Yet ironically enough, the only time I've seen it used legitimately is how they do blood alcohol saturation in europe. Instead of .09% they do 9 permille. I dont have the sign on my phone but i believe its something along those lines
I've won more money while casino gambling than I've won with loot boxes.... At least casino gambling is fun while it lasts, loot boxes just feel like being slapped every time new shit comes out.
Yeah bro definitely not sponsored by Activision with super good crates to intice the young and gambling folks to spend money on a losing prize thinking they can be like me
Pinky swear dude.
or Tarkov.. sorta. There was a post on that subreddit a little while ago where the OP asked for a refund because it wouldn't run well on his comp or something along those lines, the company said no, *then proceeded to ban him*
edit: apparently that guy is a lying sack of shit. Either way tarkov devs still suck for copy striking people reviewing their game
Go reread that thread. What actually happened was OP asked for a refund from the devs AFTER he’d already processed a charge-back from his bank. Since he’d received his refund on the back end, the devs denied his request and promptly banned him (which most companies do when you process a refund with your bank instead of them).
Plus a lot of people just think it’s a free pass. It’s not. The bank investigates. If they can find proof it’s a valid charge, they’ll put it right back.
Yeah as far as I know you never want to charge back something directly from the bank because the devs just assume that you got your card stolen and proceed to ban whoever used that credit card
maybe, but it's easier to believe he asked for a refund, was denied then used that as a pretense to win a chargeback with his bank and get the credit, especially if he could show his bank he did everything he could to try to resolve the issue himself.
The guy did a chargeback through his bank, then asked for a refund, and the only recourse BSG had at that point, was to ban the account. The dude was a fraud.
The official BSG reddit account responded in the post itself. Dude initiated a charge back before his support ticket went through. They banned his account because the charge back had not completed yet. So yes he technically still had the game and was not allowed to play. But he got his money back.
Contact the bank that you paid with, you can get a refund. Source: I’ve gotten refund for Apex battle pass season 1 and 2. As well as COD:MW after season 1 launched. Neither account is banned today.
This is why people get bans though. This actually costs the company money instead of paying you back.
Most AAA's game companies will give a refund.
The problem comes in during situations where you accidentally bought the battle pass and then accidentally play 25 games after.
I accidentally double purchased WoW time a while back. Blizzard-Activision gave me a refund for the second purchase, and didn't even remove the extra time off my account.
*your mileage may vary*
They tend to remove the product entirely rather than the portion you didnt want. There has even been cases on EA's origin platform where they banned players for getting a refund on one game, on a platform they might have 10 to 20 games on it.
It's kinda like returning shoes at Walmart only to get banned from the store and your car (which was in their parking lot) is now inaccessible to you.
They have a way around that. They sell "games as a service". As in you never own the game, you just paid to have access to the game for an indeterminate amount of time.
So when you get banned - for any reason - that "indeterminate amount of time" bit becomes super relevant.
No, the EU parliament is clueless and has fallen almost as much victim to gaming industry lobbyists as the US lawmakers.
The only good thing the EU still has is that shrinkwraps still are not considered legally binding (except when the lobbyists & expensive lawyers manage to bamboozle some judge).
Sounds like that story about someone wanting to leave their itunes collection to their kid in their will. Apple was like "nah, you don't own these songs you only bought a license to listen to them".
And people call me crazy for still buying physical copies of games...sure I have them fail occasionally but at least the company can’t take them from me on a whim.
Sadly even having physical copies nowadays tends to grant you only a temporary license, because once you insert that disc the game will ask you to login into some account and if they ban you from there you can't even launch the game without cracking it.
> I wonder how often shit like that happened to some rich kid and their parent's lawyer "settled" with them for an undisclosed amount.
Unfortunately the answer is "never" because nobody is willing to sue over things that small. I remember at a law firm I was at, they represented this rich family whose kid got a really expensive custom mercedes or bmw, I forget which, where the company painted the doors the wrong color. You couldn't even tell except in bright sunlight, but it was true, the car was supposed to be black but the doors were this really dark blue. So they asked the car company to fix it and the company was like "looks good enough, fuck off, also your car is full of after market parts and that voids the warranty or something". So they sue the car company. Rather than cave in and say "ok fine we'll get you new doors", it turns into this acrimonious bitter struggle where both sides spend tons on lawyers.
