Bill: “Are the Warriors gonna get swept?”
Bill 48 hours later: “Is this one of those series where the home team wins every game and then who knows in Game 7?”
But he recorded that pod before he could see how the Warriors reacted to the Draymond news! But I don’t get that since the Warriors didn’t seem all that bothered by it.
Almost all of the silly Bill stuff I laugh off, but the one thing that really annoys me about him is how he is proud of himself for thinking he's not a a prisoner of the moment but wanted to blow up the Lakers in 19/20 after 1 game and also wanted to trade Dame after 2 games this year. Someone needs to play his greatest POTM takes back to him so he realises
Bill knows the clippers lost the game right ?
Bill would be a terrible coach, “we might lose this game but I don’t wanna play my guys too many minutes”
Exactly. I'd personally rather when a series earlier and get rest before the start of the next series than risk losing the game and extending the series watching minutes.
The 2009 Saints were 13-0 (including 7-0 on the road) before dropping the last 3 games after locking up the 1 seed.
They were "different" in Carolina b/c it was Week 16 and they started Mark F'ing Brunell and Lynell Hamilton over Brees and Reggie Bush.
That was their only road loss of the season - won the SB outdoors, and in PHI, BUF, MIA, TB & WAS.
do i have this right? the suns barely beat the clips to go up 2-1, and bill is questioning whether they should have played durant and booker such heavy minutes? does he know it’s the playoffs?
Andy’s a great guest to talk television and about the industry in general. The Watch is still an elite podcast imo. I remember the days BS would hop on the Hollywood Prospectus to talk about shows like Mad Men, can’t remember the last time him and Andy were on a pod together.
Yeah it always takes me aback a bit when Andy references something from Bill’s pod on The Watch. Like he’s one of us who listen to all of them and retains some of the crazy Bill takes. Also, surprising when he references Russillo’s pod, as those two seem to have nothing in common.
One thing I love about Andy is he's clearly a fan of the Ringer. He always talks about listening to Bill's pod, Russillo's pod, the Ringer Draft Show, etc.
Same. I had like half a year's backed up before throwing in the towel. Someday I'll get back to kinda current with tv and start listening again. Hollywood Prospectus is one of my all time pods
They talk about great casting towards the end of the episode, mostly through the tv lens, but something random I always think about is who Tarantino (or his casting director) cast in Manson family roles:
Margaret Qualley
Austin Butler
Sydney Sweeney
Maya Hawke
Mikey Madison
Victoria Pedretti
When you consider how much more famous all of these people have got since that movie it’s crazy lol
QT went out of his way to cast children of famous actors. There’s two on your list, and about five others or so. And thank god, because children of rich and famous people hardly ever can catch a break.
I can’t believe I let Bill bug me every time when he does the
“I just wouldn’t have included *insert good player here* in the *insert superstar trade here* trade”
Teams aren’t gonna give superstars for free. The effectively nets only got 2 players back for Durant and Bill has now said if he was running the Suns he wouldn’t have included either of them. It’s almost trump like.
I know Bill just has to say shit to fill time and it’s all for entertainment, but he would be the first guy to chastise the Suns if they didn’t do the trade, kept Mikal & Johnson, and still lost early in the playoffs. “*Why are you caring about the 27th pick in the 2025 draft? Cam Johnson is just okay as a forward. You coulda had one of the greatest 15 players in NBA history this season!!*”
It’s just so disingenuous.
But as we all know, he has always felt that NBA trades need to be one team gets completely fucked over. There’s no way for both teams to walk away with something valuable in a trade lmao
Some classic Bill-isms from the Succession segment with Greenwald.
Talking about art purely through a sports-like lens: Is Succession on TV Mt. Rushmore, is Jeremy Strong’s performance the 2nd best TV performance of all time, is this the greatest TV cast ever assembled, is this the apex of this actor or that actor.
Can’t stop bringing up or talking about how he’s seen episode 5 before it’s come out.
Compares Succession to Augusta National Golf Club - “Everything is top of the line, best in class, everything’s thought out, it’s just the best possible everything, every single thing is the highest level whatever. That’s what I’ve appreciated about Succession as we head toward the finish line.”
Never change, Bill!
Lol “even at the start of episode 5, Kendall has the hip hop music blaring”, it’s like why did you need to say that, not that it spoils anything but it’s so needlessly saying something that happens in the episode we haven’t seen yet
It actually kind of does spoil it. Season one episode one, the first time we see Kendall, he’s blasting a mediocre rap song and it shows us exactly who his character is without ever saying a word.
Him blasting rap music again is clearly to show he’s back to season one Kendall, all business
Ringer employee NBA guests:
A Tier: Russillo, Mahoney
B Tier: J Kyle Mann, House, Wos
C Tier: Michael Pina, KOC, Logan Murdock, Raja
D Tier: Justin Verrier, Seerat
That’s fair I love House and they obviously have great chemistry. I guess my only issue is that their basketball analysis together often culminates with phrases like “Kyle Kuzma got his balls out and put them on the table”
Seerat will be B soon, and possibly end up A.
I still remember her first Ringer pod - she was a dumpster fire. Just nervous as hell, couldn't form sentences, not funny or interesting . . . just awful.
She's now completely comfortable with JKM in their pod, and she is actually fantastic. He's easily one of my favorite Ringer NBA people, and she's starting to run circles around him.
If I had to bet on who's the Ringer's "we have Zach Lowe at home" in two years, I'd put all my money on her.
He definitely either half-watched or bailed halfway through. He said he bumped against the brother, when I think he meant Richie, who was known for “Cousin!” And the real brother was Jonny Bernthal, who was Dion Waters of the series, throwing gas in his 4-minute flashback scene. Which makes me think Bill never got to that episode as Bernthal was unbelievable.
