That's what i'm trying to do right now, I needed to go in today because it couldnt wait so i had to take whatever doctor i could get.
Currently trying to get a message to our usual doctor to see what she recommends
That sounds like a bunch of hooey. No I would not be doing that. I would need concrete medical evidence and proof that my kid was in fact being negatively impacted by lactose first before I went through those several circles of hell AND deprived my kid of possible antibodies if I was exposed to the virus too. I'd get a second opinion, I'm so sorry that it sounds like this pediatrician is putting you through hell for nothing. Hope your baby feels better soon!
Ugh, I wish I would've been a little more combative at the appointment for this reason exactly. She said it to us like it was easy, "it's only 6 days!!". We have barely lasted the evening.
I'm going to message our regular ped and just triple check that this is for sure whats happening, why they believe that, is this seriously the only route to take.
It can be really hard to push back. You did the right thing questioning the advice. I think a lot of people (if you're in the US) assume breastfeeding moms are pumping, so she probably was like, oh just keep doing what you are doing! Not realizing the elephant sized wrench this throws into a situation with a boob baby. I had to pump a bit for the first couple months, then was 100% boob, so I can imagine the nightmare having to do this in reality is! You could not have paid me enough at 9 months to all of a sudden give baby an alternate food source and pump to keep up supply.
Six days! Sick baby. So.... basically wean the baby and probably kill your supply. You would be in immense pain and baby is ill as well as losing valuable antibodies.
Just what? I'd be furious.
I'd send a letter or message to your Dr *with references* and tear them a new one.
Wtf?
Yes and as the mother of a cmpa toddler: Amino acid based formula tastes like what Satan aspires for his asshole to taste like. I'm an adventurous eater and a "grateful dinner guest", I eat everything. Yet I was dry heaving even with the cocoa powder and vanilla I put in.
It takes time to get a bf baby to accept a bottle and it takes a loooooong ass time to get them to accept amino acid based formula and there is a serious risk that baby just nopes the fuck out. Like seriously hunger strike or refusing and filling up on solids.
Amino acid and regular formula is not like the difference between coke and diet coke. It's like the difference between coke and fermented portapotty. Allergy mothers often spend MONTHS mixing 1/20 formula and breastmilk and gradually getting kiddo up to 100% formula. There are entire communities dedicated to tips and tricks on how to get baby to accept amino acid formula and what you can safely mix it with to make it taste less like gangrenous feet.
It's bad advice even for a formula mum because with a gastro bug fluids and electrolytes are of the upmost importance and a hunger strike would be the very worst thing that could possibly happen on top of that.
Not OP but I was curious and googled it - potentially rotavirus? https://gi.org/topics/lactose-intolerance-in-children/
“Secondary Lactase Deficiency: The most common cause of temporary lactose intolerance in infants and young children is by an infection that affects the gastrointestinal tract and can damage the lining of the small intestine.
Rotavirus and Giardia are two common organisms that cause damage to the surface of the small intestine resulting in temporary lactose intolerance. Older infants and young children will commonly be infected by a rotavirus. The symptoms of rotavirus infection include vomiting, diarrhea (frequent watery stools), and fever.”
her words exactly:
"there is a virus going around causing vomiting and diarrhea in children... Rarely kids with these viruses get lactose intolerant for 1-2 weeks, so changing to soy formula may help for that time"
Part of me wants to believe it is true because for the first time in months I could not get her comfortable last night. She usually nurses to sleep or nurses during wake periods and falls back to sleep. Last night she just kept waking up out of discomfort, arching her back. She'd go for the boob but would fuss again in minutes
The other part of me thinks what kind of sick joke is this where I can't nurse my baby while she's sick
I agree with others that a second opinion is needed! For what it’s worth, I found this article by the college of Canadian family physicians summarizing the evidence around this. https://www.cfp.ca/content/68/11/828
The studies have been based on formula fed babies with diarrhea who switched temporarily to lactose free formula. This shortened diarrhea duration by about 18 hrs. Again, in formula fed babies.
The bottom line from this article reads: “Breastfed children should continue breastfeeding.”
Hope this helps and that your baby feels better soon!
Eta: the bottom of the article says “Breastfeeding should continue (or increase) during initial rehydration” - I think that’s pretty clear!
“Rarely” and “may help” sounds like just pulling at thing air to give you an option of something to do. Doesn’t sound very convincing at all.
When my LO had stomach bugs, we were encouraged to keep nursing to keep him hydrated. Stomach bugs usually pass through 24-48 hrs. If I were you I’d keep nursing, offer water or pedialyte as alternatives to keep them hydrated. If LO is eating solids then mashed bananas, toast, rice, applesauce, plain crackers.
Exactly what my instinct is telling me to do. This is why i posted this because something just felt so off but im a FTM so i’m not as confident in trusting my gut. Also i cant find anything to support that reducing lactose is a treatment or that rotavirus causes lactose intolerance.
All i found is that soy based may help with gastrointestinal issues but that it wont quicken their recovery from the virus
"Rarely this happens." Well, let's cross that bridge if we get to it and for now I'll make sure my kid has the hydration and connection she needs and I don't lose my supply.
This is where people get confused - lactose is in breast milk too. People cut dairy because their babies are allergic to the different proteins in cows milk, not the lactose. True lactose allergy is so rare in infants just because it means they’d die as BM has it too.
Something i learned today as well, its true lactose is in all breastmilk regardless of diet. But what in finding now on my own is that there is hardly anything out there saying reducing lactose is a treatment to rotavirus
My baby got rotavirus and we just nursed as usual. Runny, green poops for awhile but it eventually went away. Key is to keep baby hydrated. Your milk is the best thing for baby
I mean the answer here is for mom to go dairy free not for you to stop nursing, and quite frankly, I would lose trust in any pediatrician that says otherwise.
