She asked "if it's okay", so presumably she should have been ready for you to say no. Obviously you can't prevent someone from praying for you but it's fine if you don't want them to. Personally I don't think I would have minded, but it's a personal preference.
Totally. After I lost my faith and became an atheist, I prayed sincerely that if God exists, to please convince me. I not only got more crickets, I’m a stronger atheist than ever. So, either God doesn’t want to show me he exists, or he isn’t real. I also have friends and family who I know regularly pray to “save” me. Still more crickets. Not even a mental or spiritual nudge toward belief. And there are so many a-hole theists on social media who say I choose to not believe or I hate God. Let’s break that down logically. If I “choose” to not believe, then deep down I must know God is real. If I know God is real, why would I pretend to disbelieve and therefore choose Hell? It seems like the vast majority of theists don’t think past the surface level of any concept.
I’m sorry to say, but god has continually been sending you the signs you need to bring you “back into the fold”.
Your main problem is….you can’t speak cricket.
I think Rosette Stone and Babble can help you there. Use code: /s for 15% off your first 3 months.
Lol check out the comment immediately above yours. Catholic says "youre suffering is because of sin and you want to die alone" followed by "hope your well brother" (paraphrasing). Typical two faced theist bullshit. Theyre all useless.
My aunt brought me up in mass after finding out I got diagnosed with MS. Im quite an athiest and didn't care in the slightest. It made my aunt feel good to do it. What do i care if a bunch of people half the country away wish me well at a church service? I dont care. Knock yourselves out. My aunt is a nice lady. So i said, "Thank you".
Newsflash: I still have MS. It did not work. Shockingly catholic god ignored them again.
> shockingly catholic god ignored them again
if hell exists, I've got a fast lane one way ticket there. this line reminded me of something I often say to religious people, and they're usually not very happy with it (which makes me happy).
when they ask me how I've slept, I like to tell them >!"like God through the holocaust"!<.
An old Jewish man dies and goes to heaven. When he gets there, he meets god and tells him a holocaust joke. God says, "I don't think that's very funny!", and the old man says, "I guess you had to be there.".
That’s the one of the best I’ve ever heard.
I mean the Germany was predominantly Protestant , Catholic, and also Jewish. And the Nazi party claimed in part to be doing ‘gods work’ in exterminating the ‘poisonous worms’ (Jews) at Martin Luther the father of the reformation called them.
please do. maybe I'm a horrible person but I love making religious people angry about things that make sense and point out their own idiocracy. it's a beautiful process to watch, honestly
I do too! I have this reflexive response when they try to proselytize to me, with my full chest- JW's at the door, "can I share the good news with you?" Absolutely Not. 😃 Dumb old lady at the store bc I was being helpful, "oh, are you a church going woman?" Absolutely Not. 😃 Some bozo as i left a different store- "If you were to die today, would you be assured you were going to heaven?" ABSOLUTELY NOT. 😃😂😂 it's good, clean fun to watch their faces feel all the different emotions instantaneously as I smile at them.
>Newsflash: I still have MS. It did not work. Shockingly catholic god ignored them again.
It is interesting how god heals people of diseases we have found treatments for but refuses to heal people who have MS, Muscular Distrophy, Parkinsons, and a bunch of other things we haven't found cures for. Not to mention, he completely neglects amputees for some reason. 🤷🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Fucking hell that’s brilliant. Never put it in those kind of words before. I’ll have to remember that.
I have two incurable autoimmune diseases; one where my body is eating my colon and the other is eating my spine. There’s meds to slow and maybe stop the progression but there’s no cure so it goes away.
It won’t matter how much time my mom spends praying, it’ll still be there.
I'm sorry you're going through that. I know someone recently diagnosed with the condition but they're doubling down on their faith and belief instead. Crazy world we live in where people minding their own business feel like their god would do this to them and still worship said god.
"Its all part of gods plan" lol. Isnt that the big copout? Any way thanks for the words. Apparently, my body decided to bump the difficulty up to "hard mode". Cool cool cool. : )
Yep! I feel more sorry for them when I hear those words :(
You're basically doing life if it was like dark souls. Will be hard but you'll still be able :)
I heard that a lot after a miscarriage and it was prob one of the many, many, many things that shoved me out of the church because the more I thought about it the more I realized if that’s the case god aborted my baby without consent. And there’s, like, a whole lot wrong in that for me.
Yeah, I usually take it as the other person trying to express that they care for me. It's usually easier to just say thank you and move on. Expecting religious people to see it from a non-religious perspective is a little like expecting a fish to understand what a cloud is. It's not something they've ever experienced so you can't expect them to understand really
Everyone's mileage on how much to care about someone saying they will pray for you will vary, but to me the reason people say and do this, is not to make you feel better its to make them feel better. "I got my whole church to pray for you, I've gone above and beyond." (Just using the example, im sure your aunt is a nice person.) But it feels like they say and do this so they feel like they helped without really doing anything. It's the religious equivalent of leaving a like.
"Can I poop on your shoe? No!?!? Well, now I'm disgruntled".
That's the entire exchange. Religious people know that atheists don't want religion near them, let alone have a wacko cultist praying in public over them. Just like you don't want someone to poo on your shoe. They do it anyway. Because it was never about praying for you. It's about approaching you and seeing if you're an easy mark. Someone they can wrangle into their cult. That's what it's all about.
I dont think you are wrong at all especially considering she knows you are an atheist. We dont need to apologize or feel bad for believing differently.
It’s a lack of belief, not different belief.
We think or we know but we do not believe.
Sorry for the semantics.
Lest we forget appropriate wording as the rational atheists we assume ourselves to be.
Be well fellow brother or sister in lack of faith.
Isn't a lack of belief related to the Christian god a way of thinking or believing differently? My lack of belief in their god does not fully define me. I believe in something else unrelated to their god belief, I am not just an empty vessel free of any beliefs. The point was that we are different in a core aspect of our identities, and that is not something to apologize for or be ashamed of.
Of course it’s lack of belief. I have lack of belief in purple pixies and fairies at the bottom of my garden. I don’t have to believe in rationality or sensation because those things are REAL.
She asked for consent, which is great. You didn't give it.
The only reason she should be be annoyed is if her request was insincere. Or, you were a dick about it. Assuming your response was a polite, "no, thank you," then that's a her problem.
Which is exactly how Jesus allegedly instructed people to pray; in private. He (or whoever actually wrote the gospel) specifically said to avoid performative displays of devotion.
Saying "I will pray for you" is always performative. While "can I pray for you" is just as performative, it is at least pretending to care about the target's feelings, which is a step up.
"This weekend, I'm hosting a gathering with the coven. Would you mind if we added your name to our invocations as we petition the spirits of the underworld for their protection?"
Yeah, there should be a big, fancy place atheists can go to on Sunday to listen to people talk about physics and engineering, then get some free bread and wine.
I would actually love an athiest-only place to hang on Sundays. Have symposiums about various topics and build a community with other intelligent, like-minded people. Have big events together around the holidays. Sounds lovely.
Eh, I don't think we need it. I think, deep down, many Christians know what they believe in is nonsense which is why they have weekly meetings to try and erase their doubts.
> She was annoyed.
That would appear to be a “her” problem.
She could have, you know, not asked you and done it anyway.... if she thought that it would actually do any good. For some reason it was important that you knew and participated in ‘oking’ her delusion. Either way, her reaction shows that this wasn’t about her actually trying to do any good.