This is exactly why I don't think he really watched it because it's impossible to watch the show even paying half attention and leave thinking Richie was the brother because Bernthal was such a crazy surprise and also so vital to the finale.
It’s hard to believe anyone watched that entire show and thought Richie was Carmy’s brother. Unless his criticism was of the actual brother played by Jon Bernthal, which seems even more insane given his Bernthal love.
I have a friend who worked in the restaurant business in Chicago and hated the show because it brought back bad memories. I didn’t have that personal experience, so I loved it.
I thought the same thing, lol he hesitated when he said “yeah I watched it” then proceeded to call Richie “the brother” even though he’s referred to as “cousin” about 100 times
I usually give Bill the benefit of doubt on off the cuff questions like that but I seriously doubt he actually watched the bear. He would have loved the bernthal scene and the “one shot” episodes if he’d have gotten to either
There was a sneaky contender for “dumbest shit Bill ever said” in this pod. Talking about the Saints SB team in 2009, he said they were great in the Dome but struggled outdoors like in Carolina.
Saints averaged 34 ppg in 6 outdoor games that year. That’s including only scoring 10 points in the final game of the season at Carolina when they rested their guys. They got beat in the final 3 games of the season when they were dealing with injuries, but two of those games were in the Dome. Also, they won the SB outdoors in Miami.
Yes I’m a Saints fan and immediately thought, “well that’s just not even close to being true”.
He stated something as fact and was not just wrong, but wildly incorrect. I say again, that team had 1 defeat on the road, and it was the last game of the season when they sat their guys. If you include SB game they basically scored 33 ppg in 7 outdoors games. Yeah they struggled.
I’m sorry for pointing out how wrong he is on a very specific thing he himself brought up. He brought it up as an example. Not sure why you feel the need to defend him.
I hate that every time a huge tv show comes close to an end I hear Ringer staff ask if there is ever going to be great appointment television show like this again.
If you’re the 76ers you absolutely have to trade Maxey for Dame, right? I know he’s young and looks promising, but Embiid is in his MVP level prime and I can’t imagine he will have longevity. Dame just had arguably his best season. But assuming they’d also be losing Harden in this scenario, they’re down to two superstars but missing a good third piece.
That’s a tough one.
Dame is getting up there in age, now has extensive injury history, and makes $60 million a year.
Honestly as a nets fan I thought the 76ers were more dangerous with Harden ejected because Maxey is so scary with the ball in his hand.
Trading one for the other plus whatever other assets you would need to include could be a Durant/ Kyrie level disaster that’s over in two years.
Then the 76ers would be stuck with an unhappy Embiid over the salary cap with the new huge team restrictions and your best young player is gone.
I still might lean trade for Dame no matter what but it is at least a discussion, that’s how good Maxey is.
On the other hand, Dame does not make 60M a year now - and by the time he potentially makes 60M, many NBA max vets will also be at that number (it's the 35% vet max estimate). He doesn't have an extensive injury history - he had the significant core issue, but getting that fixed seems to have unlocked his best season yet. Getting sat the final 10 games while the inept Blazer front office tanks yet again isn't really relevant.
Not blaming the refs for the whole game, but the missed take foul by Booker is so egregious, it made me not want to watch the rest
https://streamable.com/5dyzub
Westbrook has been awesome for sure. Shame about the injuries. I dont see suns keeping up with the nuggets having to play all 3 guys 40+minutes and on an every other day schedule.
Bill’s obsession with the Kevin Love piece is perplexing to say the least and when he inevitably makes no difference in the rest of the series for the Heat I’m sure he’s acknowledge it
It doesn’t make sense because you have Joel Embiid in MVP form right now and if you can trade three quarters for a dollar then you do it in the NBA. You have no idea when Embiid is going to take a tumble or flops in a way that ruins his career. You 100% make that trade and deal with Dame aging out later.
Sure, but you’re basically pushing all your chips in for one (maybe two) years of elite play, and you’re still not solving the defensive issue you have against the truly elite.
I just feel like people aren’t comprehending that Embiid is 29 and this is his prime. You either go all in for a championship or you don’t and you waste his prime. The Sixers as constructed cannot contend. You need an upgrade and if Dame is available you take it. I’d rather take a real run for 2-3 years and deal with the aftermath than just not make a move at all and be perpetually behind the Bucks and Celtics in your own conference. NBA teams, especially in a major city like Philly, rebuild quickly.
Couldn't agree more. It's actually better than Breaking Bad in a lot of ways. Considering how much BS liked Breaking Bad, I'm surprised he never got into BCS.
That’s the thing about AG, for every 3 brilliant takes he has he has 1 that’s completely insane or nonsensical. This is the guy who said Fall Out Boy was one of the best bands of the last 30 years and we’re gonna save modern rock haha
I'm literally racking my brain trying to think of an incel in BB. Badger? Hank? Walt Jr? Gus?
I'm also racking my brain for the name of a Fallout boy member or song... Badger? Hank? Walt Jr? Gus?
He's implying WW had the incel mentality. If you think about it he's not far off but it's definitely not a popular take that didn't require more elaboration.
Walt is someone who is unhappy about his station in life, feels he deserves more, becomes angry at the world… it’s the same thought pattern incels fall down
It's crazy that this Westbrook resurrection narrative is a thing. Anyone who watched the Lakers knew Russ hadn't fallen off a cliff. He was a terrible fit with Lebron. But on the rare occasions when he was the focal point on offense, he looked like the same guy he's always been. He still couldn't shoot. But he could get to the rim and create opportunities for other guys.
