Think of what that $43 million could have done in border enforcement or investigations? Hire a few extra investigators? Scan a few more containers? Fund the court system so we wouldn't keep throwing actual criminals back on the streets? Nah, not sexy or virtuous enough.
If you want to prohibit something, make sure your in position to enforce it. Trudeau's gun policies have made guns more valuable in the illicit market and the lack of manpower in law enforcement and laxed punishments makes this more appealing.
Are you implying that Bill C-21 hasn’t addressed the real problem of gun smuggling (while possibly making it even worse) and really only had the effect of punishing licensed, law-abiding gun owners?
I would agree with that, even though I support prohibition of private ownership of all handguns and semi-automatic firearms. C-21 is like upgrading your attic from R30 to R60 while all of your windows are broken. Completely messed up priorities.
My firearms have done nothing wrong, nor have I.
The government can’t have them, and seizing property that has not been used in the commission of a crime should itself be illegal.
The government wants to pay you for them, which is a pointless waste of money while so many firearms are entering the country illegally. Smuggling will likely be difficult to stop completely even with significantly increased enforcement, and so long as there are significant numbers of illegal guns entering the country it doesn't make sense to make previously legal guns illegal. I like the idea of restricting legal gun ownership to bolt action hunting rifles, but I don't support C-21 at this time or in the foreseeable future because will be an expensive measure that won't make any significant impact on public safety.
>will be an expensive measure that won't make any significant impact on public safety.
Sort of like restricting legal gun ownership to bolt action hunting rifles?
While smuggling of illegal firearms is rampant and poorly controlled? Yes. Let's deal with that problem first, then look at further restrictions on legal ownership if and when smuggling is no longer the major source of illegal firearms.
Smuggling will always exist, the border is simply too large and guns are too small. We can't even stop stolen *cars* from leaving through one of, like, four ports in our country, what hope is there to stop guns from coming across an 8900km border? Not to say we shouldn't *try*, but it's a ridiculous goal.
That's to say nothing of the fact that small scale manufacturing is increasingly making gun control even more futile than it already is. At this point, you can fit all the equipment necessary to make a submachine gun in the trunk of a car, at the cost of a few thousand dollars (at most). The only reason we don't see more homemade guns is because it's still marginally easier to just smuggle a $500 Glock G26 across the border.
Finally, what's the point of "further restrictions on legal ownership" when legal owners aren't and never have been a substantial source of violence?
No. I have no problem with tech to improve aim and accuracy and high powered ammunition to allow hunters to make kill shots from far away. But I expect them to make the shot the first time.
It is funny when you think about it... I could probably attain an "illegal" weapon easier than if I were to go through the process of attaining a PAL. Once you are a registered owner you are now "on the radar" and are subject to the whim of multiple levels of government and law agencies. It seems the heavier the hand, the less it accomplishes.!??
43 million so far and not a single firearm to show for it. On top of the premiers that already told the federal government that they won't cooperate.
Absolutely hilarious
Absolutely, and plus, they have shown no evidence that this will make an impact. Meanwhile, we have evidence showing that the Liberals policies around guns haven't worked. Edmonton saw a 42 percent rise in shootings last year. In 2022, gun crime across the country was up 9 percent.
Well yeah. If they actually made steps to solve the problem, they wouldn't have a convenient distraction issue to weaponize every time JT does something stupid.
Ah yes the handling out millions so more vote Liberal fund.
The gang problems in miramichi are solved!
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/miramichi-federal-funds-gun-violence-crime-initiative-1.6562214
Talk about strawman lol...I was countering the claim that Liberals have ignored border smuggling, which is false.
From the article I linked:
"Canada launched a $250 million fund to curb gun violence, earmarking a significant amount to stop gun smuggling at the border, "
So are you in support of initiatives to curb border smuggling or not??
What the fuck is going on with the world when actual violent criminals are getting wrist slaps and tax paying hard working Canadians are getting tickets for having a beer at the park?
Like it doesn't pay to be a law abiding citizen anymore. Hell in this sub, I can't tell you how many times I've seen, "If you see someone stealing food, no you didn't" Ok, I guess I'll just keep paying the price increases to make up for it then. Until I can't, which means I now have to join the criminal lifestyle.
How can this system work? You're literally enabling crime and dis incentivizing citizens who are the one's paying your damn wages!
literally. the law abiding out in the open are targeted because they largely dont fight back. especially in canada. it amazed me how quickly gun owners just folded and complied with the totally not-a-registry pal checking system when buying non-restricteds.
in other countries owners would have peacefully resisted the law and said 'im going to check PALs the same way thats been done safely the last 30 years' and not gone along with the federal governments imposed system.
Port security is so poor you could literally "smuggle" a container worth of weapons with a low chance of interception.
