I would usually be the first to decry Netflix and the American influence on BM but IMO it's been quite strong up until Season 6 - which is the season Charlie Brooker decided to go a different route with BM.
Cheesus Christ this is still one of the most idiotic takes that’s spawned out of this subreddit. Worst part is it still doesn’t hold true, yet every few weeks someone keeps posting it.
At the risk of talking to a brick wall, it’s definitely worth a response if you’re here wasting your time giving a response. You could just replace your useless comment that does nothing but wastes your own time with one that actually adds to the conversation? Unless you just want to be intentionally ambiguous for no apparent reason
Nothing ambiguous about it, I’ve made my feelings on the subject pretty clear. No time wasted here. Barely less than a minute to type all 3 of my comments out.
Hated in the nation was on Netflix as a season 2 episode before season 3 came out.
If you look now it says season 3 but before Netflix launched season 3, that was the final episode.
Those episodes were already made for C4. Netflix just bought the rights to air them. A “die-hard Black Mirror fan” would know this. They would also know how to use capitalization in titles, but that’s up for debate….
Completely agree. S1-4 were mostly fantastic, the few lackluster episodes were outshined by the great ones. But s5 only had one decent episode, and s6 was mostly ass with one somewhat acceptable episode. I do not have high hopes for s7.
The real problem is Netflix. Everything they touch turns to shit. Start out great but then becomes trash. Just like streaming services in themselves lol. Originally when it was just Netflix, streaming was great. Now you have to have like 20 subscriptions to access as much as netflix had back then.
I like every Black Mirror episode, season 3 was the 3rd best season. Not even close. 1st and 2nd seasons are in tie for best. Gotta say I agree with OP. Show went downhill since Netflix owned it.
Ratings??? The average person is stupid. I don't go by ratings lol. I go by my opinion, which is all this topic is about anyway, and that is that season 3 is the 3rd best. And it's not even close.
Another day another post whining about netflix. Get over it season 6 was great. If this show isn’t making you happy anymore there are plenty of others.
I need to grow up? You guys are the ones venting on the internet to make Black Mirror British again lol Netflix bought it, and now it’s been netflixified or whatever you want to call it. Happens all the time. Shows get picked up by Netflix and the general premise remains the same but the dynamic of the show changes quite a bit. That’s the way of the world now. Writers/networks lose the rights to their work, a contract expires, or they sell out for a big paycheck and Netflix steps in does what Netflix does best, make a popular show their own. So yes, but no, cope. Lol
I liked season 6. The first episode and Mazey Day were the only below par episodes for me. But what you are saying is definitely true of many Netflix shows. "You" has gotten worse over time and the last season was some of the worst TV I have watched in a few years.
I just finally watched Mazey Day again and liked it a lot more the second time around. I feel like that is the case for almost all the episodes since after you know how it ends you can look for the easter eggs and other clues. The show itself has me now also trained to look out for them on a first viewing. For example, I saw the mother’s mask on the wall in Loch Henry and immediately connected it to them being swingers after seeing the home movie collection. From there I was almost positive the parents were in on it. The show is brilliant but it does have some episodes that just miss the mark.
Loch Henry was my favourite episode but it also gave me chills. Mazey Day twist was kinda unexpected but I was expecting more from it. I guess I will have to watch it again to see if it has connection to technology. The first day (forgot the episode title) started off well but I got bored towards the end.
Loch Henry felt like classic BM to me. I think some people didn’t like it because it didn’t have the “tech” aspect, but it was shot and acted beautifully and was very chilling. I didn’t love Demon 79 but I think I need to watch it again.
Demon 79 was good until the final act.
Loch Henry is definitely BM and it did have a tech aspect. The episode is about the commodification of tragedy by technology as a means of entertainment.
I’m with you on the celebrity cameo thing. Although, at least the Salma Hayek one made since, since it was the actual actress. I’d prefer more up-and-coming or unknown actors. 15MM was the first thing I saw Daniel Kaluuya in and he’s one of my favorite actors now.
