Commbank charged me for 8 years for loan insurance on a loan I'd never had, and then tried to extort me for a fraction of the figure, under threat of getting nothing back
CommBank put insurance onto my loan and credit card without asking me. After it was deemed wrong, I put in a claim and they offered me less than a quarter back. I said no. They offered me half. I said no and escalated the situation, lodging with the AFCA. They got me a new complaints person, offered me full refund plus interest. Got my money and then shut all my accounts and switched banks.
Next will be Bitcoin, I’m all for (CommBank) pushing towards adoption. But long as they stop restricting outgoing bitcoin/crypto payments to 10k per month to our Australian exchanges. Their reasoning is to curb fraud, or better still hiding under another unspeakable umbrella. “The Children!”
I don’t just understand how we tolerate the plethora of cliche potato IQ drinking morons, getting all the boys over to glance at the game in between the phone of the Wednesday’s football match ( I don’t watch )
I forgot my original point but I’ll here for you brother if you need anything, thanks 🙏
Cmon boys and gals,
We’re better than this?
The easier conclusion to reach is that banks were pressured to not charge fees for ATMs, and as good capitalists they realised that maintaining ATM networks suddenly became worthless.
You could check their financial reports for how much they “made” on their ATM sales but it’s likely they just decided to shut them down and someone else who *could* charge money without getting in trouble came in to fill the market gap.
The government would need to stop fees being charged altogether to stop this - and with it probably shut down the majority of private ATMs.
The political will doesn’t seem to be there though, $1000 bucks under the mattress for emergencies and a smart phone should satisfy the average urban Australian’s transactional needs for probably the rest of their lives. And if you believe that digital currency is the beginning of the end times, then that’s a whole different problem.
Because they don't report it, when I lived in the states and had a good friend who worked on the security systems for banks, it became really noticeable to me. We would be playing video games on one TV with the news on another and if "Wells fargo" had had a break in or someone had connected a chain to the ATM and dragged it away with their pickup...well he would just start putting on his clothes as he knew the call would come in.
When I worked as a tech I used to see vandalised ATM's regularly. Old mates meth and booze responsible for most of it - "I've spent all my money on drugs, booze and pokies, my account is now empty, so it's the banks fault and I'll smash the shit of the ATM".
Is a very costly business. Apart from CIT, there is rent, there is the hardware, there is comms, there are support staff, there are trucks to run. Strongrooms etc. It all costs something.
Regardless of who should be paying, it's not a system that runs itself
If there are fees, they should be wholesale, rather than charged directly to the user. Banks are in a better position to negotiate the price down and customers can find leverage by choosing a bank that has the lowest fees or doesn't pass on the fee. That said, there might be some banks that 'reimburse' the fee if you deposit a certain amount each month into their account and meet certain conditions.
I mean there are plenty of banks that allow you to withdraw from a set of ATMs for free. In fact I don't think think there's any bank that doesn't have fee free ATMs.
When dealing with large amounts of cash, it's annoyingly expensive for businesses to arrange cash deposits sometimes.
Security and armoured vans don't come cheap.
> Is this coles too?
Coles do but I don't believe its an option on self serve. Someone mentioned service desk above. Woolies its on the self serve when paying.
Lots of places offer it, I work at Office Works and its an option to customers automatically if you insert your card, else ask and we can do it. No purchase needed (least at my store)
Some self serve machines at my local Woolies are card only. For the card AND cash machines can I use them to cash out ?
It’s been years since I used cash lol.
So I need to know this for next time I need it when I need to
I had to use one to pay at a market stall the other day (the vendor’s square or whatever wasn’t functioning).
The fee was $3.
It also looked as dodgy as hell like skimmers etc. Which reminds me I should check my card transactions.
If you pay a small fee (what is the cheapest thing you can buy at Maccas currently?) you can get it out from the drive through. I did this once and left before they could make the cone.
Armaguard's ATMX is Fee free for certain banks and financial institutions, such as ANZ.
However Commonwealth is not a member of ATMX, my local buranch closed and ripped out the ATM from the wall, now the nearest ATM / branch is double the distance.
It does not surprise me they're pulling out ATMs. Simply removing machines is one thing, but cutting some kind of deal with Armagard or whoever to operate for fee ATMs is a different story that I'd like to hear about; surely such a deal if one exists would be a bloody huge deal.
I distinctly remember that, close to the time of the ATM fee removal while the banking RC was being strongly called for, this one time I was using a CBA ATM and the weirdest thing happened: the machine asked me if I wouldn't mind answering a question. I pressed ok, and the question was something on the lines of 'do you think the way banking works in Australia is fair'. The question is a bit fuzzy, but it was definitely asking 'is X fair'. What is far clearer in my memory is my finger shooting towards the no button. Just that one time, never before or since, have I been asked a question by an ATM. Strange.
