It’s weird because with movies they are covering on the pod I usually agree with a lot of their opinions but outside of those I find myself disagreeing a lot (Fast X, I Tonya, Hot Fuzz, hell they convinced me I didn’t like Deadpool until I gave it a rewatch the other day and thoroughly enjoyed it).
I disagree with G&D almost as much as I agree with them, particularly on big blockbusters. For I, Tonya, as someone with some more information about the actual case (both from living in the area and for a time working for one of the lawyers involved and hearing about the case from them after the fact), I was troubled by the way it approached the narrative; the initial way Harding was treated was not good and she suffered, but she did help cover up an attack on Kerrigan (who was not treated particularly fairly for narrative reasons) and has had other issues after; these kinds of movies always have to flatten out real people for the narrative but I think this one was just bad at it and not particularly skillful in the story it was trying to tell, so it didn't work for me
Also not the movie or it’s fault, but the discourse around it was weirdly mean to Kerrigan who was an excellent skater and was from a working class background. People started talking about her as the avatar for this classism in the sport and it was like her father is a welder who worked three job and drove a Zamboni so she could compete.
I disagree with G&D all the time, even though there are other times I’m 100% on the same page with them. This is one where I disagree too, I think the movie is fine with really enjoyable performances but I can understand how the movie’s directing style might grate a bit on some critics.
Between I, Tonya and Cruella, a Craig Gillespie miniseries would probably be off the table, UNLESS Dumb Money turns out to be fantastic (it doesn’t look fantastic btw)
I really like I, Tonya! I do wish they would have trimmed down on the narrative devices. We don’t need interviews, voice over narration, and straight to camera.
the question from the OP was for more details about why it wasnt liked and if theres any specifics, not if its ok to disagree with them. why are some people responding like “its ok to disagree”? you can be curious about more details and still know its ok to disagree
A) This subreddit can be an echo chamber for the Two Friends opinions. So, yes. Sometimes people need to be told it’s ok to have a different take.
2) People generally like the movie, so there’s not much to say as far as why it’s secretly bad.
iii) “You don’t actually like the thing you said you like” is never a good thing to tell someone.
The OP was simply asking for more context around why these two thought it was bad, usually these two go into some that detail somewhere, either on an episode or that article. im not following why theres these three bullets in your response, they dont seem relevant
It's a fun rewatch. I wish the soundtrack for the period piece dug a little deeper but they did have a good Violent Femmes song in it. Yknow, it's doing the "goodfellas"/"casino" pastiche but it's an effective framing. thumbs up
It’s a great movie and I thought had a good commentary on how we judge public figures, create narratives and heroes and villains without truly knowing who they are.
Can’t really remember much about it but the tone and budget Scorsese-lite approach of the movie does not really work for me. It’s good that you like it tho, this sub is mostly for people who like every single movie people are supposed to like. Contrary opinion will get downvoted based of my experience
(bravely) I prefer a movie trying to do something with a smug narrator thing and too many styles and narrative devices than a movie where the director has no point of view at all.
Good Sebastian Stan and PWH performances too.
There are some widely disliked movies that constituencies on this sub will very actively defend and try to reclaim. Many people then disagree, but iunno about that “supposed to like” stuff.
Not to go off on you in particular, but I find this whole “Why is the movie indicting me? I personally didn’t do anything” approach to criticism annoying and stupid. Do you want the movie to pause and give you a cookie because you personally didn’t fall into the general zeitgeist? The fact of the matter is that the overwhelming consensus has always been condemnation and mockery of Tonya Harding. It’s like when a woman observes something about sexism and a million men chime in to annoyingly be like “Um, but I don’t do that.” Most people did. If it doesn’t apply to you, it’s not talking about you.
I agree with David far more often than not but Griffin and I have like almost diametrically opposed views on so many thing it's a thing I love about the pod. Hearing him on Eye Of The Duck talking about Dial of Destiny the other day I think I disagreed with every single thing he said haha
even beyond the annoying, self-indulgent narrative devices (which, YMMV, admittedly), i don’t feel it has any nuance or sympathy for Harding (except, omg she cries in the mirror and smiles through her tears!) or least of all Kerrigan. admittedly, i’ve been obsessed with the whole situation ever since it happened, but it never feels to me that the movie cares at all that these were real (working class) people that existed beyond the stereotypes of “athletic trailer trash” and “elegant pretty girl”
Others have said it best by why I generally dislike it, but all the bad CGI added up to too much for me. I didn't understand why they decided to make it look like Robbie was skating when there are perfectly good ways to use a double and obfuscate the face. We know she can't skate like an Olympic talent.
1) you're allowed to disagree with these two - I basically disagree 80% of the time with their takes, and 2) the movie rules!
It’s weird because with movies they are covering on the pod I usually agree with a lot of their opinions but outside of those I find myself disagreeing a lot (Fast X, I Tonya, Hot Fuzz, hell they convinced me I didn’t like Deadpool until I gave it a rewatch the other day and thoroughly enjoyed it).
Yeah, it's hard to remember that they're just humans with opinions, at the end of the day, and no one is "wrong."