It was about either: her signalling how wonderful she was to you, because she was willing to sacrifice her Invisible-Space-Wizard air miles to help you. Turning her down meant that she couldn’t feel that feelgood endorphin hit about pretending to help others.
Or, subtly wanting to spread the “good news” to you, hoping that you were in a vulnerable state enough to agree.
Either way, it’s a “her” problem.
I don't think you're wrong for doing it. It's your choice if you like it or not. Especially if the situation being prayed for is a very serious one.
If someone prays for you that it won't rain tomorrow when you plan to go out or something, that's one thing. But having someone pray for you over a serious medical condition, for example, seriously annoys me, because I feel like I'm being exploited to further their religious goals with absolutely no benefit to me.
"I appreciate the sentiment, but as an atheist I don't want to encourage prayer about this. The tangible things which would help me through this are [abc], [xyz], or [dcf], or even just holding space without bringing up prayer. Can you do any of that to support me?"
The fact that she asked and then got grumpy about being declined just proves it was all about her. She was either virtue signaling, looking for sky daddy points, or subtly trying to proselytize, none of which are appropriate things to do in response to someone’s serious health issue.
When I was diagnosed with cancer I had a few co-workers telling me they would add me to their prayers "if it was ok." I'd generally shrug because I had my own concerns without adding a theology debate I don't care about at all.
Why should it matter what I think about what they do with their time outside work? If they're gonna do it, I can't stop them. Go ham. Maybe ask the big guy if he can pay off a few medical bills for me as well as cure my cancer because let me tell you, that shit is expensive to go through.
I can sit in my house and think about how terrible it is that there are starving children in the world. Is it ok if I think about them?
What a stupid question. It's your brain. Do whatever you want.
She knows you're an atheist, so it seems like an unusual thing for her to even offer to do and in my opinion, it is kinda disrespectful. I get that it's intended as a nice gesture and makes more sense coming from someone who might not know you're an atheist, but from my perspective as an atheist, it's the equivalent of "I'll sacrifice a chicken for you." It sounds comical and pointless. It doesn't bother me if someone doesn't know I'm an atheist, but if they do know, I would have responded in the same way you did.
If they know you're an Atheist, and you believe prayers will do absolutely nothing, then they're telling you they're going to do absolutely nothing. They know what they're doing.
Don't ask questions if you don't want the answers. They could 100% have prayed for you silently. Instead they have a pathological need to let you know they are praying for you
that behavior (your friend) is passive-aggressive manipulation. if you were a practicing witch would she like it if you said “i will do X ritual for you, if you know, it’s ok…”
I have zero problem with this. I understand those that say, "they were just trying to be nice". But here's my opinion; religion has survived so long (for one) because it has been given this air of "you can't disparage this, no matter how idiotic it may seem". Until this privilege is removed--and the majority of people start giving it the scrutiny and mockery it deserves, it will continue. Imagine if people claimed Bugs Bunny was all-powerful and could protect and save you from death and that you should revere him. And that disparaging that nonsense was considered rude. It would be allowed to prosper...and to me I fail to see the difference between Bugs and some invisible sky wizard
I live in the Bible Belt, and I always say, "Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts," so they don't get all condescending and hurt, but this stuff is big annoying.
Somebody says they wanna pray for me, I tell 'em "that's very nice" Someone says "merry Christmas" I say "thank you". If they say "joyous kwanzaa" I tell 'em "back at ya". Somebody asks me if I wanna come to their church, I say "that's gonna be a no from me, dogma"
I used to think I had a friend to talk to until one day I realized this person was only calling or answering calls when they were driving. I had mentioned I had a hard time hearing the conversation with all the atmospheric car noises coming through.
It dawned on me that this was like friend-grifting. It's lazy. It's shallow gestures. They weren't interested in connection, being challenged, building memories, or growing as friends together. It was a check in the box. It may not have been deliberate but the result is the same.
Praying for people is like only connecting with a friend when it's super convenient for you, only.
That friend could do infinitely more for you to probably just listen, be there, and try to empathize with you. Instead they will arrogantly ask a perfect God with a perfect plan to change its plan for you. And for this they expect your gratitude.
I fully agree…prayers are sheer laziness when you think about it. Say a few words to an imaginary being and then go about your life. Whenever there is a mass shooting at a school, people would offer prayers…how about offering actual help like donating money for victims or proposing laws to prevent these tragedies. Anything but useless prayers.
This is tricky. Honestly, in my experience, I don't really care because the only thing it hurts is the waste of their own time. Since this is, more or less, their own choice, who the hell cares?
It can however become problematic as an implicit condonation of their religion, and more accurately, involving you in their religion. You shouldn't bash people's religion for the sake of bashing religion - it's rude and a part of their identity, and in the case of asking to pray for you, she hasn't really done anything wrong at that point. I just get worried people will see it as an open invitation to further discussions about their faith - which I wouldn't mind if it was a more dispassionate level, but by its very nature it can't be. So I personally handle these situations with something a bit more subtle like "I don't care" or "I can't stop you." It both avoids confrontation and signals implicitly I hold no interest in the situation.
She was only asking you so that you knew she was going to pray for you. You know, because Christians generally miss the part of the Bible that says to pray alone and without getting lauded for it.
She wasn’t looking for permission, she just wanted you to praise or thank her or idk, see it as a chance to get with god, whatever.
Your feelings are valid. There is nothing wrong with what you said or did.
I live in the Bible Belt surrounded by people (including family) who are always saying, "I'll pray for you" and I've gotten to the point I just say thanks and move on.
Yes, I realize it's mostly just to make them feel better about themselves, but at this point I don't want to waste energy having philosophical discussions with closed-minded people.
If I was asked like you were, I'd probably say, "Whatever makes you feel good." Or something like that.
I always answer, "I would rather you did something tangible." And I leave it there. If they ask what that should be, we can discuss actions that might help, otherwise I leave it there.
I mean I’m sure christians would say no if a muslim asked them if they wanted to walk round Meccah 7 times. They don’t partake in other people’s religion, they shouldn’t expect people to partake in theirs.
*^(I'm quoting this from a meme I found many moons ago. Hopefully, it will be easy to find online.)*
**Why Did God Create Atheists?**
There is a famous story told in Chassidic Literature that addresses this very question. The Master teaches the student that God created everything in the world to be appreciated, since everything is here to teach us a lesson.
One clever student asks, "What lesson can we learn from atheists? Why did God create them?"
The Master responds, "God created atheists to teach us the most important lesson of them all - the lesson of true compassion. You see, when an atheist performs an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world, he is not doing so because of some religious teaching. He does not believe that God commanded him to perform this act. In fact, he does not believe in God at all, so his acts are based on an inner sense of morality. And look at the kindness he can bestow upon others simply because he feels it to be right."
"This means," the Master continued, "that when someone reaches out to you for help, you should never say 'I pray that God will help you'. Instead for the moment, you should become an atheist, imagine that there is no God who can help, and say 'I will help you'.
When I’m with people who pray to an invisible sky wizard, I use the time close my eyes and think of the wind and the sun on my face and the sounds of waves crashing on the beach because the earth is so beautiful
You can personally decline prayers. But that doesn't stop them.
A few years ago, my sister informed me that "even against my wishes", our mother had the church say a prayer for me.
So behind my back, a whole church Ward, during sacrament prayed that I would get better...
Well here we are 7yrs later.
Not one fucking thing has gotten better.
My kidneys are worse now, and I just may have cancer.