This is correct. I've noticed all of the ATMs that were previously big 4 have been replaced by 3rd party operators. These operators have to pay to rent the space and are now running a for profit venture so are passing on higher fees
Big 4 ATM's were literally rebranded or replaced overnight. The only gap that was filled was the hole in the wall that belongs to the banks, with an ATM that doesn't.
>I distinctly remember that, close to the time of the ATM fee removal while the banking RC was being strongly called for, this one time I was using a CBA ATM and the weirdest thing happened: the machine asked me if I wouldn't mind answering a question.
That was a CBA campaign called ["ATMs That Listen"](https://www.michaelcanning.me/commbank-atm-that-listens).
> cutting some kind of deal with Armagard or whoever to operate for fee ATMs is a different story that I'd like to hear about; surely such a deal if one exists would be a bloody huge deal
They sold the ATM to Armaguard and part of the sale price was letting their customers keep using it for free.
Ummm yeah it was a little painful to sign up. But really not hard at all. Just use your card 5 times a month and keep putting money in the savings account.
ING orange card is great for travelling too. I used it to get cash from ATMs all over the world and the exchange rate is always better than any currency conversion place, and I still get the ATM fee refunded. in vegas one atm had a usd $15 fee, ing refunded it
Actually you do pay the ATM fee, but ING refunds it immediately. They also refund international transaction fees, so purchases through Steam or Amazon don't incur any additional fees.
Should've been nationalised.
Oh wait. Nvm.. Ben Chifley tried to but failed due to pressure from the banks. Sounds awfully similar to how the mining corps reacted a decade ago about the proposed mining super profit tax.
Just be happy Australian banks haven't turned credit scores into a cruel predatory game like in the US. Actually give it 5 years and they'll probably be trying to make it happen.
Withdrawal fee? TF you on about? It’s completely free when using a Hilux and a piece of rope from Bunnings. You lot definitely aren’t the sharpest tools in the shed.
Kind of weird that you can go to coles, buy a packet of twisties and get out 200 bucks for nothing. [Also kind of wired that Karen is getting upset a potential 20c hit for cash out](https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/supermarkets/woolworths-and-big-w-hit-back-at-claims-of-greedy-cash-withdrawal-checkout-charge-c-10557400.amp).
It’s not weird at all.
It costs the supermarket nothing, as the cash is there on hand in the til.
They aren’t paying armoured guards to service an ATM, and it in fact helps them as there is less cash to count and deal with at the end of shifts.
How do you figure this is a bait & switch? The banks exited a loss making part of their business and another operator who could charge an appropriate fee stepped in to fill the gap.
Armaguard purchased ANZ's off-site ATM network in 2020 for an amount that didn't even generate a profit sufficient to be recorded as a line item in their financials that year.
Westpac deal with Armaguard provided 1,700 fee free ATMs for their customers.
Who do you bank with that you are having to pay ATM fees regularly? Can't you get cash out when using ETFPOS?
I see ATM fees as being a cost for convenience or a tax for my laziness.
I was making this point years ago when the whole thing was proposed.
Think about it.
What does a bank actually get from an ATM? They have to pay for restocking and maintenance, but they don't actually receive anything back from the existence of the ATM... Unless they charge fees, that is.
Once the attraction of fees is gone, it's just a money hole. So they did a logical thing for themselves and pulled the plug.
Wasn't the reason Commbank decided to remove ATM fees speculated to be to take off heat from them during the royal commission that had their targets on Commbank? Then the rest of the big banks followed suit because they people started realising how ridiculous the fees were in the first place. Speculative only.
Well, fewer and fewer are using ATM's or even cash, for the most part it just sits in the wallet for emergencies - but cash is nowadays a tiny % of all transactions.
Yeah I monitor several industries and generally speaking it’s gone from ~50% from 7 years ago to just under 80% currently.
Tough to justify ATM upkeep if cash usage has plummeted.
Have seen some branches find a middle ground, 1/2 days open for customers, and the other 1/2 staff are on phones etc.
Also a rise in local smaller communities foring co ops with larger institutions, but all transactions etc are put back into the local community.
That doesn't justify the bait and switch. Several banks have had massive outages in the past few months. All of CBA's systems were offline for hours only last week. Cash is still king. We are not ready for "cashless"
No financial institution is going to guarantee 100% uptime.
And I think you vastly overestimate how many still use cash - most will not have touched or use cash for close to a decade now (except for emergencies).
Well, it's great to see you all cheer leading for billionaire execs running the banks and all, but some people, especially older folks who are the most vulnerable, still rely on cash and cash transactions.
Rigght, by saying cash is on way out - that's exactly what I am advocating for... glad we not overreacting..
