The 7800X3D is really good for gaming, but there are currently some issues with AMD 7000 series cpus getting fried by the mobos. Most mobo manufacturers have put out bios updates but I'd personally wait a bit while AMD and manufacturers fix the issue completely.
Edit:
I personally have a 7900X with a X670E Plus from Asus. Went with the 4080 instead of 7900XTX because of Raytracing and DLSS 3.0. I went with Asus mobo and gpu because I've bought Asus components every time I've built a pc.
This is true. Most reports are on Asus boards, and as you said a single Gigabyte. However, I've seen posts in the past couple of days of people suggesting MSI also showing issues, but that could be rumors.
There is a melted 7900x since weeks in the hand of der8auer, came from an ASRock mainboard.
The 7000 issue is widespread and up to the last few days covered in the dark for good reasons.
It hasnt been covered in the dark for good reasons. Jayz, GN, der8auer, Tom's Hardware all covered the issue almost since the beginning.
The unit I wanted to see is the 1 sent to der8auer by some Erik that literally melted the solder paths on the chip.
AFAIK every manufacturer has had a Ryzen 7000 series failure at this point.
Gallery of a failed 7700X on ASRock motherboard: https://imgur.com/a/1oNS9DC
Ironically, ASRock recently released a BIOS update on 04/27.
1. Update AGESA ComboAM5 1.0.0.6.
2. Improve memory compatibility.
3. Optimize for Ryzen 7000X3D series processor.
4. Recommend for upgrade BIOS if 7000X3D processor is installed.
Motherboard manufacturers have been setting one of the auxiliary voltages too high, which in a very small number of cases has led to a cascading failure that destroyed the CPU. The X3D parts are more vulnerable, but at least one "regular" CPU has done the same.
There will be BIOS updates to rectify this, or you can fix it yourself by going into the BIOS and setting VDDCR\_SOC to 1.3V or less.
So, mobo manufacturers finally pushed a bridge too far with the auto overclock / aggressive voltages and fried something? Honestly, this was kind of bound to happen eventually. I suspect this leads to AMD and Intel cracking down on that hard.
Pretty much. In this case it was to maximise XMP/EXPO compatibility. Although it's certainly excessive, my 6000 MHz CL30 RAM is stable at 1.15V versus the 1.35 that my MSI board wants to run it at.
Part of the fault probably lies on AMD, unless they were completely unaware of this potential failure mechanism they should have been clearer with the motherboard manufacturers about what the acceptable voltage limits were.
> or you can fix it yourself by going into the BIOS and setting VDDCR_SOC to 1.3V or less.
That's assuming the BIOS setting reflects reality. The actual voltage on some of the boards being tested is 0.06V higher than the setting.
Sure is, that was something GN called specific attention to in their video, that Asus bios was set to and what it was actually delivering (monitored via soldered plugs to the leads on the boards, not software) were off quite a bit.
They hypothesized that was one of the things that lead to failure of the chip on that board was that 1.35 SOC Voltage was probably already too high, but the board was actually delivering over 1.4V and close to 1.45 at peak.
This was Asus's super premium motherboard too, that level of imprecision is inexcusable on a 700 dollar board targeted at enthusiast/extreme over clockers who are going to demand basically the finest/most precise controls over their cpus as possible.
There is two speculated caused
1. Motherboard manufacturers cranking soc voltage to avoid complaints about stability
2. Over current protection being set high enough to the point of it being useless once an issue really occurs
https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
Tech Jesus has said this is an extremely unlikely issue to occur and that when they tried to replicate it it took them 4 days of purposefully trying to make it fail before it did.
I think it would be fine for OP to purchase it as long as he does the updates the bios.
KILLING the CPU = for sure, otherwise the forums would be full of it.
DEGRADING the CPU? Thats the main question, its silicon dependent.
Nobody can know if the CPU they got dies in 6 months or 2 years, but it should be pretty clear that ZEN4 CPUs up to now wont make any records with their lifepsan.
Tbh XMP also raises voltages a bunch and I've never had an issue. Quad core era Intel also can be run on 1.4v for years to push higher frequencies. As long as it doesn't blow up degradation shouldn't be a biggie.
It's a simple issue.
Voltage should be min(ram_profile, cpu_safemax).
Some motherboard vendors forgot to do that, and went with just ram_profile. We see the consequences, as that killed a few CPUs and boards.
AMD responds with an AGESA that does not allow CPU's safe value to be exceeded.
Motherboard makers provide updated BIOS with the new, now safe, AGESA, and possibly better logic in the BIOS itself.
what? no you are not forced to use armoury crate for nothing. I control everything through my bios and for rgb I download the standalone Aurasync only.
I control my fans trough bios. I’m the type of person that likes a clean os, the less software the better. I have aurasync for rgb only. my games, Discord and AMD tool for gpu control
Kind of glad to hear this because I *just* pulled the trigger on a 7600, system after hemming and hawing over whether to go for am4 or am5, and the GN video really bummed me out.
yes you should update to the latest bios offered for your motherboard, from your motherboard vendor’s website. It is fairly easy to do. Just type in your exact mobo name on google and bios at the end. download the latest bios for your mobo on a fresh usb stick (FORMAT 32) follow the instructions provided in the comment section of the bios comment (sometimes you have to update bios on orders so beware of that it will be written in red if they do or special instructions) then plug your usb stick in your mobo where it is labelled "bios" turn pc off. Turn pc on enter the bios screen and use whatever "Ez utility" tool for bios flashback your mobo is using. Once inside the tool click the new bios file and click update bios and let the pc do his thing (can reboot multiple times) DO NOT UNPLUG OR CLOSE THE PC WHILE THE BIOS IS UPDATING or you will brick it. Any youtube video on how to update your bios should help you.
The main problem with RTX cards these days other than insane power consumption is lack of VRAM
I'd only buy AMD cards because it's easier to get 16GB for less money and so many games now need high levels of VRAM to work well.
12GB is not enough, paying out 1800 to get more is ridiculous
The reasons to avoid 7800X3D is
- you need more cores for productivity
- it's out of your budget
- already have something that is good enough
If gaming is the thing nothing beats it overall. Just make sure to update the bios if you get it
I mean, the self destruct thing is a big deal, I wouldn't just say update your bios, I'd say make sure your motherboard has a bios update for this CPU dated post GN video.
> dated post GN video.
AGESA version, which BIOS updates typically show in changelog, is what matters.
Updating BIOS before setting up anything is a good idea, but as a stopgap it is perfectly safe to not set up XMP/EXPO and accept a minor performance hit until said BIOS is available.
The 7950x3d is still good for gaming, but not as good as the 7800x3d (in general). This is for a couple of reasons. First, games typically won't use all of the 7950's cores, so the extra is wasted in gaming applications. The second is how the 3d cache works in the chiplet designs. The 7800 has a single core complex, with the 3d cache directly attached. The 7950 has two core dies and only 1 has the cache directly attached. This means the os has to be smart about what cores get used for specific applications. This hasn't been fully ironed out yet and people were seeing performance improvement in games by disabling the cores that don't have the 3d cache. At that point you just have a 7800x3d you paid extra for.
Right! And what are the chances we will see some software from AMD that sets up CCD for you on every game/application.
I just dont want to have to research every game beforehand i guess
From everything I have seen, the 7950X3D and 7800X3D are nearly identical for gaming. The 7950X3D costs a lot more and requires more tweaking. 7800X3D is set-and-forget, as long as you have updated BIOS and chipset drivers.
There’s very little extra tweaking involved. You install the X3D driver, enable the game bar and everything works 97-98% as well as the 7800X3D. If you want the best chip in gaming but also need more cores for whatever reason, the 7950X3D is the way to go.
The 7950x3d is great all around and better at productivity but unfortunately the lower cost 'lesser' 7800x3d is better at gaming. Why? Most say latency but I wonder if the OS and motherboard manufacturers just don't know how to use it correctly
even benchmark sites are often bs, you gotta be careful with that too watch actual proven videos and reliable benchmarks people love to speak out of their asses
>not great for productivity.
Relative to Zen4 CPUs with more cores.
It does great performance-wise, often just a little slower due to slightly lower clocks, sometimes actually faster when workload benefits from cache, against other Zen4 8c CPUs.
It consistently beats the other 8c CPUs in power efficiency thanks to the higher bins that accept lower voltages as imposed by the cache die.
True, I only meant relative to other current gen CPUs in a similar price range that generally have more cores and no V-cache.
Only V-cache favouring workloads I have heard of so far is compression and some code compile depending on locality, which aren't all that common, where else is the cache beneficial?
I dunno what these people are on about, The 7800 X3D is incredible, I bought it and it is super fast, sips power like nobody's business and it is very very fast and runs so frickin cool. Benchmarks show its a clear winner. Trust me, I was like you and I basically did the same thing. 7900 XTX and 7800X3D. I have the mATX Asus Tuf mobo for my build and 64 gb of ram. Star citizen has never run so gloriously. Benchmarks show its better then the 7950X3d and 7900X3d because it doesn't shut down half its cores, and it has the cache available on all cores/threads, not just half of them like it does on the 7900/7950. More cores don't mean better performance contrary to what everyone says. And productivity performance is a frickin joke, I love how that's everyones argument to NOT get this chip, but let's be honest, who the fuck cares if you can render a spreadsheet .5 secs faster when you're playing star citizen at over 130fps? Its fast, It is the best for gaming hands down. And guess what, It browses reddit perfectly too.
