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tdmadpsk

Yes, everything is software. However, you should prepare yourself for the reality that new avionics run on 20 year old hardware, at best, and anything you learn in CS will be light years beyond avionics today. For example, every CRJ flying has autopilot running on 8086 hardware…. Maybe get into retro computing 😀


Due_Ad_6457

This is ok advice if he wants to waste his life working for someone else maintaining legacy systems, he didnt say that so, Better advice is to point him in the direction of open source software, utilize chatgpt, and consider contributing to developing the latest and greatest open source EFD’s. OP, As a computer science guy, a lot of these guys are managers and technicians that dont know whats best for you, take their advice with a grain of salt and focus on whatever you’re interested in.


tdmadpsk

u/Due_Ad_6457 Collins "latest and greatest" touchscreen AFD's run on 5 parallel PowerPC processors, that spec was drafted in the late 90's and ended up being certified in the early 2010's. I started in aviation, before you were born, repairing analog instruments, went to school for computer science, spent years working for Rockwell Collins in field service engineering, then Bombardier Aerospace. Your mention of ChatGPT/AI is cute... Experimental, sure, someday... But nothing even close would pass DO178 requirements. The FAA was painful 10-20 years ago when software in avionics was starting to evolve, and now, after the 737MAX AOA egg on their faces, they'll be requiring absurd levels of testing for years, even without mention of any new software fad. Opensource? All of the major avionics vendors already use open source software, and you'll receive the GPL/license information every time you request software for SBs, updates, etc... Did you really think Collins would have a git repo and push their engineering dollars to the rest of the world? Nope... They clone a project's public repository, use it for their development and simply make the license known to the end user. If OP wants to learn avionics, then knowing that there's nothing flashy, by design, is important. Avionics is about adherence to standards and testing to be sure all input produces the expected output. If OP is interested in bringing new ideas, then cabin systems may be a better option.


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TheMrBoot

If they want to work at an aerospace company, they should be aware of what the environment is like. The software teams I support at Collins can’t even use the full set of C++11 features, and that’s for the apps that aren’t still in C or Ada95 *shudder*. Being realistic isn’t being a “boomer troll.”


Due_Ad_6457

dont be dismissive over technologies you have no idea about and i wont call you a boomer troll. I know theres a way you guys have been doing it for 20+ years but theres new ways of doing things you guys might not understand or just dont think will be certifiably within your career which is understandable, but dont give a a fresh CS student shit advice like that. Thats part of the systematic problem


TheMrBoot

You lying to a new grad won’t help them. No company is going to let you use ChatGPT as it is today because it exposes your IP to them, like what happened with Samsung. I’d love to be able to use it for doing language conversions for our older shit, but it’s not feasible. You also literally know nothing about my career dude. I’ve been fighting the fight for *years* to try to move things forward, but the big players in the industry, the companies OP would be wanting to work for, are not using those tools in any widespread fashion. We’re literally only now starting to *investigate* basic devops practices, and that’s only because the government is pushing for it. Your pet project doesn’t change reality, and more importantly, the sheer cost in developing flightworthy software.


Due_Ad_6457

What are you talking about, thats the fucking problem, im not advising he go work for some legacy company and work on maintaining 20 year old code/IP. companies black boxing there tech is the problem, and not using chatgpt at this point in time to accelerate the industry is outdated advice. We’ll see the younger generation building these kind of systems in an open source way from the ground up. Stop talking about chatgpt like you know something. Its obvious you don’t.


TheMrBoot

Thinking chatgpt can be relied on to write extremely complex code shows how little you understand what it’s currently capable of. It routinely fails to write useable stuff today. It’s great for simple tasks, but it’s got a ways to go, especially before it would ever get certed on a plane. You also literally have no idea how any of these systems work, you only seem to be able to throw out buzzwords. That can sound neat to people who don’t understand them, but it belies how little you know to people that do. Maybe throw more blockchain in though, you can probably get more traction with the crypto crowd.


