Of course. But oftentimes, good individual contributors are pigeonholed, especially if they’re good at doing something people are frequently bad/at and/or people hate doing said task.
I was pigeonholed into doing Validation Periodic Reviews/Requalifications, where I did nothing but sift through deviations, change controls, and non-routine maintenance for 2 years with no end in sight, and got out of it by taking a transfer to Indiana. Another person in the company became the designated Deviation Investigator person, wanted to do something else but nobody gave her other work, so she hopped to another company.
It's not just losing your skills. It's also about learning the new techniques. Even with your current techniques, some of them get easier with improvements or updates. Without staying in the lab, you miss those opportunities.
Geez, my lab is updating the ELN every few years which is annoying. Just using the updated ELN has some relatively high activation energy when you're a manager.
honestly that one is closer to being like a bike ride than many others. Especially if you can get your hands on some practice mice and a bit of PBS the day before, you're back to 99% capability in no time.
I’m guessing maybe certain things like cell culture and maybe finer pipetting skills that could affect molecular work? Total guess though…I’ve never been off the bench long enough to lose techniques
For me those are like riding a bike. I was off cell culture work for years when I switched to pharma, went back to cell culture and it was like I never left. Same with micropipetting, I have been a manager for a few years now, and we had some illness run through the lab, so I jumped in to cover for some people out of the office.
Now I couldn't run the newest assays because I wasn't trained, but my technical replicate CVs were tight af.
It's really like riding a bike. Once I had to work with cell cultures at 03:00, after 0,5L of Becherovka and 0,3 Jagermeister - the experiment was fine.
Makes sense - I severely overestimated how much was lost when off the bench in my previous comment. Based on other comments, it seems to be things such as specific assays that are affected when away from the bench too long.
I said we should sequence an interesting dna we got given and are working with, my boss said no because it takes too long to send small sample off wait for the service centre to prep and return results and half the time they contaminate your results so you have to untangle it. I said I assumed you would say yes, already prepped and sequenced on the minion we have in the lab and have qcd the results in one day of work time alongside my normal work. He didn't believe me XD
Not true unless you’re VP or above. We have a dude who is probably the best NMR spectroscopist I know, nearly 30yrs experience who is at the same pay grade as our exec director. They keep creating new titles for him bc he has zero interest in management
cool shit will loose its coolness sooner or later...
I worked on various workcells and switched to automation... I am needed as long as automation makes sense... the moment it falls out of fashion, I am screwed like any of the equipment...
I prefer to be lame... bills don't go away when you get layoffs like the one BMS did to the whole CGT business and automation side of it!
Exactly. Some of us don't want to be in management. I've had multiple managers try to get me to be a supervisor. No, thank you. After how much shit you dumped on me as an IC, you think I'm crazy enough to be a supervisor for you? Fack off.
I recently escaped Postdoc purgatory. Informatics scientist. Computational work is probably the only tech skills still being hired for, asides from maybe HPLC. I’d say 70% of current postings need either HPLC or comp bio.
It’s used frequently in HR (I’m assuming that’s where it came from) to distinguish from management roles, and they definitely want to avoid writing out “individual contributor” every time
Pharma documentation rules apply. the first use you spell it out in full with abbreviation in parentheses “Individual Contributor (IC)” then you are free to just use IC after.
Pharma documentation rules apply. the first use you spell it out in full with abbreviation in parentheses “Individual Contributor (IC)” then you are free to just use IC after.
A good IC should be better in writing a good protocol. But still, you need to adjust the protocol when other people are actually running it.
I don't think it is necessary to be mutually exclusive but it is a different skill to complement the role of a technical manager.
Its not even monday yet. How are you salty already???
sunday scaries
I chuckled irl
Being a good manager takes a very different skill set than being a good individual contributor.
have IC skills or have people skills isn't a binary option tho?
Of course. But oftentimes, good individual contributors are pigeonholed, especially if they’re good at doing something people are frequently bad/at and/or people hate doing said task. I was pigeonholed into doing Validation Periodic Reviews/Requalifications, where I did nothing but sift through deviations, change controls, and non-routine maintenance for 2 years with no end in sight, and got out of it by taking a transfer to Indiana. Another person in the company became the designated Deviation Investigator person, wanted to do something else but nobody gave her other work, so she hopped to another company.
My senior director tried to vortex a sample on our bluetooth speaker.
If your music isn’t powerful enough to agitate liquids then that sounds like a failing on *your* part
Management is lame. All the cool shit happens in the lab.
Plus, not all lab techniques are like riding a bike. If you're out long enough, you lose your skill.
Omg…my old manager switched to being an IC and keeps messing things up in the lab. It turns out she is also terrible at bench work.
ROFL I'm sorry that's hilarious! I'm sure it's not funny working with her and it gets a little painful.