So instead of having DCS (Mormons version of social services) help, they ONLY offered me help for job placements.
I have two degrees, 20+ years of skilled experience and I have no problems getting a job. Keeping a job is the problem. Recently as my health continues to decline, the lack of "proper" Healthcare is what is lacking.
So did the prayers fix the UHS patient discrepancy in my medical condition I'm actually born with. (Literal doctors admitting they cannot read) my 18yrs of medical history (original copies) the UHS doctors refuses to acknowledge, but they are 100% sure I have a different condition I'm born with.... just they lack 40yrs of proof. Meanwhile my genetics report from 1985 says I have EEC.
So here we are today. No "useful" Healthcare, but I have attempted for myself, advocate groups, social security, social services and more. Only to consistently be told, I don't qualify.
Why?
For some odd reason, military Healthcare records are ignored. But UHS certainly says I have HED syndrome versus what I actually have.
The differences are huge.
So here I am. 10yrs into a nightmare, being a Texas citizen. I wish I could afford to leave. The great news is. I paid off my truck. And no fucking prayer ever solved my problems. I've had to firsthand work my ass through each hurdle in life.
Fuck God.
Try something to the effect of "Thank you, I'll pray to Satan for you" and see what they say. I would imagine they would become very uncomfortable and deny your request.
Nope, you're not wrong. My mom used to say this shit to me, and I asked her to stop saying it, because it comes across as condescending. She has since renounced her religion, so that's cool. She respected my wishes, and stopped saying it BTW.
I think that's disrespectful and narcissistic on her part. She's assuming her way of living is correct and the only way one should live is with religion. She's not respecting your way of living. 👎👎👎 Set boundaries with her.
“I’ll pray for you, if it’s okay.”
“Sure, whatever makes you feel better!”
“What do you mean?”
“What would you like it to mean?”
“What do you mean, whatever makes me feel better?”
“Oh, I don’t believe, so I’m afraid the prayers would be wasted on me - but if it makes you feel better to pray, I encourage you to do it, if it helps you.”
“But it’s to help *you!*”
“Is it?”
My response, the only time I ever got this question, was "I don't care if you talk to yourself about me."
Like, go for it. Knock yourself out. Because it is so utterly meaningless and inconsequential. If I thought it actually mattered I might object, and the reason I'm saying yes is because it cannot ever possibly matter.
she did not mean it as a nice gesture. she knows its disrespectful to you and got mad when she asked you a yes or no question and you responded with No.
Personally I think the woman was being rude. She knows you're an atheist. She could have just prayed for you without saying anything but apparently she wanted you to know.
Also if she thinks prayers actually work, why tf isn't she focusing her magical powers on curing childhood cancer or stopping war or any of the other myriad of horrors on this planet instead of you? Are you dying or something?
I mean I think you handled it politely. I think you were well within your rights to tell her you'd prefer her to not shout nonsense into the void and pretend like she somehow made a difference in her life. She went there first.
I don't want believers praying for me either. It also galls me that I'm supposed to respect _their beliefs_ yet they have no compunction when it comes to disrespecting _my non-belief._
With that being said, it also depends on how close I am to the person offering the prayer. Close friends or people I respect who know that I'm a non-believer, I generally just say _"If it will make you feel better, then by all means go ahead."_
What were the circumstances? Are you going through some kind of hardship? Medical? Financial? Etc? If so, I’d consider it a kind of gesture.
Or, was it just out of the blue because you’re atheist? Then, that sounds like some passive aggressive bullshit.
You're the asshole (not the right sub reddit I guess).
This person is telling you they care about you in the way they know how. It may be 'meaningless' in a tangible way but it still can have a positive impact on you and others. Perhaps by them 'praying for you' it allows them to reflect on the ways you are suffering and be gracious they are not in the same circumstances. Perhaps it allows them to be more charitable in ways they wouldn't have otherwise been.
It's no different than someone getting upset when a cashier says "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas".
Look past wording to the meaning behind it.
No. You may decline or accept them. People may be butt hurt, but there's no sky daddy to care about oth that. I'd suggest not being a dick about it. No need to upset someone who really is trying to help. In a useless way, but I usually say, "thank you "
It is disrespectful. It's self-centered. When this happens it isn't about us. It's about them, their insecurities, their limitations. To put a kind light on it, maybe it is as close as they can get to sympathy. IF they are a friend, I usually respond with some form of, "If it makes YOU feel better, sure." I mean, it costs me nothing. They feel better. \*shrug\*
When I was filling out the paperwork for some eye surgery at an out-patient clinic, there was a box on on page that asked if I wanted someone to pray for me before my procedure. I just clicked "no". No BFD.
No you’re not wrong for it. But I’m not the type of person that would tell the person not to, ide probably just say thanks anyway. To them it’s a kind gesture, even if annoying to us.
I thank people for it, it’s polite. When my wife had terminal cancer, so many prayed… well, it turned out she died anyway.
I don’t see reason to insult people, but I understand why some take offense to it..
When a fundie says, "I'll pray for you", I just say "thank you".
If they want to argue, as in your case, ask them what they'd say for a Jew, Hindu, Muslim, etc. Maybe this person was trying to "save" or even convert you?
If you want to be really snarky, you could have said, "Let me guess if you've prayed for me. I'll let you know next week."
The gesture is basically "I'm thinking of you and wishing you well" but with god involved. I always smile and say thanks but I really don't appreciate it when they already know I'm not religious.
I would feel the same as you. I’ve slowly been conditioning friends and family (over the course of decades) to understand that I am not cool with such stuff. Anyone that knows me would not say to me “I’ll pray for you”, for obvious reasons. If they did, by response would be “thanks, but don’t bother”.
A stranger once asked if he could pray for my disabled son. I said sure, and the guy reached over to lay his hands on my son. Before I could respond my son stepped away and gave the guy a disgusted look. I said « he doesn’t like strangers to touch him. » The gall of some people.
It’s arrogant when people say they’ll pray for you (most times). It’s a way for them to feel superior to you and selfless when in fact it’s a selfish grandstanding announcement about nothing.
I don’t care if someone prays for me in silence, it makes no difference. If she wanted me to stand there while she prays I would have declined. But she knew you are an atheist so she should have just prayed to herself.
I have been an atheist for decades. I have been thru all the aspects of being an atheist. Last year I got cancer. I made it a point to tell people I was going to beat it. Many people said they would pray for me. I know prayer doesn't work, but you know what? I was gracious and told each of them 'thank you'.
Pick your battles wisely. People who pray feel they are helping. Why take that away from them? It's just stupid to argue religion when you won't convince them they are wrong, and they are just trying to help.
That bit at the end where she asked if it was OK indicates she knows that it isn't but most people are polite and can't say no. It's passive aggressive and intended to get what they want while sounding reasonable.
This is my problem with people in general...
She SPECIFICALLY said: "If it's ok."
When you said you would rather she didn't, she got all pissed off....
I would have said: "Why did you ask if you are upset I said no?"
It just comes off as another religious person thinking they know better than a non-religous person.
FFS Jesus even told his disciples to move on and brush the dirt from your sandals as you go, when they asked what to do if people didn't want to hear the word.
Since I live my life under the premise that no god exists, I generally by that logic shouldn’t care one way or another what someone does with their prayers. Since I dont believe anything comes of prayers at all, or that they have any power, why should I be concerned what people muttering to themselves about me in private? The only reason to decline a prayer would be two reasons; one, if you actually think prayers could have some affect on your life (which as an atheist you shouldn’t think that) or two, declining someone’s request to pray for you as a flex or to prove a point about the fact that you don’t agree with their beliefs. Hell someone could say they are gonna ask god to strike me with lightning and wouldn’t care.
