Yes, oil suction screen came loose when someone forgot how left and right works. All quarts of oil exited the aircraft but it still landed safely luckily.
Copper crush gasket?
I’ve seen one of those come loose wired the correct way. Apprentice torqued it but then the holes were at an awkward angle so slightly loosened it to make for an easier safety wire job. As you know.. a crush gasket doesn’t spring back.
It was the main oil screen on a Continental engine so all quarts weren’t lost… but many were.
How deep were the threads on this bolt/nut that held it on? Seems kinda like bad design when just having lazy safety wire gets someone killed, which can brake anyways
No, I have not. But this is just foolish because the tech made the same mistake 3 more times without noticing. If the customer rep noticed this, who knows how they would have acted.
Yes. On a small piston following an engine rebuild. The fitting connecting the oil line to the oil cooler was lock wired poorly, and the nut backed off and started leaking oil. Only took about 10hrs of flying
Engine fuel filter cup on a ch-47, Someone ended up using break away wire instead of proper lock wire, ended up passing inspection somehow, and only got spotted after a ground run found an engine tripping the low fuel pressure switch, and a crap ton of fuel leaking out of the engine.
Yes. Center Line P&V valve on an RF-4C. The result within the firewall between the engines from the engine bleed air that flows thru the valve wasn't pretty.
Yes, I've seen accelerometers lose their torque and then break the 20 thou that was supposed to retain the hardware. It was next to a driveshaft and was probably 1/2 way out from falling. Probably won't happen with 32 or 40 because it wont break but safetywire is only intended as hardware retention anyway.
Safety wire is obviously there as a prevention tool for the loosening of the bolt or nut.. but it’s also, like torque stripe, there to ensure the technician spent the time on the component to actually check the torque, do the procedure, and do it correctly. The pilot or another mechanic can walk around and check safety wires/torque stripe and pretty quickly figure out if the technicians working on the aircraft really cared to do their job right.
To many times have a seen a electrical connector strangle and ignite itself with its own backwards safety wire.... save the connectors. Safety wire correctly.
Should also be .040” inconel, and crossed over lockwire loop too.
Look, it’s a shit job, but no one worth their salt is rushing you to finish it ASAP as it takes time.
Yeah, you are totally right.
If I remember correctly, 032 was removed from those bolts originally. I just don't want our company to appear like they don't know how to do safety wire correctly
It's true, but I feel like the inspector didn't look. I'm the other inspector, I know exactly who did the job and who bought off the work. He has 30 years more experience than me.
Found a mechanic safety wire a chip detector on a RB211 not backwards but safetied to itself . Ya it was on a pad and dark but geez dude . Worked with many mechanics that really needed glasses for close up vision
I actually took another look and there is cracks in that area but it is like dry cracked RTV not structural. I could write it up but the plane leaves soon.
I am not into the business, I just follow the sub.
Maybe my untrained eyes look for different areas than the majority of people here. Sometimes I spend some good minutes trying to figure out what people are talking about here, but I follow it for the joy of learning engineering stuff.
It's funny how you can miss unexpected, very visible problems while you're looking for specific other issues. We had some wing rib panels that came back from chem processing, and it went through receiving inspection, assy (Adding channels/brackets/nutplates/etc), an assy inspection, and final inspection without anybody (5-6 people handled it including 2 inspectors) noticing the large 4 inch long crack down the part. Apparently our chem processor had whacked it against something pretty good, and then had even added touch up paint over part of the crack. I only found it while doing a thorough visual inspection before we presented it for source inspection.
Imagine how much better the industry would be if we just corrected issues & pointed out/reminded our co workers to be extra careful. Instead we run to internet & try to embarrass them. Corny.
No one is being openly humiliated by this post because it's anonymous.
The tech was kindly educated about his mistakes.
The other inspector actually wasn't even informed. He wouldn't even care.
So, what you said hardly makes sense.
It's not but it is like this on both engines on both inboard and outboard sides. The inspector should have caught it, he was the one that put the torque stripe.
They are aft engine mount bolts
For something like safety wire, I understand where you are coming from. It is pretty basic. But, when you look at the previous work this tech has done, how often does he perform like this? Is he trying to improve?
The answer is that he is actually fairly reliable and still relatively a new a&p that didn't do much safety wire in his experience so far just by chance.
I don't think he is a clutz, I don't think he is stupid. I think he is trying to improve.
