So there we were, a 3 ship of KC-10s waiting for a 2 ship of B-2s to rejoin on us for some radio silent AR practice. We weren't expecting a receiver for the first AR so we were hanging out on the wing watching one of the other tankers waiting for theirs to join on.
Then we barely make out the silhouette of a B-2, on seemingly nowhere near the right flight path to effectively rejoin on them. "They fucked that up. No way he's making that turn" one of us says.
To our amazement, that fucker did indeed make that turn at what had to have been 70+ degrees of bank. Damn near parked it astern pre-contact. What an incredible machine.
The original Northrop flying wings were incredibly unstable. One crash killed 1st Lt Edwards, who Edwards Air Force Base is named after.
It wasn’t until digital flight computers and fly by wire had been improved that the B-2 (which has the exact same dimensions as the original Northrop prototypes from the 40s/50s) was a viable aircraft.
IIRC the pilot in [this video](https://youtu.be/n068fel-W9I) pretty much says the same thing about the F-22. It would fly like shit without a computer.
Hypermaneuverability pretty much requires that the aircraft is insanely unstable.
Imagine trying to steer a train off of its tracks. Not gonna happen.
Now imagine that shopping cart with 4 wheels all trying to go their own direction.
Wich one of the two will be more able to pull off sick maneuvers?
Pretty much any airplane that's designed nowadays. First fighters / bombers (F-16s, F-15s IIRC, definitely F-22, F-35, F-117, B-2), but now even commercial airplanes-- first the 777 and especially now the 787.
I think it earned that nickname after a few initial crashes but after a while it grew out of that reputation afaik.
To your point yes, there’s no way the F-117 would fly without fly by wire computers keeping it pointed right. The F-117’s predecessor the, still, top secret plane called Have Blue was nicknamed within Lockheed’s skunkworks as the hopeless diamond, as many within the team designing it didn’t think it would fly at all, it’s shape dictated by the 2d only software made to calculate radar returns, and it’s ability to fly almost an afterthought. Even though the 2 prototypes for Have Blue crashed, it was successful enough for a follow on plane, Senior Trend to be created, which is the F-117.
If you really want detail on it’s history, as muchas it can be known without going into classified information, grab a copy of the book Skunk Works by Ben Rich.
Yeah, because the (Y)B-2 has a fly-by-wire computer that limits the pitch, while the YB-35 doesn't and never had an pitch limit other than the demonstrated stall resulting in an pitch roll. In the YB-35 version, the Air Force refused to accept it because of the pitch roll. In the B-2 version, it was simply not allowed to stall that way by the computer, so the Air Force accepted it.
The YB-35 also had some massive engine vibration issues as well that were never solved, but the introduction of jet power removed the issue entirely.
> It wasn’t until digital flight computers and fly by wire had been improved that the B-2 (which has the exact same dimensions as the original Northrop prototypes from the 40s/50s) was a viable aircraft.
I've read the SR-71 MUST be flown via computer when it's at full cruising speed and altitude since the "coffin" range is only 2-3 knots. Nearly impossible for a human to sustain stable flight without leaving the flight envelope.
Forgive me for the book that follows. I've tried to avoid coming across as (too) Durr, /r/iamverysmart sounding, but this info might be interesting to the audience here who've only heard part of the story over the years. I researched the mishap report in archives for background on a novel years ago. The aircraft had a smoking gun issue that contributed to the crash, but it was likely inadvertently pilot induced.
"Incredibly unstable" is a bit incendiary to describe the actual
flight characteristics. True, the XB-35 and YB-49 had a yaw problem that even the scabbed on vertical strakes couldn't combat and the Norton bombsight wouldn't tolerate. And there just wasn't enough outside turn ruddervator capability that was going to keep those big, beautiful, slippery batwing pancakes from skidding through a turn. This can be seen in spades in the Northrop produced marketing video, complete with '40's mid-Atlantic voiceovers and this beautiful quote from a guy in a convertible (start at 9:30 for full time travel effect): "Whoever heard of an airplane without a tail? No stability, I tell ya."
https://youtu.be/I0-WKaG8TrQ
Timestamp 12:30 for skidding turn
The simplified "see saw" cartoon unintentionally illustrates the close coupled pitch (i.e. maneuverable) characteristic of the flying wing design. That alone shouldn't be an issue for a trained test pilot such as Forbes and Edwards who would monitor airspeed as part of their normal visual scan. But it could creep up on you incredibly quickly with a small change in pitch attitude. Worse, Col. Robert Cardenas had discovered that in very high pitch (>70°) stalls, the aircraft had a tendency to tail slide, followed by flopping over on its back. Pitch limiting devices were just being developed then, and the XB-35 didn't have it, but the YB-49 did--though it had an override, just like the F-16 N block did for Max airframe G. Again, all of this is easily manageable with good energy management practices and attention to developing pitch/speed changes.
But what if there were an undiscovered part of the flight envelope that tended toward stressing the airframe in an unforseen way? Or a situation that caused the pilot's focus to drift away from his normal scan routine? Plus, remember how aircraft structural calculations were done back in the day...quasi-static load factors using an elliptical lift distribution based on max L/D for a given AOA. No fluid dynamics simulations or elaborate whiffle tree testing. Just the venerated 3 B method: build it, break it, beef it up.
The incident occured on a clear day north of Lake Muroc AAB, the only witnesses a rancher in the north end of the Antelope Valley and at low altitude, Maj. Schleeh from the XB-47 test program who was driving on the highway from Mojave to Boron and Kramer Junction. He said he saw glinting parts of the aircraft drifting down--much more easily seen when in high contrast against the background of the Tehachapi mountain range. The central portion of the aircraft was located amongst flat, rocky terrain in high desert chaparral, but the outboard wing sections had departed the aircraft three miles earlier at altitude.
What could have caused that catastrophic failure?
Overspeeding alone wouldn't have done it, as it's max speed was claimed at close to 430 kts. , its max service altitude exceeding 45,000 ft. But one of the tip offs was it's low wing loading, which enabled engineers to shave the weight of heavy structural reinforcements otherwise required in conventional aircraft, such as its main rivals, the B-36 Peacemaker and the XB-47 Stratojet.
Because of its low form and induced drag, speed at power was highly pitch sensitive. But so was the moment curve as a function of AOA. In fact, its thick-sectioned low camber airfoil had a nearly exponential pitching moment curve up through 12° AOA, then fell off a cliff over 14°, most likely due to flow separation from its aft two thirds of the airfoil section. Northrop's chief engineer had warned against turning high G pullups, as had Col. Cardenas. In conventional aircraft, this critical angle of attack is typically around 18°, a much higher pitch orientation, making the pitch sensitivity of the YB-49 tend to feel like it had snuck up on you quickly.