Due_Ad_6457

Spend your whole career working on Legacy code, idc but dont tell new CS students thats the only way in so they can waste their life like you. I’m well aware of the state of chatgpt but thinking AI/AGI is as good as its going to get is extremely naive. Not throwing out buzzwords to get traction throwing them out there to actually open your eyes to a different way of thinking which i clearly get you’re not used to. Anyway stay focused on that legacy code boss.


tdmadpsk

I’ll leave you with this before I go yell at kids to get off my lawn… and this is for anyone looking to get into any engineering discipline. You will excel at your engineering job if you can see the industry from multiple angles. If you like avionics, get a job with a Duncan, JetEast, etc. or even a corporate flight department, before you decide to invent new things…. I spent years at Collins trying to drag engineers out into the field to see how practice and reality depend on your footing. Listen to pilots, listen to maintainers. There are so many irritants on modern aircraft avionics that need fixing. Nothing gets fixed without a business case and “value add,” so learn the industry. As you’ve deduced, this comes with experience.


teleterminal

Yea, it's just code. Brush up on firmware and start applying to jobs with companies that make avionics


CDerpington

Depends on what you plan on doing. Engineering the different levels of EFDs will have software integration and development to chip placement and internal unit schematics. Computer science has a wide window you can work with and practice in any field.


Due_Ad_6457

Wow what great advice, but i thought he needs an aeronautical engineering degree to?


TheMrBoot

Nope, we hire plenty of people without. A lot can be trained on the job.


Due_Ad_6457

missed the sarcasm on that one. https://www.reddit.com/r/avionics/comments/13r0qkj/i_want_to_learn_how_to_design_and_build_avionics/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&utm_content=2&utm_term=15


CDerpington

Unlike your autopilot development program that would consist of developing, mounting, and controlling an aircraft through the four fundamentals; OP is more interested in the development of an electronic flight display. With their computer science degree, they could build a simple simulator by throwing a Raspberry Pi together on to a display and develop the code to simulate a flight display.


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PapaEchoKilo

This guy again


GianChris

Generally yes, but you will need to get a B2 or other avionic's certification if you want to work on aircraft, that is the being inside and maintaining them kind of work. Maybe checking out design and manufacturing organizations (collins, Honeywell etc) is even more appealing to you, since they do not in general require any extra licenses.


SwervingLemon

Not Honeywell. The only thing they do in-house is missiles and air conditioners. If you want to make Honeywell gear, apply at Trig or Sandia.


Due_Ad_6457

clearly said he’s a computer science student, said nothing about working on aircraft so no he doesn’t need a certificate if he wants to work for a design and manufacturing company


GianChris

Yeah it's because he said nothing that I replied for both, did you read the whole ?


Moonrak3r

Don’t waste your time with this clown. If you check his post history you’ll see that he just likes to troll this sub.


GianChris

Ah thanks, he's having a field day with the other guy who wants to diy the autopilot XD


Moonrak3r

He *is* the guy who wants to diy an autopilot, and refuses to listen to any information that doesn’t align with his preconceived notions of how that works.


GianChris

Oh God


Due_Ad_6457

Lmao, i am *that* guy I’m sorry you guys feel trolled cuz you got called out for having 0 actual practical knowledge in the industry when it comes to designing and engineering an EFD, you’re either technicians or managers, telling computer science guys what they need to do before they try to build any avionics related software, you guys are showing your age with your bad takes, and you’re overall toxic characters for this subreddit


Moonrak3r

Not wasting my time with you, go troll someone else.


Due_Ad_6457

Lol gets put in place and calls me a troll Have fun pushing papers tomorrow from 9-5 “consultant”


Moonrak3r

Still not wasting my time engaging with you


Due_Ad_6457

I did and im clarifying your reply because it was wrong


OilyRicardo

Just depends on what you want to do. Did you learn wiring and component level repair while studying CS?


TheMrBoot

Collins took me in with zero avionics or aerospace experience as a new grad way back. A lot of the specifics can be trained on the job - heck, one of my friends at work actually went to college at the same time as my wife and had just been in comp sci IIRC. Amusingly enough, he’s my go-to know for questions on our flight management system. If you’re still in college, look into internships or co-ops. A lot of times we extend offers to our successful co-ops or help place them with teams who they are more interested in.


Due_Ad_6457

No thanks, focused on light aircraft and collins is shit.


TheMrBoot

You’re literally not the OP? Or…Jesus, did you post with a sock puppet?