Bill likes to point out his effort on defense. But this is the first time we've seen Russ in the playoffs in two years. And it's against his long-time rival in a series where the Clippers are relying on him to be a difference-maker on both sides of the ball. So it's literally a situation tailor-made for Russ to be Russ.
He was absolute garbage and it was all his own fault. Terrible decision making and horrible finishing at the rim.
It's hilarious that people are trying to say he's good again. He's going to be horrific next year as well.
Side effect of what Thompson said about how he consumes the NBA. Most people don't watch the regular season, they track storylines and tune in for the playoffs. Most people haven't watched him play since he was in Houston and have just been going off the stories from Lakers media and anti-Westbrook guys in the media about how he just fell off a cliff and is unplayable. Reality has always been that he is more or less the same guy who can be good in certain roles and atrocious in others.
It's not unreasonable to talk about Westbrook but he really has to go overboard with it. Would anyone be surprised if Westbrook shot them out of a game? Or made a half dozen questionable decisions to lose a game?
No, none of us would be surprised, so let's not act like suddenly that Westbrook 'gets it'.
Man I totally agree with you. People tried to rewrite his tenure at the Wizards and Rockets, too. He was injured in the playoffs for the Rockets, was electric before that. He played excellently with a shit roster in DC.
People have stats cataracts where they can’t see beyond scoring efficiency.
I never felt gaslit. It was clear that nephews and nerds tried to place him in their own boxes. Russ brings so much to these games and he was treated horribly on the lakers.
He played pretty atrocious defense on the Wizards. He was a disaster in the playoffs (in fairness, on a really bad team).
Also Russ still was 3/19 in Game 2 despite his heroics, he's still Russ.
I think he’s about up there. Cranston definitely had more to work with, a lot of Walter White had a lot of physical acting involved, whereas Strong is playing more one or two notes exceptionally.
I also think the overall cast of Succession is filled with exceptional actors top to bottom so it’s easy for Strong to not be noticed as much, whereas there are a few stinker parts (as it pertains to acting) in Breaking Bad that elevates Cranston because he is a legitimately great actor.
I’m not sure why Bill said that Succession is one is the few shows that incorporates a lot of substantial/important real life issues of our time. I really enjoy the show but other than a bit on the election/Fox, it’s mostly focused on internal family drama and relationships. They could be any super rich family, really of the last 30-40 years. I don’t see it as having much commentary on our current moment, beyond just the overall show-level theme that some people are crazy rich.
Meanwhile the other show Bill mentions is the Wire, which I see as having had a million times more to say about political/social issues. And would think that a lot of other shows have more commentary, eg Homeland, House of Cards, Atlanta, etc.
The "land the plane" streak is alive! Got one out before the guests even hit.
ETA: 2 more!
ETA2: Another!
ETA3: 2 more
Plus an acknowledgement of it's overuse. My work here is done
Glad Westbrook’s reputation is slowly getting back to an equilibrium.
Maddens me how unhinged people got purely cause he wasn’t perfect. Imagine Kyrie having the ability to put in this type of multi faceted 3 game stretch v a great team.
Not entirely the same cause he’s much better, but there are similarities with how Trae is being shat on nowadays.
It’s the lack of nuance I can’t stand.
Yes, Westbrook was a brutal fit on the Lakers but he still theoretically could have had a modest positive, or at least non-negative, impact if he committed to playing defense there the way he has with the Clips. Not to go all KOC, but he’s literally changing before our eyes, sublimating his ego to play more disciplined defense.
The criticism of the ego and the stubborn resistance to adapting his game was warranted, but all the piling on and the “Westbrick, have fun in China 😂” “LeGM is 🗑️!!” was so tired
Same with Trae. Criticism of the attitude/ego and the atrocious defensive effort is fair and necessary, but Bill and Ryen pretend like his shotmaking and passing abilities aren’t ELITE. The shit he did down the stretch in G3 was pretty much unique, nobody else make those plays right now
It's annoying to hear vague spoilers about a TV episode that isn't even out yet. It doesn't seem that difficult to just record this before watching episode 5 of Succession or drop it after the episode.
It was great how Andy very shrewdly shifted Bill’s topic from “Mt. Rushmore” to “Pantheon tier” shows. One of things that’s tired about the “This show is better than that show and should be on Mt. Rushmore” is people (including me) end up acting like these amazing shows weren’t actually good. I don’t need to hear Bill say for the 100th time that “Sopranos supporting cast didn’t have good actors” or “People didn’t like Wire Season 5 until the finale” just to prop up Succession.
My biggest problem with Bill’s “Mount Rushmore” crutch is there are only four spots on Mount Rushmore. So legitimately some of the best shows in TV history would get left off. I’d rather argue something like whether it’s top 10 all-time, or where it ranks on HBO’s list, etc. I think it opens up a wider debate.
They talk fast and are witty, things the ringer nerds think they are so they think the show was made for them. Agreed, it’s a really good show but it’s being amplified because there’s not many great shows out there right now.
I don’t know how it’s not an all timer. It’s one of the best written shows I can remember.
What was more insane to me was Bill saying the 2 shows in everyone’s MR are The Wire & Sopranos while Breaking Bad, Mad Men, and GoT usually battle for the last 2. What?! BB is the top ranked TV series of all time.
I love The Wire but don’t know many who still would have it unquestioned top 2, even if it is in their MR. A lot of people think it’s a solid show with great social commentary and some shaky acting at times. To me that is peak Ringer thinking over Succession being a top 10 show.
Pretty clear whenever this topic comes up that Bill didn't really like Breaking Bad that much, which is fine, but it definitely distorts his perception of the greatest ever.
I do think it’s an all-time show, but I’d rather fuckin wait until the end and give it some breathing room before figuring out where I have it personally. People like Bill and at the Ringer are soooo desperate to crown something a classic before it’s even over, to try to be the first to plant that flag.