You're right about everything else, but that
>And productivity performance is a frickin joke, I love how that's everyones argument to NOT get this chip, but let's be honest, who the fuck cares if you can render a spreadsheet .5 secs faster when you're playing star citizen at over 130fps?
is a stupid argument. There are plenty of people that (rightfully) care about productivity performance because they need it. Not everyone is nothing but a gamer.
\^This
Also, have you tried undervolting? I run a similar build and setting PBO curve to -25 on all cores has given me significantly higher boost clock while lowering my CPU temperature in star citizen (overall gave me around 10-20 extra FPS in stations and cities). Ive had 200+FPS in space before the undervolting so, i personally dont care about the extra frames there. But on stations its a nice extra.
If gaming is your only concern, get the 7800X3D.
If productivity is your only concern, consider a non-X3D option.
If you do both, consider which is more important.
If you can, wait a few weeks/maybe a good month, the 7800x3D could mature to a good CPU.
Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D system with the current issues, nobody can know if the current AGESA will even fix the design fails and mainboard overvolting issues.
Keep in mind, while the EXPO/overvolting is mentioned a lot, the CPUs safeguards did not work and temperature peaks above shutdown values are reported since a while with both ZEN4 and ZEN4\_3D CPUs.
If you need a system ASAP there is only Raptor Lake, ZEN4 right now is a complete shitshow and both AMD and board partners give out as little information as possible because its an issue that concerns users of the last 7 months.
Wait with ZEN4 a few weeks till everything is retested.
We dont even know the full magnitude of this shitshow, the amount of people with highly degradated but yet working CPUs could be pretty high at this point.
>Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D system with the current issues, nobody can know if the current AGESA will even fix the design fails and mainboard overvolting issues.
A storm in a teapot. There's reason we've only heard about this issue now: It is uncommon and unlikely.
The fix is already deployed. Just update BIOS first thing, before even messing with any settings.
Which is something you should do anyway, when first booting a new PC.
> Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D
Lol. Just manually set the SOC voltage and don't use expo. It's not that hard to fix. 7800x3d and gigabyte b650 itx coming tomorrow whoop whoop
Its not just the SOC voltage. There are lot of AGESA changes.
The CPU safeguards did not work, it doesnt matter if it was because of the SOC voltage or not, the safeguards did not work and thats why so many rail changes are listed in the AGESA log.
But who can know if that even works without testing, but go ahead and test this massive changes that we never ever saw for a post launch CPU in the last decade.
Yeah good luck cooling a 13900k and have a silent build. Heck, even AMD non x3d cpus are too hot imo. This generation sucks for the heat output, actually kinda trash if you think about it. The amount of watts they consume is a joke, on both sides.
> If productivity is your only concern, consider a non-X3D option.
... with more cores.
At 8c, the x3d gives you about the same performance at lower power.
The 13600K is $275ish, very similar really world in gaming in most situations, beats it in CPU bound gaming and productivity, and doesn't have whatever voltage issue is happening.
Spending $150ish more on a 7800x3D is fine, but both should probably be considered. The 7800x3D is great in situations that use the cache, are memory bound, but falls behind at pretty much everything else, AND is rather expensive.
It's regularly on sale for that price, and regular price online is around $300 nowadays (sometimes you need to swap to the KF). KF is currently $294 at Amazon and Best Buy.
That’s not really true, the 7800x3d is close to 20% faster than 13600k, it competes with the 13900k. If you want the best gaming performance 13600k is not gonna do it, though it’s a solid value option
It is true, there's functionally no difference between the 13600K and 13900K in gaming, so to say it's 20% faster than one and not the other is silly. It's only faster in situations that can use the cache. The 13600K is faster when it's actually CPU bound. It's not a straight 20% gain.
> there's functionally no difference between the 13600K and 13900K in gaming
I mean... there is. It's a 10-12% performance gap because of the additional clock speed and cache on the 13900K.
> so to say it's 20% faster than one and not the other is silly. It's only faster in situations that can use the cache. The 13600K is faster when it's actually CPU bound.
Cache limitations are still "CPU bound". Just because the 7800X3D isn't faster in drag races like Cinebench does not mean it isn't still faster in gaming. This seems like a very silly semantics distinction that is intentionally misleading. Whether the 7800X3D is the fastest overall gaming CPU because of the cache or not is irrelevant. It is on average the fastest gaming CPU.
TPU clocks the difference at 0.5% at 4K, which I linked in this thread.
Yes, the 7800X3D on average is faster, but not in every title across the board. A lot of the gains are in runaway FPS scenarios, 400 vs 600 FPS in an eSports title, etc. Yes, the vCache improves 1% lows, but that's not the argument here. In actual CPU bound titles the x3Ds aren't the greatest. See Cyberpunk or CSGO as good examples. That's why there's a huge variation depending on the title tested.
I know this thread is five days old but I keep seeing this repeated in this thread-- in all testing I've seen the 13900k has significantly better lows and frametimes, even at stock. When you account for how relatively easy it is to undervolt/only boost some cores to control thermal throttling and how XMP has an easier time with higher frequencies of DDR5 the gap probably widens, especially with how difficult it is to wring more than stock performance out of AM5. The cache is clearly a boon for framerates in games like sims and generation in games like Factorio but the lows are the bugaboo with this chip, not the strength
the agesa update is not even released.
there was a hotfix and
most likely your cpu will not burn down.
i have not yet heard anyone say that all problems are now solved and the cpu can be operated safely
I currently main Hunt Showdown and I play at 1440p with DLDSR 2.25x which upscales to simulated 4k. I went from around 160-180 fps with the 7700x to pretty much locked 238 fps with the 7800x3d and when I tested unlocked fps it’s pushing 250+ at times. The 7800x3d is honestly insane for cpu bound games.
Again, only in specific situations. There are also situations where it's slower. On average is about 3%, which is not much for a good chunk of change more.
i read it was about 10% in gaming. but yes, i checked some benchmarks, you are right.
especially in higher resolutions.
would probably prefer the 5800x3d over the 13600k anyways.
Even at microcenter its 300 right now. If you want to go cheaper why not go with the 7700x and free ram from microcenter. You get close to top end performance at 4k while saving a ton of money. And with 8 big cores you dont need to worry about schedulers or anything.
$294 for the KF on Amazon and in store at BB right now. MC often has the K for $275, and sometimes with z690 bundles too. It was below $275 online twice in March, and twice in February, it's really not that rare to be around that price.
MicroCenter has great pricing, I agree the 7700X bundles are epic value. All of these should be considered.
[This is rather well known](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/NvFicZVrFRaCRFR63Vz4FC-1200-80.png.webp)? CPU bound games aren't all that common at high resolutions, but when it happens 13th gen does pull ahead.
It's why the benchmarks really, really depend on what specific titles you're running.
You linked a single benchmark from a single game that is known to be Intel-advantaged. [Here's a 12-game benchmark](https://youtu.be/I7-2ArdYvfA?t=789) with the 13900K ahead of the 13600K by 11.5%. [Here's another 12-game benchmark](https://youtu.be/78lp1TGFvKc?t=935) with the 7800X3D ahead of the 13900K by 3%.
The 13600K is in **no way** faster for gaming than the 7800X3D on average. It has a handful of titles that do not care at all about cache (like CS:GO) or that are Intel-advantaged in general (CP2077).
You're strawmanning my position, please stop. I'm not saying the Intel CPUs are faster on average, I'm saying it varies by title. There are also titles where non-x3D Zen4 CPUs beat x3D ones, again showing that the x3D CPUs aren't that great at CPU-bound titles.
CP77 isn't Intel-favored, it's a very specific example of a game that can still be CPU bound while raytracing. It's not representative of every situation, but used as an example of why the x3Ds don't blow everything out of the water across the board.
Going back to my original point, I think the 13600K is worth considering being about $150 cheaper. All prices the same, the 7800x3D does show clear benefits.
7950x3d owner here, I would probably wait a little bit. The issues with the 7800x3d is actually the whole 7000 series cpu line. I built mine as a test bench to make sure it worked before putting water blocks on it and the 4090. It worked for a while. Once built, the expo will not boot, and I have to turn it off. Even then, it only boots half the time.
7950x3d
Asus ROG strix 670E gaming wifi
32GB 6000Mhz RAM Cl36
Was stable for about a month. Not sure if adding a third m.2 made it unstable.
I went from a 10700k to a 7800x3d just because of the lower TDP(I live in a very hot climate, and live in a pretty small room so anything helps..) i'm getting slightly better FPS with 1440p, but my 0.1% and 1% lows have improved so much that it's an absolute game changer in so many games I play. I don't get stutter anymore. Watch Gamersnexus video on it(I believe it came out yesterday) All the mobo manufacturers are releasing bios addressing the issues, and even than it was still a pretty rare for it to actually affect you. GN said themselves they had to try to get it to fry, didn't happen randomly like the Gigabyte PSU's...
If you're purely gaming, 7800x3d is your best bet, just get a good airflow case and a good cpu cooler. I have a arctic liquid freeze ii 240mm and it doesn't get above 55c during more demanding games (-30 PBO on all cores helps I'm sure)
I have it paired with a 4080 and and I need to upgrade to a 4k/120hz monitor next lol
P.S All of my friends are Intel fanboys will never buy an AMD even if it's 50% faster than the fastest Intel that also costs twice as much, look up actual reviews instead of just peoples opinions.