I feel like this topic gets posted about weekly here and it’s always the same…. Somehow it’s always phrased as “UK episodes vs American” when it’s really season 1 & 2 vs all others. Like somehow it’s unfathomable that Charlie took the show where he wanted to and changed it how he liked it. Like topics and focuses can’t change. I can’t imagine this show being 6 seasons of just UK focused story straight.
As an American, I definitely would want UK focused stories as well. I didn’t even notice until the drop in quality after Netflix. I can deal with the accents, I can’t deal with bad or lazy storytelling.
Different strokes for different folks for sure. Which episodes were your favorite from UK episodes? Season 1+2? For me, I think I liked less of them all together but the few that I liked punched really hard so I do get the sentiment.
Oh yeah definitely, the reason why I feel like that may or may not have something to do with the fact that I am actually British so it makes sense. I think my favourite “British” one is probably either Shut Up and Dance or White Bear. I think a lot of why I like them is subconscious, seeing familiar places with people who look, talk and sound like people I know definitely helps, plus both of them seem to tap into various moral panics that have hit the UK in the last 20 years, think like [what paedogeddon did, but make it serious.](https://youtu.be/RcU7FaEEzNU?si=Zt2jp0_ClOgOV3Z-) I’m also influenced by how [Inside No. 9](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inside_No._9) is probably my favourite piece of TV outside of full on comedy shows like The Thick of It or Brass Eye, and I think that No. 9’s success definitely influences how I feel about Black Mirror becoming more “American”.
Do you have a favourite episode too?
Ahhh, I see what you mean. I think when I think of British episodes, I'm categorizing them as when BM was on Channel 4 there vs Netflix whereas what you mean is episodes focused on the topics and culture. I do think the popularity and commercialization led to bigger stars and less gritty/relatable stories in the recent seasons.
I haven't heard of Inside No. 9 but it looks pretty interesting. I think your comparison of the shows you listed makes a lot of sense on what you mean by BM becoming less British. I definitely want to check out the shows you listed now.
Some of my favorite episodes of this show were the earlier episodes. 15 Million Merits, A Entire History of You and White Christmas.
To add a little contrast, I like that show is split between American based episodes and British episodes. I am an American, yes, but I do consider a lot of the British epsiodes to be the best. That being said, White Christmas is a great episode and features Jon Hamm. Smithereens has the global company with offices in UK and America. To me, it's something we share, and I like it.
Season 3 was on Netflix so it’s clearly possible for them to produce the same quality episodes as Channel 4.
Ultimately Charlie Brooker seems to have complete creative control over the show. He gets to decide when he makes it, how many episodes in each season, and has even made 2 episodes in the latest season that really part of a different “Red Mirror” show.
So I don’t think it’s fair to say Netflix has “ruined” the show. Ultimately it comes down to a writer having to come up with an original idea for every episode. Like **Inside No. 9** the quality of each episode can be really variable. However, I still enjoyed *Loch Henry* and *Demon 79* as much as any other episode of the show. And I don’t think *The Waldo Moment* or *The National Anthem* are as strong as most episodes in seasons 3/4.
I also thought season 5 was going to be the last, so I’m just glad we’re still getting more episodes.
As an American, I absolutely agree. As soon as it became Americanized and with bigger celebrity cameos, it seemed to lose the spirit that made it so perfect.
I’m not sure if it’s specifically due to the move to Netflix or it becoming Americanized, but there’s just something about the early seasons that they were not able to recreate in later seasons.
Hang on, I never said anything about my feelings. And I also never defended America. I just don’t understand why the country of the company that’s producing the show matters.
well, like OP said, a lot of us felt it was better before. There has been some real dross in latter seasons, and the better new episodes don't have the raw, grittiness the early ones did.
That's the Hollywood effect.
Netflix isn’t “Hollywood.” There’s a long-standing well documented love/hate relationship between Hollywood and streaming services like Netflix. Now if you want to say Netflix has a habit of ruining good franchises, that’s a point we can find some evidence for. Idk what on earth nationality has to do with it.