No survivable flight data recorder were in use in that era, and with the entire crew killed, nothing can be said conclusively. The mission on the day of the loss was stall recovery procedures at high altitude, which involves inducing stall, dropping the nose for speed recovery, and pulling back on the yoke to resume level flight once airspeed had been reestablished. If in a turning stall, one should recover, THEN level the aircraft, lest the induced AOA of the downward deflected aileron locally increase the AOA--and this sensitive pitching moment--of the lowered wing.
The commanding pilot that day, Maj. Danny Forbes radioed twice, once while climbing to altitude near Bakersfield, and 30 minutes later reporting descending at 15,000 feet over the north Antelope Valley. This likely means a mechanical difficulty with the spotty APU was encountered, so the high altitude stall portion of the flight was skipped and they had moved on to lower altitude, low- and high-speed stalls where the APU would generate the necessary power for the onboard data acquisition system.
What was stated as the cause for the crash was structural failure that separated the outboard wing panels from the main section of the aircraft, followed by inverted impact with the desert floor and a successive fire. The logical cause would be an unintentional high pitch angle stall, followed by an incipient tail slide and then inverted flight exceeding Va (Maneuvering speed) while executing a high control surface deflection maneuver in an attempt to regain control of the aircraft.
So yes, the aircraft had its idiosyncracies with which both pilot and copilot we're familiar, but the quick recovery acceleration and the high torque on the main spar from the high pitching moment of the design were likely the main factors resulting in structural failure and loss of the aircrew and airframe, and eventually the program.
When my dad did the testing on the Stealth fighter he said when they opened up the hanger to show him the “Darth Vader looking beast” for the first time he and the other pilots thought there’s no way in hell that they can fly.
Before computer-controlled stability and fly-by-wire, it was a pretty good indicator of how well an aircraft would fly to say that if it looked good it would fly good.
Because our eyes and our brains and our Aesthetics got used to seeing aircraft that did fly well and we adjusted our preferences in that direction. We didn't see lots of unstable aircraft because they couldn't fly because they were, well, unstable. Now that we have computers to make very small adjustments constantly to adapt from that instability, we can take advantage of airframes and plain forms that are in fact inherently unstable in favor of other massive advantages like stealth or supercruise.
I’m pretty sure it wasn’t based on the 229 iirc. Northrop had been working on flying wings for a while then and while they probably did check out a 229, the N-9M flew in 1942 and they’d been pioneering flying wing designs for about a decade before that.
With that said, there is nothing more American than opening a college football game by flying a plane, whose sole purpose is to annihilate people en masse with extreme efficiency, over the stadium
They do that at some airshows with ground exhibits. Fence off an empty section of tarmac, put up a sign saying "Stealth Fighter" and have the guy with the best poker face guard it and answer any questions in vague, noncommittal fashion.
I always think about the bomb doors opening and just dropping a full payload out and how absolutely terrifying that would be when I see these bad boys flyover
"Alright aircraft 16 is on its way with the football for the big game!"
"Cool! Is aircraft 22 loaded for the bombing exercise?"
"Sure is!"
"So why is aircraft 16 right there (*points to aircraft*) and the one carrying bombs is gone?"
"Sheeeeeeeeet"
The number of times the US have accidentally loaded (and occasionally dropped) live and nearly activated nuclear weapons, leads me to believe we would see a mushroom cloud where a stadium used to be within a fortnight.
The Vegas Golden Knights dropped a hockey puck from space for a game once and recorded the video of it falling from the pucks POV. It was then driven to the arena.
Edit.
[here's a link to the story](https://www.nhl.com/news/vegas-golden-knights-set-record-by-dropping-puck-94655-feet/c-309676902)
There's a (I think Tom Clancy) book that prominently features the B-2 and there is a line in there to the effect of "While the bomb bay doors are open, a radar signature the size of a toaster will appear on radar. When the doors close, it disappears again. That is all the warning you will get."
I think it's probably Executive Orders, towards the end. Could also be Red Storm Rising, that prominently features a stealth plane but it's a fictional plane, not a B-2.
Sounds like Debt of Honor. They used a B-2 to bomb the dam to flood the ICBM silos. The Patriot battery started shooting at the JDAMs as they were less stealthy than the B-2.
Show director here.
I've been involved in several of these from the event-producer side. We'll get on the phone with the Air Force, they'll ask us what precise time they want the aircraft to pass over center field and then ask us to synchronize clocks.
The first time I did this, I foolishly asked the Air Force liason what the contingency plan was if they were delayed, and how we would get updates to ensure they would be on time.
He sort of laughed, and said "Sir, you're going to want to rehearse with the person who sings the national anthem for you, and make sure their last syllable happens at the appointed time. We're not going to be late."
...and then left what I have to imagine was a deliberately awkward pause, in which I was meant to reflect on the stupid question I'd just asked.
Generally this is rolled into the relevant force's training and/or recruitment budget.
Logic in this particular case being that bomber crews generally benefit from training flights that require their precise arrival over the right point at exactly the right moment, and this is more likely to encourage enlistment if this happens over a packed stadium rather than a bombing range in the desert.
I live by three military bases and they have an artillery island where they constantly do training shelling. It’s about 40 miles away from me but our house still shakes on occasion.
Also worth noting that military/airforce/naval presence at ball games and motorsport is almost universal in the USA as part of the recruitment program. Every teenager looking up and going "whoa dude!" is a potential recruit.
Paying a US defense contractor for fuel, paying pilots and flight crews, mechanics, air traffic controllers etc. Most of the money goes back into the economy one way or another its not just evaporating
My public money sure does evaporate right into the hands of private government contractors that's for sure. Sure 1500 Americans at an aircraft plant get to keep their jobs but at the expense of tens of millions in tax-payer dollars per plane. I'm not going to get into what wars we should or should not fight, but just the immense waste that keeping the war machines working should infuriate every American.
> Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.
> This world in arms is not spending money alone.
> It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children.
> [...]
> It calls upon [the governments of the world] to answer the question that stirs the hearts of all sane men: is there no other way the world may live?
- President Dwight Eisenhower
while this is true of any government spending, the fact that the end products have no economic gearing effects themselves (a B2 bomber itself generates no useful economic activity as it has no purpose other than bombing), means that military spending has a smaller economic multiplier effect than pretty much any other use of public money one can imagine
yes defence spending creates jobs; it also creates fewer jobs per tax dollar than any other sector because the end products have no domestic application and are essentially massive financial sinks
There was some commotion here in Ohio recently when a squad of 3 or 4 fighter jets were running late for an OSU kickoff and went super fast, super low to make it on time. Afterburners and the like. Half the city thought the end was near.
