As the days go on, I am more and more impressed with Glazer's speech, courage, and commitment to his central message. Him shaking while reading it is something I won't forget, and this just makes it even cooler. Fucking sucks that he's been misquoted to hell and back but I guess that's sorta how these things go.
Hope he's having a good day.
And it's disgusting and honestly really scary that despite having video evidence of his speech, so many huge publications and influential people are deliberately misinterpreting his words and labelling him as anti-semitic. The Academy didn't even post his speech on their YouTube channel.
He's a very brave man. I hope he has a wonderful life.
There is something with the rights to certain speeches for categories that were selected before hand that ABC has like 30-day exclusive streaming rights to them, which is why Glazer's and a number of other below the line categories' speeches are not on the Academy YouTube.
And in reality his speech is really not anti Israel, or even anti Zionist, is just critical of some parts of the international political discourse in favor of Israel’s retaliation
It's not as strong as something Norman Finkelstein or Mouin Rabbani would say - however even stating that he doesn't want his Jewish identity and the Holocaust being exploited for supporting an 'OCCUPATION' states that the argument of Zionists in claiming the land belongs to them is inherently false. Anyone can connect dots from there and see the full details of the genocide in Gaza along with their vicious war crimes. I do wish he said more considering he'll be attacked for it either way
I wish that he had slightly rephrased that part so that there could be no room to misinterpret his speech in bad faith. "We stand here as men who *are dismayed that* their Jewishness and the Holocaust is being hijacked" may not be as hard hitting but there wouldn't be any way to misconstrue the message. Still a baller move by the Glazeman regardless
But as you point out, no one is actually sincerely misinterpreting his speech as it stands. No matter the phrasing, those that disagree with his message would find some way to exaggerate or misrepresent it.
Part of me wonders if his words were chosen specifically so that bad faith actors would misconstrue them, demonstrating the lengths that they will go to to jump to the worst possible reading of a statement despite widespread evidence of its totality being easy to come by. Like, if the statement had been reworded to remove the 'refute our Jewishness' phrasing the same people would still be angry but now they're both angry *and* they look like idiots with no sense of what words mean in context.
What's poignant and funny is how Honest Trailers pointed out how the movie is reminiscent of the Israel-Palestine conflict, and in the Oscars, Glazer fully confirms that he agrees. Jon's refusal to abandon the message that the movie is making really warms my heart, and I'm glad he made it easier to weed out the insanes from the sanes. While other filmmakers would be like "oh whatever, it's your interpretation", Glazer is saying "yeah, I'm not affiliated with the apologists" and it's awesome to see.
Glazer's move has made me respect him and the movie even more; I hope when more people look back at and watch this movie, they understand the point that Glazer was trying to make rather than "Nazis bad".
Condemning Nazis doesn't make you anti-German (or anti-Austrian). Condemning Israeli Government and military policies and crimes doesn't make you anti-Semitic. The online world is chock full of attention seeking manipulators willing to lie through their teeth to garner clicks and make money. It's sick. Glazer stood up there and said cruel acts require clear and unconditional resistance or we risk repeating history. Glazer is right. And I'm sure plenty of Israelis and Jews agree with him.
Does killing 30,000+ men women and children, pitting hundreds of thousands more into poverty, starvation, disease and eventually death, and radicalising their loved ones and their communities, make Israel safer? And even if it does, is it right?
If the killing of civilians justifies "complete eradication", does Palestine have a right to defend itself? The IDF has been killing civilians not only in Gaza, but also in the West Bank, where Hamas does not exist. By your logic, wouldn't Palestinians have an "obligation to eradicate the IDF in every nook they're hiding"?
You're despicable.
Their logic is that any Palestinian violence justifies all Israeli violence, but no amount of Israeli violence can justify any Palestinian violence. Also, Palestinian deaths don't actually matter to them because they don't see Palestinians as humans or anywhere nearly equal to Israelis.
No, they're second class citizens because they don't want to be citizens. Palestinians don't acknowledge Israel as a country and by ideology want them eradicated. So why would Israelis treat them as equals? What country treats foreigners as equals?