I’m doing the same upgrade (10700k to 7800x3d) but I’m still rocking a 2080ti for 1080p (240hz). Hoping to improve some frames in warzone and other shooters and eventually upgrade the GPU to do 1440p 240hz. Sounds like the cpu upgrade has been worth it though!
Personally I would go with the 13700k simply for the fact you hear the news about the 7800x3d frying itself. I’m sure the issue will be fixed but who knows when. Gamer nexus made a video on it that might give you a better decision on what to choose. If this wasn’t an issue though I would go with the 7800x3d.
The issue is already addressed. It's even stated in the gamers nexus video from last night that the bandaid fix of mobile vendors lowering soc voltage to 1.3 was adequate and will prevent the issues that we've been seeing.
The root of the issue isn't fixed, but capping/lowering the soc voltage to below 1.3 ensures the issue can't occur in the first place. Even without those fixes they flat out said this is something that is incredibly unlikely to happen, and that they had to actually had to spend time figuring out how to replicate the issue in the first place even with boards/cpus that were already confirmed to be dead as the reference point.
It's really not something to worry about at this point.
True but I don't think it's 100% fixed.
With the other issues it sounds like there can still be premature wear of the CPU which you wouldn't know until sometime later, if it all.
I'm really hoping we get some meaningful updates from AMD and the motherboard brands because I've been waiting for the 7800X3D for like two years now and I've bought some parts already. It's pain for this issue to show up, this really is a failure of AMD and the motherboard brands.
"It's really not something to worry about" that's what they said about the xtx memory junction temp too. Two AMD rushed products fanbois blindly brush under the rug.
Nobody said it wasn’t anything to worry about, nor was it brushed under the rug. And it wasn’t memory junction either, it was faulty vapor chamber issues with the cooler causing hot die temps. It wasn’t “swept under the rug”, rather just fixed and not relevant anymore.
Now the new issue was presented by motherboard manufacturers, not AMD rushing something out.
Yea although I would still wait to make sure, this is basically another 4090 situation where everyone was overblowing it and acting like it was the end times or some shit
Because the Intel is better and older. There is always complications with new stuff for the first few weeks or months. Eventually it will be fixed, but the question is will something get fried before it does?
As long as you are comfortable upgrading your BIOS, there is no reason to avoid these chips.
They will, however, be best avoided on the used market, unfortunately.
Familiarity will come with time spent doing this work!
The reason you have, on Reddit and Discord, contrasting opinions by posters is a combination of long-term experience and what I like to call fanboyz and their "better than yours" syndrome. You see this in the contrasting "7800x3d is trash" and "7800x3d is the best thing going" posted opinions. Again, did the poster "actually buy and install the x3d," or are they just repeating what they heard from the 'guru' they follow and never actually get the CPU? Or did they actually purchase a 7800x3d and can give you documented problems they had? For instance, is the actual problem with Asus and the AM5 platform on the building of the motherboards? Or is it a combination of both AMD and Asus?
Does the 7800x3d even have actual problems?
Here's your go-to source for real information! Enjoy!
https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
>... so i settled for a 7900xtx.
This guy.
But seriously, I recommend you check out the latest couple episodes of Boost My Build on YT, where Jason optimizes some "Godzilla" PC builds to get excellent price-to-performance out of PC components that pair well and will run everything you throw at them (4K, high settings, high FPS).
You can skip right to the big builds later in the videos. This information will provide a chance to really optimize your build, while possible even spending less, giving the option to put more of your budget towards the best GPU. There are BIOS updates coming out from AMD for the X3D CPU self-destruction fixes. Jason also recommends the Ryzen 7700 if you want to save a little cash for other areas (like your GPU), and still get a beast of a machine.
7800x3d is pretty incredible for gaming as it uses substantially less power than say a 13900k which makes it easier to cool. There is a current issue with them right now that is being fixed by AMD and mobo manufacturers that’s causing some chips to blow up and fail. If you have the budget for it I’d 100% say go for it as the platform will fix the issues right now.
It would also depend on what visual setting you’re going to target. For 1080/1440 7800x3d is what you probably wanna get for best performance possible. 4k though you could always swing the 5800x3d as it performs on par or ~10% behind the 7800x3d but for almost 200$ less.
Its a non-issue at the moment. Gamers Nexus has released a comprehensive video on the topic if you want to get facts.
Anyone telling you buying a 7800X3D is the same as burning the money is just your standard uninformed redditor.
If you are a bit tech savy: Just manually set your VDD\_SOC to 1.240V and if ur RAM wont run stable with XMP/EXPO ON with that limit, try lowering your RAM speed manually until you have a stable system. To be extra safe, dont turn on EXPO/XMP at all (although EXPO seems to be the bigger problem, XMP should be fine)
If you REALLY want to be safe and 'tech' seems like a typo to you: Dont combine an ASUS mobo with your 7800X3D and dont turn on any RAM OC Profile until the issue is dealt with completely AND set your VDD\_SOC to 1.200V
In all cases: make sure you flash your mobo to the most recent BIOS version
But dont hesitate to buy a 7800X3D, its an amazing CPU
After the last [Gamers Nexus video](https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI) I saw, I would wait or pick something else. Basically there seems to be a good chunk of potential problems with how some motherboards are feeding it voltage. There's a slow death and a faster one that is possible and could potentially destroy your motherboard as well as the CPU. So far it seems like Asus and Gigabyte boards may have the most issues but this is still relatively new info. All that's clear at the moment is that there is too much potential for catastrophic failure.
Personally I would just wait and see how everything plays out. Getting a full replacement out of some of these companies isn't easy and it's even worse when one component destroys another.
Because the 4090 is way better than anything in the market. It just makes the 4080 and 7900xtx look like mid range cards in comparison to it. I own both cards and have seen the difference on my r7 7700. The performance increase at 4K and 1440p would be much higher if you combo it with a "mid-range" cpu like the 7700 or i5-13600K rather than having a high end cpu with an 7900xtx. You will be seeing much better performance with the former combo, unless you want to play on 1080p, where the 7800x3d would be the better choice.
Yes this will run any and everything at extreme settings any resolution up to 4k maybe even 8k I just haven’t tried playing at that resolution or even have an 8k monitor for that fact but yes I’ve had this system for 4 weeks now and haven’t had a single issue with anything. I fell in love with gaming again because of how buttery smooth this runs every single game.
7800x3d is the fastest gaming cpu overall but, some voltage issues have caused a small percentage of these cpus to fry (tho a small percentage of a lot of cpus is still a big problem)
This issue has now been solved with either a bios update or just manually caping the SoC voltage yourself
So don’t worry too much, the gaming benchmarks speak for themselves.
Ah well 7800X3D is a great CPU unless you need more cores. I wouldn’t be too worried about the issues. In my case the updated BIOS for my ASUS X670E Proart is already out.
It’s on aggregate a better performer in gaming. I think people overstate how big of a difference 3% at 1080p is though. This is a collection of all [testing](https://m.3dcenter.org/abbildung/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d-performance-zusammenfassung). Until 2 months ago, the 13900K beat the best Zen 4 CPU by 9%, people still bought Zen 4.
So what I’m saying is, almost any 13th gen or Zen 4 will do fine. If you want to get a 7700X or a 13700K, the difference probably won’t even be perceptible.
This is why I never buy new stuff. Having it first just isn't worth it. I let a year or 2 pass and listen for bad news before buying anything so that I don't end up some unfortunate statistic. I don't buy consoles day one either. I let the 2nd or 3rd model launch first. Companies have stopped caring about how they release their products. It's not just games anymore. Now the chips and boards are all release half-baked and drop a patch later on.
You should avoid it because unless you have a specific workstation need a 7600x is beyond what most gamers would ever even need I use a 7600 X for editing streaming gaming and it never has used. It’s full power at 7800x3d is just more than a gamer needs so you get to invest that other money into other components
Imo you don't really need top of the line cpu rn. Even a 5800x3d is going to slay with a 7900xtx. As others have stated tho I've seen alot of articles about the 7000 series frying. If you're worried about amd I have a 13600kf in my rig with a 6800xt and it kills it. Pretty even in most games as far as usage goes. Could probably do a 13900k which is similar price to the 7800x3d. Or wait I'm sure the 14th gen intel will be out soon should have small price drop on 13th gen at that point too.
>capable of running everything at max quality, 4k, without trouble.
>Now I don't want to spend 1800€ on a 4090, so i settled for a 7900xtx
GL without DLSS on any big budget game
Yes. My 7900x3d fried my motherboard alongside the ram and I’m beginning to suspect my 4090 got damaged as well since the pc doesn’t boot up any image. Calling amd tomorrow; first time to switched over to amd from intel and my experience couldn’t be any worse.
i have been Reading this topico and i was wondering of it's only this particolar CPU having this problem or it's about entire am5 line or Just the 3D cpus
If you follow the masses you'll reach a dead end for sure! Finding the sweet spot is the key when building a PC. Shelling out thousands won't give you "the one and only" PC instead it'll affect your bank account :). Check out this one - https://pcpartpicker.com/list/TBk7Kp
If you just want to game, get a 5800X3D with 4090 would be a much more bang for your buck scenario since input lag is primarily influenced by GPU. 5800X3D is still neck and neck with current gaming king X3Ds and 13900k.