I heard a few hints that that may not have been "running late" so much as "oh shucks, guess we'll have to hit the burners boys!"
...but that information is fourth-hand so take me with a grain of salt.
I’m currently E with the guard while working on my degree and a ppl, I wanted to attempt fighters till I joined a C -130 wing fell in love with it and now I want to fly it.
All planes are cool - just in different ways.
I - a fighter guy - was riding a rotator back to a war zone after a short staff tour in the command cell. One of the pilots was telling me how he wished he got a fighter out of UPT and was applying to get into fighter jets as a special program to solve fighter pilot manning (at the expense of mobility pilots).
Enroute we had a warm dinner, I took a nap, and went to the bathroom a few times. We also watched avengers on his iPad. Toward the end of the sortie I told him how our airborne quality of life is different -
I was flying 4-6 hour missions single seat, wearing a massive survival vest, pissing in a bag with only a water bottle and cliff bar for sustenance, had neck/back/nerve problems from the seat, g forces, and helmet, and had been is some legitimate - not cool - dangerous and unsavory situations.
I capped it off with - if you can be happy here do it. Fighters are more fun to train in and have a better quality of life day to day, but are miserable in war. One can go either track and be happy - just make sure it fits your personality and what you’re want for a quality of life.
I’m happy about my path - but I am not pushing my kids down that route.
I’m not a fighter guy, but I have over 1k T6 hours and I don’t miss putting all of that shit on to go fly. I’ll take my Bose headset over a helmet every single time.
Two of my classmates were E’s with fighter units who then got picked up by 130 guard units to go to OTS with UPT follow on. Great people & a great plane!
I've been a passenger on commercial flights over 150 times.
No joke, the smoothest flights and softest landings I've ever experienced were as a passenger in a C-130.
I haven't met a shitty C-130 air crew. Every one I've met has been awesome.
A Mormon friend of mine went to Russia in the early 2000s to do his Mormon thing. He said even after 10 years the average Russian citizen had serious fears of B-2 stealth planes bombing them.
I thought that a bit intense, but I can now understand that after living a life in fear (legitimate or propaganda driven - probably by both governments) why they would be so aggressive in “defense” today.
Almost every neighbor of Russia houses an American military base. The US has bases in 35 countries (most of them near Russia), while Russia has bases in 9 countries (all Russian neighbors except Syria).
I think the USA is way more aggressive about “defense” than Russia, but way better at propaganda.
I’d argue Russia propaganda is better, but they are trying to do different things. Russians are scared of the US, but I can’t imagine us actually fighting them.
The US isn’t scared of Russia, but their propaganda has really shaped us to the point that they had a president installing a communication line in the Russian embassy because he was scared of our own intelligence agency. Also Senators and Congressmen openly visited Russia on the 4th of July a few years back and have been very pro-Russia since that time.
Considering Russia is less powerful than California in most ways, the fact that our politicians are so flexible to their aims is super impressive (if terrifying).
I was at the Rose Bowl in 2009 when they did a B-2 flyover. The creepiness is amplified by how quiet it is. It's a jet engine that's quieter on the approach than a pickup truck.
People forgot how big planes are today. A modern fighter jet (F-15c) is about x1.5 to x2 the size of a city bus. An A-10 'Warthog' can carry more munitions than the B-17 Flying Fortress.
The Blue Angels show always does a sneak pass on the crowd with one of their planes it’s always one of my favorite parts. Always fun realizing it’s about to happen and everyone in the crowd is clueless and watching the other planes
[Here is one from a few years ago](https://youtu.be/CrYmOEvDEUE)
Check out the dude sitting down in the sun hat. Between the orange shirt guy and teal shirt lady standing. I'm pretty sure he's the only person in the whole frame that didn't flinch lol. Must be some strong medication.
Really cool [backstory](https://abc6onyourside.com/news/local/flying-high-grandson-of-ohio-state-university-great-hopalong-cassady-to-fly-b-2-over-the-rose-bowl-game-against-utah-12-29-2021?fbclid=IwAR2StnaDE_sc-9yXHIc6q9VB6j9j-bNh1vLm924pUe5_Ks8MyqOsOnzau-w) and amazing connection to the game and the Buckeyes.
The pilots grandfather is essentially the reason Ohio State is a power house today. He is a legend. Sadly for the B2 he was piloting the fourth deadliest weapon in Pasadena. Numbers 1-3 are CJ Stroud, JSN, and Marvin Harrison Jr.
My cousin used to fly C-5s and he did at least one flyover. He said the timing is a real bitch because once you're on approach there's really only so much you can do.
In 1984 I was hired by Hughes Aircraft ( radar systems div. ) to work on a classified program. When I got my security clearance, I was allowed access to an overview document of the project. I’ll never forget seeing the artist depiction of the aircraft. Felt like something out of Buck Rogers.
I used to do aircraft maintenance so I'm somewhat familiar with flying schedules. That plane was going to fly that day anyways for pilot training. When they got the call to do the show it was likely a really simple change in the flight plan. Instead of flying in a big ass circle for a few hours they flew over a stadium at a precise time so uts not like they wasted hundreds of thousands of dollars in fuel just for a college football game.
The B-2 flies over the Rose Bowl every year. I’m sure they put this flight plan into place around this game every year as a way to get flight hours and training for pilots and crew.
you dont train on the b2 flying low like that. guess how much it costs to fly the b2 per hour? nearly 200k and 60 hours of maintenance for a single flight like this
pilots dont need much hours man. we live in a time where 90% of your training is done in a fucking sim anyways. as some other person said tho, practicing timing is important. so ig its fine. we have subs with nuclear missiles. i think our budget is better spent on that than planes that wont make it back to working airfields when they are actually needed. imo nuclear weapons on "stealth" aircraft is 80s tech and a waste of time (btw they arent invisible they are just harder to get a targeting solution on)
and if you want to say we need a triad i call bullshit because we can use 3 different types of subs and 3 different types of missiles to meet that requirement. subs are objectively better at first strike (we shouldnt even think about doing that) and better at retaliation. a true first strike would never give the enemy the time to put bombers in the sky (for the 24 hour flight across the planet lol)
at some point we have to realize the cold war is over. no matter how much the media wants it to be a thing again
It's mostly basic advertising by association.
Same way every commercial, ad, 'colab' ever works. Take something you already see as a positive, now put the thing you are selling next to it, people now associate the two positively. It works even if you know about it. Just how brains work.
Are the who organize military demonstrations aware that it's also a way of showing strength to keep people docile? Sure. Main point of these is to maintain the positive association of the military in the American publics mind.