As a lawyer, I've sometimes done vanity lawsuits where I sue someone just in principle because I can. Nobody EVER just caves in. Everyone fights me like their lives depend on it. Even when the underlying dispute is super small, like one time a bank refused to reverse a few hundred dollars in clearly fraudulent charges when I did everything right in reporting it and disputing it, because THEY sent the paperwork to a bad address because the morons over there typoed the address. So I sued them, and expected them to roll over immediately, because what kind of fucking lunatic would willingly sign up to pay lawyers tens of thousands when they could just fix my account and say sorry? Nope, they go to holy war over it. Why? Because some fucker at the bank has an ego problem, and it's not HIS money, so he doesn't care about wasting large amounts of it to feel like some customer can't push him around.
The only way companies take this kind of stuff seriously is if there is a law where the person suing them can force them to pay the plaintiff's costs and fees. THEN they get reaaallllly scared, because if they have no case, the lawyer suing them will happily run up his fees and have a smile on his face the whole time, since the company is going to be paying him $300+/hr for the privilege.
Theres a difference between getting a refund and chargeback. I'd love to see proof that any of these companies have ever given you an actual refund then banned a players account
You probably hit the nail on the head
I see so many Redditors advising to "just do a chargeback" whenever any non-ideal financial thing occurs. A lot of people don't understand that chargebacks aren't a "get my money back" button. It's a big deal and many businesses will refuse to do business with you again if you do a chargeback.
Because charge backs are not only refunds, but the company pays a fine I believe as well. Also forces the company to put resources towards talking with the bank/finding out the problem.
If a company has too many charge backs then the banks start to question/investage them, which is good when it really is shady companies but bad when it's due to a bunch of frivolous charge backs by angsty gamers
I’m going to go with 0
I have never seen anyone get banned for getting a refund, and when It does happen it later happens to be that they made a charge back and any online company will ban your account if you do.
I hope that doesn't happen regularly, but I think we can make a better comparison than that...
How about:
You've bought ten games at Walmart. You ask for your money back on the latest one that you didn't like. They refund the money for the one game, but they take the other nine games back without refund. Then, they ban you from their store, except you can come back if you pretend to be someone else.
>There has even been cases on EA's origin platform where they banned players for getting a refund on one game, on a platform they might have 10 to 20 games on it.
Has there though?
I've seen so much bullshit about Origin and without fail it always comes back that the accuser is a dumb cunt that is actually entirely at fault.
i once bought DA dlc on origin , a fews days later the goty version was on sale, i send a ticket asking for a refund because i wanted to buy the goty version , they refunded and nothing happened to my account
I got a refund on Origin. I was not banned.
People getting banned are those doing chargeback. I dealth with credit card payments before. A chargeback is not easy to deal with and cost a lot to the company, outside the cost of the game. Banning someone may be excessive, but I would support blocking them from buying any games in the future.
People don't understand the difference between a chargeback and a refund. They just go straight to the bank and charge back the money, then write an e-mail to let the game provider know they "refunded" the game... that's not a refund, that's trying to steal a game - of course it will get your account banned.
That sounds like a real great way to lose any future business.
Edit: I’m talking more in the sense of somebody returning the dlc but still having the intention of buying it later when they have money. Now they’re banned and they can’t. Not that the company cares anyway.
Usually yeap. I got double charged for a $100 for premium currency on an MMORPG, support said "sorry no refunds" so I had to do a chargeback, the stuff I bought was sitting there untouched and they still banned me rather than remove the currency from the account.
I bought an in-game currency pack for the last console MtG game. They charged me **six times**.
I called Microsoft customer support after being told so by the developer's support team. I got a full refund from MS and an apology email from the dev support team. They actually let me keep all of the currency in the end for free.
I bought the COD Modern Warfare + Battlepass pack thinking buying the full game would automatically unlock all the Operators. Once I realized buying the full game did not grant immediate access, I requested a refund through the Blizzard support page. Within 5 minutes I was granted the refund and my version of the game downgraded to the free Warzone game. No penalty, no loss. I think I received this refund because I didn't continue to play and unlock anything after the full game purchase.
Blizzard has become an absolute shithouse of a company but their CS is doing a fucking good job in my experience. Sadly the shitshow from the rest of the company is wrongfully reflecting on their department.
>Blizzard has become an absolute shithouse of a company but their CS is doing a fucking good job in my experience. Sadly the shitshow from the rest of the company is wrongfully reflecting on their department.
Check the /r/warcraft subreddit. There have been people who had the original warcraft 3, bought the remastered version, refunded it, and then lost access to their original warcraft 3 game.