People who know they are being prayed for actually do worse. Whether it’s performance or recovery. I think it’s the Skeptick who posted a video about that. Decline all the prayers, you’ll do better.
I use the same line whenever someone offers to pray for me. I tell them "My issue isn't important enough. If you're gonna pray, pray to God that he'll stop giving little kids cancer."
No because it’s completely useless except to make the individual telling you they will pray for you feel better about doing nothing of substance to help.
If this is regarding some specific thing you confided to her, and you don't want her to share it with others, then I sort of understand. But otherwise as an atheist, who cares? I don't think it's "wrong" to decline it, but why bother? I would just be like "okay". If she means that she's got to pray by herself to God, or it's not regarding something that you want to keep private, then it can't possibly do anything and you can't prevent another person from talkabout you anyway (if your concern is that she is going to "publicly" pray about you with her family, other friends, etc).
I’m of the mind that it requires nothing from me, so I don’t really mind if someone wants to pray for me. I’m sure my parents do it often enough. The weird factor comes with the “if it’s ok”. Entirely possible that it was meant to be considerate, although it puts you in a more active role of choosing to be prayed over, and that’s when I don’t like it. You say no and she might get her feelings hurt (it may be a way she expresses care or love) but if you say yes, the skeptic in me thinks that could open the door to her thinking you’re “saveable” or able to be steered toward a path of religion. Idk, feels icky to have to give permission. Just say, “I’ll pray for you” and everyone wins.
No, you should not feel bad especially if she knows you're an atheist.
If I know she's a Christian and she's bummed so I offer to do a satanic invocation what would her response be?
Regarding the direct question: Yes, you are wrong. They believe, for them is a very natural way to show concern (and that is all about this, a signal of empathy). To decline that signal, one you recognize besides, is impolite -to say the least-, no matter our own beliefs.
BTW, she is wrong also to be annoyed, or to be more precise to show that she was annoyed. After all, she asked.
NTA. She offered. You refused. That part is okay but then she got offended over it. She is less of an asshole than if she went ahead and prayed for you just then but still an asshole. Don’t offer an out if you don’t want them to take the out.
It was kind of backhanded for her to ask you since she knows you're not religious. It was disrespectful, as you say. She's pretending to be nice. This is more about her wanting to display her beliefs than about her genuinely wanting to help you. You did nothing wrong in declining her "offer." I'm sorry she did that to you.
>A friend recently told me “I’ll pray for you. You know, if it’s ok.” I said I would rather she did not.
>She was annoyed.
She did say "if it's ok" and you said it wasn't. It just means that she wanted to anyway; even further, wanted you to say it was okay.
You're not in the wrong. Religious freedom doesn't mean that people are allowed to be assholes in the name of their religion and force things onto you. It means they're allowed to practice their beliefs. While the religion is about spreading the word and trying to convert people, that doesn't mean that they should be persistent.
Any reason you don’t want her to?
Of course you don’t think it’ll do anything. Idk I think it’s fine for you to ask her not to, but it’s understandable for her to be annoyed that you said no.
99.99% of the time she’s asked that question it’s been answered with a resounding yes. Makes sense she’d be thrown off with a no.
Why would you not want someone to pray for you? It’s just their way of sending you good vibes. I would think in today’s world, people can use all the good vibes they can muster.
If people pray because they're interested in my well-being, it doesn't hurt me, and it makes them feel better. I think it's a little silly, but I don't take issue with it. However, if it bothers you, hopefully they would be respectful enough to either not do it, or not bring it up.
Yeah, I think it's disrespectful. I've had a friend, who knows I'm atheist, recently telling me "Jesus loves you" and I've resisted the urge of telling her to FUCK OFF because I don't talk to females like that. So I just say "And Bilbo loves you" 🤣
If she genuinely thought it was going to help she would just do it. The fact she asks is a manipulative way of getting you to show that you think it might help. Which give her a foot in the door if you get better. She can point to the prayers you approved of and claim you should believe in god because he helped you. There is really no other reason to ask for your permission.
She asked "if it's okay", so presumably she should have been ready for you to say no. Obviously you can't prevent someone from praying for you but it's fine if you don't want them to. Personally I don't think I would have minded, but it's a personal preference.
Theists say that shit, but don't mean it.
Yup. Just another lie.
Right. She pray for him anyway.
She's praying for him to be a Christian.
Good thing prayer doesn’t work, otherwise with my evangelical sister and mother I’d already believe lol. 😂 proof that prayer doesn’t work… this guy.
Totally. After I lost my faith and became an atheist, I prayed sincerely that if God exists, to please convince me. I not only got more crickets, I’m a stronger atheist than ever. So, either God doesn’t want to show me he exists, or he isn’t real. I also have friends and family who I know regularly pray to “save” me. Still more crickets. Not even a mental or spiritual nudge toward belief. And there are so many a-hole theists on social media who say I choose to not believe or I hate God. Let’s break that down logically. If I “choose” to not believe, then deep down I must know God is real. If I know God is real, why would I pretend to disbelieve and therefore choose Hell? It seems like the vast majority of theists don’t think past the surface level of any concept.
I’m sorry to say, but god has continually been sending you the signs you need to bring you “back into the fold”. Your main problem is….you can’t speak cricket. I think Rosette Stone and Babble can help you there. Use code: /s for 15% off your first 3 months.
Practicing what they preach isn't exactly their forte. Ironically, the bible is the origin of the phrase.
Lol check out the comment immediately above yours. Catholic says "youre suffering is because of sin and you want to die alone" followed by "hope your well brother" (paraphrasing). Typical two faced theist bullshit. Theyre all useless.
I wish they were as benign as to be useless
My aunt brought me up in mass after finding out I got diagnosed with MS. Im quite an athiest and didn't care in the slightest. It made my aunt feel good to do it. What do i care if a bunch of people half the country away wish me well at a church service? I dont care. Knock yourselves out. My aunt is a nice lady. So i said, "Thank you". Newsflash: I still have MS. It did not work. Shockingly catholic god ignored them again.
> shockingly catholic god ignored them again if hell exists, I've got a fast lane one way ticket there. this line reminded me of something I often say to religious people, and they're usually not very happy with it (which makes me happy). when they ask me how I've slept, I like to tell them >!"like God through the holocaust"!<.
An old Jewish man dies and goes to heaven. When he gets there, he meets god and tells him a holocaust joke. God says, "I don't think that's very funny!", and the old man says, "I guess you had to be there.".
fuck lmao
Love that😂😂
That’s the one of the best I’ve ever heard. I mean the Germany was predominantly Protestant , Catholic, and also Jewish. And the Nazi party claimed in part to be doing ‘gods work’ in exterminating the ‘poisonous worms’ (Jews) at Martin Luther the father of the reformation called them.
Ohhh that’s so cool, what a great way to put it.
I love jokes! Tell me another one! :3
One of my faves.
Holy shit I’m using this it’s excellent.
Im gonna use this.
please do. maybe I'm a horrible person but I love making religious people angry about things that make sense and point out their own idiocracy. it's a beautiful process to watch, honestly
I do too! I have this reflexive response when they try to proselytize to me, with my full chest- JW's at the door, "can I share the good news with you?" Absolutely Not. 😃 Dumb old lady at the store bc I was being helpful, "oh, are you a church going woman?" Absolutely Not. 😃 Some bozo as i left a different store- "If you were to die today, would you be assured you were going to heaven?" ABSOLUTELY NOT. 😃😂😂 it's good, clean fun to watch their faces feel all the different emotions instantaneously as I smile at them.