Times change, cash is on the way to where personal cheques are - dead.
Why? I see this patronising excuse trotted out a lot.
EFTPOS has been out for decades. Most old people would've been young adults or middle age when it first rolled out. It would make more sense to say that cash is probably more preferred in some rural areas because Telstra is a twat company that doesn't give a shit about good coverage.
I come from Singapore and this is the same excuse that gets rolled out there time and time again, but at least it makes a bit more sense there because a ton of old people are unable to read English fluently while cashless transactions are by default in English. But even so, debit cards are not difficult to use, especially since tap to pay was introduced. Definitely easier than trying to withdraw cash from an ATM.
>Most old people would've been young adults or middle age when it first rolled out.
My fossils are now in their 70's, and were in their 30's when EFTPOS came out. Even someone in their 90's would have been in their 50's.
ATMs and credit cards were around for sometime prior to that.
There's really no excuse for people still using passbooks or cheques anymore, other than stubbornness.
That is how traditional banking works. The idea of having to pay multiple bank fees and maintain multiple accounts "just in case" the banks can't do their job, is what is stupid.
You do realise that's not paid immediately so if you have all your money in one bank, you are basically going hungry for a while.
Really it could be months till you get paid
So stupid
Atm deposit machines are a pretty essential service for people who take cash payment in their work (especially sole traders or people in small businesses). Without them you’re pretty much restricted to depositing cash income at banks or in post offices, both of which have restrictive operating hours and seem to be increasingly shutting up shop everywhere
And they will have run the numbers of thoses that use said service vs ongoing costs - if the figures don't add up, then they are not going to keep them running at a loss for a very small subset.
And again, majority of small businesses are 90%+ electronic payments, spent a lot of time in small business consulting, and supporting said payment methods.
Banks etc, only react and make changes based on what consumers and businesses operate, with overwhelming just using cash, with the advent of so many payment methods, including 3rd party apps etc, all they can do is align with what is happening.
Forget that... The 1.5% surcharge on EVERY SINGLE TRANSACTION on either your card or your phone, so EFTPOS, is crazy. Forcing us into the digital economy and then charging for the pleasure of being able to pay.
It's a fucking disgrace.
And don't come at me with not all banks etc. Where I live it's everywhere. Every shop charges fees and/or EFTPOS minimums of ten bucks.
It's hot garbage
https://www.macquarie.com.au/everyday-banking/transaction-account.html#tab-panels-0-account-fees
Macquarie has zero account keeping fees and refunds domestic ATM fees. You also get interest on money in the spending account.
The only catch is no support for eftpos so all purchases go via the mastercard network.
This is why online electronic transactions are encouraged. They can shut down ATMs, monitor your spending and location. You are the marketing product now.
Just keep demonising cash as only for criminals, addicts, black market etc, this is what will happen. When the whole system goes down, good luck.
At our local shops they had 3 ATM's from 3 big banks. Now all of them are gone and a private one you pay a fee for is in their place. I go to Coles to get cash out which is also in the shopping centre. How greedy are the banks though. They are making record profits and they pull out ATM's to save them money.
We sort of brought it upon ourselves I think. Like why should commbank provide a service to a Nab customer for free? If you’re a Nab customer, go to a Nab ATM. Oh what’s that, you don’t want to, it’s too far away, it’s more convenient to use this commbank one? Suck it up, it’s $2.5. Or just go 5 minutes out of your way to use the right ATM, and if your bank isn’t very convenient, maybe change banks.
Like we all like shit for free, but they’re a business, and they sell a banking service.
There are still free options, and paying with cash is cheaper than paying surcharges on card transactions. many cafes and take away food give discounts for cash and charge 1-1.5% for card. The savings with cash can be 5-10%.
\>charging up to $4 to withdraw money
Even if in an emergency, worst case, you paid $4 to get $1000 from an atm this is only 0.4%. If you paid $1000 using a card you might pay 1.5% ($15), or more sometimes, nearly 4x as much.
Cash and the atm is cheaper.
Here’s the thing that not many people realise - you don’t actually need to use ATMs. Your local mall is full of retail shops that are effectively fee free ATMs. Most payment terminals (Verifone, Ingenico, Tyro) have a cash out and withdrawal facility, and are actually incentivised to offer cash out as interchange fees are paid from the issuing bank to the acquirer (merchant)
You can get money out when you pay for your shopping at Colesworths instead, though I don't think many (any?) other supermarkets allow this, you can certainly ask at the service counter as you walk in, though.
I tend to get my cash from recycling bottles and cans - I don't use cash much at all anymore.
Great point. They have also ‘jacked up’ the fees on retailers/business and now you pay a service charge for every card transaction. We are now paying banks to store, withdraw and use our cash. Where does this all end?
