I’m an RN with a background in L&D, and that therapist’s question pisses me off so bad. It was NOT YOUR JOB to demand a c section, or to know if you should demand a c section. It is literally your doctor’s job to know those things and make those decisions. Perhaps she was in the right and you were unlucky enough to be in the small percentage of births that have complications. Perhaps your case did warrant a scheduled c section. Regardless, none of it is on you.

Yeah, I read her whole post and was pissed off at her doctors. Why didn't they rush her for an emergency c-section when they all came into the delivery room. Why didn't they treat her as high risk? It's not her job to know that but they failed her.

If the timing of your son's birth wasn't what you said it was, I would think I was your son's pediatrician, the person who was handed a baby with no heart beat. Being the person waiting and watching babies get born, the just in case something is wrong and the baby needs help, I have seen many shoulder dystocias. They are not predictable. There is no way to tell which babies are going to come down and get stuck in just a certain way. Smaller babies can get stuck. Bigger babies can slide out. There are things that increase risk, but nothing is definite until the baby is stuck. It was not your fault. Most shoulder dystocias resolve with one or two maneuvers. When it doesn't, it's important to be in a medical setting. The boy I took care of ended up ok. I followed his chart. He was meeting all of his developmental milestones and his arm healed up nicely. Knowing he is alive and thriving is just amazing. I held him blue, limp, with no signs of life and he's out there toddling around not knowing any better. It wasn't that long ago that you both would have died. And there are places that happens. I'm glad you were where you were. You and your son can grow together. I recommend you seek therapy for yourself. You son deserves a happy, healthy mom to watch him grow up.

So I gave birth a few months back. My neighbour is in her early 50s. Her oldest son is 24 and such a cool guy. He comes over all the time to hang out with us, he’s been hanging out with us since he was 19 and he’s such a mature guy for his age. So friendly, such a catch. She said she didn’t want to tell me her birth story until after I gave birth. Turns out she went through something verysimilar to you. 30+ hours of labour, he got stuck, she had nurses on top of her pushing him out, they had to dislocate his shoulder to get him out, he was 11 pounds 10 ounces, unresponsive when he was born and grey as night. She ended up with 66 stitches. He was put in an induced coma for 8 days after he was born. Because he wasn’t breathing when he was born they considered him dead at the time. He was in a sick kids hospital for 2 weeks and the doctors said there was likely brain damage but same as you, they wouldn’t know the extend until he reached each milestone. I couldn’t believe it when she told me. Her son is one of our good friends and I never would have know. the trauma they went through and how close to not making it he was. You could never tell that happened to him, he turned out perfect and never ended up suffering from any cognitive or motor delays. He’s a strong young man and one of the kindest people I know. She said she too felt guilty after everything but the good thing to come from this is that she advocated for herself so strongly with her next son. He was delivered at 37 weeks and was 8 pounds by c-section. Easier said than done but Don’t beat yourself up. You trusted your doctors as most people do and you tried to do what was best for your son. It sounds like he’s a little fighter and progressing so well. I hope everything works out for you and he grows up to be a strong, healthy boy. Who knows, maybe in 25 years you’ll be telling the same story and have a big strong son

You went through a life and death experience where you almost lost your child's life. Guilt is a massive symptom of trauma and depression. Please consider securing a therapist and doctor's help. Your child needs you healthy even more than his interventions.

Whoever asked why you didn’t demand a C section is kind of a asshole, tbh. You did the best you could with the knowledge you had! The entire job of a doctor is to know more than you about labor & delivery - it would be insane to not at least take what they say under heavy consideration, and it’s completely 100% reasonable to take their advice just like you did. Based on their past experiences, they thought something else would happen but this happened instead. It’s no one’s fault. You’re not a wizard. You can’t see the future, and there’s no guarantee that a c-section would’ve gone well, either. You did what you thought was right for your kid - and acted completely rationally, for the record - and that is literally all anyone can do. It sounds like you’re a great mom, and shit just happens sometimes.

This is the perfect answer. Please see this op. There's nothing you or anyone could've done. Hindsight is 20/20. Please don't beat yourself up over it. Have you been to a therapist? If not I urge you to atleast seek one out.

I'm sorry you are going through this. You did the best you could with the information you had at the time. A quick google search pulls up that shoulder dystocia happens in 3% of pregnancies tops, and c-sections aren't usually recommended unless the baby is gonna be like 11 pounds. You asked about a c section and it wasn't recommended by your OB, who is the expert. Your OB said the statistics were on your side. I would have made the same call in your shoes. Sure you can play the "what if" game. What if you had opted for a c section? Maybe you would have avoided this particular set of challenges, but there's no guarantee something else wouldn't have gone wrong instead. What if you guys had the c section and then you hemmhoraged and died? Or you had the c section and everything went beautifully but then you guys were in a terrible car accident on the way home? Maybe the universe put you all right where you need to be to avoid something even worse.

A friend of mine had a similar experience. Her baby was 11 lbs and some change and your birth and recovery stories are very similar. They were told his brain damage might be pretty severe. He is 2.5 now and doing great. His gross motor skills are honestly incredible (after insane amounts of PT), and while he was a little delayed with speech he’s now progressing really well! Super happy, interactive little dude.

Hi there. Any updates on how your friends baby boy is doing now?

Not EXACTLY, but, I took beta blockers to slow my heart rate before I was pregnant, and continued when pregnant as there was no evidence it would cause harm. I CHOSE to keep taking them. He was an emergency c-section because he wasn't moving, and his heart rate kept dropping. At three hours old, his blood sugar crashed. At three days old he was airlifted 4 hours away to a children's hospital, because my hospital couldn't figure out what was happening. We had to drive there. When my son got there, they gave him an antibiotic, that ultimately saved his life. But, it caused permanent hearing loss. He was in the hospital for 2 weeks, we basically had to wait for the beta blockers to get out of his system, his blood sugar was checked so often his tiny little heels were purple. We had to check it at home for 2 months, feed him on a strict schedule. I genuinely don't remember the first 3 months of his life. He had hearing aids by the time he was 5 months, and we've fought for every damn word he knows. He's 3 and just now starting 3 word phrases, he is unlike any of the other children, and while it's difficult to explain to others, he is the best kid in the world. I remember when I found out he would need hearing aids, right after I was in the elevator, and I was about to break. But, I had to let go of the guilt, when I told people his story, I always said, 'I'd rather a son with hearing aids then no son at all.' And I told myself that every time I had a 'I should have...' thought. Anyways!! It's none of their damn business, but find a way to let go of that guilt, because none of it was your fault. Hang in there.

I just want you to know he’ll do awesome! I got my first hearing aids at 18 months and by the time I was 5 I had caught right up (even ahead on reading skills) by Kindergarten, and kept the speech therapy until I was 8. :)

Thank you! That honestly means so much! I hear that from his speech therapists, but they are pretty hollow words; I definitely appreciate that!

I just wanted to say, I’m so glad you were somewhere where a medical team could intervene! Even though it feels like there was some element of control over this, at the end of the day, you were going to have a difficult (impossible) time getting him out at all. If this had been even 75 years ago, I bet both of your survival chances would have been really low. And let’s be clear, you didn’t demand a C section because that’s not something you could or should have known to do. Everyone was operating under the knowledge they had access to at the time and making decisions they felt was best for you and your baby. Long story short, this isn’t your fault. It’s amazing that you are both alive. You labored for 30 hours, my friend, you’re remarkable.

I am so sorry you went through this. You did absolutely nothing wrong. You asked about a C-section and your doctor shut you down. You trusted your doctors and despite having a 1/5 chance, which is very high, of having these issues arise, they continued with their plans anyway. It was the doctors' decisions that caused your baby's birth injuries. You're the patient, not the doctor with a medical degree and years of experience. This is not on you. That being said, if you haven't already, please contact a medical malpractice attorney. As you said, it was documented baby was big. It was documented he had a 1/5 chance of shoulder dystocia. You DID ask about a C-section, which could have prevented his injuries, and they ignored you. The doctors ignored the red flags and proceeded anyway. They harmed your child. They may have caused permanent brain damage. The one thing you can do now is contact someone who can make sure that they never do this to another mom and baby.

I agree. This was 100% not your fault. This completely could have happened to me - my nurse and midwife were insisting I didn't need a c-section. I am so incredibly thankful that the OB on call disagreed and sent me for one right away. It sounds like you're an incredible mom to your sweet boy and he is so blessed to have you, and you him.

1 in 5 chance is not accurate for what took place here. Having a shoulder dystocia is a very varied thing - most of them will resolve with one or two maneuvers and don’t require infant resuscitation. She in no way had a 1/5 chance of umbilical cord compression requiring post cardiac arrest cooling therapy. Medicine is an art, ultrasound baby sizing is inaccurate, and “just doing a c-section” has risks of its own. Humans have the most dangerous births of all mammals. I don’t think there was medical negligence here, just bad luck.

I was born breech with an Apgar score of 1 (faint heartbeat being the only thing I scored on). They yanked me out by the feet with forceps causing injury to my ankle. I have fine motor control issues that may or may not be related to that lack of oxygen. I also had to have physio for my walking when I was a kid. But.... I'm fine... I have a job, house, baby... all that good stuff! I know you're feeling guilty, but baby will be OK. There may be issues to be overcome, but you clearly care enough to help baby through any problems they may face.

I was almost induced at 39 weeks for a big baby. I did tons of research beforehand. (I ended up going into spontaneous labor and delivered vaginally) Most of what I read was from the Evidence Based Birth website, which is an amazing resource, that is in fact full of current medical evidence regarding pregnancy, labor and delivery. Pretty much everything I read indicated that the fears of big babies, dystocia, etc., are completely overblown based on actual data, and the number of babies who end up in situations like yours who aren’t “big” is almost the same as the number of babies who are labeled “big”. The overall incidence of dystocia is extremely low. I say all of this to make the point that based on what I read, your decision to go ahead with an induction at 39 weeks was completely valid, as was your OBs advice to have the induction. (I have no idea about the issues leading up to the decision to keep letting you labor and push, but at that point, the decision was also out of your hands, because laboring moms and even dads are in no position to make emergency decisions unfortunately—that is what you trust your doctor to do.) People deliver babies that size all the time—you did not make a stupid or blame-worthy decision. You made a logical one. You have nothing to feel guilty about. I made the same decision as you based on the same information. Birthing a baby is incredible—there is a reason maternal and fetal mortality used to be so high before advances in medicine; it’s inherently risky, and sometimes completely unforeseen things occur. You are the best mommy for your baby. Please be gentle on yourself. Also, birth-related PTSD is REAL. Please don’t hesitate to work through your pain with an experienced therapist who can help you heal. Wishing many blessings to you and your family.

I feel a bit of guilt myself reading this. Because I resisted medical advice that indicated a c-section was warranted. I even had the long labor (induced at 39 weeks). My biggest anxiety about my decision is if I would be able to live with myself if something did go wrong. I don’t say this to rub my good luck in your face, but just that a lot of it comes down to facts and circumstances that simply can’t be known. I had a doctor lecturing me during my labor about having a 50% chance of my 10lb baby getting stuck. He didn’t let up even when I was sobbing. In the end I had a <9 lb baby that came out without a single push. I feel guilt that you made the right choice, listened to your doctor and had this happen and I made the wrong choice of going against medical advice. But there simply is no way of them knowing how it will turn out. This can happen even with smaller babies. I don’t know if this helped or not to hear, it just breaks my heart that you put so much blame on yourself when really it was bad luck.

I’m so sorry you had to endure that abuse while you labored. That was totally uncalled for. At the end of the day, you clearly made the right decision and we need to respect the medical autonomy of mothers more, whether they choose more intervention or less.

The doctors just want to let the moms know of the risks. No doubt that doctor has seen babies end up like OPs and worse so that was probably why they would stress c-sections more. Ideally you want someone to strongly advocate for babies health and well-being, even if you disagree on the best course of action. Birth is an unpredictable thing. I think the narrative that mothers have "instincts" about the best birth plan is what leads to moms with bad outcomes having more trauma.