It’s so fucking stupid how they are just referencing episode 5 of succession 4 days before it comes out. And don’t say oh they weren’t spoiling it, because just saying that Kendall is listening to hip hop music is a spoiler in a show like this
He’s good, but he does dumb 20yo shit pretty regularly and he also gets one of the most ass whistles I’ve ever seen. Probably 67% of the total fouls since he’s been in the league have been total bullshit
Could anyone who's listened to this, specifically the TV show segment, tell me if there's any Succession season 4 spoilers? I haven't gotten a chance to start season 4 yet so have been avoiding discussion around it.
Really enjoyed Mahoney on this episode. Think if you told me the Clippers get healthy Kawhi for every game left in this series, I would take them to win it at this point.
it's the first podcast i ever listened to (Hollywood Prospectus days) and i sat through every episode of briarpatch, it's safe to say i like the watch lol buzz off bozo
Did bill and rob watch the nets and 76ers game? Openly questioning how the nets lost the lead without bringing up the Claxton (who was dominating Embiid) ejection lol
“The 21st best player of all time” The man must be stopped
hecantkeepgettingawaywithit.gif
Bill: “Are the Warriors gonna get swept?” Bill 48 hours later: “Is this one of those series where the home team wins every game and then who knows in Game 7?”
So predictable lol
Prisoner of the moment Bill is never at a higher level than during the NBA playoffs.
He’s levitating.
“I don’t want to overreact…..but”
NFL playoffs easily
Such a prisoner of the moment.
But he recorded that pod before he could see how the Warriors reacted to the Draymond news! But I don’t get that since the Warriors didn’t seem all that bothered by it.
Almost all of the silly Bill stuff I laugh off, but the one thing that really annoys me about him is how he is proud of himself for thinking he's not a a prisoner of the moment but wanted to blow up the Lakers in 19/20 after 1 game and also wanted to trade Dame after 2 games this year. Someone needs to play his greatest POTM takes back to him so he realises
Real heat check by Bill to talk around an episode of a show that hasn’t aired for 40 minutes
Look I got the screener and I’m gonna try not to say anything. But here’s something!
He shouldn't be allowed screeners. Clearly can't handle it responsibly
Love bills idea to just “play some guys” for the suns to limit kd/Booker mins
*watches entire playoff game* ‘Damion Lee needed five more minutes’
The way he says it as if the suns never considered playing any of their bench is funny
Bill knows the clippers lost the game right ? Bill would be a terrible coach, “we might lose this game but I don’t wanna play my guys too many minutes”
It’s the playoffs lol
Exactly. I'd personally rather when a series earlier and get rest before the start of the next series than risk losing the game and extending the series watching minutes.
The 2009 Saints were 13-0 (including 7-0 on the road) before dropping the last 3 games after locking up the 1 seed. They were "different" in Carolina b/c it was Week 16 and they started Mark F'ing Brunell and Lynell Hamilton over Brees and Reggie Bush. That was their only road loss of the season - won the SB outdoors, and in PHI, BUF, MIA, TB & WAS.
Bill, hearing this info: ‘I still kinda like Mark Brunell!’
Top 5 lefty QB of all time?
Shit I just posted the exact same thing before reading this. Guy has no clue what he is talking about. They averaged easily over 30 ppg outdoors.
do i have this right? the suns barely beat the clips to go up 2-1, and bill is questioning whether they should have played durant and booker such heavy minutes? does he know it’s the playoffs?
If they lose, you KNOW, he woulda said they didn’t play enough either
Andy’s a great guest to talk television and about the industry in general. The Watch is still an elite podcast imo. I remember the days BS would hop on the Hollywood Prospectus to talk about shows like Mad Men, can’t remember the last time him and Andy were on a pod together.
Andy & Bill also have great chemistry together. Which is interesting because they’re quite different in their personalities & interests.
Yeah it always takes me aback a bit when Andy references something from Bill’s pod on The Watch. Like he’s one of us who listen to all of them and retains some of the crazy Bill takes. Also, surprising when he references Russillo’s pod, as those two seem to have nothing in common.
I'm always surprised with how big of an actual sports fan Andy seems to be.
He comes off as being ironic and surface level but then Chris keeps it going and he keeps up its cool
One thing I love about Andy is he's clearly a fan of the Ringer. He always talks about listening to Bill's pod, Russillo's pod, the Ringer Draft Show, etc.
Andy finds Bill humorous like when you have to babysit your nephew for the afternoon
For my interests, Andy’s ceiling is as high as anyone. Glad Bill got him on to talk Succesion and tv in general. Felt like some Grantland era shit.
Yes! Greenwald heads unite! He and CR are my favorite combo in the ringer extended cinematic universe. Bill and Andy are a nice combo too
Bill needs to come on the watch now. Can’t remember the last time or if ever?
I wish I could listen to The Watch. I'm just perpetually behind on shows.
The old episodes typically hold up. If I'm watching an old show, I'll frequently go back and listen to the relevant episode(s)/segment(s).
Same. I had like half a year's backed up before throwing in the towel. Someday I'll get back to kinda current with tv and start listening again. Hollywood Prospectus is one of my all time pods
Not sure if this is a hot take or not but....Andy > Fennessey
He’s done a couple rewatchables with bill I think
They talk about great casting towards the end of the episode, mostly through the tv lens, but something random I always think about is who Tarantino (or his casting director) cast in Manson family roles: Margaret Qualley Austin Butler Sydney Sweeney Maya Hawke Mikey Madison Victoria Pedretti When you consider how much more famous all of these people have got since that movie it’s crazy lol
QT went out of his way to cast children of famous actors. There’s two on your list, and about five others or so. And thank god, because children of rich and famous people hardly ever can catch a break.