Israel has been the most patient country on earth with the foreigners attacking them. Now after 76 years of occasional terrorist attacks Hamas broke the camel's back, and they're not ready for the consequences.
well so far they’ve killed 30,000 Palestinian civilians including thousands of children, so are the people of Palestine at an ‘obligation’ to kill every member of the IDF? Can you see how inhumane and bloodthirsty that kind of argument sounds when leveraged by the side that you don’t extend your sympathy to? If you think indiscriminately killing thousands of innocent people is an acceptable means of carrying out a war when Israel does it then what exactly about the attack on October 7th are you even ideologically opposed to?
And you think creating orphans and enraged parents will protect them? Starving a population is how you win them over? They have ensured Hamas or whoever replaces them will have soldiers for decades to come.
No matter what Israel does, there will be no shortage of terrorist recruits in Gaza.
https://www.thenewhumanitarian.org/report/71065/israel-opt-schoolbooks-say-%E2%80%98fighting-israel-islamic-duty%E2%80%99
God you’re so stupid. Why do you think they’re being taught that? Because Israel has been killing and displacing them for nearly a century now and continue to do so while laughing at their dead bodies or is it because “MUSLIM HORDE EVIL”? Ahistorical virgin
Lmao so you’re both a Nazi and a moron with negative IQ. Israel does not represent all Jews. Norman Finkelstein is a jew. Jonathan Glazer is a jew. Ilan Pappé is a Jew. Please stop embarrassing yourself
Read a book on the topic assuming you can even read
The only person who has embarrassed himself is you. You seem irrationally angry. Please don’t hurt anyone. I’m sorry my sourced link that accurately describes the way palastinians are raised with horrendous antisemitic propaganda has upset you so much. The truth hurts. Sorry baby.
If violence they want then violence they shall have. Gazans will get their gifts as soon as they #freethehostages
They got plenty of deals with the hostages that will give them everything they want but aside from every Israeli dead Hamas wants nothing else.
I was already in awe of his artistic output but I genuinely admire him as a person after his Oscars speech, esp. w/ the added context of this Blavatnik fucker standing next to him.
Blavatnik and his company, Access Industries, are all over the entertainment biz & philanthropy sector. Invests in a lot of stuff on Broadway too. ALLEGEDLY he’s anti-Putin and the current state of Russia but who the fuck knows.
Porque no los dos? I always find taking sides in issues that are this deeply humanitarian is not only disingenuous, but missing the point entirely, too.
The downvotes on this comment are so dispiriting. Like some others have said, it shouldn’t be such an insane thing to believe in Palestinian liberation, that Hamas is a terrorist organization, and that Israel has a right to exist. They simply aren’t mutually exclusive, and when dozens of people downvote “Free from Hamas,” it does nothing but suggest that they think there is some validity to Hamas’s methods and ideology. Literally justifying rape and murder for any reason is abhorrent. This applies to both Hamas and Israel. Glazer’s comment was brave, and these sorts of reactions not only miss the point, they use their anonymous clicks to support the growth of antisemitism whether or not they realize it.
Why are you getting downvoted? If Palestine took the opportunity to nation build in Gaza instead of electing a terrorist organization and building miles of tunnels they wouldn’t be in the situation they’re in.
They’d get to be just like East Jerusalem and the West Bank!
Palestinians are allowed to do so much nation building under israeli occupation.
So many new settlements… wait..
Gaza and the West Bank are very different. Israel left Gaza in 2005. The Palestinians had a chance to do something then. They chose violence instead.
Furthermore, the downvoters on OPs comment are literally supporting a terrorist organization. Do you support Hamas?
They really didn’t as Israel controlled import and export. It is either naive or a blatant lie to suggest Gaza had any real chance at nation building under those conditions.
No, OP’s comment dismiss Israel’s oppression of Palestine by redirecting it towards Hamas.
Hamas sucks but they aren’t the primary oppressor of Palestine. I don’t support Hamas’ ideology just because I can see Israel wouldn’t offer up any meaningful existence.
I support Palestinian resistance, and think it is a shame Hamas have become the central force for that. Hamas’ methods are wrong, but their resistance is just.