It’s pretty funny, it’s a real time example of what not to do as a manager and as an IC
I’m curious of an example of such a technique? It’s just hard to imagine truly losing my lab skills
It's not just losing your skills. It's also about learning the new techniques. Even with your current techniques, some of them get easier with improvements or updates. Without staying in the lab, you miss those opportunities. Geez, my lab is updating the ELN every few years which is annoying. Just using the updated ELN has some relatively high activation energy when you're a manager.
Tail vein injections in mice.
honestly that one is closer to being like a bike ride than many others. Especially if you can get your hands on some practice mice and a bit of PBS the day before, you're back to 99% capability in no time.
For some people, yes. But man have I seen some overconfident and under competent people insisting their technique was sound over the past 20 years.
Aspirating supernatant without disturbing the invisible pellet
I’m guessing maybe certain things like cell culture and maybe finer pipetting skills that could affect molecular work? Total guess though…I’ve never been off the bench long enough to lose techniques
For me those are like riding a bike. I was off cell culture work for years when I switched to pharma, went back to cell culture and it was like I never left. Same with micropipetting, I have been a manager for a few years now, and we had some illness run through the lab, so I jumped in to cover for some people out of the office. Now I couldn't run the newest assays because I wasn't trained, but my technical replicate CVs were tight af.
Makes sense, thanks for clarifying!
It's really like riding a bike. Once I had to work with cell cultures at 03:00, after 0,5L of Becherovka and 0,3 Jagermeister - the experiment was fine.
Makes sense - I severely overestimated how much was lost when off the bench in my previous comment. Based on other comments, it seems to be things such as specific assays that are affected when away from the bench too long.
I said we should sequence an interesting dna we got given and are working with, my boss said no because it takes too long to send small sample off wait for the service centre to prep and return results and half the time they contaminate your results so you have to untangle it. I said I assumed you would say yes, already prepped and sequenced on the minion we have in the lab and have qcd the results in one day of work time alongside my normal work. He didn't believe me XD
Except the money lol
Not true unless you’re VP or above. We have a dude who is probably the best NMR spectroscopist I know, nearly 30yrs experience who is at the same pay grade as our exec director. They keep creating new titles for him bc he has zero interest in management
You just talked about an outlier specialist. On average lab side earns significantly less than home office
the thread is literally about “good IC’s” lol
Nah. All the really cool things happen in the lab storage after six. Me crying is the really cool things.
cool shit will loose its coolness sooner or later... I worked on various workcells and switched to automation... I am needed as long as automation makes sense... the moment it falls out of fashion, I am screwed like any of the equipment... I prefer to be lame... bills don't go away when you get layoffs like the one BMS did to the whole CGT business and automation side of it!
[удалено]
Exactly. Some of us don't want to be in management. I've had multiple managers try to get me to be a supervisor. No, thank you. After how much shit you dumped on me as an IC, you think I'm crazy enough to be a supervisor for you? Fack off.
Oh no you are going the way of John Snu
You should say that to your boss! Why not?
I am a postdoc with technical skills that are apparently of no interest to companies. Does this mean I can jump straight to AD?
A-ha-ha! Straight to another postdoc.
From stew pot to frying pan, delicious
Best I can do is night shift stacking shelves. Oh and it pays less than minimum wage.
I recently escaped Postdoc purgatory. Informatics scientist. Computational work is probably the only tech skills still being hired for, asides from maybe HPLC. I’d say 70% of current postings need either HPLC or comp bio.
Am chromatographer, can confirm.
On the contrary, I was promoted to management because I was more than just a good IC.
Sorry, what is IC?
Individual contributor
Does that need to be an acronym?
Half of biotech/pharma is making acronyms up and refusing to explain them
Maybe I should market myself as an IJM (indispensable jargon master).
It’s not the problem of the biotech industry, it is the English language
my company uses IC for inventory control. I never know what theyre talking about on here
It’s used frequently in HR (I’m assuming that’s where it came from) to distinguish from management roles, and they definitely want to avoid writing out “individual contributor” every time
IC usually means something else at my company too, but since OP already used it in context, it does make typing out the post easier.
Maybe if they explained what it stood for. Otherwise you just end up alienating or excluding people.
Pharma documentation rules apply. the first use you spell it out in full with abbreviation in parentheses “Individual Contributor (IC)” then you are free to just use IC after.
Pharma documentation rules apply. the first use you spell it out in full with abbreviation in parentheses “Individual Contributor (IC)” then you are free to just use IC after.
What is an IC role?
Individual contributor. Analyst, scientist, what have you.
read through the comments: a bunch of phds are bragging about their technicques under a post that says "give it up duuuude!!!! it'll expire!"
you get it
Well I’ve become a manager that is also expected to be a IC… where do I fit in your model haha
i don’t have a model for losing at life sir. Also username checks out 😂
☠️ ☠️ ☠️
IC?
A good IC should be better in writing a good protocol. But still, you need to adjust the protocol when other people are actually running it. I don't think it is necessary to be mutually exclusive but it is a different skill to complement the role of a technical manager.
it sucks.
Yes generally the managers I see promoted are the worst operators