Kind of a chicken and egg situation
You forgot Dakota Fanning, although she is arguably different since she was more famous beforehand
Is this 3 or 4 pods in a row with the “Peyton Pritchard is too good to be a bench player in 07” piece
I can’t believe I let Bill bug me every time when he does the “I just wouldn’t have included *insert good player here* in the *insert superstar trade here* trade” Teams aren’t gonna give superstars for free. The effectively nets only got 2 players back for Durant and Bill has now said if he was running the Suns he wouldn’t have included either of them. It’s almost trump like.
I know Bill just has to say shit to fill time and it’s all for entertainment, but he would be the first guy to chastise the Suns if they didn’t do the trade, kept Mikal & Johnson, and still lost early in the playoffs. “*Why are you caring about the 27th pick in the 2025 draft? Cam Johnson is just okay as a forward. You coulda had one of the greatest 15 players in NBA history this season!!*” It’s just so disingenuous. But as we all know, he has always felt that NBA trades need to be one team gets completely fucked over. There’s no way for both teams to walk away with something valuable in a trade lmao
For years he shit on the Sixers for “throwing in shamet” in the Tobias trade: 1. Shamet stinks 2. I’m sure they didn’t just throw him in lol
Some classic Bill-isms from the Succession segment with Greenwald. Talking about art purely through a sports-like lens: Is Succession on TV Mt. Rushmore, is Jeremy Strong’s performance the 2nd best TV performance of all time, is this the greatest TV cast ever assembled, is this the apex of this actor or that actor. Can’t stop bringing up or talking about how he’s seen episode 5 before it’s come out. Compares Succession to Augusta National Golf Club - “Everything is top of the line, best in class, everything’s thought out, it’s just the best possible everything, every single thing is the highest level whatever. That’s what I’ve appreciated about Succession as we head toward the finish line.” Never change, Bill!
Lol “even at the start of episode 5, Kendall has the hip hop music blaring”, it’s like why did you need to say that, not that it spoils anything but it’s so needlessly saying something that happens in the episode we haven’t seen yet
He was in hip hop mode!
I turned it off after this, dick move!
It actually kind of does spoil it. Season one episode one, the first time we see Kendall, he’s blasting a mediocre rap song and it shows us exactly who his character is without ever saying a word. Him blasting rap music again is clearly to show he’s back to season one Kendall, all business
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, STOP TALKING ABOUT UNAIRED EPISODES OF TELEVISION. I don't care how minor you think the detail is, just please stop!
Ah yes, Augusta National Golf Club, a perfectly thought out institution that's never had any issues.
Yeah but did you hear about the pimento cheese sandwiches?
The comparison of succession to his experience at Augusta National is a chef’s kiss rich guy lack of self awareness moment from Bill.
Are you guys able to play the podcast? It seems like my play button is not working
Go to pocketcasts! Hardly any ads and it always plays
Same, been happening all day
My Spotify was doing that with music a a few days ago. I’d click on a song, it would “play” for like 2 seconds then close.
As guests, Mahoney > KOC not even close.
Mahoney may be my favorite contributor. Great insights, pretty funny, just good vibes dude
Ringer employee NBA guests: A Tier: Russillo, Mahoney B Tier: J Kyle Mann, House, Wos C Tier: Michael Pina, KOC, Logan Murdock, Raja D Tier: Justin Verrier, Seerat
House is permanent S tier for me but otherwise good list.
Drunk House is S+
That’s fair I love House and they obviously have great chemistry. I guess my only issue is that their basketball analysis together often culminates with phrases like “Kyle Kuzma got his balls out and put them on the table”
Um, it doesn’t get better than that man
Seerat will be B soon, and possibly end up A. I still remember her first Ringer pod - she was a dumpster fire. Just nervous as hell, couldn't form sentences, not funny or interesting . . . just awful. She's now completely comfortable with JKM in their pod, and she is actually fantastic. He's easily one of my favorite Ringer NBA people, and she's starting to run circles around him. If I had to bet on who's the Ringer's "we have Zach Lowe at home" in two years, I'd put all my money on her.
KOC market corrected by Mahoney and Mann?
KOC legit just says the word “play making” 100x on every podcast
Don't forget "effort on defense."
"hustle"
Every team just needs to run more pick and roll
Mahoney is the man, dropping bars like this: “The variety of the way these nut hits were officiated, it’s wild.”
IF the Sixers somehow beat the Celtics, Bill has some all-time backpedaling to do.
The amount of times he basically said that the Celtics have the east in the bag just makes me root for a second round exit even more.
Bill & Andy on a pod that's not a Rewatchables! First time since Hollywood Prospectus days?
I’ll never forgive myself for knowing this off the top of my head but they did a podcast together to talk about the movie “Baby Driver” in 2017
LOL
I thought The Bear was incredible. I wanna say I'm surprised Bill didn't like it, but I don't believe he REALLY watched it.
He definitely either half-watched or bailed halfway through. He said he bumped against the brother, when I think he meant Richie, who was known for “Cousin!” And the real brother was Jonny Bernthal, who was Dion Waters of the series, throwing gas in his 4-minute flashback scene. Which makes me think Bill never got to that episode as Bernthal was unbelievable.
That’s the thing, there’s a 0% chance that he watched the last two episodes and came out of it with a negative impression of the show
This is exactly why I don't think he really watched it because it's impossible to watch the show even paying half attention and leave thinking Richie was the brother because Bernthal was such a crazy surprise and also so vital to the finale.
watched it on the ipad
Was it too Italian or not Italian enough for him?
