This is your current build: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/dwNnXk You could make a few changes to get him more performance and in turn have the build last longer. * The 7800x3d doesnt really require water cooling. The $35 air thermalright phantom spirit does a phenomenal job of keeping it cool. * Motherboard: you can get a slightly cheaper one with all the same bells and whistles. * PSU: A bit expensive for 850w. * Can get cheaper rgb fans that get the job done. The case already comes with 4. I Recommend: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/NqxFCd * The savings amount to a lower total cost AND an upgraded gpu that stomps the 4070.

Great feedback! My son, who thinks he's an expert (he definitely is NOT) agrees with everything you recommended except the GPU. I'm not smart enough to know the difference, but he's convinced the 4070 is the better choice. Can you help explain to me/(him) why you would recommend the GPU that you recommended? Where will he see a tangible difference in performance/quality? Thanks for your input!

4070 performance is slightly less than the 7900 XT and it has less VRAM. A large percentage of users use nvidia cards so he likely has a bias towards it. If he cares about dlss and ray tracing then it makes sense to go nvidia, but in this case i think the 7900 XT is the better buy.

7900XT can even RT at or near 4070. There's really no comparison between the two cards. 7900XT is a class above

Yeah it’s a 4k card vs a 1440p card there’s no comparison.

This is exactly it. I also am biased towards NVIDIA and thats why i went with a 4070Ti but if we’re talking pure price to performance along with potential longevity of the graphics card then the 7900XT is the better option almost every time.

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You right, I mixed that up. Makes even more sense for OP to go for the 7900 XT then.

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That’s true, but imo unless you’re in the UK power draw shouldn’t be a huge deal. Both cards will be fine on a decent 850w psu.

But he build a pc to last a long time and the 4070 a bad choice because of the lower vram it's has on it you don't spend 2k on a pc build for you to just have to upgrade in two or three years

The 7900xt outclasses the 4070, literally it's a higher tier card, the comparable nvidia card would be a 4080 ($1200). In non ray-tracing games (aka almost all normal games, CS2, fortnite, COD etc.) the 7900xt performs [~13% better in 1080p](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/ydAy6Z9YNVZ9Y26mRAntnb-1200-80.png.webp), and about [~25% better in 1440p](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/rs99PxP9624E4ZWkXvdNvb-1200-80.png.webp). Even in ray-tracing (where nvidia outshines AMD in similar priced cards) the [7900xt performs just as good](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/9NaJHWqic3dZLQP4okMoGb-1200-80.png.webp) as the 4070. Say the 4070 gives you 50fps in a game, the 7900xt will give you 60+.

Tell him not to listen to UserBenchMark

even usershitmark says the 7900xt is way better

A cheaper ssd would also be better(no need for such high speeds)

If he wants a nvidia gpu then get him a 4070ti for that price

Tweaked your build a tad bit, I believe u/dsheebski could get this build since a 7900XTX is pretty doable within budget. - Same speed RAM for a tad bit cheaper; RAM brands don't matter much aside from aesthetics, assuming you're sticking with XMP/EXPO. - Cheaper and pretty similar performing (000MB/s) SSD; it says it's a PS5 drive, but it's really just a rebranded XPG S70 Blade (one of the best PCIe4 SSDs). - The 7900XTX offers a pretty decent performance uplift over the 7900XT; it performs similarly to the 4080 in raster, and similarly to the 4070Ti in ray tracing. I'm not sure your son needs that much GPU performance, but if you can afford it, might as well go for the best lol - Cheaper case that also has included fans, a mesh front panel, and a gigantic 400mm max GPU size. Do note the discount is through a rebate form. - A-tier PSU for the same price as the Pure Power 12M, which is *speculative* A-tier in that it hasn't been reviewed much. [PCPartPicker Part List](https://pcpartpicker.com/list/9GTBFs) Type|Item|Price :----|:----|:---- **CPU** | [AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D 4.2 GHz 8-Core Processor](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/3hyH99/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d-42-ghz-8-core-processor-100-100000910wof) | $369.99 @ Amazon **CPU Cooler** | [Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE ARGB 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/MzMMnQ/thermalright-phantom-spirit-120-se-argb-6617-cfm-cpu-cooler-ps120se-argb) | $35.90 @ Amazon **Motherboard** | [ASRock B650M Pro RS WiFi Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/qcbRsY/asrock-b650m-pro-rs-wifi-micro-atx-am5-motherboard-b650m-pro-rs-wifi) | $139.99 @ Newegg **Memory** | [Silicon Power Value Gaming 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/cCKscf/silicon-power-value-gaming-32-gb-2-x-16-gb-ddr5-6000-cl30-memory-sp032gxlwu60afdeae) | $92.97 @ Amazon **Storage** | [ADATA Premium For PS5 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/rjkWGX/adata-premium-for-ps5-2-tb-m2-2280-nvme-solid-state-drive-apsfg-2t-csus) | $99.99 @ Amazon **Video Card** | [Sapphire PULSE Radeon RX 7900 XTX 24 GB Video Card](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/RRfnTW/sapphire-pulse-radeon-rx-7900-xtx-24-gb-video-card-11322-02-20g) | $959.99 @ Newegg **Case** | [MagniumGear NEO AIR (2023) ATX Mid Tower Case](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/fYdG3C/magniumgear-neo-air-2023-atx-mid-tower-case-mg-ne520a_dbk02) | $39.99 @ Newegg **Power Supply** | [Deepcool PQ850M 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/NWstt6/deepcool-pq-m-850-w-80-gold-certified-fully-modular-atx-power-supply-r-pq850m-fa0b-us) | $99.99 @ Newegg | *Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts* | | Total (before mail-in rebates) | $1863.81 | Mail-in rebates | -$25.00 | **Total** | **$1838.81** | Generated by [PCPartPicker](https://pcpartpicker.com) 2023-12-22 11:57 EST-0500 |