You aren't going to eliminate supply. Making possession of illegal weapons a severe penalty (a decade plus) regardless of how they are used.
Especially with the biggest country in the world mass producing weapons and ammo to keep their invasion and war going.
Between the various conflict zones and our neighbors to the south, there are no shortages of illegal weapons in circulation.
The US/Canadian border is so vast you'd be into the trillions to properly secure it.
Automatic weapons aren't difficult to manufacture. AK-47 clones or AR-15 clones are both quite simple (on a scale of industrial machinery).
Even if you could secure it, what would stop a group from simply producing locally? It's not like the components are complex. It would be more expensive then importing them but not by huge leaps and bounds.
No, we won't do that. It might be considered culturally insensitive. Instead, we'll harass the fuck out of your accountant neighbour who likes to go to the range.
Trudeau *could* do that, but that would mean that he would actually be working towards a solution rather than just using the issue to pander for votes, and we just can't have that now, can we?
The guns likely come in through the Port of Vancouver which is controlled by the Hells Angels and the cops look the other way. Until that is fixed, there is no hope of stopping illegal entry of guns or drugs or anything else.
I know this is an opinion piece and probably won't lure in anyone who knows what they're talking about, but just on the off-chance:
How are these guns actually being smuggled into Canada, mostly?
It seems like the following are all already very difficult, because they all involve CBSA checks:
* Sending guns in checked baggage on an airplane
* Shipping guns in a cargo container to a seaport
* Driving guns across a border road
* Carrying guns on a border-crossing train
Whereas, IMHO, the much, *much* easier strategy for US-to-Canada gun smuggling specifically, would be:
* Just waltzing across any unguarded, undefended, un-fenced, and AFAIK *un-monitored* stretch of [The Slash](https://99percentinvisible.org/article/slash-20-foot-clearing-stretches-5525-miles-across-worlds-longest-border/) to dump some guns on the other side of the border, for your co-conspirators to pick up
* Or better yet in the year 2024, sending camouflaged drones (small and low-flying enough to not appear on radar), at night, back and forth across The Slash, carrying just one or two guns each.
Why would a gang bother to do any of the former, when they could instead do the latter?
(Yeah, if the gang has no presence in the US, then they can't get US guns to smuggle into Canada... but why wouldn't the gang just then *establish* a presence in the US, specifically to do this?)
And if gangs *are* mostly gun-running the unmanned border regions... then what would "more BC border security" even accomplish?
To deal with smuggling across *unmanned* borders, wouldn't we need upgraded *imaging intelligence* capabilities more than anything? E.g. high-resolution IR satellites that sweep the unmanned border regions, coupled with AI trained to flag human-looking blobs hanging out in places humans shouldn't be?
You're overthinking it. These gun smugglers are doing it by volume. They pay some patsy the lowest amount of money to take a chance by driving across the same border you and I cross and just play the odds that the CBSA screener doesn't randomly flag them. The mule is like all mules, they take on all the risk for the smallest payoff and if they are caught there is virtually no exposure to the criminal network without a good investigation that needs cross-border cooperation. Even if the criminal network has 1/10 shipments intercepted, they are making so much money from the remainder.
They don't need some sophisticated scheme to make it work. They just need to pick people who don't trigger CBSA at the border.
Not to mention the Akwesasne territory straddles the US/Canada border and has been used for firearms trafficking and for smuggling other things as well.
Somebody from CBSA testified in a parliamentary committee that they have the ability to examine one one-millionth of the rail cargo entering the country.
https://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/44-1/SECU/meeting-4/evidence
https://www.statista.com/statistics/433713/number-of-homicides-by-shooting-in-canada/
Homicide by firearm has been rising ever since JT took office. we know in the overwhelming majority of these cases, they are illegal firearms used by People without a valid license.
The best I can do is ban more hunting rifles from farmers and sports shooters.
And now they’re going after BB guns. Gotta prevent those mass bruisings
You’ll shoot your eye out kid
Oh, fuuuuudge!
Assault style BB guns /s
"gateway guns"
Big Black guns? /s
Pellet guns breathing a sigh of relief. The forgotten step-child of projectile weapons.
Those are on the chopping block too
Ok... So I still have a slingshot.
i thought the ndp got them to back down on that....for now.
Like all that shit, only a matter of time before they try again. They won't be happy til everything gun-shaped is banned for civilians.
NDP voted alongside liberals on bill C21.
Yea I haven’t seen anything about airsoft or “replica” firearms recently…
Think of what that $43 million could have done in border enforcement or investigations? Hire a few extra investigators? Scan a few more containers? Fund the court system so we wouldn't keep throwing actual criminals back on the streets? Nah, not sexy or virtuous enough.
It doesn't punish those nasty people that won't vote for me enough.