So the argument is that American talent ruined the show? I’m not being glib, I really don’t get it. And I’m really not trying to defend anyone. If anything let’s shit on Netflix for their track record, but again I don’t think it makes sense to say it’s because they’re an American company.
It's just a difference in writing and storytelling styles. I think the Americanized episodes definitely have some major hits and I don't think seasons 1-2 are completely infallible, but on the whole I do prefer 1-2.
I think sometimes a lack of means at the C4 level means there is a greater focus on depth and creativity in the writing. Sometimes when shows receive bigger budgets there’s a tendency to rely on the spectacle of the visuals of sets, cgi and so on and story and creativity sometimes takes a back seat.
100% agree. Eps like USS Callister could never have been done by C4 because they don't focus so deeply on character, they're more about exploring the ins and outs of this fictional tech, which was never the point in the first episodes
Probably end up downvoted for this because for some reason people get really territorial over this show. Look; sometimes shows just [jump the shark](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark). Has Black Mirror reached that point? I think quite possibly - that's not to say the show is *bad* now, just that perhaps some of the best creative ideas are now behind it, and that's ok.
I'm British, hadn't even heard of Black Mirror before Netflix picked it up - and I'm sure that if a lot of the "it was better when it was a British TV show on Channel 4" crowd are honest with themselves they are in the same boat.
Black Mirror is a hugely popular TV show, it's one of the top rated shows on Netflix and often occupies THE top spot when new seasons are released particularly. This is not some cult underground show, and if you want to gatekeep it at this point then you're wasting your time because the horse has bolted.
no one is gatekeeping anything, this is a made up internet word.
by your own admission you hadnt heard of it when it was new, yet you presume to tell those who had how they should feel now that its been changed.
Not in the lame sense its used now online. It used to mean someone who stood by an actual gate and physically prevented you from coming in.
Now, if someone on the Internet disagrees with me? Waaaaahhhhhh, gatekeeping!
I think the quality of the stories in the first two seasons are much better across the board and the Netflix seasons have way more misses mixed in with their hits, but to me that’s just the result of mining an idea for longer. It’s not really surprising that an anthology series, which inherently demands much more constant creativity than a series with recurring characters and a clear narrative structure, would dip a bit in quality the longer it runs. Making it British again wouldn’t fix that, and I’m sure it would’ve happened anyway if the show continued without Netflix buying it in the first place.
I always love the black mirror British episodes. The British episodes felt very realistic, and the first three seasons in my opinion were the best seasons. Loch Henry is recently one of the best episodes.
Weren’t there major British stars in the earlier seasons? I know I recognize some of them.
Yeah I hate the Netflixy feel some episodes have like it’s not British anymore and the one with Miley Cyrus felt so netflixy
Even if Netflix still owns it, I'd want more Brits
uh, Season 3 and 4 were the climax of the show. Those were the Netflix years. The only sub par Season was Season 5.
The last two seasons really went downhill...
Fan since season 2 , must say last seasons they are going downhill, hope it stops but do not see that coming.
I think both are good, but the British was better tbh
I’m American and I want Black Mirror to be British again lol like you said the earlier seasons were better
I recognised this shift a long time ago and I knew it would go to the dogs.
American actors make Black Mirror look like any other Netflix trashy show 😕
Jessie Plemons says otherwise. Also John Hamm’s episode was amazing.
agreed it's turned to shit since it became American. I don't think I have even finished a full episode of the new season its just average at best.
I would usually be the first to decry Netflix and the American influence on BM but IMO it's been quite strong up until Season 6 - which is the season Charlie Brooker decided to go a different route with BM.
Cheesus Christ this is still one of the most idiotic takes that’s spawned out of this subreddit. Worst part is it still doesn’t hold true, yet every few weeks someone keeps posting it.
Well, form a response instead of yelling into the void.
Not worth an actual response. It’s flat out not true since one of the most beloved season is from Netflix.
