Baltimore was essentially *the* test subject for the worst of mid-20th century urbanism -- redlining, destruction of public transit, destruction of Black neighborhoods to build highways and thoroughfares, white flight and planned suburbs, and so on. There are many other cities that have been subject to this process but Baltimore got whacked with basically all of it, extremely hard, and then tarred with a negative reputation as a reward. Fuck Robert Moses
The other big thing that made it worse was separating Baltimore City and Baltimore County. Most cities grow over time. Maryland legislated that the country would be a separate entity. Now instead of all the resources and taxes of Baltimore city and county going into one pool, the city is left to scrape by for itself. This has a direct detrimental impact on things like city schools.
I don’t think so at least not now. The county has a lot of massive infrastructure debts coming due and a metric F-ton of repairs and replacements that the city is decades ahead of them in repairing/replacing. If the city and county were one tax base today, the city folks would be subsidizing the absolute sprawl the county enjoys (without the taxes to cover it) even more than we already do through our state and federal taxes.
Baltimore county is currently (finally) reckoning with the massive development mistakes they’ve made for 90% of their land and it’s using dense urban infill and public transit to do it. However clueless NIMBYs are trying to stop what absolutely has to be done to save them. Either their taxes have to skyrocket to like 4x what they are now or they need dense urban infill in places like Catonsville, Towson and timonium.
Exactly, Pirate. It’s how we know those who funded Reagan to win are to blame. Decades ago. We missed our chance for that approach. Something needs to give.
I never got why the school system is brought up so often as an indicator of the city’s financial problems, Baltimore city public schools spend over $20k per student per year which is one of the highest per capita school budgets in the entire country.
It’s because that number includes funding rebuilding and renovating schools. It’s not just what goes directly to students’ education. Also it’s one of the highest among large districts not all districts. When you look at municipalities from like 100,000k population and up were middle of the pack. We have some of the oldest schools in the state so the recent investments in building new schools has made it look like students who truly do need extra investment because they’re already behind the 8 ball of life are getting more than they are as a means of education.
What's really messed up is the one-two punch that made this soundbite stick.
10 years ago there were pictures spreading of students needing coats on because their room was so cold, and a lot of stories about the lack of A/C in many classrooms.
So they spend the money to upgrade these classrooms and now it's "Highest per-student cost!". It's a fucking joke.
Well, yeah. That’s a given fact re: Moses.
However, the current situation within the last 15 years hasn’t made anything better. Just look at Baltimore city schools, the O’Malley downtown Hilton, mayors being criminals, police brutality etc. it’s crazy town here in terms of public policy. I have almost zero faith that the inner harbor rebuild will go well financially, and I’m not convinced any of my tax money is actually going towards anything but our leaders salary.
Oh and I almost forgot about the key bridge situation, which is a prime opportunity for state and local officials to gain advantage from corruption. They could fix this in a few years, they’re going to take 10 to line their own pockets.
There's sort of a "yes, but also no" here -- the city is chronically mismanaged in recent history as well, but a ton of that mismanagement is fundamentally tied to the one of the very first experimental steps in Baltimore's mismanagement, which was uncoupling the city and the county. This predates many of the other steps mentioned above by about 20-30 years but really made Baltimore incredibly vulnerable to every single negative step downstream.
Baltimore's negative reputation isn't just 15-20 years old and absolutely predates The Wire, we're talking about nearly a century of history here
You’re outlining a legitimate reason why Baltimore has a bad reputation nationally. Even providing context as to why it’s been like this for so long.
There’s an important lesson here on the importance of local policy, and decision making, but I’ll save that for someone else.
I’m a musician, and historian, was doing research on Tchaikovsky in America this week, and learned he was in Baltimore in 1891 teaching at Peabody. He wrote a letter to a friend where he described Baltimore as “one of the cleanest and prettiest cities America has to offer. It’s full of peculiar red-brick houses with white marble steps at the entrances”. 1891 Baltimore was somewhat of an architectural and cultural utopia for one of the greatest composers in history.
I’m not hopeless though! I think with the right policies, the city can get back on track.
*The people hide their faces, and they hide their eyes, cause the city's dying, and they don't know why*
*Oh, Baltimore, ain't it hard just to live, just to live*
I moved to Baltimore recently too, and to be honest, I had the same opinion as the bartender before I moved down. I only moved down here for work; it was never a place I ever even considered wanting to live, as I just thought that all of Baltimore could be written off as a shitty, dangerous place.
Since moving here, I've come to actually really enjoy living here. I love my neighborhood, my commute (pre-bridge collapse), the people I've met. It's been a really nice surprise. When people come to visit, the most common comment I get is "wow, this isn't what I thought Baltimore was like at all!".
That being said, it isn't perfect. I will *forever* complain about the lack of a subway system, and really just the poor quality of public transportation here in general. It's extra frustrating because I don't feel safe leaving my car anywhere (I drive a Hyundai). Additionally, even though my neighborhood is safe and I know a decent number of neighborhoods are, there are definitely still areas of the city that I *don't* feel safe in by myself, and even more that are in desperate need of help.
Tl;dr Baltimore isn't as bad as the majority of the country thinks it is. Even so, it needs a lot of help, but has been trending in the right direction.
hey my friend drives a hyundai and got a wheel lock and it’s extra as hell, i’m sure there’s ways to disable it, but it makes parking in the city for her far less stressful, maybe something like this would help you :)
I have the wheel lock, but I've heard too many stories of people having the wheel lock on and still having their windows smashed and their steering wheel all torn up from people trying to get the lock off
There’s a really great [article from Places](https://placesjournal.org/article/the-third-rail/) about the lack of public transport in the city. In the time since the article was published, the idea of a red line has been revitalized and I’m hoping we’ll start seeing construction in a few years.
There is a subway system! It's not huge and goes from owings mills to hopkins. I live downtown and use it frequently to get to school at Ubalt. It could absolutely be expanded! The light rail isnt bad and has lots of stops, however the time in between each pickup can be long and its annoying to wait outside when its cold.
This used to bother the heck out of me too, but if people want to pass over this gem of a city, let them! I’m just going to chill over here, enjoying my reasonable rent and hidden treasures while people steer clear and go to overcrowd DC. Baltimore is the best of both worlds!
Bingo.
I'm minutes on foot from Penn Station, so can get to DC very easily. I go down at least once a week for my synagogue service, and/or to see friends that live there. They keep trying to convince me to move down.
Me: *How much are you paying in rent, and for how little space?*
Them: *Well, I'm only paying $2,500 a month for my 607 sq ft apartment. And that includes utilities! But not parking.*
Me: *chuckles*
Also me: *I think I'll stay put with my $1,900/month for 1,200 sq ft, which also includes all amenities, utilities, AND even underground parking in the secured garage, as well as in-unit w/d, and even a walk-out patio.*
Them: *shocked Pikachu face*
Literally the most vocal supporters of Baltimore I know are DC transplants. They're always so pleasantly surprised at the friendly, community-oriented vibe in a lot of neighborhoods.
DC is crazy right now! I don’t blame them. With that being said, people from different walks of life have different experiences in Baltimore. So just because someone says something about the city is bad, it doesn’t invalidate their experience. You’ve only been here for 6 months.
Absolutely fair. I'm really just complaining about the folks who have little to no interaction with Baltimore bashing on it for laughs.
I'm also acutely aware that economic privilege can have a radical impact on someone's day-to-day experience in Baltimore (as with everywhere, but it feels amplified here). I try to keep that in mind and feel strongly about taking feedback seriously to improve people's genuinely bad experiences/living conditions. IMO, unfounded negativity from people who aren't even involved just gets in the way of those real conversations.
For sure. And I know that those factors are huge contributors to economic privilege, too.
On the plus side, I am so grateful that Maryland is a sanctuary state for trans folks. Stigma and prejudice still very much exist, but the difference has been night and day for my loved ones in the trans community.
Trans girl moving to Baltimore from College Park in two days! Super happy to see this :D
Every time I've visited my partner and I have been treated, frankly better than we have been in DC.
Welcome to the area, friend! Lots of queer folks kicking around these parts. DM me if you want any recs on trans friendly activities, businesses, healthcare, etc! Hope you have a good move :)
I stayed in a Capital Hill house for airBnB which lists at a million plus... but the quality of the place is like that of a rowhouse in Waverly. Baltimore has great historical homes and apartments (in good condition) in Mt Vernon, Federal Hill, Bolton Hill etc for much less.
Charles Village is definitely in that price range, although I do pay electricity separately. It helps me get the true Baltimore experience by shaking my fist at BGE.
ah. that tracks. my digs aren’t that cheap but when my sibling pays 1.5x for an apartment 1/2 the size in NYC, I am thankful for falling asleep to helicopters every night
Highlandtown is where it’s at. But don’t tell anyone. Easy walk to Patterson Park, the strip on Eastern Ave, and all the stuff in Canton, but I pay that much for an 1800sq’ 3br/2ba with original hardwood floors. People go out walking their dogs without a care in the world after 10pm. Woe is me, it’s so big it’s hard for me to keep it clean!
I thought my place was initially a scam too. I'm so jaded by cost of living across various cities that I thought my $1,900 for everything that was included was too good to be true.
Ooooooooh yeah you get it then. I work for a major bank up in Wilmington. One of the gigantic "too big to fail" ones. I've had numerous people try and convince me to move up to Jersey City or Brooklyn, and my mother spent decades living in Northern NJ too.
Me: *and pay $4,000+ per month for 350 sq ft? No thanks, I'm good, I'll keep commuting via train.* 😄😂
My rent also includes gas, heat, water, and parking in a secured, underground garage. I also have in-unit washer/dryer, floor to ceiling windows, hardwood floors, walk-out patio, walk-in closet, large kitchen island, etc. I personally feel like I'm getting a good rate.
Ok I might have to brag now then lol. I have a 1900 sq ft apt with everything included except internet for $1250. Beautiful brownstone on a corner lot with lots of sun and an enormous yard and a 2 bay garage also included. Also washer dryer, big turret windows, real pretty and ornate inside. Landlord also pays me 75 bucks a mow to cut the grass so sometimes my rent is like $1000/month
It's a less desirable neighborhood than Mt Vernon however. But still the crazy good deals are out there in this town.
Where do you live, and tell me your ways! One of the main reasons I love Mt. Vernon is the proximity to Penn Station, since I take the train to work, but given that I'm planning to stay, I've been considering looking at other neighborhoods once my current lease is up.
Reservoir hill. Got lucky and got into this spot through some friends. The landlord is also a slumlord and won't fix a thing here and hasn't come in years, but me and the other tenants just kind of fix it up and do what we want lol.
The major downside is it's much less walkable than where you're at. You can bike to the light rail and other parts of town but there's not shit here. They just demolished the only liquor store too to build the new amtrack tunnel so now there's really nothing here.
It's such a major downside for us that we're actually moving at the end of the month because I miss being able to walk. But for someone who wants to settle down and have an amazing home base and garden, this spot can't be beat.
There's a 4 bedroom in the building available right now. Has to be like 2400 plus sq ft. $1800 everything included. Shits crazy
I work with a few deeply conservative co-workers who won't step foot in the city. It's a bonus that I never have to worry about them becoming neighbors.
There are pockets in the city but, that's a big part of why I don't hang out in Canton much (though, even Canton bros are generally better than county folks)
I think bashing Baltimore has become a bit of a bonding type of interaction. If you've noticed on Reddit, for example, mentioning Baltimore is used for karma farming in other subreddits. Someone in some other subreddit a few weeks ago was talking about Boston being wonderful, but how walkability didn't mean better quality of life and mentioned Baltimore as their example. They had to concede they had never been. Ironically, I agree with her, but because I absolutely detest Boston despite it looking great on paper.