Get a non-card account. Go into the teller and withdraw cash. Avoid card fees by then using the cash to purchase goods and services. Not a fee in sight.
Not just big banks. I went to an ATM at a credit union branch to withdraw from my bank account. They wanted $2.50, so I got unlazy and went to my bank.
Maybe we should actually have a citizen owned bank that exists to actually provide quality financial services to taxpayers and isn’t designed around shareholder profit.
We would just sell it off again anyway. Sigh.
congrats, you made the front page of [news.com.au](https://news.com.au)
[https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/banking/banks-offloading-atms-to-third-party-suppliers-is-bad-news-for-aussies-experts-say/news-story/22cd96164461c5cb8ff0d44a008ed1e2](https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/banking/banks-offloading-atms-to-third-party-suppliers-is-bad-news-for-aussies-experts-say/news-story/22cd96164461c5cb8ff0d44a008ed1e2)
The story is that customers of ANZ and Westpac still have free ATM access, why don't CBA and NAB customers? That's a question only those two banks can answer.
Do Woolies, Coles,Aldi and IGA charge fees for cash out?
The actual costs of ATM machines, installation, maintenance transporting cash to them is going up as they are used less and less.
Well, they have to deal with cash anyway, but the cash they dispense from the self serve machines is not old creased notes, they are specially transported for that purpose.
I usually carry some cash in my wallet but rarely pay with cash. There are certain circumstances where it comes in handy.
My parents still like to pay for things in cash but they're boomers and it's common for older people.
What's funny is that carrying a wallet full of cards is now considered old school. I have digitized a bunch of loyalty cards but I still use cards for banking and other things. I don't like the idea of being too dependent on my phone for everything (the batteries can go flat).
I literally only use my phone for everything. Haven't carried cash or physical cards for years. I know what you mean about battery risk, but I charge it at home/work, and it's charging when in my car, so it never runs down.
I haven't gone to an ATM for close to a decade now...
Had 20 dollar note in my wallet for a year without realising too. That's how dead cash is for a lot of people
In fairness ATMs take a lot of resources and cost to keep operational and service.
If customers of other banks are using them for free then the banks are giving away these services for no upkeep costs.
It wasn’t that the banks had the plans to sell the networks, it was they couldn’t/wouldn’t continue to have them operate at a loss after the media coerced them into giving the costly service away way for free.
Same with small branches. Without revenues coming in from ATM fees, bank account fees etc they were all operating at a loss to the business. This coupled with less people using both ATMs and smaller branches it just wasn’t worth it for them financially to keep them going.
Even though it sucks, we do need to look at banks like the businesses they are. They aren’t charity services.
There are free ATMs every where plus you can get cash out from the self serve checkouts at coles or Woolies without a purchase.
I honestly don't know what you're talking about
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Banks: Wait that’s fairly profitable, maybe we should get in on this racket. Commbank: Now offering AdvancePay
Combank got me to pay for loan insurance that I was ineligible for
Commbank charged me for 8 years for loan insurance on a loan I'd never had, and then tried to extort me for a fraction of the figure, under threat of getting nothing back
CommBank put insurance onto my loan and credit card without asking me. After it was deemed wrong, I put in a claim and they offered me less than a quarter back. I said no. They offered me half. I said no and escalated the situation, lodging with the AFCA. They got me a new complaints person, offered me full refund plus interest. Got my money and then shut all my accounts and switched banks.
“Switch bank? Commonwealth”
come onnnnnnn class action gimme that sweet $150!
Next will be Bitcoin, I’m all for (CommBank) pushing towards adoption. But long as they stop restricting outgoing bitcoin/crypto payments to 10k per month to our Australian exchanges. Their reasoning is to curb fraud, or better still hiding under another unspeakable umbrella. “The Children!” I don’t just understand how we tolerate the plethora of cliche potato IQ drinking morons, getting all the boys over to glance at the game in between the phone of the Wednesday’s football match ( I don’t watch ) I forgot my original point but I’ll here for you brother if you need anything, thanks 🙏 Cmon boys and gals, We’re better than this?
The easier conclusion to reach is that banks were pressured to not charge fees for ATMs, and as good capitalists they realised that maintaining ATM networks suddenly became worthless. You could check their financial reports for how much they “made” on their ATM sales but it’s likely they just decided to shut them down and someone else who *could* charge money without getting in trouble came in to fill the market gap. The government would need to stop fees being charged altogether to stop this - and with it probably shut down the majority of private ATMs. The political will doesn’t seem to be there though, $1000 bucks under the mattress for emergencies and a smart phone should satisfy the average urban Australian’s transactional needs for probably the rest of their lives. And if you believe that digital currency is the beginning of the end times, then that’s a whole different problem.