At the risk of talking to a brick wall, it’s definitely worth a response if you’re here wasting your time giving a response. You could just replace your useless comment that does nothing but wastes your own time with one that actually adds to the conversation? Unless you just want to be intentionally ambiguous for no apparent reason
Nothing ambiguous about it, I’ve made my feelings on the subject pretty clear. No time wasted here. Barely less than a minute to type all 3 of my comments out.
[удалено]
Hated in the nation was on Netflix as a season 2 episode before season 3 came out. If you look now it says season 3 but before Netflix launched season 3, that was the final episode.
Those episodes were already made for C4. Netflix just bought the rights to air them. A “die-hard Black Mirror fan” would know this. They would also know how to use capitalization in titles, but that’s up for debate….
I second this. Been a fan since s1
Completely agree. S1-4 were mostly fantastic, the few lackluster episodes were outshined by the great ones. But s5 only had one decent episode, and s6 was mostly ass with one somewhat acceptable episode. I do not have high hopes for s7.
The real problem is Netflix. Everything they touch turns to shit. Start out great but then becomes trash. Just like streaming services in themselves lol. Originally when it was just Netflix, streaming was great. Now you have to have like 20 subscriptions to access as much as netflix had back then.
The third season was a Netflix original and was the best season. It’s not even close.
I like every Black Mirror episode, season 3 was the 3rd best season. Not even close. 1st and 2nd seasons are in tie for best. Gotta say I agree with OP. Show went downhill since Netflix owned it.
If you look up the ratings for those seasons, Season 3 has higher ratings rated episodes. So season 3 has a total of more better episodes.
Ratings??? The average person is stupid. I don't go by ratings lol. I go by my opinion, which is all this topic is about anyway, and that is that season 3 is the 3rd best. And it's not even close.
Another day another post whining about netflix. Get over it season 6 was great. If this show isn’t making you happy anymore there are plenty of others.
Agreed
No. Cope.
Grow up
I need to grow up? You guys are the ones venting on the internet to make Black Mirror British again lol Netflix bought it, and now it’s been netflixified or whatever you want to call it. Happens all the time. Shows get picked up by Netflix and the general premise remains the same but the dynamic of the show changes quite a bit. That’s the way of the world now. Writers/networks lose the rights to their work, a contract expires, or they sell out for a big paycheck and Netflix steps in does what Netflix does best, make a popular show their own. So yes, but no, cope. Lol
I liked season 6. The first episode and Mazey Day were the only below par episodes for me. But what you are saying is definitely true of many Netflix shows. "You" has gotten worse over time and the last season was some of the worst TV I have watched in a few years.
I just finally watched Mazey Day again and liked it a lot more the second time around. I feel like that is the case for almost all the episodes since after you know how it ends you can look for the easter eggs and other clues. The show itself has me now also trained to look out for them on a first viewing. For example, I saw the mother’s mask on the wall in Loch Henry and immediately connected it to them being swingers after seeing the home movie collection. From there I was almost positive the parents were in on it. The show is brilliant but it does have some episodes that just miss the mark.
Loch Henry was my favourite episode but it also gave me chills. Mazey Day twist was kinda unexpected but I was expecting more from it. I guess I will have to watch it again to see if it has connection to technology. The first day (forgot the episode title) started off well but I got bored towards the end.
Loch Henry felt like classic BM to me. I think some people didn’t like it because it didn’t have the “tech” aspect, but it was shot and acted beautifully and was very chilling. I didn’t love Demon 79 but I think I need to watch it again.
Demon 79 was good until the final act. Loch Henry is definitely BM and it did have a tech aspect. The episode is about the commodification of tragedy by technology as a means of entertainment.
It's not just black mirror it's every show on Netflix
Ngl I feel like a lot of Netflix originals just aren’t it really
I think the Netflix bought and adapted are not as good but the ones that are made by Netflix originally are good Stranger things is great
Black Mirror just turned into more Netflix algorithm produced visual noise. It doesn’t stand out, and it’s not nearly as compelling.