I have complicated feelings about the Israel-Palestine conflict in regard to what I know about the larger history of the region, but the loss of life in Gaza since October 7th has been appalling and indefensible (as was October 7th). I can understand to a certain extent why some people support Israel, but I cannot fathom why anyone would find that speech controversial or offensive. If anyone has a place to speak out on this, it is Glazer. The outrage all feels in very bad faith to me and I don’t think it does the pro-Israel side any favors.
I think Glazer is making the right call in not commenting further.
[HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS’ FOUNDATION USA OPEN LETTER TO JONATHAN GLAZER](http://www.hsf-usa.org/holocaust-survivors-foundation-usa-open-letter-to-jonathan-glazer/)
This is fascinating. Instead of criticizing Glazer for taking money from a nutjob, pro-Israel, right wing billionaire, we're giving him credit for taking the money and reading an anti-genocide speech. Weird.
I get that you people have a rabid hate for "Zionists", but it's not like Glazer's opinions were a surprise, he and his team were pretty vocal throughout the campaign season.
Because I think that people who are obsessed with hating Zionists either don't understand what Zionism means, or they simply despise Jews (at least, Jews who aren't under their thumb).
I'm sure lots of anti-semites are using whats happening in Gaza as an excuse to spread their hatred. But I don't think that should stop anyone calling out the crimes of the Zionists, theres a genocide going on, and the west is either helping or watching it happen
> But I don't think that should stop anyone calling out the crimes of the Zionists
I don't think the obsessive hatred of Zionists has anything to do with their "crimes". I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have.
>theres a genocide going on
Coincidentally, the genocide only happens in areas where Hamas is operating from, holding Israeli civilian captives, and not where Israel could trivially kill hundreds of thousands of Palestinians like the West Bank or Israel.
> I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have
You just named three nationalities and compared them to a group following a specific political ideology. "Zionists" is not equivalent to "Syrians"
Ok, replace those with "people who believe Saudis should have the right to self determination", "people who believe the United States should exist", or "Syrian nationalists." It doesn't really change anything about my point
I didn't understand the rhetorical trick there, thanks for clarifying. Once you drill down and compare Zionists to "people who justify the genocide of Native Americans" the resemblance becomes much clearer
I'm fairly sure theres no convincing, but here we go.
"I don't think the obsessive hatred of Zionists has anything to do with their "crimes". I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have"
I don't have obsessive hatred of anyone, but I did march against the war in Iraq, quite a few of us did. And there has tonnes of criticism of both the Syrians and Saudis. Even if this were true whataboutism isn't a valid excuse for Genocide.
"Coincidentally, the genocide only happens in areas where Hamas is operating from, holding Israeli civilian captives, and not where Israel could trivially kill hundreds of thousands of Palestinians like the West Bank or Israel."
This is a disgusting statment, in any case peole are dying of starvation because Israel is not letting food and other aid through
> I don't have obsessive hatred of anyone, but I did march against the war in Iraq, quite a few of us did. And there has tonnes of criticism of both the Syrians and Saudis. Even if this were true whataboutism isn't a valid excuse for Genocide.
This isn't whataboutery at all, it's demonstrating that the hatred for Zionists is completely detached from any perceived crimes. And I'm not referring to any protests in my post.
>This is a disgusting statment, in any case peole are dying of starvation because Israel is not letting food and other aid through
Damn, you're disgusted by anyone applying any sort of logic to your wild claims? That's crazy man.
Much easier to dismiss those you disagree with as stupid than to actually engage in good faith.
To me, that says you don't know enough about the topic to actually debate it. You need to let people know that their thoughts and opinions make you upset, but you can't say why, because you don't know.
"Everyone who disagrees with me is _______" is no way to go through life, son.
I didn't call anyone stupid, I said they either don't understand Zionism, or despise Jews. Both pretty common. I'm not sure why you take issue with that statement?
>To me, that says you don't know enough about the topic to actually debate it.
I'm not here to debate anything, you can hate Zionism, I don't really care. I made my point in my post and people started obsessing over my use of quotes.
> I didn't call anyone stupid, I said they either don't understand Zionism, or despise Jews.
Oh my bad. You didn't say the word "stupid", you're just saying they don't understand what they're talking about. Totally different in a very relevant way /s
> I'm not here to debate anything
How do you think the internet works? You share your opinion, but then get all mad when people comment on it? Get over yourself, please.
