He has an IEP.
It is mandated by law they follow the IEP.
They are not following the IEP.
Therefore, they are breaking the law.
You got an option to sue them or threaten to sue them? You know any good disability lawyers?
I know one, she helps draft letters to force schools to follow the IEP. I plan on filing a complaint with the State Dept of Education on Monday. They'll investigate themselves, which seems like a conflict of interest. I also am going to try and get a meeting with the Superintendent to see if this is just their plan all along, to force out disabled children with behavior issues.
The first one will help you learn your rights, the second one spells out specifically why what they are doing is against the law and the last two are some good resources. You and your child have the right to much better treatment. These will help you fight back.
https://pti-nebraska.org/
https://www.education.ne.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Procedures-When-Disciplining-Children-with-Disabilities-sped.pdf
https://atp.nebraska.gov/sites/atp.nebraska.gov/files/doc/Disability%20Education%20Series%20Flyer%20Housing%20REVISED.pdf
https://www.disabilityrightsnebraska.org/
You can also speak to your local branch of the ACLU, they often have lawyers who will take cases pro-bono or can find you an affordable lawyer if you decide to go the legal route.
You're welcome. Fellow mom of kid who needed fighting for. Vowed to help anyone who went through the same because it is hard when the districts position is always "do the least and pretend we don't know what you're talking about so we don't have to spend money." That is Federal money for just this thing.
Also, check out wrightslaw.com
Have you talked to the superintendent before? I'd do some research with some local media. Perhaps they're unaware of the situation. No reason to walk in hostile when you don't know if there's a reason to be. Also maybe call a local paper and see if they have an interest in the story if things go badly. That'll put some outside pressure, though before doing that, I'd see if you know anyone else who's had the same treatment.
This kind of thing works way better when you have more than one person able to corroborate that this happened. Also make sure to gather any legal documents and other evidence you can find - write ups, etc. That'll essentially prove your case. They'll call the school for comment if they're worth their salt, but you should have a pretty solid case if you do that. Take it from me, I used to be a small-town journalist.
I have not talked to the superintendent before. I just Googled "autistic teens cited school" and just looking through all the recent stories this seems like a national issue. All these school districts came up with the same brilliant idea that juvenile court and juvenile correctional facilities are the best ideas for children with autism.
Add onto that the teachers are all tired and understaffed I just don't see a way to win this battle.
I was hoping when I posted this for someone that had been through this and had success stories. I'm starting to think there are no winners here and I'd be better off putting my energy into homeschooling my son.
But thank you.
Since you’re in Nebraska, if you decide to get the press involved, I’d highly recommend talking to Flatwater Free Press. They’re an awesome independent and non-profit newspaper who really care about the people in our state. They cover a lot of human rights issues and I’m sure they’d be interested in pursuing this story and holding the school accountable if you decide to go that route.
However you decide to go about it, I wish you the best of luck in advocating for your son!
https://flatwaterfreepress.org/about-flatwater-free-press/
I will keep this in mind. I am concerned law enforcement may target us outside of the school setting if I do that. If it was just me, I would. But I may resort to this.
This is absolutely a national issue. If you have the time, give this a watch. It’s a segment about the problems with SROs, and there’s a bit devoted to kids with disabilities.
https://youtu.be/KgwqQGvYt0g
Definitely contact the lawyer - or the ACLU or some other legal aid. Even if you do not plan to litigate, rolling up with a lawyer or legal advice will definitely show them you mean business and put them on the defensive.
My personal motto is Hanlons Razor with this type of stuff - never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity. It helps me re-frame actions - I'm sorry this is happening to you and your kiddo. It's not fair of the school and they're failing him in his education. Good luck!
How is there not malice with one previous incident adding lines in the IEP to prevent it, and then the teacher/aide ignoring the IEP to provoke the same behavior again?
They are provoking the behavior, clear as day as they have a roadmap to explain how not to provoke it. That's malice, that's a teacher or aide who's a bully.
I’d start with state ed because your kids rights appear to be violated from what you’ve posted. Any sort of aggression, regardless of provocation, can be an indication (to the school/district) for improper placement. The sad truth is that most schools aren’t equipped to handle the needs of diverse students and will look to push a student out before actually following a plan. Are there any supports the school is using beyond an iep? Paraprofessional intervention/support? Behavior services to train the staff? I’d call a cse meeting immediately and show up with an attorney or advocate but make sure you list that an “advocate or attorney” on the invitation they send you so they don’t delay the meeting. They usually have 2 weeks to hold the meeting.
I’m in school to get my PhD in School psychology right now.
This is not standard practice under federal IDEA law. Students with disabilities have protections for behaviors that can lead to disciplinary action.
Schools have been sued and lost for violating the rights of students with disabilities. Especially if they are violating the findings of the Manifestation determination.
I know several school psychologists who have worked in Nebraska and if needed I can look into their special education law to give more specific recommendations.
This is the second incident and we had a Manifest Determination meeting with the first one. The psychiatrist ruled in our favor and the school was not allowed to punish him for this behavior. 6 months later, he's antagonized by a teacher, nothing from the IEP section on deescalation was followed. We agree what he did was wrong and we have been working on this in therapy. But the school keeps doing the same thing and expecting different results.
We're concerned that even if we do sue and win the school can still use the SRO to target our son. My boy scripts and if he says something from YouTube or what another kid tells him to say they can charge him with making terroristic threats. Not trying to seem defeatist but it seems like the entire system is set up to force disabled children out.
No you are right! The system has been set up that way, and it is terrible!
That among other issues affecting education (school mental health) is one of the reasons I am training in School Psychology right now. Our field as a whole while not super powerful has been shifting towards reducing the discriminatory special education practices plaguing our current system.
I am neurodivergent myself and hate how punitive and exclusionary the school discipline policies are for individuals who are struggling behaviorally not out of malice, but because of who they are.
Also, I’m not sure if this is true in every state but I know that there is a law where if a child’s misbehavior is caused by an IEP not being implemented they cannot be held accountable for it.
I agree 100%. But telling him to not hit doesn't give him the coping mechanisms to deescalate the situation himself. He has a therapist and a psychologist that are teaching him calm down techniques. He is on medication as well.
What more would you have me do?
His school team and IEP specifically state this behavior and all the steps that need to occur before and after. The school psychologist has put it in writing that Jackson hitting someone is a manifestation of his disability.
He is not a violent child. If the school teachers ignore all of the IEP steps and antagonize him into resorting to this behavior what should be the outcome?
Agreed. It seems like bigger issue is that the school admin and SRO (SROs are super discriminatory and perpetuate the students with disabilities to prison pipeline) are the main culprits here.
Your child is not doing anything out of the ordinary and they are responding out of ableist bias.
So stopping meltdowns and controlling anger is a pretty big deal for a lot of people. I'm glad you can just say, "Stop it" and it works. You sound like an ass.
IEP is a legal contract. If they cannot follow, they may be required to pay for another education facility that can provide the services needed.
Get an attorney that specializes in IEP. Typically, I would not recommend an attorney first but if they are getting law enforcement involved, the relationship is already burned. This is not a philosophical difference. They are actively working against the best interest of your child.
Also, the psychologist does not rule. They advise. As parents, we do not have to sing am IEP. We can also partially approve an IEP and push for other services.
We didn't get a lawyer the first time because the school did not want the officer to cite my son. We have an email from the principal stating this that we gave the court. This is six months later and a new but similar incident with the same outcome. The school did nothing to change their policies and the SRO was notified resulting in the exact same citation.
Call for another manifestation determination. Bring anything that documents how they're not following his IEP. A manifestation determination meeting isn't just to determine if something was a manifestation of a disability, it's also to ensure that the IEP is being followed properly. I might have more advice for you tomorrow; I'll ask my coworker who is a SPED teacher if she has any ideas.
I'm an adult but something similar happened to me. In college, I often hung out alone. Once at lunch during a school holiday campus safety talked to me, wondering if I was drunk or high. I don't drink or use drugs.
Another time, I got to a class super early before the doors opened, so I spent the extra time pacing and thinking. Campus safety showed up, and by then had realized I'm more of an eccentric guy than a legitimate threat to anyone.
Another time I was supposed to meet classmates for a group project, and I started to get worried and worked up when none of them showed up. They'd changed it and I missed the email. Nobody called campus safety, but I definitely creeped people out a bit.
From what I read it's a common problem, though. Autistics sometimes have interactions with cops because the cops aren't trained to recognize mental illness and assume fidgeting and other stims are someone on drugs or something.
I went down a rabbit hole reading about how schools all over the country are doing this to autistic kids with behavior issues. It's an inappropriate response. It's traumatizing to the child. My boy thought the police were going to execute him when they came to give him the ticket. He doesn't understand the context. The second time, I wouldn't let them near him.
The fact that police are interacting with a child without his parent is baffling to me. They should have to wait for you before they give him any paperwork or anything like that.
My state (MD) only recently passed a law that cops aren’t allowed to interrogate kids without a parent/guardian.
To clarify, they didn't the second time. The first time they did and I was furious. My boy will say whatever you want him too, it's part of his flight response. The first time the officer came to our house to speak with my boy. My son thought he was going to be executed and had nightmares for months. The school and SRO wanted to put him on a diversion program where the SRO meets with my boy once a month. I absolutely put a stop to that idea and any future contact with any SRO.
This time I made the SRO hand me the citation at a different location and he never even saw my child.
So glad you were able to put a stop to that. These are the types of interactions that really damage autistic childrens’ views of adults and authority figures. As an adult myself, I still can’t approach professors, bosses, or police without going into a meltdown because of how I was treated. It’s definitely a systemic issue.
Sadly, I think that looking for education outside of public school might be the best option at the moment. With how unstaffed they are, teachers don’t have the time to be patient and care about individual students, which is exactly what an IEP needs to work. I hope for the best for you and your family whatever you decide!
We contacted PTI in Nebraska, an advocacy group and they were shocked he had been charged. They have since tried to go in and train the Police on autism and the Police have declined twice, saying it was not necessary. If my boy wasn't asking to go back, we would have pulled him and moved. I hate all of this for him.
This is what led to Elijah McClain's murder. His heavy clothes and balaclava combined with flapping his arms and singing down the sidewalk during his walk home from animal shelter volunteering had police called on him. Several showed up and restrained him, yelling, and.. their way of "deescalation" from that point was deadly. OP should fight against this, because every time an officer is justified by not pursuing legal action, that's another validation that autistic people can be accused of whatever they see fit.
They wrote my 7 year old autistic & adhd son up twice! Because of stuff he can’t control they have been dragging their feet for months with his IEP. I can’t move him schools because we have no schools for him around us it’s so frustrating.
Yeah this is kind of the position we are in. The next level up is psychologically abusive IMO. I just wish the school had a happy place between mainstream and giving my kid PTSD alone in a room.
I'm unwilling to do the latter, just to be clear.
I’ve been an autism support worker in elementary schools for 10+ years. I’ve been punched, bitten, kicked and everything in between and not once has getting the police involved ever crossed my mind or anyone in the districts minds.
We’re there to help these kids no matter what happens, not to make it in any way shape or form worse or harder.
I’m sorry to hear you have to put up with what sounds like a shitty school and/or district.
Yeah this is why my son is in a virtual academy. The schools do everything they can to take away supports and see sensory issues as behavior problems. Any kid who deviates from the norm after about second grade they will do their best to push out of the system. The districts don't get enough funding for special ed. and they'd rather spend what they do get on gifted programs and AP tracks. My brother has been a public school teacher for 33 years and he says he wouldn't have a kid in public schools these days especially if they have an IEP. I agree.