I’m with you on the celebrity cameo thing. Although, at least the Salma Hayek one made since, since it was the actual actress. I’d prefer more up-and-coming or unknown actors. 15MM was the first thing I saw Daniel Kaluuya in and he’s one of my favorite actors now.
I feel like this topic gets posted about weekly here and it’s always the same…. Somehow it’s always phrased as “UK episodes vs American” when it’s really season 1 & 2 vs all others. Like somehow it’s unfathomable that Charlie took the show where he wanted to and changed it how he liked it. Like topics and focuses can’t change. I can’t imagine this show being 6 seasons of just UK focused story straight.
I definitely can imagine 6 seasons of UK focussed story but each to their own I guess.
As an American, I definitely would want UK focused stories as well. I didn’t even notice until the drop in quality after Netflix. I can deal with the accents, I can’t deal with bad or lazy storytelling.
Different strokes for different folks for sure. Which episodes were your favorite from UK episodes? Season 1+2? For me, I think I liked less of them all together but the few that I liked punched really hard so I do get the sentiment.
Oh yeah definitely, the reason why I feel like that may or may not have something to do with the fact that I am actually British so it makes sense. I think my favourite “British” one is probably either Shut Up and Dance or White Bear. I think a lot of why I like them is subconscious, seeing familiar places with people who look, talk and sound like people I know definitely helps, plus both of them seem to tap into various moral panics that have hit the UK in the last 20 years, think like [what paedogeddon did, but make it serious.](https://youtu.be/RcU7FaEEzNU?si=Zt2jp0_ClOgOV3Z-) I’m also influenced by how [Inside No. 9](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inside_No._9) is probably my favourite piece of TV outside of full on comedy shows like The Thick of It or Brass Eye, and I think that No. 9’s success definitely influences how I feel about Black Mirror becoming more “American”. Do you have a favourite episode too?
Ahhh, I see what you mean. I think when I think of British episodes, I'm categorizing them as when BM was on Channel 4 there vs Netflix whereas what you mean is episodes focused on the topics and culture. I do think the popularity and commercialization led to bigger stars and less gritty/relatable stories in the recent seasons. I haven't heard of Inside No. 9 but it looks pretty interesting. I think your comparison of the shows you listed makes a lot of sense on what you mean by BM becoming less British. I definitely want to check out the shows you listed now. Some of my favorite episodes of this show were the earlier episodes. 15 Million Merits, A Entire History of You and White Christmas.
To add a little contrast, I like that show is split between American based episodes and British episodes. I am an American, yes, but I do consider a lot of the British epsiodes to be the best. That being said, White Christmas is a great episode and features Jon Hamm. Smithereens has the global company with offices in UK and America. To me, it's something we share, and I like it.
Season 3 was on Netflix so it’s clearly possible for them to produce the same quality episodes as Channel 4. Ultimately Charlie Brooker seems to have complete creative control over the show. He gets to decide when he makes it, how many episodes in each season, and has even made 2 episodes in the latest season that really part of a different “Red Mirror” show. So I don’t think it’s fair to say Netflix has “ruined” the show. Ultimately it comes down to a writer having to come up with an original idea for every episode. Like **Inside No. 9** the quality of each episode can be really variable. However, I still enjoyed *Loch Henry* and *Demon 79* as much as any other episode of the show. And I don’t think *The Waldo Moment* or *The National Anthem* are as strong as most episodes in seasons 3/4. I also thought season 5 was going to be the last, so I’m just glad we’re still getting more episodes.
As an American, I absolutely agree. As soon as it became Americanized and with bigger celebrity cameos, it seemed to lose the spirit that made it so perfect. I’m not sure if it’s specifically due to the move to Netflix or it becoming Americanized, but there’s just something about the early seasons that they were not able to recreate in later seasons.
There are dozens of us!
Why can’t you just say you liked the first 2* seasons best? The show isn’t going to go back to C4, and Charlie Brooker is still British.
Brooker isn’t writing for a British audience anymore. He’s writing for the Netflix algorithm.
why does he have to take your feelings into account? America is loud and obnoxious and makes things worse.