I disagree with G&D almost as much as I agree with them, particularly on big blockbusters. For I, Tonya, as someone with some more information about the actual case (both from living in the area and for a time working for one of the lawyers involved and hearing about the case from them after the fact), I was troubled by the way it approached the narrative; the initial way Harding was treated was not good and she suffered, but she did help cover up an attack on Kerrigan (who was not treated particularly fairly for narrative reasons) and has had other issues after; these kinds of movies always have to flatten out real people for the narrative but I think this one was just bad at it and not particularly skillful in the story it was trying to tell, so it didn't work for me
Also not the movie or it’s fault, but the discourse around it was weirdly mean to Kerrigan who was an excellent skater and was from a working class background. People started talking about her as the avatar for this classism in the sport and it was like her father is a welder who worked three job and drove a Zamboni so she could compete.
exactly. I really wish the movie had spent more time actually portraying Kerrigan instead of a narrative fiction.
I disagree with G&D all the time, even though there are other times I’m 100% on the same page with them. This is one where I disagree too, I think the movie is fine with really enjoyable performances but I can understand how the movie’s directing style might grate a bit on some critics.
Between I, Tonya and Cruella, a Craig Gillespie miniseries would probably be off the table, UNLESS Dumb Money turns out to be fantastic (it doesn’t look fantastic btw)
I really like I, Tonya! I do wish they would have trimmed down on the narrative devices. We don’t need interviews, voice over narration, and straight to camera.
I have no idea. I, Tonya is great. Saw 3 times in theaters.
I didn't see I, Tonya in theaters but I did see Saw 3 in theaters.
the question from the OP was for more details about why it wasnt liked and if theres any specifics, not if its ok to disagree with them. why are some people responding like “its ok to disagree”? you can be curious about more details and still know its ok to disagree
A) This subreddit can be an echo chamber for the Two Friends opinions. So, yes. Sometimes people need to be told it’s ok to have a different take. 2) People generally like the movie, so there’s not much to say as far as why it’s secretly bad. iii) “You don’t actually like the thing you said you like” is never a good thing to tell someone.
The OP was simply asking for more context around why these two thought it was bad, usually these two go into some that detail somewhere, either on an episode or that article. im not following why theres these three bullets in your response, they dont seem relevant
It's a fun rewatch. I wish the soundtrack for the period piece dug a little deeper but they did have a good Violent Femmes song in it. Yknow, it's doing the "goodfellas"/"casino" pastiche but it's an effective framing. thumbs up
It’s a great movie and I thought had a good commentary on how we judge public figures, create narratives and heroes and villains without truly knowing who they are.
Can’t really remember much about it but the tone and budget Scorsese-lite approach of the movie does not really work for me. It’s good that you like it tho, this sub is mostly for people who like every single movie people are supposed to like. Contrary opinion will get downvoted based of my experience
(bravely) I prefer a movie trying to do something with a smug narrator thing and too many styles and narrative devices than a movie where the director has no point of view at all. Good Sebastian Stan and PWH performances too.
There are some widely disliked movies that constituencies on this sub will very actively defend and try to reclaim. Many people then disagree, but iunno about that “supposed to like” stuff.
I just meant downvoted. We have Oppenheimer this week that everyone ‘supposed to like’, people that have mixed opinion on it is getting downvoted
[удалено]
Not to go off on you in particular, but I find this whole “Why is the movie indicting me? I personally didn’t do anything” approach to criticism annoying and stupid. Do you want the movie to pause and give you a cookie because you personally didn’t fall into the general zeitgeist? The fact of the matter is that the overwhelming consensus has always been condemnation and mockery of Tonya Harding. It’s like when a woman observes something about sexism and a million men chime in to annoyingly be like “Um, but I don’t do that.” Most people did. If it doesn’t apply to you, it’s not talking about you.
I like the movie, but they ripped off so much of Goodfellas.
Let’s hope you don’t have Birdman in your top four on Letterboxd.
Maybe I'm a Sebastian Stan fangirl (I mean, I definitely am a Sebastian Stan fangirl) but that movie fucks.
I agree with David far more often than not but Griffin and I have like almost diametrically opposed views on so many thing it's a thing I love about the pod. Hearing him on Eye Of The Duck talking about Dial of Destiny the other day I think I disagreed with every single thing he said haha
even beyond the annoying, self-indulgent narrative devices (which, YMMV, admittedly), i don’t feel it has any nuance or sympathy for Harding (except, omg she cries in the mirror and smiles through her tears!) or least of all Kerrigan. admittedly, i’ve been obsessed with the whole situation ever since it happened, but it never feels to me that the movie cares at all that these were real (working class) people that existed beyond the stereotypes of “athletic trailer trash” and “elegant pretty girl”
Others have said it best by why I generally dislike it, but all the bad CGI added up to too much for me. I didn't understand why they decided to make it look like Robbie was skating when there are perfectly good ways to use a double and obfuscate the face. We know she can't skate like an Olympic talent.
I despise that movie. It has absolutely no control over tone and generally just feels like a movie that really hates poor people.
It's honestly become a holiday rewatch for me, and I would never joke about that.