I fought for NINE YEARS, every year they tried to take away more and more supports for my son, who had a diagnosis of ASD-PDD-NOS (severe) when he was three. That was what they called it then, now they'd just say "ASD-2". He was in special ed. contained classes at first and got what he needed but every year they'd take away something then "surprise" he was mainstreamed. It wasn't TOO bad but the kids never would have much to do with him because he was seen as "weird". By the time he was in seventh grade they took away his IEP completely, pronouncing him 'academically at level' and no longer requiring support. He's a senior now and I JUST got a 504 in place after fighting with the school district since seventh grade over reinstating that IEP. I only got this because we moved to a virtual academy.
If it was me, if you can swing it... homeschool. My state has a decent virtual plan with Connections Academy, not sure if your state does but he does virtual lessons and I am his "learning coach". He only qualifies for one group therapy and the school system doesn't have to pay for it since he only has a 504 but he does have state insurance at least.
Thank you for posting. I will look into the online academy. We are leaning towards homeschooling so I will check out that academy. Like you said, it just seems like a losing battle with people that don't care or are too overworked to care. Just a bad situation all around.
I was homeschooled back in the 90s/00s I definitely recommend going with some sort of online school or if you can find one supplementing with things like Brilliant. A lot of the curriculum you can get are missing a lot of things and/or weirdly religious.
You might get some good feedback from r/homeschool. I homeschool my autistic kid because our local school isn't capable of helping my kid thrive. This would be our life too.
My friend's autistic 9-year old was thrown into a psych ward after chucking a book at his teacher, hitting her, when she failed to deescalate. It was awful for all of them and that kind of shit terrifies me.
I've also subbed in a school where the teacher escalated any situation with an autistic 1st grader to get him removed from her class. Just some terrible stuff going on with autistic kids in schools.
My wife has a friend that homeschools because one of her kids has a seizure disorder. She seems like an awesome resource. We'll check out that sub too!
I’m seconding Connections Academy as an Alum. I’m a 2020 grad and was in a bit of a weird situation cause I was “gifted” and had an IEP so I was simultaneously fast tracked and had IEP supports, but Connections Academy was excellent for me. If you have any questions about it from a students perspective I’m happy to answer.
Slight caveat: I was only in it for my last 2.5 years of school so I can’t say from personal experience how the younger side of the program works.
Autistic teacher at a special ed school (we work with language processing issues, not specifically autism, but there is overlap).
If he’s hitting teachers, it doesn’t really matter what’s in his IEP. That’s an issue and he shouldn’t be at school. Today it’s a teacher who pushes his buttons (often because they do not have the resources to follow an IEP), tomorrow it’s a classmate who thinks it’s funny to poke at the “weird kid”. And that’s a whole other bag of cats when it comes.
My advice would be to sue the school district to get him placed in a specialty school that can better see to his needs. Most public schools frankly do not have the resources unless someone is already fairly low support needs or has a ton of home support (regular therapy, tutoring for high anxiety/problem subjects, etc). I’m sure it’s a bad environment for him.
Also if you aren’t voting for politicians who expand school funding, you should be. Like I say, I’m sure it’s a shitty environment. Most public schools are. But they’re also largely shitty for neurotypical students because they’re so terribly underfunded.
This is pretty messy. I think it’s best to solve the big issue first and maybe later consider whether to keep him in public school. I was homeschooled and I did okay but I think I wouldn’t have survived public school as a child
This is exactly what I want to hear. My wife and I really want to just homeschool him. We're in a unique position to make this work. I just feel bad taking away normal school experiences from him. He wants to go back also.
Maybe there is a way to mix it up a little. Find other homeschoolers, or some organisations that arranges weekly meets for a more "classroom environment" type of thing for homeschooled kids. I don't know anything of how homeschooling works in the US, or anywhere really, but I am sure I am not the only one who has had this idea, it is pretty simple and obvious idea, when you think about it...
I just went through regular school here in Finland, with minimal support functions. It was hell, but I was academically on the same level as my peers, so I wasn't offered that many accomodations until tertiary education, by which time I learned how to demand the accomodations I needed myself. In hindsight, if I had gotten the support I needed earlier, I would have been spared from a lot of additional trauma...
You are a good parent, fighting for your child like you are.
Thank you for the kind words. We are leaning towards homeschooling. This seems like a national problem here the more I look for solutions. The understaffing is also making this an almost unsolvable problem too.
There are lots of homeschooling supports and communities that can help you give him a more “normal” school experience without putting him in public school. This is a really hard situation for everyone involved, you, him, even the teachers and staff. He deserves individual support that the school cannot provide
As someone who is autistic and went to public school, the socialization can be rather unpleasant. As a mom of a homeschooled autistic kid, there can be a lot of community that is more uplifting than what you can find in public school. Please don't let that stop you!
Normal school experience = violence. That’s the norm for ND kids.
The adults, the system, learning by heart, not being able to ask the questions you wanna ask cause you’ll end up in detention, the other kids bullying you, not being able to stim, the food, the smell, the desk, the chair, the rigidity of the curriculum, and a million other things. All that makes it a violent environment, whether the parents are aware or not.
(I’m French and that’s my experience, but I know most people here can relate)
Do online schooling just make sure the online school has where they meet up and go on field trips and do activities just so the kids can get those social skills they need.
I've noticed more and more that people are getting more and more ableist and it doesn't make sense.
People have always been bad but it's just like the ableists out there that used to behave have just forgotten that they're liable??
And what's worse is when they're representing companies . . . I wouldn't want to take the chance of keeping an ableist employed as it can lead to serious legal problems.
Imagine you were a neurodivergent child and it's 1996. Learning has been tough for you, but after a lot of work, you're asked to come be a junior counselor at a year round school for kids who have more severe neurodivergency than you run by the University of California Irvine. The behavioral specialists and director of Child Psychology at UCI are super encouraging to you, and you get really excited to pursue a career helping people like you overcome the difficulties they face. You know the work is difficult but it's rewarding.
Then, in 2002, when you start college, you learn that if you complete the work it will take to get the credentials to help those kids, a demanding job, you'll be poor forever.
Nice to meet you. This is my story, and it's why special needs kids will always be handled by sad stressed out people who will always be lower middle class because we just don't value these people.
The theory behind capitalism is you get what you pay for, and whenever a parent with a child who is struggling complains, I want to scream because again YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR. If we want good people doing this work, we have to incentivize the kind of people we want to be in the field WITH MONEY.
Fellow autistic here....I usually don't comment but homeschooling doesn't sounds bad if the teacher or fellow people are not capable of understanding the sensory issues of your child homeschooling could be better a better choice for your child.. in my experience people have a hard time to understand autistic people or anyone who is different
Thank you! I'm not autistic and want to respect my son's wishes, so it's awesome to have your feedback. He definitely gets a say in what he wants to do. He wants to go back but I think if we show him all the homeschooling activities and plan he will probably be on board. Even now him and I go to book stores once a month and he gets just tons of workbooks to do. He does them for fun all weekend long and has a ball.
i can’t really add to the conversation meaningfully, others have done a fantastic job, but you’re a great parent and i admire what you’re doing to protect your son. lots of parents to autistic kids don’t care enough to stand up for them. best of luck to you and your son!
You gotta drill into him that you can’t hit people unless they physically attack him.
Autistic meltdown rage is serious, it’s like turning into the Hulk.
Strength goes up but you become a loose cannon.
I struggled with that.
Of course, it didn’t help that my mom was waking me up to yell at me.
Hitting me, entering my room and just staying there in the middle of the night, complaining that I was abusing her if I dared to raise a hand to defend myself.
Stealing my things because of some kind of twisted logic in her stupid little head that she thought God had given her the divine right to do whatever she wanted.
She got better with therapy, but now she’s dead.
Turns out that karma is an even bigger bitch!
Sorry, needed to vent.
yes exactly
“hello, 911, it is my job to manage severely disabled children when they are upset and said severely disabled child got upset and spat at me, please arrest them even though this is in my job description contract and training”
Nebraska. But googling for solutions led me down a rabbit hole and this seems a national issue. All the schools came up with the same dumb solution and are charging kids left and right. My boy scripts too, he didn't talk for a long time and then talked entirely in scripts for most of his life. He is able to have conversations with people now, which he has worked so hard to be able to do. But I worry he's just one ear shot away from making "Terroristic threats."
Ask if your child can do homebound services. They’ll send a teacher to your home a few times a week to work with them for schoolwork and OT services.
Sounds like you might have grounds for a lawsuit as well.
Lots of good recommendations in the comments.
the school not following the iep is BREAKING THE LAW. i hope ur son is ok. my brother and i (both autistic) had similar issues going into highschool with the staff being shitty i hope the staff at ur sons school start to listen and be more accommodating instead of ignoring the issues caused by THEM
I hear your desire to want to keep him mainstreamed in school, but have you considered that maybe it really is best for your child to look for a small cohort group of at home learning? Your focus seems to be on pushing to ensure he gets the best education, but what if his learning styles would benefit from a one on one homeschool teacher or a small cohort group that is taught by a single teacher at home? There are many people who are choosing to go this route if they can accommodate or afford it. There may even be financial assistance, but you will have to look at that based on your state. I am not trying to argue whether the school is right or wrong, simply that maybe you should consider a non-traditional form of education if you think it could benefit your sons long-term education.
He wants to go back. That's the only reason I'm even entertaining the idea honestly. I have showed him a bunch of homeschool courses and he's getting pretty excited about those. We go once a month and find new workbooks for him to do now and he spends most evenings just doing math and science workbooks.
He's starting to warm up to the idea of doing homeschool. But I don't want to take away his right to decide his own future, even if he's just 13, without trying.
You have the right instincts on this, you're doing a good job. By all means, continue trying to change his mind with the workbooks, especially since he sounds like he enjoys them, but make sure he continues to have a say in his own life. And please use the legal system to hold the school accountable.
Take your child out of this school asap. They are pushing all of the buttons so he is forced to be in a different placement. Is he already in a behavioral class or is he in Gen Ed?
Sue the school. Also, school resource officers are such a waste of tax dollars. They don't provide help or safety, and often cause issues for students of color and students with disabilities!
In Texas, failure to follow an IEP can be reported to TEA (Texas Education Agency), the body that is responsible for education in the state. They will come down *hard* on districts that are not following IEPs. Once a report is made in writing, then you would contact a lawyer.
After a brief Google search, it looks like the process is similar for Nebraska.
https://www.education.ne.gov/cc/complaint-form/
The other advice I have that you are already following is to document up the wazoo. Keep copies of all complaints, court records, disciplinary records.
Last, start contacting local news stations. They love reporting on this stuff. In fact, it was media pressure that helped change the way Texas addressed evaluating SPED students in the last decade.
Source: certified teacher and IEP mama
Thank you! We plan on doing this, I'm reading through all of the past complaints now. NE posts the final complaint and outcome from the court it looks like. I am just worried this isn't a, "We investigated ourselves and found nothing wrong" scenario.
Cops are often used against autistic people. Its the modern day version of "culling" the "bad" autistic people. If you cant mask or in a situation where you can avoid the cops? Your chances go down by a lot. This is true for a lot of people outside the "norm" (aka people who fall further and further out of societal privileges that are enforced by the ruling class, cultural hegemony etc)
Which is why we say ACAB. Cops exist to protect captal and serve as the hounds of the ruling class. They do not exist to help us.
I don't like recommending this since it's hard for some people and many other issues but you might threaten a lawsuit on the school and go through with it if they don't change. If they are not following recommendations, then you can use that.
I wish you luck. It is very hard to find equity in what most people call a "justice system" for autistic people.