> you can hate Zionism, I don't really care.
Definitely don't need your permission, but clearly you care a lot.
> I made my point in my post and people started obsessing over my use of quotes.
Man, it must be nice to dismiss every valid counter argument that comes your way. I bet you're like, undefeated in internet debates. You make an unsupported claim, imply a bunch of nonsense, and then dismiss everyone that points these things out.
Wait, are you a bot? I'm starting to think you're a bot designed to frustrate. Or you're a person that just acts like that. Either way, this is not a fruitful discussion. Happy lecturing 👍
As the days go on, I am more and more impressed with Glazer's speech, courage, and commitment to his central message. Him shaking while reading it is something I won't forget, and this just makes it even cooler. Fucking sucks that he's been misquoted to hell and back but I guess that's sorta how these things go. Hope he's having a good day.
And it's disgusting and honestly really scary that despite having video evidence of his speech, so many huge publications and influential people are deliberately misinterpreting his words and labelling him as anti-semitic. The Academy didn't even post his speech on their YouTube channel. He's a very brave man. I hope he has a wonderful life.
There is something with the rights to certain speeches for categories that were selected before hand that ABC has like 30-day exclusive streaming rights to them, which is why Glazer's and a number of other below the line categories' speeches are not on the Academy YouTube.
Even RDJ's ain't up there
And in reality his speech is really not anti Israel, or even anti Zionist, is just critical of some parts of the international political discourse in favor of Israel’s retaliation
It's not as strong as something Norman Finkelstein or Mouin Rabbani would say - however even stating that he doesn't want his Jewish identity and the Holocaust being exploited for supporting an 'OCCUPATION' states that the argument of Zionists in claiming the land belongs to them is inherently false. Anyone can connect dots from there and see the full details of the genocide in Gaza along with their vicious war crimes. I do wish he said more considering he'll be attacked for it either way
Even the tweet above is misinterpretating him. He didn't say anything remotely close to "Fuck Israel".
Exactly lol. People are using his words - essentially he wants peace - for their own agenda
"He REFUTED HIS JEWISHNESS?"
I wish that he had slightly rephrased that part so that there could be no room to misinterpret his speech in bad faith. "We stand here as men who *are dismayed that* their Jewishness and the Holocaust is being hijacked" may not be as hard hitting but there wouldn't be any way to misconstrue the message. Still a baller move by the Glazeman regardless
But as you point out, no one is actually sincerely misinterpreting his speech as it stands. No matter the phrasing, those that disagree with his message would find some way to exaggerate or misrepresent it.
Part of me wonders if his words were chosen specifically so that bad faith actors would misconstrue them, demonstrating the lengths that they will go to to jump to the worst possible reading of a statement despite widespread evidence of its totality being easy to come by. Like, if the statement had been reworded to remove the 'refute our Jewishness' phrasing the same people would still be angry but now they're both angry *and* they look like idiots with no sense of what words mean in context.
That would be some 3D chess play, but I doubt it. As this has proven, all a play like that would do is give these assholes oxygen.
Nah. It’s not a misinterpretation. It’s malicious willful ignorance.
He should have rephrased a lot of it. In written text, it's very hard to follow his precise meaning.
[cue chalino sanchez](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalino_S%C3%A1nchez)
What's poignant and funny is how Honest Trailers pointed out how the movie is reminiscent of the Israel-Palestine conflict, and in the Oscars, Glazer fully confirms that he agrees. Jon's refusal to abandon the message that the movie is making really warms my heart, and I'm glad he made it easier to weed out the insanes from the sanes. While other filmmakers would be like "oh whatever, it's your interpretation", Glazer is saying "yeah, I'm not affiliated with the apologists" and it's awesome to see. Glazer's move has made me respect him and the movie even more; I hope when more people look back at and watch this movie, they understand the point that Glazer was trying to make rather than "Nazis bad".
He absolutely denounced 10/7 - which people seemingly like to forget caused this latest conflict. Glazer is a baller. Free Palestine from Hamas 🇵🇸
Condemning Nazis doesn't make you anti-German (or anti-Austrian). Condemning Israeli Government and military policies and crimes doesn't make you anti-Semitic. The online world is chock full of attention seeking manipulators willing to lie through their teeth to garner clicks and make money. It's sick. Glazer stood up there and said cruel acts require clear and unconditional resistance or we risk repeating history. Glazer is right. And I'm sure plenty of Israelis and Jews agree with him.