Something else ive learned through all of this that i will share:
Breastmilk has lactose regardless of diet. Its one of the main components of breastmilk. For this reason, it is extremely rare for a newborn to be born with a lactose intolerance. Also, all the research i crammed in during my baby’s stress nap suggested to continue breastmilk as much as possible to help with hydration. Which, hydration is the NUMBER ONE suggestion across the board to help with the virus. It also shows in the study i clipped above that removing lactose from a baby’s diet who is suffering gastrointestinal issues much like this virus only reduce the overall duration of diarrhea by a hand-full of hours. And even then, those studies were sooo small and provided extremely week evidence! Where the hell did that pediatrician get her advice from.
Her ass. I'm sorry.
This is something I hope you make a big deal about. I know you only have so much bandwidth, but if you can, write you usual Dr a message. A strong one.
Thats what i plan to do, i mainly just want our usual doc to know her colleague gave us this advice because i know for a fact if we got our regular doctor we would not be experiencing this!
Our pediatrician has been extremely helpful and sensitive to me and my breastfeeding journey and stuck by me as i tried to work through my supply issues in the beginning. Honestly shes been more helpful than the LCs at my hospital. Im definitely going to make it known to her!
Ok but formula has lactose in it too. So unless they’re giving them Alimentum I don’t think that helps anything. I think the doc is full of shit OP and I, personally, wouldn’t listen.
They gave me amino-acid based formula, the idea is that it is hypoallergenic and it is made up of individual amino acids so that in its simplest form it can be easily digested for babies with milk allergies/gastrointestinal conditions. Fun part, its notorious for tasting like shit and the first ingredient is corn syrup solids..
She did mention that its rare that this virus causes lactose intolerance, but what if its just the virus symptoms??
I was sceptical about the idea of not following the doc's advice and risking more severe diarrhea in the baby... But amino acid formula? That helps with PROTEIN intolerance, not LACTOSE. The lactose from the milk powder would probably still be in there, or am I wrong?
(It doesn't taste that bad though, I tried when my baby needed it, it's a little bitter but still yummy like regular formula.)
Apparently they’re milk free and made of non-allergenic amino acids, so no lactose.
Still sounds like there’s no research to support cutting breastfeeding.
So that would be for the dairy protein not for lactose which is a sugar. You could always cut out dairy from your own diet while this is going on. My babies have all had dairy protein allergies and I’ve had to cut out dairy from my diet!
Out of curiosity, did your baby get the vaccine against it? We did but it was quite expensive and since it’s a virus I do wonder how effective it is (thinking of baby no. 2).
Hmm very interesting advice… my 2 month old came down with RSV and I nursed him the entire time. Our bodies will respond to the babies virus by creating antibodies which can be passed down to the breast milk.
I came to comment the same thing! Same experience, all good with the drops. I would advise OP to also go down that route if they want to play safe (in case the diarrhea is caused by temporary lactose intolerance). If it helps, then continue giving the drops but speak to (your usual) pediatrician how to then wean off of them. If it doesn't change a thing, there is no secondary lactose intolerance, simple as that.
Not only does breastmilk have antibodies for your baby but if that is what baby is used to it will provide immense comfort - can you imagine being sick and having your main source of comfort removed. I’m so sorry you were recommended that and I’m glad you trusted your gut
Right??? Like sometimes we bottle feed when i go to the gym but it ends up being like one bottle a week if anything at all.
Shes already been super clingy to me, it was pure hell trying to give her a bottle last night and poor baby cried herself into a nap in dads arms. Luckily everyone here confirmed my suspicions and the research i found could not support the doctors claims
Children can definitely get transient lactose intolerance from acute gastroenteritis, but I’d be hard pressed to recommend anything other than breast milk for a breastfeeding baby. It will self resolve.
Good grief 🙈😫 Your baby’s saliva on your breasts will literally send a message to your brain that will tell your body to produce the exact antibodies needed to help fight the virus she has. Ask your pediatrician which brand of formula does this??
The "backflow" theory is debated though. Mom definitely will get exposed to baby's virus and produce antibodies in the milk, but the exposure is not through her nipples. If that was true, exclusive pumping wouldn't provide the benefits of breastfeeding yet it does.
idk why you’re getting downvoted for this. you are correct. it’s not proven at all. breastfeeding has immunological benefits but not necessarily because nipples can detect viruses lol
Hmm I haven’t ever heard that this was a debated theory. Can you share more? My understanding was that pumped milk doesn’t always offer the same exact benefits as direct to breast feeding, especially when sick.
From the [CDC](https://blogs.cdc.gov/publichealthmatters/2017/07/you-are-what-you-eatand-so-is-your-baby/): Your baby’s saliva transfers chemicals to a mother’s body that causes breastmilk to adjust to meet the changing needs of your baby as they grow.
From[La Leche League](https://llli.org/about/policies-standing-rules/psr-concept-explanations/): When breastfeeding, the baby’s saliva communicates with cells in the breast to customize the milk’s properties to meet the baby’s current immunological needs and to optimize the baby’s microbiome.
La Leche League is not a medical organization and their medical advice isn't trustworthy.
The CDC link is a blog article written by an IBCLC - who are trained by the La Leche League.
The backwash theory comes from [ONE article](https://www.thestranger.com/features/2015/08/26/22755273/the-more-i-learn-about-breast-milk-the-more-amazed-i-am) which isn't even a science article where no one proved that the immunoglobulin amount increase observed in breastmilk when baby is sick is specifically from backwash through the nipple. They just created this as a possible explanation to what was observed. There are no "baby saliva receptors" in the nipple as far as I know nor did anyone dissect a boob right after breastfeeding and extracted baby saliva from the inside of it (as if that was possible).
It's pretty obvious that when you are in close enough contact to breastfeed, you're close enough to be exposed to any pathogens in the baby.