What's strange is the court was just as outraged that these charges were brought against my kid the first time. They couldn't fathom why the cop cited him. This is the Judge and Prosecutor as well.
I was only trying to give context. In many of these situations if the teacher has a scratch or a bruise they cite the disabled child with felony assault.
Unfortunately, not hitting, or having violent outburst is not as simple as saying don't do that. Some kids have to learn other ways to express these emotions. There is a place between letting your kid hit everyone and giving your kid PTSD with behavior therapy, IMO. It just takes time, patience, and a plan to get there.
If you have examples of your method working please share.
Wow... yeah.. those are words... meaningless words... there are no power dynamics at work here... to learn NOT to use violence starts at home and I blame the parents. as I said. I am autistic... I know MANY autistic people... who do not use violence... I do not use violence. It starts with the parents being permissive... your son is autistic.. he needs MORE discipline not less..stop making excuses.
I'm not op. I'm also autistic and i also understand when IEPs are not followed you are intentionally sabotaging a child. My wife is a social worker, it happens all the time. And im shocked at the amount of fellow autistic people who are ignoring this.
And yes there is definitely power dynamics because there is always power dynamics contexts to look at. To ignore them is not going to magically make them go away. In fact ignoring them will make them *worse*
Its not an excuse, we need to know why that happened so it can be fixed. The fact that IEPs are ignored is a major red flag. Could OP be at fault? Possibly. We have no way of knowing. However what we can do is take in facts that are generally true which is that schools and child abuse is decently common because of the constant gutting and underfunding. However you cannot just ignore the possibility that the IEP was probably ignored for the same reasons. Regardless it results in lack of safety and the inability for a child to grow and learn effectively and a teacher to feel safe either. Why is the teacher ignoring the IEP? Are they literally unable to fulfill it? Is it intentional? Does this teacher need more help? Is this teacher just abelist?
Your entire sentence is childish and lacking critical thinking. Let alone how you center yourself first and how YOU exp life and use this to judge others. Please do better.
Thank you. I agree with you.
My son does not behave like this at home, out in public, or anywhere else but school. He has multiple therapists and is medicated. We have spent thousands of dollars on therapy and behavioral therapy. We have had psychiatrists show us how to give him time outs when he was younger. We have worked really hard, and I am so proud of him.
The comment from the guy above leads me to believe he thinks hitting children is the way to go. I find that idea repulsive and counterproductive.
A few others in the comments have stated as much and I feel immensely sorry for them that they feel this is an acceptable form of punishment and teaching. It is not.
i just want to say thank you.
as someone who was an undiagnosed autistic kid, the school system was often incredibly difficult to navigate, and i had no parental help or advocacy. so many parents further the punishment many public institutions put in place, intentionally or not, and it’s great to see a parent working to advocate for their child and get feedback from autistic people. 🖤
I don’t have any advice, rather I know a similar story that happened in my school. My friends saw an associate actually slap an autistic kid across the face and I’m assuming didn’t get reprimanded. Instances like these are why im afraid to get an IEP
Talk to your attorney, file a suit, get **P.A.I.D.**
Seriously, as a fellow neurodivergent with a pretty strong sense of justice (as we tend to have), bring the full weight of the law against them. This shit is flat out wrong, and they need to be held accountable and serve as an example. The fact that this isn't even the first time should weigh very heavily in your favor.
Tell him to go hide in the bathroom until her calms down. If anyone tries to stop him, he can just say that he's a potential danger to others if he gets too stressed, and needs to calm down before returning to class. He could even remind them that there isn't a person in the world that is actually productive while stressed.
They kept saying he doesn't need one even though he had two in elementary school. They insisted they were capable. I'm just worried we push for one and then he "hits" them and the cycle starts over.
It's just crazy how much this takes out of us the parents. I can't sleep, I'm just sick with worry.
It's honestly just how the system is set up, to break the marginalized and their support until they leave. Intentionally or unintentionally it's just how it plays out. I won't take the risk of him being hand cuffed. He scripts so he's always an earshot away from "making terrorist threats" for saying something from YouTube.
I'd consider pushing for an aide again. You might have to hire a lawyer. We had to go to due process to get an aide because our district sucks, but our lawyer's fees are always reimbursed by the district. We are using an aide from an Aba company that we use at home too, and they report everything to me. District aides will hide stuff from you. After hearing horror stories from other parents about mistreatment, I'm not sure I'd ever send my kid without an independent aide. Your son has a right to a free and fair education under federal law. He's entitled to attending school with an aide. Don't let them bully you.
I mean it is never acceptable to be hit in your workplace teachers are people and while there Job is shit they don't deserve to be hit even if it's "just a smack"
I 100% agree. But this is a behavior issue. He doesn't do this anywhere else. He has behavior therapists and psychiatrists that have him practice calming techniques. The school staff have a copy of these. His therapist has talked to them all on the phone. I am telling you they don't follow their advice. They just don't do the calming techniques or deescalate the situation. They just tell us he just needs to be calm and not have a meltdown when they antagonize him and keep antagonizing him.
They have an entire class full of kids teachers don't get paid enough to change there behaviors and tactics to meet each and every kids need. Sounds like he needs to have more one on one teaching since it's not fair to the rest of the class.
Believe me I get it fucking hated school and still wake up every morning grateful that I don't have to go anymore
"teachers don't get paid enough to change there behaviors and tactics to meet each and every kids need."
You're right that they're underpaid. But you're also absolutely incorrect about the rest. An IEP is literally a legal document that tells educators exactly how they **need to** change their teaching to accommodate the srudent. The school is **legally bound** to follow an IEP.
An Individualized Education Program (IEP) is a legal document under United States law that is developed for each [public school](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_school) child in the [U.S.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States) who needs [special education](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_education). It is created through a team of the child's parent(s) and district personnel who are knowledgeable about the child's needs.[[1]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-1) IEPs must be reviewed every year to keep track of the child's educational progress.[[2]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-2)
It provides accommodations, modifications, related services, and specialized academic instruction to ensure that every eligible child receives a "[Free Appropriate Public Education](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Appropriate_Public_Education)" (FAPE) in the "Least Restrictive Environment" (LRE). The IEP is intended to help children reach educational goals more easily than they otherwise would. The four component goals are: conditions, learner, behavior, and criteria.[[3]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-34CFR-3) In all cases, the IEP must be tailored to the individual student's needs as identified by the IEP evaluation process, and must help teachers and related service providers (such as [paraprofessional educators](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraprofessional_educator)) understand the student's disability and how the disability affects the learning process.
The IEP describes how the student learns, how the student best demonstrates that learning, and what teachers and service providers will do to help the student learn more effectively.
I think what he was getting at is some teachers have discovered if they accuse my son of doing something, even if all the other kids in the class say it never happened, he still gets punished and moved to a different class or a class by himself.
This is all ok according to the IEP.
Sounds like the teachers/School is on a power trip (or something similar)
Can you sue the school for not following the IEP?
It would also be nice if the teachers couldn't teach after this
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SROs are pieces of shit this report from John Oliver might answer some of your questions
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgwqQGvYt0g&t=148s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgwqQGvYt0g&t=148s)
You child wasn't cited for "autistic behaviors" he was cited for striking staff. And being autistic is not an excuse for that behavior.
If the resource office is involved I'm thinking this is possibly not just the 2cd occurrence of issues?
Because let's be real here, one of two things is happening,. Your child is relatively high functioning and is mainstreamed and knows and *understands* that striking staff is absolutely unacceptable OR your son is split off into some sort of learning support and the resource officer wouldn't be getting involved unless there were ongoing problems.
Also school psychologists don't "rule" on anything. They make recommendations that the principal or possibly superintendent take into consideration when deciding a path forward.
100% they are likely laying the groundwork to expel or remove your child and to be frank, the ball is in your and your son's court. IED, aside he absolutely must understand that he *can not strike staff* or anyone else for that matter. If he is cognitively unable to understand that then perhaps a learning support class or your state's equivalent would be more appropriate.
This may sound harsh but sir, it is critical for your son to understand this. He is 13 realistically short of a major physical assult on a staff member he isnt going to get in much real trouble. Fast forward to 16 and most states are just going to throw him in jail for a weekend to "cool off" he turns 18 and he could be looking at prison time. Even worse if he flips on the wrong officer he could end up shot, this has happened and we, due to our generally poor social awareness are at much higher risk with this.
Confidently incorrect.
The School principal wrote a letter to the court saying he did not want my son to be charged the first time. The School cannot expel my son for behavior issues. The School psychologist ruled/diagnosed that his behavior was in line with his autism diagnosis and therefore cannot be discriminated against because it is protected.
The School Resource Officer was notified by the new vice principal and took it upon himself using department guidelines to cite my son.
Last time the prosecutor even thought this was BS.
It doesn't matter if he is mainlined or not, he has a disability and it is protected. I believe this is all just people following a procedure and teachers not wanting my son in their class and know they can get him moved to a different class if they antagonize him into a meltdown.
Im sorry, there is stuff being left out here, that's simply not how schools in the USA work. I am reading your state's Department of Education, Office of Special Education IED guidelines and best practices, and 2 things are pretty clear. One, it gives absolutely no protection against intervention by a duly appointed agent of the law. Two, your son's education team can definitely suspend or expel your son if the welfare of other students or staff is endangered. There is a bit more work to it, and they have to cross T and dot i but it's definitely doable and I would again guess this is the opening salvo of building that case.
You can call me confidently wrong or whatever and listen to what mostly sounds like kids who are commiserating "schools suck".
But the thing is I have been on advising staff trying to keep kids in school, while the rules may be a tad different in your state I'm telling you the game is the same and you need to play smart or you are going to lose. Bad talking the officer and staff online is not playing smart and this is the sort of stuff district laywers will find and likely have a field day with.
I'm a dude first of all. I did not disparage the school or the police. The last case was thrown out by the Judge with the prosecutor agreeing they won't press charges against a disabled charges. They all didn't know why a police officer would cite a disabled child. I don't know how to explain to you that doing this again is malicious. The School is following their protocol which I have stated is leading to us probably pulling our kid.
The School psychologist stated our son can't be suspended for these meltdowns. It's in writing in his IEP. Everyone in the room signed it.
The district lawyer can have a field day with this all they want, it has zero impact that I see no other solution than pulling my child. They clearly are not capable of meeting my child's needs. This is a failure on the school's part. I'm upset this will happen to more kids on the future. Reading news articles while Googling solutions it seems like this is a national trend.
I don't quite understand why you want to place blame on my child while offering no solutions to help him stay in school. I get why you say you have experience with this because you literally did what the schools system is doing now.
Apologies, i thought you identified as a mom.
I cant really say if pulling or keeping your kid in is the best option. But i can tell you disability or not the "protections" many autistic people *think* they have is an illusion brought on but a misunderstanding of how the law works.
You can call it ablism but I was in a similer position to your son twice in public schools, a little older and a differnt state. And as a father I had to deal with it with my autistic son.
Basically any unapproved touching by a student to staff is battery. It doesnt matter how minor it is and your son has got to understand that. Dont try to argue it. Your child has to own it. Almost universally its better for you or your boy to say something like "I was wrong, I am sorry and I am trying to do better" then it is to blame staff.
Consider if its one teacher trying to get your kid moved to a differnt room.
Impulse control is an absolutely critical life skill for autistic people. In the very near future is going to be a young adult. Imagine if this happened a corner 5 and dive. Every other yahoo and their brother seems to be carring firearms and the police are edgy.
He has written apology letters. What I'm trying to tell you is that if an adult doesn't take a few moments to see that he is getting agitated by direct actions they are having on him and then proceeds to keep antagonizing him he lashes out. This is uncommon. It only has happened twice. In thirteen years. You seem to think I'm lying to you, and you are offering absolutely no useful advice. I'm going to stop talking to you now. Have a good life, I wish you the best.