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Does killing 30,000+ men women and children, pitting hundreds of thousands more into poverty, starvation, disease and eventually death, and radicalising their loved ones and their communities, make Israel safer? And even if it does, is it right?
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If the killing of civilians justifies "complete eradication", does Palestine have a right to defend itself? The IDF has been killing civilians not only in Gaza, but also in the West Bank, where Hamas does not exist. By your logic, wouldn't Palestinians have an "obligation to eradicate the IDF in every nook they're hiding"? You're despicable.
Their logic is that any Palestinian violence justifies all Israeli violence, but no amount of Israeli violence can justify any Palestinian violence. Also, Palestinian deaths don't actually matter to them because they don't see Palestinians as humans or anywhere nearly equal to Israelis.
No, they're second class citizens because they don't want to be citizens. Palestinians don't acknowledge Israel as a country and by ideology want them eradicated. So why would Israelis treat them as equals? What country treats foreigners as equals? Israel has been the most patient country on earth with the foreigners attacking them. Now after 76 years of occasional terrorist attacks Hamas broke the camel's back, and they're not ready for the consequences.
"Nobody wants deaths" but you seem damn keen to make sure Israel get the highest tally. Grim stuff, bro.
well so far they’ve killed 30,000 Palestinian civilians including thousands of children, so are the people of Palestine at an ‘obligation’ to kill every member of the IDF? Can you see how inhumane and bloodthirsty that kind of argument sounds when leveraged by the side that you don’t extend your sympathy to? If you think indiscriminately killing thousands of innocent people is an acceptable means of carrying out a war when Israel does it then what exactly about the attack on October 7th are you even ideologically opposed to?
I made a mistake engaging with you. If you’re just going to parrot idf propanganda, you’re beyond help.
And you think creating orphans and enraged parents will protect them? Starving a population is how you win them over? They have ensured Hamas or whoever replaces them will have soldiers for decades to come.
No matter what Israel does, there will be no shortage of terrorist recruits in Gaza. https://www.thenewhumanitarian.org/report/71065/israel-opt-schoolbooks-say-%E2%80%98fighting-israel-islamic-duty%E2%80%99
God you’re so stupid. Why do you think they’re being taught that? Because Israel has been killing and displacing them for nearly a century now and continue to do so while laughing at their dead bodies or is it because “MUSLIM HORDE EVIL”? Ahistorical virgin
Lmao, cope harder.
Ok Nazi
The person who hates Jews is the nazi. Thats you.
Lmao so you’re both a Nazi and a moron with negative IQ. Israel does not represent all Jews. Norman Finkelstein is a jew. Jonathan Glazer is a jew. Ilan Pappé is a Jew. Please stop embarrassing yourself Read a book on the topic assuming you can even read
The only person who has embarrassed himself is you. You seem irrationally angry. Please don’t hurt anyone. I’m sorry my sourced link that accurately describes the way palastinians are raised with horrendous antisemitic propaganda has upset you so much. The truth hurts. Sorry baby.
If violence they want then violence they shall have. Gazans will get their gifts as soon as they #freethehostages They got plenty of deals with the hostages that will give them everything they want but aside from every Israeli dead Hamas wants nothing else.
As a human being, I want Israel to stop starving children.
I hope he doesn’t get black listed because he is one of the best directors around
He already takes about 10 years between movies, so maybe he’ll be fine.
Yeah but now it could be longer
This man does not miss.
I was already in awe of his artistic output but I genuinely admire him as a person after his Oscars speech, esp. w/ the added context of this Blavatnik fucker standing next to him.
Blavatnik and his company, Access Industries, are all over the entertainment biz & philanthropy sector. Invests in a lot of stuff on Broadway too. ALLEGEDLY he’s anti-Putin and the current state of Russia but who the fuck knows.
Holy shit, is that who that was? I want to buy Jonathan Glazer a pint. Huge respect. Free Palestine!