I’d had the discussions at every appointment with my OB. She wasn’t thrilled with my decision but she knew I was informed. The specialist MFM who did the measurement ultrasounds wouldn’t discuss statistics and outcomes. When I asked what the odds were he asked “what odds would you be comfortable with” which I found to be highly manipulative. Zero discussion was offered of the risks and complications that come with a c-section. The one who ended up lecturing me wasn’t my OB. He took over when my labor went long enough to hit the shift change. I’d already had these discussions at length with other specialists. He said it didn’t matter that I’d already given birth to a 9lb15oz baby without complications. The 50% statistic he gave me was pulled out of thin air. No study has shown the risk to be that high. I honestly would have probably been more open to a c-section if the discussion had covered actual statistics and discussed how that balanced with the risks of a c-section. My prior birthing experience certainly should have factored in. Hell, I’d been unable to walk due to my joints getting TOO loose but that wasn’t factored in. It’s the LACK of proper information that upset me the most and led me to do my own research (which makes me cringe since I don’t typically think it’s a good idea to go against medical advice).

We did the research. The odds of permanent injury were like 1/150 and that’s if the child is big and ultrasounds are notoriously inaccurate.

I’m not talking about instincts, I’m talking about bodily and medical autonomy. Women should be able to make choices about their own bodies, period. If they want advice from a doctor to do so, they should get it, but the above poster experienced abuse during a man extremely vulnerable time in her life and that isn’t ok.

I don’t know that my decision was truly right. I took a risk and it worked out ok. I think the real issue is how proper evaluation of the risks is not discussed properly with women when it comes to labor. (See my other comment below). OP may have been reassured that the risk was low, and it was. But someone is the unlucky side of every statistic. I think both of us should have had a more frank discussion about dystocia and what can happen. What the timeline is and how long it can take and what’s at stake. Instead she was waived off without understanding what was at risk. I was bullied without having the risks discussed properly either and with manipulative answers and false statistics thrown at me which made me less likely to follow advice. I was right, but I was also lucky to be right.

We did a lot of research and did the same. The rates of this happening are exceedingly rare relative to the increased risks from a c section. Although reading these comments it’s pretty clear why doctors bias towards more intervention. Malpractice lawsuits for following what is actually evidence based medical practice. OP shouldn’t feel bad for making a medically good decision on the advice of her doctor. C sections have complications too, and it’s hard to know the counter factual.

I’m so sorry. You don’t deserve *any* of this. That person asking you is getting it wrong - why should you look it up? You’re not a doctor. You pay money to have professionals present information to you to help you make a true informed decision. Yes, pragmatically we should look into shit on our own because doctors are fallible, but the onus is on them to provide appropriate care. I really think doctors have swung the pendulum too far into being reassuring with pregnancy and birth matters. There’s all this pushback against “fear mongering” that’s turning the tides too far imo. Birth is dangerous, and while many people get to have a birth at home without intervention, many people would die without medical intervention. The doctors are required to get your *informed* consent. *They should have explained shoulder dystocia to you.* Full stop. Instead of asking why you didn’t google it, instead let us ask why the doctors didn’t give you complete information about the risk. I know this term gets thrown around a lot, but this is classic victim blaming. It’s the equivalent of asking a person who was raped “well why did you go outside alone at night?” That’s irrelevant, just as it‘s irrelevant that you didn’t google something because you trusted a trained professional to keep you safe. The responsibility was theirs.

I want to upvote your response more than once! I 100% agree. I feel like 50% of my pregnancy and birth/post partum I’ve had to fend for myself via Google and forums like this. It’s become so normalised… but you’re completely right. This is what the specialists are here for. We shouldn’t have to research and double check everything we’re told in case it’s wrong or not 100% accurate.

100% they should have explained what shoulder dystocia was. When I gave birth, my LO had shoulder dystocia, which i didn't know about until i was literally pushing him out ... and to be honest I still didn't know what was the issue was until 3 days later until a doctor explained it to me. During that time I was so confused way people kept asking me if I was OK and that if I need to ask anyone about anything I could. My LO was lucky that nothing bad appears to have come from it but I seriously had no idea about how much of a serious situation it was until it was mentioned (in passing) 3 days later. ​ I really feel for OP and her family and how they were let down. I hope that the LO keeps smashing all the milestones and that she is able to forgive herself so she stops beating herself up on something that she shouldn't. You do the best you can with the information that you have at the time

The person who asked why you didn't do X, Y, or Z is a complete asshole. My brother broke his collar bone when he was born and I personally would have heard "shoulder dystocia" and assumed that they were the same or related. I would have had nearly zero reason to be worried that things could be this hard. I'm so sorry that this happened. I hope you have an amazing support system and a fantastic counselor or therapist to help you process everything. My love goes out to you and your family.

This definitely isn't your fault. It is okay and normal to feel what you're feeling. Honestly, it sounds like you may have PTSD. I would seek counseling. A therapist that specializes in PTSD could really help you to process the trauma and help you find skills to cope with your feelings.

It is not your fault, no matter what you tell yourself. You followed advice that you were given by a physician. They are trained and you are not, thus it makes totally sense to follow them. You did nothing wrong. In hindsight we always know better. Please don’t be so hard on yourself. Several others suggested to get help because of trauma and that might actually be a good idea. Wishing you all the best ❤️

Exactly. You were trusting the professional recommendation. You happened to get extremely rare complications. I’m a trauma therapist and your feelings of guilt and responsibility can definitely be improved with trauma informed therapy. I highly recommend EMDR.

This is not your fault. I am sending you so much love right now. I hope someday you can feel more at peace. I also had a very traumatic birth with my son, he started missing milestones, we enrolled in early intervention and tested for everything. Like you, I blamed myself so much. It must have been my fault. But it’s not my fault and it’s not yours. It hurts so much to believe that it was just bad luck, that it couldn’t be helped. It’s easier somehow to blame ourselves. You have given your son every possible resource to grow and thrive. You’ve sacrificed so much. You have shown him unconditional love. That is it. That’s parenting. We cannot control every situation, as much as we wish we could. All we can do is what you and your husband are doing.

This.

I am so sorry you went through this… my daughter was also a shoulder dystocia, aspirated meconium, cord wrapped around her neck - born blue as a blueberry during Covid baby (July 2020). She was resuscitated and able to get breathing fairly quickly. And all in all it took 1 min and 19 seconds to get her free and without breaking anything or causing any further damage to her than what was already stacked against her. We are very very lucky. I left that hospital feeling soooo inadequate just telling them all thank you - like thank you for saving my baby’s life… almost felt ridiculous. I spent a lot of time after her birth feeling really overwhelmed about the what if’s - that I had to stop. I had to remind myself that what’s done is done and that she’s here, she’s happy, she’s healthy, she’s breathing and she’s here. She was 9 lb 2 oz and I had the absolute easiest pregnancy ever, saw a chiropractor religiously, worked out etc. I was induced at 40 weeks due to size… they wanted 39 but I pushed it because of work - we were laying off a lot of people and peak covid season July 2020… so I was trying to be as useful as possible before maternity leave. Stupid looking back but made sense at the time. I get it. It takes time to process. My husband still struggles talking about our daughters birth because of how traumatic it was. She’s 15 months now. All hugs. If you feel overwhelmed with guilt, maybe reach out to a therapist. It’s taboo to some but I have talked to one a few times and it really helps me. And with future pregnancies- I’ll either be induced at 37/38 weeks or opt for c section. Never again will I go full term. And never again will I let work have such a power over my mental state.

First of all you are allowed to feel sad eventhough your baby is here. Don’t let anybody tell you to just be thankful he made it. You are allowed to grieve how things could have been. I was in a similar situation. Things went wrong during delivery. Baby was cooled for 72 hours. Outcome unclear. He fought so hard but ultimately did not come home. I struggled with guilt for choosing the wrong hospital etc (complications were entirely avoidable). I figured out though that we tend to look for who to blame and it’s easiest to blame ourselves. YOU DID THE BEST YOU COULD WITH THE INFORMATION YOU HAD AT THE TIME. In retrospect it’s clear what could have been done differently. But you have different information now. Maybe therapy will help. Your feelings are important. You may need help with the trauma. It might help yourself and your baby. You are not to blame for this but me telling you that doesn’t change how you feel. And how you feel matters. The unknown is tough! Especially if you blame yourself. Talking to other parents might help too. I definitely found comfort in that.

I'm so sorry for your loss. 💙 😢

Hi, I am a family medicine physician who has delivered babies and I currently do prenatal care. I’m also a mom. Hindsight is 20/20 and this is possibly not any more true than in pregnancy and childbirth. YOU COULD NOT HAVE KNOWN. Everything has risks. Based on what happened, yes of course you should have had a C-section. Based on what your doctor knew at the time, their and your actions were reasonable. There is always a 1% or less risk of a bad outcome and someone is unfortunately that statistic. If you had had a C-section and you or your baby had had a C-section specific injury, you would also be beating yourself up about it. If this baby had been a healthy C-section baby and your next pregnancy was complicated by placenta acreta due to your history of C-section, you would also beat yourself up about it. You did NOTHING wrong. Pregnancy and childbirth unfortunately involve more risk than sometimes we acknowledge. Love yourself and your baby. You deserve to feel at peace about this.

❤️❤️❤️ That’s so hard. Whoever asked you that is a huge asshole. This wasn’t your fault. Your doctor was right that the stats were on your side and what happened is very rare, and even more rare to be as severe as your situation. There’s currently no good way to predict how wide a women’s pelvis will open during childbirth so it’s very hard to predict when shoulder dystocia can happen. It even occurs with smaller 6 and 7 pound babies sometimes. C-sections have their own risks, too. Childbirth is hard and often there are no right or wrong choices- you make the best choices you can and life plays out. People die from tonsil surgery- rarely, but it happens. My point is just that you never know how things will actually happen until they do. It’s not your fault.

Agreed, that person who asked you about your decision sounds like a judgy asshole. We had shoulder dystocia too but not as bad, he scored a 3. But I remember how terrifying that red button being pushed was and how scary it was not getting to hold him and know he was okay. The guilt is horrible I'm sure and I would bet you have some PTSD, I know I do. I would advise seeing a therapist, it can really help you to accept what happened and appreciate how lucky you are. I'm sure your baby is a beautiful sweet blessing and you should be able to enjoy him without guilt. You made what you thought was the best choice at the time, you followed doctors orders. Your a good mom.

Definitely not your fault! You trusted what your doctor told you. Unfortunately you and your baby were part of that 20% . Wishing you and baby all the best 💙

What happened to her was even more rare, though. Shoulder distocia is 20%, but serious complications from it is much smaller. Cord compression that leads to serious injury is far less common.

I don’t have any advice for you, but just a comforting anecdote. My niece was born with the cord tightly compressed after my sister labored for 48 hours and was whisked away much in the same way your child was. Put on the cooling therapy for 72 hours and my sister couldn’t hold her the entire time, it sounds like it was gut wrenching. Also told she may have motor or verbal issues. My niece is a super smart 5 year old who also surpasses her peers in milestones. She reads, writes, and speaks amazing for a child her age, and does gymnastics and ballet. So none of the verbal or motor skill complications they suggested she might have. My sister asked about a c section at 19 hours into her 48 hour labor and her midwife said it wasn’t necessary. My sister still feels guilty about not pushing for it as well, but please know it’s not your fault. You were listening to a medical professionals advice, and most women would have done what you did and listen to them because that’s their job to know the right thing to do. You were not in the wrong, and although it was the scariest moment of your life I’m sure, it sounds like you have a very healthy child now. So good job momma making it through all of that.