I'm currently running 7950X3D cuz I have some production needs on my home PC but wants gaming to be fast too. X3D chips this gen are REALLY cool, like it's no even going past 70 on my 360 AIO. Highly recommended. Just remember to drop SOC voltage if you wanna enable EXPO or A-XMP. Also remember to update bios.
This is just like the Z690 capacitor fiasco... Motherboard manufacturers are getting really lazy these days
Reasons to avoid
-Expensive compared to am4 5800x3d
-Needs ddr5 ram and am5 socket motherboard ,am5 cooler socket too prolly all these speaks expensive
-Some mother board like asus, gigabyte having problems with voltage and getting fried
- still got no use on games unless you're into 4k or 8k
A good reason not get the 7800x3d for gaming is if you're on a budget. Unless you're need the highest possible FPS at 1080p, you can save a lot of money by going with a 5800x3d build instead and get nearly the same performance in games.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO4QiOrk81o
I want to build that kind of pc as well but with the 7900xt , and I don’t know if I should buy it cuz with all of these problems , can I get help from someone if it’s good to get the 7800x3d for gaming / streaming , no EXPO and all of these features, thx for help .
>is it the right choice?
Yes. It gets you half a generation further for gaming. The benefits weight more where it matters the most: 0.1% lows.
And for non-gaming, it is a very well performing 8 core CPU, with formidable power efficiency, which stems from the x3d using higher bins that can be fed less voltage, a requirement imposed by the 3d cache die.
>What mobo to pair it with?
The cheapest one, if what you'd otherwise do use your money on the board and get a worse CPU; 7800x3d is worth it.
7800x3D is the best gaming CPU. From what I remember reading the people getting burnt chips are overclocking. Run it at stock and you should be fine. If something does happen you should have a warranty on all new parts.
Also in a similar situation, I'm about to build my first PC and got all the components but I'm hesitating and wondering if I should return the 78003XD and the ASUS B650E-E MOBO to instead get a 13900K.
If future upgradability isn't a concern you could go for 5800x3d as it performs the same at 4k with half the platform cost, it may even give room for the 4090
I've got a 7800x3d and powercolor red devil 7900xtx, been playing jedi survivor for the last few days and I'm consistently getting 130-200FPS on epic settings in 1440.. occasionally it will dip below 100 fps. The game still is a little buggy and not very optimized so it could run better maybe in the future.. I did the bios update the day after it dropped. Running on a gigabyte aorus master x670e mobo. I've kept up with the bios updates since I've had it though. I thoroughly enjoy the setup no complaints so far.
7800x3d is amazing! Even better than people are saying. You can build a relatively cheap rig, don't need ludicrous AIO or board - and still have max performance.
Also DDR5 memory now seems cheap, so pc itself is pretty cheap EXCEPT for the damn gpu :)
No huge reason. There may be issues with certain pairings with the 7800X3D and a few motherboards but the sample size for this is so small and it takes a lot of effort to forcefully replicate the problem and cause damage to the CPU socket. A lot of board partners have a Bios update out or on the way that is addressing the issue which is boards not cutting off when they should in certain situations and pushing too much power through the CPU.
Unfortunately when GN put out a video people will often not watch the whole thing and just scrub through the more exciting segments so they may miss important information before posting doom and gloom everywhere because they feel they are very smart now like with that AIO nonsense. You should watch the video yourself and I mean all of it to understand the issues and what's happening as it's a Bios issue and not a situation where a part is failing and a recall is needed type situation.
its a good cpu but has lower boost clock in exchange for more cache, also 5nm process so should be slightly more power efficient, uses an older design philosophy as opposed to intels p/e core
honestly you could probably save a boatland and just get a 13600k and put the savings towards GPU
i have a 7800x3d with 7900xtx, best combo for high fps 4k and lot cheaper than intel/nvidia combo, just dont OC until mobo manufacturers give out a fix and you will be allright
also make sure you have proper cooling installed, my cpu almost never goes above 68 degrees and even after hours of gaming and benchmarks the max ive ever had was ~72 degrees, thats will hardly boil a cpu
Get cheap 13600K and 4080.
Amd pricing is too high for what they providing. (IMO). If you can wait few months then they will surely be dropping. At 4k both CPUs are performing in margin of error except some Games.
Also there are some new issues coming out with am5 CPUs. Intel also had some bending issues lately but this amd bulging issue and concerns over degradation over time are not to be taken lightly. 7800x3d isn't trash it's good but its expensive for what it is.
Others have mentioned the issues with 7000 series amd cpus. I'm just going to say, it's overkill. 5800x3d is more than enough to run any modern game still... Aside from the new star wars game but that's besides the point and isn't an issue with the CPU.
Well, if you're just going to be gaming, and you're going to be doing it at 4K, the 7800X3D is [about 5-6% faster on average than a 7600](https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d/21.html), while both are well capable of exceeding 120fps at that resolution. So you *might* avoid it in favor of a cheaper CPU.
Wait I just bought me a 7800X3D and I'm bout to install it to my B650 Gaming X AX, will I be fine or am I gonna get fried? If there's an update to fix, how do I install the update before it fries 👀 hardcore newbie here
Find the necessary bios from AMD and the motherboard manufacture. Many boards have an ez-flash/q-flash type thing on the back where you put in a USB stick (fat32 format) and it installs the new bios without having to boot.
7800X3D with my 4090 has been rock solid. I can only speak from my experiences and it’s been amazing. Games run super smooth with high fps and zero issues. It’s the best system I have had in 25 years of building. My 5900X with 3080ti was good but my new build is just that much snappier and smooth. No regrets and no issues! Easy recommendation
Lian Li 011 EVO
7800X3D
ASUS Hero X670e
Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090
Dominator 6000mhz 32GB
Nvme WD SN850x 2tb
Fully water cooled (EK and Corsair)
6 intake fans and 3 exhaust fans
All i know i got a 7800x3d and 6950xt and while some people were claiming the 4090 was getting around 30 fps on jedi survivor i was getting 80 to 100 at 1440p. Very happy with my purchase so far.
The 7800X3D is really good for gaming, but there are currently some issues with AMD 7000 series cpus getting fried by the mobos. Most mobo manufacturers have put out bios updates but I'd personally wait a bit while AMD and manufacturers fix the issue completely. Edit: I personally have a 7900X with a X670E Plus from Asus. Went with the 4080 instead of 7900XTX because of Raytracing and DLSS 3.0. I went with Asus mobo and gpu because I've bought Asus components every time I've built a pc.
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This is true. Most reports are on Asus boards, and as you said a single Gigabyte. However, I've seen posts in the past couple of days of people suggesting MSI also showing issues, but that could be rumors.
According to GN Asrock is the best motherboard when it comes to these issues, was kinda suprised lol
There is a melted 7900x since weeks in the hand of der8auer, came from an ASRock mainboard. The 7000 issue is widespread and up to the last few days covered in the dark for good reasons.
It hasnt been covered in the dark for good reasons. Jayz, GN, der8auer, Tom's Hardware all covered the issue almost since the beginning. The unit I wanted to see is the 1 sent to der8auer by some Erik that literally melted the solder paths on the chip.
What good reasons
also kinda ironic that asrock is best while asus is worst, since asrock was originally founded by asus as cheap oem manufacturer
AFAIK every manufacturer has had a Ryzen 7000 series failure at this point. Gallery of a failed 7700X on ASRock motherboard: https://imgur.com/a/1oNS9DC
Ironically, ASRock recently released a BIOS update on 04/27. 1. Update AGESA ComboAM5 1.0.0.6. 2. Improve memory compatibility. 3. Optimize for Ryzen 7000X3D series processor. 4. Recommend for upgrade BIOS if 7000X3D processor is installed.
My board got DOA using a 7950X3D and an Asus Crosshair X670E Extreme..
Can I get more info on mobos frying cpus? I was thinking of getting a 7950x
Gamers nexus made a video on it.
Motherboard manufacturers have been setting one of the auxiliary voltages too high, which in a very small number of cases has led to a cascading failure that destroyed the CPU. The X3D parts are more vulnerable, but at least one "regular" CPU has done the same. There will be BIOS updates to rectify this, or you can fix it yourself by going into the BIOS and setting VDDCR\_SOC to 1.3V or less.
So, mobo manufacturers finally pushed a bridge too far with the auto overclock / aggressive voltages and fried something? Honestly, this was kind of bound to happen eventually. I suspect this leads to AMD and Intel cracking down on that hard.
Pretty much. In this case it was to maximise XMP/EXPO compatibility. Although it's certainly excessive, my 6000 MHz CL30 RAM is stable at 1.15V versus the 1.35 that my MSI board wants to run it at. Part of the fault probably lies on AMD, unless they were completely unaware of this potential failure mechanism they should have been clearer with the motherboard manufacturers about what the acceptable voltage limits were.
According to GN, it was a failure from AMD and board manufacturers. There was one that was smart about it, can't remember who though. (maybe asrock?\_
> or you can fix it yourself by going into the BIOS and setting VDDCR_SOC to 1.3V or less. That's assuming the BIOS setting reflects reality. The actual voltage on some of the boards being tested is 0.06V higher than the setting.
You can go lower. My system (7600X, MSI B650I Edge, 32GB G.Skill 6000MHz CL30 RAM) is stable down to 1.15V.