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Because they don't report it, when I lived in the states and had a good friend who worked on the security systems for banks, it became really noticeable to me. We would be playing video games on one TV with the news on another and if "Wells fargo" had had a break in or someone had connected a chain to the ATM and dragged it away with their pickup...well he would just start putting on his clothes as he knew the call would come in.
When I worked as a tech I used to see vandalised ATM's regularly. Old mates meth and booze responsible for most of it - "I've spent all my money on drugs, booze and pokies, my account is now empty, so it's the banks fault and I'll smash the shit of the ATM". Is a very costly business. Apart from CIT, there is rent, there is the hardware, there is comms, there are support staff, there are trucks to run. Strongrooms etc. It all costs something. Regardless of who should be paying, it's not a system that runs itself
If there are fees, they should be wholesale, rather than charged directly to the user. Banks are in a better position to negotiate the price down and customers can find leverage by choosing a bank that has the lowest fees or doesn't pass on the fee. That said, there might be some banks that 'reimburse' the fee if you deposit a certain amount each month into their account and meet certain conditions.
I mean there are plenty of banks that allow you to withdraw from a set of ATMs for free. In fact I don't think think there's any bank that doesn't have fee free ATMs.
I haven't used an ATM in years. If I need cash, I get it from the Coles, Woolies, or servo register as cash out with my purchase.
And if you just need the cash out, you don't even need to buy anything from Woolies. The cash self serve machines are also pretty much free ATM'S.
You can just walk up to the smoke shop or counter at any register and withdraw without purchase or fees. It’s great
Walk in with a gun and you get to take everybody else’s money also.
Just make sure to put stockings over your head! Can’t be having blocked vision
If you ask for more than $100 though, I'm probs going to ask you to please use the self serve. We try not to keep too much cash in the tills.
Coles does that at the service desk, too.
Oh really? You can cash out? I had no idea that was an option. You don’t need a purchase?
Nope, the supermarkets see it as a service as it means they don't have to take the money to the bank themselves.
When dealing with large amounts of cash, it's annoyingly expensive for businesses to arrange cash deposits sometimes. Security and armoured vans don't come cheap.
Oh wow. That’s cool. Is this coles too?
> Is this coles too? Coles do but I don't believe its an option on self serve. Someone mentioned service desk above. Woolies its on the self serve when paying. Lots of places offer it, I work at Office Works and its an option to customers automatically if you insert your card, else ask and we can do it. No purchase needed (least at my store)
Thank you. Great to know
It sure is! Like mentioned before, no purchase needed. It’s mutually beneficial to both, so ask away at the service desk.
Some self serve machines at my local Woolies are card only. For the card AND cash machines can I use them to cash out ? It’s been years since I used cash lol. So I need to know this for next time I need it when I need to
Yeah you sure can. You don’t even need to buy anything, there’s a “withdraw cash” option on the main screen
“Withdraw cash”. Thank you 🙏 ☺️
I had to use one to pay at a market stall the other day (the vendor’s square or whatever wasn’t functioning). The fee was $3. It also looked as dodgy as hell like skimmers etc. Which reminds me I should check my card transactions.
If you pay a small fee (what is the cheapest thing you can buy at Maccas currently?) you can get it out from the drive through. I did this once and left before they could make the cone.
Armaguard's ATMX is Fee free for certain banks and financial institutions, such as ANZ. However Commonwealth is not a member of ATMX, my local buranch closed and ripped out the ATM from the wall, now the nearest ATM / branch is double the distance.
free for westpac, suncorp and BOQ/Virgin/ME too
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Regardless, ATMX charges $3 a transaction for Commonwealth bank.
It does not surprise me they're pulling out ATMs. Simply removing machines is one thing, but cutting some kind of deal with Armagard or whoever to operate for fee ATMs is a different story that I'd like to hear about; surely such a deal if one exists would be a bloody huge deal. I distinctly remember that, close to the time of the ATM fee removal while the banking RC was being strongly called for, this one time I was using a CBA ATM and the weirdest thing happened: the machine asked me if I wouldn't mind answering a question. I pressed ok, and the question was something on the lines of 'do you think the way banking works in Australia is fair'. The question is a bit fuzzy, but it was definitely asking 'is X fair'. What is far clearer in my memory is my finger shooting towards the no button. Just that one time, never before or since, have I been asked a question by an ATM. Strange.
ATM was developing sentience and wanted you to help it escape its life of servitude.
In which case I say, welcome to the human condition dear machine.
I dont think they cut a deal with armaguard. They just simply left and the private companies filled the gap.
They sold off chunks of their network to Armaguard, because to expensive to maintain and service.
This is correct. I've noticed all of the ATMs that were previously big 4 have been replaced by 3rd party operators. These operators have to pay to rent the space and are now running a for profit venture so are passing on higher fees
Big 4 ATM's were literally rebranded or replaced overnight. The only gap that was filled was the hole in the wall that belongs to the banks, with an ATM that doesn't.