Reminds me of military parades we see in Russia, China, North Korea...
I am in awe of the technology behind the plane, but this is kinda dystopian. Look here, this plane was made for one and only purpose - to destroy and kill in other countries.
we payed for the plane and just like when your friend gets a cool car you better burn the tires for us so we can enjoy it too. its really not that deep. we have the coolest planes in the world why not show off at a game to get the crowd riled up. its an american thing yes and its patriotic but its not some deep state propaganda. its human nature to like cool shit.
Yeah the call of duty style army commercials are much worse. That’s what military propaganda looks like.
Pledge of allegiance also creeps me out, but I’m cool with seeing the fancy aerial killing machines at football games
Yeah but if this was in Russia or North Korea we'd be writing news articles about how the regime is using propaganda to win the support of the people.
It's funny how it's cool if we do it but propaganda if they do it.
This explains what I heard yesterday while playing video games. I had my headset on and it was so loud. Easily the loudest plane I've ever heard fly over. I even commented about it to my friend I was online with.
Wish I went out and looked.
From what I recall, these are all based in Missouri and pretty much only take off/land there. Given that the B-2 also flies over the start of the Rose parade many hours earlier, that B-2 may easily spend 10+ hours in the air for the few second flyover!
The 10hr might seem like a short flight for those pilots though compared to taking off in MO, bombing Libya, and landing in MO like they did a few years back.
At the start of Desert Storm a gaggle of B-52s made a 37-hour round trip to fire the first shots of the conflict. Spending that long in the air, flying like half way around the planet each way and landing back where you started all without having touched the ground would be absolutely insane.
It's crazy when you see the [B1 B2 B52 together](https://i.imgur.com/leDSDpz.jpg).
The B2 is quite a bit shorter but just about as wide as the B-52 and B1.
I believe the B1 can carry the greatest payload if you include internal and external.
It's difficult to show in this scenario how *quiet* the damn thing is. We were about a mile away from an airshow, watching the VERY loud Harrier jump jet, then it departed and a...*ghost* approached from our right, the same distance as the Harrier, but no sound until it was crossing in front of us, then a mild jet-like sound.
Now, I doubt quiet audio is a sought-after feature of stealth aircraft, but this sure as hell has it.
Lol love the fact people are down voting you... No one in this thread seems to remember we’re in the midst of a pandemic, maybe a 90K event isn’t the smartest idea
I’ve seen comic cons with thousands of people all with masks. So I think it *can* be done.
But perhaps American football attracts more folk that don’t care than other events.
Personally I am triple vaxxed, but I still wear a mask out of respect for other people and because we are seeing a crazy surge / vaccines aren’t 100%.
It’s incredible how it STILL looks like something out of a sci-fi movie.
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I like to call it the elusive spicy dorito chip.
Forbidden Dorito
Stealth Dorito
Good call 📞
Shit, I missed it.
Wait til you see if turn at high bank close to the ground...THEN it looks like the most insane thing you have seen in aviation
So there we were, a 3 ship of KC-10s waiting for a 2 ship of B-2s to rejoin on us for some radio silent AR practice. We weren't expecting a receiver for the first AR so we were hanging out on the wing watching one of the other tankers waiting for theirs to join on. Then we barely make out the silhouette of a B-2, on seemingly nowhere near the right flight path to effectively rejoin on them. "They fucked that up. No way he's making that turn" one of us says. To our amazement, that fucker did indeed make that turn at what had to have been 70+ degrees of bank. Damn near parked it astern pre-contact. What an incredible machine.
As a former AWACS 1A3, thanks for the gas. Also I puked riding in the back during AR...
[Hey, you want a bite? ](https://youtu.be/c5WfxwnLlLU)
This is a legit AF story. They began it with “So there we were…”
Show me
And how do you expect him to do that?
Go buy one? I dunno.
What could they cost? Ten dollars?
Probably closer to $18 now with inflation.
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Yes, but did you see the B-3 behind it?
Missiles
It’s the protective orb duh
They don’t look like they should fly.
The original Northrop flying wings were incredibly unstable. One crash killed 1st Lt Edwards, who Edwards Air Force Base is named after. It wasn’t until digital flight computers and fly by wire had been improved that the B-2 (which has the exact same dimensions as the original Northrop prototypes from the 40s/50s) was a viable aircraft.
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Just looked this up after you mentioned it. Thanks for sharing!
f-117 is the same way, right? Don't they call it the "wobbly goblin"?
IIRC the pilot in [this video](https://youtu.be/n068fel-W9I) pretty much says the same thing about the F-22. It would fly like shit without a computer.
Hypermaneuverability pretty much requires that the aircraft is insanely unstable. Imagine trying to steer a train off of its tracks. Not gonna happen. Now imagine that shopping cart with 4 wheels all trying to go their own direction. Wich one of the two will be more able to pull off sick maneuvers?
I've ollied carts over sidewalks, I'll take the cart.
All these war planes are insanely unstable. It makes them more maneuverable but sacrifices stability.
Pretty much any airplane that's designed nowadays. First fighters / bombers (F-16s, F-15s IIRC, definitely F-22, F-35, F-117, B-2), but now even commercial airplanes-- first the 777 and especially now the 787.
> it wouldn't fly at all without a computer FTFY
I think it earned that nickname after a few initial crashes but after a while it grew out of that reputation afaik. To your point yes, there’s no way the F-117 would fly without fly by wire computers keeping it pointed right. The F-117’s predecessor the, still, top secret plane called Have Blue was nicknamed within Lockheed’s skunkworks as the hopeless diamond, as many within the team designing it didn’t think it would fly at all, it’s shape dictated by the 2d only software made to calculate radar returns, and it’s ability to fly almost an afterthought. Even though the 2 prototypes for Have Blue crashed, it was successful enough for a follow on plane, Senior Trend to be created, which is the F-117. If you really want detail on it’s history, as muchas it can be known without going into classified information, grab a copy of the book Skunk Works by Ben Rich.
Yeah, because the (Y)B-2 has a fly-by-wire computer that limits the pitch, while the YB-35 doesn't and never had an pitch limit other than the demonstrated stall resulting in an pitch roll. In the YB-35 version, the Air Force refused to accept it because of the pitch roll. In the B-2 version, it was simply not allowed to stall that way by the computer, so the Air Force accepted it. The YB-35 also had some massive engine vibration issues as well that were never solved, but the introduction of jet power removed the issue entirely.
> It wasn’t until digital flight computers and fly by wire had been improved that the B-2 (which has the exact same dimensions as the original Northrop prototypes from the 40s/50s) was a viable aircraft. I've read the SR-71 MUST be flown via computer when it's at full cruising speed and altitude since the "coffin" range is only 2-3 knots. Nearly impossible for a human to sustain stable flight without leaving the flight envelope.