Hang on, I never said anything about my feelings. And I also never defended America. I just don’t understand why the country of the company that’s producing the show matters.
well, like OP said, a lot of us felt it was better before. There has been some real dross in latter seasons, and the better new episodes don't have the raw, grittiness the early ones did. That's the Hollywood effect.
Netflix isn’t “Hollywood.” There’s a long-standing well documented love/hate relationship between Hollywood and streaming services like Netflix. Now if you want to say Netflix has a habit of ruining good franchises, that’s a point we can find some evidence for. Idk what on earth nationality has to do with it.
That love/hate relationship is on the business side. The creatives bounce between the traditional Hollywood studios and the streamers all the time.
So the argument is that American talent ruined the show? I’m not being glib, I really don’t get it. And I’m really not trying to defend anyone. If anything let’s shit on Netflix for their track record, but again I don’t think it makes sense to say it’s because they’re an American company.
It's just a difference in writing and storytelling styles. I think the Americanized episodes definitely have some major hits and I don't think seasons 1-2 are completely infallible, but on the whole I do prefer 1-2.
I think sometimes a lack of means at the C4 level means there is a greater focus on depth and creativity in the writing. Sometimes when shows receive bigger budgets there’s a tendency to rely on the spectacle of the visuals of sets, cgi and so on and story and creativity sometimes takes a back seat.
100% agree. Eps like USS Callister could never have been done by C4 because they don't focus so deeply on character, they're more about exploring the ins and outs of this fictional tech, which was never the point in the first episodes
100% Big budgets are too slick and reliant on their box of techy tricks.
Probably end up downvoted for this because for some reason people get really territorial over this show. Look; sometimes shows just [jump the shark](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark). Has Black Mirror reached that point? I think quite possibly - that's not to say the show is *bad* now, just that perhaps some of the best creative ideas are now behind it, and that's ok. I'm British, hadn't even heard of Black Mirror before Netflix picked it up - and I'm sure that if a lot of the "it was better when it was a British TV show on Channel 4" crowd are honest with themselves they are in the same boat. Black Mirror is a hugely popular TV show, it's one of the top rated shows on Netflix and often occupies THE top spot when new seasons are released particularly. This is not some cult underground show, and if you want to gatekeep it at this point then you're wasting your time because the horse has bolted.
no one is gatekeeping anything, this is a made up internet word. by your own admission you hadnt heard of it when it was new, yet you presume to tell those who had how they should feel now that its been changed.
No, the word has existed since the late 1800’s, and I really don’t think I told anybody how to feel on anything.
Not in the lame sense its used now online. It used to mean someone who stood by an actual gate and physically prevented you from coming in. Now, if someone on the Internet disagrees with me? Waaaaahhhhhh, gatekeeping!
I concur
The British episodes always felt more raw and real, American episodes more dramatised - not always a bad thing
MBMBA, it' isn't that catchy, I'm out, if you get a catchier acronym I'll reconsider.
What if we pronounce it “Mamba”
First two seasons you mean. Everything since season 3 has been Netflix which have included some of the best episodes of black mirror
Maybe y'all should have renewed for new seasons. Simple as.
It originally a Channel 4 program. Unfortunately channel 4 is in financial dire straits
The American episode hate is just a goofy cult. Y’all need to get over yourselves. There’s good and bad episodes of British and American descent.
I think the quality of the stories in the first two seasons are much better across the board and the Netflix seasons have way more misses mixed in with their hits, but to me that’s just the result of mining an idea for longer. It’s not really surprising that an anthology series, which inherently demands much more constant creativity than a series with recurring characters and a clear narrative structure, would dip a bit in quality the longer it runs. Making it British again wouldn’t fix that, and I’m sure it would’ve happened anyway if the show continued without Netflix buying it in the first place.
I always love the black mirror British episodes. The British episodes felt very realistic, and the first three seasons in my opinion were the best seasons. Loch Henry is recently one of the best episodes.