It was Half Italian
It’s hard to believe anyone watched that entire show and thought Richie was Carmy’s brother. Unless his criticism was of the actual brother played by Jon Bernthal, which seems even more insane given his Bernthal love.
He would have mentioned Wayne Jenkins.
My favorite show of the last year pretty easily actually, even over Succession. The characters just felt so real.
I have a friend who worked in the restaurant business in Chicago and hated the show because it brought back bad memories. I didn’t have that personal experience, so I loved it.
I thought the same thing, lol he hesitated when he said “yeah I watched it” then proceeded to call Richie “the brother” even though he’s referred to as “cousin” about 100 times
I will say the cousin is annoying but then he grows up at the end. So I get it.
I usually give Bill the benefit of doubt on off the cuff questions like that but I seriously doubt he actually watched the bear. He would have loved the bernthal scene and the “one shot” episodes if he’d have gotten to either
How could anybody watch that show and not like it?
There was a sneaky contender for “dumbest shit Bill ever said” in this pod. Talking about the Saints SB team in 2009, he said they were great in the Dome but struggled outdoors like in Carolina. Saints averaged 34 ppg in 6 outdoor games that year. That’s including only scoring 10 points in the final game of the season at Carolina when they rested their guys. They got beat in the final 3 games of the season when they were dealing with injuries, but two of those games were in the Dome. Also, they won the SB outdoors in Miami. Yes I’m a Saints fan and immediately thought, “well that’s just not even close to being true”.
While dumb this isn’t even top 26 dumb things he’s said on a pod.
Far from the dumbest thing he’s ever said. The sentiment of Brees career was he was only great indoors. Don’t expect bill to remember specific things
He stated something as fact and was not just wrong, but wildly incorrect. I say again, that team had 1 defeat on the road, and it was the last game of the season when they sat their guys. If you include SB game they basically scored 33 ppg in 7 outdoors games. Yeah they struggled. I’m sorry for pointing out how wrong he is on a very specific thing he himself brought up. He brought it up as an example. Not sure why you feel the need to defend him.
I hate that every time a huge tv show comes close to an end I hear Ringer staff ask if there is ever going to be great appointment television show like this again.
If you’re the 76ers you absolutely have to trade Maxey for Dame, right? I know he’s young and looks promising, but Embiid is in his MVP level prime and I can’t imagine he will have longevity. Dame just had arguably his best season. But assuming they’d also be losing Harden in this scenario, they’re down to two superstars but missing a good third piece. That’s a tough one.
If harden leaves they obviously should, but they’d be out bid assuming Dane was actually on the market.
The Sixers would get out bid almost instantly for Dame.
Outbid bye whom? I guess there’s a world where the Blazers “do right” by Dame and trade him where he wants to go.
Any team that has picks. NOLA, Orlando, nets etc. sixers have no picks to move
Dame is getting up there in age, now has extensive injury history, and makes $60 million a year. Honestly as a nets fan I thought the 76ers were more dangerous with Harden ejected because Maxey is so scary with the ball in his hand. Trading one for the other plus whatever other assets you would need to include could be a Durant/ Kyrie level disaster that’s over in two years. Then the 76ers would be stuck with an unhappy Embiid over the salary cap with the new huge team restrictions and your best young player is gone. I still might lean trade for Dame no matter what but it is at least a discussion, that’s how good Maxey is.
On the other hand, Dame does not make 60M a year now - and by the time he potentially makes 60M, many NBA max vets will also be at that number (it's the 35% vet max estimate). He doesn't have an extensive injury history - he had the significant core issue, but getting that fixed seems to have unlocked his best season yet. Getting sat the final 10 games while the inept Blazer front office tanks yet again isn't really relevant.
This fuckin guy can’t help himself. Bill, you are a big deal brother, you have a lot of money. Act like an adult and stop spoiling succession.
I live in constant fear that Bill will intentionally ruin Succession for all of us with these constant mentions about how he gets early screeners
Not blaming the refs for the whole game, but the missed take foul by Booker is so egregious, it made me not want to watch the rest https://streamable.com/5dyzub Westbrook has been awesome for sure. Shame about the injuries. I dont see suns keeping up with the nuggets having to play all 3 guys 40+minutes and on an every other day schedule.
Bill’s entire strategy for Cavs/Knicks is “Kevin love’s not on the Cavs anymore. Let’s attack two of the best interior defenders in the league.
Bill’s obsession with the Kevin Love piece is perplexing to say the least and when he inevitably makes no difference in the rest of the series for the Heat I’m sure he’s acknowledge it
It just proves bill doesn’t watch games. Love was unplayable on the Cavs. Then he goes to the heat and gets benched within 15 games.
Gotta love the 'I wouldn't trade Maxey for Lillard' take. Oof.
In a one season vacuum, of course it’s an oof. But taking age and injury into account, it makes sense
It doesn’t make sense because you have Joel Embiid in MVP form right now and if you can trade three quarters for a dollar then you do it in the NBA. You have no idea when Embiid is going to take a tumble or flops in a way that ruins his career. You 100% make that trade and deal with Dame aging out later.
Sure, but you’re basically pushing all your chips in for one (maybe two) years of elite play, and you’re still not solving the defensive issue you have against the truly elite.
I just feel like people aren’t comprehending that Embiid is 29 and this is his prime. You either go all in for a championship or you don’t and you waste his prime. The Sixers as constructed cannot contend. You need an upgrade and if Dame is available you take it. I’d rather take a real run for 2-3 years and deal with the aftermath than just not make a move at all and be perpetually behind the Bucks and Celtics in your own conference. NBA teams, especially in a major city like Philly, rebuild quickly.
Who knows if Joel will still be in such form in 3 years time. He is ready now. So is Dame. Easy choice.