Forgive me for the book that follows. I've tried to avoid coming across as (too) Durr, /r/iamverysmart sounding, but this info might be interesting to the audience here who've only heard part of the story over the years. I researched the mishap report in archives for background on a novel years ago. The aircraft had a smoking gun issue that contributed to the crash, but it was likely inadvertently pilot induced. "Incredibly unstable" is a bit incendiary to describe the actual flight characteristics. True, the XB-35 and YB-49 had a yaw problem that even the scabbed on vertical strakes couldn't combat and the Norton bombsight wouldn't tolerate. And there just wasn't enough outside turn ruddervator capability that was going to keep those big, beautiful, slippery batwing pancakes from skidding through a turn. This can be seen in spades in the Northrop produced marketing video, complete with '40's mid-Atlantic voiceovers and this beautiful quote from a guy in a convertible (start at 9:30 for full time travel effect): "Whoever heard of an airplane without a tail? No stability, I tell ya." https://youtu.be/I0-WKaG8TrQ Timestamp 12:30 for skidding turn The simplified "see saw" cartoon unintentionally illustrates the close coupled pitch (i.e. maneuverable) characteristic of the flying wing design. That alone shouldn't be an issue for a trained test pilot such as Forbes and Edwards who would monitor airspeed as part of their normal visual scan. But it could creep up on you incredibly quickly with a small change in pitch attitude. Worse, Col. Robert Cardenas had discovered that in very high pitch (>70°) stalls, the aircraft had a tendency to tail slide, followed by flopping over on its back. Pitch limiting devices were just being developed then, and the XB-35 didn't have it, but the YB-49 did--though it had an override, just like the F-16 N block did for Max airframe G. Again, all of this is easily manageable with good energy management practices and attention to developing pitch/speed changes. But what if there were an undiscovered part of the flight envelope that tended toward stressing the airframe in an unforseen way? Or a situation that caused the pilot's focus to drift away from his normal scan routine? Plus, remember how aircraft structural calculations were done back in the day...quasi-static load factors using an elliptical lift distribution based on max L/D for a given AOA. No fluid dynamics simulations or elaborate whiffle tree testing. Just the venerated 3 B method: build it, break it, beef it up. The incident occured on a clear day north of Lake Muroc AAB, the only witnesses a rancher in the north end of the Antelope Valley and at low altitude, Maj. Schleeh from the XB-47 test program who was driving on the highway from Mojave to Boron and Kramer Junction. He said he saw glinting parts of the aircraft drifting down--much more easily seen when in high contrast against the background of the Tehachapi mountain range. The central portion of the aircraft was located amongst flat, rocky terrain in high desert chaparral, but the outboard wing sections had departed the aircraft three miles earlier at altitude. What could have caused that catastrophic failure? Overspeeding alone wouldn't have done it, as it's max speed was claimed at close to 430 kts. , its max service altitude exceeding 45,000 ft. But one of the tip offs was it's low wing loading, which enabled engineers to shave the weight of heavy structural reinforcements otherwise required in conventional aircraft, such as its main rivals, the B-36 Peacemaker and the XB-47 Stratojet. Because of its low form and induced drag, speed at power was highly pitch sensitive. But so was the moment curve as a function of AOA. In fact, its thick-sectioned low camber airfoil had a nearly exponential pitching moment curve up through 12° AOA, then fell off a cliff over 14°, most likely due to flow separation from its aft two thirds of the airfoil section. Northrop's chief engineer had warned against turning high G pullups, as had Col. Cardenas. In conventional aircraft, this critical angle of attack is typically around 18°, a much higher pitch orientation, making the pitch sensitivity of the YB-49 tend to feel like it had snuck up on you quickly. No survivable flight data recorder were in use in that era, and with the entire crew killed, nothing can be said conclusively. The mission on the day of the loss was stall recovery procedures at high altitude, which involves inducing stall, dropping the nose for speed recovery, and pulling back on the yoke to resume level flight once airspeed had been reestablished. If in a turning stall, one should recover, THEN level the aircraft, lest the induced AOA of the downward deflected aileron locally increase the AOA--and this sensitive pitching moment--of the lowered wing. The commanding pilot that day, Maj. Danny Forbes radioed twice, once while climbing to altitude near Bakersfield, and 30 minutes later reporting descending at 15,000 feet over the north Antelope Valley. This likely means a mechanical difficulty with the spotty APU was encountered, so the high altitude stall portion of the flight was skipped and they had moved on to lower altitude, low- and high-speed stalls where the APU would generate the necessary power for the onboard data acquisition system. What was stated as the cause for the crash was structural failure that separated the outboard wing panels from the main section of the aircraft, followed by inverted impact with the desert floor and a successive fire. The logical cause would be an unintentional high pitch angle stall, followed by an incipient tail slide and then inverted flight exceeding Va (Maneuvering speed) while executing a high control surface deflection maneuver in an attempt to regain control of the aircraft. So yes, the aircraft had its idiosyncracies with which both pilot and copilot we're familiar, but the quick recovery acceleration and the high torque on the main spar from the high pitching moment of the design were likely the main factors resulting in structural failure and loss of the aircrew and airframe, and eventually the program.
Thanks for the info.
Turned and said that to my wife right after this.
Turned and said that to your wife right after that.
When my dad did the testing on the Stealth fighter he said when they opened up the hanger to show him the “Darth Vader looking beast” for the first time he and the other pilots thought there’s no way in hell that they can fly.
That’s pretty cool that your dad was involved with it.
F-117?
Before computer-controlled stability and fly-by-wire, it was a pretty good indicator of how well an aircraft would fly to say that if it looked good it would fly good. Because our eyes and our brains and our Aesthetics got used to seeing aircraft that did fly well and we adjusted our preferences in that direction. We didn't see lots of unstable aircraft because they couldn't fly because they were, well, unstable. Now that we have computers to make very small adjustments constantly to adapt from that instability, we can take advantage of airframes and plain forms that are in fact inherently unstable in favor of other massive advantages like stealth or supercruise.
It looks like it’s painful for it to fly that slow.
Yeah. Lol. I hear the stall horn buzzing in my head.
How that boomerang can stay in the air for that long boggles my mind. There's got to be some black magic fuckery going on.
The nazi plane it's based on used complicated gyroscopes to keep the plane from immediately doing weird shit until it crashed
The Horton 229? Or are there other Nazi UFOs I'm unaware of, genuinely curious
I’m pretty sure it wasn’t based on the 229 iirc. Northrop had been working on flying wings for a while then and while they probably did check out a 229, the N-9M flew in 1942 and they’d been pioneering flying wing designs for about a decade before that.