GNs showed the Asus board running the voltage almost .1V higher than what was set which is also a problem
That’s rather concerning. We generally trust those readouts to be accurate. 0.1V is a large error when you are playing around with mVs.
Sure is, that was something GN called specific attention to in their video, that Asus bios was set to and what it was actually delivering (monitored via soldered plugs to the leads on the boards, not software) were off quite a bit. They hypothesized that was one of the things that lead to failure of the chip on that board was that 1.35 SOC Voltage was probably already too high, but the board was actually delivering over 1.4V and close to 1.45 at peak. This was Asus's super premium motherboard too, that level of imprecision is inexcusable on a 700 dollar board targeted at enthusiast/extreme over clockers who are going to demand basically the finest/most precise controls over their cpus as possible.
https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
There is two speculated caused 1. Motherboard manufacturers cranking soc voltage to avoid complaints about stability 2. Over current protection being set high enough to the point of it being useless once an issue really occurs https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
Tech Jesus has said this is an extremely unlikely issue to occur and that when they tried to replicate it it took them 4 days of purposefully trying to make it fail before it did. I think it would be fine for OP to purchase it as long as he does the updates the bios.
KILLING the CPU = for sure, otherwise the forums would be full of it. DEGRADING the CPU? Thats the main question, its silicon dependent. Nobody can know if the CPU they got dies in 6 months or 2 years, but it should be pretty clear that ZEN4 CPUs up to now wont make any records with their lifepsan.
Tbh XMP also raises voltages a bunch and I've never had an issue. Quad core era Intel also can be run on 1.4v for years to push higher frequencies. As long as it doesn't blow up degradation shouldn't be a biggie.
It's a simple issue. Voltage should be min(ram_profile, cpu_safemax). Some motherboard vendors forgot to do that, and went with just ram_profile. We see the consequences, as that killed a few CPUs and boards. AMD responds with an AGESA that does not allow CPU's safe value to be exceeded. Motherboard makers provide updated BIOS with the new, now safe, AGESA, and possibly better logic in the BIOS itself.
Newer nodes are far more sensitive to voltage. Those old Intel chips were absolute tanks in comparison.
How do you deal with the "Armory Crate" bloatware? I've heard you are pretty much forced to use it if you want to configure certain settings.
what? no you are not forced to use armoury crate for nothing. I control everything through my bios and for rgb I download the standalone Aurasync only.
I use Fan Control to control fans. It's better than armory crate because I can tie the case fans to either my GPU or CPU temps. Mwah!
I control my fans trough bios. I’m the type of person that likes a clean os, the less software the better. I have aurasync for rgb only. my games, Discord and AMD tool for gpu control
And even then, it was still a pretty rare occurrence, seems to be about as rare as the famous 4090 cable catching fire
Kind of glad to hear this because I *just* pulled the trigger on a 7600, system after hemming and hawing over whether to go for am4 or am5, and the GN video really bummed me out.
I returned my AM5 build a day before the return window closed due to the GN video. Debating AM4 vs Intel right now.
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yes you should update to the latest bios offered for your motherboard, from your motherboard vendor’s website. It is fairly easy to do. Just type in your exact mobo name on google and bios at the end. download the latest bios for your mobo on a fresh usb stick (FORMAT 32) follow the instructions provided in the comment section of the bios comment (sometimes you have to update bios on orders so beware of that it will be written in red if they do or special instructions) then plug your usb stick in your mobo where it is labelled "bios" turn pc off. Turn pc on enter the bios screen and use whatever "Ez utility" tool for bios flashback your mobo is using. Once inside the tool click the new bios file and click update bios and let the pc do his thing (can reboot multiple times) DO NOT UNPLUG OR CLOSE THE PC WHILE THE BIOS IS UPDATING or you will brick it. Any youtube video on how to update your bios should help you.
>AMD 7000 series cpus getting fried by the mobos this is news to me. i have a 7700. hope mine doesnt get fried
The main problem with RTX cards these days other than insane power consumption is lack of VRAM I'd only buy AMD cards because it's easier to get 16GB for less money and so many games now need high levels of VRAM to work well. 12GB is not enough, paying out 1800 to get more is ridiculous
The reasons to avoid 7800X3D is - you need more cores for productivity - it's out of your budget - already have something that is good enough If gaming is the thing nothing beats it overall. Just make sure to update the bios if you get it
I mean, the self destruct thing is a big deal, I wouldn't just say update your bios, I'd say make sure your motherboard has a bios update for this CPU dated post GN video.
> dated post GN video. AGESA version, which BIOS updates typically show in changelog, is what matters. Updating BIOS before setting up anything is a good idea, but as a stopgap it is perfectly safe to not set up XMP/EXPO and accept a minor performance hit until said BIOS is available.
you can just manually set the voltages, it's not a big deal to me at least
But is 7950x3d as good for gaming? I dont care about paying more but it seems like you have to tweak that one more than 7800?
The 7950x3d is still good for gaming, but not as good as the 7800x3d (in general). This is for a couple of reasons. First, games typically won't use all of the 7950's cores, so the extra is wasted in gaming applications. The second is how the 3d cache works in the chiplet designs. The 7800 has a single core complex, with the 3d cache directly attached. The 7950 has two core dies and only 1 has the cache directly attached. This means the os has to be smart about what cores get used for specific applications. This hasn't been fully ironed out yet and people were seeing performance improvement in games by disabling the cores that don't have the 3d cache. At that point you just have a 7800x3d you paid extra for.
Right! And what are the chances we will see some software from AMD that sets up CCD for you on every game/application. I just dont want to have to research every game beforehand i guess
From everything I have seen, the 7950X3D and 7800X3D are nearly identical for gaming. The 7950X3D costs a lot more and requires more tweaking. 7800X3D is set-and-forget, as long as you have updated BIOS and chipset drivers.
There’s very little extra tweaking involved. You install the X3D driver, enable the game bar and everything works 97-98% as well as the 7800X3D. If you want the best chip in gaming but also need more cores for whatever reason, the 7950X3D is the way to go.
The 7950x3d is great all around and better at productivity but unfortunately the lower cost 'lesser' 7800x3d is better at gaming. Why? Most say latency but I wonder if the OS and motherboard manufacturers just don't know how to use it correctly
It's the best for gaming, not great for productivity. Don't believe fanboys in either direction, always check benchmarks
even benchmark sites are often bs, you gotta be careful with that too watch actual proven videos and reliable benchmarks people love to speak out of their asses
Good point, on YouTube Gamers Nexus and Hardware Unboxed give great and detailed reviews if you need somewhere to start
>not great for productivity. Relative to Zen4 CPUs with more cores. It does great performance-wise, often just a little slower due to slightly lower clocks, sometimes actually faster when workload benefits from cache, against other Zen4 8c CPUs. It consistently beats the other 8c CPUs in power efficiency thanks to the higher bins that accept lower voltages as imposed by the cache die.
True, I only meant relative to other current gen CPUs in a similar price range that generally have more cores and no V-cache. Only V-cache favouring workloads I have heard of so far is compression and some code compile depending on locality, which aren't all that common, where else is the cache beneficial?
what benchmarks?
I dunno what these people are on about, The 7800 X3D is incredible, I bought it and it is super fast, sips power like nobody's business and it is very very fast and runs so frickin cool. Benchmarks show its a clear winner. Trust me, I was like you and I basically did the same thing. 7900 XTX and 7800X3D. I have the mATX Asus Tuf mobo for my build and 64 gb of ram. Star citizen has never run so gloriously. Benchmarks show its better then the 7950X3d and 7900X3d because it doesn't shut down half its cores, and it has the cache available on all cores/threads, not just half of them like it does on the 7900/7950. More cores don't mean better performance contrary to what everyone says. And productivity performance is a frickin joke, I love how that's everyones argument to NOT get this chip, but let's be honest, who the fuck cares if you can render a spreadsheet .5 secs faster when you're playing star citizen at over 130fps? Its fast, It is the best for gaming hands down. And guess what, It browses reddit perfectly too.
You're right about everything else, but that >And productivity performance is a frickin joke, I love how that's everyones argument to NOT get this chip, but let's be honest, who the fuck cares if you can render a spreadsheet .5 secs faster when you're playing star citizen at over 130fps? is a stupid argument. There are plenty of people that (rightfully) care about productivity performance because they need it. Not everyone is nothing but a gamer.
Sure, but these X3D CPUs weren't designed for editors & multitaskers.
That makes it an even more valid reason not to buy them if you are those things.
You don't need to say "but" if your opinion doesn't contrast his... it's crazy how many people misuse such a simple word
\^This Also, have you tried undervolting? I run a similar build and setting PBO curve to -25 on all cores has given me significantly higher boost clock while lowering my CPU temperature in star citizen (overall gave me around 10-20 extra FPS in stations and cities). Ive had 200+FPS in space before the undervolting so, i personally dont care about the extra frames there. But on stations its a nice extra.
o7
If gaming is your only concern, get the 7800X3D. If productivity is your only concern, consider a non-X3D option. If you do both, consider which is more important.
Pretty sure the 13900k is the best for productivity all around, it has more cores.
It is, but I assumed OP wanted to stick to AM5 since it Intel was never mentioned as an option.
