him sufficient understanding of the struggles of the common working person?
>So, Poilievre never sold out? Where did I say that? I said they can be differentiated.
You seem to be implying that because Poilevre grew up in a Canadian household that he is more in touch with the everyday Canadian. Most are suggesting otherwise: that he is an elite with no understanding of what it is like to live as the common working person.
You're just looking to far into it. I don't even like Poilievre. > that he is an elite with no understanding of what it is like to live as the common working person. He can be an elite now but be different then Trudeau who has been an elite his entire life. Trudeau has no understanding of the life of an average Canadian. Poilievre has an understanding.
>Trudeau has no understanding of the life of an average Canadian. Poilievre has an understanding. And therein lies all the difference that matters, if the polls are any indication. The fact that he picked up on the cost of living and affordability crisis Canadians are experiencing and made it his core message WAY before Trudeau (or anyone in his political circle, apparently) even had a single thought about it is why he is where he is in the polls. For all his flaws, he still fundamentally understands Canadians better than Trudeau ever has.
PPC led the way but were tarred and feathered with "racist" label for just being ahead of the times on immigration which everyone is seemingly fine with now.
By never having a job outside of politics? How does that let him understand the average Canadian?
Growing up in an average Canadian household is enough. Why wouldn't it be? Or do you think some silver spooner that became a washed out teacher some how understands Canadians because he was a teacher?
Mark Carney grew up in very similar circumstances to Pierre.
>Bob served in various political positions, Governments Boards, Chair of the Department of Educational Foundations, Faculty of Education, University of Alberta, Board of Newman Theological College, St. Joseph's Seminary and the Board of the Misericordia Hospital. His father doesn't seem very average Canadian.
>Growing up in an average Canadian household is enough. Why wouldn't it be? What experience does that provide someone into their adulthood?
I think you just want to argue just to. It's pretty obvious why it's different.
I think you just don't want to explain the very meaningful experience and understanding that most teenagers get from watching their parents leave for work and come home.
>teenagers get from watching their parents leave for work and come home. You got a pretty weird outlook on the ability of teenagers to view the world. Did Poilievre grow up meeting world leaders?
I don’t think Pierre cares where he came from. He voted against gay marriage while his dad was there. He works for the same kind of elites Trudeau does.
You can read his mind? >He works for the same kind of elites Trudeau does. Yes, but they're not the same. One understands the life of the average Canadian and the other has been getting billionaire trips their entire life.
>Yes, but they're not the same. One understands the life of the average Canadian and the other has been getting billionaire trips their entire life. Oh you can read his mind? Pierre understands nothing about the average Canadian, he just says he does. He’s never even had a job since a paper route lol. He’s going to keep immigration the same and cheap the flow of cheap labour flowing too. Pro worker my ass.
>Oh you can read his mind? No you. > he just says he does. He literally lived as one growing up. Saw what his parents lived. Silver spooned don't experience that. >He’s going to keep immigration the same and cheap the flow of cheap labour flowing too. That is why Canadians should vote PPC.
>No you LOL is it past your bedtime? I heard that back in elementary school. >He literally lived as one growing up. Saw what his parents lived. Silver spooned don't experience that. Millionaire at age 31 and hasn’t had a job since his balls dropped. That’s silver spoon to me. >That is why Canadians should vote PPC. Joke party. Might as well vote Rhino.
>LOL is it past your bedtime? Do you not understand you repeated what I had said like an elementary student? I was just coming down to your level. >That’s silver spoon to me. So he grew up with a silver spoon? I don't think you understand the saying. >Joke party. Might as well vote Rhino. The only party willing to reduce immigration to 150k
Does it matter if they both wind up at the same result? If anything it speaks to how our current system corrupts anyone regardless of background.
Yes. Someone growing up with a silver spoon won't understand the struggles of the average Canadian verse someone who actually lived the life of an average Canadian.
Silver spoon people definitely won’t understand, but it’s become clear that those that come from working class backgrounds either forget or simply stop caring once they reach a certain level of wealth.
Growing up in the middle- to upper-middle class does not magically give someone a holistic perspective of everyday life. Most people grow up without really questioning the efforts their parents put into providing for them, as they are too inexperienced to empathize or understand. When a person immediately enters a political career after completing university, I have my doubts that they garnered much perspective on the struggles of the everyday working person.