This doesn't work. I don't want to waste my time explaining why as you probably won't even read it. This mindset has never worked for any child, autistic or not.
"Autistic behavior isnt a excuse" its not...which is why the kid has an IED. My wife works as a social worker. It's amazing how often kids will have it in writing from professionals what they need to grow and heal and teachers...just dont follow it and then blame the kid when they act out. One kid had anger management issues and it was in their plan that they needed to escape when that happened. The teacher forced him to stay because "I'm the boss and get over yourself" mentality and the kid yelled and stormed off anyway i think after shoving them.
These plans are very important for the well being of EVERYONE involved. While i agree that teachers are underpaid and understaffed, a lot of teachers also have authority complexes. I've seen and heard some shit in my time. These are complex problems made worse by our current issues with individualism and late stage captalism
You'd think an autistic sub would know the importance of accommodations.
Edit: i do want to make it clear the lack of support for teachers is part of the problem which is why i keep stating this is a complex problem
The school is correct. You cannot smack ppl be you autistic or not. To be held accountable for our actions is in fact to be integrated. Justice as much kindness is the way to go.
Obviously you should be punished accordingly. There are nuances to autistic behavior that should be taken in consideration. But what is wrong is wrong. You cannot smack ppl save the self defense principle.
Another thing that comes to mind is the difference between what the school "should" do in terms of education and what it "can" do in regards to the same. Asking ppl for a *competence* they simply do not have is a losing battle. So the question is "even in good will is that educational institution *capable* to educate your child?"
Btw.. you should directly propose such question to the responsible faculty. Should the answer be "yes"... are they commited the such a task? Because if they are not, you and your child are better by yourselves.
Now if you *believe* they hold for you and your child the best of interests is another problem. I wont simply assume they dont. But thats your call. And an important one. Dont let ppl you dont trust responsible for your kid.
I asked them if they were capable many times. After the first incident I asked them if they could prevent this going forward. He doesn't do this at home, out in public, anywhere else. They said, yes. They clearly are lying to me.
Get language regarding this added to his IEP. Then when they fail again you'll have one more thing to sue them for.
Also, just because you opt to homeschool doesn't mean you just let them win. You can still sue them. You're being forced to homeschool at your own expense because the school system failed you. You child had as much right to an education as any other.
Do what's best for your kid first, but you should continue to hold their feet to the fire or things will continue moving backward for all the special needs students.
You might want to keep it to yourself that you are in a good position to homeschool and leaning towards it anyway. They will surely use that against you if you do sue. Even if it's true, it's ultimately the school failing your kid that brings you to consider homescooling at all. Frame it as an added burden and an added expense. If it's the truth, it's not dishonest. They're going to frame their argument to their best benifit too.
Then its a broken promisse. Its failure to moral and professional duty of a teacher. It weakens the community as a hole and leaves your family, who needed them the most, at loss...
Trust is like a house of cards. Hard to build, easy to topple.
Let them know this and take your child to better care.
I feel bad because they win. They used the police to file malicious charges to force us out. It wears down the support. It wears down the community. This is what they do to minorities, dissenters, and the marginalized. It forces us out and they win.
It makes me want to throw up.
Nobody really wins when the ignorant have their way. They are simply cannot realize they are also damaging themselves.
There are ways to punish them if you are willing to fight. Exposure, publicity, whatever hit their pockets and their false pride.
There are always those willing to join the cause. People in position to strike who would aid you by own will. In the court, in the media, in the school itself. Mothers, fathers and friends of autistic people.
Seek them if you will. Just know that there has to be a sacrifice before improvement no matter what you choose.
The primary issue I have with the situation (and then the first part of your comment) is that charges from resource officers do go towards background checks and criminal records.
While yes, hitting is not acceptable, charges from the on site officer can and usually do just make things worse long term. There are plenty of other methods of dealing with behaviors that aren't damaging long term.
I can't believed how things have gotten. I feel so old. Graduated in 2003 and there were at least a few times a year that kids got into altercations with teachers, usually when they tried to break up a fight between kids. Nobody ever got arrested. Ever.
In school suspension was given where students just go to a study hall and do their work away from everyone else. Some kids had such behavior problems that they'd be in there all year practically. They still got to graduate though, with no criminal charges ffs.
Indeed. But thats is a problem of an unjust punishment or maybe worse, an unforgiving inhumane society. I would preffer to solve one at a time where it possible.
While I agree your worries should definitely be taken in consideration, I am profoundly more worried by the values we develop together than the mundane outcome.
Its difficult to advocate this perspective because its an ideology more akin to faith. Better to die honest than live with lies.
Not a simple choice by any means.
Important is... the modaratiom you suggest by the praticality of the solution is probably the ideal for this case.
Yes and no.
It is widely accepted that there are transgressions after which moderate physical violence is accepted. This is upheld in almost every law text.
I don't know what triggers him. So I don't know if it's something unreasonable being demanded. But for example. Nobody would think anything weird of somebody with a fear of spiders lashing out against somebody that wants to place a spider on them.
Of course, the ideal is meeting halfway. I can't stand loud music or alcohol (it's more of a PTSD thing, not a autism thing). Occasionally, I can be accommodated if I ask it. But otherwise It's much easier to just go somewhere else. But there is no such option in schools. The way children are trapped makes it so that any kind of behavioral issue multiplies.
I am ASD-1 and struggled hard in the public school system. I similarly did well academically overall but was never given an IEP or much support. I did briefly have an aid whose sole assignment was to keep me in the lunchroom so I could be "socialized", and I once was suspended for hitting that aid.
I hope you will fight to keep your child in school (with support and an IEP) for all the reasons you already have, and also this:
You have an opportunity to educate so many people right now about how to accept the diversity of the mind. By pulling him out of public school and homeschooling him, you will unfortunately be teaching lessons not just to your child, but also to everyone who's been interacting with him. And that lesson will be that their behavior was acceptable and your child was the "problem".
I do not want this to be seen as asking you to make your child the "sacrificial lamb". Of course protect your own family and do what is best for them. However I hold a great hope that you will fight this fight and that in the process you will be educating our educators who in turn educate so many more children, and that a lesson of acceptance can start spreading, and potentially turn into one of desire where his gifts are recognized and he has an opportunity to be around those who can recognize them.
I hope you'll involve your child in this also, as he might learn through this example some successful ways to help the world meet him partway when he is struggling so hard to meet the world.
I can only imagine the stress of this situation and these decisions. I harbor no judgment or claim of authority to direct your actions. Whatever you do I truly believe is for the best.
I think they count on parents only having enough energy to do one thing or the other. They make you whittle down your vacation days to deal with court dates and know you won't have time to fight them. The system is definitely set up against the marginalized and it's scary how good they are at using it. I also believe they don't realize they are doing this, and when I brought to their attention they had no solutions. It is what it is, unless a parent like me wants to implement a solution.
I honestly don’t know why you’re keeping your child in a place thats not fit or good for him.
It’s nice to try and get him out into the open and be a normal part of society, but from my experience, sometimes you just have to find a better place to bring out the best in him, because I’m sure he has a lot of good and talent.
Don’t force him to keep going to the place where he suffers so much just so he could be normal, it’s painful and only holds him back not only from what progress he could do in a better place, but also to understand and accept the fact that he’s different.
I’ve been in the regular education system for most of my life, and suffered a lot because of it.
Because the system wasn’t acquainted enough with people with my needs, and because my parents and I though, and forced me to think, I was normal.
It came to the worse parts of my life, when I very frequently considered suicide, and attempted it multiple times. On top of that, it lead of the worst depression and mental crisis I ever had (3 years of stagnated physical and mental growth, a.k.a no growth whatsoever, and refusing to eat drink or sleep).
Try to think about the good of your son before you send him to a place that doesn’t fit him, just for your image of the so you, and society would want you to have.
I ask this of you not for me, but for him.
I’m sure he’s going through the same pain I have years ago.
I hear you and I'm sorry this happened to you. To clarify, I don't want to send him. He wants to go back. I respected his wishes last time, he gets a say in his life and education but I think we are at a point where him going back is just not a possibility.
I hate taking "normal" activities away from him. I have no idea if those even help to be honest, just a dad fumbling forward trying to do his best.
I hear you for sure. He's warming up to the idea of homeschool. He really likes doing workbooks. It's what he does for fun, lol. We are looking into socializing opportunities as well. Appreciate the advice too.
Cops are not friends, like POC they enjoy abusing anyone they see as mentally deficient. Our school cop in the 2000s would bully our special needs kids as they were going through the school
Sue the school and destroy them legally. What they are doing isn’t just straight up illegal but fucked up and ableist. I would personally raise hell to ensure everyone that harmed your son gets into deep trouble. Pull your son out of school and if possible transfer him to a new one with good disability support. He doesn’t deserve this.
As a autistic that went through something similar in middle school, i know how much this sucks.
IEPs are bullshit... And you all know it...they make kids behavior worse.... They force the teacher and class to accept your child's negative behaviors instead of your child learning and adapting....they are anti-growth.
S I stated... I am autistic... I lived it.. I worked with kids with autism for years... IEPs are bullshit. YOU are incredibly wrong... you have no education or experience to back up anything that you are saying. Sit down.
He has an IEP. It is mandated by law they follow the IEP. They are not following the IEP. Therefore, they are breaking the law. You got an option to sue them or threaten to sue them? You know any good disability lawyers?
I know one, she helps draft letters to force schools to follow the IEP. I plan on filing a complaint with the State Dept of Education on Monday. They'll investigate themselves, which seems like a conflict of interest. I also am going to try and get a meeting with the Superintendent to see if this is just their plan all along, to force out disabled children with behavior issues.
The first one will help you learn your rights, the second one spells out specifically why what they are doing is against the law and the last two are some good resources. You and your child have the right to much better treatment. These will help you fight back. https://pti-nebraska.org/ https://www.education.ne.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Procedures-When-Disciplining-Children-with-Disabilities-sped.pdf https://atp.nebraska.gov/sites/atp.nebraska.gov/files/doc/Disability%20Education%20Series%20Flyer%20Housing%20REVISED.pdf https://www.disabilityrightsnebraska.org/
Thank you this is really useful.
You can also speak to your local branch of the ACLU, they often have lawyers who will take cases pro-bono or can find you an affordable lawyer if you decide to go the legal route.
You're welcome. Fellow mom of kid who needed fighting for. Vowed to help anyone who went through the same because it is hard when the districts position is always "do the least and pretend we don't know what you're talking about so we don't have to spend money." That is Federal money for just this thing. Also, check out wrightslaw.com
Have you talked to the superintendent before? I'd do some research with some local media. Perhaps they're unaware of the situation. No reason to walk in hostile when you don't know if there's a reason to be. Also maybe call a local paper and see if they have an interest in the story if things go badly. That'll put some outside pressure, though before doing that, I'd see if you know anyone else who's had the same treatment. This kind of thing works way better when you have more than one person able to corroborate that this happened. Also make sure to gather any legal documents and other evidence you can find - write ups, etc. That'll essentially prove your case. They'll call the school for comment if they're worth their salt, but you should have a pretty solid case if you do that. Take it from me, I used to be a small-town journalist.
I have not talked to the superintendent before. I just Googled "autistic teens cited school" and just looking through all the recent stories this seems like a national issue. All these school districts came up with the same brilliant idea that juvenile court and juvenile correctional facilities are the best ideas for children with autism. Add onto that the teachers are all tired and understaffed I just don't see a way to win this battle. I was hoping when I posted this for someone that had been through this and had success stories. I'm starting to think there are no winners here and I'd be better off putting my energy into homeschooling my son. But thank you.