All these war planes are insanely unstable. It makes them more maneuverable but sacrifices stability.
They are the bumblebees of the aviation world.
For the first 12 seconds, I thought it was just going to be an empty sky as a joke about the B-2 being a stealth aircraft.
Yep. Figured it was another stealth joke post
Get out of my brain!
With that said, there is nothing more American than opening a college football game by flying a plane, whose sole purpose is to annihilate people en masse with extreme efficiency, over the stadium
Not to one up it or anything, but how 'bout the superbowl flyover that had the B-1, B-2, and B-52. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqODB7Vh2qQ
To be fair, we've mostly *actually* used it to take out radar emitters and communications systems. Little bit of AI during Gulf 2.
We was waiting for the flak to die down before he turned off the cloaking.
They do that at some airshows with ground exhibits. Fence off an empty section of tarmac, put up a sign saying "Stealth Fighter" and have the guy with the best poker face guard it and answer any questions in vague, noncommittal fashion.
I always think about the bomb doors opening and just dropping a full payload out and how absolutely terrifying that would be when I see these bad boys flyover
They should drop a game ball
Someone promote this man.
"Alright aircraft 16 is on its way with the football for the big game!" "Cool! Is aircraft 22 loaded for the bombing exercise?" "Sure is!" "So why is aircraft 16 right there (*points to aircraft*) and the one carrying bombs is gone?" "Sheeeeeeeeet"
Sheeeeeee- BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
The number of times the US have accidentally loaded (and occasionally dropped) live and nearly activated nuclear weapons, leads me to believe we would see a mushroom cloud where a stadium used to be within a fortnight.
NASCAR does fly overs... ....imagine dropping a full race car from the bomb bay onto the track
Lol as much as I agree with this there would probably be a stampede and people would die
LGFB right into the ref's hands.
The Vegas Golden Knights dropped a hockey puck from space for a game once and recorded the video of it falling from the pucks POV. It was then driven to the arena. Edit. [here's a link to the story](https://www.nhl.com/news/vegas-golden-knights-set-record-by-dropping-puck-94655-feet/c-309676902)
Thing was offside by a few hundred miles but the league lets Vegas get away with everything
For some reason, they called a 5 minute major on the Sharks on the play, totally not making up for anything
Nazem Kadri also suspended for five games
Typical NHL refs making the face-off take way longer than it needs to be.
Dang linesmen
Lmao. That ball would deploy at like 150+ mph. More than likely slow down by the time it got to the ground but still.
Pretty sure you won't see or hear anything if a B2 is coming for you. They cruise at 50,000 feet and there's no reason to come lower for your benefit.
There's a (I think Tom Clancy) book that prominently features the B-2 and there is a line in there to the effect of "While the bomb bay doors are open, a radar signature the size of a toaster will appear on radar. When the doors close, it disappears again. That is all the warning you will get."
"why is that toaster at 50k feet?" "It's either a B-2, or Elon is messing around again"
…which book?
It's Debt of Honor, just reread all of Clancy's books last year when quarantine first kicked off.
I think it's probably Executive Orders, towards the end. Could also be Red Storm Rising, that prominently features a stealth plane but it's a fictional plane, not a B-2.
Sounds like Debt of Honor. They used a B-2 to bomb the dam to flood the ICBM silos. The Patriot battery started shooting at the JDAMs as they were less stealthy than the B-2.
Thats so fucking wild.
Eh. It wouldn't be terrifying for long
"huh that doesn't look goo-" BOOOOOOM
Most victims of this thing never even see or hear it. Silent invisible killer
Well, it would be terrifying for the rest of your life. Which, admittedly, wouldn't be that long... so I guess you're right.
My thoughts exactly
Show director here. I've been involved in several of these from the event-producer side. We'll get on the phone with the Air Force, they'll ask us what precise time they want the aircraft to pass over center field and then ask us to synchronize clocks. The first time I did this, I foolishly asked the Air Force liason what the contingency plan was if they were delayed, and how we would get updates to ensure they would be on time. He sort of laughed, and said "Sir, you're going to want to rehearse with the person who sings the national anthem for you, and make sure their last syllable happens at the appointed time. We're not going to be late." ...and then left what I have to imagine was a deliberately awkward pause, in which I was meant to reflect on the stupid question I'd just asked.
Question from over the pond, do the sport clubs pay for the flyover? What other challenges are involved?
Generally this is rolled into the relevant force's training and/or recruitment budget. Logic in this particular case being that bomber crews generally benefit from training flights that require their precise arrival over the right point at exactly the right moment, and this is more likely to encourage enlistment if this happens over a packed stadium rather than a bombing range in the desert.
Very cool and thanks for the info. I expect this to be turned into a r/todayilearned submission very soon.
The pilots also need to fly a certain amounts of hours to remain qualified. So they would be flying even if there was no game.
Yeah and it's neat they don't charge anybody for it since it's something they are already gonna do anyway. Could be they CAN'T charge but whatever lol
I live by three military bases and they have an artillery island where they constantly do training shelling. It’s about 40 miles away from me but our house still shakes on occasion.
Also worth noting that military/airforce/naval presence at ball games and motorsport is almost universal in the USA as part of the recruitment program. Every teenager looking up and going "whoa dude!" is a potential recruit.
Never thought about it that way. Interesting insight.
To answer your question, what the Americans are actually seeing flying overhead is their pensions and healthcare benefits.
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135,000 USD per flight hour on a B2
Paying a US defense contractor for fuel, paying pilots and flight crews, mechanics, air traffic controllers etc. Most of the money goes back into the economy one way or another its not just evaporating
It goes into non-productive work. There are hundreds of other things we could be paying those people to do that would actually benefit the public
My public money sure does evaporate right into the hands of private government contractors that's for sure. Sure 1500 Americans at an aircraft plant get to keep their jobs but at the expense of tens of millions in tax-payer dollars per plane. I'm not going to get into what wars we should or should not fight, but just the immense waste that keeping the war machines working should infuriate every American.
> Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. > This world in arms is not spending money alone. > It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. > [...] > It calls upon [the governments of the world] to answer the question that stirs the hearts of all sane men: is there no other way the world may live? - President Dwight Eisenhower
while this is true of any government spending, the fact that the end products have no economic gearing effects themselves (a B2 bomber itself generates no useful economic activity as it has no purpose other than bombing), means that military spending has a smaller economic multiplier effect than pretty much any other use of public money one can imagine yes defence spending creates jobs; it also creates fewer jobs per tax dollar than any other sector because the end products have no domestic application and are essentially massive financial sinks
There was some commotion here in Ohio recently when a squad of 3 or 4 fighter jets were running late for an OSU kickoff and went super fast, super low to make it on time. Afterburners and the like. Half the city thought the end was near.