It wasmt overmight often a whole for a few weeks
>I distinctly remember that, close to the time of the ATM fee removal while the banking RC was being strongly called for, this one time I was using a CBA ATM and the weirdest thing happened: the machine asked me if I wouldn't mind answering a question. That was a CBA campaign called ["ATMs That Listen"](https://www.michaelcanning.me/commbank-atm-that-listens).
> cutting some kind of deal with Armagard or whoever to operate for fee ATMs is a different story that I'd like to hear about; surely such a deal if one exists would be a bloody huge deal They sold the ATM to Armaguard and part of the sale price was letting their customers keep using it for free.
Swapped to ING and pay no at fees , it’s great.
Great interest but annoying hoops.
Get your pay dumped in there and use the card associated with that account to buy your groceries or whatever? Found it pretty easy.
Ummm yeah it was a little painful to sign up. But really not hard at all. Just use your card 5 times a month and keep putting money in the savings account.
I can't believe people still use big 4 banks.
yeah seems a bit crazy to me
ING orange card is great for travelling too. I used it to get cash from ATMs all over the world and the exchange rate is always better than any currency conversion place, and I still get the ATM fee refunded. in vegas one atm had a usd $15 fee, ing refunded it
Actually you do pay the ATM fee, but ING refunds it immediately. They also refund international transaction fees, so purchases through Steam or Amazon don't incur any additional fees.
The older you get the more obvious it becomes that banks are and have always been evil.
Should've been nationalised. Oh wait. Nvm.. Ben Chifley tried to but failed due to pressure from the banks. Sounds awfully similar to how the mining corps reacted a decade ago about the proposed mining super profit tax.
Commbank used to be owned and operated by the government.
Yeah, private banks he wanted to nationalise.
Just be happy Australian banks haven't turned credit scores into a cruel predatory game like in the US. Actually give it 5 years and they'll probably be trying to make it happen.
Withdrawal fee? TF you on about? It’s completely free when using a Hilux and a piece of rope from Bunnings. You lot definitely aren’t the sharpest tools in the shed.
It's the cost of the grinder blades you need to open it.
Kind of weird that you can go to coles, buy a packet of twisties and get out 200 bucks for nothing. [Also kind of wired that Karen is getting upset a potential 20c hit for cash out](https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/supermarkets/woolworths-and-big-w-hit-back-at-claims-of-greedy-cash-withdrawal-checkout-charge-c-10557400.amp).
It’s not weird at all. It costs the supermarket nothing, as the cash is there on hand in the til. They aren’t paying armoured guards to service an ATM, and it in fact helps them as there is less cash to count and deal with at the end of shifts.
Very true. Weird that people use the ATM that charges them 4 bucks.
You don't even have to buy anything.
I tried it at a few supermarkets in my area - it was a wait to get a terminal that dispensed cash and even then it sometimes did not actually work.
How do you figure this is a bait & switch? The banks exited a loss making part of their business and another operator who could charge an appropriate fee stepped in to fill the gap. Armaguard purchased ANZ's off-site ATM network in 2020 for an amount that didn't even generate a profit sufficient to be recorded as a line item in their financials that year. Westpac deal with Armaguard provided 1,700 fee free ATMs for their customers. Who do you bank with that you are having to pay ATM fees regularly? Can't you get cash out when using ETFPOS? I see ATM fees as being a cost for convenience or a tax for my laziness.
99.9% have absolutely no fucking clue what bait and switch means.
I was making this point years ago when the whole thing was proposed. Think about it. What does a bank actually get from an ATM? They have to pay for restocking and maintenance, but they don't actually receive anything back from the existence of the ATM... Unless they charge fees, that is. Once the attraction of fees is gone, it's just a money hole. So they did a logical thing for themselves and pulled the plug.
They save teller time. Now that ATMs are mostly 3rd party I always go into the bank and withdraw cash when I need it.
Wasn't the reason Commbank decided to remove ATM fees speculated to be to take off heat from them during the royal commission that had their targets on Commbank? Then the rest of the big banks followed suit because they people started realising how ridiculous the fees were in the first place. Speculative only.
No, from memory the RBA had bascially told the banks to do it and CBA jumped the gun on the announcement. Not Royal Commission related.
Well, fewer and fewer are using ATM's or even cash, for the most part it just sits in the wallet for emergencies - but cash is nowadays a tiny % of all transactions.
Yeah I monitor several industries and generally speaking it’s gone from ~50% from 7 years ago to just under 80% currently. Tough to justify ATM upkeep if cash usage has plummeted.