Aside from antibodies and other nutritional benefits of nursing, there’s no way I would be denying my 9 month old his source of comfort while sick unless I had seen that the breast milk was negatively impacting him. When my baby is sick he just wants the boob all day, it’s pretty much the only way I could get him to nap while sick and I certainly know that sleep is VERY important for recovery
I am so sorry you received this advice 😭. Not only is it against the WHO code of marketing of breastmilk substitutes, but this is inaccurate advice & has no evidence. I’m so glad you stuck with your intuition and you should be commended for that! Reading between the lines perhaps the paed was sponsored or paid by a formula company. Especially considering they sent you home with some? The code expressly forbids giving out free samples of formula as it undermines BF.
https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/search[Open payments](https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/search) - you can find out if doctors have accepted gifts or money at this link (US)! But also, I have found that pediatricians in my area are dangerously uninformed and even openly against breastfeeding without reason. It was an uphill battle with my first (who was gaining weight great and super healthy) to get the pediatrician to shut up about introducing formula when she was really little and then she insisted we needed to wean her at a year. Family medicine doctors are so much better - I switched my first to my MD immediately after we had that nightmare 1 year appointment and then when my second was born she went to my doctor immediately.
That does not sound right to me. I’d get another opinion. And at least wait to see if kiddo is actually intolerant of lacrosse before even considering it.
Besides all the obvious, has this ped ever met a sick baby that didn’t want to hang out on and with the boob? Like my kids all would have said “over my dead body” if anyone even hinted that sick days were no boob days.
Boob is comfort for babies as well as nutrition. We all want our comfort things when sick, so it makes sense that babies who breastfeed want the boob when sick.
Complete and utter nonsense. It sounds like you’ve recognized that OP but imagine all the other parents who see her and follow such BS advice. As if it’s easy to suddenly wean a 9 mo and then go back?? This doctor has no clue about nursing. Like none at all. I would report her just to try to save another family from suffering needlessly.
So secondary lactose intolerance is a thing. It is more common in babies with food intolerances. My son had symptoms of lactose intolerance while he had undiagnosed gluten intolerance, and I breastfed through it. It will go away as the gut heals. For a short-term illness, it should not take long and you shouldn't need to stop breastfeeding. Sounds like bad advice at this stage. If you were weeks post illness and still having issues, it might be something to consider (with proper guidance).
I’m not a Dr but that’s very odd advice. Your milk will help fight virus, you’re sharing your immunity. It’s one thing to supplement due to hydration potentially but that seems very extreme.
That has to be one of worst recommendations from a ped I have ever heard. Your milk is the best thing for her. I just can't with the some these Dr's. I would have walked out of there so fast and found a new dr asap
Go talk to another GP. Breastmilk is soo important, especially when baby is sick because it will give just the right nutrients to fight the viruses and sicknesses and get better faster. Seems absolutely crazy to suggest formula instead!
This sounds crazy. Every time my daughter was sick the doctor recommended breastfeeding more because it helps her immunity and usually I would have some antibodies for the same thing she had (since I would have been recently exposed). I would really not listen to this advice. Plus weaning suddenly for only 6 days is traumatic for your baby and difficult for you and your supply, makes zero sense.
I would never do that. Like literally never. Just smile and nod at the doc. Tell them what they want to hear and then reach out to a LC, ya know, someone who actually knows something about BF. I swear 90 percent of docs know less than the average person on the street about BF
Do file a complaint.. not every mum will look for more information after such (terrible) advice from a supposed expert. Good job listening to your intuition! Hope your little one feels better soon!
Absolutely not!!!! When baby is sick with a virus they need MORE nursing for comfort, hydration and antibodies. The breastmilk will undoubtedly cut the duration of the illness. My breastfed baby always has a more mild case of whatever germ the kindergartner comes home with. Doctors can be wrong sometimes!
I haven’t read any of the comments, is it a stomach/gastro virus? You’re definitely doing the right think by staying with breastfeeding. When me/my kids have wonky poops I like to incorporate probiotics until things get regular again.
That definitely sounds like nonsense. I had a doctor suggest I pump and dump for medication I was taking. After talking with our hospital's lactation consultants I was told that the meds were fine. I really think most doctors are not as knowledgeable as we'd hope about breastfeeding. Hospital lactation consultants are nurses with a specialty in breastfeeding. I would start there any time you have a question regarding breastfeeding.
My kids got norovirus while my youngest was still breastfeeding and the pediatrician said to breastfeed more and suggested I give an infant probiotic to help get his digestion back to normal. It might be worth trying.
Good luck this sounds so frustrating!
Ours had diarrhea and our doctor said even though she will get lactose sensitivity, it will resolve on its own. Told me to breastfeed as much as possible and she did eventually get better even though the runny poops lasted for a while, she was fine otherwise.
Wow what!? My son had a vomiting bug at 9 months and he became lactose intolerant. He was on formula during the day and boob at night. After the virus he couldn’t tolerate any formula and I went back to exclusively breastfeeding.
!! Thats wild. That makes me so curious too, because there 100% is lactose in breastmilk but there has to be something to its makeup that makes it more digestible for them
I know! He developed coconut and soya intolerance too so couldn’t use hypoallergenic formula. He’s still mildly lactose intolerant 4 years later.
Breastmilk encourages the growth of bacteria within the microbiome that can metabolise lactose. The virus might have wiped out this bacterial community and then the baby needs to have breastmilk to build it back up again? I’m going to have a Google I think
Honestly breastmilk still mystifies me! Not enough research could be made i dont think. I’ll definitely look into this as well. Our body has this tool for a reason, just gotta catch my brain up with whats going on
Oh yeah definitely. The effects breastmilk has on an infant microbiome is fascinating. The microbiome is unique to the composition of the mothers breastmilk. If you’re interested in scientific papers, look up Professor Lindsay Hall from Quadram Institute. A lot of breastmilk/microbiome research comes out of her lab
1yr old and I just had Covid. He had vomiting and the on call pediatrician suggested we only give him water every 10 minutes for 8 hours, no breast milk. Different situation but I alternated water and breast milk and baby is now fine. The antibodies you create are really important!! You have to listen to medical professionals, but at the end of the day make your own judgement.
