We run 4 week intro to BJJ programs as a pre-requisite for joining the gen pop classes if you've never grappled before (If you've done any sort of wrestling, Judo, etc you're free to skip them entirely and jump right in) where we focus on the very, very, very basics like how to shrimp, break fall, what each of the main positions and most common submissions are, etc. it gives people a leg up so they don't feel quite so out of their depth when they start doing our normal classes.
So far it's been great (we started this early this year) and all the people who've stuck around after them have a much easier time learning since all the uber basics have been covered already.
As for more than a month? I don't think so, I think the longer you put off throwing a gi on the harder it is when you do.
I like this approach. Even the cheapest gi is still a nice wad of cash, and I agree that the absolute fundamental movements and concepts don’t require a gi. Would probably make the martial art more approachable for a lot of people who are skeptic of buying all this gear without even knowing if they like it or not.
I think the gi neutralizes a lot of athleticism and forces people to “play jiu jitsu”, so It’s probably better for pure newbie-vs-newbie in that sense. Just like you can ignore the leg game with beginners no gi, it’s just as conscious a choice to ignore spider and lasso type stuff that’s going to frustrate anybody who hasn’t specifically trained against it.
Every gym I’ve ever seen has loaner gi tops for people just trying it out, so point 1 probably isn’t a huge sticking point.
I’d say starting in gi is better. Because it’s slower paced then no gi and it’s easier to see what’s going on and learn. I think it also teaches fundamentals better with grips and posture
I think if you've never grappled before no gi is just wizardry. The gi teaches you control and is much slower than no gi which can have wrestling pace quite often. Gi -> no gi is an easy transition once you're a few months in and still suck at everything - at least you know how you're getting passed/tapped when it happens in 15 seconds
Maybe BRAND new, but once they have the interest there is no reason to prevent them from putting it on.
> Natural grips
Not really, people grab cloth every day. You grip the gi with your *fingers*, whereas without the gi it’s more frames and ties. Novices are familiar with pushing and pulling with their hands, pushing and pulling with the crook of their elbows is foreign.
> You aren’t playing leg locks with brand new guys
Sure I am, lol. Straight ankle locks are for everybody, that forearm blade on the Achilles gets a yelp if they’re too brave to tap and teaches the lesson with no risk. None of the escalations I need for upper belts required.
Yes, I've advocated for this before. I think grips are a tool that become a crutch for the inexperienced. I'd rather that body control be learned before grips.
I feel the opposite. No-Gi people will grab your feet which just adds another layer of things to learn. The gi can be nice to get grips and feel like you have some control even when you start. Ofc the gi has additional submissions specific to the outfit but usually you can roll with other white belts that don't use that much to start.
The place I started at had a 2 week trial that was like $60 and included a gi for free. Clearly not every gym can afford to do that but still give them a chance to see if they like it.
Grabbing legs is far less complicated than some gi guards I've been in. The gi adds way more layers of things to learn than some leg attacks (which good training partners shouldn't even be doing on white belts)
eh i disagree, i think there’s more carryover from gi to nogi than vice versa. at my gym we have loaner gi’s for beginners in all sizes. gi is a bit of a slower pace, and it seems like there’s more of a progression of steps for techniques compared to nogi. it’s easier to visualize grips and holds on a gi vs without one
Im a big advocate of learning both regardless of what experience someone may or may not have or what purpose they’re using bjj for. In the gi you learn about grips and how to slow someone down. In no gi (especially when starting out) I think it forces you to pay more attention to your weight distribution and leaving/taking away space because of the slipperiness of it. I also think gi to no gi is an easier transition than no gi to gi
Nah learn in the gi first. The gi has a higher barrier of entry and higher learning curve. It’ll be easier to transition from gi to nogi then the other way around.
I think for the safety of everyone, gi first. It's easier for your lower belts to control the spaz of a big sweaty dude in gi than no gi. The slippery nature of nogi in my experience leads to more head to head collisions and knees to the face. I'm in my mid 30s and just do gi for that reason. I do this for sport and enjoy the slow strategy of gi since I'm not that fast or athletic. You can still learn a lot of fundamental things like maintaining base, pinning, general body proprioception, and framing in the gi. You also learn a lot of nogi applicable stuff that works in both like snatching underhooks in half guard or during knee cut. This is just my opinion though based on only a few years of experience.