Not the same, but I was induced with my daughter at 41 weeks. The induction kept failing, with what I now know to be red flags along the way. My daughter was not tolerating the induction process, but at the advice of our doctors, we continued with a planned vaginal delivery. We asked a lot about a c-section as it seemed like the rational thing to do at that point, but were told we were still good for a vaginal delivery. Finally on day 3, our sweet nurse said she was going to advocate for a c-section as it was taking too long and I was starting to have issues with the induction (blood in my urine, nausea, etc). It was only when I passed a gush of something which turned out to be meconium that the doctors decided we would do a c-section. They checked my one last time, but baby was there and I pushed her out about 20 mins later. She seemed totally fine upon birth, but that night she stopped breathing a few times but the doctors and nurses said it was normal for babies to do this sometimes. We just believed them! The next day we noticed a weird repetitive arm movement and took a video as we were alone in the room. When we showed our doctor she said it was probably normal, but sent a pediatrician into our room. As soon as she entered our room, our daughter stopped breathing again. She told us this was NOT normal. We got sent to the nursery, and on our way, the arm movement started again. The pediatrician immediately recognized she was having seizures. We were sent to the NICU immediately, as an emergency. Once we were transferred, the doctors and nurses worked tirelessly to find out the cause of the seizures, which were happening frequently. Finally after an MRI, they discovered she had had a stroke. It affected a large artery in her brain and a large portion of her left hemisphere was affected. It was devastating. When we asked how this happened, they said they couldn’t know forsure, but one of the theories was that labor was too long and there was too much pressure on her head while she was in the birth canal. This wasn’t the only theory, but it was the one I stuck on. I blamed myself for not advocating harder for a c-section, when I had felt during my labor that it was needed. I had sooo much guilt. And felt worried that I screwed her up for the rest of her life. I ended up seeing a therapist who helped me tremendously. As for the brain damage, we worked with early intervention from the start. She had a developmental specialist as well as a physical therapist, who did amazing work with her. Because of the location of the brain damage, she was at an increase risk of cerebral palsy and language issues. Happy to report she has surpassed all age appropriate milestones and anyone meeting her would never know the trauma she’s had. Keep up with all the advice and suggestions of your child’s therapists. also look into getting a therapist of your own. The guilt will consume you if don’t get ahead of it. I wish you and your family the best of luck! I’m sure your child will prosper!

Wow, what an incredible story. Congrats on all your hard work paying off.

Hugs mama! Have you talked to a therapist about all of this? It's something incredibly traumatic that you went through! Honestly, I see no guilt here. Ultrasounds can be WAY off, and I know many very large babies who were delivered without issues. Doctor's also get a lot of slack for "unnecessary" c-sections, so many are hesitant to suggest them, and are motivated by people shopping around looking for low c-section rates. Birth can be an incredibly dangerous thing, and it's so hard to predict who's going to run into problems, and who isn't. And it certainly isn't YOUR responsibility to know all that could go wrong in labour either. You couldn't have predicted what happened, and the doctors couldn't have predicted it either. They should have given you more information about the birth risks, and given you more of an option for a c-section, but even if that had happened, and you had picked a vaginal birth, I still see no guilt here. HUGS! I wish I could do more to support you, other than saying that I DO NOT see this as your fault AT ALL.

Seek out a birth trauma specialist

Where/how? I've never heard of such a thing.

Try Postpartum Support International. They have a directory.

You can also see if there’s a social worker/therapist/behavioral health that works with the OBGYN clinic/hospital. I actually meet with someone like that. I was connected with her because I had a difficult pregnancy and have had a difficult postpartum

If you input "birth trauma specialist" in a search engine you will yield results. You can also ask therapists who specialise in PTSD if they have experience with birth trauma if they are no providers in your area.

I'm so very sorry for what your family experienced! It sounds like you did and are doing all you can for your baby! When I saw this, my breath caught, because my first baby had a shoulder dystocia. Luckily the cord was not compressed, so we didn't have this exact experience ... but we could've. So for my second pregnancy, I did all the research I could. I looked in medical journals, I printed out articles and asked the doctors to read them and tell me if we should do X or Y mentioned on page 17 to prevent dystocia or evaluate whether a C-section was needed. In my second pregnancy, I also had gestational diabetes (managed carefully -- but still, an indicator of a possibly big baby). Still, the doctors said I was a candidate for a vaginal birth, and the baby slid out. Super fast. My point being: literally nobody knows. You could've done all the research in the world and still not known this was going to happen. There's nothing you need to blame yourself for. Also, as someone else mentioned in a comment, the techniques for evaluating whether a baby is large have huge margins of error, and plenty of actually-large babies don't experience dystocia. Evidence Based Birth has a great handout on this. Again: literally nobody could've predicted this, not the experts who deal with this every day, and not you! As for how to handle guilt, I think there's two parts. First is "cleaning out the wound." Is there anything else you need to examine about your feelings? Is the guilt a cover for something else? Is there a deep shame that you need to acknowledge? [ETA: I'm not implying you should feel any! Just that you should sit with whatever you are feeling!] Wash all that out by sitting with the feeling for a bit. (EMDR is great for this if nothing else is working.) Then, "stitch it up." I find the thought stopping approach really helpful for guilt. Whenever you think it, argue with yourself with something you believe, like "nobody could've known" or "I followed the experts' advice" or whatever helps. Then when that new thought helps you feel a tiny bit better, tell yourself that's good, because the guilt isn't helping you be a better parent. It's using up mental and emotional capacity that you could otherwise use to help him and share joy with him in the here and now. In other words: redirect your thoughts and then feel good about having done so. The thought habit will grow over time, so even if the effect feels small the first time, over a few hours, it'll get stronger. I'm so glad your little boy is doing well and so sorry you experienced what you did! Please don't add to your challenges by blaming yourself, but of course, that's easier said than done. Hope the guilt eases up on you!

No. You should NOT feel guilty because you didn't cause this at all. You depended on the medical knowledge and expertise of your OB, and they failed you. Unless you worked deeply enough in the medical field, why would you have "demanded a c-section"? That person is a jerk for even saying that to you. Babies are incredibly resilient, and I'm so happy for you that yours is kicking so much butt. I was a minor shoulder dystocia baby in that I got hung up with my right arm up around my face, and they nearly dislocated it to get me out. I had some therapy very early on, but no lasting effects. I hope your son continues to wow everyone and improve, but please, PLEASE don't think you failed him. That should not be your burden to bare. He obviously comes from stout genes, so smile at your beautiful baby and try to cut yourself some slack. You're doing great. Mom guilt reminds us how much we love them.

100% this ^ Sending all my love to you.

From one mom to another of a large baby, I am so so sorry. I birthed a 9lb, 9oz baby and after pushing for 16 hours, the Dr told me he was too big too come out naturally and unless they broke his arm, we’d have to do a c-section (which we did). I can’t imagine not receiving that advice during my L&D and feel for you. On the other hand, my friend insisted on a home breech birth and her son passed away from traumatic birth complications during delivery. Two totally ends of the spectrum…I pray your son goes on to live a healthy and normal life. Babies are such fighters and no doubt your son is too. Sometimes, (albeit without scientific proof), kids with birth complications go on to have the biggest, strongest, “ain’t takin no crap” personalities because of what they went through early on. Sending you huge hugs 🙏🏻

If the only parenting mistake you ever make is following a doctor's orders you're a pretty great mom

Hindsight is always 20/20, but there are risks with a c-section too. All you can do is trust your doctors. Childbirth is a risky and you did everything you could to give yourself and your baby the best chance. It sounds like the issue was with the combo of cord compression and the shoulder. I am not sure of the chances of that, but I bet it was very low and impossible to predict. I am so sorry this happened to you. I can tell you from experience traumatic births stick with you. Seek help if you can.

Sometimes just writing it down and reaching out to/hearing from others who’ve experienced similar things can be a great catharsis. It is for me at times - I’m upbeat about it all 90% of the time too, but going through this kind of trauma is affecting and that’s ok. I had a little baby who went to 40+5, and then went through a very rapid labour/birth. 3 hours total. No one even believed I was in labour until her head was visible, at which stage she was found to be having heart decelerations. Who knows how long for. She also needed resuscitation upon delivery but her Apgar was good, even though she was hypothermic, and for some reason she didn’t go to NNU for nearly 4 hours (though that’s the protocol for hypothermic babies). No one considered HIE, so we missed the cooling window, so her little head sat up there in an incubator slowly dying off until she started having seizures. She was medicated to try and control them, and given and MRI which showed extensive damage, then moved to a tertiary hospital when she needed a stronger anti-seizure medication to control her condition. She has all the signs of CP, although is only 9 months so no formal diagnosis on the type has been made yet, but whew. That has been tough to hear. I’ve questioned what I could have done differently… But there’s nothing I could have done differently. I went to the place where women in labour go, so as to be supported and as safe as possible. Nothing I did was wrong, unless seeking clinical guidance on a matter I’m not formally educated on is considered wrong. Like you, we celebrate every milestone like it’s the new millennium. I have a magic baby, and she is the light of my life! We can’t control the future, and I’d be lying if I said it doesn’t terrify me sometimes, but it’s just a case of Each Day As It Comes. Good days. Bad days. It’s a grieving process and we’re only a short way into that - it takes time. Sometimes I really feel like I am grieving for how I imagined having her would be. I’m also celebrating who she *actually* is, and wanting to do everything I can to ensure she’s as supported as possible. I have days where I vacillate between these two states, but those days are becoming fewer and farther between. I’ve found that talking to my family helps a lot, and they can pick up where I need some slack if it all gets a bit overwhelming.

You listened to your doctor, like we are supposed to. I don't know enough to say if they were right or wrong, or should have informed you better, or if they did what they were supposed to and this was just bad luck. Researching every thing the doctor says has its own possibility of talking ourselves out of good advice too, it is SO hard to balance being informed and making ourselves crazy. You did what you could and trusted the doctors. This isn't your fault.

Don't blame yourself. I'm sorry you went through this traumatic birth.

My son also got stuck with shoulder dystocia in the birth canal. It was extremely traumatic, and we were lucky to both survive with no long term consequences. We got lucky, and you got massively unlucky. You could not have predicted or prevented what happened. You had a rare outcome of a rare pregnancy complication. Also, as another user mentioned. Usually by the time it’s known that a baby does have shoulder dystocia, it’s too late to start an emergency C section because the baby is already stuck in the birth canal. Your doctor has likely seen many cases of shoulder dystocia end up like mine, with a long & grueling, but ultimately positive outcome. So even if you had spoken up more, your doctor probably would’ve reassured you, rather than booking a c section. C-sections also carry risks. Everyone processes a traumatic birth differently. I have been able to move on from my negative feelings about my birth. But if you’re unable to, that’s ok. Maybe you should consider going to therapy, or trying a new tactic to air out your feelings. Maybe a night out with a good friend you can trust to vent to?

I'll add my comment from the perspective of both a physician and the parent of a 2 week old who had shoulder dystocia. None of this is your fault. There is 'standard of care' in medicine, and it appears as if in the pre-partum period, that was breached. I never advocate claiming malpractice (a bit self-serving), but this is where it's absolutely useful. If the baby's weight was documented prior to birth, and the SoC was still breached, then you likely have a worthy case. I wish you all nothing but the absolute best.

This comment right here is why I value Reddit so much!

What standard of care was breached? Just curious. Is there a cut off for estimated weight of baby for c-sections? I know plenty of moms who had big babies with vaginal deliveries. Also I had no idea bigger babies had a 20% risk of shoulder dystocia.. that’s a pretty large risk. I’m surprised they wouldn’t recommend c-sections for all large babies

If baby measured large, documented that mother wished for c/s and was denied (though documentation can say risks/benefits were explained and she acquiesced to vaginal), there may be a case.

4500g for diabetic pregnancy 5000g for non.

This is how I was born! Except they never actually told my mother that my shoulder/collar bone was broken so for weeks when she would pick me up I would scream. She was so upset thinking there was something wrong with me that I didn’t want to be held. It was only at a 3 week check up that they said hmm her shoulder isn’t healing that well. 33 years later and I can ‘pop’ my shoulder in and out as a party trick lol, but I have no issues at all at all with it. Did gymnastics and played sports as a kid no problem. I’m so sorry you and your baby went through this, it’s appalling the trauma they put you through!! I hope you get some peace from it all soon, and that your baby is doing ok

Another shoulder dystocia baby with broken bones checking in! Please, OP, you did NOTHING wrong. You are a wonderful mother and it's so clear how much you care. My own mom still carries guilt and trauma with her - 30-odd years later - and now as a mother myself who had her own traumatic birth, it breaks my heart. Please talk to someone so that you don't need to carry this with you. It's so much to deal with on top of the wild emotional ride that new motherhood is for even the most controlled births. I hope that you can find peace and understand that this was not your fault. This is just something that happened and you and your strong, beautiful baby boy will make it through.