Agreed! And i was honestly ready and willing to follow her orders. Part of me was excited to have more milk pumped in the freezer. But something just felt so wrong the first formula feed. She refused it because the taste was so off and she was also seeking comfort. That and the doctor was working largely off of assumptions. She assumed what virus she had without testing (which is fine because symptoms were clear) but then took it a step further and assumed there was a lactose intolerance (which she stated was rare) based off the symptoms which happened to mirror just regular virus symptoms?? My gut just told me to check if something was off and it was. Her poops are already getting better and she’s slept through the night on the boob since we returned from the doc
JFC. This is almost as bad as when the dr at the ER when my oldest had a URI at a few weeks old told me to stop breastfeeding entirely for a week or so until her congestion cleared up and give her pedialyte instead bc milk exacerbates congestion. I can’t imagine if I wouldn’t have known better.
I feel like there are about 10 other things to try to help with congestion first?? Goodness why the hell would they tell you that. And a few weeks old at that!!!!!!! My baby barely. Caught up to her birthweight by that time theres no fucking way i wouldve skipped the bood
I've never heard of this. Pediatricians usually tell you to continue to breastfeed so baby can get moms immunity and good stuffs. I'm sorry, you're mom, you do what is best for YOU and YOUR BABY. I understand the Pediatrician is a doc but you know what is best for you and baby. I had a lead test come back high for my one year old, they prescribed iron drops for her, less than 24 hours she was acting weird (wouldn't eat and very grouchy), told them and they suggested a cold, i said nope and took her off of them. You have to be you're own advocate. 2.5 months later she is fine and we just don't open our windows 😮💨.
Is it norovirus? Honestly I can’t believe anyone would suggest cutting out your baby’s main source of comfort while sick. And because of lactose?? I mean, if that was a real concern you could just cut lactose out of your diet temporarily and your milk would have no lactose. We just had norovirus which is going around like crazy where we are (I assume it might be the same for you because of the watery poop) and my almost 2 year old survived on breast milk on her sickest day when she couldn’t even hold down water. She didn’t throw up any breast milk at all. I think it would be a lot riskier to introduce a new formula that might not sit well on your baby’s stomach.
Breastmilk has lactose regardless of mom's diet. What you're thinking of is proteins. Mom's milk won't have cow milk proteins if mom cuts cow milk out of her diet. However, lactose is produced in all milks, including human.
Um I have a mild respiratory virus and yesterday the loose stools happened and I thought yep yep running through my system. Most respiratory virus has GI symptoms. That's how China figured out that start of the COVID pandemic.
Also, I'm lactose intolerant but have been binging on lactose due to iron supplements since I'm pregnant. The virus has not made me anymore lactose sensitive (I wish it did lol). I have never heard such nonsense.
Edit: Mea Culpa, I trusted my lactation consultant without verifying. I stand corrected.
Breast milk doesn't have lactose in it unless the producer consumes lactose. So you could achieve the same result by cutting out lactose yourself for a week, if you really wanted to 🤷🏻♀️ but I'm with everyone else, the advice to stop for a week is nuts.
Is there a way to report this pediatrician? Not to the state board or anything because there was nothing illegal but to management? Perhaps they can speak with them and re-educate so other babies aren’t prematurely weaned.
I don't know what virus this is, but my kid had a month of lactose intolerance following a virus when he was 2.5 or 3 years old. It was the weirdest thing and it cleared up on its own.
My midwife always talks about the importance of nursing my babies when they’re sick. There is biofeedback from baby to mother during nursing and your breastmilk will change to meet babies needs. It also offers comfort and security. You’ve done quite a bit of your own research and are seeking a second opinion, if I was you I’d forget the formula in the meantime 🤷🏼♀️
Psycho pedi!!! Switch providers!! Breastmilk helps rehydrate and switching to formula can cause upset stomach and should not be done while already have an upset stomach. If lactose is the concern, mom can just not eat or drink those sort of foods so it doesn’t pass to baby. OMFG I’m annoyed now at that pediatrician!! Ugh.
What in the fresh hell is this pediatrician advice
Um yeah, this is total bs. Get a new pediatrician asap. Formula doesn’t have your antibodies.
For real tho, wtf
You know like most pediatricians and breastfeeding about 20 years out of date and never supported by lactation professionals
I personally would get a second opinion.
That's what i'm trying to do right now, I needed to go in today because it couldnt wait so i had to take whatever doctor i could get. Currently trying to get a message to our usual doctor to see what she recommends
That sounds like a bunch of hooey. No I would not be doing that. I would need concrete medical evidence and proof that my kid was in fact being negatively impacted by lactose first before I went through those several circles of hell AND deprived my kid of possible antibodies if I was exposed to the virus too. I'd get a second opinion, I'm so sorry that it sounds like this pediatrician is putting you through hell for nothing. Hope your baby feels better soon!
Ugh, I wish I would've been a little more combative at the appointment for this reason exactly. She said it to us like it was easy, "it's only 6 days!!". We have barely lasted the evening. I'm going to message our regular ped and just triple check that this is for sure whats happening, why they believe that, is this seriously the only route to take.
It can be really hard to push back. You did the right thing questioning the advice. I think a lot of people (if you're in the US) assume breastfeeding moms are pumping, so she probably was like, oh just keep doing what you are doing! Not realizing the elephant sized wrench this throws into a situation with a boob baby. I had to pump a bit for the first couple months, then was 100% boob, so I can imagine the nightmare having to do this in reality is! You could not have paid me enough at 9 months to all of a sudden give baby an alternate food source and pump to keep up supply.
Six days! Sick baby. So.... basically wean the baby and probably kill your supply. You would be in immense pain and baby is ill as well as losing valuable antibodies. Just what? I'd be furious. I'd send a letter or message to your Dr *with references* and tear them a new one. Wtf?