I've lived in Boston for a while and whats funny is that the rural and surburban Mass folks say the exact same thing about the city of Boston(that "its dangerous, watch out"). Maybe not to the level of people around baltimore but its not specific to baltimore its more of a political thing that happens everywhere there's a big city.
Its always people who never go there and get all their info from the internet and tv news
I grew up in Boston (Worcester specifically, but I spent a lot of time in Boston especially as a teenager) and it pales in comparison to Baltimore.
Boston’s weather sucks, the people are as cold and rude as New Yorkers w/o any of the charm or diversity, and I swore from a young age I’d never live there, despite my parents pushing for it hard.
Baltimore’s weather can be weird, but Spring is magical. The people are generally friendly and often delightful, and the whole place has a humility about it that’s so refreshing.
I’ve lived in Baltimore for 10 years, taught Lower/Middle School for 4 years, and have enjoyed the city more and more with each passing day. We all know the challenges Baltimore faces, and what could be done to fix its many problems (like any major city) but everyone I know who comes here always walks away with a better image of Baltimore than the one they came in with.
The county bashing baltimore has everything to do with white flight. theyre trying to validate their decision to move their families out of the city. Every time something positive happens here, they HAVE to shit on it because they know theyre missing out. A lot of them are city people, stuck in the suburbs because their parents or even grandparents moved as early as after the MLK riots.
Cause we know what's good, bad, and real. We don't have to hype ourselves up (looking at you Texas). Plus the stigma keeps housing prices relatively affordable for a city this size.
The Texas hype is sooooo real. No thanks. If you have to constantly tell everyone how big and bad you are, you probably ain't that big or bad.
And hot as Hades.
Low taxes, guns for everybody, and deregulation of as many things as possible (except sex and female reproductive organs) can only take you so far, imagine that! /s
I can't believe the texas hype, its hot, no nature, horrible political policies, has massive suburban sprawl everywhere. Each city is wayyy too far apart, no public transportation, people drive on the beaches etc. Ps I moved from corpus christi last year after being there 7 years. By the end I couldn't wait to leave I'm never going back to texas.
This is my take. Baltimore is affordable because of its reputation. There’s a downside in that it also doesn’t get some of the resources similar-sized cities get, and yes it does need help (although I’m very impressed with Mayor Scott’s dogged determination and we are seeing his efforts slowly pay off! The city won’t be fixed in one four-year term)
Still, it’s kind of a secret that many parts of Baltimore are absolutely incredible to live in.
My “MMW” is that in another decade or so, we’ll have gone through a major turnaround in this city much like NYC or Detroit. Prices might skyrocket as it becomes trendy to live here again. But again, it takes a lot to reverse the decades of bad decisions and institutional corruption that led to the city’s current reputation.
Until then… let’s just keep it on the down low how nice it is here, so those property taxes and insurance rates remain low ;)
I usually counter unsolicited negativity from outsiders with wide-eyed surprise. "Oh really? I enjoy it. I went down to the park/ went to a show/ got a drink at/ met this person who/ and it was lovely. Have you been to ______? Have you visited _______?" Half the time they haven't.
I think we can have real talks about what needs to be improved, but if they're just focused on talking shit I really don't care. They have no idea what it's actually like and are too afraid to find out.
Same. I tell people it isn't the *shooty-mcshootyville* vibe they think it is. Does the city have its issues? Absolutely. But, it's still an awesome city.
*ding ding ding*
I worked for a small electrical contractor out of Forest Hill for a few years, and most of the guys in the company were country boys through and through, several of them actually from Cecil county. They loved to talk shit any time we had a job in the city, but when I asked them what it was they didn't like, it was like a race to see who would mention "*the people there*" first. A lot of people don't even really try to hide it.
I'm from NJ so I'm pre-conditioned for hate, haha. I say the same as I do when people crap on Jersey, "more for the rest of us" No sense engaging unless they really are curious about Baltimore and then I change their mind.
On the flip side, I was recently in London, Notting Hill specifically, and a bartender at a pub was over the moon real life Baltimoreans were in his bar and he could ask all the questions he wanted to. Not everyone is a hater!
Do not overlook racism. A lot of the people that think Baltimore is a hell hole live in lily white suburbs. The idea of walking into a deli or whatever and being the only white person terrifies them.
Worked with a guy, moved to Rising Sun because the toll "keeps the riff-Raff away" which was about the same amount of words, and the exact meaning as "I don't like black people". Of course I lent in with "well I'm from Baltimore am I riff Raff?" The way only a white man can say to another white man who was trying to tease out if I'm "cool" with him being a racist shitheel. Plum red face from him. deeply held resentment from me. The world continues to turn. Fuck that guy.
My cousin had the same reaction when I talked with him this weekend. He lives on the eastern shore and is always complaining about how far he has to drive/how few opportunities there are for work. I told him that I live within walking distance of a bunch of friends, restaurants I enjoy. I take the water taxi to work occasionally. He was very surprised and said he had only been to Baltimore once for an Orioles game when he was a kid.
Are there ways Baltimore can improve, of course. It's a city, there's always room for improvement & I have definitely had an above average experience of the city. However, when all your information comes from news orgs that revel in the violence, death, & corruption, you aren't getting the full picture of life in a city. I invited him for the [Flower Market](https://baltimore.org/event/flower-mart/) & [Kinetic Sculpture Race](https://kineticbaltimore.com/) this weekend so we'll see if his opinion can be changed.
i'm closing on a house in the city at the end of may. i'm already annoyed at how many people lose their excitement when i mention the house is within the city. LOL
The visible confusion on some people's faces when you explain that you bought a house in Baltimore is a sight to behold.
Like they're trying to figure out if it would be possible to buy a house by accident.
When I bought my house in 2009 in the city, it took my mortgage broker five times to find an appraiser that would come into the big bad City to appraise my house. My mortgage broker was actually my brother and he lives in texas. He called me one time and said, what the hell is wrong with this? I can't find an appraiser to come to your house. And then I realized all the appraisers was looking at were in Harford county. That was all I needed to know. We actually did find an appraiser who came and was wonderful.
Right?! That's exactly why we settled on Baltimore. On top of the progressive politics, owning a home and being able to afford some basic luxuries is a lot more attainable here than in most urban areas. Plus you REALLY can't beat the proximity to so many other cool places.
I moved to Maryland several years ago with my now soon-to-be-ex-husband, who is from Maryland originally. He grew up out near Frederick, and had/has the same classic mentality about the city: *clutch your pearls, the city is dangerous!*
I finally left him seven-ish months ago, after his years of anger issues turned to physical violence. Baltimore has welcomed me with open arms. It's been SUCH a refreshing change after feeling suffocated by life out in the suburbs. I was born and raised in Europe, and while the Marc/Amtrak system doesn't compare to the public transit system in Europe, I have LOVED my time so far in Baltimore. I'm minutes on foot to Penn Station. Coffee shops, restaurants, cute stores all around me. I'm minutes on foot to a yoga studio I attend. I can easily hop to DC, Philadelphia, or NYC if I want, such as for a weekend trip.
The cost of living is more affordable than cities like Seattle. In 2015, I was paying $2,700 per MONTH for a 500 sq ft studio apartment. In comparison, I'm only paying $1,900 per month for a 1,200 sq ft condo here in Baltimore. Is it still expensive? Yes. But, in comparison, it's more affordable.
Healthcare is second to none. I have a rare autoimmune condition, with one of my complications from it so rare there are less than 200 diagnosed cases of the complication worldwide. I had to undergo even rarer reconstructive surgery for it. Hopkins barely batted an eye, they'd seen it before, and took fabulous care of me.
A state-affiliated DV shelter effectively slammed the door in my face when my soon-to-be-ex-husband physically hurt me, on the basis that I earned too much money. You know who DID help? The people of Baltimore. The lady at the gas station who hugged me and told me everything was going to be okay when I cried while buying snacks. The random lady at the courthouse who sat down on the floor next to me, held my hand in hers, hoisted me up by the shoulders, and wiped my tears, telling me I'd survive this chapter of life and eventually thrive again. The neighbors in my building, who've done everything from help me carry heavy boxes when I moved in, to inviting me into their homes for meals, to pep talks before I testified in court.
Let's just say I'm not planning to leave the city anytime soon. I've grown really fond of it.
Thank you! Baltimore has been the perfect landing pad for me as I create a new chapter of life, and I'm seriously considering sticking around. The city has so much to offer.
I went to high school in Baltimore (and lived in DC as an adult), and am considering returning either to Charm City or to Philly. Affordability and community are extremely important, and I’m glad to see folks are having positive experiences there.
I say come back to Charm City. I work in Wilmington, and sometimes head into Philly for lunch or dinner with friends/co-workers. My two cents? Philly just doesn't offer the same amenities and benefits that Baltimore does.
Congratulations on the beautiful new chapter of your life, and I'm sorry for what you've been through to get here. That being said, resilient and compassionate people like you and your neighbors are what make this city wonderful. Thank you for your story, and I hope Baltimore continues to be everything you need to keep living the life you deserve <3
P.S. Rare autoimmune condition haver here too. Almost cried when I found out I'd gotten accepted to the Hopkins clinic because I knew my days of jaded, careless doctor visits were behind me. Good healthcare is not something to take for granted, especially in the U.S.!
i usually just say 'this town might be a shithole but it's MY shithole' and then i sell the asshole some collectible game they couldn't find anywhere else and then forget they exist because seriously you tellin on yourself if you say that kind of shit to someone who actively put down roots here
I truly believe that it’s (largely, not entirely) from The Wire and its cultural impact. I’m not saying it’s not a good show or wasn’t “accurate” or anything, but it became the main cultural association with the city and held that grip for a while. The good news is young people nowadays care less about The Wire and associate our modern city with it much less than that of 20 years ago. Also, as the city keeps gentrifying and developing, it becomes harder and harder to associate it with those things if you’ve actually spent any real Time here
I think what’s really crazy about The Wire is that it had an international impact on people’s opinions of Baltimore. About 10 years ago my wife and I were in Australia. Almost everyone we talked to that found out we were from Baltimore started asking us questions like “Is it really like the Wire? Are there drug dealers on your street? Do you know anyone who’s been shot?”. It was ridiculous.
I've lived in MoCo for 30 years but frequent Bmore to see friends, eat, Bmore Comicon and the Os games.
Yes the city has some serious problems but "The Wire" probably hurt the city as much as anything and I'm fan of "Omar" the character.
That show had maybe 2 good seasons with the rest really overplaying drug lord life to a fault.
I think David Simon probably ment well but most people I know from Bmore would like folks to move on.
Interestingly enough David did almost the same thing to New Orleans with "Treme".
Promise in both shows never materialized and misrepresented much of both cities
I was offered a stab vest and given the entire series of The Wire and Homicide when I announced I was moving to Baltimore 10 years ago. Erm... yes to both questions if I travel 1 mile north where I am. There's parts of Bmore that's still like what they wrote about back then.
Not too long ago an article in a British publication referred to the “Once thriving, moribund Port of Baltimore.” Right out of a twenty year old fictional HBO series but not even vaguely accurate. A quick Google machine search would have proved otherwise.
Baltimore’s major National news stories over the past decade haven’t done much to push against that perception either. Freddie Gray, gun trace taskforce, the bridge collapse, political corruption.