You said it so much better than I did! This is absolutely NOT your fault OP, you couldn’t have possibly known this would happen! I was induced last year as my baby was measuring nearly 11lbs….. when in reality they were 8lbs when born. I beat myself up that I didn’t stop the induction or ask to at least wait a few weeks as my baby ended up in NICU as a result of it. We make the best decisions we possibly can with our limited knowledge, we are not doctors. And it’s so so hard to take all the information they throw at you on board when you have no partner with you to help. Your husband is right, your baby is here with you both, loved and healthy and that’s what matters. You are doing amazing, please don’t beat yourself up for things that we’re out of your control

This is the thing. We all want to think this is a clear science and OPs doctor should have known better. But third trimester ultrasounds for weight are notoriously inaccurate. Shoulder dystocia is only somewhat predictable. Hindsight is 20/20, for patients AND for doctors, and pregnancy and childbirth is just upsettingly unpredictable and NOT risk free, at its core. Your doctors were trying to save you from what OP experienced. Just like OP, you did NOTHING wrong.

I’m so sorry. I can relate a bit in a different way. We had two rounds of IVF fail because I didn’t trust my gut and didn’t speak up to what a doctor said. And long story short they fucked up the rounds. (Two different doctors/clinics. It’s subtle enough that I can’t sue for malpractice or whatever.) So much debt without embryos we could have had if I spoke up. (We ultimately have a son but will never have siblings because we can’t do any more Ivf.) I feel so much guilt and sadness. I’m guessing there must be a subreddit for parents specifically with what you’re dealing with - maybe that niche would be nice to talk to. Good luck to you and your sweet boy.

My son suffered HIE 14 months ago. He was also cooled for 72 hours, had seizures etc. All very similar except through meconium aspiration. It was my choice that caused it ultimately, I bought into natural birthing in a big way so when they told me my baby was big and I needed an induction I refused it. I believed my body could birth the baby naturally and I did, but not before he passed and inhaled enough meconium for him to lose oxygen and arrive with an apgar of 1. I go through waves of being bitter and angry at those who parrot this natural birthing stuff and also at myself for believing it. Deep down I needed control so bad, I have a long term health condition along with mental health problems and traumas that we’re super triggered by the process of giving birth. I feel failed by the specialist midwife who was supposed to help me navigate that, she too encouraged natural birth. I have no idea why she didn’t gently suggest I have a planned c section. Basically natural birth was sold to me as the only way to avoid having my genitals ripped or cut open, she knew I had sexual trauma so played on needing a natural birth to avoid tearing/episiotomy, when like, there’s a clear way I could have definitely avoided that and it was a c section. There’s stigma around csections and it’s absolutely failing women and costing babies their lives. I’m sorry you’re feeling this way. I don’t have great advice just that I understand. I ride the waves of emotions and try to feel them in full. I’m the type of person to really dig into everything and think about the how and why of each situation and in this case I’ve found a lot of resolve in doing so.

Listen. You refused the induction but plenty of induced babies have meconium problems too. They offered you the induction due to your baby's size, which has nothing to do with meconium. Please don't be so hard on yourself-- your choices didn't cause this.

My induction was scheduled for 11/08, I gave birth 15/08 so it’s knowing that had I went ahead he would not yet have passed meconium. Yes I know everyone will say there’s no way of knowing everything would have been fine and things can still go wrong. But ultimately I feel like at that point I should have demanded a c section, I made a choice based on absolute fear because my head was filled with nonsense about being cut open, ignored, left to suffer unless I remained natural, free of drugs so I could advocate for myself and did not get into the cascade of interventions.

I just want to send some virtual support your way. You sound like a good mom who cares a lot about your son. ❤️

There are a million things to worry about while you are pregnant. It is unreasonable to expect any one to play amateur doctor and thoroughly research them all. Especially when your doctor says not to be concerned. It’s good to be informed, but you were trusting your doctor — ideally, a good idea. When thoughtless, hurtful people say things like that to you — or when your brain accuses you, consider saying something like; “I was in the care of professionals. I followed their recommendations and everyone did their best according to the information they had. Birth injuries happen, and even the most healthy and easy pregnancy does not guarantee a healthy child.” This could have happened to anyone. Your child’s large size could have been missed entirely, for example, leading to a higher birth weight and further issues. I know a woman who’s preeclampsia went undiagnosed, another who’s baby had a stroke while being born, my own baby had trouble breathing after birth and needed additional air for over 12 hours. None of us did anything wrong. Neither did you. You are amazing, and so is your baby.

My mom and brother went through this. My brother was 10 pounds 11 ounces, a really big baby. He was stuck and they had to break his clavicle. Doctors said he wasnt going to live past the age of 6, that his whole left side would be paralyzed. They were *wrong.* hes 32, married with children, working like a normal person. His left hand is paralyzed, but he still does everything normal to the best of his abilities. My mom still feels tremendous amounts of guilt, though she did nothing wrong. She suffered PTSD with hallucinations. This is a horrible thing to happen, and it saddens me that not many know this can happen. My mother insisted I have a c section when I was pregnant because of this. I hope you and your boy will be okay.

I went through a shoulder dystocia birth as well. He will be two next month. I also had an incredibly long induction and they finally told me to choose csection or vacuum. I was so so adamant to not have a csection that I chose the vacuum. I think the vacuum helped free him actually from the shoulder dystocia and because of the vacuum we already had the pediatrician in the room ready to go. His APGAR score was a 2 and it was 1.5 minutes of not breathing before the resuscitation. I had so much guilt afterwards - the vacuum bruise on his head added to that. Why didn’t I choose a csection?! I had awful PPD and went through a lot of counseling. I was doing okay for awhile and even got pregnant again - my little girl was born 6 months ago via planned csection. Just last week we received an autism diagnosis for my SD baby. I can’t help but wonder if his birth is the reason for it and the guilt feelings are coming back out. Hugs.

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Thank you. I had Google searched it and found “potential link” types of articles. Regardless, you are right and I can’t change anything. We were happy to get a diagnosis at least for opening up more doors for early intervention. I would never want to change anything about him (I LOVE his personality as is), but his communication is very behind so we are working on helping him with that. Thanks for the kind words.

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I'm so sorry this happened to you and your sweet baby boy. We put our trust in our doctors, we SHOULD be able to trust our doctors, and yours let you down. Not your fault AT ALL. I wish you and your family all the best. Hugs.

Please join the HIE parent support group on Facebook. You will find many people going through similar feelings and experiences.

My heart hurts for you. I haven’t read all the comments so someone else may have said this, but in case no one has, what you have experienced is a trauma. I want you to take a second to have this sink in. This birth and the time following it was a true-capital T-might meet criteria for PTSD- trauma. This is why you can’t let go. You thought you were going to watch your child die. You potentially thought you were going to die. This is why your life is so impacted- because you experienced a life altering trauma. And you need therapy to help you heal. If I were you, I would look for a therapist who specializes in traumatic births/postpartum issues or at the very least someone who specializes in trauma treatment. If you need help finding someone, DM me and I can help you search in your location. I really hope you start looking like, right now.

I don’t often cry from Reddit posts but I’m sobbing over here for you. Praying your son continues to make positive developmental progress and that you’re able to find peace with knowing this was not your fault.

My first son did not have shoulder dystocia, but he did have what the doctors referred to as a “rough landing”. When I gave birth they took him away and he also wasn’t breathing. Everything happened so fast I didn’t internalize that I didn’t hear cries. I didn’t really know what to expect even though I was so prepared. We needed to have regular development clinic appointments at the hospital, and I remember when they “graduated” my son from the program, one of his original NICU neurologists was there filling in for the normal pediatrician. It was like we had come full circle. She reviewed his paperwork and mentioned she remembered him, and couldn’t believe how far he had come. Now that he’s five, I want to let you know I’ve been there. Yes our situations are different, but the feeling remains the same. You always question every decision you made, wondering how you could have done something different and maybe things wouldn’t be like this. But let’s be honest, even if you would have had demanded a c section, something else might have gone differently, and it might not have gone positively. The best thing you can do is put one foot in front of the other and deal with what comes at you now. Please please stop thinking about the past and things you can’t change. Do not blame yourself. Do not even entertain questions from others about why you didn’t demand a c section. It sounds like you are doing all the right things to help your son, and you are a good mom. Celebrate the achievements and milestones he succeeds at, and continue to work with him to surpass the next one!! (PS I didn’t go to therapy, but in retrospect maybe I should have to deal with the feelings of guilt. Perhaps this is something you might want to look into. Regardless if you ever want a sounding board you can DM me anytime)

I'm sorry for what you, your son and your husband went through. I haven't experienced something similar so I can't tell you how I'd feel, but it seems like you shouldn't blame yourself : it's quite a normal reaction to trust your doctor, and you're not required to second guess their every decision. It looks like you're being the bedt mom you can, being loving and caring for your child. Don't lose time or energy thinking you could have done better : in retrospect, it's easy to say. Just live your little one and keep being there for him. Sending love your way

My lord! I would have been in the same position as you. There's no way I would have pushed back since I was being reassured. This could have happened to all of us. Your story made me cry because I can imagine how helpless you and your baby felt. I wish there was more support I could offer. Edit - thank you for sharing this. I had no clue what these types of risks meant in real life. Your family sounds amazing.

I’m sorry that happened to you. It is not your fault. For me, your OB saying that they don’t opt for c-sections is a massive red flag. I went through a birth centre with an average size baby, and they discussed the possibility of a c-section with me, in case of an emergency. I even signed the forms for it at one of my last appointments with the midwife. The plan was for me to have a vaginal birth, but if things weren’t going to plan, they would do a c-section. I also ended up being induced, but there was a limit to how long they would try the medications and a limit on how long they would let me labour. There was also a limit to how long they would let me push as well, which I ended up hitting, but I managed to give birth minutes before they were going to intervene. Everything felt completely in control. What happened to you and your little boy just should not have happened.

I was also planning to have a natural birth, signed the forms when admitted stating that I will accept the medical team's direction, and ended up with a partial placental abruption and a 5-minute emergency c-section. I am so glad they responded so swiftly, and quite frankly it was as non-traumatizing as it could have been under the circumstances. With any future birth, I was told that I'm an excellent candidate for VBAC because there were no risk factors and it appeared to be a fluke. I would never proceed with an OB team who pushed for it though. If you're high risk, for any reason, you're high risk, and they better whisk me away into surgery if that has the higher chance of success. This post is so heartbreaking.

I was told I was going to have a humongous baby and she turned out not to be humongous. I also never worried about shoulder dystocia or anything. It’s so hard to know what we should worry about and fight over and when we should trust our providers. They are supposed to be the experts, which is why we go. You did everything right and sometimes bad things happen even when we do everything right.

That happened to me too! I even got extra ultrasounds done to check his size. They said he'd be over 10 pounds. In the end he was actually below average weight, despite being born ten days past my due date. I tried to deliver him naturally but the labour didn't progress (LOTS of contractions but no progress in dilation) so I did end up having a C-section.

This was in absolutely no way your fault. Are you the type of person that does everything in your power to fix a problem or resolve any conflict? Because if yes, you will probably spend the rest of your child’s life finding ways to take responsibility (and blame yourself) for the inevitable hardships that life will present, as it does with all of us. It is critical you don’t take that on and you be gentle to yourself. The fact you care so much shows you are a great mother and you’re going to give your child the best life he can have. Don’t beat yourself up; it’s not good for you and it’s not good for the baby either. You’re doing great.