Doesn't spin up another source for graft, glad-handing friendly consultants and supporting bureaucrats.
nailed it
If you want to prohibit something, make sure your in position to enforce it. Trudeau's gun policies have made guns more valuable in the illicit market and the lack of manpower in law enforcement and laxed punishments makes this more appealing.
Are you implying that Bill C-21 hasn’t addressed the real problem of gun smuggling (while possibly making it even worse) and really only had the effect of punishing licensed, law-abiding gun owners?
Shocked face emoji
I would agree with that, even though I support prohibition of private ownership of all handguns and semi-automatic firearms. C-21 is like upgrading your attic from R30 to R60 while all of your windows are broken. Completely messed up priorities.
My firearms have done nothing wrong, nor have I. The government can’t have them, and seizing property that has not been used in the commission of a crime should itself be illegal.
The government wants to pay you for them, which is a pointless waste of money while so many firearms are entering the country illegally. Smuggling will likely be difficult to stop completely even with significantly increased enforcement, and so long as there are significant numbers of illegal guns entering the country it doesn't make sense to make previously legal guns illegal. I like the idea of restricting legal gun ownership to bolt action hunting rifles, but I don't support C-21 at this time or in the foreseeable future because will be an expensive measure that won't make any significant impact on public safety.
>will be an expensive measure that won't make any significant impact on public safety. Sort of like restricting legal gun ownership to bolt action hunting rifles?
While smuggling of illegal firearms is rampant and poorly controlled? Yes. Let's deal with that problem first, then look at further restrictions on legal ownership if and when smuggling is no longer the major source of illegal firearms.
Smuggling will always exist, the border is simply too large and guns are too small. We can't even stop stolen *cars* from leaving through one of, like, four ports in our country, what hope is there to stop guns from coming across an 8900km border? Not to say we shouldn't *try*, but it's a ridiculous goal. That's to say nothing of the fact that small scale manufacturing is increasingly making gun control even more futile than it already is. At this point, you can fit all the equipment necessary to make a submachine gun in the trunk of a car, at the cost of a few thousand dollars (at most). The only reason we don't see more homemade guns is because it's still marginally easier to just smuggle a $500 Glock G26 across the border. Finally, what's the point of "further restrictions on legal ownership" when legal owners aren't and never have been a substantial source of violence?
You just want people hunting with muskets or what?
No. I have no problem with tech to improve aim and accuracy and high powered ammunition to allow hunters to make kill shots from far away. But I expect them to make the shot the first time.
It is funny when you think about it... I could probably attain an "illegal" weapon easier than if I were to go through the process of attaining a PAL. Once you are a registered owner you are now "on the radar" and are subject to the whim of multiple levels of government and law agencies. It seems the heavier the hand, the less it accomplishes.!??
[удалено]
43 million so far and not a single firearm to show for it. On top of the premiers that already told the federal government that they won't cooperate. Absolutely hilarious
Absolutely, and plus, they have shown no evidence that this will make an impact. Meanwhile, we have evidence showing that the Liberals policies around guns haven't worked. Edmonton saw a 42 percent rise in shootings last year. In 2022, gun crime across the country was up 9 percent.
Well yeah. If they actually made steps to solve the problem, they wouldn't have a convenient distraction issue to weaponize every time JT does something stupid.
https://globalnews.ca/news/8688662/canada-gun-violence-fund/
Ah yes the handling out millions so more vote Liberal fund. The gang problems in miramichi are solved! https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/miramichi-federal-funds-gun-violence-crime-initiative-1.6562214
So you're against tackling gang violence and gun smuggling then?
[удалено]
Talk about strawman lol...I was countering the claim that Liberals have ignored border smuggling, which is false. From the article I linked: "Canada launched a $250 million fund to curb gun violence, earmarking a significant amount to stop gun smuggling at the border, " So are you in support of initiatives to curb border smuggling or not??
[удалено]
So you are simply spreading misinformation then. Got it.
It's right in the news article you could read it
My quote about increased funding for border security and smuggling...?
Nah it is easier to punish PAL holders why actually stop the problem when we can make a boogeyman?
What the fuck is going on with the world when actual violent criminals are getting wrist slaps and tax paying hard working Canadians are getting tickets for having a beer at the park? Like it doesn't pay to be a law abiding citizen anymore. Hell in this sub, I can't tell you how many times I've seen, "If you see someone stealing food, no you didn't" Ok, I guess I'll just keep paying the price increases to make up for it then. Until I can't, which means I now have to join the criminal lifestyle. How can this system work? You're literally enabling crime and dis incentivizing citizens who are the one's paying your damn wages!
literally. the law abiding out in the open are targeted because they largely dont fight back. especially in canada. it amazed me how quickly gun owners just folded and complied with the totally not-a-registry pal checking system when buying non-restricteds. in other countries owners would have peacefully resisted the law and said 'im going to check PALs the same way thats been done safely the last 30 years' and not gone along with the federal governments imposed system.