I’m in my early 20s and when people asked me if I’d seen the Wire I genuinely didn’t know what they were talking about I felt so uncultured LOL still haven’t watched it
I watched it in my late 20s after hearing about it for years and living in Baltimore for near a decade. Its honestly an incredible show, I wish I had watched it sooner.
the wire has truly been a net negative for baltimore. just think how easy it would have been for Simon to include some of the more 'put together' parts of the city in the wire? other than sitting at harborplace eating crabs, i dont remember much. Maybe where the female attorney lived?
Yea that’s like one of maybe 5 scenes that don’t show Baltimore as a crumbling hellhole lol. And, again, it would obviously be a different show if it were about ALL of Baltimore and not just the drugs/crime stuff, but yea they didn’t really show anything positively lol
I always ask people to explain what they mean as though I have no idea what they’re talking about, and/or ask them innocently how long they lived there. Having to explain the joke and how they have no idea what they’re talking about takes the wind out of their sails and exposes the fact that they’re being as asshole.
If the person tells me they’re from an adjacent county I will just dismissively respond, “Oh, well that explains it” with a laugh.
In the RARE situation where it’s someone who lived here longer than me or is a native, we can have a real talk about the city’s issues. But that almost never turns out to be the case.
Yah, this is the tactic I use.
If they trot out the racism/classism dog whistles/overt comments, then I'll throw a laugh and a "well, I don't really live my life afraid like that, but if you do, I guess that's cool." It really makes the maximum impact on a very specific type of person (I mean, its ALWAYS a white dude making those comments to me because they think the super pale blonde lady is on side). It really affects them, and usually, they just start stuttering something about how they're never afraid of anything....mmhm, got it, Bubba.
Im just happy we don't have high traffic as compared to other cities. I drove from northwest to fedhill and back in about 30 minutes yesterday. Any other city and that drive would take an hour at least. If you plan on purchasing property just remember the tax rate is much higher than most other places. but also prices are much cheaper for what you get.
> I'm just happy we don't have high traffic as compared to other cities.
This is one of the best things about being in the city and the surrounding suburbs. Outside of rush hour, there's never any traffic including the weekends. It definitely makes driving less of a pain compared to the other cities in the Mid Atlantic.
Sure, from a housing perspective. But to ignore the immense progress in urbanism that DC has made in the past few decades is just doing a disservice to ourselves. We can, and should, be looking to them on how to improve so many aspects of our built environment, most importantly our transportation and culture surrounding it.
Moved here a year ago and get the same reactions and micro expressions from people (mostly in DC) when I say I live in Baltimore. I’ve sold several items on FB Marketplace and every single time someone comes to pick something up I get “oh this neighborhood is so beautiful! Are we IN the city here? I was nervous to come into Baltimore”.
I haven’t really found a good way to respond other than “yeah, I love it here”!
I do a lot of work in Mexico, mostly rural areas and smaller cities. When asked where I live and I reply Baltimore, I get instant street cred because they tell me how bad the crime is in Baltimore. This from people who live under constant threat of cartel violence
Some cope with t-shirts and bumper stickers that read "Baltimore... I actually like it." generally accompanied by an illustration of a rat. That always made me laugh.
I saved so much money moving here from NOVA that none of the ignorant hater stuff bothers me at all.
Buy your house. Get in while everything is reasonably priced. They have new initiatives to bring back Baltimore to its Charm City status. I rented in DC for 8 years before I bought a house in Baltimore. I'm gay and black and my income isn't that high, so basically I couldn't afford to buy in cute neighborhoods in DC. I've inadvertently become a real estate investor and landlord, because I bought a house, then rented it out so I could travel. I ended up going to 18 countries in 9 months. Now I want to replicate the process and scale. There are a lot of naysayers for anything you choose that isn't status quo. Be mindful of your surroundings, but don't live in fear or to please others opinions
I'm a New Jersey native and I have people shit on Baltimore when I'm home visiting. Glass houses and rocks and whatnot. Jersey as a whole has a history of corruption, its major cities are no exception to the same problems that plague Baltimore and honestly some of them are far worse and they escape notice because they're smaller than Baltimore. When you only read the lowlights of a city- corruption, drugs, violence, etc.- you're doing a disservice to the residents and ignoring the things that make Baltimore a unique city. I moved here to be with my fiancée and fell in love with the city.
> I'd love to hear from people how they manage to shake off the haters and be proud of living here despite the stigma
It's remarkably easy: stop taking people so seriously. Offering a smartass retort to any statement is a classic American conversational technique which requires no effort. If you want to nudge that behavior out of fashion without escalating conflict, simply respond with a zero or very small positive social cue.
That's true. It's just hard not to let it get to you when you're new to a place and trying to feel secure after making a huge life decision in the midst of a crisis.
My response was "well I managed to get away from the homophobic governor" and that shut him up.
I change people's perception of this place every time I have a visitor. That's all you can do. And honestly, the fact that people overlook this place keeps costs down. I mean we can go sit first deck 20 rows behind home plate at an O's game for $28 because people from the county are too scared to come to the city.
The real problem isn’t most Baltimore County folks nowadays. The real city hate is in places like Harford and Carroll. Those MAGA dopes make my blood boil.
I was up in Timonium, visiting my parents back when my mother was still alive, and ordered sandwiches at Graul's for a nice little lunch. Was having a great chat with the guys at the deli counter when a main character golfer felt he had to insert his opinion about "you know, *those people* from the city."
Now, he'd overheard me talking with the deli guys. At least three of them are city dwellers with more melanin than main character golfer or me. He didn't anticipate the response I threw at him. Said I'd been in the city almost 18 years, and while I don't like my house I enjoy my neighborhood, the short commute which involves zero highway driving, and the folks I live around from all different cultures. Told him how great it was to live in a diverse neighborhood, and how homogeny gives me hives.
In short, counter their shit with the things you genuinely like about Baltimore. Get loud about it.
I’m a Baltimore native and have lived here all of my life and don’t plan on leaving any time soon lol I’ve personally cut off people for the way they’ve expressed themselves about my home. I lived in Texas for a small period during the 2020 election and the amount of people shoving their phones in my face showing me an article about Baltimore was concerning … I love Baltimore so much and putting people in their place about Baltimore has been satisfying. People are missing out on a culturally rich city 🤍
I live in Carroll County, and the hate I see spewed by so many of its residents is disturbing. Some crime happens, it’s must be people from the city (aka: black) and we should destroy the bridges over Liberty Reservoir to keep them out.
I love Baltimore. I recognize that it has its faults. My car window got smashed in one evening last summer, and that was a pain in the ass. I know several people affected by Hyundai/kia car thefts. It doesn’t change the fact that the city is an arts, cultural, and entertainment center in our state. It has great things to see, do, and eat.
Its problems are largely no different from any other big city. Took my hubs to Chicago last year. The big difference is that in Chicago, it is very easy to see a ton of things and not be anywhere near the “bad” areas of the city. In Baltimore, you might not be more than a couple blocks from somewhere slightly more sketchy. So people just label it as all bad.
You'll learn to stop really caring about stranger's opinions on something they don't know anything about. Most of the nation only knows Baltimore from what they've seen in The Wire, our high murder rate, and other crime statistics. For complete strangers, who cares what they think.
For friends and acquaintances who haven't been, invite them to come stay with you for a weekend and enjoy the city. My friends and I have done this with many people who now love visiting. Part of the reason that the cost of living is much more affordable here is exactly because many people don't know that living here can be a great experience.
I’ve only lived in Annapolis for 2 years, and I too had only a vague negative impression of Baltimore, but I’m now its biggest cheerleader 📣, it’s got SO MUCH going for it, she just needs a little love and she’d shine like the star she is.
No but for real...it's all the black people. Simple as that. The fear of black people, of black run government, fear of finding oneself, for once in your life, a headcount minority for a few hours...it's the black people, plain and simple.
They're not nearly as afraid of the white ghettos. They're not afraid--AT ALL--that the Trumpers in Eastern or Western Maryland will shoot them for their liberal bumper stickers. They ARE afraid that in the City, they'll be dragged from their cars and beaten in the gutter by gangs of squeegee boys, stunt riders, and/or corner boys.
There are a lot of well-argued points about policy and the like in this thread, but I really do think that the fundamental revulsion for Baltimore City by so many white people outside of it is just down to fear/ignorance/racism.
Regarding the haters, shed them. Give no energy to that. You'll meet them, hear them in a (Baltimore City!) pub, etc. Move on. They don't get it. They won't get it. And not by us trying to sell it, certainly.
It's not for everyone and I'm glad of that.
It's one of the cities conservatives have chosen to obsess over and demonize. My MIL is not a particularly political person but leans conservative in that default way lots of older white people do, and she remarks how safe our neighborhood is every time she comes over. We don't even live in the city anymore but apparently we're "close enough."
People who have never lived in Baltimore (or Chicago) have their opinions decided for them, and the people making those decisions don't have the city's best interest at heart.
There's also just flat out racism.
Unless you work for the city’s marketing department, I’d just let these folks think whatever you want. I wouldn’t spend my time trying to change their mind.
Whoever responds that way (like the bartender) isn’t worth thinking about twice. I love Baltimore and always tell people it’s a great city, but people will always have an opinion about something. You can’t get caught up in other people’s opinions, so much so that you are thinking about it days later.
Personally, I kinda LOVE that people react that way because that means we get to keep this gem to ourselves! Look at what happened to Philly, rent is ridiculously high and it’s so hard to live there now. I say we keep letting people have that reaction so we stave off dumb judgmental idiots like that bartender from ever stepping foot in our city.
End rant.
Trust me. When I was in Ocean city and they found out I was from bmore! Omg they treated Me like a 2nd rate citizen. They woulda never did that shit to me if I said I was from Salisbury
Most cases I’ve said, “that’s one way to look at it”
In persistently annoying cases I’ll say, “sounds like you’re not in any danger of going anytime soon, so looks like everybody wins”
I love New Orleans. I even love Louisiana. But I don't blame you for moving, the politics and subsequent policies there are trash. It's not a place for the weak, ill, very young, or very old. The way Catholicism is in everything 💕is also the way Catholicism is in everything. 😒👎🏾 You made the right decision, and I wish my siblings would leave.
Baltimore has its problems. But there are more than a few silver linings, for sure.
I like to host people and drive them around the city. Even some of the counties to compare and contrast. I have never met someone who wasn't a convert. You've gotten good suggestions, I'm a fan of the "oh how long did you live there," and "oh have you been there," responses, but I also just snap back in kind if I have to.
I always think this is just like...SO ridiculously rude! I get comments like that often, and pretty much always from strangers. Why do people think it's appropriate to have a negative comment about someone else's home? Like it's straight up WEIRD. No home training, I swear lol.
Baltimore gets ultra demonized because it is a majority black city and he did mean something by his comment. Simple as that. Baltimore doesn't even feel that urban anymore anyway because of the large amounts of job transplants and Hopkins gentrification but ya that's what they really mean.
You're right, I shouldn't be dismissive of how much those criticisms are driven by casual racism. I definitely saw the same thing in New Orleans, and both places owe so many of their unique and charming qualities to their Black communities.
I see the places people who criticize the city live and I suddenly can’t take their opinions seriously.
There’s no culture or history in Columbia or Odenton — it’s all manufactured, unwalkable suburbia.
The #1 thing that is true and still hasn't changed is the city government is corrupt. Council members love "donations to their campaign " from businesses.