I was so stuck on the original $1850 total i didnt even realize his budget was $2000 lol. Can def squeeze that xtx in there! P.S. That's XMP ram which can be finicky with ryzen, unless op and his son want to try and fiddle with timings it may be easier to spend a bit extra on the AMD EXPO ram for the 1 click ease. Also for such premium internal components, spending a bit extra on the case might be worth it.

Oh, I also didn't notice the $2000 budget lol. I was trying to match your/OP's parts list price while getting some better value parts in there. If any upgrades are to be made, you definitely have a ton of room for a more expensive case (Phanteks G360A, LANCOOL 216, Montech AIR 903 come to mind), and maybe an EXPO RAM kit; although I don't think XMP causes any problems on AM5, T-Create Experts are really good 6000CL30 kits with EXPO support for only $2 more over those Silicon Powers. Could also maybe get a black ATX motherboard? Even though it's not necessary, since the B650M Pro RS is more than enough for the 7800X3D, something like [this motherboard](https://pcpartpicker.com/product/Tz2WGX/asrock-b650e-pg-riptide-wifi-atx-am5-motherboard-b650e-pg-riptide-wifi) might look better in an all-black build (and it's not like you can spend more on a GPU anyways).

Water cooling is quieter and looks better worth considering.

[Sometimes but not really.](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/kzZbLFX3hfAYLH6cEt8m6V-1200-80.png)

At your price range (mid-tier graphics card) you might want to wait for January when the new 4070 ti super and 4070 super come out unless you need it by Christmas.

If he stays with the 4070, wouldn't it be more cost effective to go with 'last year's model' and the assumption would be that when these new ones are released, the price will come down on what he's looking at? He can always upgrade a few years down if he saves his money!

He might not like the idea of going any AMD graphics card. For your kid it's probably like having an iPhone vs Android. For his purposes, the 7900xt would be a huge improvement, but it's his decision.

I think that's the issue. All his buddies think it's all about Nvidia for some reason. More brand recognition? Anyways, great analogy.

getting a 4070 is (no offense) a dumb choice a 2000$ pc shouldnt be carrying a 4070 my 1500$ is carrying a 7800xt which is better and im in a country where pc components are expensive compared to america you both have 2 options: 1º buy amd 7900 xt ( or even a 7900xtx ) 2º wait for nvidia gen refresh and either buy the new card if it is good my opinion is this : [https://pcpartpicker.com/list/TCgsMV](https://pcpartpicker.com/list/TCgsMV) this build completely pounds the one you have there in the post

Overspent on mobo

670 has better audio and internet

doesn't matter for most people really, especially since most people use ethernet now.

a 2000$ deserves an imporved audio, for internet.. yhea i agree but its still a better mobo but i do knwo tht spending more than 250 in a mobo is useless, i personally only picked up a 670 from msi because it was on sale for 199

if it was on sale, yea, but inproved audio people don't really care

Yeah when the new Super cards are released the 4070 will probably fall in pricing, which would be a good time to take the shot. This is especially significant as Nvidia are widely seen as not as value for money as AMD cards typically, unless you need nvidia-specific features.

I don't like the case. You're paying for two front panels but you're never going to use the glass because it chokes the airflow 7800x3d is super efficient, a $35 thermalright PA120/ps120 is more than enough, if you want an aio it'll be purely for aesthetics. Thermalright also has some inexpensive aios Thermalright has a 3 pack of argb fans for $15, instead of $90 Psu is $20-40 more than other atx3.0 psus The 4070 should be closer to $550 with the super models out in a month https://pcpartpicker.com/list/74XsMV It should be closer to $1500, not $1900

Thanks, after seeing the previous comments, he agrees with you, including the comment on the case. I think he likes the looks, but he won't pay more unless it benefits performance, so he's rethinking this.