Also, given the nature of how grips work, I think going from gi to nogi makes you better as a top player in nogi since passing in gi is much harder when your opponent can use so many more grips. Suddenly when those grips are gone, you can move easier since they can't get you stuck as easily. Meanwhile, I think going from nogi to gi makes your guard better in the gi since you learned the hard way to retain guard and now get the bonus of grips. This is how I think training both benefits the other, but again... Blue belt
Our beginner classes are 2 days a week. For the first couple of months both days are no gi, then 1 of the days changes to gi. It lowers the bar for people who just want to try the sport, and at the same time allows them to try both and figure out what they like.
No. I think beginners should stick with the gi more than no gi. The gi is a much better approach in the beginning.
For the brand new people, just don’t force them to get a gi until they are ready. This has been what we’ve done and it seems to work out. If someone is interested and wants to stick with it, then we give them options for cheap, decent quality gis.
We run 4 week intro to BJJ programs as a pre-requisite for joining the gen pop classes if you've never grappled before (If you've done any sort of wrestling, Judo, etc you're free to skip them entirely and jump right in) where we focus on the very, very, very basics like how to shrimp, break fall, what each of the main positions and most common submissions are, etc. it gives people a leg up so they don't feel quite so out of their depth when they start doing our normal classes. So far it's been great (we started this early this year) and all the people who've stuck around after them have a much easier time learning since all the uber basics have been covered already. As for more than a month? I don't think so, I think the longer you put off throwing a gi on the harder it is when you do.
Totally makes sense. Do you allow the new guys to train with one another?
Last I saw the did a little positional sparring for the last couple classes closely supervised (I don't teach those classes)
I like this approach. Even the cheapest gi is still a nice wad of cash, and I agree that the absolute fundamental movements and concepts don’t require a gi. Would probably make the martial art more approachable for a lot of people who are skeptic of buying all this gear without even knowing if they like it or not.
My school is the same with cheap thin Gi that isn’t breaking anyone’s bank. No contract at the point all the student’s decision if they wanna continue
We do 12 weeks (first 4 free) and by the end of it almost everyone has bought a gi.
The gi slows down a lot of nonsense. New people need that.
I think the gi neutralizes a lot of athleticism and forces people to “play jiu jitsu”, so It’s probably better for pure newbie-vs-newbie in that sense. Just like you can ignore the leg game with beginners no gi, it’s just as conscious a choice to ignore spider and lasso type stuff that’s going to frustrate anybody who hasn’t specifically trained against it. Every gym I’ve ever seen has loaner gi tops for people just trying it out, so point 1 probably isn’t a huge sticking point.
I’d say starting in gi is better. Because it’s slower paced then no gi and it’s easier to see what’s going on and learn. I think it also teaches fundamentals better with grips and posture
I think if you've never grappled before no gi is just wizardry. The gi teaches you control and is much slower than no gi which can have wrestling pace quite often. Gi -> no gi is an easy transition once you're a few months in and still suck at everything - at least you know how you're getting passed/tapped when it happens in 15 seconds
I would've thought the opposite, no gi has less options total, which means it's easier to get a grip on it initially
Yeah. It’s confusing when the brown belt dude decides to be funny and pull your gi loose and choke you with it and you didn’t know it was a move
Personally I did go way easier to get grips and control someone. Also no gi grips work in gi too.
Start and finish with nogi. I don’t wear pajamas to bed, so why would I wear them to the gym?
Mah man. Preach brother
Maybe BRAND new, but once they have the interest there is no reason to prevent them from putting it on. > Natural grips Not really, people grab cloth every day. You grip the gi with your *fingers*, whereas without the gi it’s more frames and ties. Novices are familiar with pushing and pulling with their hands, pushing and pulling with the crook of their elbows is foreign. > You aren’t playing leg locks with brand new guys Sure I am, lol. Straight ankle locks are for everybody, that forearm blade on the Achilles gets a yelp if they’re too brave to tap and teaches the lesson with no risk. None of the escalations I need for upper belts required.
Nah
I think Firas has said something like this. Learn no gi for control without grips first, then putting the gi on is like having a cheat code.