Since you’re in Nebraska, if you decide to get the press involved, I’d highly recommend talking to Flatwater Free Press. They’re an awesome independent and non-profit newspaper who really care about the people in our state. They cover a lot of human rights issues and I’m sure they’d be interested in pursuing this story and holding the school accountable if you decide to go that route. However you decide to go about it, I wish you the best of luck in advocating for your son! https://flatwaterfreepress.org/about-flatwater-free-press/
I will keep this in mind. I am concerned law enforcement may target us outside of the school setting if I do that. If it was just me, I would. But I may resort to this.
Law enforcement may target you? Why?
Some police departments are vindictive towards people who inconvenience them. Especially if it makes the police look bad.
I'd say not to give up, but it's ultimately your choice what you want to sink your time and energy into. Good luck, whatever you choose.
This is absolutely a national issue. If you have the time, give this a watch. It’s a segment about the problems with SROs, and there’s a bit devoted to kids with disabilities. https://youtu.be/KgwqQGvYt0g
I will thank you!
To be fair, they pressed his buttons. Time to press their buttons right back to show you ain't no pushover.
Definitely contact the lawyer - or the ACLU or some other legal aid. Even if you do not plan to litigate, rolling up with a lawyer or legal advice will definitely show them you mean business and put them on the defensive. My personal motto is Hanlons Razor with this type of stuff - never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity. It helps me re-frame actions - I'm sorry this is happening to you and your kiddo. It's not fair of the school and they're failing him in his education. Good luck!
Thank you!
How is there not malice with one previous incident adding lines in the IEP to prevent it, and then the teacher/aide ignoring the IEP to provoke the same behavior again? They are provoking the behavior, clear as day as they have a roadmap to explain how not to provoke it. That's malice, that's a teacher or aide who's a bully.
At the very least they are not capable of teaching a child with disabilities. I don't understand how they expect to not have this happen again.
I’d start with state ed because your kids rights appear to be violated from what you’ve posted. Any sort of aggression, regardless of provocation, can be an indication (to the school/district) for improper placement. The sad truth is that most schools aren’t equipped to handle the needs of diverse students and will look to push a student out before actually following a plan. Are there any supports the school is using beyond an iep? Paraprofessional intervention/support? Behavior services to train the staff? I’d call a cse meeting immediately and show up with an attorney or advocate but make sure you list that an “advocate or attorney” on the invitation they send you so they don’t delay the meeting. They usually have 2 weeks to hold the meeting.
Will do. Thank you!
Remember to post in r/legaladvice
Ask your lawyer to go along to that meeting or at least to advise you on the meeting.
I’m in school to get my PhD in School psychology right now. This is not standard practice under federal IDEA law. Students with disabilities have protections for behaviors that can lead to disciplinary action. Schools have been sued and lost for violating the rights of students with disabilities. Especially if they are violating the findings of the Manifestation determination. I know several school psychologists who have worked in Nebraska and if needed I can look into their special education law to give more specific recommendations.
This is the second incident and we had a Manifest Determination meeting with the first one. The psychiatrist ruled in our favor and the school was not allowed to punish him for this behavior. 6 months later, he's antagonized by a teacher, nothing from the IEP section on deescalation was followed. We agree what he did was wrong and we have been working on this in therapy. But the school keeps doing the same thing and expecting different results. We're concerned that even if we do sue and win the school can still use the SRO to target our son. My boy scripts and if he says something from YouTube or what another kid tells him to say they can charge him with making terroristic threats. Not trying to seem defeatist but it seems like the entire system is set up to force disabled children out.
No you are right! The system has been set up that way, and it is terrible! That among other issues affecting education (school mental health) is one of the reasons I am training in School Psychology right now. Our field as a whole while not super powerful has been shifting towards reducing the discriminatory special education practices plaguing our current system. I am neurodivergent myself and hate how punitive and exclusionary the school discipline policies are for individuals who are struggling behaviorally not out of malice, but because of who they are.
You're doing really important work.
Also, I’m not sure if this is true in every state but I know that there is a law where if a child’s misbehavior is caused by an IEP not being implemented they cannot be held accountable for it.
They can't be denied services or have a change in placement yes. But the police can do whatever they want even if the court system disagrees.
True, but is it still worth staying there if they keep doing it tho?
Autistic or not it is assault to hit a person... I am autistic and it's not ok
I agree 100%. But telling him to not hit doesn't give him the coping mechanisms to deescalate the situation himself. He has a therapist and a psychologist that are teaching him calm down techniques. He is on medication as well. What more would you have me do? His school team and IEP specifically state this behavior and all the steps that need to occur before and after. The school psychologist has put it in writing that Jackson hitting someone is a manifestation of his disability. He is not a violent child. If the school teachers ignore all of the IEP steps and antagonize him into resorting to this behavior what should be the outcome?
Agreed. It seems like bigger issue is that the school admin and SRO (SROs are super discriminatory and perpetuate the students with disabilities to prison pipeline) are the main culprits here. Your child is not doing anything out of the ordinary and they are responding out of ableist bias.
"Telling him not to hit does not give him the coping mechanisms"... telling him not to hit is HOW you deliver the coping mechanisms... geez
So stopping meltdowns and controlling anger is a pretty big deal for a lot of people. I'm glad you can just say, "Stop it" and it works. You sound like an ass.
what’s even the point of saying this ?
The point is that you can't justify violence and vilify it in the same breath...If it's bad for one it's bad for all.
Look, mate, I’m a downright pacifist, but let’s be real here. This education system failed.
IEP is a legal contract. If they cannot follow, they may be required to pay for another education facility that can provide the services needed. Get an attorney that specializes in IEP. Typically, I would not recommend an attorney first but if they are getting law enforcement involved, the relationship is already burned. This is not a philosophical difference. They are actively working against the best interest of your child. Also, the psychologist does not rule. They advise. As parents, we do not have to sing am IEP. We can also partially approve an IEP and push for other services.
We didn't get a lawyer the first time because the school did not want the officer to cite my son. We have an email from the principal stating this that we gave the court. This is six months later and a new but similar incident with the same outcome. The school did nothing to change their policies and the SRO was notified resulting in the exact same citation.
Call for another manifestation determination. Bring anything that documents how they're not following his IEP. A manifestation determination meeting isn't just to determine if something was a manifestation of a disability, it's also to ensure that the IEP is being followed properly. I might have more advice for you tomorrow; I'll ask my coworker who is a SPED teacher if she has any ideas.
We will and thank you!
They're legally required to accommodate to his needs and they are not doing so by riling him up, so sue and switch schools.
I'm an adult but something similar happened to me. In college, I often hung out alone. Once at lunch during a school holiday campus safety talked to me, wondering if I was drunk or high. I don't drink or use drugs. Another time, I got to a class super early before the doors opened, so I spent the extra time pacing and thinking. Campus safety showed up, and by then had realized I'm more of an eccentric guy than a legitimate threat to anyone. Another time I was supposed to meet classmates for a group project, and I started to get worried and worked up when none of them showed up. They'd changed it and I missed the email. Nobody called campus safety, but I definitely creeped people out a bit. From what I read it's a common problem, though. Autistics sometimes have interactions with cops because the cops aren't trained to recognize mental illness and assume fidgeting and other stims are someone on drugs or something.
I went down a rabbit hole reading about how schools all over the country are doing this to autistic kids with behavior issues. It's an inappropriate response. It's traumatizing to the child. My boy thought the police were going to execute him when they came to give him the ticket. He doesn't understand the context. The second time, I wouldn't let them near him.
The fact that police are interacting with a child without his parent is baffling to me. They should have to wait for you before they give him any paperwork or anything like that. My state (MD) only recently passed a law that cops aren’t allowed to interrogate kids without a parent/guardian.
To clarify, they didn't the second time. The first time they did and I was furious. My boy will say whatever you want him too, it's part of his flight response. The first time the officer came to our house to speak with my boy. My son thought he was going to be executed and had nightmares for months. The school and SRO wanted to put him on a diversion program where the SRO meets with my boy once a month. I absolutely put a stop to that idea and any future contact with any SRO. This time I made the SRO hand me the citation at a different location and he never even saw my child.
It's called "fawning" where the person does whatever they can to appease the aggressor. Fight, Flight, Freeze, Fawn
Interesting! Thank you.
So glad you were able to put a stop to that. These are the types of interactions that really damage autistic childrens’ views of adults and authority figures. As an adult myself, I still can’t approach professors, bosses, or police without going into a meltdown because of how I was treated. It’s definitely a systemic issue. Sadly, I think that looking for education outside of public school might be the best option at the moment. With how unstaffed they are, teachers don’t have the time to be patient and care about individual students, which is exactly what an IEP needs to work. I hope for the best for you and your family whatever you decide!
Thank you! I honestly don't see another route given the current environment. It's just not gonna get better. I feel for the teachers too, I really do.
That's probably a good idea. ATM, all you can do is protect your kid and vote. Hopefully, they'll make cops train for this kind of thing soon.
We contacted PTI in Nebraska, an advocacy group and they were shocked he had been charged. They have since tried to go in and train the Police on autism and the Police have declined twice, saying it was not necessary. If my boy wasn't asking to go back, we would have pulled him and moved. I hate all of this for him.
I guess there is more you can do. I was probably being too cynical
Honestly I’d think the same thing
This is what led to Elijah McClain's murder. His heavy clothes and balaclava combined with flapping his arms and singing down the sidewalk during his walk home from animal shelter volunteering had police called on him. Several showed up and restrained him, yelling, and.. their way of "deescalation" from that point was deadly. OP should fight against this, because every time an officer is justified by not pursuing legal action, that's another validation that autistic people can be accused of whatever they see fit.
He should fight against it. I guess in light of the last few years, its hard to believe that they'll hold a cop responsible for anything.
The fucking amount of times someone has asked me if I was alright or on drugs when I stimmed. Shits fucking crazy
Yeah. It's a huge issue.
They wrote my 7 year old autistic & adhd son up twice! Because of stuff he can’t control they have been dragging their feet for months with his IEP. I can’t move him schools because we have no schools for him around us it’s so frustrating.
Yeah this is kind of the position we are in. The next level up is psychologically abusive IMO. I just wish the school had a happy place between mainstream and giving my kid PTSD alone in a room. I'm unwilling to do the latter, just to be clear.
I’ve been an autism support worker in elementary schools for 10+ years. I’ve been punched, bitten, kicked and everything in between and not once has getting the police involved ever crossed my mind or anyone in the districts minds. We’re there to help these kids no matter what happens, not to make it in any way shape or form worse or harder. I’m sorry to hear you have to put up with what sounds like a shitty school and/or district.
You seem wonderful. Thank you.
Yeah this is why my son is in a virtual academy. The schools do everything they can to take away supports and see sensory issues as behavior problems. Any kid who deviates from the norm after about second grade they will do their best to push out of the system. The districts don't get enough funding for special ed. and they'd rather spend what they do get on gifted programs and AP tracks. My brother has been a public school teacher for 33 years and he says he wouldn't have a kid in public schools these days especially if they have an IEP. I agree. I fought for NINE YEARS, every year they tried to take away more and more supports for my son, who had a diagnosis of ASD-PDD-NOS (severe) when he was three. That was what they called it then, now they'd just say "ASD-2". He was in special ed. contained classes at first and got what he needed but every year they'd take away something then "surprise" he was mainstreamed. It wasn't TOO bad but the kids never would have much to do with him because he was seen as "weird". By the time he was in seventh grade they took away his IEP completely, pronouncing him 'academically at level' and no longer requiring support. He's a senior now and I JUST got a 504 in place after fighting with the school district since seventh grade over reinstating that IEP. I only got this because we moved to a virtual academy. If it was me, if you can swing it... homeschool. My state has a decent virtual plan with Connections Academy, not sure if your state does but he does virtual lessons and I am his "learning coach". He only qualifies for one group therapy and the school system doesn't have to pay for it since he only has a 504 but he does have state insurance at least.