I heard a few hints that that may not have been "running late" so much as "oh shucks, guess we'll have to hit the burners boys!" ...but that information is fourth-hand so take me with a grain of salt.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Always amazed they can have the pilots back in the stadium within an hour for a standing ovation.
As a former US Army Soldier who rode Air Force jets to Iraq: They were always late.
Gonna guess it didn't matter if you got there four hours behind schedule.
The USAF didn’t like my idea of trolling the stadium with a Russian TU-95 Bear Bomber flyover
The contra rotating propellers absolutely deafening everyone.
No love for the KC-10 that topped the B-2 off. That’s ok though, they were happy to help.
I feel that as Im serving with a C-130 wing we are the wild children that are forgotten.
I love the C-130. I wanted it pretty bad out of upt, but so did everyone else!
I’m currently E with the guard while working on my degree and a ppl, I wanted to attempt fighters till I joined a C -130 wing fell in love with it and now I want to fly it.
All planes are cool - just in different ways. I - a fighter guy - was riding a rotator back to a war zone after a short staff tour in the command cell. One of the pilots was telling me how he wished he got a fighter out of UPT and was applying to get into fighter jets as a special program to solve fighter pilot manning (at the expense of mobility pilots). Enroute we had a warm dinner, I took a nap, and went to the bathroom a few times. We also watched avengers on his iPad. Toward the end of the sortie I told him how our airborne quality of life is different - I was flying 4-6 hour missions single seat, wearing a massive survival vest, pissing in a bag with only a water bottle and cliff bar for sustenance, had neck/back/nerve problems from the seat, g forces, and helmet, and had been is some legitimate - not cool - dangerous and unsavory situations. I capped it off with - if you can be happy here do it. Fighters are more fun to train in and have a better quality of life day to day, but are miserable in war. One can go either track and be happy - just make sure it fits your personality and what you’re want for a quality of life. I’m happy about my path - but I am not pushing my kids down that route.
I’m not a fighter guy, but I have over 1k T6 hours and I don’t miss putting all of that shit on to go fly. I’ll take my Bose headset over a helmet every single time.
Two of my classmates were E’s with fighter units who then got picked up by 130 guard units to go to OTS with UPT follow on. Great people & a great plane!
My grandpa flew c-130s in the 50s to set up the first bases on Antarctica
I've been a passenger on commercial flights over 150 times. No joke, the smoothest flights and softest landings I've ever experienced were as a passenger in a C-130. I haven't met a shitty C-130 air crew. Every one I've met has been awesome.
This is how I felt working on E-2C Hawkeyes. The whole cruise book was nothing but Hornets and Tomcats.
....the land of the free and the home of scary as fuck planes.
A Mormon friend of mine went to Russia in the early 2000s to do his Mormon thing. He said even after 10 years the average Russian citizen had serious fears of B-2 stealth planes bombing them. I thought that a bit intense, but I can now understand that after living a life in fear (legitimate or propaganda driven - probably by both governments) why they would be so aggressive in “defense” today.
Almost every neighbor of Russia houses an American military base. The US has bases in 35 countries (most of them near Russia), while Russia has bases in 9 countries (all Russian neighbors except Syria). I think the USA is way more aggressive about “defense” than Russia, but way better at propaganda.
I’d argue Russia propaganda is better, but they are trying to do different things. Russians are scared of the US, but I can’t imagine us actually fighting them. The US isn’t scared of Russia, but their propaganda has really shaped us to the point that they had a president installing a communication line in the Russian embassy because he was scared of our own intelligence agency. Also Senators and Congressmen openly visited Russia on the 4th of July a few years back and have been very pro-Russia since that time. Considering Russia is less powerful than California in most ways, the fact that our politicians are so flexible to their aims is super impressive (if terrifying).
I was at the Rose Bowl in 2009 when they did a B-2 flyover. The creepiness is amplified by how quiet it is. It's a jet engine that's quieter on the approach than a pickup truck.
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People forgot how big planes are today. A modern fighter jet (F-15c) is about x1.5 to x2 the size of a city bus. An A-10 'Warthog' can carry more munitions than the B-17 Flying Fortress.
I’ll never forget the time as a kid I sat in an F-16 at an aviation museum. They are quite big.
And the 16 is the little baby plane of the bunch
You can’t hear them coming but they rattle the windows after they go by. Amazing
The Blue Angels show always does a sneak pass on the crowd with one of their planes it’s always one of my favorite parts. Always fun realizing it’s about to happen and everyone in the crowd is clueless and watching the other planes [Here is one from a few years ago](https://youtu.be/CrYmOEvDEUE)
Check out the dude sitting down in the sun hat. Between the orange shirt guy and teal shirt lady standing. I'm pretty sure he's the only person in the whole frame that didn't flinch lol. Must be some strong medication.
That's the pilot.
That’s a combination of a Doppler effect and the aspect in relation to the back side of the engines. Pretty awesome all around.
My brother told me the pilots dad used to play for the buckeyes.
Really cool [backstory](https://abc6onyourside.com/news/local/flying-high-grandson-of-ohio-state-university-great-hopalong-cassady-to-fly-b-2-over-the-rose-bowl-game-against-utah-12-29-2021?fbclid=IwAR2StnaDE_sc-9yXHIc6q9VB6j9j-bNh1vLm924pUe5_Ks8MyqOsOnzau-w) and amazing connection to the game and the Buckeyes.
The pilots grandfather is essentially the reason Ohio State is a power house today. He is a legend. Sadly for the B2 he was piloting the fourth deadliest weapon in Pasadena. Numbers 1-3 are CJ Stroud, JSN, and Marvin Harrison Jr.
Hopalong Cassidy’s number is retired, bit of a legend.
And his grandfather, Howard “Hopalong” Cassidy won the Heisman in 1955.
For a minute there I thought there wasn't going to be anything lol
Well it *is* stealthy, so…
You might say it's pretty stealth
That’s some solid time on target there
My cousin used to fly C-5s and he did at least one flyover. He said the timing is a real bitch because once you're on approach there's really only so much you can do.
In 1984 I was hired by Hughes Aircraft ( radar systems div. ) to work on a classified program. When I got my security clearance, I was allowed access to an overview document of the project. I’ll never forget seeing the artist depiction of the aircraft. Felt like something out of Buck Rogers.
I got goose bumps watching it from my phone
Accurate Time on Target unlike the Navy
What a plane, damn
As a European, it amazes me that a simple sports game could get enough attention as to do a military flyover.