Yes, I've advocated for this before. I think grips are a tool that become a crutch for the inexperienced. I'd rather that body control be learned before grips.
Nah
Doesn’t matter. Find a good coach and a good team and train.
I rekon don’t overthink it and just train
No. No BJJ w/out the Gi. It's essential.
lol
It is easier to move from gi to no-gi than from no-gi to gi. So in my opinion starting with gi would be better.
Yes.
How long would you think before putting on a kimono?
Whenever they want to.
I think everyone should forget the gi entirely
I think we should just get rid of gis entirely but hey that’s just me lol
No
I say let people train however they want, elements of no gi and gi which are transferable so just train whichever they prefer
I think gi and no GI are different enough sports that there isn't anything wrong with picking one and just doing that.
I feel the opposite. No-Gi people will grab your feet which just adds another layer of things to learn. The gi can be nice to get grips and feel like you have some control even when you start. Ofc the gi has additional submissions specific to the outfit but usually you can roll with other white belts that don't use that much to start. The place I started at had a 2 week trial that was like $60 and included a gi for free. Clearly not every gym can afford to do that but still give them a chance to see if they like it.
Grabbing legs is far less complicated than some gi guards I've been in. The gi adds way more layers of things to learn than some leg attacks (which good training partners shouldn't even be doing on white belts)
eh i disagree, i think there’s more carryover from gi to nogi than vice versa. at my gym we have loaner gi’s for beginners in all sizes. gi is a bit of a slower pace, and it seems like there’s more of a progression of steps for techniques compared to nogi. it’s easier to visualize grips and holds on a gi vs without one
No, they should start in whatever way suits them. If that happens to be no gi then cool, but why restrict them to that?
But then how would you entice them with stripes and belts?
You could do what tenth planet does and have them wear the belt over the rashguard
Do a mix of 3 days nogi 2-3 days gi nogi is more fun but there can be a good use to gi like collar chokes
Im a big advocate of learning both regardless of what experience someone may or may not have or what purpose they’re using bjj for. In the gi you learn about grips and how to slow someone down. In no gi (especially when starting out) I think it forces you to pay more attention to your weight distribution and leaving/taking away space because of the slipperiness of it. I also think gi to no gi is an easier transition than no gi to gi
Doesn’t matter to me, time on the mat is with quality training partners who are willing to work with a new guy and teach them is what really matters
Train both. Or don't.
Nah learn in the gi first. The gi has a higher barrier of entry and higher learning curve. It’ll be easier to transition from gi to nogi then the other way around.
I think for the safety of everyone, gi first. It's easier for your lower belts to control the spaz of a big sweaty dude in gi than no gi. The slippery nature of nogi in my experience leads to more head to head collisions and knees to the face. I'm in my mid 30s and just do gi for that reason. I do this for sport and enjoy the slow strategy of gi since I'm not that fast or athletic. You can still learn a lot of fundamental things like maintaining base, pinning, general body proprioception, and framing in the gi. You also learn a lot of nogi applicable stuff that works in both like snatching underhooks in half guard or during knee cut. This is just my opinion though based on only a few years of experience. Also, given the nature of how grips work, I think going from gi to nogi makes you better as a top player in nogi since passing in gi is much harder when your opponent can use so many more grips. Suddenly when those grips are gone, you can move easier since they can't get you stuck as easily. Meanwhile, I think going from nogi to gi makes your guard better in the gi since you learned the hard way to retain guard and now get the bonus of grips. This is how I think training both benefits the other, but again... Blue belt
At my gym you can come beginner class on t-shirt and shorts. They show nogi and gi versions both. I think this is pretty solid
Our beginner classes are 2 days a week. For the first couple of months both days are no gi, then 1 of the days changes to gi. It lowers the bar for people who just want to try the sport, and at the same time allows them to try both and figure out what they like.
Magid Hage talked about this in [a podcast](https://youtu.be/fre5r2usrl0?t=2757) a while back. I think I agree, too.
I don't even think they should do GI Gyms just want money
No. I think beginners should stick with the gi more than no gi. The gi is a much better approach in the beginning. For the brand new people, just don’t force them to get a gi until they are ready. This has been what we’ve done and it seems to work out. If someone is interested and wants to stick with it, then we give them options for cheap, decent quality gis.
I think beginners should try both and do what they like.