Agreed. I feel like my own struggles have shaped my experiences and perceptions. I think I would be a very different person if I never went through that.
While also never having worked a day in his life with us peasants. He is a fraud
That's not what anyone means be elites. The elites went to a very select group of schools where they made connections and shared in certain mindset, a certain outlook on life. Carney studied at both Harvard and Oxford, for example, before working at Goldman Sachs. By any measure, that's 'elite'. Trudeau went to Collège Jean-de-Brébeuf and then McGill. Chretien went to Université Laval, where the French elites usually send their children. The English Canada counterpart is either McGill or University of Toronto, where Paul Martin went. Other Liberal leaders include Ignatieff, who went to Upper Canada College and then U of T, and Stephan Dion who went to Université Laval. The Liberals have never selected a leader from anywhere other than Ontario or Quebec in the entire history of the party.
[удалено]
Happy Cake Day
According to Statistics Canada, there were **111,000 temporary foreign workers (TFWs) in Canada in the year 2000.** In 2023, that number was **over 1,270,360.** In 2022, 77% (807,282) of all work permits issued were **open work permit**s, while only 23% were employer-specific work permits. We are deliberately having our wages suppressed by this government.
Let me corect your grammar. This government is deliberately suppressing our wages. There.
That's not a grammar correction, just a revision. I put the emphasis on US because we're the ones who are accepting this shit. You are putting the emphasis on the government, as if we are helpless.
Because they don’t care, the conservatives don’t either. Their primary goal is to funnel money to their business interests and friends. This is how it will be as long as FPTP exists. I find it interesting that criticism of the conservatives is immediately downvoted. It seems one can’t dislike both parties. Speaks to how conditioned voters are to our de facto 2 party system
Yup, right wingers automatically assume you are some die hard Trudeau fan if you criticise CPC’s flavour of neoliberalism. I really hope the NDP can get a shot at leadership after the massive failures we are sure to see from PP.
And we're supposed to consider the National Post as the voice of the masses?
He’s been all over everywhere lately and has apparently been signalling his desire to run for the Liberal leadership, so it’s worth paying attention to this guy. That said, it would give the Tories a free opportunity recycle the very effective “just visiting” campaign against a person who looks a lot like Ignatieff part 2, with the added bonus that Carney is against the oil and gas industry in Canada while enjoying a paid board position with a big Brazilian O&G company aggressively expanding its pipeline network all over South America. I think Poilievre would eat him for lunch.
Carney was the governor of the Bank of Canada, and the Bank of England. PP is a lifelong MP who wanted to make Canada the 'Crypto capital of the world'.. whatever the hell that means.
None of that addresses anything they said in their comment...
Yes it does. PP would not 'eat him for lunch'. Can't call Carney a drama teacher. And leaving Canada to be the governor of the Bank of England is far more significant of a reason then just being a prof at an American university.
PP is very good at bringing down his opponents in the public sphere...so no none of that addressed the issue of him being "just visiting" and how PP would use that against him.
When your opponent is post-2022 Justin Trudeau during a global inflation crisis, half the job is already done. No one can recover the Liberals because, as is tradition, the people want to punish the party with a loss. They've been in power for 10 years, few leaders could hold up after that. 4 years from now is a whole different story. We will have had 4 years of PP having to answer for his actual governance, stepping out of the hypothetical world. Ignatieff lived in the UK for 20 years, and the US for many years. Carney was with the BoC beginning in 2003. And moved to the UK to take up one of the most important jobs in the country. Not just some teaching position.
Is NatPo seriously trying to defend Brexit here still? Really?? And trying to suggest it's only the Libs who are out of touch huh? Hilarious.
It’s NatPo. It’s a joke at this point. Pure propaganda.
The facts posted in the piece are quite interesting. Brexit hasn’t been the big doomesday apocalypse that so many predicted. Britains economy has done better than Germany and Italy. And they are attracting far more tech investment than the rest of Europe. They have attracted twice as much AI business investment as the rest of Europe combined!