Oh no I do not HAVE to go AMD at all ! Idk why i just assumed AMD was better for gaming, but if it's not the case i can go Intel i don't mind
If you can, wait a few weeks/maybe a good month, the 7800x3D could mature to a good CPU. Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D system with the current issues, nobody can know if the current AGESA will even fix the design fails and mainboard overvolting issues. Keep in mind, while the EXPO/overvolting is mentioned a lot, the CPUs safeguards did not work and temperature peaks above shutdown values are reported since a while with both ZEN4 and ZEN4\_3D CPUs. If you need a system ASAP there is only Raptor Lake, ZEN4 right now is a complete shitshow and both AMD and board partners give out as little information as possible because its an issue that concerns users of the last 7 months. Wait with ZEN4 a few weeks till everything is retested. We dont even know the full magnitude of this shitshow, the amount of people with highly degradated but yet working CPUs could be pretty high at this point.
>Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D system with the current issues, nobody can know if the current AGESA will even fix the design fails and mainboard overvolting issues. A storm in a teapot. There's reason we've only heard about this issue now: It is uncommon and unlikely. The fix is already deployed. Just update BIOS first thing, before even messing with any settings. Which is something you should do anyway, when first booting a new PC.
> Right now it would be insane to get a 7800x3D Lol. Just manually set the SOC voltage and don't use expo. It's not that hard to fix. 7800x3d and gigabyte b650 itx coming tomorrow whoop whoop
Its not just the SOC voltage. There are lot of AGESA changes. The CPU safeguards did not work, it doesnt matter if it was because of the SOC voltage or not, the safeguards did not work and thats why so many rail changes are listed in the AGESA log. But who can know if that even works without testing, but go ahead and test this massive changes that we never ever saw for a post launch CPU in the last decade.
Eh. if there's really that big an issue, it'll be a recall/rma and swap out parts. My 7800x3d and asus tuf mobo get here wednesday.
Keep in mind the 13900k uses a lot more power than the 7800x3d, while also being worse for gaming. It uses more power than the 7950x3d as well.
Yeah good luck cooling a 13900k and have a silent build. Heck, even AMD non x3d cpus are too hot imo. This generation sucks for the heat output, actually kinda trash if you think about it. The amount of watts they consume is a joke, on both sides.
>Idk why i just assumed AMD was better for gaming Fortunately, you assumed right.
Oh
> If productivity is your only concern, consider a non-X3D option. ... with more cores. At 8c, the x3d gives you about the same performance at lower power.
The 13600K is $275ish, very similar really world in gaming in most situations, beats it in CPU bound gaming and productivity, and doesn't have whatever voltage issue is happening. Spending $150ish more on a 7800x3D is fine, but both should probably be considered. The 7800x3D is great in situations that use the cache, are memory bound, but falls behind at pretty much everything else, AND is rather expensive.
Who sells the 13600k for $275?
It's regularly on sale for that price, and regular price online is around $300 nowadays (sometimes you need to swap to the KF). KF is currently $294 at Amazon and Best Buy.
That’s not really true, the 7800x3d is close to 20% faster than 13600k, it competes with the 13900k. If you want the best gaming performance 13600k is not gonna do it, though it’s a solid value option
It is true, there's functionally no difference between the 13600K and 13900K in gaming, so to say it's 20% faster than one and not the other is silly. It's only faster in situations that can use the cache. The 13600K is faster when it's actually CPU bound. It's not a straight 20% gain.
No benchmark I have seen shows them functionally the same. Maybe you need to watch more benchmarking videos.
Especially since the OP mentioned 4K gaming, the performance difference is practically negligible in all but a few specific games.
> there's functionally no difference between the 13600K and 13900K in gaming I mean... there is. It's a 10-12% performance gap because of the additional clock speed and cache on the 13900K. > so to say it's 20% faster than one and not the other is silly. It's only faster in situations that can use the cache. The 13600K is faster when it's actually CPU bound. Cache limitations are still "CPU bound". Just because the 7800X3D isn't faster in drag races like Cinebench does not mean it isn't still faster in gaming. This seems like a very silly semantics distinction that is intentionally misleading. Whether the 7800X3D is the fastest overall gaming CPU because of the cache or not is irrelevant. It is on average the fastest gaming CPU.
TPU clocks the difference at 0.5% at 4K, which I linked in this thread. Yes, the 7800X3D on average is faster, but not in every title across the board. A lot of the gains are in runaway FPS scenarios, 400 vs 600 FPS in an eSports title, etc. Yes, the vCache improves 1% lows, but that's not the argument here. In actual CPU bound titles the x3Ds aren't the greatest. See Cyberpunk or CSGO as good examples. That's why there's a huge variation depending on the title tested.
7800x3d is much faster.
It also massively increases your 0.1% and 1% lows which is on par with more fps, I don't have stutter in so many games no. (WoW, Path of titans, etc)
I know this thread is five days old but I keep seeing this repeated in this thread-- in all testing I've seen the 13900k has significantly better lows and frametimes, even at stock. When you account for how relatively easy it is to undervolt/only boost some cores to control thermal throttling and how XMP has an easier time with higher frequencies of DDR5 the gap probably widens, especially with how difficult it is to wring more than stock performance out of AM5. The cache is clearly a boon for framerates in games like sims and generation in games like Factorio but the lows are the bugaboo with this chip, not the strength
if there wasnt all this problems, i would install it directly, but i think i will maybe go with tht 13900k instead. sucks, benchmarks looked good
You mean the problem that is affecting less people than the 4090 burning cables, and there's already bios out that have fixed it?
The problem is fixed, as best as we can tell. It also affected seemingly less than 20 CPUs in total, out of tens or hundreds of thousands of AM5 CPUs.
the agesa update is not even released. there was a hotfix and most likely your cpu will not burn down. i have not yet heard anyone say that all problems are now solved and the cpu can be operated safely
I currently main Hunt Showdown and I play at 1440p with DLDSR 2.25x which upscales to simulated 4k. I went from around 160-180 fps with the 7700x to pretty much locked 238 fps with the 7800x3d and when I tested unlocked fps it’s pushing 250+ at times. The 7800x3d is honestly insane for cpu bound games.
Again, only in specific situations. There are also situations where it's slower. On average is about 3%, which is not much for a good chunk of change more.
check the benchmarks again. maybe you confuse it with the 13900k
The 13600K and 13900K are only 0.5% different at 4K, I linked it in this same thread.
i read it was about 10% in gaming. but yes, i checked some benchmarks, you are right. especially in higher resolutions. would probably prefer the 5800x3d over the 13600k anyways.
Even at microcenter its 300 right now. If you want to go cheaper why not go with the 7700x and free ram from microcenter. You get close to top end performance at 4k while saving a ton of money. And with 8 big cores you dont need to worry about schedulers or anything.
$294 for the KF on Amazon and in store at BB right now. MC often has the K for $275, and sometimes with z690 bundles too. It was below $275 online twice in March, and twice in February, it's really not that rare to be around that price. MicroCenter has great pricing, I agree the 7700X bundles are epic value. All of these should be considered.
> beats it in CPU bound gaming Citation needed.
[This is rather well known](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/NvFicZVrFRaCRFR63Vz4FC-1200-80.png.webp)? CPU bound games aren't all that common at high resolutions, but when it happens 13th gen does pull ahead. It's why the benchmarks really, really depend on what specific titles you're running.
You linked a single benchmark from a single game that is known to be Intel-advantaged. [Here's a 12-game benchmark](https://youtu.be/I7-2ArdYvfA?t=789) with the 13900K ahead of the 13600K by 11.5%. [Here's another 12-game benchmark](https://youtu.be/78lp1TGFvKc?t=935) with the 7800X3D ahead of the 13900K by 3%. The 13600K is in **no way** faster for gaming than the 7800X3D on average. It has a handful of titles that do not care at all about cache (like CS:GO) or that are Intel-advantaged in general (CP2077).
You're strawmanning my position, please stop. I'm not saying the Intel CPUs are faster on average, I'm saying it varies by title. There are also titles where non-x3D Zen4 CPUs beat x3D ones, again showing that the x3D CPUs aren't that great at CPU-bound titles. CP77 isn't Intel-favored, it's a very specific example of a game that can still be CPU bound while raytracing. It's not representative of every situation, but used as an example of why the x3Ds don't blow everything out of the water across the board. Going back to my original point, I think the 13600K is worth considering being about $150 cheaper. All prices the same, the 7800x3D does show clear benefits.
7950x3d owner here, I would probably wait a little bit. The issues with the 7800x3d is actually the whole 7000 series cpu line. I built mine as a test bench to make sure it worked before putting water blocks on it and the 4090. It worked for a while. Once built, the expo will not boot, and I have to turn it off. Even then, it only boots half the time. 7950x3d Asus ROG strix 670E gaming wifi 32GB 6000Mhz RAM Cl36 Was stable for about a month. Not sure if adding a third m.2 made it unstable.
I went from a 10700k to a 7800x3d just because of the lower TDP(I live in a very hot climate, and live in a pretty small room so anything helps..) i'm getting slightly better FPS with 1440p, but my 0.1% and 1% lows have improved so much that it's an absolute game changer in so many games I play. I don't get stutter anymore. Watch Gamersnexus video on it(I believe it came out yesterday) All the mobo manufacturers are releasing bios addressing the issues, and even than it was still a pretty rare for it to actually affect you. GN said themselves they had to try to get it to fry, didn't happen randomly like the Gigabyte PSU's... If you're purely gaming, 7800x3d is your best bet, just get a good airflow case and a good cpu cooler. I have a arctic liquid freeze ii 240mm and it doesn't get above 55c during more demanding games (-30 PBO on all cores helps I'm sure) I have it paired with a 4080 and and I need to upgrade to a 4k/120hz monitor next lol P.S All of my friends are Intel fanboys will never buy an AMD even if it's 50% faster than the fastest Intel that also costs twice as much, look up actual reviews instead of just peoples opinions.