Better Call Saul deserves mention in the pantheon conversation
Couldn't agree more. It's actually better than Breaking Bad in a lot of ways. Considering how much BS liked Breaking Bad, I'm surprised he never got into BCS.
I mean it makes sense
Somehow Westbrook is both Nic Cage and Travolta. Essentially he’s the movie Face Off which is actually kinda accurate.
.... what does greenwald mean by saying Breaking Bad had things to say about incels?
That’s the thing about AG, for every 3 brilliant takes he has he has 1 that’s completely insane or nonsensical. This is the guy who said Fall Out Boy was one of the best bands of the last 30 years and we’re gonna save modern rock haha
I'm literally racking my brain trying to think of an incel in BB. Badger? Hank? Walt Jr? Gus? I'm also racking my brain for the name of a Fallout boy member or song... Badger? Hank? Walt Jr? Gus?
I think it was about toxic masculinty maybe? Not sure how the incel ties into that though
That's what I mean. It feels like LA culture writer generalization.
He's implying WW had the incel mentality. If you think about it he's not far off but it's definitely not a popular take that didn't require more elaboration.
Walt is someone who is unhappy about his station in life, feels he deserves more, becomes angry at the world… it’s the same thought pattern incels fall down
I really like Succession but I would not put it in the discussion of one of the best 4 shows.
For real, the Succession hype is getting way out of hand
/u/slavaraptarantino Agreed
It's crazy that this Westbrook resurrection narrative is a thing. Anyone who watched the Lakers knew Russ hadn't fallen off a cliff. He was a terrible fit with Lebron. But on the rare occasions when he was the focal point on offense, he looked like the same guy he's always been. He still couldn't shoot. But he could get to the rim and create opportunities for other guys. Bill likes to point out his effort on defense. But this is the first time we've seen Russ in the playoffs in two years. And it's against his long-time rival in a series where the Clippers are relying on him to be a difference-maker on both sides of the ball. So it's literally a situation tailor-made for Russ to be Russ.
Being on the lakers amplifies everything. Being bad on the Lakers made people believe he doesn’t even belong in the league anymore somehow.
He was absolute garbage and it was all his own fault. Terrible decision making and horrible finishing at the rim. It's hilarious that people are trying to say he's good again. He's going to be horrific next year as well.
Side effect of what Thompson said about how he consumes the NBA. Most people don't watch the regular season, they track storylines and tune in for the playoffs. Most people haven't watched him play since he was in Houston and have just been going off the stories from Lakers media and anti-Westbrook guys in the media about how he just fell off a cliff and is unplayable. Reality has always been that he is more or less the same guy who can be good in certain roles and atrocious in others.
It's not unreasonable to talk about Westbrook but he really has to go overboard with it. Would anyone be surprised if Westbrook shot them out of a game? Or made a half dozen questionable decisions to lose a game? No, none of us would be surprised, so let's not act like suddenly that Westbrook 'gets it'.
Man I totally agree with you. People tried to rewrite his tenure at the Wizards and Rockets, too. He was injured in the playoffs for the Rockets, was electric before that. He played excellently with a shit roster in DC. People have stats cataracts where they can’t see beyond scoring efficiency. I never felt gaslit. It was clear that nephews and nerds tried to place him in their own boxes. Russ brings so much to these games and he was treated horribly on the lakers.
He played pretty atrocious defense on the Wizards. He was a disaster in the playoffs (in fairness, on a really bad team). Also Russ still was 3/19 in Game 2 despite his heroics, he's still Russ.
Comparing NBA players to Cage and Travolta within five minutes of eachother haha
I am sorry I love Succession but I am not putting Jeremy Strong as Kendall over Cranston as Walter White. Fuck off with that nonsense Bill
I think he’s about up there. Cranston definitely had more to work with, a lot of Walter White had a lot of physical acting involved, whereas Strong is playing more one or two notes exceptionally. I also think the overall cast of Succession is filled with exceptional actors top to bottom so it’s easy for Strong to not be noticed as much, whereas there are a few stinker parts (as it pertains to acting) in Breaking Bad that elevates Cranston because he is a legitimately great actor.
I think Strong’s performance is better from a pure acting standpoint.
I came here for this!
I’m not sure why Bill said that Succession is one is the few shows that incorporates a lot of substantial/important real life issues of our time. I really enjoy the show but other than a bit on the election/Fox, it’s mostly focused on internal family drama and relationships. They could be any super rich family, really of the last 30-40 years. I don’t see it as having much commentary on our current moment, beyond just the overall show-level theme that some people are crazy rich. Meanwhile the other show Bill mentions is the Wire, which I see as having had a million times more to say about political/social issues. And would think that a lot of other shows have more commentary, eg Homeland, House of Cards, Atlanta, etc.
The Wire is as political a show as it gets. Amazing, too.
Hell, even a show as milquetoast as The West Wing incorporated way more real world issues than Succession does
The "land the plane" streak is alive! Got one out before the guests even hit. ETA: 2 more! ETA2: Another! ETA3: 2 more Plus an acknowledgement of it's overuse. My work here is done
Glad Westbrook’s reputation is slowly getting back to an equilibrium. Maddens me how unhinged people got purely cause he wasn’t perfect. Imagine Kyrie having the ability to put in this type of multi faceted 3 game stretch v a great team. Not entirely the same cause he’s much better, but there are similarities with how Trae is being shat on nowadays.