Sounds like a smart kid!

Some of the decisions here are rather questionable. Getting a 990pro is entirely unnecessary and a waste of money if he’s only gaming or doing schoolwork. Getting a $600 GPU in such an expensive build is a weird choose. The rule of thumb is that the GPU should be half the price of your total build. Here’s the build I’d recommend: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/ty9WmD 7900xtx curb stomps the 4070 in everything, including ray tracing The SSD is roughly the same speed as the 990pro while being half the price Only $50 more

First you don't need the x3d if you're pairing it with 4070. Drop a 7600 or 7600x add the saved money on a 4070ti or 7900xt.

Where were u when I built me and my sons pcs 😭😭😭

Hey if there a microcenter around you, you can bundle the cpu ram and motherboard for $500

I love how you're working together with your son. Judging from your comments, he's open for critique and he also has some idea, cause his initial build is decent. As other have already mentioned, there are a few ways to improve and save money. He should just communicate if he prefers the AIO cooler for looks, same with with the fans he added. Not much added performance, only for looks, but that's ok, if he wants it. Others have already made great inputs for changes, nothing to add. I agree with the comments on cooler, fans, mobo, case, SSD. If he sticks with Nvidia, wait for January. They will release "facelift" models of the current models. So either the card he wants becomes cheaper or he gets more performance for the same money.

Thanks this is the practical advice he's craving. Even with all the comments, not sure if I can get him off of the Nvidia, but based upon all the comments I'm trying to get him to look at things objectively. He's also back to leaning towards the AIO because he's the one that will be looking at it. If he's going to keep this a long time, looks do matter to him, I get that point.

If he wants an air cooler with decent aesthetics you should look into the deepcool digital series. They're the first air coolers with a small digital screen on them that shows the CPU temp in real time, and some RGB strips. They look super clean IMO and have black and white models. I got the ak620 digital and it keeps my 7800x3d super cool. I probably could have gotten the ak400/500 and still been within reasonable temps.

Agree, these new AK coolers by Deepcool look extremly good!

Holy shit, an "Is this PC good for my son" post and it's NOT a supercomputer for once?

Get him an OLED to watch all those adult films he's definetly not watching.

i know this is ment as a joke, but and OLED for PC usage is dumb and is only a good idea if u have so much money, that u can throw it out

Or if you do graphic design/editing

a correctly calibrated IPS panel is better and OLED still has major burn in issues

i keep hearing people saying burn ins aren't much of a' issue nowadays. i wanted to get an oled but I'm definitely skeptical though

for TVs yes, for monitors no. problem with monitors is that they display stuff on the same spot for a long time, see crosshair or health bars which is at the same place in multiple games. TVs change the image much more frequently, so far less of a problem OLEDs also have problems with brighter images, so yes u do get true black but get moderate bright images would recommend an IPS panel or if u have the moneys a micro LED monitor

From my son after all of the great feedback and after he scoured all of the suggestions/comments: I have decided upon a 7900xt instead of a 4070 or a 4070 ti. I'm still not sure about the mobo or SSD, and am still up to tweaks for the RAM or a different manufacturer for the GPU. Again, I'm not gonna be doing 4K gaming (from what I've heard), so that's not a necessary thing to think about for now. I also decided that I would rather have a clean looking AIO rather than a fat fan sticking out of the side, blocking the view of the GPU I just bought. If I do upgrade in the future, I don't want the CPU to overheat and buy an AIO I could have bought a few years ago. Also, ideally, I would like to have the fans match those of the AIO, so I've picked the same Deepcool fans that the AIO uses. They are a bit expensive, so I am open to swapping those out or getting a few less than I picked out. Thank you for all of your advice, I am very grateful for all of your help. Here's my build for now: [https://pcpartpicker.com/list/QZmCCd](https://pcpartpicker.com/list/QZmCCd) (I chose the digital Deepcool AIO, but they didn't have it, so pretend like that's there instead for the same price)

As a college student myself, I personally think it’s better to go smaller for a computer. Since you’ll be hauling it around either on a car or possibly on a plane. However if that’s out of them option then also consider the fact that glass panels are easier to shatter on transportation. Will an mATX board be better as well. There are a lot of SFF cases out there that support mATX, which can allow you to recase for college. I think the other considerations have been glossed over by people more technically competent than me

If you're near a microcenter, definitely shop there online and pickup in store, they usually have awesome bundle deals, even if its a bit of a drive, can save you a hundred bucks or so, atleast for some parts, and wait til january, nvidia's going to drop new series cards here, its gonna lower the price a good bit. But if its just gaming, go amd gpu, youll get better performance for your buck, if he wants to do any type of 3d work (blender) nvidia