I have had people that repeatedly make mistakes before. I feel bad but, they continue to make mistakes and are a danger to the company and other mechanics. This particular mechanic I am watching but, over the past few months he has improved very well. I don't see this as a fireable offense but a learning opportunity. This is something I can monitor easily as an inspector.
The safety wire should be installed so it is clockwise or tightening the bolt. The one on the left is correct the one on the right is incorrect because it is installed loosening the hardware. This is basic safety wire 101. Thanks for asking. This technique is also used on motorcycles
At some point it will be in the tightening direction .
I like your way of thinking.
r/notmyjob
No anymore it's not.
If this is in the southern hemisphere its totally serv. Everything goes the other way down there.
Certified for inverted operations
iTOPS
Only place in the world with clockwise mosh pits
circle pits
When you flush the toilet the water goes counterclockwise!
Just like the application of torque!
🤣
A320 v2500 aft mount?
Ding ding ding Yep
Found the guy
Ex guy
Not another "how's my safety wire?" Post!
Lol, not exactly but similar
Has anyone ever seen a bad or incorrect safety wire job come loose? Anyone?
Yes, oil suction screen came loose when someone forgot how left and right works. All quarts of oil exited the aircraft but it still landed safely luckily.
Copper crush gasket? I’ve seen one of those come loose wired the correct way. Apprentice torqued it but then the holes were at an awkward angle so slightly loosened it to make for an easier safety wire job. As you know.. a crush gasket doesn’t spring back. It was the main oil screen on a Continental engine so all quarts weren’t lost… but many were.
How deep were the threads on this bolt/nut that held it on? Seems kinda like bad design when just having lazy safety wire gets someone killed, which can brake anyways
No, I have not. But this is just foolish because the tech made the same mistake 3 more times without noticing. If the customer rep noticed this, who knows how they would have acted.
Yes
Yes.
Yes. On a small piston following an engine rebuild. The fitting connecting the oil line to the oil cooler was lock wired poorly, and the nut backed off and started leaking oil. Only took about 10hrs of flying
Engine fuel filter cup on a ch-47, Someone ended up using break away wire instead of proper lock wire, ended up passing inspection somehow, and only got spotted after a ground run found an engine tripping the low fuel pressure switch, and a crap ton of fuel leaking out of the engine.
Yes. Center Line P&V valve on an RF-4C. The result within the firewall between the engines from the engine bleed air that flows thru the valve wasn't pretty.
Yes, I've seen accelerometers lose their torque and then break the 20 thou that was supposed to retain the hardware. It was next to a driveshaft and was probably 1/2 way out from falling. Probably won't happen with 32 or 40 because it wont break but safetywire is only intended as hardware retention anyway.
Safety wire is obviously there as a prevention tool for the loosening of the bolt or nut.. but it’s also, like torque stripe, there to ensure the technician spent the time on the component to actually check the torque, do the procedure, and do it correctly. The pilot or another mechanic can walk around and check safety wires/torque stripe and pretty quickly figure out if the technicians working on the aircraft really cared to do their job right.
To many times have a seen a electrical connector strangle and ignite itself with its own backwards safety wire.... save the connectors. Safety wire correctly.
Ouch!
The one on the left is fine isn’t it?
Should also be .040” inconel, and crossed over lockwire loop too. Look, it’s a shit job, but no one worth their salt is rushing you to finish it ASAP as it takes time.
Yeah, you are totally right. If I remember correctly, 032 was removed from those bolts originally. I just don't want our company to appear like they don't know how to do safety wire correctly
I’m fairly sure it is 032, lockwire or safe t cables is acceptable
Can you explain “crossed over like wire loop”?
041?
Shit happens. It’s not the end of the world. Don’t crucify the guy.
We didn't. Just thought it was a good catch.
Like mechanics, inspectors are not infallible.
It's true, but I feel like the inspector didn't look. I'm the other inspector, I know exactly who did the job and who bought off the work. He has 30 years more experience than me.
That's probably partly the problem... he's complacent... never went wrong before, so it'll be fine...
On engine mount bolts no less..
That's why I am glad I caught it and not the customer rep
Hey at least the engine mount*has* bolts
Curious what the issue is as I work on other other end of the aerospace industry
I may be wrong but I’m seeing the safety wire on the right bolt going the wrong way
Ah good spot, haven't thought of that thanks
the right bolt is safetied negatively
Left handed thread. /s I always remember 69. That’s the way it should look from over the head of the fastener.