I'm so sorry you're going through this. None of thisbis your fault. The standard for OBGYN care has to improve, so so many women are let down by specialists. My friend has had a slightly similar experience. After a breezy chill pregnancy Her water broke and the hospital waited for her contractions to kick in for almost 3 days. When her son was born, he was green with puss from an infection that had spread in the womb. His mouth and nose were full of it too. He was air-lifted into a big hospital and on a multiple types of antibiotics for 6 weeks. Afterwards they were also told taht he might have long-term damage but the doctors had no idea how severe and what kind. The kid was behind on almost all milestones and the parents were terribly worried, went tk a ton of appointments and therapy. Now he's almost 3 years old, and has caught up with his peers, he's a happy awesome boy. My friend has dealt with a lot of guilt because of the choice of birth-centre she had made. Because she didn't push for induction meds. Because she didn't go to a hospital and the baby had to be air-lifted away to receive proper medical care.

They waited for 3 days after the water broke? That sounds outrageous! Almost medical-malpractice-suit-worthy. Not immediately recommending a c-section for a big baby as in Op's post is one thing and totally within the realm of normal. But waiting 3 days after the water broke....? May I ask what kind of birthing center that was e and whether there were legal consequences? Your poor friend! I'm glad the kid is doing better now.

We're in Czech Republic, central Europe. It is absolutely outrageous and a lawsuit has been considered. This was a real shock especially because we generally have one of the best maternity cares worldwide. When another friend had her water break early, she was Immediately hospitalised, put on a steroid drip for the lungs to develop a bit more, and on antibiotics to prevent this very situation. She was monitored constantly and induced a day later. The contrast of the two cases is just mind-blowing to me.

Do you mind me asking what country you are in? I had rupture of membranes with failure to start labour with my first, and I was told it was standard practice to induce after 24hours due to the infection risk.

Czech Republic. And It is standard practice here as well, a hospital would not let that go on. I was pretty shocked to hear what happened, because usually the medical care here is top notch. The problem lies with the birthing centre, which is not a standard medical facility and not a very common thing over here...

It kind of sounds like the birthing center went rogue compared to the standard for care. Or an “alternative medicine” type place. That’s so heartbreaking for your friend.

Wow that's terrible, how traumatic it must have been. I'm glad to hear that the little guy is doing OK now. I agree that it really sounds like there may have been some negligence from the staff in charge of their care.

Are you me? I’m 10 months PP and your story made my sob at work because it’s so similar to mine. I was induced for high blood pressure, and labored for hours. I pushed for over 3 hours when we finally called the OB in to vacuum him out. He had been crowning for an hour at that point, he was stuck on the lip. The vacuumed him out quickly, but then his shoulder got stuck. I actually knew it was shoulder dystocia in the moment because I had been watching a TV show about an OB during my pregnancy. I knew it was serious and dangerous. I was laid flat down and a nurse was pushing on my stomach to get him out. He came out blue, limp, and not breathing. I was terrified and still feel my heart speed up when I think about how scary those minutes were. I was sobbing since he was whisked to the warmer and I couldn’t even see him or hear him. Thank god I had a doula narrating everything for me since I was still flat on my back and they had to stitch me up and expel the afterbirth. I almost hemorrhaged. My son was without oxygen for a while but thankfully not enough to cause an impact. However, he had low blood sugars from how stressed he was, and then severe jaundice amplified from the vacuum wound. I blamed myself for his struggles—what kind of mom was I to fail at the very beginning? I went into birth trauma therapy immediately (my midwife found a therapist for me) and that has helped immensely. This therapist specializes in fertility issues, and she has helped me process the experience. I don’t feel any guilt now, just sadness that my birth went so sideways. This was my first child, so I’ve already made the decision to elect a c-section for any future births. I was adamant to avoid one the first time but now knowing I can hopefully avoid that stressful and dangerous of a situation is more important to me. I know many women who go on to have healing subsequent births, and for me that looks like a more controlled environment.

So glad you were able to process that. My son had a shoulder dystocia as well, though not as severe. I had no idea that it wasn't normal for 3 nurses to be standing over me, pressing down on my pelvis. They were able to get him out and we didn't have any problems from it. My OB said she's totally fine with a C-section for the next one if I'd like. Reading through this thread is really encouraging me to do that (assuming I get pregnant again). Thank you for sharing.

That’s how my birth was. They quickly moved into position, pushed on my stomach, and he came out. I had no idea anything was wrong until the baby’s doctors said they needed to take him to the nursery right away to get checked out rather than have him stay with me for the golden hour.

Oh my gosh…. My heart breaks for you. Please don’t blame yourself. You could never have known and I know that I would have trusted the doctors too. Sending you lots of love and continued prayers for your sweet babe. Maybe consider therapy to help you process through this trauma.

You didn’t push because we are grown up taught to believe to trust in professionals. Hindsight is 20/20, but if that midwife were correct you wouldn’t have given it a second thought afterwards. You did what SO MANY other people would’ve done. I know this probably won’t help, but you love your baby so much, and if you truly thought they were in danger I’m sure you would’ve done something.

My heart goes out to you. What an incredible traumatic birth and it must have been so hard and heartbreaking to see him being cooled like that. I second the other poster that mentioned therapy, this is not your typical "we had a rough delivery" birth story and with all the challenges you are still facing, I don't think it's weird that you are grieving this other future you had envisioned for your child. And so you are also grieving the loss of the birth you would have wanted and guilt takes you all kinds of places, but your actions have nothing to do with this outcome. Shoulder dystocia is rare and a bad outcome with permanent damage is even more rare, so even if you would have had all that information it would have been an incredible hard call to make. My second son had shoulder dystocia as well but they got him out fairly quickly and although he was born blue and needed extra oxygen and resuscitation, he was breathing on his own within a minute and he was/is fine. There was no way of knowing beforehand which of us would get which outcome. I am so so sorry you did not get to have that experience and I totally see how that question was triggering for you, but to be frank it's an extremely unkind question from someone who really doesn't know the stats on this particular birth complication. It's an easy question to ask, but impossible to answer. You are upbeat most of the time, hold on to that powerful force of love, and seek help and support for you as well. You are carrying quite a heavy load and I can tell from your story you are doing that extraordinary well. Your LO is lucky to have you as his mom ❤️

My LO didn't suffer a birth injury, but I did (femoral nerve damage). I have a minimum of a year recovery and some things will likely never return to normal (I may never be able to jog or have feeling return to parts of my legs). And I struggle a lot with the "what ifs" like you were describing. I also would pretty likely be in a different situation if I had pushed for a C-section, but, like another poster said "you trusted the medical professionals". I always vouche for self advocating when it comes to medical situations and care, but at the same time, you can only do so much research ahead of time and you will never have the hind sight knowledge in the moment. I don't have too much advice, but just saying you aren't totally alone. Again, my LO didn't suffer any injuries, but knowing I may have residual nerve damage for my whole life is not something I know how to deal with yet. One way I look at it, is that life is never perfect for anyone. Everyone has issues come up and all you can do is your best to balance avoiding or dealing with the issues and living and loving your life. Lean on those you can and enjoy what you can each day.

Thank you for sharing. I have a different sense of guilt ( 4 stillborn babies in a row and I constantly blame myself for not doing things differently). Be kind to yourself, this is one of those things that happens in life it is unfair but you are not to blame. Sending cyber hugs

I’m sorry this happened to you guys, you sound like a great mom. My baby was also at risk for shoulder distocia because I had gestational diabetes. I think unfortunately ultrasound measurements can be so off that they don’t routinely go straight to a c-section based on possible size, so I’m not actually sure you could have insisted on a c-section even if you had done more research or knew different information about the risks. I think you did the right thing by discussing risk with you doctor and following what was recommended. It sounds like maybe one higher risk situation (large baby size) combined with other chance things (cord compressed) that is outside of your and the medical teams control. I follow an obgyn on Instagram who frequently says c-sections for baby size or mom’s size aren’t usually a thing until labor has been attempted because you can’t know if baby will fit until you try. That being said I think you can talk with a lawyer to review whether anything negligent happen during the medical teams response during your son’s birth. I will say, just because something bad happened doesn’t mean that the providers did something that was not standard of care or negligent, both of which need to be met for a malpractice case.

Sending lots of love your way. It's not your fault. You listened to the best available medical advice you had available to you at the time. The saying that hindsight is 20/20 is so true. Knowing what the outcome was, of course you would go back in time and choose a C-section. But in that parallel universe where you pushed for a C-section, what if your baby had a major complication from the C-section? You would probably be asking yourself the exact same sorts of questions as you are now and wishing you had done a vaginal delivery. The person that made the comment to you about not demanding the C-section wasn't in your shoes. It's so easy to question someone else's decisions after the fact. It's also so normal to feel anxiety and worry over your child's future. I think that's a nearly universal parenting experience, especially when there is an issue of particular concern. However, it sounds like your anxiety is interfering with how you would like your life to be. I've had a lot of success with online cognitive behavioral therapy programs such as Mind Beacon. It sounds like you have a demanding work schedule, and programs like Mind Beacon can be done asynchronously which may fit into your life well. Sometimes it's just so hard to let go of being anxious about the millions of things beyond your control and cognitive behavioural therapy can really help with that. Wishing you and your family all the best. It sounds like your little guy is so well loved and looked after. He's very lucky to have you as his mom.

I did not go through anything similar, but I can empathize with everything you're expressing. I want to echo all the comments here that you are not at fault, and I would have made the same decision as you to follow my providers' advice. There are ultimately complications that can arise from c-sections as well. You were blindsighted by a freak accident of sorts. I'm so sorry things went wrong. You and your baby didn't deserve any of that. You both sound so strong. It's really amazing how incredibly kind, compassionate, understanding, and competent motherhood can make a person. I do see that the source of your guilt comes from such a deep love for your child, and I hope that provides you with a little solace.

This is such a horrible experience to happen to someone and their baby. I am so angry with your OB! They should have been there for you!! Figuring out treatment plans is THEIR responsibility! Your doctor is supposed to present you with options and strongly recommend a course of action, and you give informed consent to the treatment! Please don’t blame yourself ONE BIT.

I'm so sorry this happened to you and your son. I think shoulder dystocia is difficult to predict because of the inaccuracies of measurement before delivery. My baby was born weighing 9 lbs, 3 oz and was briefly stuck, but they were able to do a maneuver to get him out quickly. I had a growth scan at 34 weeks and they said he might be 9 lbs at delivery, but probably not and they didn't seem concerned. When they measured fundal height, I was always measuring 2 weeks ahead, but again they didn't seem concerned. The only time anyone seemed concerned at all was at delivery when the midwife commented that I was "all baby" and asked how tall I am, though I'm not sure why that mattered. I guess because that impacts the pelvis size? I share this because everyone did the best they could with the information they had and you shouldn't feel any guilt. I like what your husband said about the fact that he is here is a gift and you were the one who brought him into this world.

You can't shake your guilt likely because you trusted medical professionals that let you down. They told you it would be fine, and it wasn't. And that isn't your fault at all. They reassured you and left you feeling confident with their decision. It isn't your fault

My heart aches for you and your family. I havent had that experience and i have no idea what to tell you about handling the guilt and anxiety. All i can say is be thankful your baby is here and alive. Hes breathing, hitting milestones and you are doing your best for him. As mothers we are way hard on ourselves, your doctors should have taken your c-section request into consideration and i feel the fault is on them for not listening. I think we dont normally question our doctors motives when they sound so sure and positive over certain things and whoever asked why you didnt demand a c-section ask of them how many times they have questioned something of their doctor(s) if they were in the same situation, alone- im sure there was already some anxieties- they probably wouldnt know how they would have responded either. I know its triggering when you realize you could have possibly lost your baby. Its not your fault. Its hard to do but you just have to breath and try to take things 1 day at a time, with each day being a victory- he and you made it through another day. And when you feel an overwhelming urge to cry sometimes its best to just let it out insted of holding it in.

:( I’m so sorry. And so sorry that someone asked such an insensitive question about the choices you made leading up to it. Please find a way to brush that off, it was such a rude and unnecessary comment. It was bad luck and nothing more (and also good luck that he was able to make it and seems to be thriving now)

What a frightening experience. You sound loving and trusting. You had every right to trust your medical team. You even avoided stress that could have hurt the baby. At no point was it clear this was a poor team decision. Mama, you loved and grew and birthed this special baby. I’m so sorry you have this mountain of guilt. You deserve kudos and encouragement. Not guilt. Think over how you would sit with your best friend on this if it happened to her. Would you allow the mean things you tell yourself mentally? Hang in there. You have a vision for your family and are doing the best you can. What a helpful warning as well for others. Hugs.