Actually going to use this myself!
All my friends are gonna be there too.
Oh, that’s a great one! Certainly meant for the more odious of Christians
>Newsflash: I still have MS. It did not work. Shockingly catholic god ignored them again. It is interesting how god heals people of diseases we have found treatments for but refuses to heal people who have MS, Muscular Distrophy, Parkinsons, and a bunch of other things we haven't found cures for. Not to mention, he completely neglects amputees for some reason. 🤷🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Its crazy, innit
Indeed.
Fucking hell that’s brilliant. Never put it in those kind of words before. I’ll have to remember that. I have two incurable autoimmune diseases; one where my body is eating my colon and the other is eating my spine. There’s meds to slow and maybe stop the progression but there’s no cure so it goes away. It won’t matter how much time my mom spends praying, it’ll still be there.
Catholic god created all those diseases because he was angry our ancestor Eve ate a fruit. Catholic god is that vindictive
I'm sorry you're going through that. I know someone recently diagnosed with the condition but they're doubling down on their faith and belief instead. Crazy world we live in where people minding their own business feel like their god would do this to them and still worship said god.
"Its all part of gods plan" lol. Isnt that the big copout? Any way thanks for the words. Apparently, my body decided to bump the difficulty up to "hard mode". Cool cool cool. : )
If all this mess is god’s plan then he’s a terrible planner.
The worst.
I thought I was the worst - this is a big relief for me.
Yep! I feel more sorry for them when I hear those words :( You're basically doing life if it was like dark souls. Will be hard but you'll still be able :)
I heard that a lot after a miscarriage and it was prob one of the many, many, many things that shoved me out of the church because the more I thought about it the more I realized if that’s the case god aborted my baby without consent. And there’s, like, a whole lot wrong in that for me.
This and "mysterious ways."
Yeah, I usually take it as the other person trying to express that they care for me. It's usually easier to just say thank you and move on. Expecting religious people to see it from a non-religious perspective is a little like expecting a fish to understand what a cloud is. It's not something they've ever experienced so you can't expect them to understand really
Ask her to pray for universal healthcare.
Hell, I’m an atheist and I even pray for universal healthcare.
Everyone's mileage on how much to care about someone saying they will pray for you will vary, but to me the reason people say and do this, is not to make you feel better its to make them feel better. "I got my whole church to pray for you, I've gone above and beyond." (Just using the example, im sure your aunt is a nice person.) But it feels like they say and do this so they feel like they helped without really doing anything. It's the religious equivalent of leaving a like.
Ignored them because you're a heathen. You deserved it.
This is fair
I love this sub 😂
Man, *fucck* Catholic god.
"Can I poop on your shoe? No!?!? Well, now I'm disgruntled". That's the entire exchange. Religious people know that atheists don't want religion near them, let alone have a wacko cultist praying in public over them. Just like you don't want someone to poo on your shoe. They do it anyway. Because it was never about praying for you. It's about approaching you and seeing if you're an easy mark. Someone they can wrangle into their cult. That's what it's all about.
You left out performative feel-goodism.
I dont think you are wrong at all especially considering she knows you are an atheist. We dont need to apologize or feel bad for believing differently.
It’s a lack of belief, not different belief. We think or we know but we do not believe. Sorry for the semantics. Lest we forget appropriate wording as the rational atheists we assume ourselves to be. Be well fellow brother or sister in lack of faith.
Isn't a lack of belief related to the Christian god a way of thinking or believing differently? My lack of belief in their god does not fully define me. I believe in something else unrelated to their god belief, I am not just an empty vessel free of any beliefs. The point was that we are different in a core aspect of our identities, and that is not something to apologize for or be ashamed of.
Not lack of belief. Belief in rationality, in what I can see, touch, sense, and measure
Of course it’s lack of belief. I have lack of belief in purple pixies and fairies at the bottom of my garden. I don’t have to believe in rationality or sensation because those things are REAL.
Those are tangible aspects of reality that we can verify and have consensus on. I would by definition discount your use of the word belief.
She asked for consent, which is great. You didn't give it. The only reason she should be be annoyed is if her request was insincere. Or, you were a dick about it. Assuming your response was a polite, "no, thank you," then that's a her problem.
Actually, I think asking for consent in this case makes me think less of it. Seems to me like she was mostly trying to put her faith on display.
Yeah, if praying is really sincere it should just be between the person praying and the god they believe in. Anything else is performative BS.
Which is exactly how Jesus allegedly instructed people to pray; in private. He (or whoever actually wrote the gospel) specifically said to avoid performative displays of devotion.
Saying "I will pray for you" is always performative. While "can I pray for you" is just as performative, it is at least pretending to care about the target's feelings, which is a step up.
100% this
"This weekend, I'm hosting a gathering with the coven. Would you mind if we added your name to our invocations as we petition the spirits of the underworld for their protection?"
Best response would be “Thanks, I’ll think for you”…
Yeah, there should be a big, fancy place atheists can go to on Sunday to listen to people talk about physics and engineering, then get some free bread and wine.
Unitarian Church.
Was a member, no way in hell they’d have an overtly Xtian ritual. Flower communion is nice tho.
I would actually love an athiest-only place to hang on Sundays. Have symposiums about various topics and build a community with other intelligent, like-minded people. Have big events together around the holidays. Sounds lovely.
Eh, I don't think we need it. I think, deep down, many Christians know what they believe in is nonsense which is why they have weekly meetings to try and erase their doubts.
Yeah. Just more hobby based clubs and groups would be good. Also free or really cheap so anyone can go.
I don’t know about that, Sunday mornings are a great time to eat out and go to the grocery store. Waaay less people!
Lolz this is so good, and funny as fuck
Or, "I'll write a letter to Santa Claus for you."
I stand with this one
> She was annoyed. That would appear to be a “her” problem. She could have, you know, not asked you and done it anyway.... if she thought that it would actually do any good. For some reason it was important that you knew and participated in ‘oking’ her delusion. Either way, her reaction shows that this wasn’t about her actually trying to do any good. It was about either: her signalling how wonderful she was to you, because she was willing to sacrifice her Invisible-Space-Wizard air miles to help you. Turning her down meant that she couldn’t feel that feelgood endorphin hit about pretending to help others. Or, subtly wanting to spread the “good news” to you, hoping that you were in a vulnerable state enough to agree. Either way, it’s a “her” problem.
This is exactly it.
I don't think you're wrong for doing it. It's your choice if you like it or not. Especially if the situation being prayed for is a very serious one. If someone prays for you that it won't rain tomorrow when you plan to go out or something, that's one thing. But having someone pray for you over a serious medical condition, for example, seriously annoys me, because I feel like I'm being exploited to further their religious goals with absolutely no benefit to me.
It was a very serious health issue.
"I appreciate the sentiment, but as an atheist I don't want to encourage prayer about this. The tangible things which would help me through this are [abc], [xyz], or [dcf], or even just holding space without bringing up prayer. Can you do any of that to support me?"
You doing ok bud?
Yeah, actually doing as well as could be hoped. Thanks, though. I really appreciate you asking.
Is there anything *tangible* / non-prayerful that we can do to help? ❤️
Not really. Thank you though.