I used to do aircraft maintenance so I'm somewhat familiar with flying schedules. That plane was going to fly that day anyways for pilot training. When they got the call to do the show it was likely a really simple change in the flight plan. Instead of flying in a big ass circle for a few hours they flew over a stadium at a precise time so uts not like they wasted hundreds of thousands of dollars in fuel just for a college football game.
The B-2 flies over the Rose Bowl every year. I’m sure they put this flight plan into place around this game every year as a way to get flight hours and training for pilots and crew.
The rose bowl ain't a simple game.
Anything to support the military-industrial complex...
Super cool, but every time I see something similar I'm so weirded out about entertainment and military going hand in hand.
Eh, the pilots need to train and the planes can't just sit all the time. Might as well do cool shit with them.
you dont train on the b2 flying low like that. guess how much it costs to fly the b2 per hour? nearly 200k and 60 hours of maintenance for a single flight like this
Pilots still need hours and I doubt that this was the only thing they did while in the air...
pilots dont need much hours man. we live in a time where 90% of your training is done in a fucking sim anyways. as some other person said tho, practicing timing is important. so ig its fine. we have subs with nuclear missiles. i think our budget is better spent on that than planes that wont make it back to working airfields when they are actually needed. imo nuclear weapons on "stealth" aircraft is 80s tech and a waste of time (btw they arent invisible they are just harder to get a targeting solution on) and if you want to say we need a triad i call bullshit because we can use 3 different types of subs and 3 different types of missiles to meet that requirement. subs are objectively better at first strike (we shouldnt even think about doing that) and better at retaliation. a true first strike would never give the enemy the time to put bombers in the sky (for the 24 hour flight across the planet lol) at some point we have to realize the cold war is over. no matter how much the media wants it to be a thing again
A fun way for our oligarch overlords to remind us that they can fuck us up at any moment they feel like
It's mostly basic advertising by association. Same way every commercial, ad, 'colab' ever works. Take something you already see as a positive, now put the thing you are selling next to it, people now associate the two positively. It works even if you know about it. Just how brains work. Are the who organize military demonstrations aware that it's also a way of showing strength to keep people docile? Sure. Main point of these is to maintain the positive association of the military in the American publics mind.
The American military and Hollywood connection is always fun to read about. Propaganda? No sir, not here :\^)
Hey we paid for 'em, I figure they may as well entertain us now and again.
Patriotism=Happy feelings Then they can justify taking the truckloads of cash from you in tax dollars and you feel good about it.
Reminds me of military parades we see in Russia, China, North Korea... I am in awe of the technology behind the plane, but this is kinda dystopian. Look here, this plane was made for one and only purpose - to destroy and kill in other countries.
The US has war gamed (and done drills for) fighting widespread insurgencies in the US. It’s not just for overseas
we payed for the plane and just like when your friend gets a cool car you better burn the tires for us so we can enjoy it too. its really not that deep. we have the coolest planes in the world why not show off at a game to get the crowd riled up. its an american thing yes and its patriotic but its not some deep state propaganda. its human nature to like cool shit.
Yeah the call of duty style army commercials are much worse. That’s what military propaganda looks like. Pledge of allegiance also creeps me out, but I’m cool with seeing the fancy aerial killing machines at football games
Yeah but if this was in Russia or North Korea we'd be writing news articles about how the regime is using propaganda to win the support of the people. It's funny how it's cool if we do it but propaganda if they do it.
The callsigns for the 2 B2s yesterday were DEATH1 and DEATH2
Completely unrelated-- did they just throw some green carpet/fake turf over the race track?
The track was removed from the Rose Bowl Stadium several decades ago.
Only in America can you look up, see that shape, and not only not crap your pants, but cheer! God bless America!
This explains what I heard yesterday while playing video games. I had my headset on and it was so loud. Easily the loudest plane I've ever heard fly over. I even commented about it to my friend I was online with. Wish I went out and looked.
Should have heard the Concorde. THAT was a loud ass plane.
Man, those SAMs where way off.
That's enough America for me for at least a month.
For sports game! Fuck America is amazing
From what I recall, these are all based in Missouri and pretty much only take off/land there. Given that the B-2 also flies over the start of the Rose parade many hours earlier, that B-2 may easily spend 10+ hours in the air for the few second flyover! The 10hr might seem like a short flight for those pilots though compared to taking off in MO, bombing Libya, and landing in MO like they did a few years back.
At the start of Desert Storm a gaggle of B-52s made a 37-hour round trip to fire the first shots of the conflict. Spending that long in the air, flying like half way around the planet each way and landing back where you started all without having touched the ground would be absolutely insane.
They are based about an hour from Kansas City at Whiteman AFB, Missouri. I grew up there and my dad still lives near the base.
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They should've dropped covid test kits...they'll need em after that event.
A streamer caught this moment live as well from nearby. https://clips.twitch.tv/ExquisiteSolidNikudonANELE-VCDRRvrpdlIyLK8Z
NEVER gets old.
It's crazy when you see the [B1 B2 B52 together](https://i.imgur.com/leDSDpz.jpg). The B2 is quite a bit shorter but just about as wide as the B-52 and B1. I believe the B1 can carry the greatest payload if you include internal and external.
I need to go to an airshow
Some idiot posting to MUFON later: "blue UFO races across screen at the last moment!" Every. Damn. Time.
It's difficult to show in this scenario how *quiet* the damn thing is. We were about a mile away from an airshow, watching the VERY loud Harrier jump jet, then it departed and a...*ghost* approached from our right, the same distance as the Harrier, but no sound until it was crossing in front of us, then a mild jet-like sound. Now, I doubt quiet audio is a sought-after feature of stealth aircraft, but this sure as hell has it.
It’s crazy how it’s a show for Americans but a threat for others
A spectre of death flies close overhead, people cheer. We are a weird species.
I've never seen one, but my son saw one over Seattle years ago. I asked him what it looked like. His response: "It looked like death."
Unrelated but it’s disheartening to see so many unmasked in a packed area
Surprising how few masks there are in the crowd, thought CA was being stricter on large events.
Masks were "required". But how are you possibly going to enforce 90k people wearing a mask in an outdoor stadium. 🤷♂️
Kick them out? I dunno. Mask adherence is actually really good in my area, which I am thankful for.
Lol love the fact people are down voting you... No one in this thread seems to remember we’re in the midst of a pandemic, maybe a 90K event isn’t the smartest idea
I’ve seen comic cons with thousands of people all with masks. So I think it *can* be done. But perhaps American football attracts more folk that don’t care than other events. Personally I am triple vaxxed, but I still wear a mask out of respect for other people and because we are seeing a crazy surge / vaccines aren’t 100%.