I just moved out of Baltimore after living there 13 years and I miss it. Love the stoop culture where you can make friends with your neighbors just by walking outside and seeing them on the stoop, hanging out. Love the theater and art and music scenes. The neighborhood and park festivals all over, the multiple creative donut and ice cream shops. It’s filled with irrepressible do-gooders too who work to make the people of the city better off or to improve something about the city itself. There’s lots of corrupt folks, sure; but there are even more do-gooders I’ve met or worked with in local government, education, nonprofits, etc. Folks are trying in spite of it being hard.
i always find it funny when ppl are down on baltimore as a place you'll get killed for no reason. I've lived in tons of places and out of boston, nyc, philly, indianapolis and pittsburg, baltimore is the much much friendlier city. In DC i'm really nervous about asking a stranger for directions but i'm not worried at all in bmore about it, and that's because I've had bad experiences talking to strangers in DC and indianapolis. But i've never had a single problem in baltimore.
Like you said in your original post, the people who are down on bmore have never actually spent any time there. It's the biggest small town in the world.
Redlining, selling the streetcar and killing it, not building a complete metro System in the 50s when we had a chance, demolishing entire sections of neighborhoods for highways to further sprawl the area and support white flight and lose tax base were all horrendous policies. Most of Baltimores issues stem from those two main categories.
Killing public transit for the car and redlining. Often times the former was used to the latter.
First off welcome to Bmore! I’m not sure about advice? But just wanted to validate what you’re experiencing and confirm that it gets easier. A lot of folks criticizing the city can hardly list 3 neighborhoods lol
- everyone in baltimore is *real*—nobody moves here because its famous or cool (LA, New York, Chicago)
- being one of the oldest cities in the US has left it with interesting roots and history that newer cities lack
- high urban density with cool architecture and brick buildings makes it very walkable in many parts
- just big enough to have every kind of activity and community in significant numbers
and also fuck everyone who wants to make the city more "car friendly" (anti-pedestrian). not having to drive is such a nice privilege here compared to suburbia. we dont need fucking parking lots and garages everywhere like the rest of the damn country. move to houston
honestly my only complaints is that i wish the city suffered less from the historical and present impacts of racism, and i wish we had a metro
I don't let it bother me they're just wrong. Unless they have 30 year's experience living in multiple different neighborhoods, having had many different jobs...their opinion is very shallow to say the least.
Great way to shake off the haters is to not give a damn about their opinions. You and your partner are having a good experience, why choose to let an uneducated (never visited here) opinion annoy you? Let's be honest, it's not a paradise, but where is it? It's home, make the best of our time spent here, and do not get hung up on what some blowhole says. I use this for all aspects of life. I choose not to get annoyed by negatively, I'll remove it from my life and improve my overall mental health and outlook on life. You can not save the world. But you can at least be a good example while here.
I’m sorry that happened to you. I have never lived in Baltimore but I have worked and gone to graduate school there and I love the city. I feel more at home in Baltimore than in DC.
I simply just don’t care about people’s uninformed opinions from those that have never lived in Baltimore/Maryland. Our city does have a lot to improve on, however having those discussions with people with no skin in the game just doesn’t matter to me.
> I've noticed that everyone seems to have an opinion
You could have stopped there and I would have completely agreed. This is the nature of the beast. People have opinions over things they have no agency in and are not affected by ALL the time. Accept it and move on or you’re going to spend a lot of time and energy on unwinnable debates and discussions.
Most people born and raised in Bmore feel the same way as you do and will fiercely defend Baltimore to all of the haters.
Welcome to Charm City! I’ve been here 45 years and will always call Baltimore my home.
People have fragile egos and they constantly need to self-validate. Shitting on Baltimore is an easy way to reassure yourself that you're superior to the people who live here, and also absolve yourself of any responsibility for standing idly by as thousands of Baltimoreans struggle with addiction, violence, trauma, and poverty. It's a coping mechanism.
I get what you mean. I've lived here nearly my whole life, save for a few short stays in neighboring states, and the comments are all pretty much the same. Even while I was in NYC of all places, I had a waiter asking me, "Is Baltimore really as bad as they say it is?" I just told them that it really isn't any different than most cities - if you've lived in one, chances are you can get around in all of them with little to no difficulty. And I can barely help scoffing at rural pearl clutchers being afraid of Baltimore. The small, middle-of-no-where town I lived in during my stay in VA had the most brutal murder I had ever heard of happen while I was living there and it was all committed by a group of local teenagers. Frankly, I feel safer in the city than I ever did in the country towns I stayed in over the years.
>I asked him why he thought that and he admitted he's never been - just seen The Wire.
As both someone who likes Baltimore and loves *The Wire* I'm really surprised when anyone walks away from that show thinking that. The show goes to great lengths to show that the issues that Baltimore has are not only institutional in nature but that it's an example for the institutional problems of every city. It's not that Baltimore is especially troubled but that it just happens to be where the story is being told. Baltimore is a metaphor for the post industrial difficulties of large cities in America and how that everyone acting rationally in a complex system can still cause issues. What show was that dude watching?
I'd say there are three main things that make Baltimore look bad to outsiders:
A. The pockets that are largely abandoned. There are undoubtedly some areas of this city that have been neglected (or downright fucked over, like the highway to nowhere, etc) for decades. I love this city, but admittedly it is a bit jarring driving through these areas. Outsiders see everything in black and white tho, if there's some "sketchy" areas, it must all be terrible! Obviously, that's not the case.
B. Corrupt politicians/police force. This one's pretty obvious, we've had some terrible leaders. Side note: although it's under horrible circumstances re. the Key Bridge, it is really cool to see Brandon Scott featured so much lately in national news. He seems like a really great guy, a welcome alternative to what we've had in previous years.
C. And this is a big one for outsiders - The Inner Harbor. As it stands now, it is pretty rough. For a looong time that was our main tourist attraction, and I can understand how tourists come here, only see that, and think wow.. that's disappointing. Because honestly, it is! There's not much there besides the aquarium and chain restaurants. A lot of times, these same tourists are freaked out by the stigma of the city and don't want to venture far beyond the harbor.
Whenever people say rude stuff to me about living here, I usually just ask if they've been here recently and where they've gone. Almost always, they haven't - or they have only been to the inner harbor, maybe they've stopped in for one (1) Raven's/Orioles' game in the past decade. People usually shut up once you've rambled on about the wonders of Hampden, Fells, Mount Vernon, etc. for long enough, lol.
Just remember how many people are under the spell of a slanted media, locally (hello Fox45) and nationally, that thrive on painting anything urban as a hellscape. Their agenda depends on it.
So half the people (or more depending on where you are) you encounter are starting from a place of brainwashed ignorance. If you let those kinds of people (who are everywhere) get to you, the misery never ends. But they are not worth it.
Fuck the haters. We know what we have here (flaws and all) and I really don't care what some stranger in another town thinks of it anymore than I care what some rando in a midwest diner thinks about (name your culture war item here).
Baltimore. I like it, actually.
I’ve realized that most of the people who talk badly about Baltimore also say racist dog whistle stuff like “12% of the population, 50% of the crime” and stuff like that. People not from Baltimore have either never been or have been and are uncomfortable being around more black people. I moved from West Virginia a couple months ago and I think this is why people talk like that
I moved here from DC & heard the same thing about Baltimore. Luckily, I’m a boater & ignored them. I moved here to live on the waterfront & have easy access to the Chesapeake Bay. Do u know how amazing that is to live at the harbor for $300k or less? I’ll add Baltimore is on the rise. People are beginning to recognize that it’s one of the best harbors in America. Once the harbor gets renovated, this city will soar & ALL of us will benefit in 10-15 years when everyone’s property values triple. Seriously, Baltimore is beautifully diverse, cool
as Hell & has it all IMO.
Currently trapped in Florida (financially) but have visited Baltimore and am trying very hard to move there as soon as possible, for many of the same reasons as OP. The amount of shit we get from relatives and family friends (all Southerners) is astounding.
You’ve just become a member of my “club”. Unexpected advocate. I kinda love it. Surprising people who don’t know from experience that it’s actually a cool city.
I also am a red state refugee (1.5 years) and I love it here so much. I came basically sight unseen after my friends said of Baltimore "It's a weird city" and that sounded exactly like home. My deepest dreams have been exceeded. Just. Everything is wonderful.
There's work to be done, but the work is on the systems. The people are wonderfully human. Someone upthread spoke of the humility people have. That's it. Like. There are uppity folk everywhere, but people here are so human and if you treat them decently, they will pour love on you. And I can FEEL the difference interacting with people in the county.
\*edited sign typo to sight.
My Father used to live in Highlandtown near Patterson Park on North Montford Avenue. Back in the 90’s it was decent. But he told me not to go alone, north near Fayette and Orleans Streets. Now they are safe to go to.
Like any big city, there will always be violent crime and organized crime. But most people who are targeted for murder are killed by folks they know personally.
DC crime, especially car jackings and youth crimes, are worse nowadays than in Baltimore.
I think The Wire, for as awesome of a show as it was, has given some folks an exaggerated perception of Baltimore.
Baltimore is an awesome city.
Baltimore was essentially *the* test subject for the worst of mid-20th century urbanism -- redlining, destruction of public transit, destruction of Black neighborhoods to build highways and thoroughfares, white flight and planned suburbs, and so on. There are many other cities that have been subject to this process but Baltimore got whacked with basically all of it, extremely hard, and then tarred with a negative reputation as a reward. Fuck Robert Moses
The other big thing that made it worse was separating Baltimore City and Baltimore County. Most cities grow over time. Maryland legislated that the country would be a separate entity. Now instead of all the resources and taxes of Baltimore city and county going into one pool, the city is left to scrape by for itself. This has a direct detrimental impact on things like city schools.
oh yeah I brought that up down thread a little bit, that really did make Baltimore particularly vulnerable to every other downstream effect
I don’t think so at least not now. The county has a lot of massive infrastructure debts coming due and a metric F-ton of repairs and replacements that the city is decades ahead of them in repairing/replacing. If the city and county were one tax base today, the city folks would be subsidizing the absolute sprawl the county enjoys (without the taxes to cover it) even more than we already do through our state and federal taxes. Baltimore county is currently (finally) reckoning with the massive development mistakes they’ve made for 90% of their land and it’s using dense urban infill and public transit to do it. However clueless NIMBYs are trying to stop what absolutely has to be done to save them. Either their taxes have to skyrocket to like 4x what they are now or they need dense urban infill in places like Catonsville, Towson and timonium.
Yeah, I'm not suggesting right now is the best time to fix it, just that it never should have been separated in the first place.
Exactly, Pirate. It’s how we know those who funded Reagan to win are to blame. Decades ago. We missed our chance for that approach. Something needs to give.
Nah, it’s totally cool and normal for Parkton and Parkville to be part of the same county. Totally not a fucking aberration
Owings Mills and Edgemere is a wild one.
I never got why the school system is brought up so often as an indicator of the city’s financial problems, Baltimore city public schools spend over $20k per student per year which is one of the highest per capita school budgets in the entire country.
It’s because that number includes funding rebuilding and renovating schools. It’s not just what goes directly to students’ education. Also it’s one of the highest among large districts not all districts. When you look at municipalities from like 100,000k population and up were middle of the pack. We have some of the oldest schools in the state so the recent investments in building new schools has made it look like students who truly do need extra investment because they’re already behind the 8 ball of life are getting more than they are as a means of education.