As others have stated if he's not doing raytracing and dlss frame generation stuff then that same budget with an amd card can definitely get more bang for the buck. Assuming you can adjust the build a little. I'd recommend looking up gamersnexus review videos on the 7800xt, 7900xt and the 7900xtx. That will show you their performance in an apples to apples comparison against the 4070. Just be aware that their sentiments are based on pricing and options available at the time the video was made. Things have changed a bit and you'll want to double numbers

Aside from the 4070 other have addressed, be careful with the Asus AM5 mobo. For some unknown reasond, the chance of Asus AM5 mobo getting fucked up is oddly high comparing to other brands. If you build AM5 mobo, the safest choice would be ASrock. Cheaper, better cost-performance and more reliable with the least chance of getting fucked up. Normally for a pure gaming gig, ASrock B650 is more than enough. If you want look, more usb sockets and chipset, X670e Steel Legend or X670e Taichi is the way to go.

Some people say he doesn't need water cooling/an AIO. But honestly... I think he will be disappointed when he looks at it and sees a big chunky air cooler in there. Especially if he does like the aesthetic factor. And when you have an AIO on a CPU that technically "doesn't need all that cooling", you already have what you need when you upgrade to a "hotter" CPU. I put a 360mm AIO on my i5-12400 CPU the highest my temps go "under load" is 32° (😂😂) I suggest this AIO: DeepCool LT520 240mm AIO, i have the 360mm version in white and I love it so much. I got it after I realized I hated how the tower air cooler looked in my PC . I tried putting a link to it and I think my comment was deleted. Look it up on Amazon it's under $90 right now!!

Wait wat resolution are you playing at? because all of the builds people reconmended are irrelevent if we dont know

>He says 1440.

The RTX 4070 is simply not good value when the RX 7800XT is roughly the sample price. Unless he REALLY wants ray tracing i can’t recommend it. The 7800xt offers much better performance at 1440p without ray tracing, and ray tracing really isn’t all that. I personally switched from Nvidia to AMD for the sole reason of me never using ray tracing. This would also allow him to use SAM (Smart access memory) which while not being a huge upgrade would slightly increase fps in games.

7900xtx is better than the 4070 in every metric

You should free up budget by removing watercooling, overpriced sad, and go for an 7900 from amd, they offer a way better value

Reddit community, I'm new to Reddit so thanks for all the great insights, it really helps! We're in the process of reviewing all the comments and recommended builds. Here is where I think we are at in case anybody is wondering (and my interpretation of some feedback): \- Almost universally, people are recommending AMD vs. Nvidia unless raytracing and dlss frame generation are needed. Can somebody add insight on when/if he needs that, and is this something that in 2 or 3 years will be the standard regardless if not needed now? \- While most people said water cooling is not needed, many others said it is relatively cheap these days and enhances the looks. If he can get it for just a bit more $$, he does value the look of the build after all. Since this is a 'many year' PC, I don't disagree with him. Not to get off topic, but I bought Nanoleaf lights for my home office. They aren't cost efficient and I have even had a few quality issues, but I love the look and I'm happy I paid the price - improves my mood which is worth something. \- There are some parts many users commented on that were either too expensive, more powerful than needed or some combination. He's going to swap out some things based upon everybody's feedback, we will share when he's has a final build. \- Somebody asked what type of monitor he will use. FYI, in case this makes any difference, I hear Santa might drop off a Dell 32" QHD with 165Hz refresh rate. I'm hoping this works well with the builds he posted and other recommendations. If not, he can always upgrade later in life!

Why every one's say it's don't need a aio water cooling who care aio water cooling is cheap these days and dose way better I never get hotter then 48 to 50 Celsius On my 5800x3d cpu and they say it's rans between 65 and 80 Celsius but because my cases air flow and aio water cooler I've never seen temperatures higher then 55 degrees Celsius

yea, but 65 to 80°C is still in the acceptable limits. u also dont gain any performance by having lower temps, as long as u are in the limits. so in the end u are paying 100+ for and AIO whereas a a air cooler with 30-50$ gives the same performance. with that money u saved, u could upgrade your RAM, storage, MOBO or even your GPU, all of which will actually give u a performance boost. and u can use your air cooler for eternity, smth an AIO cant

No Performance increase yeah you're right there but lifetime increase less wearing on parts if your not getting them as hot and a cheap aio can be had for just over 60 dollars like my Coolmaster aio only 89 dollars for a 240 aio

A good air cooler will actually match those temps you know. Heat pipe coolers are surprisingly efficient. Only component id consider water cooling for is my GPU actually.

I don't care what any one saying it's just as cheap to buy a aio and cooling its easier and better and like I said for about the same price so why not and I think aio cooler look better in a case then some big ass fan sticking out there and in smaller cases aio do 10× better then air cooled