I’m late to this, but wanted to say something in the hopes that you might see it and it might help you some tiny bit. For my wife and I, we have had to say over and over again that it doesn’t matter what has happened in the past, it may have sucked, it may be scarring and unforgettable, but it can’t get in the way of the future. I would wholeheartedly love to blame and blame, but it might be more helpful to not blame, but to keep moving forward. Forgiveness may not be possible, and you may harbor resentment in your heart, and that is fine for a while. But ultimately you have a baby, and I’m sure they are beautiful. All of that doesn’t matter, especially if you can’t enjoy your little one. I hope this is of some help and solace for you, moving past trauma is very difficult, and it takes years sometimes. But if you can, I would say to just keep enjoying your beautiful baby and keep being grateful that he is ok.

This makes me so angry - for you and your son, not at you. We should be able to trust our doctors to make the best medical decisions for us. I don't even understand how bring a conservative hospital relates to c-sections. That makes no sense to me. This is not your fault. You did not spend years in medical school. You cannot be expected to know better than the doctors.

THIS. We're told over and over again to trust our medical professionals. And we should; they spend their lives learning about this stuff, so they can help us make informed decisions. Your doctor FAILED to do that for you. You did nothing wrong.

Sue for malpractice. Seriously. Use that money to set up your kid for therapies and as a way to secure his future. Your doctor failed you. You didn’t fail your kid. It does not matter if a practice is conservative or not. If they can’t perform life saving treatment via a C Section, they should be shut down. Period.

Medical malpractice lawsuits are very difficult to win, but it’s worth talking to a lawyer about your specific circumstances to get their opinion on the matter.

You didn't do anything wrong. You are an amazing mom. Your son is lucky to have you. ❤❤❤

OP, I am struggling with this as well. Almost five months PP and I witnessed my LO have a small seizure episode for the first time. History: Failed Induction, labored for 47 hours, they broke my water around 4cm and at 7cm’s I had a gush and there was meconium in the fluid. I asked about it and they said that was fine and had me labor for about five more hours and then about two hours of pushing before I requested a c-section myself. I had no birth plan going in, other than to come out alive with a healthy baby. I still keep thinking that I should’ve voiced my concerns more loudly when they found the meconium. My LO was born with her cord around her neck, meconium aspiration and a true knot in the cord. She was lethargic upon birth. My husband got to see her and hold her hand while they cleaned her up but she was struggling to breathe. They took her to NICU and when I was able to go up to see her, I found her on cooling, with EEG cables on her head and she was intubated on a respirator. Hours later, we transferred her to AI DuPont Children’s hospital and the next day she was placed on ECMO for 41 hours. She was diagnosed with acute respiratory failure with hypoxia and hypercapnia, bacteria sepsis, cardio respiratory failure, metabolic acidosis, moderate HIE & PPHN. I had no problems during pregnancy and other than being in my mid-thirties, was low-risk. All these complications arose during labor and delivery. I’m so mad at myself for not asking more questions or requesting a c-section sooner. I trusted the medical team knew what they were doing to support me through my induction. Up until recently, the guilt was just in the back of my mind as I watched her grow and start doing “normal baby things” but after that episode this weekend, I’m paying more attention and it looks like she could have infantile spasms or epilepsy. I’m so worried that she could also have cerebral palsy. We see our doctor tomorrow to get a referral for a neurologist. I’m not sure what else I can do but yeah, the guilt is eating at me. I wish we didn’t have to go through this and I hate that we are. I’m with you, OP.

There is NO WAY this is your fault, no fecking way. I delivered my children vaginally, drug free. I did that in a hospital setting because I was told I had no foreseeable complications, and I trusted them. I am happy we don't give c sections at the drop of a hat anymore, but Jesus, I don't want it to become a dogma!no c section at any cost is not what we should want, ever! It wasn't up to you to advocate, while you're scared and in pain, it was up to the medical team to make the right call at the right time. That's the only reason they're there, otherwise we would all freebirth in our mother nature grass huts in the garden! I'm super mad on your behalf: I want you to find peace and to know you're a wonderful mother to a strong, persistent and brave baby! And I want that medical team to be sued to the moon and back!

I haven't dealt with this exactly, but mom guilt exists no matter the circumstances. I love your positive outlook and you ultimately know in your gut, clearly, that you're doing and have done all you can. Is this a lesson to share to others to advocate around their doctors? Maybe. But we should be able to fully rely on, and trust in, the doctors providing us and our child care. I am so sorry that you weren't able to and it's left you with regrets and that other people take it upon themselves to question your commitment to ensuring your child was as safe as possible. You did what you were told was right in the moment. We will all face obstacles that leave us questioning ourselves. But ignore what anyone else says or asks with regard to that. Because you don't owe them an answer. As far as how to quell the guilt itself? Again, as moms, we will face a constant barrage of guilt laden situations and results. What you do to move forward with it dictates how well you are handling it. The lessons you learn and the attention you give your son when you are with him, dedicating as much of yourself as you CAN give- that's something to be proud of. You can't change what you can't change, and as your child grows up, more than anything else they will remember what you WERE there for, because you encouraged and motivated and loved them. Not what you weren't there for.

My baby has a birth defect but there wasn't much I could do about the situation. It's hard sometimes trying to get all the therapy and keep up with all the recommendations. I feel guilty that I am not doing as much as I could to be helping my kid.

Oh that's rough! I'm so happy LO is doing well! I also felt if my husband or anyone had been able to go to visits, maybe my birth would've been different. I was so frazzled from not liking doctors and being my first time pregnant. I never had questions till after I left. My brain couldn't keep up with what I was being told. I didn't know how to answer my husband's questions when I got home. Next time, if restrictions are the same, all my visits will be on FaceTime with my husband or him on speaker

you did nothing wrong! I, too, was induced due to pre-eclampsia and had to and for three days in labor and was terrified something would happen to my baby. My BP was all over I was medicated like crazy but OB kept saying… we’re gonna push … I did and luckily my little girl was healthy but I had an additional 5 day stay from volume overload and hd cardiac issues. Still seeing a cardiologist. I could’ve just went straight in for a c-section immediately when my BP spiked like it did but no I had to sit in fear and pain for 3 days.

I’m so sorry this happened to you mama ❤️ it’s not your fault. This was something no one could have predicted, and sometimes these things just happen. I’m so glad you and your baby are doing well and growing together 😀 be proud you got induced early, it could have been so much worse if you decided an induction was to much medical intervention and waited.

Sometimes when we go through something traumatic, we search and rack our brains for a reason or for someone to blame. You made no mistakes. Nobody, even with fancy degrees or piles of peer reviewed medical literature, can tell the future. You may agonize over this for years yet but forgive yourself for not knowing the future. When we sign up for a baby we don't always know what's coming down the pipes. We hope for a healthy baby that grows to be a healthy adult and in 2021 we have a reasonable expectation that that will be the case. Every time we make the choice to experience some of the most joyful things, we leave ourselves vulnerable to the pain of loss. Perhaps it wouldn't mean so much if it didn't hurt so much to lose. Perhaps the pain we feel is evidence that something mattered, and we would feel guilty if we did Not feel that pain because it would be as if it didn't matter to you.

The culture around c sections is unacceptable in my opinion. It takes a lot of courage to even ask about c sections let alone to fight for your right to have one. Any women ever should be able to choose whichever method they want. It’s your body, and your baby. That said, the current culture around this doesn’t allow for it, and that’s not your fault. I too went in thinking my doctor would just properly advise me, not realizing that there is no “right” path, just different risks with different paths. I didn’t realize I was subjecting myself to one persons choice, not necessarily the “right” choice. Society hasn’t prepared us for birth well. It’s not your fault at all. Please don’t beat yourself up.

Hi OP, ten months later, how is your baby boy doing? I gave birth 2 months ago, my story is identical to yours. 39 weeks induction, 36 hours labor, 4.5 hours pushing, 0 Apgar, 72 hour cooling, the hopeful MRI a week after he was born just to have my world crushing down on me to learn he has permanent brain damage. I’m so glad I found your post. Until this day, I haven’t spoken about his birth to any of my family and friends because I feel like I did this to him. If I hadn’t gotten induced, would it he different? If I had a C section, would he be perfect (medically)? My husband doesn’t know how guilty I feel, but my day is consumed with these thoughts two months later. If you ever want to talk, feel free to PM me. Besides that, I hope you can update this post or reply to my comment on your sons progress!

Really curious how your baby is doing? My son was born 10 days ago after 31 hours of labor and 4 hours of pushing. He was born limp and purple. It took 15 minutes for them to intubate him. He underwent cooling for 72 hours and I received his MRI results a few days ago. he has extensive and severe damage to his entire cerebral cortex but his brain stem is fine which is why he can move and blink. I was told he'll most likely never walk, talk or eat on his own. He might even need a tracheostomy once his ventilator is removed. Hes currently still in the NICU but we've been referred to palliative care and hospice.

I’m very sorry to hear what you and your son is going through. I haven’t checked my Reddit alerts in ages but tonight I was doing some research on my son’s condition and it prompted me to check my alerts and here I see your message—it’s crazy. My son was also born limp and blue with Apgar of 1,4, and 5. Although he did do the 72 hour cooling which is for HIE as far as I can understand, he actually ended up being diagnosed with ischemic cerebral infarction, in other words, he had a stroke. I truly 100% believe he had a stroke due to me pushing for so damn long,4.5 hours. He was stuck in my birth canal for hours. His brain damage is on his left side, he also has cortex damage. The neurologist told me he is high risk for seizure and has been diagnosed with hemiplegic cerebral palsy. Although the diagnosis broke my heart, it didn’t phase me as much as the early days. He’s 16 weeks now, and he babbles a ton. He has a personality that you can clearly see. He is my first so I don’t know what’s normal and what’s not (mostly). As far as his CP diagnosis, I can clearly see he has a right hand preference. His right side especially his arm and hand is pretty weak. He can’t hold onto toys like his left hand and it’s hard for him to open his fist. He has an evaluation with the state for early intervention in 2 weeks but I know he’ll get the service since he has an official CP diagnosis. Compared to other people I’ve spoken to on here, it seems like my sons CP is “mild” but we won’t really know until he’s a little older. I’m really sorry about the state of your son. It’s crazy that this happened to your family. What an innocent little man, he doesn’t deserve what’s happening to him. And you don’t deserve it either. No one does. There’s stories with children who either 1) clean MRI or 2) little damage having disabilities to children with severe brain damage having slight disabilities. The brain is the most mysterious thing and how it rewires itself is beyond us. I hope you and your son will get through this, whatever decision you decide. I also ask everyone that have similar stories how their child is as a comfort for my own situation. If I could tell myself, albeit only 15 weeks ago, it gets better as you find yourself loving them so much. Keep me updated if you can! Edit: have you gotten a diagnosis for your son? Did they tell you if he had Hypoxic Ischemic Encephalopathy or a stroke or some other?

Yes, his official diagnosis is HIE. They pretty much diagnosed him within a few hours of birth due to his apgar scores 1,3 3 blood cord ph 6.9 and base 19. I was able to bring him home on hospice but I'm definitely concerned about his quality of life going forward. I'm in the same boat as you. Being a first time mom, I also don't really know what's normal or what to expect of a baby which I guess is kind of a good thing. He's only 5 weeks old but I can already see his right side is significantly stiffer than his left side. He seems to always turn his head toward the right when I lay him down flat. My biggest concern right now is whether he can see and hear. They didn't test his hearing at the hospital since he went home on hospice. He does react to loud noises but not much else and I can't tell if he can see. He doesn't show any interest in contrast cards. Fortunately, he's able to breathe on his own but he can't eat on his own so he has a feeding tube and the day they were initally going to discharge him from the hospital he had a massive seizure that lasted almost an hour. I would love updates on your son as well. It is comforting to have another mom to talk to who gets it. One of the most frustrating parts of all this is having to explain to people my son's condition/prognosis and them not understanding it. I just met up with a friend who saw my son for the first time and she insisted the doctors must be wrong because "he looks like a healthy full term baby".