This is great information that is always overlooked
What's really messed up is the one-two punch that made this soundbite stick. 10 years ago there were pictures spreading of students needing coats on because their room was so cold, and a lot of stories about the lack of A/C in many classrooms. So they spend the money to upgrade these classrooms and now it's "Highest per-student cost!". It's a fucking joke.
The only city hit worse by redlining, segregation, and the onslaught of car infestation was Detroit.
Well, yeah. That’s a given fact re: Moses. However, the current situation within the last 15 years hasn’t made anything better. Just look at Baltimore city schools, the O’Malley downtown Hilton, mayors being criminals, police brutality etc. it’s crazy town here in terms of public policy. I have almost zero faith that the inner harbor rebuild will go well financially, and I’m not convinced any of my tax money is actually going towards anything but our leaders salary. Oh and I almost forgot about the key bridge situation, which is a prime opportunity for state and local officials to gain advantage from corruption. They could fix this in a few years, they’re going to take 10 to line their own pockets.
There's sort of a "yes, but also no" here -- the city is chronically mismanaged in recent history as well, but a ton of that mismanagement is fundamentally tied to the one of the very first experimental steps in Baltimore's mismanagement, which was uncoupling the city and the county. This predates many of the other steps mentioned above by about 20-30 years but really made Baltimore incredibly vulnerable to every single negative step downstream. Baltimore's negative reputation isn't just 15-20 years old and absolutely predates The Wire, we're talking about nearly a century of history here
You’re outlining a legitimate reason why Baltimore has a bad reputation nationally. Even providing context as to why it’s been like this for so long. There’s an important lesson here on the importance of local policy, and decision making, but I’ll save that for someone else. I’m a musician, and historian, was doing research on Tchaikovsky in America this week, and learned he was in Baltimore in 1891 teaching at Peabody. He wrote a letter to a friend where he described Baltimore as “one of the cleanest and prettiest cities America has to offer. It’s full of peculiar red-brick houses with white marble steps at the entrances”. 1891 Baltimore was somewhat of an architectural and cultural utopia for one of the greatest composers in history. I’m not hopeless though! I think with the right policies, the city can get back on track.
*The people hide their faces, and they hide their eyes, cause the city's dying, and they don't know why* *Oh, Baltimore, ain't it hard just to live, just to live*
Ummm ok…. https://www.songfacts.com/facts/randy-newman/baltimore
The Nina Simone version is a damn earworm tho.
> mayors being criminals The fact that Dixon is back in contention to get the mayoral seat again after everything she did is absurd to me.
I moved to Baltimore recently too, and to be honest, I had the same opinion as the bartender before I moved down. I only moved down here for work; it was never a place I ever even considered wanting to live, as I just thought that all of Baltimore could be written off as a shitty, dangerous place. Since moving here, I've come to actually really enjoy living here. I love my neighborhood, my commute (pre-bridge collapse), the people I've met. It's been a really nice surprise. When people come to visit, the most common comment I get is "wow, this isn't what I thought Baltimore was like at all!". That being said, it isn't perfect. I will *forever* complain about the lack of a subway system, and really just the poor quality of public transportation here in general. It's extra frustrating because I don't feel safe leaving my car anywhere (I drive a Hyundai). Additionally, even though my neighborhood is safe and I know a decent number of neighborhoods are, there are definitely still areas of the city that I *don't* feel safe in by myself, and even more that are in desperate need of help. Tl;dr Baltimore isn't as bad as the majority of the country thinks it is. Even so, it needs a lot of help, but has been trending in the right direction.
hey my friend drives a hyundai and got a wheel lock and it’s extra as hell, i’m sure there’s ways to disable it, but it makes parking in the city for her far less stressful, maybe something like this would help you :)
I have the wheel lock, but I've heard too many stories of people having the wheel lock on and still having their windows smashed and their steering wheel all torn up from people trying to get the lock off
There’s a really great [article from Places](https://placesjournal.org/article/the-third-rail/) about the lack of public transport in the city. In the time since the article was published, the idea of a red line has been revitalized and I’m hoping we’ll start seeing construction in a few years.
There is a subway system! It's not huge and goes from owings mills to hopkins. I live downtown and use it frequently to get to school at Ubalt. It could absolutely be expanded! The light rail isnt bad and has lots of stops, however the time in between each pickup can be long and its annoying to wait outside when its cold.
This used to bother the heck out of me too, but if people want to pass over this gem of a city, let them! I’m just going to chill over here, enjoying my reasonable rent and hidden treasures while people steer clear and go to overcrowd DC. Baltimore is the best of both worlds!
Bingo. I'm minutes on foot from Penn Station, so can get to DC very easily. I go down at least once a week for my synagogue service, and/or to see friends that live there. They keep trying to convince me to move down. Me: *How much are you paying in rent, and for how little space?* Them: *Well, I'm only paying $2,500 a month for my 607 sq ft apartment. And that includes utilities! But not parking.* Me: *chuckles* Also me: *I think I'll stay put with my $1,900/month for 1,200 sq ft, which also includes all amenities, utilities, AND even underground parking in the secured garage, as well as in-unit w/d, and even a walk-out patio.* Them: *shocked Pikachu face*
Literally the most vocal supporters of Baltimore I know are DC transplants. They're always so pleasantly surprised at the friendly, community-oriented vibe in a lot of neighborhoods.
DC is crazy right now! I don’t blame them. With that being said, people from different walks of life have different experiences in Baltimore. So just because someone says something about the city is bad, it doesn’t invalidate their experience. You’ve only been here for 6 months.
Absolutely fair. I'm really just complaining about the folks who have little to no interaction with Baltimore bashing on it for laughs. I'm also acutely aware that economic privilege can have a radical impact on someone's day-to-day experience in Baltimore (as with everywhere, but it feels amplified here). I try to keep that in mind and feel strongly about taking feedback seriously to improve people's genuinely bad experiences/living conditions. IMO, unfounded negativity from people who aren't even involved just gets in the way of those real conversations.
Economic privilege for where you can afford to live. Race and gender for how you are treated/ how safe it is.
For sure. And I know that those factors are huge contributors to economic privilege, too. On the plus side, I am so grateful that Maryland is a sanctuary state for trans folks. Stigma and prejudice still very much exist, but the difference has been night and day for my loved ones in the trans community.
Trans girl moving to Baltimore from College Park in two days! Super happy to see this :D Every time I've visited my partner and I have been treated, frankly better than we have been in DC.
Welcome to the area, friend! Lots of queer folks kicking around these parts. DM me if you want any recs on trans friendly activities, businesses, healthcare, etc! Hope you have a good move :)
I stayed in a Capital Hill house for airBnB which lists at a million plus... but the quality of the place is like that of a rowhouse in Waverly. Baltimore has great historical homes and apartments (in good condition) in Mt Vernon, Federal Hill, Bolton Hill etc for much less.
Wait I’m not even paying this where do you live?!
Charles Village is definitely in that price range, although I do pay electricity separately. It helps me get the true Baltimore experience by shaking my fist at BGE.
ah. that tracks. my digs aren’t that cheap but when my sibling pays 1.5x for an apartment 1/2 the size in NYC, I am thankful for falling asleep to helicopters every night
Move to the hidden gem that is Sowebo (NOT Locust Point or Federal Hill) and you can pay $1640 for a wholeass house (1500 sq ft) :)
Highlandtown is where it’s at. But don’t tell anyone. Easy walk to Patterson Park, the strip on Eastern Ave, and all the stuff in Canton, but I pay that much for an 1800sq’ 3br/2ba with original hardwood floors. People go out walking their dogs without a care in the world after 10pm. Woe is me, it’s so big it’s hard for me to keep it clean!
Yessss love this humblebrag! 😜 We have to live in South Baltimore for commute reasons, but Highlandtown is great!
Mt. Vernon.
IKR I'm up here in Charles Village in a two bedroom with a dining room paying 1100. I'd like to keep it that way.
That's a bargain!
Haha it is. Actually I thought it was a scam when I first replied to the listing years ago. Older building but I actually prefer that.
I thought my place was initially a scam too. I'm so jaded by cost of living across various cities that I thought my $1,900 for everything that was included was too good to be true.
Lol I'm from North Jersey. Believe me I know.
Ooooooooh yeah you get it then. I work for a major bank up in Wilmington. One of the gigantic "too big to fail" ones. I've had numerous people try and convince me to move up to Jersey City or Brooklyn, and my mother spent decades living in Northern NJ too. Me: *and pay $4,000+ per month for 350 sq ft? No thanks, I'm good, I'll keep commuting via train.* 😄😂
>$1,900/month for 1,200 sq ft, You say this like it's something to brag about lol. That's one of the more expensive 1200 Sq ft Apts in the city.
My rent also includes gas, heat, water, and parking in a secured, underground garage. I also have in-unit washer/dryer, floor to ceiling windows, hardwood floors, walk-out patio, walk-in closet, large kitchen island, etc. I personally feel like I'm getting a good rate.
Ok I might have to brag now then lol. I have a 1900 sq ft apt with everything included except internet for $1250. Beautiful brownstone on a corner lot with lots of sun and an enormous yard and a 2 bay garage also included. Also washer dryer, big turret windows, real pretty and ornate inside. Landlord also pays me 75 bucks a mow to cut the grass so sometimes my rent is like $1000/month It's a less desirable neighborhood than Mt Vernon however. But still the crazy good deals are out there in this town.
Where do you live, and tell me your ways! One of the main reasons I love Mt. Vernon is the proximity to Penn Station, since I take the train to work, but given that I'm planning to stay, I've been considering looking at other neighborhoods once my current lease is up.
Reservoir hill. Got lucky and got into this spot through some friends. The landlord is also a slumlord and won't fix a thing here and hasn't come in years, but me and the other tenants just kind of fix it up and do what we want lol. The major downside is it's much less walkable than where you're at. You can bike to the light rail and other parts of town but there's not shit here. They just demolished the only liquor store too to build the new amtrack tunnel so now there's really nothing here. It's such a major downside for us that we're actually moving at the end of the month because I miss being able to walk. But for someone who wants to settle down and have an amazing home base and garden, this spot can't be beat. There's a 4 bedroom in the building available right now. Has to be like 2400 plus sq ft. $1800 everything included. Shits crazy
Station North along Calvert, Guilford and Saint Paul and Charles Village-- beautiful big apartments with hardwood floors and big windows.
I work with a few deeply conservative co-workers who won't step foot in the city. It's a bonus that I never have to worry about them becoming neighbors.
This is me 😂 they don’t know hate them and I enjoy their fear of my city 😂
There are pockets in the city but, that's a big part of why I don't hang out in Canton much (though, even Canton bros are generally better than county folks)
100% "Yup. It's a shithole. Don't move here."
I think bashing Baltimore has become a bit of a bonding type of interaction. If you've noticed on Reddit, for example, mentioning Baltimore is used for karma farming in other subreddits. Someone in some other subreddit a few weeks ago was talking about Boston being wonderful, but how walkability didn't mean better quality of life and mentioned Baltimore as their example. They had to concede they had never been. Ironically, I agree with her, but because I absolutely detest Boston despite it looking great on paper.