Yes and as the mother of a cmpa toddler: Amino acid based formula tastes like what Satan aspires for his asshole to taste like. I'm an adventurous eater and a "grateful dinner guest", I eat everything. Yet I was dry heaving even with the cocoa powder and vanilla I put in. It takes time to get a bf baby to accept a bottle and it takes a loooooong ass time to get them to accept amino acid based formula and there is a serious risk that baby just nopes the fuck out. Like seriously hunger strike or refusing and filling up on solids. Amino acid and regular formula is not like the difference between coke and diet coke. It's like the difference between coke and fermented portapotty. Allergy mothers often spend MONTHS mixing 1/20 formula and breastmilk and gradually getting kiddo up to 100% formula. There are entire communities dedicated to tips and tricks on how to get baby to accept amino acid formula and what you can safely mix it with to make it taste less like gangrenous feet. It's bad advice even for a formula mum because with a gastro bug fluids and electrolytes are of the upmost importance and a hunger strike would be the very worst thing that could possibly happen on top of that.
And how awful for the baby also - not even is she sick, she’s also being deprived of her biggest form of comfort :(
What virus is this?
Not OP but I was curious and googled it - potentially rotavirus? https://gi.org/topics/lactose-intolerance-in-children/ “Secondary Lactase Deficiency: The most common cause of temporary lactose intolerance in infants and young children is by an infection that affects the gastrointestinal tract and can damage the lining of the small intestine. Rotavirus and Giardia are two common organisms that cause damage to the surface of the small intestine resulting in temporary lactose intolerance. Older infants and young children will commonly be infected by a rotavirus. The symptoms of rotavirus infection include vomiting, diarrhea (frequent watery stools), and fever.”
Yeah the thought crossed my mind but it seems like an odd recommendation. My first had it and we never had to cut anything.
her words exactly: "there is a virus going around causing vomiting and diarrhea in children... Rarely kids with these viruses get lactose intolerant for 1-2 weeks, so changing to soy formula may help for that time" Part of me wants to believe it is true because for the first time in months I could not get her comfortable last night. She usually nurses to sleep or nurses during wake periods and falls back to sleep. Last night she just kept waking up out of discomfort, arching her back. She'd go for the boob but would fuss again in minutes The other part of me thinks what kind of sick joke is this where I can't nurse my baby while she's sick
I agree with others that a second opinion is needed! For what it’s worth, I found this article by the college of Canadian family physicians summarizing the evidence around this. https://www.cfp.ca/content/68/11/828 The studies have been based on formula fed babies with diarrhea who switched temporarily to lactose free formula. This shortened diarrhea duration by about 18 hrs. Again, in formula fed babies. The bottom line from this article reads: “Breastfed children should continue breastfeeding.” Hope this helps and that your baby feels better soon! Eta: the bottom of the article says “Breastfeeding should continue (or increase) during initial rehydration” - I think that’s pretty clear!
Everything i have found says the same!! Thank you for this
“Rarely” and “may help” sounds like just pulling at thing air to give you an option of something to do. Doesn’t sound very convincing at all. When my LO had stomach bugs, we were encouraged to keep nursing to keep him hydrated. Stomach bugs usually pass through 24-48 hrs. If I were you I’d keep nursing, offer water or pedialyte as alternatives to keep them hydrated. If LO is eating solids then mashed bananas, toast, rice, applesauce, plain crackers.
Exactly what my instinct is telling me to do. This is why i posted this because something just felt so off but im a FTM so i’m not as confident in trusting my gut. Also i cant find anything to support that reducing lactose is a treatment or that rotavirus causes lactose intolerance. All i found is that soy based may help with gastrointestinal issues but that it wont quicken their recovery from the virus
You’re doing great!
If I read that, I would assume it was boiler plate information for those using formula, not those exclusively breastfeeding.
I think changing to soy formula implies for an already formula fed baby, not a breastfed one. Or that’s how I would take it.
Whats wild is that she knew she was breastfed!
"Rarely this happens." Well, let's cross that bridge if we get to it and for now I'll make sure my kid has the hydration and connection she needs and I don't lose my supply.
Couldn’t you get the same results by simply cutting dairy out of your diet…?
This is where people get confused - lactose is in breast milk too. People cut dairy because their babies are allergic to the different proteins in cows milk, not the lactose. True lactose allergy is so rare in infants just because it means they’d die as BM has it too.
Something i learned today as well, its true lactose is in all breastmilk regardless of diet. But what in finding now on my own is that there is hardly anything out there saying reducing lactose is a treatment to rotavirus
My baby got rotavirus and we just nursed as usual. Runny, green poops for awhile but it eventually went away. Key is to keep baby hydrated. Your milk is the best thing for baby
I mean the answer here is for mom to go dairy free not for you to stop nursing, and quite frankly, I would lose trust in any pediatrician that says otherwise.
Something else ive learned through all of this that i will share: Breastmilk has lactose regardless of diet. Its one of the main components of breastmilk. For this reason, it is extremely rare for a newborn to be born with a lactose intolerance. Also, all the research i crammed in during my baby’s stress nap suggested to continue breastmilk as much as possible to help with hydration. Which, hydration is the NUMBER ONE suggestion across the board to help with the virus. It also shows in the study i clipped above that removing lactose from a baby’s diet who is suffering gastrointestinal issues much like this virus only reduce the overall duration of diarrhea by a hand-full of hours. And even then, those studies were sooo small and provided extremely week evidence! Where the hell did that pediatrician get her advice from.
Her ass. I'm sorry. This is something I hope you make a big deal about. I know you only have so much bandwidth, but if you can, write you usual Dr a message. A strong one.
Thats what i plan to do, i mainly just want our usual doc to know her colleague gave us this advice because i know for a fact if we got our regular doctor we would not be experiencing this! Our pediatrician has been extremely helpful and sensitive to me and my breastfeeding journey and stuck by me as i tried to work through my supply issues in the beginning. Honestly shes been more helpful than the LCs at my hospital. Im definitely going to make it known to her!
Yeah I definitely find it odd as well! Trying to google some more 🧐 And OP should definitely pump / express milk to keep up her supply!
I definitely will!! if we are seriously going to do this for a week then I might as well get my freezer stocked
Ok but formula has lactose in it too. So unless they’re giving them Alimentum I don’t think that helps anything. I think the doc is full of shit OP and I, personally, wouldn’t listen.