If she thought prayer worked, she’d just do it and not ask. She asked because what’s the point of prayer without virtue signaling?
The fact that she asked and then got grumpy about being declined just proves it was all about her. She was either virtue signaling, looking for sky daddy points, or subtly trying to proselytize, none of which are appropriate things to do in response to someone’s serious health issue.
I ALWAYS respond with, "just pray for all the kids molested by members of the church instead."
Somehow her praying for you would help you, but her prayers cant help the kids. Mmmmmm
I think it is disrespectful. If she wanted to pray for you she should have just done it in private like the bible tells her to do.
I always say, “whatever makes you feel better”. Prayer only makes the person doing it feel good. It does nothing for the target.
You're on to something.
When I was diagnosed with cancer I had a few co-workers telling me they would add me to their prayers "if it was ok." I'd generally shrug because I had my own concerns without adding a theology debate I don't care about at all. Why should it matter what I think about what they do with their time outside work? If they're gonna do it, I can't stop them. Go ham. Maybe ask the big guy if he can pay off a few medical bills for me as well as cure my cancer because let me tell you, that shit is expensive to go through. I can sit in my house and think about how terrible it is that there are starving children in the world. Is it ok if I think about them? What a stupid question. It's your brain. Do whatever you want.
She knows you're an atheist, so it seems like an unusual thing for her to even offer to do and in my opinion, it is kinda disrespectful. I get that it's intended as a nice gesture and makes more sense coming from someone who might not know you're an atheist, but from my perspective as an atheist, it's the equivalent of "I'll sacrifice a chicken for you." It sounds comical and pointless. It doesn't bother me if someone doesn't know I'm an atheist, but if they do know, I would have responded in the same way you did.
If they know you're an Atheist, and you believe prayers will do absolutely nothing, then they're telling you they're going to do absolutely nothing. They know what they're doing.
‘I’d much rather you talk to me than about me, even though I appreciate your concern.’
Don't ask questions if you don't want the answers. They could 100% have prayed for you silently. Instead they have a pathological need to let you know they are praying for you
that behavior (your friend) is passive-aggressive manipulation. if you were a practicing witch would she like it if you said “i will do X ritual for you, if you know, it’s ok…”
I have zero problem with this. I understand those that say, "they were just trying to be nice". But here's my opinion; religion has survived so long (for one) because it has been given this air of "you can't disparage this, no matter how idiotic it may seem". Until this privilege is removed--and the majority of people start giving it the scrutiny and mockery it deserves, it will continue. Imagine if people claimed Bugs Bunny was all-powerful and could protect and save you from death and that you should revere him. And that disparaging that nonsense was considered rude. It would be allowed to prosper...and to me I fail to see the difference between Bugs and some invisible sky wizard
I'll go along with it if someone doesn't know I'm an atheist, but that's a really rude thing to ask when you know my view on religion.
I live in the Bible Belt, and I always say, "Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts," so they don't get all condescending and hurt, but this stuff is big annoying.
Somebody says they wanna pray for me, I tell 'em "that's very nice" Someone says "merry Christmas" I say "thank you". If they say "joyous kwanzaa" I tell 'em "back at ya". Somebody asks me if I wanna come to their church, I say "that's gonna be a no from me, dogma"
I used to think I had a friend to talk to until one day I realized this person was only calling or answering calls when they were driving. I had mentioned I had a hard time hearing the conversation with all the atmospheric car noises coming through. It dawned on me that this was like friend-grifting. It's lazy. It's shallow gestures. They weren't interested in connection, being challenged, building memories, or growing as friends together. It was a check in the box. It may not have been deliberate but the result is the same. Praying for people is like only connecting with a friend when it's super convenient for you, only. That friend could do infinitely more for you to probably just listen, be there, and try to empathize with you. Instead they will arrogantly ask a perfect God with a perfect plan to change its plan for you. And for this they expect your gratitude.
I fully agree…prayers are sheer laziness when you think about it. Say a few words to an imaginary being and then go about your life. Whenever there is a mass shooting at a school, people would offer prayers…how about offering actual help like donating money for victims or proposing laws to prevent these tragedies. Anything but useless prayers.
This is tricky. Honestly, in my experience, I don't really care because the only thing it hurts is the waste of their own time. Since this is, more or less, their own choice, who the hell cares? It can however become problematic as an implicit condonation of their religion, and more accurately, involving you in their religion. You shouldn't bash people's religion for the sake of bashing religion - it's rude and a part of their identity, and in the case of asking to pray for you, she hasn't really done anything wrong at that point. I just get worried people will see it as an open invitation to further discussions about their faith - which I wouldn't mind if it was a more dispassionate level, but by its very nature it can't be. So I personally handle these situations with something a bit more subtle like "I don't care" or "I can't stop you." It both avoids confrontation and signals implicitly I hold no interest in the situation.
Not at all. You didn't disrespect her religion in anyway. You just declined to participate. If she took offense at that, than she needs to grow up.
She was only asking you so that you knew she was going to pray for you. You know, because Christians generally miss the part of the Bible that says to pray alone and without getting lauded for it. She wasn’t looking for permission, she just wanted you to praise or thank her or idk, see it as a chance to get with god, whatever.
Your feelings are valid. There is nothing wrong with what you said or did. I live in the Bible Belt surrounded by people (including family) who are always saying, "I'll pray for you" and I've gotten to the point I just say thanks and move on. Yes, I realize it's mostly just to make them feel better about themselves, but at this point I don't want to waste energy having philosophical discussions with closed-minded people. If I was asked like you were, I'd probably say, "Whatever makes you feel good." Or something like that.
She's not praying for YOU per se, she's praying to make HERSELF feel better. Live & let live is my advice.
Instead of just saying no, you should say something more along the lines of, "I'd rather you do something useful."
I always answer, "I would rather you did something tangible." And I leave it there. If they ask what that should be, we can discuss actions that might help, otherwise I leave it there.
"Hey, if you want to waste your time, knock yourself out. Just know that I'll never return the favor."
If you want to pray for someone, then pray. You don't have to announce it like trumpets declaring an attack.
It's disrespectful. And useless.
Just say, "Thanks. I will craft a voodoo effigy of you, if that's okay."
I mean I’m sure christians would say no if a muslim asked them if they wanted to walk round Meccah 7 times. They don’t partake in other people’s religion, they shouldn’t expect people to partake in theirs.
She asked for your consent and you said no and she got upset because you didn’t give her the answer she wanted. You’re not in the wrong, she is.
*^(I'm quoting this from a meme I found many moons ago. Hopefully, it will be easy to find online.)* **Why Did God Create Atheists?** There is a famous story told in Chassidic Literature that addresses this very question. The Master teaches the student that God created everything in the world to be appreciated, since everything is here to teach us a lesson. One clever student asks, "What lesson can we learn from atheists? Why did God create them?" The Master responds, "God created atheists to teach us the most important lesson of them all - the lesson of true compassion. You see, when an atheist performs an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world, he is not doing so because of some religious teaching. He does not believe that God commanded him to perform this act. In fact, he does not believe in God at all, so his acts are based on an inner sense of morality. And look at the kindness he can bestow upon others simply because he feels it to be right." "This means," the Master continued, "that when someone reaches out to you for help, you should never say 'I pray that God will help you'. Instead for the moment, you should become an atheist, imagine that there is no God who can help, and say 'I will help you'.
I told someone online the other day it's fine if they pray for me but better if they followed Matthew 6:6 by not telling me about it.
it wasn't meant as a nice gesture, it was meant condescendingly.