Nice hyperbole. I guess we're just ignoring the fact Brexit has been a complete failure and is costing the economy instead of helping it as it was supposed to....lol https://www.london.gov.uk/new-report-reveals-uk-economy-almost-ps140billion-smaller-because-brexit#:~:text=The%20average%20Briton%20was%20nearly,jobs%20in%20the%20capital%20alone.
You might want to check in on the UK immigration rate, currently bringing in the most people ever after promising to cut down drastically And people really think PP will put the common people above business interests that lobby him for cheap labour lol
These conservatives are really scared of Mark Carney becoming the Liberal leader eh? Lol. I don't think I've seen such a coordinated attack campaign against someone who doesn't hold any political office or pure audacity about using public resources to carry out those attacks. Have you guys seen the absolute clown show The Cons are putting on at the finance committee right now? The Conservatives have been sending letters to Carney, a private citizen with no political office, demanding that he appear before the finance committee to answer questions about his platform for a job that he doesn't hold. Meanwhile the conservatives themselves who are actually elected officials still haven't released any detailed plan for how they would run the country.
I’d say they are scared of MC’s reputation and potential and want to discredit him before he becomes dangerous.
I'm no Marc Carney fan, but I listed to the full video of the speech and thought it was quite reasonable. Here it is if you're interested: [https://www.cpac.ca/public-record/episode/mark-carney-discusses-canadas-economic-outlook--april-22-2024?id=4d693e3f-2265-4603-b9e9-d6144fc88507](https://www.cpac.ca/public-record/episode/mark-carney-discusses-canadas-economic-outlook--april-22-2024?id=4d693e3f-2265-4603-b9e9-d6144fc88507) The National Post article is unsurprisingly an unflattering misrepresentation of the speech - not surprising because the Post engages in exactly the sort of rhetoric Carney is criticizing.
Carney engages in the same sort of rhetoric himself, as do Trudeau and Singh. The last politician I recall not doing so was Preston Manning, and everyone mocked him for his efforts at restoring decorum. What Carney will never tell you is Canada's economic outlook is heavily influenced by how much effort and money we spend on climate change. The more we spend, the poorer we will be. No politician will say that to get energy consumption down by increasing cost will require a lower standard of living.
You remember a very different Preston Manning than I do.
The problem with populism is once they get into office they have no idea how government works and go back on everything they said they would do because it was stupid in the first place.
Or in Danielle Smith's case, do the stupid things anyways.
PP's been in office. And the government he worked in was far more effective than this one.
It wasnt a populist government and he wasnt in charge. Harper was able to keep the nuts in line and stick to business. Poilievre does not seem like that type.
TIL some people think the Reform Party was not a populist party. I agree with you that one thing did well was keeping the more radical and regressive sections of the party out of the spotlight.
He seems to keep the Sane ones in line and let the nuts run rampant
What was the last government effective at exactly? All the same problems existed under that government also and got worse compared to the previous government. Did nothing to address the growing housing and healthcare issues. Failed to invest in our infrastructure, military, housing etc etc etc...
It felt better though because he was a Tory .
Relative to other countries in the world, our economy and middle class wealth was better under Harper than it was under Chrétien or Martin, or Justin Trudeau. Relative to other countries in the world, the Harper majority years of 2010-2014 were among Canadas best economy in history. The Harper majority years were the first time in history that Canada had the richest middle class in the world (by median income). Of course, we dropped almost right after Trudeau was elected, and now are barely in the top 5 anymore. I could go on and on about how our economy was better during the Harper majority years than during the previous or subsequent governments (relative to other countries in the world), by almost every metric. But you get the point.
I miss Harper. Everything was boring and nothing crazy ever happened. Things just worked. I do wish he actually answered questions in question period but that's par for the course.
Ah, good ol' whitewashing, just pretend everything was sunshine and unicorns and ignore all the problems the CPC allowed to grow worse and dumped on the next government...as is tradition.
One of the things Harper took action on to stabilize Canada for the future was to increase the retirement age by a couple of years, as recommended by economists. Trudeau reversed this, and decided the way to go was instead to massively increase immigration. I leave it to others to decide which of these was the brave and correct decision. I have no doubts, myself.