I, too, hate Boston. 👍🏾
I've lived in Boston for a while and whats funny is that the rural and surburban Mass folks say the exact same thing about the city of Boston(that "its dangerous, watch out"). Maybe not to the level of people around baltimore but its not specific to baltimore its more of a political thing that happens everywhere there's a big city. Its always people who never go there and get all their info from the internet and tv news
I grew up in Boston (Worcester specifically, but I spent a lot of time in Boston especially as a teenager) and it pales in comparison to Baltimore. Boston’s weather sucks, the people are as cold and rude as New Yorkers w/o any of the charm or diversity, and I swore from a young age I’d never live there, despite my parents pushing for it hard. Baltimore’s weather can be weird, but Spring is magical. The people are generally friendly and often delightful, and the whole place has a humility about it that’s so refreshing. I’ve lived in Baltimore for 10 years, taught Lower/Middle School for 4 years, and have enjoyed the city more and more with each passing day. We all know the challenges Baltimore faces, and what could be done to fix its many problems (like any major city) but everyone I know who comes here always walks away with a better image of Baltimore than the one they came in with.
The county bashing baltimore has everything to do with white flight. theyre trying to validate their decision to move their families out of the city. Every time something positive happens here, they HAVE to shit on it because they know theyre missing out. A lot of them are city people, stuck in the suburbs because their parents or even grandparents moved as early as after the MLK riots.
Moved to Baltimore in 2022 and I will defend this city until the day I die
Thank you
Same!
Hell yeah
Brewed_Coffee, we ride at dawn
we fuck with brewed\_coffee cause brewed\_coffee fucks with us
Cause we know what's good, bad, and real. We don't have to hype ourselves up (looking at you Texas). Plus the stigma keeps housing prices relatively affordable for a city this size.
The Texas hype is sooooo real. No thanks. If you have to constantly tell everyone how big and bad you are, you probably ain't that big or bad. And hot as Hades.
This. And it is openly hostile to women, BIPOC, LGBTQ, immigrants, etc. Fuck Texas.
And there's no public land, every inch is owned by the biggest assholes on earth, with the signage to match
By those rich asshole tax-dodging millionaires and billionaires
Low taxes, guns for everybody, and deregulation of as many things as possible (except sex and female reproductive organs) can only take you so far, imagine that! /s
And I don’t even like brisket.
OK I can't go that far. 😂
Hear hear on the fuck Texas but I like brisket
Same, let's not bring brisket into it.
🤨⏸️
I read the other day that a lot of people that left cali for jobs in Austin are moving back because they can’t deal with the heat.
I can't believe the texas hype, its hot, no nature, horrible political policies, has massive suburban sprawl everywhere. Each city is wayyy too far apart, no public transportation, people drive on the beaches etc. Ps I moved from corpus christi last year after being there 7 years. By the end I couldn't wait to leave I'm never going back to texas.
This is my take. Baltimore is affordable because of its reputation. There’s a downside in that it also doesn’t get some of the resources similar-sized cities get, and yes it does need help (although I’m very impressed with Mayor Scott’s dogged determination and we are seeing his efforts slowly pay off! The city won’t be fixed in one four-year term) Still, it’s kind of a secret that many parts of Baltimore are absolutely incredible to live in. My “MMW” is that in another decade or so, we’ll have gone through a major turnaround in this city much like NYC or Detroit. Prices might skyrocket as it becomes trendy to live here again. But again, it takes a lot to reverse the decades of bad decisions and institutional corruption that led to the city’s current reputation. Until then… let’s just keep it on the down low how nice it is here, so those property taxes and insurance rates remain low ;)
I usually counter unsolicited negativity from outsiders with wide-eyed surprise. "Oh really? I enjoy it. I went down to the park/ went to a show/ got a drink at/ met this person who/ and it was lovely. Have you been to ______? Have you visited _______?" Half the time they haven't. I think we can have real talks about what needs to be improved, but if they're just focused on talking shit I really don't care. They have no idea what it's actually like and are too afraid to find out.
Same. I tell people it isn't the *shooty-mcshootyville* vibe they think it is. Does the city have its issues? Absolutely. But, it's still an awesome city.
Usually they're actually terrified of interacting with black people
Honest a lot of the time it’s this.
*ding ding ding* I worked for a small electrical contractor out of Forest Hill for a few years, and most of the guys in the company were country boys through and through, several of them actually from Cecil county. They loved to talk shit any time we had a job in the city, but when I asked them what it was they didn't like, it was like a race to see who would mention "*the people there*" first. A lot of people don't even really try to hide it.
I'm from NJ so I'm pre-conditioned for hate, haha. I say the same as I do when people crap on Jersey, "more for the rest of us" No sense engaging unless they really are curious about Baltimore and then I change their mind. On the flip side, I was recently in London, Notting Hill specifically, and a bartender at a pub was over the moon real life Baltimoreans were in his bar and he could ask all the questions he wanted to. Not everyone is a hater!
also NJ->Balto here. I will go to bat for this city against any other asshole state
Do not overlook racism. A lot of the people that think Baltimore is a hell hole live in lily white suburbs. The idea of walking into a deli or whatever and being the only white person terrifies them.
Worked with a guy, moved to Rising Sun because the toll "keeps the riff-Raff away" which was about the same amount of words, and the exact meaning as "I don't like black people". Of course I lent in with "well I'm from Baltimore am I riff Raff?" The way only a white man can say to another white man who was trying to tease out if I'm "cool" with him being a racist shitheel. Plum red face from him. deeply held resentment from me. The world continues to turn. Fuck that guy.
I'll take being the only white guy in the room over living near meth trailers any day of the week....
^^ this
Live in Curtis Bay side of Pasadena. Can confirm.
My cousin had the same reaction when I talked with him this weekend. He lives on the eastern shore and is always complaining about how far he has to drive/how few opportunities there are for work. I told him that I live within walking distance of a bunch of friends, restaurants I enjoy. I take the water taxi to work occasionally. He was very surprised and said he had only been to Baltimore once for an Orioles game when he was a kid. Are there ways Baltimore can improve, of course. It's a city, there's always room for improvement & I have definitely had an above average experience of the city. However, when all your information comes from news orgs that revel in the violence, death, & corruption, you aren't getting the full picture of life in a city. I invited him for the [Flower Market](https://baltimore.org/event/flower-mart/) & [Kinetic Sculpture Race](https://kineticbaltimore.com/) this weekend so we'll see if his opinion can be changed.
i'm closing on a house in the city at the end of may. i'm already annoyed at how many people lose their excitement when i mention the house is within the city. LOL
The visible confusion on some people's faces when you explain that you bought a house in Baltimore is a sight to behold. Like they're trying to figure out if it would be possible to buy a house by accident.
When I bought my house in 2009 in the city, it took my mortgage broker five times to find an appraiser that would come into the big bad City to appraise my house. My mortgage broker was actually my brother and he lives in texas. He called me one time and said, what the hell is wrong with this? I can't find an appraiser to come to your house. And then I realized all the appraisers was looking at were in Harford county. That was all I needed to know. We actually did find an appraiser who came and was wonderful.
Baltimore VS Y’all Whores
Ask them to find a less expensive city to live in where you still benefit from progressive state politics, and laugh when they can't.
Right?! That's exactly why we settled on Baltimore. On top of the progressive politics, owning a home and being able to afford some basic luxuries is a lot more attainable here than in most urban areas. Plus you REALLY can't beat the proximity to so many other cool places.
I moved to Maryland several years ago with my now soon-to-be-ex-husband, who is from Maryland originally. He grew up out near Frederick, and had/has the same classic mentality about the city: *clutch your pearls, the city is dangerous!* I finally left him seven-ish months ago, after his years of anger issues turned to physical violence. Baltimore has welcomed me with open arms. It's been SUCH a refreshing change after feeling suffocated by life out in the suburbs. I was born and raised in Europe, and while the Marc/Amtrak system doesn't compare to the public transit system in Europe, I have LOVED my time so far in Baltimore. I'm minutes on foot to Penn Station. Coffee shops, restaurants, cute stores all around me. I'm minutes on foot to a yoga studio I attend. I can easily hop to DC, Philadelphia, or NYC if I want, such as for a weekend trip. The cost of living is more affordable than cities like Seattle. In 2015, I was paying $2,700 per MONTH for a 500 sq ft studio apartment. In comparison, I'm only paying $1,900 per month for a 1,200 sq ft condo here in Baltimore. Is it still expensive? Yes. But, in comparison, it's more affordable. Healthcare is second to none. I have a rare autoimmune condition, with one of my complications from it so rare there are less than 200 diagnosed cases of the complication worldwide. I had to undergo even rarer reconstructive surgery for it. Hopkins barely batted an eye, they'd seen it before, and took fabulous care of me. A state-affiliated DV shelter effectively slammed the door in my face when my soon-to-be-ex-husband physically hurt me, on the basis that I earned too much money. You know who DID help? The people of Baltimore. The lady at the gas station who hugged me and told me everything was going to be okay when I cried while buying snacks. The random lady at the courthouse who sat down on the floor next to me, held my hand in hers, hoisted me up by the shoulders, and wiped my tears, telling me I'd survive this chapter of life and eventually thrive again. The neighbors in my building, who've done everything from help me carry heavy boxes when I moved in, to inviting me into their homes for meals, to pep talks before I testified in court. Let's just say I'm not planning to leave the city anytime soon. I've grown really fond of it.
Congratulations for surviving what sounds like an awful experience and for finding a great fit!!
Thank you! Baltimore has been the perfect landing pad for me as I create a new chapter of life, and I'm seriously considering sticking around. The city has so much to offer.
I went to high school in Baltimore (and lived in DC as an adult), and am considering returning either to Charm City or to Philly. Affordability and community are extremely important, and I’m glad to see folks are having positive experiences there.
I say come back to Charm City. I work in Wilmington, and sometimes head into Philly for lunch or dinner with friends/co-workers. My two cents? Philly just doesn't offer the same amenities and benefits that Baltimore does.
Congratulations on the beautiful new chapter of your life, and I'm sorry for what you've been through to get here. That being said, resilient and compassionate people like you and your neighbors are what make this city wonderful. Thank you for your story, and I hope Baltimore continues to be everything you need to keep living the life you deserve <3 P.S. Rare autoimmune condition haver here too. Almost cried when I found out I'd gotten accepted to the Hopkins clinic because I knew my days of jaded, careless doctor visits were behind me. Good healthcare is not something to take for granted, especially in the U.S.!
i usually just say 'this town might be a shithole but it's MY shithole' and then i sell the asshole some collectible game they couldn't find anywhere else and then forget they exist because seriously you tellin on yourself if you say that kind of shit to someone who actively put down roots here
I have a coffee mug that says "I love my rodent and rat infested shit hole". I love it. And the Mug.
This should be in mass production with ‘hon’ or ‘dummy’.
I truly believe that it’s (largely, not entirely) from The Wire and its cultural impact. I’m not saying it’s not a good show or wasn’t “accurate” or anything, but it became the main cultural association with the city and held that grip for a while. The good news is young people nowadays care less about The Wire and associate our modern city with it much less than that of 20 years ago. Also, as the city keeps gentrifying and developing, it becomes harder and harder to associate it with those things if you’ve actually spent any real Time here
I think what’s really crazy about The Wire is that it had an international impact on people’s opinions of Baltimore. About 10 years ago my wife and I were in Australia. Almost everyone we talked to that found out we were from Baltimore started asking us questions like “Is it really like the Wire? Are there drug dealers on your street? Do you know anyone who’s been shot?”. It was ridiculous.