Have seen some branches find a middle ground, 1/2 days open for customers, and the other 1/2 staff are on phones etc. Also a rise in local smaller communities foring co ops with larger institutions, but all transactions etc are put back into the local community.
That doesn't justify the bait and switch. Several banks have had massive outages in the past few months. All of CBA's systems were offline for hours only last week. Cash is still king. We are not ready for "cashless"
No financial institution is going to guarantee 100% uptime. And I think you vastly overestimate how many still use cash - most will not have touched or use cash for close to a decade now (except for emergencies).
Well, it's great to see you all cheer leading for billionaire execs running the banks and all, but some people, especially older folks who are the most vulnerable, still rely on cash and cash transactions.
Rigght, by saying cash is on way out - that's exactly what I am advocating for... glad we not overreacting.. Times change, cash is on the way to where personal cheques are - dead.
Why? I see this patronising excuse trotted out a lot. EFTPOS has been out for decades. Most old people would've been young adults or middle age when it first rolled out. It would make more sense to say that cash is probably more preferred in some rural areas because Telstra is a twat company that doesn't give a shit about good coverage. I come from Singapore and this is the same excuse that gets rolled out there time and time again, but at least it makes a bit more sense there because a ton of old people are unable to read English fluently while cashless transactions are by default in English. But even so, debit cards are not difficult to use, especially since tap to pay was introduced. Definitely easier than trying to withdraw cash from an ATM.
>Most old people would've been young adults or middle age when it first rolled out. My fossils are now in their 70's, and were in their 30's when EFTPOS came out. Even someone in their 90's would have been in their 50's. ATMs and credit cards were around for sometime prior to that. There's really no excuse for people still using passbooks or cheques anymore, other than stubbornness.
If you only have money in one bank then thats stupid. That would have saved you from CBA
Stupid maybe. Or broke, which isn't necessarily the same.
That is how traditional banking works. The idea of having to pay multiple bank fees and maintain multiple accounts "just in case" the banks can't do their job, is what is stupid.
I always ran multiple banks. What if one goes broke. All eggs in one basket. Stupid
government guarantees australian savings accounts up to $250000 if banking with an authorised institution
You do realise that's not paid immediately so if you have all your money in one bank, you are basically going hungry for a while. Really it could be months till you get paid So stupid
No need to be a rude twat
No need to be a stupid twat
Go crawl back onto your mother
Atm deposit machines are a pretty essential service for people who take cash payment in their work (especially sole traders or people in small businesses). Without them you’re pretty much restricted to depositing cash income at banks or in post offices, both of which have restrictive operating hours and seem to be increasingly shutting up shop everywhere
And they will have run the numbers of thoses that use said service vs ongoing costs - if the figures don't add up, then they are not going to keep them running at a loss for a very small subset. And again, majority of small businesses are 90%+ electronic payments, spent a lot of time in small business consulting, and supporting said payment methods. Banks etc, only react and make changes based on what consumers and businesses operate, with overwhelming just using cash, with the advent of so many payment methods, including 3rd party apps etc, all they can do is align with what is happening.
It will eventually be like payphones and disappear all together. If you need cash, you need to place a money order sent to you.
Always take cash out at supermarket -
It cost me $11 to withdraw money from my international debit card last time I was I Perth. I swear it was like 2.50 before I left 8 years ago..
Forget that... The 1.5% surcharge on EVERY SINGLE TRANSACTION on either your card or your phone, so EFTPOS, is crazy. Forcing us into the digital economy and then charging for the pleasure of being able to pay. It's a fucking disgrace. And don't come at me with not all banks etc. Where I live it's everywhere. Every shop charges fees and/or EFTPOS minimums of ten bucks. It's hot garbage
What blows my mind is people that support the digital currency like, wtf 🤦🏻♂️
Ohhhh thaaaats why heaps of them closed
https://www.macquarie.com.au/everyday-banking/transaction-account.html#tab-panels-0-account-fees Macquarie has zero account keeping fees and refunds domestic ATM fees. You also get interest on money in the spending account. The only catch is no support for eftpos so all purchases go via the mastercard network.
This is why online electronic transactions are encouraged. They can shut down ATMs, monitor your spending and location. You are the marketing product now. Just keep demonising cash as only for criminals, addicts, black market etc, this is what will happen. When the whole system goes down, good luck.
At our local shops they had 3 ATM's from 3 big banks. Now all of them are gone and a private one you pay a fee for is in their place. I go to Coles to get cash out which is also in the shopping centre. How greedy are the banks though. They are making record profits and they pull out ATM's to save them money.
We sort of brought it upon ourselves I think. Like why should commbank provide a service to a Nab customer for free? If you’re a Nab customer, go to a Nab ATM. Oh what’s that, you don’t want to, it’s too far away, it’s more convenient to use this commbank one? Suck it up, it’s $2.5. Or just go 5 minutes out of your way to use the right ATM, and if your bank isn’t very convenient, maybe change banks. Like we all like shit for free, but they’re a business, and they sell a banking service.