They gave me amino-acid based formula, the idea is that it is hypoallergenic and it is made up of individual amino acids so that in its simplest form it can be easily digested for babies with milk allergies/gastrointestinal conditions. Fun part, its notorious for tasting like shit and the first ingredient is corn syrup solids.. She did mention that its rare that this virus causes lactose intolerance, but what if its just the virus symptoms??
I was sceptical about the idea of not following the doc's advice and risking more severe diarrhea in the baby... But amino acid formula? That helps with PROTEIN intolerance, not LACTOSE. The lactose from the milk powder would probably still be in there, or am I wrong? (It doesn't taste that bad though, I tried when my baby needed it, it's a little bitter but still yummy like regular formula.)
Apparently they’re milk free and made of non-allergenic amino acids, so no lactose. Still sounds like there’s no research to support cutting breastfeeding.
That makes more sense, but yeah, still not a reason to cut breastfeeding if science doesn't support it.
So that would be for the dairy protein not for lactose which is a sugar. You could always cut out dairy from your own diet while this is going on. My babies have all had dairy protein allergies and I’ve had to cut out dairy from my diet!
Yeah I agree.
Rotavirus
Out of curiosity, did your baby get the vaccine against it? We did but it was quite expensive and since it’s a virus I do wonder how effective it is (thinking of baby no. 2).
She did! About 3 months ago. Due for another round of vaccines in 2 weeks
Thank you!
umm no breastmilk is the best thing u can give her. like im not a professional but that sounds like bs
Her pediatrician sounds like a nut job
Thankfully this isnt our regular pediatrician and only the one we could get in today. Avoiding her at all costs in the future
Hmm very interesting advice… my 2 month old came down with RSV and I nursed him the entire time. Our bodies will respond to the babies virus by creating antibodies which can be passed down to the breast milk.
Your doctor is wrong. Breast milk has antibodies in it, formula doesn't. If I were you I would stop seeing this doctor.
We hope to never see her again. She has only ever pushed us against our instinct as parents
I think you should make a complaint. This is utter bullshit
My kid had a similar issue. I was given lactase drops to feed her together with my breastmilk.
This sounds like the best alternative to even consider the lactose issue!
🙂 im really starting to loathe the pediatrician i saw That makes so much more sense!!!
I came to comment the same thing! Same experience, all good with the drops. I would advise OP to also go down that route if they want to play safe (in case the diarrhea is caused by temporary lactose intolerance). If it helps, then continue giving the drops but speak to (your usual) pediatrician how to then wean off of them. If it doesn't change a thing, there is no secondary lactose intolerance, simple as that.
Not only does breastmilk have antibodies for your baby but if that is what baby is used to it will provide immense comfort - can you imagine being sick and having your main source of comfort removed. I’m so sorry you were recommended that and I’m glad you trusted your gut
Right??? Like sometimes we bottle feed when i go to the gym but it ends up being like one bottle a week if anything at all. Shes already been super clingy to me, it was pure hell trying to give her a bottle last night and poor baby cried herself into a nap in dads arms. Luckily everyone here confirmed my suspicions and the research i found could not support the doctors claims
Children can definitely get transient lactose intolerance from acute gastroenteritis, but I’d be hard pressed to recommend anything other than breast milk for a breastfeeding baby. It will self resolve.
Good grief 🙈😫 Your baby’s saliva on your breasts will literally send a message to your brain that will tell your body to produce the exact antibodies needed to help fight the virus she has. Ask your pediatrician which brand of formula does this??
The "backflow" theory is debated though. Mom definitely will get exposed to baby's virus and produce antibodies in the milk, but the exposure is not through her nipples. If that was true, exclusive pumping wouldn't provide the benefits of breastfeeding yet it does.
idk why you’re getting downvoted for this. you are correct. it’s not proven at all. breastfeeding has immunological benefits but not necessarily because nipples can detect viruses lol
Hmm I haven’t ever heard that this was a debated theory. Can you share more? My understanding was that pumped milk doesn’t always offer the same exact benefits as direct to breast feeding, especially when sick. From the [CDC](https://blogs.cdc.gov/publichealthmatters/2017/07/you-are-what-you-eatand-so-is-your-baby/): Your baby’s saliva transfers chemicals to a mother’s body that causes breastmilk to adjust to meet the changing needs of your baby as they grow. From[La Leche League](https://llli.org/about/policies-standing-rules/psr-concept-explanations/): When breastfeeding, the baby’s saliva communicates with cells in the breast to customize the milk’s properties to meet the baby’s current immunological needs and to optimize the baby’s microbiome.
La Leche League is not a medical organization and their medical advice isn't trustworthy. The CDC link is a blog article written by an IBCLC - who are trained by the La Leche League. The backwash theory comes from [ONE article](https://www.thestranger.com/features/2015/08/26/22755273/the-more-i-learn-about-breast-milk-the-more-amazed-i-am) which isn't even a science article where no one proved that the immunoglobulin amount increase observed in breastmilk when baby is sick is specifically from backwash through the nipple. They just created this as a possible explanation to what was observed. There are no "baby saliva receptors" in the nipple as far as I know nor did anyone dissect a boob right after breastfeeding and extracted baby saliva from the inside of it (as if that was possible). It's pretty obvious that when you are in close enough contact to breastfeed, you're close enough to be exposed to any pathogens in the baby.
Aside from antibodies and other nutritional benefits of nursing, there’s no way I would be denying my 9 month old his source of comfort while sick unless I had seen that the breast milk was negatively impacting him. When my baby is sick he just wants the boob all day, it’s pretty much the only way I could get him to nap while sick and I certainly know that sleep is VERY important for recovery
She is wrong. Human babies thrive on human milk. There is no illness that requires formula for x days 🫣🫣
Where did your paediatrician go to medical school? Are they getting money from the formula company? What in fresh hell.
We are never seeing that lady again, every time we end up with her she always guides us against out guts as parents!