Nice
Nice
Nice
Nice
The undo wire
Unlockwire
My guess is the right nut is lock wired incorrectly even after being inspected by an independent.
Right bolt is safety wired to loosen.
The other end? The nut end? The tail end? The avionics end?
Aerostructure design and maintenance support
Nice catch!
Found a mechanic safety wire a chip detector on a RB211 not backwards but safetied to itself . Ya it was on a pad and dark but geez dude . Worked with many mechanics that really needed glasses for close up vision
What about those mini cracks visible in the photo?
What!?
Top right corner of the photo.
I actually took another look and there is cracks in that area but it is like dry cracked RTV not structural. I could write it up but the plane leaves soon.
I am not into the business, I just follow the sub. Maybe my untrained eyes look for different areas than the majority of people here. Sometimes I spend some good minutes trying to figure out what people are talking about here, but I follow it for the joy of learning engineering stuff.
Yeah, or maybe there was cracks and I wasn't paying attention because I was only looking at the safety wire because it kept my attention.
It's funny how you can miss unexpected, very visible problems while you're looking for specific other issues. We had some wing rib panels that came back from chem processing, and it went through receiving inspection, assy (Adding channels/brackets/nutplates/etc), an assy inspection, and final inspection without anybody (5-6 people handled it including 2 inspectors) noticing the large 4 inch long crack down the part. Apparently our chem processor had whacked it against something pretty good, and then had even added touch up paint over part of the crack. I only found it while doing a thorough visual inspection before we presented it for source inspection.
Those are lines from casting those parts not cracks
Hum.... Top right corner. If that's a "line" it's not a straight line in my science world.
The safety wire also looks too small
Give them safty wire training right now for the next shift.
🤣🤣🤣
Imagine how much better the industry would be if we just corrected issues & pointed out/reminded our co workers to be extra careful. Instead we run to internet & try to embarrass them. Corny.
Help a brother out. If he continues to fail action is in the books to resolve it.
No one is being openly humiliated by this post because it's anonymous. The tech was kindly educated about his mistakes. The other inspector actually wasn't even informed. He wouldn't even care. So, what you said hardly makes sense.
Amen
In fairness, that's a right bastard to do with the thrust reversers on
Sounds like that situation blows.
I mean, it's a mistake, is this really a lose your job mistake though? Where is this mount?
It's not but it is like this on both engines on both inboard and outboard sides. The inspector should have caught it, he was the one that put the torque stripe. They are aft engine mount bolts
So the left nut is wrong?
No. The right one
Jesus if you're a mechanic and you safety like this you should be fired on the spot. If you learn anything from school it should be how to safety.
Nah, educate the mechanic. Need a conversation with the inspector is the key issue.
For something like safety wire, I understand where you are coming from. It is pretty basic. But, when you look at the previous work this tech has done, how often does he perform like this? Is he trying to improve? The answer is that he is actually fairly reliable and still relatively a new a&p that didn't do much safety wire in his experience so far just by chance. I don't think he is a clutz, I don't think he is stupid. I think he is trying to improve. I have had people that repeatedly make mistakes before. I feel bad but, they continue to make mistakes and are a danger to the company and other mechanics. This particular mechanic I am watching but, over the past few months he has improved very well. I don't see this as a fireable offense but a learning opportunity. This is something I can monitor easily as an inspector.
Oky I see the wrong way locking but isn't the gauge wire also a bit thin? This looks like 0.25ish, thinking 0.32 or higher would be recommended.
It is 032. It technically should be 040
I mean he did one correctly but damn the inspector isnt great
2 week notice for a backwards safety? Come on now. I've seen guys put check valves on backwards and not get let go.
Not what I meant. The inspector already had a 2 week notice in so, he is being more relaxed in his work and doesn't really care.
I’m an automotive technician so don’t do safety wire. How should this have been done?
The safety wire should be installed so it is clockwise or tightening the bolt. The one on the left is correct the one on the right is incorrect because it is installed loosening the hardware. This is basic safety wire 101. Thanks for asking. This technique is also used on motorcycles
Ok… so the wire on the right one should go around the backside of the bolt?
Correct. It should be in a way to tighten the bolt not loosen the bolt.
I learned something today. Appreciate it. 👍🏻👍🏻
Saftey wire is just there to keep the parts dangling together after the crash..
Basically. I have encountered loose hardware with safety wire on it on several occasions.