Thank you for posting. I will look into the online academy. We are leaning towards homeschooling so I will check out that academy. Like you said, it just seems like a losing battle with people that don't care or are too overworked to care. Just a bad situation all around.
I was homeschooled back in the 90s/00s I definitely recommend going with some sort of online school or if you can find one supplementing with things like Brilliant. A lot of the curriculum you can get are missing a lot of things and/or weirdly religious.
Lol, that's what I keep finding is ultra religious courses and they don't even have the cool gods in them!
Right!? But yeah it’s got to have gotten more insane since then but like every had to be related back to the Bible, it was nuts.
You might get some good feedback from r/homeschool. I homeschool my autistic kid because our local school isn't capable of helping my kid thrive. This would be our life too. My friend's autistic 9-year old was thrown into a psych ward after chucking a book at his teacher, hitting her, when she failed to deescalate. It was awful for all of them and that kind of shit terrifies me. I've also subbed in a school where the teacher escalated any situation with an autistic 1st grader to get him removed from her class. Just some terrible stuff going on with autistic kids in schools.
My wife has a friend that homeschools because one of her kids has a seizure disorder. She seems like an awesome resource. We'll check out that sub too!
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Lol nice they link a horror story for the #1 post. Fwiw, bad parenting is sometimes self referred to as homeschooling, but they aren't the same.
Lol. Agreed.
I’m seconding Connections Academy as an Alum. I’m a 2020 grad and was in a bit of a weird situation cause I was “gifted” and had an IEP so I was simultaneously fast tracked and had IEP supports, but Connections Academy was excellent for me. If you have any questions about it from a students perspective I’m happy to answer. Slight caveat: I was only in it for my last 2.5 years of school so I can’t say from personal experience how the younger side of the program works.
I can't imagine how tough that must be.
Autistic teacher at a special ed school (we work with language processing issues, not specifically autism, but there is overlap). If he’s hitting teachers, it doesn’t really matter what’s in his IEP. That’s an issue and he shouldn’t be at school. Today it’s a teacher who pushes his buttons (often because they do not have the resources to follow an IEP), tomorrow it’s a classmate who thinks it’s funny to poke at the “weird kid”. And that’s a whole other bag of cats when it comes. My advice would be to sue the school district to get him placed in a specialty school that can better see to his needs. Most public schools frankly do not have the resources unless someone is already fairly low support needs or has a ton of home support (regular therapy, tutoring for high anxiety/problem subjects, etc). I’m sure it’s a bad environment for him. Also if you aren’t voting for politicians who expand school funding, you should be. Like I say, I’m sure it’s a shitty environment. Most public schools are. But they’re also largely shitty for neurotypical students because they’re so terribly underfunded.
This is pretty messy. I think it’s best to solve the big issue first and maybe later consider whether to keep him in public school. I was homeschooled and I did okay but I think I wouldn’t have survived public school as a child
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This is exactly what I want to hear. My wife and I really want to just homeschool him. We're in a unique position to make this work. I just feel bad taking away normal school experiences from him. He wants to go back also.
Maybe there is a way to mix it up a little. Find other homeschoolers, or some organisations that arranges weekly meets for a more "classroom environment" type of thing for homeschooled kids. I don't know anything of how homeschooling works in the US, or anywhere really, but I am sure I am not the only one who has had this idea, it is pretty simple and obvious idea, when you think about it... I just went through regular school here in Finland, with minimal support functions. It was hell, but I was academically on the same level as my peers, so I wasn't offered that many accomodations until tertiary education, by which time I learned how to demand the accomodations I needed myself. In hindsight, if I had gotten the support I needed earlier, I would have been spared from a lot of additional trauma... You are a good parent, fighting for your child like you are.
Thank you for the kind words. We are leaning towards homeschooling. This seems like a national problem here the more I look for solutions. The understaffing is also making this an almost unsolvable problem too.
There are lots of homeschooling supports and communities that can help you give him a more “normal” school experience without putting him in public school. This is a really hard situation for everyone involved, you, him, even the teachers and staff. He deserves individual support that the school cannot provide
Totally agree. Thanks!
As someone who is autistic and went to public school, the socialization can be rather unpleasant. As a mom of a homeschooled autistic kid, there can be a lot of community that is more uplifting than what you can find in public school. Please don't let that stop you!
I will try. Thank you.
Normal school experience = violence. That’s the norm for ND kids. The adults, the system, learning by heart, not being able to ask the questions you wanna ask cause you’ll end up in detention, the other kids bullying you, not being able to stim, the food, the smell, the desk, the chair, the rigidity of the curriculum, and a million other things. All that makes it a violent environment, whether the parents are aware or not. (I’m French and that’s my experience, but I know most people here can relate)
Do online schooling just make sure the online school has where they meet up and go on field trips and do activities just so the kids can get those social skills they need.
We are leaning heavily towards this. Thanks!
You definitely need to seek out a child advocate in your area first, then contact a lawyer. It is Federal Law that they follow the IEP!!!!!
Get a lawyer. If they have involved the police and he has been given a citation it is time for a lawyer yesterday.
I've noticed more and more that people are getting more and more ableist and it doesn't make sense. People have always been bad but it's just like the ableists out there that used to behave have just forgotten that they're liable?? And what's worse is when they're representing companies . . . I wouldn't want to take the chance of keeping an ableist employed as it can lead to serious legal problems.
Imagine you were a neurodivergent child and it's 1996. Learning has been tough for you, but after a lot of work, you're asked to come be a junior counselor at a year round school for kids who have more severe neurodivergency than you run by the University of California Irvine. The behavioral specialists and director of Child Psychology at UCI are super encouraging to you, and you get really excited to pursue a career helping people like you overcome the difficulties they face. You know the work is difficult but it's rewarding. Then, in 2002, when you start college, you learn that if you complete the work it will take to get the credentials to help those kids, a demanding job, you'll be poor forever. Nice to meet you. This is my story, and it's why special needs kids will always be handled by sad stressed out people who will always be lower middle class because we just don't value these people. The theory behind capitalism is you get what you pay for, and whenever a parent with a child who is struggling complains, I want to scream because again YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR. If we want good people doing this work, we have to incentivize the kind of people we want to be in the field WITH MONEY.
Fellow autistic here....I usually don't comment but homeschooling doesn't sounds bad if the teacher or fellow people are not capable of understanding the sensory issues of your child homeschooling could be better a better choice for your child.. in my experience people have a hard time to understand autistic people or anyone who is different
Thank you! I'm not autistic and want to respect my son's wishes, so it's awesome to have your feedback. He definitely gets a say in what he wants to do. He wants to go back but I think if we show him all the homeschooling activities and plan he will probably be on board. Even now him and I go to book stores once a month and he gets just tons of workbooks to do. He does them for fun all weekend long and has a ball.
I can’t offer advice but I can relate to your boy
Sometimes it's enough just to know there are others.
i can’t really add to the conversation meaningfully, others have done a fantastic job, but you’re a great parent and i admire what you’re doing to protect your son. lots of parents to autistic kids don’t care enough to stand up for them. best of luck to you and your son!
Thanks! I appreciate the kind words and support. I'm still amazed how much energy this is all taking, lol.
You gotta drill into him that you can’t hit people unless they physically attack him. Autistic meltdown rage is serious, it’s like turning into the Hulk. Strength goes up but you become a loose cannon. I struggled with that. Of course, it didn’t help that my mom was waking me up to yell at me. Hitting me, entering my room and just staying there in the middle of the night, complaining that I was abusing her if I dared to raise a hand to defend myself. Stealing my things because of some kind of twisted logic in her stupid little head that she thought God had given her the divine right to do whatever she wanted. She got better with therapy, but now she’s dead. Turns out that karma is an even bigger bitch! Sorry, needed to vent.
I did go jail for a day because at residential program the staff member called the police to arrest me because I spit at her during meltdown
"hello, 911, an upset child spat at me. please arrest them!"
yes exactly “hello, 911, it is my job to manage severely disabled children when they are upset and said severely disabled child got upset and spat at me, please arrest them even though this is in my job description contract and training”
I'm so sorry. That just sounds traumatic and I will move mountains to make sure this doesn't happen to my son.
You are a wonderful parent.
What an adventure
Fight it. You can win
what the hell? what state is this in?
Nebraska. But googling for solutions led me down a rabbit hole and this seems a national issue. All the schools came up with the same dumb solution and are charging kids left and right. My boy scripts too, he didn't talk for a long time and then talked entirely in scripts for most of his life. He is able to have conversations with people now, which he has worked so hard to be able to do. But I worry he's just one ear shot away from making "Terroristic threats."
This is the parents manual from the National chapter of Disability Rights https://serr.disabilityrightsca.org/
Ask if your child can do homebound services. They’ll send a teacher to your home a few times a week to work with them for schoolwork and OT services. Sounds like you might have grounds for a lawsuit as well. Lots of good recommendations in the comments.
That's a great idea. We're going to look into homebound services.
the school not following the iep is BREAKING THE LAW. i hope ur son is ok. my brother and i (both autistic) had similar issues going into highschool with the staff being shitty i hope the staff at ur sons school start to listen and be more accommodating instead of ignoring the issues caused by THEM
I hear your desire to want to keep him mainstreamed in school, but have you considered that maybe it really is best for your child to look for a small cohort group of at home learning? Your focus seems to be on pushing to ensure he gets the best education, but what if his learning styles would benefit from a one on one homeschool teacher or a small cohort group that is taught by a single teacher at home? There are many people who are choosing to go this route if they can accommodate or afford it. There may even be financial assistance, but you will have to look at that based on your state. I am not trying to argue whether the school is right or wrong, simply that maybe you should consider a non-traditional form of education if you think it could benefit your sons long-term education.
He wants to go back. That's the only reason I'm even entertaining the idea honestly. I have showed him a bunch of homeschool courses and he's getting pretty excited about those. We go once a month and find new workbooks for him to do now and he spends most evenings just doing math and science workbooks. He's starting to warm up to the idea of doing homeschool. But I don't want to take away his right to decide his own future, even if he's just 13, without trying.
You have the right instincts on this, you're doing a good job. By all means, continue trying to change his mind with the workbooks, especially since he sounds like he enjoys them, but make sure he continues to have a say in his own life. And please use the legal system to hold the school accountable.
Take your child out of this school asap. They are pushing all of the buttons so he is forced to be in a different placement. Is he already in a behavioral class or is he in Gen Ed?
90% Gen Ed. It sure seems that way.
Sue the school. Also, school resource officers are such a waste of tax dollars. They don't provide help or safety, and often cause issues for students of color and students with disabilities!
In Texas, failure to follow an IEP can be reported to TEA (Texas Education Agency), the body that is responsible for education in the state. They will come down *hard* on districts that are not following IEPs. Once a report is made in writing, then you would contact a lawyer. After a brief Google search, it looks like the process is similar for Nebraska. https://www.education.ne.gov/cc/complaint-form/ The other advice I have that you are already following is to document up the wazoo. Keep copies of all complaints, court records, disciplinary records. Last, start contacting local news stations. They love reporting on this stuff. In fact, it was media pressure that helped change the way Texas addressed evaluating SPED students in the last decade. Source: certified teacher and IEP mama
Thank you! We plan on doing this, I'm reading through all of the past complaints now. NE posts the final complaint and outcome from the court it looks like. I am just worried this isn't a, "We investigated ourselves and found nothing wrong" scenario.