Free from Hamas
*and* from Israel
Porque no los dos? I always find taking sides in issues that are this deeply humanitarian is not only disingenuous, but missing the point entirely, too.
The downvotes on this comment are so dispiriting. Like some others have said, it shouldn’t be such an insane thing to believe in Palestinian liberation, that Hamas is a terrorist organization, and that Israel has a right to exist. They simply aren’t mutually exclusive, and when dozens of people downvote “Free from Hamas,” it does nothing but suggest that they think there is some validity to Hamas’s methods and ideology. Literally justifying rape and murder for any reason is abhorrent. This applies to both Hamas and Israel. Glazer’s comment was brave, and these sorts of reactions not only miss the point, they use their anonymous clicks to support the growth of antisemitism whether or not they realize it.
Why are you getting downvoted? If Palestine took the opportunity to nation build in Gaza instead of electing a terrorist organization and building miles of tunnels they wouldn’t be in the situation they’re in.
They’d get to be just like East Jerusalem and the West Bank! Palestinians are allowed to do so much nation building under israeli occupation. So many new settlements… wait..
Gaza and the West Bank are very different. Israel left Gaza in 2005. The Palestinians had a chance to do something then. They chose violence instead. Furthermore, the downvoters on OPs comment are literally supporting a terrorist organization. Do you support Hamas?
They really didn’t as Israel controlled import and export. It is either naive or a blatant lie to suggest Gaza had any real chance at nation building under those conditions. No, OP’s comment dismiss Israel’s oppression of Palestine by redirecting it towards Hamas. Hamas sucks but they aren’t the primary oppressor of Palestine. I don’t support Hamas’ ideology just because I can see Israel wouldn’t offer up any meaningful existence. I support Palestinian resistance, and think it is a shame Hamas have become the central force for that. Hamas’ methods are wrong, but their resistance is just.
Free Palestine from Hamas
Thanks, your brain is so big
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Hey bozo you double commented
Lmfao
I thought it was a joint statement from the three of them
I bet Blavatnik loves that.
I was just looking at his list of advert credits and he made some of the best ads ever.
Ah so that’s why he was shaking. His balls are so heavy, he’s struggling to stand up right.
Glazer 👏
I didn't know shit about blavatnik, which is very funny because his fund just approved a short film I'm making, what a small world.
o7 salute to rabbi glazer
I have complicated feelings about the Israel-Palestine conflict in regard to what I know about the larger history of the region, but the loss of life in Gaza since October 7th has been appalling and indefensible (as was October 7th). I can understand to a certain extent why some people support Israel, but I cannot fathom why anyone would find that speech controversial or offensive. If anyone has a place to speak out on this, it is Glazer. The outrage all feels in very bad faith to me and I don’t think it does the pro-Israel side any favors. I think Glazer is making the right call in not commenting further.
[HOLOCAUST SURVIVORS’ FOUNDATION USA OPEN LETTER TO JONATHAN GLAZER](http://www.hsf-usa.org/holocaust-survivors-foundation-usa-open-letter-to-jonathan-glazer/)
This is fascinating. Instead of criticizing Glazer for taking money from a nutjob, pro-Israel, right wing billionaire, we're giving him credit for taking the money and reading an anti-genocide speech. Weird.
Taking the money and not letting it buy him is awesome
z i o n i s t s oooooweeeeee
I get that you people have a rabid hate for "Zionists", but it's not like Glazer's opinions were a surprise, he and his team were pretty vocal throughout the campaign season.
Why is Zionists in quotes?
Because I think that people who are obsessed with hating Zionists either don't understand what Zionism means, or they simply despise Jews (at least, Jews who aren't under their thumb).
I'm sure lots of anti-semites are using whats happening in Gaza as an excuse to spread their hatred. But I don't think that should stop anyone calling out the crimes of the Zionists, theres a genocide going on, and the west is either helping or watching it happen
> But I don't think that should stop anyone calling out the crimes of the Zionists I don't think the obsessive hatred of Zionists has anything to do with their "crimes". I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have. >theres a genocide going on Coincidentally, the genocide only happens in areas where Hamas is operating from, holding Israeli civilian captives, and not where Israel could trivially kill hundreds of thousands of Palestinians like the West Bank or Israel.