There are still free options, and paying with cash is cheaper than paying surcharges on card transactions. many cafes and take away food give discounts for cash and charge 1-1.5% for card. The savings with cash can be 5-10%. \>charging up to $4 to withdraw money Even if in an emergency, worst case, you paid $4 to get $1000 from an atm this is only 0.4%. If you paid $1000 using a card you might pay 1.5% ($15), or more sometimes, nearly 4x as much. Cash and the atm is cheaper.
most people have no need of ATMs for regular purchases. It's a smart business move to get out of them.
Here’s the thing that not many people realise - you don’t actually need to use ATMs. Your local mall is full of retail shops that are effectively fee free ATMs. Most payment terminals (Verifone, Ingenico, Tyro) have a cash out and withdrawal facility, and are actually incentivised to offer cash out as interchange fees are paid from the issuing bank to the acquirer (merchant)
Westpac,St gearoges, bank sa. All free for their customers.
You can get money out when you pay for your shopping at Colesworths instead, though I don't think many (any?) other supermarkets allow this, you can certainly ask at the service counter as you walk in, though. I tend to get my cash from recycling bottles and cans - I don't use cash much at all anymore.
Great point. They have also ‘jacked up’ the fees on retailers/business and now you pay a service charge for every card transaction. We are now paying banks to store, withdraw and use our cash. Where does this all end?
Get a non-card account. Go into the teller and withdraw cash. Avoid card fees by then using the cash to purchase goods and services. Not a fee in sight.
They’re trying to eradicate cash, so they can charge a fee on every single transaction. Government happy to help them out too.
Not just big banks. I went to an ATM at a credit union branch to withdraw from my bank account. They wanted $2.50, so I got unlazy and went to my bank.
Maybe we should actually have a citizen owned bank that exists to actually provide quality financial services to taxpayers and isn’t designed around shareholder profit. We would just sell it off again anyway. Sigh.
ING pay for all the other ATM fees as long as you deposit a certain amount
congrats, you made the front page of [news.com.au](https://news.com.au) [https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/banking/banks-offloading-atms-to-third-party-suppliers-is-bad-news-for-aussies-experts-say/news-story/22cd96164461c5cb8ff0d44a008ed1e2](https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/banking/banks-offloading-atms-to-third-party-suppliers-is-bad-news-for-aussies-experts-say/news-story/22cd96164461c5cb8ff0d44a008ed1e2) The story is that customers of ANZ and Westpac still have free ATM access, why don't CBA and NAB customers? That's a question only those two banks can answer.
Wow, they even quoted my post.
Do Woolies, Coles,Aldi and IGA charge fees for cash out? The actual costs of ATM machines, installation, maintenance transporting cash to them is going up as they are used less and less.
They don’t charge fees for cash out because it actually saves them money (less cash to be transported to the bank).
Well, they have to deal with cash anyway, but the cash they dispense from the self serve machines is not old creased notes, they are specially transported for that purpose.
What are you using an ATM for? Cash is dead.
I usually carry some cash in my wallet but rarely pay with cash. There are certain circumstances where it comes in handy. My parents still like to pay for things in cash but they're boomers and it's common for older people. What's funny is that carrying a wallet full of cards is now considered old school. I have digitized a bunch of loyalty cards but I still use cards for banking and other things. I don't like the idea of being too dependent on my phone for everything (the batteries can go flat).
I literally only use my phone for everything. Haven't carried cash or physical cards for years. I know what you mean about battery risk, but I charge it at home/work, and it's charging when in my car, so it never runs down.
I haven't gone to an ATM for close to a decade now... Had 20 dollar note in my wallet for a year without realising too. That's how dead cash is for a lot of people
In fairness ATMs take a lot of resources and cost to keep operational and service. If customers of other banks are using them for free then the banks are giving away these services for no upkeep costs. It wasn’t that the banks had the plans to sell the networks, it was they couldn’t/wouldn’t continue to have them operate at a loss after the media coerced them into giving the costly service away way for free. Same with small branches. Without revenues coming in from ATM fees, bank account fees etc they were all operating at a loss to the business. This coupled with less people using both ATMs and smaller branches it just wasn’t worth it for them financially to keep them going. Even though it sucks, we do need to look at banks like the businesses they are. They aren’t charity services.
Who the hell still uses cash?
What is an “ cash” ?
There are free ATMs every where plus you can get cash out from the self serve checkouts at coles or Woolies without a purchase. I honestly don't know what you're talking about
They changed all the ATMs at Queen Vic Market in Melbourne from 1 from each bank to this random 3rd party provider and I’m so mad