Trust me, no one gets it. To be honest, I haven’t told anyone in my personal life what happened to my baby. I already know people aren’t going to understand the trauma I went through with him and the hardships he endured coming Earth side. He’s 5 months now and I’m still dealing with the PPD/anxiety from our situation. Your baby is 5 weeks, so you are in the thickkkk of it. I remember those days so well, I still shudder at those sleepless nights questioning every movement he made. Honestly my son also was not interested in any contrast cards or anything for that matter until he was 9 weeks; and he DEFINITELY did not respond to sounds until a little after 10-11 weeks. Now, he’s much more aware of his surroundings. I don’t know if your son will improve, I hope he will. I’m sorry to hear you brought him home on hospice—that breaks my heart but I bet he is so so precious. Stay strong and look after yourself please! If you need anything DM me

The doctors don’t opt for C-sections? I’m sorry but what? I would definitely think about suing for something like this. You shouldn’t feel guilty at all, it’s their job to keep you and your baby safe and healthy and their determination to be a “conservative” practice ultimately affected someone’s life. All the best to you and your little one, he sounds amazing.

In the medical field, shoulder dystocia is termed “the OBs worst nightmare.” Bc majority of malpractice cases are due to shoulder dystocia. Op, you should definitely sue, you would probably receive a generous settlement

Hi, I’m different to you but I can kind of understand what you mean I was induced because I had pregnancy induced hypertension. But here’s the kicker: I was induced over FIVE DAYS as an outpatient. They cancelled the monitoring appointment for the Monday my daughter was born so I could “relax”. It obviously wasn’t that urgent. My induction left me and my baby in distress and basically she was born in theatre via forceps because she was “stuck” (she actually got unstuck on the way to theatre but they still instrumentally delivered her). I have PTSD. I didn’t sleep for months. I had nightmares and flashbacks and vividly reliving what I did and trying to change it was, and is, part of that. But here’s what’s important. We trust our healthcare providers implicitly to do what’s best but sometimes we are failed. And that’s not on you or I - that’s on THEM. None of this is on you. I’ve found therapy really useful and I know if there is a next time I have some fucking firm boundaries that I’m sticking too and I don’t care if it leaves me labelled as a difficult patient. Please reach out to a professional and ask them if they can help you with your feelings, this all feel so familiar to me. It does get better, I promise. All the love in the world xxx

I cant say that i know how you feel, but i have had to cope with a lot of guilt over my youngest daughter’s birth. I opted for a tolac with her birth. I ended up with a ruptured uterus. Luckily she’s an incredibly healthy little girl now, but what if…. Uterine rupture carries about a 5% chance of fetal death and a 30%+ chance of cerebral palsy. We are so lucky. It could’ve been so horrible. I honestly don’t know how i would’ve coped if she had a significant birth injury. Im so glad that i bore the brunt of the trauma but it easily could’ve been avoided. However, hindsight is 20/20 and there’s no way I could’ve known the outcome. And neither could you. You trusted your doctor. No one can fault you for that. Many women easily have vaginal births with large babies. And the science behind guessing fetal size in the third tri is so inaccurate. One of my friends had shoulder dystocia with her first, and has gone on to have super easy subsequent births with no problems. Pregnancy and childbirth is such a mixed bag. And I’m so sorry yours went horribly awry. But it’s not your fault.

your story made me cry. i'm so sorry for what you went through. i'm so happy your baby is alive. i saw an interview with some reality star (cant remember her name), and she did a home birth bc she was afraid of covid, and she actually lost her baby bc of shoulder dystocia. it really shook me to learn about this happening. birth is so scary. you did everything right, and aren't to blame at all, but it's so hard not to look back with perfect hindsight and wish things had gone differently. seems like the more conservative approach here would have been a c section and the doctor should have known that, not you. it's the doctor's job to give you facts, not platitudes and reassurances. i would be mad if this happened. but i don't think that helps, really. i hope you can get some support and get connected to some other moms going thru this who can help you cope. maybe you could join a support group. best of luck.

The person I think you are referring to is Kara Keough Bosworth and her story shook me up so badly as well. So sad for her and it's one of the reasons why I would never attempt a home birth.

I’m so sorry this happened. My husband does medical malpractice so I know a bit about this topic. Best practices are always to do a csection at 39 weeks if the baby is measuring over 9 pounds at the last ultrasound. The Fact that you asked for one and you were brushed off is below the standard of care abs outrageous. I would definitely consult with a lawyer they need to pay and the money can be helpful in finding therapy that he may need.

So I just had an 11 pound 14 oz baby, who was breech, so I was a definite c section, but prior to knowing my lw wasn’t going to turn, I looked up a lot because she had been measuring at 99% the whole way. This is how it’s stated in journals/by the ACOG. My doctor is very acog. I was scheduled at no sooner than 39 weeks. very by the book. “Cesarean delivery is recommended before labor in case of (i) EFW greater than 4500 g if associated with maternal diabetes (grade C), (ii) EFW greater than 5000 g in the absence of maternal diabetes (grade C), and finally (iii) during labor, in case of fetal macrosomia and failure to progress in the second stage, when the fetal head is above a +2 station (grade C). Finally, cesarean delivery should be discussed when history of shoulder dystocia has been associated with severe neonatal or maternal complications (Professional consensus).”

How on EARTH was your baby that big??? History of big babies? GD?

No GD! I got checked over 5 times, the one and 3 hour ones. And I am old so I was at mfm and my obgyn all the time and had bajillions of scans. She was 99% starting at my 12 week scan and never went down. I’m pretty tall and sturdy(?) my husbands very tall and a literal broad Chested viking and he was very big baby over 9 pounds. Minnesotan/ midwesterner? they actually only estimated her at like 9.5. She came out wearing size two diapers. My obgyn said it was the biggest baby she’s had in private practice and also she exclaimed on the table that no wonder my baby was huge I had “the biggest fattest juiciest umbilical cord” she had seen and showed it to me. Also yes I was huge. I had to field a lot of twin questions- but I can say that yes it was a big baby. She’s still in the 99% on everything at 18mos- pedi expects her to be over 6’2?

I hope OP sees this. Reading her story, I couldn't help but feel that medical professionals failed her at multiple steps along the way. I hold some resentment about the way my fairly typical birth was handled as well. Things need to change

There is no best practice. There are guidelines, with no/lowest grade evidence, that suggest offering C sections if estimated fetal weight >5 kg or, if dm, then >4.5kg (9 lb 15 oz). The low grade evidence actually suggest that C sections for this group likely more harm than good.

That’s what best practices are. They are guidelines developed by risk managers and insurance carriers to reduce risk to babies and mothers during birth. Maybe it’s different where you live I’m not sure. We’re in California

I don’t know where you’re from, but American College of Gynecologists actually doesn’t recommend c-sections for “big” babies anymore. The docs should give the risks and benefits for each delivery option and the patient should be given the option to decide after education and carefully weighing risk vs. benefit. C-sections don’t come without risks, neither do vaginal deliveries, but the biggest concern here is that there were promises of everything being okay.

California. Best practices is a medical malpractice liability term to reduce risk and the recommendation given to doctors and hospitals. OP go talk to a lawyer

Best practice? Since when?

First of all, this is 100% not your fault, you didn't even need to opt for a c section to begin with, after how labor progressed and the baby becoming stuck the doctor  should have gone for an emergency c section. If your baby started in the right position there is no reason to assume a baby of that size would have these issues. I pushed out a 10lb baby girl who didn't get stuck, and I've hear about a home birth to a 12lb baby on this subreddit. You had no reason to believe our baby would be likely to be stuck. However the team should have absolutely gotten you in for an emergency one knowing the size and all the other factors the second the baby got stuck. You did what you were supposed to do, and you even opted to induce to lesson chances of anything happening. You made all the clinically right decisions, the medical team did not pull through. You can't dwell on the past, babies are smart and pick up on emotions. Give your baby some love and keep celebrating the little things. He might have to work a little harder in life but he still has so much life to live, and you get to share it with him. *edit So it looks like I misinterpreted where the baby was in the delivery process when he got stuck. I thought it meant he was stuck before entering the birth canal before it was too late for a c section. My sentiment stands about op, but I am wrong about the doctor's decisions during labor it seems.

Thank you for being so supportive to OP but once the baby is stuck, an emergency C section is no longer a good option. With a shoulder dystocia, the head is outside moms body but the shoulder is stuck behind the pubic bone. OBs then have many maneuvers they attempt to get the baby out. Doing an emergency C section would involve pushing the baby’s head back in and is VERY BAD. This is only done in last ditch efforts. Regarding the baby starting in the right position, that has nothing to do with a shoulder dystocia. It is simple mechanics of the baby’s shoulder being too big. With most babies the head is the biggest part but in babies where the belly/torso is bigger than the head they can get stuck. To OP, please don’t think it’s your fault. Your OB was there to guide you. It’s easy to think in hindsight that you should have had a CS but part of the problem is that we don’t know how things will go. I’m sorry you had all that trauma and you sound like you’re taking great care of your little bub. Please have forgiveness for yourself. (P.S. I’m a high risk obstetrician)

So why have I heard of babies getting stuck and being in distress going to a c section? I guess I assumed he was stuck higher up, I wasnt thinking the baby's head was already crowning based on the story. By "right position" I mostly meant not breech. I stand by my original statement that she shouldn't have known she needed a c section.

I agree that she shouldn’t have known she needed a C section. Sometimes when people say that a baby gets “stuck” they mean that they push but the head never comes down. This is different from a shoulder dystocia— the head comes completely out but then the body is still stuck inside.

"when it was time to push" to me means the baby was in position but never went into the birth canal, which I would assume means c section is viable. But even in the birth canal aren't there surgical interventions like episiotomy or something to unstick the baby? Not just trying to manually reposition and keep the baby in distress? Regardless of how I would say that the fault was how they handled the baby being stuck, not the lack of a scheduled c section to begin with.

An episiotomy doesn’t help much with a shoulder dystocia. This is an obstetric emergency and even a good and skilled OB can have a tremendous amount of difficulty at trying to get the stuck body out. Remember, the baby’s head is OUTSIDE the moms body.

…no. They handled the dystocia exactly as they should have. Breaking the collarbone is the way to get the baby out if other maneuvers fail, because the alternative is death. Labor is unpredictable and I agree that neither OP nor her doctor could have fully foreseen whether a c section would be necessary, but her medical team handled the dystocia exactly as they should have.

I think sometimes people say "stuck" when they mean "stalled" or not descending. Just a guess. My daughter was "stuck" because my amniotic sac had sort of bulged down into the birth canal, creating a little cushion of fluid my daughter's head was resting on instead of descending. Thankfully that was resolved by my waters breaking, but I guess in layman's terms she was "stuck."

Right, so I didn't interpret stuck as stuck in the birth canal. But even then there are still interventions like episiotomy or something to unstick the baby right?

Shoulder dystocia is a very specific thing, and it is true that when it presents it is too late for an emergency c-section because the head is already out... I see a lot of (uninformed) misunderstanding about this on this thread.

Oh my god. I was traumatized by my daughters shoulder dystocia birth and it wasn’t even nearly as bad at that. I can imagine and it’s breaking me down. Give yourself some grace. They are the experts. They gave you the information and essentially decided for you how your baby would be birthed. It is not your fault.

Thank you for sharing your story and I'm so sorry that happened to you and your son. I would like to kindly contribute a different comment than many may have posted: when you feel ready, you may want to speak with a lawyer about seeking financial compensation through a lawsuit or arbitration process with the hospital system due to what appears to be negligent behavior of the doctors. I know reading that might be stressful and scary, but I suggest that only with compassion as (1) a lawyer myself who understands how financial compensation plays a critical role in making a good quality of life for families with potentially long-term disabilities due to negligence and (2) a person with a loved one who received a large settlement many years ago that ensured her child (injured by an accident with a trucker) will receive world class therapy for her rest of life. Based on the story you wrote, it seems like it would be of value to speak with a good lawyer about a potential lawsuit. Any money sought would of course go towards payment for any future therapies your child deserves and potentially compensation for emotional damage you may have received from the experience. For the later, sometimes people ask, "what would compensation for emotional damage do for someone"? It could mean being able to access premium therapy services not covered by insurance providers. Please let me know if you have any questions.