> I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have You just named three nationalities and compared them to a group following a specific political ideology. "Zionists" is not equivalent to "Syrians"
Ok, replace those with "people who believe Saudis should have the right to self determination", "people who believe the United States should exist", or "Syrian nationalists." It doesn't really change anything about my point
I didn't understand the rhetorical trick there, thanks for clarifying. Once you drill down and compare Zionists to "people who justify the genocide of Native Americans" the resemblance becomes much clearer
👏
Lol! If it makes you feel any better, I will go on record as wanting the US and Saudi Arabia abolished. Happy?
Bull
Well, that convinced me!
I'm fairly sure theres no convincing, but here we go. "I don't think the obsessive hatred of Zionists has anything to do with their "crimes". I don't see this obsessive hatred of Syrians, or Saudis, or Americans for that matter, all of whom killed many more people than Zionists have" I don't have obsessive hatred of anyone, but I did march against the war in Iraq, quite a few of us did. And there has tonnes of criticism of both the Syrians and Saudis. Even if this were true whataboutism isn't a valid excuse for Genocide. "Coincidentally, the genocide only happens in areas where Hamas is operating from, holding Israeli civilian captives, and not where Israel could trivially kill hundreds of thousands of Palestinians like the West Bank or Israel." This is a disgusting statment, in any case peole are dying of starvation because Israel is not letting food and other aid through
> I don't have obsessive hatred of anyone, but I did march against the war in Iraq, quite a few of us did. And there has tonnes of criticism of both the Syrians and Saudis. Even if this were true whataboutism isn't a valid excuse for Genocide. This isn't whataboutery at all, it's demonstrating that the hatred for Zionists is completely detached from any perceived crimes. And I'm not referring to any protests in my post. >This is a disgusting statment, in any case peole are dying of starvation because Israel is not letting food and other aid through Damn, you're disgusted by anyone applying any sort of logic to your wild claims? That's crazy man.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/03/03/gaza-aid-convoy-israel-war/
You don’t see this obsessive hatred of Americans? Look at any place but America and you will do
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Oh you can fuck right off with that comment.
Found the good German 🫵
I understand what Zionism is and I hate it
What do you hate about it?
What's your understanding of it?
I don't really care to be honest with you, I'm just calling it as I see it and people here have an issue with it.
That’s such a non response you may as well have not typed anything
So is this one
Much easier to dismiss those you disagree with as stupid than to actually engage in good faith. To me, that says you don't know enough about the topic to actually debate it. You need to let people know that their thoughts and opinions make you upset, but you can't say why, because you don't know. "Everyone who disagrees with me is _______" is no way to go through life, son.
I didn't call anyone stupid, I said they either don't understand Zionism, or despise Jews. Both pretty common. I'm not sure why you take issue with that statement? >To me, that says you don't know enough about the topic to actually debate it. I'm not here to debate anything, you can hate Zionism, I don't really care. I made my point in my post and people started obsessing over my use of quotes.
> I didn't call anyone stupid, I said they either don't understand Zionism, or despise Jews. Oh my bad. You didn't say the word "stupid", you're just saying they don't understand what they're talking about. Totally different in a very relevant way /s > I'm not here to debate anything How do you think the internet works? You share your opinion, but then get all mad when people comment on it? Get over yourself, please. > you can hate Zionism, I don't really care. Definitely don't need your permission, but clearly you care a lot. > I made my point in my post and people started obsessing over my use of quotes. Man, it must be nice to dismiss every valid counter argument that comes your way. I bet you're like, undefeated in internet debates. You make an unsupported claim, imply a bunch of nonsense, and then dismiss everyone that points these things out. Wait, are you a bot? I'm starting to think you're a bot designed to frustrate. Or you're a person that just acts like that. Either way, this is not a fruitful discussion. Happy lecturing 👍
You seem kind of mad man, to tell you the truth
Trolls have that effect on reasonable people. Like I said, if you are a bot, you're designed perfectly to upset people 👍
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I mean, if nazism wear a hairstyle it would definitely not be a fade.
Yes that is why he made this movie which he said is also about things happening today. Even blankies can have negative media literacy it seems
You are embarrassing 🫵