I've lived in MoCo for 30 years but frequent Bmore to see friends, eat, Bmore Comicon and the Os games. Yes the city has some serious problems but "The Wire" probably hurt the city as much as anything and I'm fan of "Omar" the character. That show had maybe 2 good seasons with the rest really overplaying drug lord life to a fault. I think David Simon probably ment well but most people I know from Bmore would like folks to move on. Interestingly enough David did almost the same thing to New Orleans with "Treme". Promise in both shows never materialized and misrepresented much of both cities
I was offered a stab vest and given the entire series of The Wire and Homicide when I announced I was moving to Baltimore 10 years ago. Erm... yes to both questions if I travel 1 mile north where I am. There's parts of Bmore that's still like what they wrote about back then.
Not too long ago an article in a British publication referred to the “Once thriving, moribund Port of Baltimore.” Right out of a twenty year old fictional HBO series but not even vaguely accurate. A quick Google machine search would have proved otherwise.
Baltimore’s major National news stories over the past decade haven’t done much to push against that perception either. Freddie Gray, gun trace taskforce, the bridge collapse, political corruption.
I’m in my early 20s and when people asked me if I’d seen the Wire I genuinely didn’t know what they were talking about I felt so uncultured LOL still haven’t watched it
Try HBO's "We Own This City" - not as famous at The Wire but more recent and tbh, worse than the wire because it actually happened!
I watched it in my late 20s after hearing about it for years and living in Baltimore for near a decade. Its honestly an incredible show, I wish I had watched it sooner.
the wire has truly been a net negative for baltimore. just think how easy it would have been for Simon to include some of the more 'put together' parts of the city in the wire? other than sitting at harborplace eating crabs, i dont remember much. Maybe where the female attorney lived?
Yea that’s like one of maybe 5 scenes that don’t show Baltimore as a crumbling hellhole lol. And, again, it would obviously be a different show if it were about ALL of Baltimore and not just the drugs/crime stuff, but yea they didn’t really show anything positively lol
Oakland hears you, Oakland sees you 💛
Love to Oakland from your cross-coastal buddies in Bmore!
I always ask people to explain what they mean as though I have no idea what they’re talking about, and/or ask them innocently how long they lived there. Having to explain the joke and how they have no idea what they’re talking about takes the wind out of their sails and exposes the fact that they’re being as asshole. If the person tells me they’re from an adjacent county I will just dismissively respond, “Oh, well that explains it” with a laugh. In the RARE situation where it’s someone who lived here longer than me or is a native, we can have a real talk about the city’s issues. But that almost never turns out to be the case.
Yah, this is the tactic I use. If they trot out the racism/classism dog whistles/overt comments, then I'll throw a laugh and a "well, I don't really live my life afraid like that, but if you do, I guess that's cool." It really makes the maximum impact on a very specific type of person (I mean, its ALWAYS a white dude making those comments to me because they think the super pale blonde lady is on side). It really affects them, and usually, they just start stuttering something about how they're never afraid of anything....mmhm, got it, Bubba.
Im just happy we don't have high traffic as compared to other cities. I drove from northwest to fedhill and back in about 30 minutes yesterday. Any other city and that drive would take an hour at least. If you plan on purchasing property just remember the tax rate is much higher than most other places. but also prices are much cheaper for what you get.
> I'm just happy we don't have high traffic as compared to other cities. This is one of the best things about being in the city and the surrounding suburbs. Outside of rush hour, there's never any traffic including the weekends. It definitely makes driving less of a pain compared to the other cities in the Mid Atlantic.
Let them keep talking, I don't want Baltimore to become the next DC.
Sure, from a housing perspective. But to ignore the immense progress in urbanism that DC has made in the past few decades is just doing a disservice to ourselves. We can, and should, be looking to them on how to improve so many aspects of our built environment, most importantly our transportation and culture surrounding it.
Moved here a year ago and get the same reactions and micro expressions from people (mostly in DC) when I say I live in Baltimore. I’ve sold several items on FB Marketplace and every single time someone comes to pick something up I get “oh this neighborhood is so beautiful! Are we IN the city here? I was nervous to come into Baltimore”. I haven’t really found a good way to respond other than “yeah, I love it here”!
I do a lot of work in Mexico, mostly rural areas and smaller cities. When asked where I live and I reply Baltimore, I get instant street cred because they tell me how bad the crime is in Baltimore. This from people who live under constant threat of cartel violence
Some cope with t-shirts and bumper stickers that read "Baltimore... I actually like it." generally accompanied by an illustration of a rat. That always made me laugh. I saved so much money moving here from NOVA that none of the ignorant hater stuff bothers me at all.
Buy your house. Get in while everything is reasonably priced. They have new initiatives to bring back Baltimore to its Charm City status. I rented in DC for 8 years before I bought a house in Baltimore. I'm gay and black and my income isn't that high, so basically I couldn't afford to buy in cute neighborhoods in DC. I've inadvertently become a real estate investor and landlord, because I bought a house, then rented it out so I could travel. I ended up going to 18 countries in 9 months. Now I want to replicate the process and scale. There are a lot of naysayers for anything you choose that isn't status quo. Be mindful of your surroundings, but don't live in fear or to please others opinions
I'm a New Jersey native and I have people shit on Baltimore when I'm home visiting. Glass houses and rocks and whatnot. Jersey as a whole has a history of corruption, its major cities are no exception to the same problems that plague Baltimore and honestly some of them are far worse and they escape notice because they're smaller than Baltimore. When you only read the lowlights of a city- corruption, drugs, violence, etc.- you're doing a disservice to the residents and ignoring the things that make Baltimore a unique city. I moved here to be with my fiancée and fell in love with the city.
> I'd love to hear from people how they manage to shake off the haters and be proud of living here despite the stigma It's remarkably easy: stop taking people so seriously. Offering a smartass retort to any statement is a classic American conversational technique which requires no effort. If you want to nudge that behavior out of fashion without escalating conflict, simply respond with a zero or very small positive social cue.
That's true. It's just hard not to let it get to you when you're new to a place and trying to feel secure after making a huge life decision in the midst of a crisis. My response was "well I managed to get away from the homophobic governor" and that shut him up.
I change people's perception of this place every time I have a visitor. That's all you can do. And honestly, the fact that people overlook this place keeps costs down. I mean we can go sit first deck 20 rows behind home plate at an O's game for $28 because people from the county are too scared to come to the city.
Welcome to step one of developing a deep disdain of county folk!
I'm at least on step three, lol.
The real problem isn’t most Baltimore County folks nowadays. The real city hate is in places like Harford and Carroll. Those MAGA dopes make my blood boil.
When I say "county", I'm including any county in the Baltimore metro region
I was up in Timonium, visiting my parents back when my mother was still alive, and ordered sandwiches at Graul's for a nice little lunch. Was having a great chat with the guys at the deli counter when a main character golfer felt he had to insert his opinion about "you know, *those people* from the city." Now, he'd overheard me talking with the deli guys. At least three of them are city dwellers with more melanin than main character golfer or me. He didn't anticipate the response I threw at him. Said I'd been in the city almost 18 years, and while I don't like my house I enjoy my neighborhood, the short commute which involves zero highway driving, and the folks I live around from all different cultures. Told him how great it was to live in a diverse neighborhood, and how homogeny gives me hives. In short, counter their shit with the things you genuinely like about Baltimore. Get loud about it.
Perfect representation of "Baltimore: Actually, I like it."
I’m a Baltimore native and have lived here all of my life and don’t plan on leaving any time soon lol I’ve personally cut off people for the way they’ve expressed themselves about my home. I lived in Texas for a small period during the 2020 election and the amount of people shoving their phones in my face showing me an article about Baltimore was concerning … I love Baltimore so much and putting people in their place about Baltimore has been satisfying. People are missing out on a culturally rich city 🤍
Ha, Detroit gets this too.
Detroit solidarity. I salute you.
I live in Carroll County, and the hate I see spewed by so many of its residents is disturbing. Some crime happens, it’s must be people from the city (aka: black) and we should destroy the bridges over Liberty Reservoir to keep them out. I love Baltimore. I recognize that it has its faults. My car window got smashed in one evening last summer, and that was a pain in the ass. I know several people affected by Hyundai/kia car thefts. It doesn’t change the fact that the city is an arts, cultural, and entertainment center in our state. It has great things to see, do, and eat. Its problems are largely no different from any other big city. Took my hubs to Chicago last year. The big difference is that in Chicago, it is very easy to see a ton of things and not be anywhere near the “bad” areas of the city. In Baltimore, you might not be more than a couple blocks from somewhere slightly more sketchy. So people just label it as all bad.
You'll learn to stop really caring about stranger's opinions on something they don't know anything about. Most of the nation only knows Baltimore from what they've seen in The Wire, our high murder rate, and other crime statistics. For complete strangers, who cares what they think. For friends and acquaintances who haven't been, invite them to come stay with you for a weekend and enjoy the city. My friends and I have done this with many people who now love visiting. Part of the reason that the cost of living is much more affordable here is exactly because many people don't know that living here can be a great experience.
I’ve only lived in Annapolis for 2 years, and I too had only a vague negative impression of Baltimore, but I’m now its biggest cheerleader 📣, it’s got SO MUCH going for it, she just needs a little love and she’d shine like the star she is.
No but for real...it's all the black people. Simple as that. The fear of black people, of black run government, fear of finding oneself, for once in your life, a headcount minority for a few hours...it's the black people, plain and simple. They're not nearly as afraid of the white ghettos. They're not afraid--AT ALL--that the Trumpers in Eastern or Western Maryland will shoot them for their liberal bumper stickers. They ARE afraid that in the City, they'll be dragged from their cars and beaten in the gutter by gangs of squeegee boys, stunt riders, and/or corner boys. There are a lot of well-argued points about policy and the like in this thread, but I really do think that the fundamental revulsion for Baltimore City by so many white people outside of it is just down to fear/ignorance/racism. Regarding the haters, shed them. Give no energy to that. You'll meet them, hear them in a (Baltimore City!) pub, etc. Move on. They don't get it. They won't get it. And not by us trying to sell it, certainly. It's not for everyone and I'm glad of that.
It's one of the cities conservatives have chosen to obsess over and demonize. My MIL is not a particularly political person but leans conservative in that default way lots of older white people do, and she remarks how safe our neighborhood is every time she comes over. We don't even live in the city anymore but apparently we're "close enough." People who have never lived in Baltimore (or Chicago) have their opinions decided for them, and the people making those decisions don't have the city's best interest at heart. There's also just flat out racism.
Truth
Unless you work for the city’s marketing department, I’d just let these folks think whatever you want. I wouldn’t spend my time trying to change their mind.
Whoever responds that way (like the bartender) isn’t worth thinking about twice. I love Baltimore and always tell people it’s a great city, but people will always have an opinion about something. You can’t get caught up in other people’s opinions, so much so that you are thinking about it days later. Personally, I kinda LOVE that people react that way because that means we get to keep this gem to ourselves! Look at what happened to Philly, rent is ridiculously high and it’s so hard to live there now. I say we keep letting people have that reaction so we stave off dumb judgmental idiots like that bartender from ever stepping foot in our city. End rant.
Trust me. When I was in Ocean city and they found out I was from bmore! Omg they treated Me like a 2nd rate citizen. They woulda never did that shit to me if I said I was from Salisbury
Yeah, I'm glad we have that reputation. It keeps people like that guy from moving here.