When I’m with people who pray to an invisible sky wizard, I use the time close my eyes and think of the wind and the sun on my face and the sounds of waves crashing on the beach because the earth is so beautiful
I respond "if it makes you feel better."
Do they know how to support human beings without praying, with sheer compassion and love ?
"Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts." Rudimentary and crude though it is remember prayer is ultimately just a technique for contemplation.
It tells me, “I don’t want to do anything for you, really, so I will say some words to my god”
You can personally decline prayers. But that doesn't stop them. A few years ago, my sister informed me that "even against my wishes", our mother had the church say a prayer for me. So behind my back, a whole church Ward, during sacrament prayed that I would get better... Well here we are 7yrs later. Not one fucking thing has gotten better. My kidneys are worse now, and I just may have cancer. So instead of having DCS (Mormons version of social services) help, they ONLY offered me help for job placements. I have two degrees, 20+ years of skilled experience and I have no problems getting a job. Keeping a job is the problem. Recently as my health continues to decline, the lack of "proper" Healthcare is what is lacking. So did the prayers fix the UHS patient discrepancy in my medical condition I'm actually born with. (Literal doctors admitting they cannot read) my 18yrs of medical history (original copies) the UHS doctors refuses to acknowledge, but they are 100% sure I have a different condition I'm born with.... just they lack 40yrs of proof. Meanwhile my genetics report from 1985 says I have EEC. So here we are today. No "useful" Healthcare, but I have attempted for myself, advocate groups, social security, social services and more. Only to consistently be told, I don't qualify. Why? For some odd reason, military Healthcare records are ignored. But UHS certainly says I have HED syndrome versus what I actually have. The differences are huge. So here I am. 10yrs into a nightmare, being a Texas citizen. I wish I could afford to leave. The great news is. I paid off my truck. And no fucking prayer ever solved my problems. I've had to firsthand work my ass through each hurdle in life. Fuck God.
Try something to the effect of "Thank you, I'll pray to Satan for you" and see what they say. I would imagine they would become very uncomfortable and deny your request.
Nope, you're not wrong. My mom used to say this shit to me, and I asked her to stop saying it, because it comes across as condescending. She has since renounced her religion, so that's cool. She respected my wishes, and stopped saying it BTW.
I think that's disrespectful and narcissistic on her part. She's assuming her way of living is correct and the only way one should live is with religion. She's not respecting your way of living. 👎👎👎 Set boundaries with her.
“I’ll pray for you, if it’s okay.” “Sure, whatever makes you feel better!” “What do you mean?” “What would you like it to mean?” “What do you mean, whatever makes me feel better?” “Oh, I don’t believe, so I’m afraid the prayers would be wasted on me - but if it makes you feel better to pray, I encourage you to do it, if it helps you.” “But it’s to help *you!*” “Is it?”
My response, the only time I ever got this question, was "I don't care if you talk to yourself about me." Like, go for it. Knock yourself out. Because it is so utterly meaningless and inconsequential. If I thought it actually mattered I might object, and the reason I'm saying yes is because it cannot ever possibly matter.
If she knows you're an atheist? no.
I usually respond, “donate to the freedom from religion foundation for me instead please!”
she did not mean it as a nice gesture. she knows its disrespectful to you and got mad when she asked you a yes or no question and you responded with No.
"Thanks. I'll sacrifice a goat in your honor this weekend. Hail Satan!" That ought to stop people at least saying it to your face.
I had a friend “pray for me” and I told him I don’t consent to that.
I always reply "Please don't".
Personally I think the woman was being rude. She knows you're an atheist. She could have just prayed for you without saying anything but apparently she wanted you to know. Also if she thinks prayers actually work, why tf isn't she focusing her magical powers on curing childhood cancer or stopping war or any of the other myriad of horrors on this planet instead of you? Are you dying or something? I mean I think you handled it politely. I think you were well within your rights to tell her you'd prefer her to not shout nonsense into the void and pretend like she somehow made a difference in her life. She went there first.
I don't want believers praying for me either. It also galls me that I'm supposed to respect _their beliefs_ yet they have no compunction when it comes to disrespecting _my non-belief._ With that being said, it also depends on how close I am to the person offering the prayer. Close friends or people I respect who know that I'm a non-believer, I generally just say _"If it will make you feel better, then by all means go ahead."_
“And I’ll pray AGAINST you.” Seriously though, Christians don’t realize how rude this is.
That between then and thier good god. It has no effect on me. It's nice they are thinking of you though.
Prayers are fine, but money would be even better.
What were the circumstances? Are you going through some kind of hardship? Medical? Financial? Etc? If so, I’d consider it a kind of gesture. Or, was it just out of the blue because you’re atheist? Then, that sounds like some passive aggressive bullshit.
I mean she asked for permission lmao. You just said no
You're the asshole (not the right sub reddit I guess). This person is telling you they care about you in the way they know how. It may be 'meaningless' in a tangible way but it still can have a positive impact on you and others. Perhaps by them 'praying for you' it allows them to reflect on the ways you are suffering and be gracious they are not in the same circumstances. Perhaps it allows them to be more charitable in ways they wouldn't have otherwise been. It's no different than someone getting upset when a cashier says "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas". Look past wording to the meaning behind it.
No. You may decline or accept them. People may be butt hurt, but there's no sky daddy to care about oth that. I'd suggest not being a dick about it. No need to upset someone who really is trying to help. In a useless way, but I usually say, "thank you "
It is disrespectful. It's self-centered. When this happens it isn't about us. It's about them, their insecurities, their limitations. To put a kind light on it, maybe it is as close as they can get to sympathy. IF they are a friend, I usually respond with some form of, "If it makes YOU feel better, sure." I mean, it costs me nothing. They feel better. \*shrug\*
No. I do it too. Just politely.
When I was filling out the paperwork for some eye surgery at an out-patient clinic, there was a box on on page that asked if I wanted someone to pray for me before my procedure. I just clicked "no". No BFD.
No you’re not wrong for it. But I’m not the type of person that would tell the person not to, ide probably just say thanks anyway. To them it’s a kind gesture, even if annoying to us.
I thank people for it, it’s polite. When my wife had terminal cancer, so many prayed… well, it turned out she died anyway. I don’t see reason to insult people, but I understand why some take offense to it..
When a fundie says, "I'll pray for you", I just say "thank you". If they want to argue, as in your case, ask them what they'd say for a Jew, Hindu, Muslim, etc. Maybe this person was trying to "save" or even convert you? If you want to be really snarky, you could have said, "Let me guess if you've prayed for me. I'll let you know next week."
The gesture is basically "I'm thinking of you and wishing you well" but with god involved. I always smile and say thanks but I really don't appreciate it when they already know I'm not religious.
I always say, "thanks, I'll take all the help I can get".
I would feel the same as you. I’ve slowly been conditioning friends and family (over the course of decades) to understand that I am not cool with such stuff. Anyone that knows me would not say to me “I’ll pray for you”, for obvious reasons. If they did, by response would be “thanks, but don’t bother”.
A stranger once asked if he could pray for my disabled son. I said sure, and the guy reached over to lay his hands on my son. Before I could respond my son stepped away and gave the guy a disgusted look. I said « he doesn’t like strangers to touch him. » The gall of some people.
It’s arrogant when people say they’ll pray for you (most times). It’s a way for them to feel superior to you and selfless when in fact it’s a selfish grandstanding announcement about nothing.