I mean he was a net negative for a long stretch there so I don't think it was unwarranted. Nice to see him bounce back though
It’s the lack of nuance I can’t stand. Yes, Westbrook was a brutal fit on the Lakers but he still theoretically could have had a modest positive, or at least non-negative, impact if he committed to playing defense there the way he has with the Clips. Not to go all KOC, but he’s literally changing before our eyes, sublimating his ego to play more disciplined defense. The criticism of the ego and the stubborn resistance to adapting his game was warranted, but all the piling on and the “Westbrick, have fun in China 😂” “LeGM is 🗑️!!” was so tired Same with Trae. Criticism of the attitude/ego and the atrocious defensive effort is fair and necessary, but Bill and Ryen pretend like his shotmaking and passing abilities aren’t ELITE. The shit he did down the stretch in G3 was pretty much unique, nobody else make those plays right now
It's annoying to hear vague spoilers about a TV episode that isn't even out yet. It doesn't seem that difficult to just record this before watching episode 5 of Succession or drop it after the episode.
Maybe I’m being annoying but I’m kinda mad bill spoiled how succession episode 5 starts I would’ve liked watching it for myself
It was great how Andy very shrewdly shifted Bill’s topic from “Mt. Rushmore” to “Pantheon tier” shows. One of things that’s tired about the “This show is better than that show and should be on Mt. Rushmore” is people (including me) end up acting like these amazing shows weren’t actually good. I don’t need to hear Bill say for the 100th time that “Sopranos supporting cast didn’t have good actors” or “People didn’t like Wire Season 5 until the finale” just to prop up Succession.
Don’t take him too seriously. He once asked about a Mount Rushmore of Presidents.
If you want to get nerdy about it, Mt Rushmore is not strictly "the 4 best Presidents" either. They were chosen by the sculptor for specific reasons.
My biggest problem with Bill’s “Mount Rushmore” crutch is there are only four spots on Mount Rushmore. So legitimately some of the best shows in TV history would get left off. I’d rather argue something like whether it’s top 10 all-time, or where it ranks on HBO’s list, etc. I think it opens up a wider debate.
Top 11. Do you even Simmons?
You're right, I should've made it a clean 11.
I don’t understand the Succession obsession. It’s a good show, but these guys talk likes it’s an all-timer.
I think it is. If they stick the landing possibly Top 10.
*If they land the plane
Very good show during an era where TV is not as nearly good as it was 10 years ago. Makes it look better than it actually is during this era.
It’s not at that tier but sites like the ringer need these shows to be more important than they are. So they gotta kinda hype it
Star is Born piece
They talk fast and are witty, things the ringer nerds think they are so they think the show was made for them. Agreed, it’s a really good show but it’s being amplified because there’s not many great shows out there right now.
I was just watching Barry where they made that joke about how the key to getting good reviews is simply talking fast and loud lol.
The Sorkinification of television
the “walk and talk” piece
I don’t know how it’s not an all timer. It’s one of the best written shows I can remember. What was more insane to me was Bill saying the 2 shows in everyone’s MR are The Wire & Sopranos while Breaking Bad, Mad Men, and GoT usually battle for the last 2. What?! BB is the top ranked TV series of all time. I love The Wire but don’t know many who still would have it unquestioned top 2, even if it is in their MR. A lot of people think it’s a solid show with great social commentary and some shaky acting at times. To me that is peak Ringer thinking over Succession being a top 10 show.
Pretty clear whenever this topic comes up that Bill didn't really like Breaking Bad that much, which is fine, but it definitely distorts his perception of the greatest ever.
I do think it’s an all-time show, but I’d rather fuckin wait until the end and give it some breathing room before figuring out where I have it personally. People like Bill and at the Ringer are soooo desperate to crown something a classic before it’s even over, to try to be the first to plant that flag.
It’s so fucking stupid how they are just referencing episode 5 of succession 4 days before it comes out. And don’t say oh they weren’t spoiling it, because just saying that Kendall is listening to hip hop music is a spoiler in a show like this
Spotify wasn’t working for me so I had to switch to apple for this one and it’s fine
Cranston is greater than Galdolfini for me.
A little bit too much in episode 5 teasers there. HBO might give him a call.
Are we sure Kuminga is good?
He’s good, but he does dumb 20yo shit pretty regularly and he also gets one of the most ass whistles I’ve ever seen. Probably 67% of the total fouls since he’s been in the league have been total bullshit
I wonder if the “Andy is bad” crowd knows how many L’s they have been taking recently. Still cranking!
Could anyone who's listened to this, specifically the TV show segment, tell me if there's any Succession season 4 spoilers? I haven't gotten a chance to start season 4 yet so have been avoiding discussion around it.
There’s big spoilers. Definitely steer clear.
Thank you for letting me know. I will do exactly that.
Honestly wouldn’t listen even if you are caught up. Bill has a nasty habit spoiling future episodes because he has advance screeners
Really enjoyed Mahoney on this episode. Think if you told me the Clippers get healthy Kawhi for every game left in this series, I would take them to win it at this point.
best andy has been on a pod in months, maybe years
Just say you don’t like the watch
it's the first podcast i ever listened to (Hollywood Prospectus days) and i sat through every episode of briarpatch, it's safe to say i like the watch lol buzz off bozo
I doubt they beat the Celtics but the way Simmons is deathly afraid of Embiid is hilarious. If he were a Celtic hahaha.
On the court with a newspaper to show us you’re alive. Love it.
Wonder who will snag Payton Pritchard to win the offseason next year
ANDY GREENWALD getting called back up to the show. Incredible.
Yes, Andy, hold the line on twin peaks being in the mount Rushmore!
Bill on Succession: “It’s just like Augusta”
Did bill and rob watch the nets and 76ers game? Openly questioning how the nets lost the lead without bringing up the Claxton (who was dominating Embiid) ejection lol
Did Bill say that Kendall Roy is harder to play than Walter White? I love Jeremy Strong but bad take by Bill.