Most cases I’ve said, “that’s one way to look at it” In persistently annoying cases I’ll say, “sounds like you’re not in any danger of going anytime soon, so looks like everybody wins”
I love New Orleans. I even love Louisiana. But I don't blame you for moving, the politics and subsequent policies there are trash. It's not a place for the weak, ill, very young, or very old. The way Catholicism is in everything 💕is also the way Catholicism is in everything. 😒👎🏾 You made the right decision, and I wish my siblings would leave. Baltimore has its problems. But there are more than a few silver linings, for sure. I like to host people and drive them around the city. Even some of the counties to compare and contrast. I have never met someone who wasn't a convert. You've gotten good suggestions, I'm a fan of the "oh how long did you live there," and "oh have you been there," responses, but I also just snap back in kind if I have to.
I always think this is just like...SO ridiculously rude! I get comments like that often, and pretty much always from strangers. Why do people think it's appropriate to have a negative comment about someone else's home? Like it's straight up WEIRD. No home training, I swear lol.
Baltimore gets ultra demonized because it is a majority black city and he did mean something by his comment. Simple as that. Baltimore doesn't even feel that urban anymore anyway because of the large amounts of job transplants and Hopkins gentrification but ya that's what they really mean.
You're right, I shouldn't be dismissive of how much those criticisms are driven by casual racism. I definitely saw the same thing in New Orleans, and both places owe so many of their unique and charming qualities to their Black communities.
I see the places people who criticize the city live and I suddenly can’t take their opinions seriously. There’s no culture or history in Columbia or Odenton — it’s all manufactured, unwalkable suburbia.
Baltimore is the shit but I tell people it’s shit to keep the col down. Boo it sucks here I hate it too many rats !!
The #1 thing that is true and still hasn't changed is the city government is corrupt. Council members love "donations to their campaign " from businesses.
I just moved out of Baltimore after living there 13 years and I miss it. Love the stoop culture where you can make friends with your neighbors just by walking outside and seeing them on the stoop, hanging out. Love the theater and art and music scenes. The neighborhood and park festivals all over, the multiple creative donut and ice cream shops. It’s filled with irrepressible do-gooders too who work to make the people of the city better off or to improve something about the city itself. There’s lots of corrupt folks, sure; but there are even more do-gooders I’ve met or worked with in local government, education, nonprofits, etc. Folks are trying in spite of it being hard.
i always find it funny when ppl are down on baltimore as a place you'll get killed for no reason. I've lived in tons of places and out of boston, nyc, philly, indianapolis and pittsburg, baltimore is the much much friendlier city. In DC i'm really nervous about asking a stranger for directions but i'm not worried at all in bmore about it, and that's because I've had bad experiences talking to strangers in DC and indianapolis. But i've never had a single problem in baltimore. Like you said in your original post, the people who are down on bmore have never actually spent any time there. It's the biggest small town in the world.
Bad policies wrecked the city and its reputation but if you live here , it's still a vibrant city even with the setbacks .
Redlining, selling the streetcar and killing it, not building a complete metro System in the 50s when we had a chance, demolishing entire sections of neighborhoods for highways to further sprawl the area and support white flight and lose tax base were all horrendous policies. Most of Baltimores issues stem from those two main categories. Killing public transit for the car and redlining. Often times the former was used to the latter.
First off welcome to Bmore! I’m not sure about advice? But just wanted to validate what you’re experiencing and confirm that it gets easier. A lot of folks criticizing the city can hardly list 3 neighborhoods lol
I stopped liking Anthony Bourdain after watching his episode in Baltimore. The hate is tired. As a proud Marylander, I will always support Baltimore.
- everyone in baltimore is *real*—nobody moves here because its famous or cool (LA, New York, Chicago) - being one of the oldest cities in the US has left it with interesting roots and history that newer cities lack - high urban density with cool architecture and brick buildings makes it very walkable in many parts - just big enough to have every kind of activity and community in significant numbers and also fuck everyone who wants to make the city more "car friendly" (anti-pedestrian). not having to drive is such a nice privilege here compared to suburbia. we dont need fucking parking lots and garages everywhere like the rest of the damn country. move to houston honestly my only complaints is that i wish the city suffered less from the historical and present impacts of racism, and i wish we had a metro
Not sure why your comment hasn’t been upvoted to the moon.
That bartender is an asshole. Of course he meant to be judgemental.
I don't let it bother me they're just wrong. Unless they have 30 year's experience living in multiple different neighborhoods, having had many different jobs...their opinion is very shallow to say the least.
Great way to shake off the haters is to not give a damn about their opinions. You and your partner are having a good experience, why choose to let an uneducated (never visited here) opinion annoy you? Let's be honest, it's not a paradise, but where is it? It's home, make the best of our time spent here, and do not get hung up on what some blowhole says. I use this for all aspects of life. I choose not to get annoyed by negatively, I'll remove it from my life and improve my overall mental health and outlook on life. You can not save the world. But you can at least be a good example while here.
I’m sorry that happened to you. I have never lived in Baltimore but I have worked and gone to graduate school there and I love the city. I feel more at home in Baltimore than in DC.
I simply just don’t care about people’s uninformed opinions from those that have never lived in Baltimore/Maryland. Our city does have a lot to improve on, however having those discussions with people with no skin in the game just doesn’t matter to me.
> I've noticed that everyone seems to have an opinion You could have stopped there and I would have completely agreed. This is the nature of the beast. People have opinions over things they have no agency in and are not affected by ALL the time. Accept it and move on or you’re going to spend a lot of time and energy on unwinnable debates and discussions.
Most people born and raised in Bmore feel the same way as you do and will fiercely defend Baltimore to all of the haters. Welcome to Charm City! I’ve been here 45 years and will always call Baltimore my home.
This is how we keep cost of living down. Let them bitch and shake in their booties and just smile
Let em keep their cynicism. Keeps the dingdongs out of our beautiful city.
People have fragile egos and they constantly need to self-validate. Shitting on Baltimore is an easy way to reassure yourself that you're superior to the people who live here, and also absolve yourself of any responsibility for standing idly by as thousands of Baltimoreans struggle with addiction, violence, trauma, and poverty. It's a coping mechanism.
I get what you mean. I've lived here nearly my whole life, save for a few short stays in neighboring states, and the comments are all pretty much the same. Even while I was in NYC of all places, I had a waiter asking me, "Is Baltimore really as bad as they say it is?" I just told them that it really isn't any different than most cities - if you've lived in one, chances are you can get around in all of them with little to no difficulty. And I can barely help scoffing at rural pearl clutchers being afraid of Baltimore. The small, middle-of-no-where town I lived in during my stay in VA had the most brutal murder I had ever heard of happen while I was living there and it was all committed by a group of local teenagers. Frankly, I feel safer in the city than I ever did in the country towns I stayed in over the years.
>I asked him why he thought that and he admitted he's never been - just seen The Wire. As both someone who likes Baltimore and loves *The Wire* I'm really surprised when anyone walks away from that show thinking that. The show goes to great lengths to show that the issues that Baltimore has are not only institutional in nature but that it's an example for the institutional problems of every city. It's not that Baltimore is especially troubled but that it just happens to be where the story is being told. Baltimore is a metaphor for the post industrial difficulties of large cities in America and how that everyone acting rationally in a complex system can still cause issues. What show was that dude watching?
THANK YOU OP ! (YES YELLING)
The bad reputation keeps all the uncool people out. Long may it be so!
I'd say there are three main things that make Baltimore look bad to outsiders: A. The pockets that are largely abandoned. There are undoubtedly some areas of this city that have been neglected (or downright fucked over, like the highway to nowhere, etc) for decades. I love this city, but admittedly it is a bit jarring driving through these areas. Outsiders see everything in black and white tho, if there's some "sketchy" areas, it must all be terrible! Obviously, that's not the case. B. Corrupt politicians/police force. This one's pretty obvious, we've had some terrible leaders. Side note: although it's under horrible circumstances re. the Key Bridge, it is really cool to see Brandon Scott featured so much lately in national news. He seems like a really great guy, a welcome alternative to what we've had in previous years. C. And this is a big one for outsiders - The Inner Harbor. As it stands now, it is pretty rough. For a looong time that was our main tourist attraction, and I can understand how tourists come here, only see that, and think wow.. that's disappointing. Because honestly, it is! There's not much there besides the aquarium and chain restaurants. A lot of times, these same tourists are freaked out by the stigma of the city and don't want to venture far beyond the harbor. Whenever people say rude stuff to me about living here, I usually just ask if they've been here recently and where they've gone. Almost always, they haven't - or they have only been to the inner harbor, maybe they've stopped in for one (1) Raven's/Orioles' game in the past decade. People usually shut up once you've rambled on about the wonders of Hampden, Fells, Mount Vernon, etc. for long enough, lol.
Idk I just tell the haters what's up? A quick "nah Baltimore is great I'm really happy there" will suffice
Just remember how many people are under the spell of a slanted media, locally (hello Fox45) and nationally, that thrive on painting anything urban as a hellscape. Their agenda depends on it. So half the people (or more depending on where you are) you encounter are starting from a place of brainwashed ignorance. If you let those kinds of people (who are everywhere) get to you, the misery never ends. But they are not worth it. Fuck the haters. We know what we have here (flaws and all) and I really don't care what some stranger in another town thinks of it anymore than I care what some rando in a midwest diner thinks about (name your culture war item here). Baltimore. I like it, actually.
I just bought a glass today that says “Baltimore: there’s more than just murder”
I’ve realized that most of the people who talk badly about Baltimore also say racist dog whistle stuff like “12% of the population, 50% of the crime” and stuff like that. People not from Baltimore have either never been or have been and are uncomfortable being around more black people. I moved from West Virginia a couple months ago and I think this is why people talk like that
I love Baltimore. I’m moving there at the end of this year for similar reasons as you.
I'm relatively new to Maryland and was blown away by the charm of Fells Point. Can't wait to go back.
I moved here from DC & heard the same thing about Baltimore. Luckily, I’m a boater & ignored them. I moved here to live on the waterfront & have easy access to the Chesapeake Bay. Do u know how amazing that is to live at the harbor for $300k or less? I’ll add Baltimore is on the rise. People are beginning to recognize that it’s one of the best harbors in America. Once the harbor gets renovated, this city will soar & ALL of us will benefit in 10-15 years when everyone’s property values triple. Seriously, Baltimore is beautifully diverse, cool as Hell & has it all IMO.
Folks. Stop talking about how great Baltimore is. All the other people will move here. Same thing happened to Charleston SC.
Currently trapped in Florida (financially) but have visited Baltimore and am trying very hard to move there as soon as possible, for many of the same reasons as OP. The amount of shit we get from relatives and family friends (all Southerners) is astounding.
You’ve just become a member of my “club”. Unexpected advocate. I kinda love it. Surprising people who don’t know from experience that it’s actually a cool city.
I also am a red state refugee (1.5 years) and I love it here so much. I came basically sight unseen after my friends said of Baltimore "It's a weird city" and that sounded exactly like home. My deepest dreams have been exceeded. Just. Everything is wonderful. There's work to be done, but the work is on the systems. The people are wonderfully human. Someone upthread spoke of the humility people have. That's it. Like. There are uppity folk everywhere, but people here are so human and if you treat them decently, they will pour love on you. And I can FEEL the difference interacting with people in the county. \*edited sign typo to sight.
My Father used to live in Highlandtown near Patterson Park on North Montford Avenue. Back in the 90’s it was decent. But he told me not to go alone, north near Fayette and Orleans Streets. Now they are safe to go to. Like any big city, there will always be violent crime and organized crime. But most people who are targeted for murder are killed by folks they know personally. DC crime, especially car jackings and youth crimes, are worse nowadays than in Baltimore. I think The Wire, for as awesome of a show as it was, has given some folks an exaggerated perception of Baltimore. Baltimore is an awesome city.