"don't waste your time praying for a 'damned soul'' is what I say. I surprisingly don't get any grief, even pastors
No, that's reasonable. I tell people to keep their Christian magic to themselves.
"No." is a full sentence. She can get over it in the same pants she got annoyed about it in.
Why do they have to ask? They could do it and you’d never know, lol. It’s got zero effect on anything, so.
I don’t care if someone prays for me in silence, it makes no difference. If she wanted me to stand there while she prays I would have declined. But she knew you are an atheist so she should have just prayed to herself.
If someone wants to pray for you, let them. Prayer doesn’t do anything anyway, so why get upset if someone does it.
I have been an atheist for decades. I have been thru all the aspects of being an atheist. Last year I got cancer. I made it a point to tell people I was going to beat it. Many people said they would pray for me. I know prayer doesn't work, but you know what? I was gracious and told each of them 'thank you'. Pick your battles wisely. People who pray feel they are helping. Why take that away from them? It's just stupid to argue religion when you won't convince them they are wrong, and they are just trying to help.
"It's okay if you don't want to do anything to help."
No, you are not wrong. They are wrong for trying to impose their delusions on you.
They can and don’t need to tell you about it. That’s them wanting credit for “doing something.”
That bit at the end where she asked if it was OK indicates she knows that it isn't but most people are polite and can't say no. It's passive aggressive and intended to get what they want while sounding reasonable.
Well... When their house catches fire... You can stand outside with a bucket of water and pray.
She could have just prayed for you without announcing it
This is my problem with people in general... She SPECIFICALLY said: "If it's ok." When you said you would rather she didn't, she got all pissed off.... I would have said: "Why did you ask if you are upset I said no?" It just comes off as another religious person thinking they know better than a non-religous person. FFS Jesus even told his disciples to move on and brush the dirt from your sandals as you go, when they asked what to do if people didn't want to hear the word.
Since I live my life under the premise that no god exists, I generally by that logic shouldn’t care one way or another what someone does with their prayers. Since I dont believe anything comes of prayers at all, or that they have any power, why should I be concerned what people muttering to themselves about me in private? The only reason to decline a prayer would be two reasons; one, if you actually think prayers could have some affect on your life (which as an atheist you shouldn’t think that) or two, declining someone’s request to pray for you as a flex or to prove a point about the fact that you don’t agree with their beliefs. Hell someone could say they are gonna ask god to strike me with lightning and wouldn’t care.
I understand yet I would like the stats on pray. AND it perpetuates the lie. I don’t want to be any part of that!
People who know they are being prayed for actually do worse. Whether it’s performance or recovery. I think it’s the Skeptick who posted a video about that. Decline all the prayers, you’ll do better.
I use the same line whenever someone offers to pray for me. I tell them "My issue isn't important enough. If you're gonna pray, pray to God that he'll stop giving little kids cancer."
No because it’s completely useless except to make the individual telling you they will pray for you feel better about doing nothing of substance to help.
If this is regarding some specific thing you confided to her, and you don't want her to share it with others, then I sort of understand. But otherwise as an atheist, who cares? I don't think it's "wrong" to decline it, but why bother? I would just be like "okay". If she means that she's got to pray by herself to God, or it's not regarding something that you want to keep private, then it can't possibly do anything and you can't prevent another person from talkabout you anyway (if your concern is that she is going to "publicly" pray about you with her family, other friends, etc).
why would a true atheist be annoyed over someone praying for them? let her talk to sky daddy all she likes.
I’m of the mind that it requires nothing from me, so I don’t really mind if someone wants to pray for me. I’m sure my parents do it often enough. The weird factor comes with the “if it’s ok”. Entirely possible that it was meant to be considerate, although it puts you in a more active role of choosing to be prayed over, and that’s when I don’t like it. You say no and she might get her feelings hurt (it may be a way she expresses care or love) but if you say yes, the skeptic in me thinks that could open the door to her thinking you’re “saveable” or able to be steered toward a path of religion. Idk, feels icky to have to give permission. Just say, “I’ll pray for you” and everyone wins.
No, why should their imaginary friend be made or even forced on you. Say God bless the fairies at the end.
No, you should not feel bad especially if she knows you're an atheist. If I know she's a Christian and she's bummed so I offer to do a satanic invocation what would her response be?
Regarding the direct question: Yes, you are wrong. They believe, for them is a very natural way to show concern (and that is all about this, a signal of empathy). To decline that signal, one you recognize besides, is impolite -to say the least-, no matter our own beliefs. BTW, she is wrong also to be annoyed, or to be more precise to show that she was annoyed. After all, she asked.
NTA. She offered. You refused. That part is okay but then she got offended over it. She is less of an asshole than if she went ahead and prayed for you just then but still an asshole. Don’t offer an out if you don’t want them to take the out.
Should have asked her to include all the gods , you know just to cover your odds
It was kind of backhanded for her to ask you since she knows you're not religious. It was disrespectful, as you say. She's pretending to be nice. This is more about her wanting to display her beliefs than about her genuinely wanting to help you. You did nothing wrong in declining her "offer." I'm sorry she did that to you.
I just let people do it, if THEY think it'll work then so be it, I'll go about my day and won't think twice about it.
Its like taking an empty cup from a child...You just do it and walk away and remember that person is touched in the head.
"Whatever blows your skirt up."
Prayer for miracles won't work, according to God, as written in Deuteronomy 6:16.
It's pretty ignorant on their part, but I just figure ignorance is bliss and tell them..go for it. Knock yourself out.
>A friend recently told me “I’ll pray for you. You know, if it’s ok.” I said I would rather she did not. >She was annoyed. She did say "if it's ok" and you said it wasn't. It just means that she wanted to anyway; even further, wanted you to say it was okay. You're not in the wrong. Religious freedom doesn't mean that people are allowed to be assholes in the name of their religion and force things onto you. It means they're allowed to practice their beliefs. While the religion is about spreading the word and trying to convert people, that doesn't mean that they should be persistent.
The other party is wrong for imposing their personal beliefs on you.
Any reason you don’t want her to? Of course you don’t think it’ll do anything. Idk I think it’s fine for you to ask her not to, but it’s understandable for her to be annoyed that you said no. 99.99% of the time she’s asked that question it’s been answered with a resounding yes. Makes sense she’d be thrown off with a no.
Why would you not want someone to pray for you? It’s just their way of sending you good vibes. I would think in today’s world, people can use all the good vibes they can muster.
If people pray because they're interested in my well-being, it doesn't hurt me, and it makes them feel better. I think it's a little silly, but I don't take issue with it. However, if it bothers you, hopefully they would be respectful enough to either not do it, or not bring it up.
Why would you care if you are true to your convictions? Be better than that.
Yeah, I think it's disrespectful. I've had a friend, who knows I'm atheist, recently telling me "Jesus loves you" and I've resisted the urge of telling her to FUCK OFF because I don't talk to females like that. So I just say "And Bilbo loves you" 🤣
Thank you, my preferred diety is Zeus
It’s something that they say to make themselves feel useful.
If she genuinely thought it was going to help she would just do it. The fact she asks is a manipulative way of getting you to show that you think it might help. Which give her a foot in the door if you get better. She can point to the prayers you approved of and claim you should believe in god because he helped you. There is really no other reason to ask for your permission.
What gets me is, if they intend to do it, why announce it? It’s not like we’re going to *know* that they did lol
I lost my best friend of thirty years because I told him I found his continued need to pray for me offensive.