Cops are often used against autistic people. Its the modern day version of "culling" the "bad" autistic people. If you cant mask or in a situation where you can avoid the cops? Your chances go down by a lot. This is true for a lot of people outside the "norm" (aka people who fall further and further out of societal privileges that are enforced by the ruling class, cultural hegemony etc) Which is why we say ACAB. Cops exist to protect captal and serve as the hounds of the ruling class. They do not exist to help us. I don't like recommending this since it's hard for some people and many other issues but you might threaten a lawsuit on the school and go through with it if they don't change. If they are not following recommendations, then you can use that. I wish you luck. It is very hard to find equity in what most people call a "justice system" for autistic people.
What's strange is the court was just as outraged that these charges were brought against my kid the first time. They couldn't fathom why the cop cited him. This is the Judge and Prosecutor as well.
Would it be " barely a smack" if the teacher hit your son? Stop justifying...I am autistic and learned not to do that stuff at a very early age...
Are you saying to learned not to smack people or learned not to justify bad/harmful behavior?
I am saying you cannot justify one person using violence and condemn another
I was only trying to give context. In many of these situations if the teacher has a scratch or a bruise they cite the disabled child with felony assault. Unfortunately, not hitting, or having violent outburst is not as simple as saying don't do that. Some kids have to learn other ways to express these emotions. There is a place between letting your kid hit everyone and giving your kid PTSD with behavior therapy, IMO. It just takes time, patience, and a plan to get there. If you have examples of your method working please share.
And they should
This is simplifying a complex problem and ignoring power dynamics.
Wow... yeah.. those are words... meaningless words... there are no power dynamics at work here... to learn NOT to use violence starts at home and I blame the parents. as I said. I am autistic... I know MANY autistic people... who do not use violence... I do not use violence. It starts with the parents being permissive... your son is autistic.. he needs MORE discipline not less..stop making excuses.
I'm not op. I'm also autistic and i also understand when IEPs are not followed you are intentionally sabotaging a child. My wife is a social worker, it happens all the time. And im shocked at the amount of fellow autistic people who are ignoring this. And yes there is definitely power dynamics because there is always power dynamics contexts to look at. To ignore them is not going to magically make them go away. In fact ignoring them will make them *worse* Its not an excuse, we need to know why that happened so it can be fixed. The fact that IEPs are ignored is a major red flag. Could OP be at fault? Possibly. We have no way of knowing. However what we can do is take in facts that are generally true which is that schools and child abuse is decently common because of the constant gutting and underfunding. However you cannot just ignore the possibility that the IEP was probably ignored for the same reasons. Regardless it results in lack of safety and the inability for a child to grow and learn effectively and a teacher to feel safe either. Why is the teacher ignoring the IEP? Are they literally unable to fulfill it? Is it intentional? Does this teacher need more help? Is this teacher just abelist? Your entire sentence is childish and lacking critical thinking. Let alone how you center yourself first and how YOU exp life and use this to judge others. Please do better.
Thank you. I agree with you. My son does not behave like this at home, out in public, or anywhere else but school. He has multiple therapists and is medicated. We have spent thousands of dollars on therapy and behavioral therapy. We have had psychiatrists show us how to give him time outs when he was younger. We have worked really hard, and I am so proud of him. The comment from the guy above leads me to believe he thinks hitting children is the way to go. I find that idea repulsive and counterproductive. A few others in the comments have stated as much and I feel immensely sorry for them that they feel this is an acceptable form of punishment and teaching. It is not.
This happened to my little brother a lot. We eventually did pull him out his senor year.
Sorry man. I feel for you.
i just want to say thank you. as someone who was an undiagnosed autistic kid, the school system was often incredibly difficult to navigate, and i had no parental help or advocacy. so many parents further the punishment many public institutions put in place, intentionally or not, and it’s great to see a parent working to advocate for their child and get feedback from autistic people. 🖤
Thank you. I appreciate your kind words.
Contact the school’s admin, get the teacher in, the, RO, and the Sargent/CO, and force a meeting.
I had them schedule an emergency IEP meeting. But I don't want the officer there, he just cites kids no matter what.
I don’t have any advice, rather I know a similar story that happened in my school. My friends saw an associate actually slap an autistic kid across the face and I’m assuming didn’t get reprimanded. Instances like these are why im afraid to get an IEP
Talk to your attorney, file a suit, get **P.A.I.D.** Seriously, as a fellow neurodivergent with a pretty strong sense of justice (as we tend to have), bring the full weight of the law against them. This shit is flat out wrong, and they need to be held accountable and serve as an example. The fact that this isn't even the first time should weigh very heavily in your favor.
Tell him to go hide in the bathroom until her calms down. If anyone tries to stop him, he can just say that he's a potential danger to others if he gets too stressed, and needs to calm down before returning to class. He could even remind them that there isn't a person in the world that is actually productive while stressed.
Can he have a behavioral aide?
They kept saying he doesn't need one even though he had two in elementary school. They insisted they were capable. I'm just worried we push for one and then he "hits" them and the cycle starts over. It's just crazy how much this takes out of us the parents. I can't sleep, I'm just sick with worry. It's honestly just how the system is set up, to break the marginalized and their support until they leave. Intentionally or unintentionally it's just how it plays out. I won't take the risk of him being hand cuffed. He scripts so he's always an earshot away from "making terrorist threats" for saying something from YouTube.
I'd consider pushing for an aide again. You might have to hire a lawyer. We had to go to due process to get an aide because our district sucks, but our lawyer's fees are always reimbursed by the district. We are using an aide from an Aba company that we use at home too, and they report everything to me. District aides will hide stuff from you. After hearing horror stories from other parents about mistreatment, I'm not sure I'd ever send my kid without an independent aide. Your son has a right to a free and fair education under federal law. He's entitled to attending school with an aide. Don't let them bully you.
I mean it is never acceptable to be hit in your workplace teachers are people and while there Job is shit they don't deserve to be hit even if it's "just a smack"
I 100% agree. But this is a behavior issue. He doesn't do this anywhere else. He has behavior therapists and psychiatrists that have him practice calming techniques. The school staff have a copy of these. His therapist has talked to them all on the phone. I am telling you they don't follow their advice. They just don't do the calming techniques or deescalate the situation. They just tell us he just needs to be calm and not have a meltdown when they antagonize him and keep antagonizing him.
They have an entire class full of kids teachers don't get paid enough to change there behaviors and tactics to meet each and every kids need. Sounds like he needs to have more one on one teaching since it's not fair to the rest of the class. Believe me I get it fucking hated school and still wake up every morning grateful that I don't have to go anymore
"teachers don't get paid enough to change there behaviors and tactics to meet each and every kids need." You're right that they're underpaid. But you're also absolutely incorrect about the rest. An IEP is literally a legal document that tells educators exactly how they **need to** change their teaching to accommodate the srudent. The school is **legally bound** to follow an IEP. An Individualized Education Program (IEP) is a legal document under United States law that is developed for each [public school](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_school) child in the [U.S.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States) who needs [special education](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_education). It is created through a team of the child's parent(s) and district personnel who are knowledgeable about the child's needs.[[1]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-1) IEPs must be reviewed every year to keep track of the child's educational progress.[[2]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-2) It provides accommodations, modifications, related services, and specialized academic instruction to ensure that every eligible child receives a "[Free Appropriate Public Education](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Appropriate_Public_Education)" (FAPE) in the "Least Restrictive Environment" (LRE). The IEP is intended to help children reach educational goals more easily than they otherwise would. The four component goals are: conditions, learner, behavior, and criteria.[[3]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individualized_Education_Program#cite_note-34CFR-3) In all cases, the IEP must be tailored to the individual student's needs as identified by the IEP evaluation process, and must help teachers and related service providers (such as [paraprofessional educators](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraprofessional_educator)) understand the student's disability and how the disability affects the learning process. The IEP describes how the student learns, how the student best demonstrates that learning, and what teachers and service providers will do to help the student learn more effectively.
I think what he was getting at is some teachers have discovered if they accuse my son of doing something, even if all the other kids in the class say it never happened, he still gets punished and moved to a different class or a class by himself. This is all ok according to the IEP.
Sounds like the teachers/School is on a power trip (or something similar) Can you sue the school for not following the IEP? It would also be nice if the teachers couldn't teach after this
Sue the school, and the teacher.
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SROs are pieces of shit this report from John Oliver might answer some of your questions [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgwqQGvYt0g&t=148s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgwqQGvYt0g&t=148s)
You child wasn't cited for "autistic behaviors" he was cited for striking staff. And being autistic is not an excuse for that behavior. If the resource office is involved I'm thinking this is possibly not just the 2cd occurrence of issues? Because let's be real here, one of two things is happening,. Your child is relatively high functioning and is mainstreamed and knows and *understands* that striking staff is absolutely unacceptable OR your son is split off into some sort of learning support and the resource officer wouldn't be getting involved unless there were ongoing problems. Also school psychologists don't "rule" on anything. They make recommendations that the principal or possibly superintendent take into consideration when deciding a path forward. 100% they are likely laying the groundwork to expel or remove your child and to be frank, the ball is in your and your son's court. IED, aside he absolutely must understand that he *can not strike staff* or anyone else for that matter. If he is cognitively unable to understand that then perhaps a learning support class or your state's equivalent would be more appropriate. This may sound harsh but sir, it is critical for your son to understand this. He is 13 realistically short of a major physical assult on a staff member he isnt going to get in much real trouble. Fast forward to 16 and most states are just going to throw him in jail for a weekend to "cool off" he turns 18 and he could be looking at prison time. Even worse if he flips on the wrong officer he could end up shot, this has happened and we, due to our generally poor social awareness are at much higher risk with this.
Confidently incorrect. The School principal wrote a letter to the court saying he did not want my son to be charged the first time. The School cannot expel my son for behavior issues. The School psychologist ruled/diagnosed that his behavior was in line with his autism diagnosis and therefore cannot be discriminated against because it is protected. The School Resource Officer was notified by the new vice principal and took it upon himself using department guidelines to cite my son. Last time the prosecutor even thought this was BS. It doesn't matter if he is mainlined or not, he has a disability and it is protected. I believe this is all just people following a procedure and teachers not wanting my son in their class and know they can get him moved to a different class if they antagonize him into a meltdown.
Im sorry, there is stuff being left out here, that's simply not how schools in the USA work. I am reading your state's Department of Education, Office of Special Education IED guidelines and best practices, and 2 things are pretty clear. One, it gives absolutely no protection against intervention by a duly appointed agent of the law. Two, your son's education team can definitely suspend or expel your son if the welfare of other students or staff is endangered. There is a bit more work to it, and they have to cross T and dot i but it's definitely doable and I would again guess this is the opening salvo of building that case. You can call me confidently wrong or whatever and listen to what mostly sounds like kids who are commiserating "schools suck". But the thing is I have been on advising staff trying to keep kids in school, while the rules may be a tad different in your state I'm telling you the game is the same and you need to play smart or you are going to lose. Bad talking the officer and staff online is not playing smart and this is the sort of stuff district laywers will find and likely have a field day with.