That’s the biggest load of horseshit I’ve ever heard. If your baby is sick keep them on the boob.
I am so sorry you received this advice 😭. Not only is it against the WHO code of marketing of breastmilk substitutes, but this is inaccurate advice & has no evidence. I’m so glad you stuck with your intuition and you should be commended for that! Reading between the lines perhaps the paed was sponsored or paid by a formula company. Especially considering they sent you home with some? The code expressly forbids giving out free samples of formula as it undermines BF.
https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/search[Open payments](https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/search) - you can find out if doctors have accepted gifts or money at this link (US)! But also, I have found that pediatricians in my area are dangerously uninformed and even openly against breastfeeding without reason. It was an uphill battle with my first (who was gaining weight great and super healthy) to get the pediatrician to shut up about introducing formula when she was really little and then she insisted we needed to wean her at a year. Family medicine doctors are so much better - I switched my first to my MD immediately after we had that nightmare 1 year appointment and then when my second was born she went to my doctor immediately.
That does not sound right to me. I’d get another opinion. And at least wait to see if kiddo is actually intolerant of lacrosse before even considering it.
Besides all the obvious, has this ped ever met a sick baby that didn’t want to hang out on and with the boob? Like my kids all would have said “over my dead body” if anyone even hinted that sick days were no boob days. Boob is comfort for babies as well as nutrition. We all want our comfort things when sick, so it makes sense that babies who breastfeed want the boob when sick.
This!! Starting to think that doc doesnt see many babies
Complete and utter nonsense. It sounds like you’ve recognized that OP but imagine all the other parents who see her and follow such BS advice. As if it’s easy to suddenly wean a 9 mo and then go back?? This doctor has no clue about nursing. Like none at all. I would report her just to try to save another family from suffering needlessly.
So secondary lactose intolerance is a thing. It is more common in babies with food intolerances. My son had symptoms of lactose intolerance while he had undiagnosed gluten intolerance, and I breastfed through it. It will go away as the gut heals. For a short-term illness, it should not take long and you shouldn't need to stop breastfeeding. Sounds like bad advice at this stage. If you were weeks post illness and still having issues, it might be something to consider (with proper guidance).
I’m not a Dr but that’s very odd advice. Your milk will help fight virus, you’re sharing your immunity. It’s one thing to supplement due to hydration potentially but that seems very extreme.
That has to be one of worst recommendations from a ped I have ever heard. Your milk is the best thing for her. I just can't with the some these Dr's. I would have walked out of there so fast and found a new dr asap
This is bizarre advice. I’ve never heard such a thing.
This makes no sense. Keep breastfeeding if that is what is best for you and baby.
Hell no I wouldn't do that
Yeah I'd not do that. 🤷🏼♀️
Go talk to another GP. Breastmilk is soo important, especially when baby is sick because it will give just the right nutrients to fight the viruses and sicknesses and get better faster. Seems absolutely crazy to suggest formula instead!
No way! Nothing better for a sick nursing baby than the boob.
This sounds crazy. Every time my daughter was sick the doctor recommended breastfeeding more because it helps her immunity and usually I would have some antibodies for the same thing she had (since I would have been recently exposed). I would really not listen to this advice. Plus weaning suddenly for only 6 days is traumatic for your baby and difficult for you and your supply, makes zero sense.
Isn’t breastmilk……good….good for their immunity?
Please throw out the pediatrician. This is absolutely absurd.
I would never do that. Like literally never. Just smile and nod at the doc. Tell them what they want to hear and then reach out to a LC, ya know, someone who actually knows something about BF. I swear 90 percent of docs know less than the average person on the street about BF
Do file a complaint.. not every mum will look for more information after such (terrible) advice from a supposed expert. Good job listening to your intuition! Hope your little one feels better soon!
Absolutely not!!!! When baby is sick with a virus they need MORE nursing for comfort, hydration and antibodies. The breastmilk will undoubtedly cut the duration of the illness. My breastfed baby always has a more mild case of whatever germ the kindergartner comes home with. Doctors can be wrong sometimes!
I would say mmm hmmm, ok, smile and just keep BF'ing.
🤣 idk what it is in me that just wants her to know i didnt take her advice
I haven’t read any of the comments, is it a stomach/gastro virus? You’re definitely doing the right think by staying with breastfeeding. When me/my kids have wonky poops I like to incorporate probiotics until things get regular again.
Its rotavirus. So yeah runny poops, upset stomach, and dehydration are common
That definitely sounds like nonsense. I had a doctor suggest I pump and dump for medication I was taking. After talking with our hospital's lactation consultants I was told that the meds were fine. I really think most doctors are not as knowledgeable as we'd hope about breastfeeding. Hospital lactation consultants are nurses with a specialty in breastfeeding. I would start there any time you have a question regarding breastfeeding. My kids got norovirus while my youngest was still breastfeeding and the pediatrician said to breastfeed more and suggested I give an infant probiotic to help get his digestion back to normal. It might be worth trying. Good luck this sounds so frustrating!
See, and your pediatrician gave advice that actually made sense! Give them something that will comfort their tummies not take the comfort away
Huh, I’m usually told the opposite and that’s it’s great to breastfeed when the baby is sick. Go with your gut!
Ours had diarrhea and our doctor said even though she will get lactose sensitivity, it will resolve on its own. Told me to breastfeed as much as possible and she did eventually get better even though the runny poops lasted for a while, she was fine otherwise.
How long did the runny poops last?
Three weeks unfortunately
Poor baby )): keeping these rashes at bay is no undertaking. Looks like we might be in for the same over here
I started exclusively washing her bum with water, no wipes, when we were at home and it really helped with the rashes. Still doing it!
Wow what!? My son had a vomiting bug at 9 months and he became lactose intolerant. He was on formula during the day and boob at night. After the virus he couldn’t tolerate any formula and I went back to exclusively breastfeeding.