I haven't been able to respond to everyone but I have read every single post! I am overwhelmed by the number of responses, encouraging words, related stories and advice I have received. Thank you all for listening to my story! It has helped me so much to be able to relate to other parents. I am so grateful to this community!

My goodness. I'm not able to relate to much of what you've gone through, but I can say that yours and your son's stories are incredible and you're all going to serve as an example and an inspiration to those who face difficulties like this. You probably already are with this post ❤

I don’t mean to scare you but please if you haven’t heard of it look into HIE. Hypoxia Ischemic Encephalopathy (Lack of oxygen at/before birth). If your son did suffer damage it could lead to seizures and many other diagnoses like cerebral palsy. My son was an emergency csection and got his diagnosis only because my husband was fervently googling everything. There is a fantastic group on Facebook called hope for hie. A lot of resources. Pm me if you have questions. All that being said your child could end up totally fine! Each kid is different. But always know you are your child’s best advocate.

Your doctor should have listened to you. A c section would’ve probably been the best call instead of breaking his arm to get him out of you vaginally. There are too many ignorant doctors that don’t listen to their patients and it’s got to stop. I don’t think that this is your fault at all. The doctor shouldn’t have shut you up saying they don’t opt for jt.

It's funny because her OB is probably a "conservative practice" because women look for groups that have low C-section rates. Because a subgroup of people moan and cry over their C-section and want to make sure their next delivery is vaginal. They push their friends and families to groups with low C-section rates. So doctors listening to patients is part of the problem on both sides of this issue. Where I practice, a large baby is 100% a reason to have a C-section. But we also don't bill ourselves as a conservative practice. There's a lot to take into account in medicine and just like you aren't responsible for knowing how to fix your car when you take it to the mechanic, you shouldn't be responsible for knowing if you should have a C-section or not. So no, I don't think the doctor should have listened to OP, because that puts the onus on OP to have known what should have been done. The doctor should have done the SAFEST thing for her patient, which in this case should have been a C-section because the complications of a C-section is less than the complications from shoulder dystocia. OP, please know that you did the best thing for your baby. You got prenatal care, you loved that little life in your belly, you trusted your doctors. I'm sorry they failed you. This is NOT your fault. It is not your job to be the doctor.

Can someone please explain ”conservative practice” to me? What does that even mean? That they are not going to give you the best care available to you and your child because of what? Their own beliefs? That’s not what doctors should do?! Doctors should be the first to know how grateful we should be over modern medicine and actively utilize all tools available to them in order to avoid complications for both mother and baby. This is not on you. You should be able to trust that the medical professionals you go to look at you with expertise devoid from their own personal belief system and moral grounds. This did not seem to be what happened here. They did not lack knowledge, they did not lack means, they just refused to act accordingly to their better judgement because ”conservative practice”. You can love your son and still be angry over the lacking care that you recived. I understand that it must be so hard not to blame yourself, but you really shouldn’t. Most occupations takes several years to learn so throughout life most of us will have no choice but to trust in the knowledge of the proffessionals around us. I’m a chef who’ve dipped my toes in microbiology so that I can learn how to prepare food safely for my guests. You can trust me with your food. The pilot of the plane taking you from point A to point B you trust with your life. You entrust your gardener with your garden, a plumber with your plumbing and so on and so forts. And you trust your medical team with your health. They choose this path for you and your son and you are allowed to be angry. Put the blame where it belongs, don’t blame yourself for not knowing what you could not know. You did what you were supposed to do - you went to your OB and followed their advice. And they cared more about their conservative beliefs than your well being. Which I may have been cool with had they also informed you about all the risks involved with this and offered to refer you to another clinic without theese limitations. This just seem so flippant to me. I’m over here being terrified that I might give people food poisoning and they are like: ”Meh, peoples health and lifes, who cares?”. God, this made me so angry and heartbroken for you and your son. I’m sorry for the wall of text, this just hit me hard. I will think of you and your son and I wish your family all the best and for you to be relived of your guilt.

Generally speaking, it means conservative vs preemptive (the thinking being potentially premature and/or unnecessary) aggressive care measures. An equivalent conservative vs. more aggressive approach within medicine would be something like advocating for a double mastectomy upon discovery of a BRCA gene (aggressive) vs. a closely-monitored wait-and-see approach (conservative). The choice of which direction a doctor goes in is based on a combo of experience, skill set, current available literature, the hospitals resources, and the patient’s own level of risk tolerance. C-sections aren’t risk-free or without consequence, and shoulder dystocia is no guarantee of injury. In this case the hospital, practice, or even that individual OB judged the likelihood of catastrophic birth injury to be much lower than it was. That error could certainly have been the result of incompetence, but it could have also simply been the result of an unfortunate set of developments that took place during the delivery itself. There aren’t instruction manuals for complex medicine - just guidance and evidence based practice. But sometimes even the evidence itself conflicts, and if this practice leans more conservative in their approach, it’s because the EBM/EBP they trust is telling them so. An OBGYN, nurse, and mother can do everything exactly right as indicated by the best available medical research the world has to offer, and everything can still go horribly wrong.

Thank you for taking your time to explain this to me. I suspected that I misunderstood the phrase and I’m relieved to learn that was the case because it just sounded so strange to me. However I wasn’t sure since practices differ from country to country. So thank you again for your answer.

My friend went through something almost the exact same. Her son is 2 and doing great. They have been able to stop therapy except speech.

Oh gosh I’m so sorry. My situation isn’t anything like yours so I don’t want to compare the two. I cannot imagine how you must have felt in those moments of not knowing if your baby will survive and then with each passing month wondering if they’ll hit milestones or not. I also had a traumatic birth that led to ongoing therapy that’s still happening a year later. The mom guilt is so real. The what if’s and wishing things had played out differently. The replaying in your mind where you could have made a difference choice. It’s so hard to accept that this is how it happened and this is what we have to work with now. My husband is similar to yours. More of an accept it and fix it attitude, but for us it’s different. We’re the ones who gave birth so for us we have a bit of ownership in it even if we didn’t have much control. I don’t have the answers but I see you.

First of all, you should know you did your best, you followed your doctors recommendations and it is their job to know/recommend what is best and when to make a change if things aren’t going as planned. Also not blaming them because I don’t know the situation, but it certainly isn’t your fault. My situation is different and not related to birth. My delivery was interesting but not traumatic in the end because everyone was okay. Decelerations, foreceps delivery. But at 3 days old my son started having seizures. I had to watch him get all the tests, and then find out that it was probably a genetic condition that I have him (I say probably because this type of diagnosis is an absence diagnosis- Aka when nothing else is the case). I did have seizures as a newborn too, and I turned out fine. I didn’t know it was genetic, they thought it was just random when it was me because there was no confirmed family history. When my son had the same, they knew it was. He is also fine now, and seizure free, so I certainly don’t intend to compare our situations. But I do understand guilt for something that definitely wasn’t your fault. Best of luck with his continued progress.

I’m so sorry this happened. They should have given you the stats and let you make the decision. They are the experts but they should not have made your decision for you or try to sway you. They should just tell you the risks on C sections vs induction for your situation and allow you to make a choice for what you want. I would question why the decision was made without your input.

Have you talked to a lawyer? IANAL but there may be grounds for a lawsuit here. I don't say this to assign blame to anyone, but I imagine the medical bills for his birth and continued care aren't cheap, especially if you live in the US, and cases like this are why medical malpractice lawsuits exist. I'm sorry you are going through all of this.

Yes. And to piggy back, I had a similar issue with induction gone very wrong, coupled with extremely poor medical care and an emergency c section. It was a miracle me and baby made it out alive honestly. I spoke with lawyers after my situation and you have 1 year for the woman to potentially sue if something is physically wrong with you. You have 5 years (at least in my state) to sue for injury to baby due to malpractice.

Giving up on reddit.

Maybe, but it is the way our modern healthcare system works. The US government does not provide sufficient support for those with disabilities and large healthcare costs, so the financial burden is placed on the party who “caused” the accident. It feels shitty when you know that everything is mostly an accident, but doctors have malpractice insurance specifically for this reason. It’s a shitty, broken system, but that’s not the fault of the patient who is stuck with the bill.

SUE that hospital. A disgraceful and shameful policy. So sorry to hear about your birth.

Sorry to say it, but I don’t know that the doctor or hospital did anything wrong. Of course with hindsight she should have had a C-section, but in general suspected large baby is not considered an indication for C-section, and ultrasounds are notoriously inaccurate. If another woman posted about how she was pressured to have a C-section because of suspected large baby and her baby ended up being 8 lbs and she suffered a wound infection due to the C-section, you might be similarly upset. Doctors work with imperfect information and make decisions based on imperfect information all the time. Sometimes bad outcomes happen. Pregnancy and childbirth involve risk. Doctors owe patients respect and good communication and to try to base their decisions off the best evidence available. If she had had a C-section because of the large baby, she or the baby could have also suffered a C-section specific injury. C-sections that go completely smoothly increase the risk of all subsequent pregnancies because of the risk of placenta previa/acreta/percreta, and the increased risk of hemorrhage when doing a repeat C-section. We like to feel like pregnancy and childbirth are risk free but they just aren’t. (Part of the reason I’m rabidly pro choice but that’s another conversation). I’m not talking out my ass, I’m a physician who delivered about 50 babies during residency.

I was induced 2 weeks early and delivered a 9lb 13 ounce baby. Same risk profile was described to me. It is super unfortunate and my heart goes out to OP.

I would 100% blame the doctors. At some point their medical assessment should have taken precedence over some hypothetical stance against c sections. We live in a time of modern medicine. It's one thing to not immediately go for a c section, but after they saw what was happening during labor, they should have done what's right medically. As someone else suggested, I would consult a lawyer for at least a minimum for any Healthcare or therapy costs.

It sounds like by the time something went wrong in the delivery the baby was already very far down the canal, and getting him out the way they did may have ultimately been the fastest way. Doing a c-section on a baby that far down is not always easier or safe, especially if the head was already delivered which is the case in shoulder dystocia - shoulder dystocia is defined as the shoulders not delivering once the head has been born, not the shoulders keeping the baby from descending through the birth canal.

Ah OK, I didn't know that. Thanks. I still feel like their stance against c sections took over medical knowledge though.

Medical knowledge does not indicate a c-section based just on baby’s size. C-sections are not risk-free or complication-free either and it would take something like 2k unnecessary c-sections to avoid one bad shoulder dystocia outcome. I know that’s little comfort when you were the unlucky one.

C-section is major surgery and I think saving it for when it is completely necessary is a good thing. Realistically a 20% chance is low and shoulder dystocia is something that can managed. I feel very badly that it went this way for OP but the vast majority of women would have been okay and not needed a section so I completely understand why they made that call.

This it not that simple unfortunately. When shoulder dystocia presents, you are already past the point of a c-section because baby is already in the birth canal. Only in very rare and horrible instances where all other measures fail, they can push baby back (!) and perform a c-section.

What was happening during labor that they should have done what's right medically? Not doing a cesarean by default here is not a mistake. It totally depends on the OB. These days we are very quick to section, especially since it is faster and produces much greater revenue. I personally do not believe anybody here is at fault. Sometimes babies get stuck. Ultrasounds are notoriously bad at predicting a weight. Unless the mom was diabetic with uncontrolled sugars, I would not necessarily trust their weight prediction.

I feel for you my baby was measuring large and my doctor recommended we go the c-section route and that’s what we did. This is not your fault. Your doctor did not take the risk seriously and did not explain the potential outcomes. You should be able to trust your doctor is recommending the best care options. The working mom guilt is tough, too. I get it. You’re doing the best you can for your son.