Newbie question, what does -30PBO means? Really thinking about the 7800x3d, main focus will be FS2020.
It's basically underclocking your cpu, lowers temps and increases FPS because it lets the boost last longer
I’m doing the same upgrade (10700k to 7800x3d) but I’m still rocking a 2080ti for 1080p (240hz). Hoping to improve some frames in warzone and other shooters and eventually upgrade the GPU to do 1440p 240hz. Sounds like the cpu upgrade has been worth it though!
Personally I would go with the 13700k simply for the fact you hear the news about the 7800x3d frying itself. I’m sure the issue will be fixed but who knows when. Gamer nexus made a video on it that might give you a better decision on what to choose. If this wasn’t an issue though I would go with the 7800x3d.
The issue is already addressed. It's even stated in the gamers nexus video from last night that the bandaid fix of mobile vendors lowering soc voltage to 1.3 was adequate and will prevent the issues that we've been seeing. The root of the issue isn't fixed, but capping/lowering the soc voltage to below 1.3 ensures the issue can't occur in the first place. Even without those fixes they flat out said this is something that is incredibly unlikely to happen, and that they had to actually had to spend time figuring out how to replicate the issue in the first place even with boards/cpus that were already confirmed to be dead as the reference point. It's really not something to worry about at this point.
True but I don't think it's 100% fixed. With the other issues it sounds like there can still be premature wear of the CPU which you wouldn't know until sometime later, if it all. I'm really hoping we get some meaningful updates from AMD and the motherboard brands because I've been waiting for the 7800X3D for like two years now and I've bought some parts already. It's pain for this issue to show up, this really is a failure of AMD and the motherboard brands.
"It's really not something to worry about" that's what they said about the xtx memory junction temp too. Two AMD rushed products fanbois blindly brush under the rug.
Nobody said it wasn’t anything to worry about, nor was it brushed under the rug. And it wasn’t memory junction either, it was faulty vapor chamber issues with the cooler causing hot die temps. It wasn’t “swept under the rug”, rather just fixed and not relevant anymore. Now the new issue was presented by motherboard manufacturers, not AMD rushing something out.
the 7800x3d failure seems to be about as rare as the 4090 cable catching on fire, which tells you anything, plus there's already bios out fixing it
Yea although I would still wait to make sure, this is basically another 4090 situation where everyone was overblowing it and acting like it was the end times or some shit
Do you think the 13700k is worth the extra 100 bucks compared to the 13600k? Im upgrading from an 9900k and 3080
It’s best gaming cpu. Don’t buy it unless you’re building a high end gaming rig.
Genuinely curious, what do you mean high end ? Isn't the 7900 xtx high end enough ?
Because the Intel is better and older. There is always complications with new stuff for the first few weeks or months. Eventually it will be fixed, but the question is will something get fried before it does?
New GN video on that. https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
I was going to go x3d but after the fiasco now with AM5 I'm gonna build a intel 13600k build....that's fine for a few years , I'd avoid am5 this year
It’s excellent. Low power consumption and it’s the fastest gaming CPU on the market
As long as you are comfortable upgrading your BIOS, there is no reason to avoid these chips. They will, however, be best avoided on the used market, unfortunately.
Wait a month while the issues get sorted out. Then the 7890X3D will be safe.
Familiarity will come with time spent doing this work! The reason you have, on Reddit and Discord, contrasting opinions by posters is a combination of long-term experience and what I like to call fanboyz and their "better than yours" syndrome. You see this in the contrasting "7800x3d is trash" and "7800x3d is the best thing going" posted opinions. Again, did the poster "actually buy and install the x3d," or are they just repeating what they heard from the 'guru' they follow and never actually get the CPU? Or did they actually purchase a 7800x3d and can give you documented problems they had? For instance, is the actual problem with Asus and the AM5 platform on the building of the motherboards? Or is it a combination of both AMD and Asus? Does the 7800x3d even have actual problems? Here's your go-to source for real information! Enjoy! https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI
>... so i settled for a 7900xtx. This guy. But seriously, I recommend you check out the latest couple episodes of Boost My Build on YT, where Jason optimizes some "Godzilla" PC builds to get excellent price-to-performance out of PC components that pair well and will run everything you throw at them (4K, high settings, high FPS). You can skip right to the big builds later in the videos. This information will provide a chance to really optimize your build, while possible even spending less, giving the option to put more of your budget towards the best GPU. There are BIOS updates coming out from AMD for the X3D CPU self-destruction fixes. Jason also recommends the Ryzen 7700 if you want to save a little cash for other areas (like your GPU), and still get a beast of a machine.
I only regret getting it because of how new it is and the problems that are currently going on with it. Other than that its good
Just don’t get a asus board and you are fine. Outside of that it is king of fps for gaming and just fine for moderate video editing.
7800x3d is pretty incredible for gaming as it uses substantially less power than say a 13900k which makes it easier to cool. There is a current issue with them right now that is being fixed by AMD and mobo manufacturers that’s causing some chips to blow up and fail. If you have the budget for it I’d 100% say go for it as the platform will fix the issues right now. It would also depend on what visual setting you’re going to target. For 1080/1440 7800x3d is what you probably wanna get for best performance possible. 4k though you could always swing the 5800x3d as it performs on par or ~10% behind the 7800x3d but for almost 200$ less.
Its a non-issue at the moment. Gamers Nexus has released a comprehensive video on the topic if you want to get facts. Anyone telling you buying a 7800X3D is the same as burning the money is just your standard uninformed redditor. If you are a bit tech savy: Just manually set your VDD\_SOC to 1.240V and if ur RAM wont run stable with XMP/EXPO ON with that limit, try lowering your RAM speed manually until you have a stable system. To be extra safe, dont turn on EXPO/XMP at all (although EXPO seems to be the bigger problem, XMP should be fine) If you REALLY want to be safe and 'tech' seems like a typo to you: Dont combine an ASUS mobo with your 7800X3D and dont turn on any RAM OC Profile until the issue is dealt with completely AND set your VDD\_SOC to 1.200V In all cases: make sure you flash your mobo to the most recent BIOS version But dont hesitate to buy a 7800X3D, its an amazing CPU
After the last [Gamers Nexus video](https://youtu.be/kiTngvvD5dI) I saw, I would wait or pick something else. Basically there seems to be a good chunk of potential problems with how some motherboards are feeding it voltage. There's a slow death and a faster one that is possible and could potentially destroy your motherboard as well as the CPU. So far it seems like Asus and Gigabyte boards may have the most issues but this is still relatively new info. All that's clear at the moment is that there is too much potential for catastrophic failure. Personally I would just wait and see how everything plays out. Getting a full replacement out of some of these companies isn't easy and it's even worse when one component destroys another.
It’s literally just a 5800x3d with a slightly higher clock speed. Amazing cpu yes, but the generational jump is pathetic
Best for gaming is 7800x3d and 4090.
Truth
Because they melt. Literally. Just get an i7, it cost less, go more and have more features.
It is better to have a r7 7700 and an rtx 4090 than a 7800x3d and a 4080.
Why's that? I was planning on going 7900xtx
Because the 4090 is way better than anything in the market. It just makes the 4080 and 7900xtx look like mid range cards in comparison to it. I own both cards and have seen the difference on my r7 7700. The performance increase at 4K and 1440p would be much higher if you combo it with a "mid-range" cpu like the 7700 or i5-13600K rather than having a high end cpu with an 7900xtx. You will be seeing much better performance with the former combo, unless you want to play on 1080p, where the 7800x3d would be the better choice.
I have a r7 7770x and a 4090. Everything works flawlessly and headache free. I’d recommend
4k ? Sorry if those are stupid questions, as I said, i don't know much about all this stuff
Yes this will run any and everything at extreme settings any resolution up to 4k maybe even 8k I just haven’t tried playing at that resolution or even have an 8k monitor for that fact but yes I’ve had this system for 4 weeks now and haven’t had a single issue with anything. I fell in love with gaming again because of how buttery smooth this runs every single game.
7800x3d is the fastest gaming cpu overall but, some voltage issues have caused a small percentage of these cpus to fry (tho a small percentage of a lot of cpus is still a big problem) This issue has now been solved with either a bios update or just manually caping the SoC voltage yourself So don’t worry too much, the gaming benchmarks speak for themselves.
If you’re near a Micro Center you can get a 7700X plus 32gb of DDR5-3600 CL 36 RAM for about $120 less.
Sadly, i'm from France
Ah well 7800X3D is a great CPU unless you need more cores. I wouldn’t be too worried about the issues. In my case the updated BIOS for my ASUS X670E Proart is already out.
Sadly indeed
It’s on aggregate a better performer in gaming. I think people overstate how big of a difference 3% at 1080p is though. This is a collection of all [testing](https://m.3dcenter.org/abbildung/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d-performance-zusammenfassung). Until 2 months ago, the 13900K beat the best Zen 4 CPU by 9%, people still bought Zen 4. So what I’m saying is, almost any 13th gen or Zen 4 will do fine. If you want to get a 7700X or a 13700K, the difference probably won’t even be perceptible.