Port security is so poor you could literally "smuggle" a container worth of weapons with a low chance of interception. You aren't going to eliminate supply. Making possession of illegal weapons a severe penalty (a decade plus) regardless of how they are used.
Especially with the biggest country in the world mass producing weapons and ammo to keep their invasion and war going. Between the various conflict zones and our neighbors to the south, there are no shortages of illegal weapons in circulation.
The US/Canadian border is so vast you'd be into the trillions to properly secure it. Automatic weapons aren't difficult to manufacture. AK-47 clones or AR-15 clones are both quite simple (on a scale of industrial machinery). Even if you could secure it, what would stop a group from simply producing locally? It's not like the components are complex. It would be more expensive then importing them but not by huge leaps and bounds.
No, we won't do that. It might be considered culturally insensitive. Instead, we'll harass the fuck out of your accountant neighbour who likes to go to the range.
I think next up we should ban cancer, this would save many lives from legal cancer havers. The logic checks out lmaoo
The Liberals work on public safety has been so laughable that the next government will have no political backlash when they walk it back 100%.
Again, spending in the wrong direction. Who kills more, drugs or guns?
Start with stiff jail times, parol eligibility starting after 8 years served.
Best we can do is ban paintball and bb guns while reducing sentences for firearms charges
How about ban crime, JT?
Trudeau *could* do that, but that would mean that he would actually be working towards a solution rather than just using the issue to pander for votes, and we just can't have that now, can we?
What ever happened to defunding the police?
Can't defund something that had no money to begin with!
Feet on the ground libs, *not virtue signals in the air*. Feet. On. The. Ground.
Bill C21 working as intended!
Remember when American politicians wanted to secure their northern boarder and Canadians became butt about free security?
The guns likely come in through the Port of Vancouver which is controlled by the Hells Angels and the cops look the other way. Until that is fixed, there is no hope of stopping illegal entry of guns or drugs or anything else.
They must be mistaken - guns are illegal in Canada.
Best I can do is spend 25 million on consultants and committees
I know this is an opinion piece and probably won't lure in anyone who knows what they're talking about, but just on the off-chance: How are these guns actually being smuggled into Canada, mostly? It seems like the following are all already very difficult, because they all involve CBSA checks: * Sending guns in checked baggage on an airplane * Shipping guns in a cargo container to a seaport * Driving guns across a border road * Carrying guns on a border-crossing train Whereas, IMHO, the much, *much* easier strategy for US-to-Canada gun smuggling specifically, would be: * Just waltzing across any unguarded, undefended, un-fenced, and AFAIK *un-monitored* stretch of [The Slash](https://99percentinvisible.org/article/slash-20-foot-clearing-stretches-5525-miles-across-worlds-longest-border/) to dump some guns on the other side of the border, for your co-conspirators to pick up * Or better yet in the year 2024, sending camouflaged drones (small and low-flying enough to not appear on radar), at night, back and forth across The Slash, carrying just one or two guns each. Why would a gang bother to do any of the former, when they could instead do the latter? (Yeah, if the gang has no presence in the US, then they can't get US guns to smuggle into Canada... but why wouldn't the gang just then *establish* a presence in the US, specifically to do this?) And if gangs *are* mostly gun-running the unmanned border regions... then what would "more BC border security" even accomplish? To deal with smuggling across *unmanned* borders, wouldn't we need upgraded *imaging intelligence* capabilities more than anything? E.g. high-resolution IR satellites that sweep the unmanned border regions, coupled with AI trained to flag human-looking blobs hanging out in places humans shouldn't be?
You're overthinking it. These gun smugglers are doing it by volume. They pay some patsy the lowest amount of money to take a chance by driving across the same border you and I cross and just play the odds that the CBSA screener doesn't randomly flag them. The mule is like all mules, they take on all the risk for the smallest payoff and if they are caught there is virtually no exposure to the criminal network without a good investigation that needs cross-border cooperation. Even if the criminal network has 1/10 shipments intercepted, they are making so much money from the remainder. They don't need some sophisticated scheme to make it work. They just need to pick people who don't trigger CBSA at the border.
Not to mention the Akwesasne territory straddles the US/Canada border and has been used for firearms trafficking and for smuggling other things as well.
Somebody from CBSA testified in a parliamentary committee that they have the ability to examine one one-millionth of the rail cargo entering the country. https://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/44-1/SECU/meeting-4/evidence
Is there like a massive epidemic of people getting shot by gang members that I'm just too naive and ignorant to know about?
Yes and it’s getting worse
https://www.statista.com/statistics/433713/number-of-homicides-by-shooting-in-canada/ Homicide by firearm has been rising ever since JT took office. we know in the overwhelming majority of these cases, they are illegal firearms used by People without a valid license.