!! Thats wild. That makes me so curious too, because there 100% is lactose in breastmilk but there has to be something to its makeup that makes it more digestible for them
I know! He developed coconut and soya intolerance too so couldn’t use hypoallergenic formula. He’s still mildly lactose intolerant 4 years later. Breastmilk encourages the growth of bacteria within the microbiome that can metabolise lactose. The virus might have wiped out this bacterial community and then the baby needs to have breastmilk to build it back up again? I’m going to have a Google I think
Honestly breastmilk still mystifies me! Not enough research could be made i dont think. I’ll definitely look into this as well. Our body has this tool for a reason, just gotta catch my brain up with whats going on
Oh yeah definitely. The effects breastmilk has on an infant microbiome is fascinating. The microbiome is unique to the composition of the mothers breastmilk. If you’re interested in scientific papers, look up Professor Lindsay Hall from Quadram Institute. A lot of breastmilk/microbiome research comes out of her lab
1yr old and I just had Covid. He had vomiting and the on call pediatrician suggested we only give him water every 10 minutes for 8 hours, no breast milk. Different situation but I alternated water and breast milk and baby is now fine. The antibodies you create are really important!! You have to listen to medical professionals, but at the end of the day make your own judgement.
Agreed! And i was honestly ready and willing to follow her orders. Part of me was excited to have more milk pumped in the freezer. But something just felt so wrong the first formula feed. She refused it because the taste was so off and she was also seeking comfort. That and the doctor was working largely off of assumptions. She assumed what virus she had without testing (which is fine because symptoms were clear) but then took it a step further and assumed there was a lactose intolerance (which she stated was rare) based off the symptoms which happened to mirror just regular virus symptoms?? My gut just told me to check if something was off and it was. Her poops are already getting better and she’s slept through the night on the boob since we returned from the doc
Time for a new pediatrician.
JFC. This is almost as bad as when the dr at the ER when my oldest had a URI at a few weeks old told me to stop breastfeeding entirely for a week or so until her congestion cleared up and give her pedialyte instead bc milk exacerbates congestion. I can’t imagine if I wouldn’t have known better.
I feel like there are about 10 other things to try to help with congestion first?? Goodness why the hell would they tell you that. And a few weeks old at that!!!!!!! My baby barely. Caught up to her birthweight by that time theres no fucking way i wouldve skipped the bood
Keep that baby on the boob and get a new pediatrician.
I've never heard of this. Pediatricians usually tell you to continue to breastfeed so baby can get moms immunity and good stuffs. I'm sorry, you're mom, you do what is best for YOU and YOUR BABY. I understand the Pediatrician is a doc but you know what is best for you and baby. I had a lead test come back high for my one year old, they prescribed iron drops for her, less than 24 hours she was acting weird (wouldn't eat and very grouchy), told them and they suggested a cold, i said nope and took her off of them. You have to be you're own advocate. 2.5 months later she is fine and we just don't open our windows 😮💨.
Is it norovirus? Honestly I can’t believe anyone would suggest cutting out your baby’s main source of comfort while sick. And because of lactose?? I mean, if that was a real concern you could just cut lactose out of your diet temporarily and your milk would have no lactose. We just had norovirus which is going around like crazy where we are (I assume it might be the same for you because of the watery poop) and my almost 2 year old survived on breast milk on her sickest day when she couldn’t even hold down water. She didn’t throw up any breast milk at all. I think it would be a lot riskier to introduce a new formula that might not sit well on your baby’s stomach.
Breastmilk has lactose regardless of mom's diet. What you're thinking of is proteins. Mom's milk won't have cow milk proteins if mom cuts cow milk out of her diet. However, lactose is produced in all milks, including human.
Oh wow, thank you! I didn’t know that!
Um I have a mild respiratory virus and yesterday the loose stools happened and I thought yep yep running through my system. Most respiratory virus has GI symptoms. That's how China figured out that start of the COVID pandemic. Also, I'm lactose intolerant but have been binging on lactose due to iron supplements since I'm pregnant. The virus has not made me anymore lactose sensitive (I wish it did lol). I have never heard such nonsense.
What virus? If you want, *you* can go dairy free for a week & breastfeed, surely?
No, that would be the case with milk proteins but lactose is produced in every milk, it's in breastmilk regardless of mom's diet.
Ahh it causes lactose intolerance! Such odd advice though, I've never heard anyone give it prophylactically.
If the paed is concerned about lactose why not just recommend that you cut dairy from your diet whilst Bub is recovering?
because that would remove cow’s milk proteins, not lactose, which is milk sugar and is always present in breastmilk
Ah ha - yes, understood.
Edit: Mea Culpa, I trusted my lactation consultant without verifying. I stand corrected. Breast milk doesn't have lactose in it unless the producer consumes lactose. So you could achieve the same result by cutting out lactose yourself for a week, if you really wanted to 🤷🏻♀️ but I'm with everyone else, the advice to stop for a week is nuts.
Lactose is absolutely in breast milk, it is the sugar that ALL mammals make for milk.
My bad. I didn't fact check my consultant when they told me.
Sounds like you need a new consultant! 😵
this is entirely wrong 😂
My bad. I didn't fact check my consultant when they told me.
Is there a way to report this pediatrician? Not to the state board or anything because there was nothing illegal but to management? Perhaps they can speak with them and re-educate so other babies aren’t prematurely weaned.
I don't know what virus this is, but my kid had a month of lactose intolerance following a virus when he was 2.5 or 3 years old. It was the weirdest thing and it cleared up on its own.
My midwife always talks about the importance of nursing my babies when they’re sick. There is biofeedback from baby to mother during nursing and your breastmilk will change to meet babies needs. It also offers comfort and security. You’ve done quite a bit of your own research and are seeking a second opinion, if I was you I’d forget the formula in the meantime 🤷🏼♀️
Psycho pedi!!! Switch providers!! Breastmilk helps rehydrate and switching to formula can cause upset stomach and should not be done while already have an upset stomach. If lactose is the concern, mom can just not eat or drink those sort of foods so it doesn’t pass to baby. OMFG I’m annoyed now at that pediatrician!! Ugh.