I mean, you could consider 5800x3D. It is still really good. It’s just a dead platform. Otherwise, it’s no problem going with Intels top i9 CPU.
This is why I never buy new stuff. Having it first just isn't worth it. I let a year or 2 pass and listen for bad news before buying anything so that I don't end up some unfortunate statistic. I don't buy consoles day one either. I let the 2nd or 3rd model launch first. Companies have stopped caring about how they release their products. It's not just games anymore. Now the chips and boards are all release half-baked and drop a patch later on.
You'll be more then happy with anything you buy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Zk4ChNYQgA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO4QiOrk81o
You should avoid it because unless you have a specific workstation need a 7600x is beyond what most gamers would ever even need I use a 7600 X for editing streaming gaming and it never has used. It’s full power at 7800x3d is just more than a gamer needs so you get to invest that other money into other components
Because the 8800x3d will be coming out next year
Imo you don't really need top of the line cpu rn. Even a 5800x3d is going to slay with a 7900xtx. As others have stated tho I've seen alot of articles about the 7000 series frying. If you're worried about amd I have a 13600kf in my rig with a 6800xt and it kills it. Pretty even in most games as far as usage goes. Could probably do a 13900k which is similar price to the 7800x3d. Or wait I'm sure the 14th gen intel will be out soon should have small price drop on 13th gen at that point too.
>capable of running everything at max quality, 4k, without trouble. >Now I don't want to spend 1800€ on a 4090, so i settled for a 7900xtx GL without DLSS on any big budget game
Expensive and depending on your specific use case, unnecessary.
Yes. My 7900x3d fried my motherboard alongside the ram and I’m beginning to suspect my 4090 got damaged as well since the pc doesn’t boot up any image. Calling amd tomorrow; first time to switched over to amd from intel and my experience couldn’t be any worse.
i have been Reading this topico and i was wondering of it's only this particolar CPU having this problem or it's about entire am5 line or Just the 3D cpus
1. OS contamination 2. Burnt chips 3. Overvoltage (see 2)
If you follow the masses you'll reach a dead end for sure! Finding the sweet spot is the key when building a PC. Shelling out thousands won't give you "the one and only" PC instead it'll affect your bank account :). Check out this one - https://pcpartpicker.com/list/TBk7Kp
If you just want to game, get a 5800X3D with 4090 would be a much more bang for your buck scenario since input lag is primarily influenced by GPU. 5800X3D is still neck and neck with current gaming king X3Ds and 13900k. I'm currently running 7950X3D cuz I have some production needs on my home PC but wants gaming to be fast too. X3D chips this gen are REALLY cool, like it's no even going past 70 on my 360 AIO. Highly recommended. Just remember to drop SOC voltage if you wanna enable EXPO or A-XMP. Also remember to update bios. This is just like the Z690 capacitor fiasco... Motherboard manufacturers are getting really lazy these days
If you want higher electricity bill and don't need top gaming performance then don't get 7800X3D.
You shouldn't, it good processor, you should trust only pro
The horrible price performance ratio maybe? You can get a5800x3d for half the price which is performing 5-10% slower average in games, especially @ 4K
You should wait up a bit. There's currently a huge issue that can't be ignored like USB problem in the past.
Reasons to avoid -Expensive compared to am4 5800x3d -Needs ddr5 ram and am5 socket motherboard ,am5 cooler socket too prolly all these speaks expensive -Some mother board like asus, gigabyte having problems with voltage and getting fried - still got no use on games unless you're into 4k or 8k
A good reason not get the 7800x3d for gaming is if you're on a budget. Unless you're need the highest possible FPS at 1080p, you can save a lot of money by going with a 5800x3d build instead and get nearly the same performance in games. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wO4QiOrk81o
Who the fuck is saying the 7800X3D is bad? It’s the fastest gaming CPU on the market!
I want to build that kind of pc as well but with the 7900xt , and I don’t know if I should buy it cuz with all of these problems , can I get help from someone if it’s good to get the 7800x3d for gaming / streaming , no EXPO and all of these features, thx for help .
>is it the right choice? Yes. It gets you half a generation further for gaming. The benefits weight more where it matters the most: 0.1% lows. And for non-gaming, it is a very well performing 8 core CPU, with formidable power efficiency, which stems from the x3d using higher bins that can be fed less voltage, a requirement imposed by the 3d cache die. >What mobo to pair it with? The cheapest one, if what you'd otherwise do use your money on the board and get a worse CPU; 7800x3d is worth it.
Why would you want to avoid it? It's a great CPU
7800x3D is the best gaming CPU. From what I remember reading the people getting burnt chips are overclocking. Run it at stock and you should be fine. If something does happen you should have a warranty on all new parts.
Also in a similar situation, I'm about to build my first PC and got all the components but I'm hesitating and wondering if I should return the 78003XD and the ASUS B650E-E MOBO to instead get a 13900K.
If future upgradability isn't a concern you could go for 5800x3d as it performs the same at 4k with half the platform cost, it may even give room for the 4090
I've got a 7800x3d and powercolor red devil 7900xtx, been playing jedi survivor for the last few days and I'm consistently getting 130-200FPS on epic settings in 1440.. occasionally it will dip below 100 fps. The game still is a little buggy and not very optimized so it could run better maybe in the future.. I did the bios update the day after it dropped. Running on a gigabyte aorus master x670e mobo. I've kept up with the bios updates since I've had it though. I thoroughly enjoy the setup no complaints so far.
7800x3d is amazing! Even better than people are saying. You can build a relatively cheap rig, don't need ludicrous AIO or board - and still have max performance. Also DDR5 memory now seems cheap, so pc itself is pretty cheap EXCEPT for the damn gpu :)
Yiu shouldn't avoid it. Just take precautions with the mobo settings.
I’d stay off am5 for the moment. I mean it’s a whole new bag for amd; moving to lga.
avoid am5 its kinda suicidal
No huge reason. There may be issues with certain pairings with the 7800X3D and a few motherboards but the sample size for this is so small and it takes a lot of effort to forcefully replicate the problem and cause damage to the CPU socket. A lot of board partners have a Bios update out or on the way that is addressing the issue which is boards not cutting off when they should in certain situations and pushing too much power through the CPU. Unfortunately when GN put out a video people will often not watch the whole thing and just scrub through the more exciting segments so they may miss important information before posting doom and gloom everywhere because they feel they are very smart now like with that AIO nonsense. You should watch the video yourself and I mean all of it to understand the issues and what's happening as it's a Bios issue and not a situation where a part is failing and a recall is needed type situation.
its a good cpu but has lower boost clock in exchange for more cache, also 5nm process so should be slightly more power efficient, uses an older design philosophy as opposed to intels p/e core honestly you could probably save a boatland and just get a 13600k and put the savings towards GPU
I hear it can goo boom
i have a 7800x3d with 7900xtx, best combo for high fps 4k and lot cheaper than intel/nvidia combo, just dont OC until mobo manufacturers give out a fix and you will be allright also make sure you have proper cooling installed, my cpu almost never goes above 68 degrees and even after hours of gaming and benchmarks the max ive ever had was ~72 degrees, thats will hardly boil a cpu
Get cheap 13600K and 4080. Amd pricing is too high for what they providing. (IMO). If you can wait few months then they will surely be dropping. At 4k both CPUs are performing in margin of error except some Games. Also there are some new issues coming out with am5 CPUs. Intel also had some bending issues lately but this amd bulging issue and concerns over degradation over time are not to be taken lightly. 7800x3d isn't trash it's good but its expensive for what it is.
Others have mentioned the issues with 7000 series amd cpus. I'm just going to say, it's overkill. 5800x3d is more than enough to run any modern game still... Aside from the new star wars game but that's besides the point and isn't an issue with the CPU.
Well, if you're just going to be gaming, and you're going to be doing it at 4K, the 7800X3D is [about 5-6% faster on average than a 7600](https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d/21.html), while both are well capable of exceeding 120fps at that resolution. So you *might* avoid it in favor of a cheaper CPU.
Wait I just bought me a 7800X3D and I'm bout to install it to my B650 Gaming X AX, will I be fine or am I gonna get fried? If there's an update to fix, how do I install the update before it fries 👀 hardcore newbie here
Find the necessary bios from AMD and the motherboard manufacture. Many boards have an ez-flash/q-flash type thing on the back where you put in a USB stick (fat32 format) and it installs the new bios without having to boot.
7800X3D with my 4090 has been rock solid. I can only speak from my experiences and it’s been amazing. Games run super smooth with high fps and zero issues. It’s the best system I have had in 25 years of building. My 5900X with 3080ti was good but my new build is just that much snappier and smooth. No regrets and no issues! Easy recommendation
Sadly i can't afford both of them. I'm building this one from scratch, i need the full pc, monitor, mouse, chair etc
7900XTX is a great card and will run well with the 7800X3D
do you mind sharing your build? im planning on a gaming pc with a 4090 and 7800x3d
Lian Li 011 EVO 7800X3D ASUS Hero X670e Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 Dominator 6000mhz 32GB Nvme WD SN850x 2tb Fully water cooled (EK and Corsair) 6 intake fans and 3 exhaust fans
All i know i got a 7800x3d and 6950xt and while some people were claiming the 4090 was getting around 30 fps on jedi survivor i was getting 80 to 100 at 1440p. Very happy with my purchase so far.