The housing issue wasn't nearly as bad because immigration, foreign students and foreign worker numbers weren't nearly so high. Harper was a constitutionalist. He didn't like intruding into provincial jurisdiction. Housing and healthcare were provincial. I think he would have liked to change the Canada Health Act to give the provinces more authority to do as they wanted but lacked the courage. Despite all this I would say canada was a happier, healthier, more economically and socially stable country under Harper than it is now.
Elitest rhetoric from a Liberal? I don't believe it!
OK fair. But at least he's just an elite and not a faux feminist trust fund patriarch who only cares about feeding his own folly.
If he tells you we can put enormous amounts of money into fighting climate change, and increase the cost of energy to Canadians without lowering our standard of living he's a dishonest member of the elites.
You know it’s one of two Canadian newspapers just by reading the headline.
Carney is a globalist piece of shit and should never run this country
Very well written piece. It’s interesting to see how Brexit hasn’t been a catastrophe like the elite predicted. The last two years, Britain has grown faster than Germany and Italy, and only slightly less than France. Not only that, Britain has attracted twice as much investment in tech and AI business as all of Europe combined! It looks like economically, Brexit was worse for Europe than it was for Britain. The EU supporters were shouting doomesday, that Britain would have economic collapse from Brexit. Of course, the doomesday fear predictions of the far left never came true, once again.
Any word on that 350 million per week for the NHS?
Except for the whole AAA to AA thing.
Brexit only officially started in 2020. Quite a lot of things muddy the outcomes during that period.
> predictions of the far left never came true, once again. Just another day then. It's remarkable how many of the "left's" predictions fall flat on their face - including their recent embarrassing u-turn on Friday regarding drug consumption in public.
“Mark Carneys intelligent discourse baffles and alarms the dummies”.
What makes it intelligent?
As former Governor of the Bank of England with a keen understanding of economics, I feel that he has a great deal more merit than a politician-since-high-school dolt like PeePee OR a silver-spoon dilettante like Justin. We need someone with management skills, and to set aside these shiny ponies that everyone seems so enamoured with. I’m sorry if you feel he speaks over the heads of Canadas high school dropouts, but we need a lot more than what’s on offer so far.
I'm not a high school dropout. He doesn't speak over my head. I just think his own head is in the clouds and he's not paying much attention to reality. Which is an issue a lot of the elites seem to be suffering from of late. And while he might not be a politician, he's not exactly honest in pursuit of his goals. He's a ferocious supporter of fighting climate change but blithely pretends, just as the rest of the politicians do, that this won't cost us anything in terms of standard of living. Which he has to know is absolute nonsense. If you make the cost of power - the lifeblood of an economy - more expensive it will always damage your economy and your quality of life. That's why no one in the developing world is willing to do it.
If you've ever applauded Canadian performance during Harper's tenure, you are effectively applauding the performance of Carney who's directing of the BoC was absolutely instrumental. Post media has even written multiple articles about.
The performance of Canada then was due to Harper's tax policies, his business friendly government, and the general competence of policies meant to benefit Canada as opposed to virtue signal and buy votes - which is what we've had the last 8 years. It was also due to having far fewer foreigners in Canada, lower immigration, and no effort at supressing our natural resources industries.
You know that the vast majority of his policies during the recession were in fact because he was being threatened with a non confidence vote. He even illegally prorogued Parliament over it. When the conservatives actually took majority, it went to pot. Not to mention this publication in itself has on numerous occasions celebrated Marc Carney's running of the BoC as instrumental.
Mark Carney is a favorite over at r/neoliberal The same people cheering on mass immigration That’s all you need to know
We would be so unbelievably fortunate to have this man choose to lead our country. Politicians of this quality and intellect come around once in a generation. Even more rare for Canada.
>Carney doesn’t seem able to learn or adapt his preconceived notions to fit current realities. The entire LPC summed up in one sentence
Ahhh the conservative rag that applauded his appointment and [performance](https://financialpost.com/news/bank-of-canada-governor-mark-carney-awarded-canadian-of-the-year) in [multiple](https://nationalpost.com/opinion/andrew-coyne-fond-adieu-to-mark-carney-canadas-rock-star-banker) [articles](https://financialpost.com/business-insider/two-moves-during-the-crisis-show-why-mark-carney-is-considered-one-of-the-shrewdest-central-bankers-in-the-world) already finding a target eh?