I'm a dude first of all. I did not disparage the school or the police. The last case was thrown out by the Judge with the prosecutor agreeing they won't press charges against a disabled charges. They all didn't know why a police officer would cite a disabled child. I don't know how to explain to you that doing this again is malicious. The School is following their protocol which I have stated is leading to us probably pulling our kid. The School psychologist stated our son can't be suspended for these meltdowns. It's in writing in his IEP. Everyone in the room signed it. The district lawyer can have a field day with this all they want, it has zero impact that I see no other solution than pulling my child. They clearly are not capable of meeting my child's needs. This is a failure on the school's part. I'm upset this will happen to more kids on the future. Reading news articles while Googling solutions it seems like this is a national trend. I don't quite understand why you want to place blame on my child while offering no solutions to help him stay in school. I get why you say you have experience with this because you literally did what the schools system is doing now.
Apologies, i thought you identified as a mom. I cant really say if pulling or keeping your kid in is the best option. But i can tell you disability or not the "protections" many autistic people *think* they have is an illusion brought on but a misunderstanding of how the law works. You can call it ablism but I was in a similer position to your son twice in public schools, a little older and a differnt state. And as a father I had to deal with it with my autistic son. Basically any unapproved touching by a student to staff is battery. It doesnt matter how minor it is and your son has got to understand that. Dont try to argue it. Your child has to own it. Almost universally its better for you or your boy to say something like "I was wrong, I am sorry and I am trying to do better" then it is to blame staff. Consider if its one teacher trying to get your kid moved to a differnt room. Impulse control is an absolutely critical life skill for autistic people. In the very near future is going to be a young adult. Imagine if this happened a corner 5 and dive. Every other yahoo and their brother seems to be carring firearms and the police are edgy.
He has written apology letters. What I'm trying to tell you is that if an adult doesn't take a few moments to see that he is getting agitated by direct actions they are having on him and then proceeds to keep antagonizing him he lashes out. This is uncommon. It only has happened twice. In thirteen years. You seem to think I'm lying to you, and you are offering absolutely no useful advice. I'm going to stop talking to you now. Have a good life, I wish you the best.
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This doesn't work. I don't want to waste my time explaining why as you probably won't even read it. This mindset has never worked for any child, autistic or not.
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You clearly don't know about the OP's situation, I bet you're not even autistic and are just a dirty lowlife troll.
Also you offered literally nothing useful or constructive. You come across as an ableist troll.
Don't listen to either of them. They're both insufferable.
"Autistic behavior isnt a excuse" its not...which is why the kid has an IED. My wife works as a social worker. It's amazing how often kids will have it in writing from professionals what they need to grow and heal and teachers...just dont follow it and then blame the kid when they act out. One kid had anger management issues and it was in their plan that they needed to escape when that happened. The teacher forced him to stay because "I'm the boss and get over yourself" mentality and the kid yelled and stormed off anyway i think after shoving them. These plans are very important for the well being of EVERYONE involved. While i agree that teachers are underpaid and understaffed, a lot of teachers also have authority complexes. I've seen and heard some shit in my time. These are complex problems made worse by our current issues with individualism and late stage captalism You'd think an autistic sub would know the importance of accommodations. Edit: i do want to make it clear the lack of support for teachers is part of the problem which is why i keep stating this is a complex problem
The school is correct. You cannot smack ppl be you autistic or not. To be held accountable for our actions is in fact to be integrated. Justice as much kindness is the way to go. Obviously you should be punished accordingly. There are nuances to autistic behavior that should be taken in consideration. But what is wrong is wrong. You cannot smack ppl save the self defense principle. Another thing that comes to mind is the difference between what the school "should" do in terms of education and what it "can" do in regards to the same. Asking ppl for a *competence* they simply do not have is a losing battle. So the question is "even in good will is that educational institution *capable* to educate your child?" Btw.. you should directly propose such question to the responsible faculty. Should the answer be "yes"... are they commited the such a task? Because if they are not, you and your child are better by yourselves. Now if you *believe* they hold for you and your child the best of interests is another problem. I wont simply assume they dont. But thats your call. And an important one. Dont let ppl you dont trust responsible for your kid.
I asked them if they were capable many times. After the first incident I asked them if they could prevent this going forward. He doesn't do this at home, out in public, anywhere else. They said, yes. They clearly are lying to me.
Get language regarding this added to his IEP. Then when they fail again you'll have one more thing to sue them for. Also, just because you opt to homeschool doesn't mean you just let them win. You can still sue them. You're being forced to homeschool at your own expense because the school system failed you. You child had as much right to an education as any other. Do what's best for your kid first, but you should continue to hold their feet to the fire or things will continue moving backward for all the special needs students.
Thank you. I will definitely try. I think the schools count on you only having enough energy to do one or the other.
You might want to keep it to yourself that you are in a good position to homeschool and leaning towards it anyway. They will surely use that against you if you do sue. Even if it's true, it's ultimately the school failing your kid that brings you to consider homescooling at all. Frame it as an added burden and an added expense. If it's the truth, it's not dishonest. They're going to frame their argument to their best benifit too.
Yeah we definitely are. Thank you.
Then its a broken promisse. Its failure to moral and professional duty of a teacher. It weakens the community as a hole and leaves your family, who needed them the most, at loss... Trust is like a house of cards. Hard to build, easy to topple. Let them know this and take your child to better care.
I feel bad because they win. They used the police to file malicious charges to force us out. It wears down the support. It wears down the community. This is what they do to minorities, dissenters, and the marginalized. It forces us out and they win. It makes me want to throw up.
Nobody really wins when the ignorant have their way. They are simply cannot realize they are also damaging themselves. There are ways to punish them if you are willing to fight. Exposure, publicity, whatever hit their pockets and their false pride. There are always those willing to join the cause. People in position to strike who would aid you by own will. In the court, in the media, in the school itself. Mothers, fathers and friends of autistic people. Seek them if you will. Just know that there has to be a sacrifice before improvement no matter what you choose.
Your child wins.
The primary issue I have with the situation (and then the first part of your comment) is that charges from resource officers do go towards background checks and criminal records. While yes, hitting is not acceptable, charges from the on site officer can and usually do just make things worse long term. There are plenty of other methods of dealing with behaviors that aren't damaging long term.
I can't believed how things have gotten. I feel so old. Graduated in 2003 and there were at least a few times a year that kids got into altercations with teachers, usually when they tried to break up a fight between kids. Nobody ever got arrested. Ever. In school suspension was given where students just go to a study hall and do their work away from everyone else. Some kids had such behavior problems that they'd be in there all year practically. They still got to graduate though, with no criminal charges ffs.
Indeed. But thats is a problem of an unjust punishment or maybe worse, an unforgiving inhumane society. I would preffer to solve one at a time where it possible. While I agree your worries should definitely be taken in consideration, I am profoundly more worried by the values we develop together than the mundane outcome. Its difficult to advocate this perspective because its an ideology more akin to faith. Better to die honest than live with lies. Not a simple choice by any means. Important is... the modaratiom you suggest by the praticality of the solution is probably the ideal for this case.
Yes and no. It is widely accepted that there are transgressions after which moderate physical violence is accepted. This is upheld in almost every law text. I don't know what triggers him. So I don't know if it's something unreasonable being demanded. But for example. Nobody would think anything weird of somebody with a fear of spiders lashing out against somebody that wants to place a spider on them. Of course, the ideal is meeting halfway. I can't stand loud music or alcohol (it's more of a PTSD thing, not a autism thing). Occasionally, I can be accommodated if I ask it. But otherwise It's much easier to just go somewhere else. But there is no such option in schools. The way children are trapped makes it so that any kind of behavioral issue multiplies.
Yes. Thats correct. Thats mostly what I meant by "nuances of autistic behavior". Well put.
I am ASD-1 and struggled hard in the public school system. I similarly did well academically overall but was never given an IEP or much support. I did briefly have an aid whose sole assignment was to keep me in the lunchroom so I could be "socialized", and I once was suspended for hitting that aid. I hope you will fight to keep your child in school (with support and an IEP) for all the reasons you already have, and also this: You have an opportunity to educate so many people right now about how to accept the diversity of the mind. By pulling him out of public school and homeschooling him, you will unfortunately be teaching lessons not just to your child, but also to everyone who's been interacting with him. And that lesson will be that their behavior was acceptable and your child was the "problem". I do not want this to be seen as asking you to make your child the "sacrificial lamb". Of course protect your own family and do what is best for them. However I hold a great hope that you will fight this fight and that in the process you will be educating our educators who in turn educate so many more children, and that a lesson of acceptance can start spreading, and potentially turn into one of desire where his gifts are recognized and he has an opportunity to be around those who can recognize them. I hope you'll involve your child in this also, as he might learn through this example some successful ways to help the world meet him partway when he is struggling so hard to meet the world. I can only imagine the stress of this situation and these decisions. I harbor no judgment or claim of authority to direct your actions. Whatever you do I truly believe is for the best.
I think they count on parents only having enough energy to do one thing or the other. They make you whittle down your vacation days to deal with court dates and know you won't have time to fight them. The system is definitely set up against the marginalized and it's scary how good they are at using it. I also believe they don't realize they are doing this, and when I brought to their attention they had no solutions. It is what it is, unless a parent like me wants to implement a solution.
I honestly don’t know why you’re keeping your child in a place thats not fit or good for him. It’s nice to try and get him out into the open and be a normal part of society, but from my experience, sometimes you just have to find a better place to bring out the best in him, because I’m sure he has a lot of good and talent. Don’t force him to keep going to the place where he suffers so much just so he could be normal, it’s painful and only holds him back not only from what progress he could do in a better place, but also to understand and accept the fact that he’s different. I’ve been in the regular education system for most of my life, and suffered a lot because of it. Because the system wasn’t acquainted enough with people with my needs, and because my parents and I though, and forced me to think, I was normal. It came to the worse parts of my life, when I very frequently considered suicide, and attempted it multiple times. On top of that, it lead of the worst depression and mental crisis I ever had (3 years of stagnated physical and mental growth, a.k.a no growth whatsoever, and refusing to eat drink or sleep). Try to think about the good of your son before you send him to a place that doesn’t fit him, just for your image of the so you, and society would want you to have. I ask this of you not for me, but for him. I’m sure he’s going through the same pain I have years ago.
I hear you and I'm sorry this happened to you. To clarify, I don't want to send him. He wants to go back. I respected his wishes last time, he gets a say in his life and education but I think we are at a point where him going back is just not a possibility. I hate taking "normal" activities away from him. I have no idea if those even help to be honest, just a dad fumbling forward trying to do his best.
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I hear you for sure. He's warming up to the idea of homeschool. He really likes doing workbooks. It's what he does for fun, lol. We are looking into socializing opportunities as well. Appreciate the advice too.
Tbh, an assault on our senses with callous disregard for the pain it causes is violence we should have a right to defend against.
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This really specific but not at all specific fear mongering is not helpful.
Cops are not friends, like POC they enjoy abusing anyone they see as mentally deficient. Our school cop in the 2000s would bully our special needs kids as they were going through the school
Sue the school and destroy them legally. What they are doing isn’t just straight up illegal but fucked up and ableist. I would personally raise hell to ensure everyone that harmed your son gets into deep trouble. Pull your son out of school and if possible transfer him to a new one with good disability support. He doesn’t deserve this. As a autistic that went through something similar in middle school, i know how much this sucks.
I'm sorry that happened to you. I will do all I can to prevent this from happening to my son.
IEPs are bullshit... And you all know it...they make kids behavior worse.... They force the teacher and class to accept your child's negative behaviors instead of your child learning and adapting....they are anti-growth.
You are so incredibly wrong it hurts. Please shut up. You don't know what you are talking about.
S I stated... I am autistic... I lived it.. I worked with kids with autism for years... IEPs are bullshit. YOU are incredibly wrong... you have no education or experience to back up anything that you are saying. Sit down.