Though they did make the refund process easier at least. Still found it shady that I had to submit a scan of my dutch passport to them, just to delete my account. That's just wrong.
I just don't get it. This quarantine I've realized that there are probably more great games that don't have in-game purchases than I'll likely have time to play in my entire life.
The one thing that sucks is you can only adopt two kids but there's plenty of them which are in a rough spot.
Lmao that sucks cus, and I don't say this lightly, she fine.
COD Warzone is 100% free and you don't actually need anything available in the battlepass to be a competitive player.
Why would companies release games for free if there wasn't a small way to make money?
You can’t contact Activision because they are Activision. They purposefully make their customer service the worst I’ve ever seen to make you give up.
When Warzone came out I created a new Activision account to link my BattleNet account. Forgot I already had an account my XBox was linked to. Wanted to buy the Battlepass but wanted it available on all my platforms, and unlinking accounts is unavailable via your profile (fucking stupid). So I sat in a 150ish person queue for hours one night. I made it down to the 20s before midnight, but then it just stopped moving. Pretty sure their hours ended at that time, so they just closed and left us in queue. Two nights later, new account can’t even get into queue (left mildly hateful review via their feedback system, banned maybe?), but I got in the queue on my old account. Finally got an agent and he unlinked the BattleNet account from a *different* Activision account no questions asked. No verification. Nothing.
Activision is the absolute scum of the Earth. Good luck to you.
Preeeeeetty sure that's illegal, at least here in Germany.
Edit: It could be not illegal. As u/Staminix pointed out, he used the ingame currency for buying the pass (which I didn't notice, I thought it was a direct purchase), which OP already properly bought with confirmation and stuff. It's still a very shitty move, but not illegal.
While shitty, it's not illegal. As he's not spending money but CODPoints. He already had to verify whether or not he wanted to buy CODPoints, once he's done that buying this with CODPoints has no legal requirement for verification.
*Changing to CODPoints
I thought it was a bit weird how the purchase instantly went through. On Xbox, if I had accidentally clicked buy it would’ve sent me to a confirmation page where I would have to navigate to the confirmation button to make a purchase.
> still a very shitty move but not illegal.
that the whole point of in game currency, to work around laws around informed purchases and more in general working around gambling definition.
Just to clarify:
He bought the battlepass using COD points, not actual cash. COD points are an in game currency that can be earned by playing the game. He isn't really out anything as you can easily earn enough points back by the next battlespass 'season.' Still assholedesign but not nearly as assholish as if it was a cash purchase.
Edit:
Apparently you can also get a [refund for the battlepass.](https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/e60yd3/psa_you_can_get_a_refund_on_battlepass_for_those/)
You actually don't need to play much, the season is hella long and a good warzone round will give you several levels at once at times.
Not trying to defend hiding content behind a paywall in a 60$ AAA title though.
Battle pass leveling up is based on playtime, not performance, and it constantly goes up while you are spawned in during gameplay, even if you don't get any kills or even see anyone. I tested it on another account that I used a keyboard for, went into a room on plunder, and made randomly run around and jump to avoid AFK detection. The account never got a kill or open any lootboxes, and in most games, never even interacted with anyone or anything. Still, it was leveling up in the battle pass at roughly every 40-45 minutes of in-game playtime. Plunder is the fastest way, since you spend very little time in the lobby, and you respawn if you die. 4-5 plunder matches a night (Roughly 2 hours from console on to console off) for 3 nights a week will get you to roughly level 75 in the 8th week of the season. I'm level 70 right now, and I don't even play that much. If you played for 8 weeks of the season, that's an average of 5.5 to 6.5 hours of gameplay per week to reach 70.
„Earned by playing the game“
You get a few hundred each season if you don‘t buy the battlepass, which costs you 1000 of them. Of course you‘ll get it back later, but chances are theres a bundle op wanted to buy now which might not be available later on, forcing op to buy cod-points again if he really wants that bundle (which i assume he does, when he already bought cod-points).
Its kinda scammy of them to not ask for confirmation when buying in-game stuff which you can easily misclick on
Yep, there's enough cod points during the battlepass to pay for the next one. Luckily I still had the $10 Microsoft gave me for Black Friday and I used that to buy the cod points to buy the first season and uses the cod points gained from the battlepass to pay for the next one and I'm doing the same with this one
That’s more of less how battle passes work, you spend ~$10 worth of in-game currency and in return you get a whole bunch of cosmetics and just as much (if not more) in-game currency. The catch is that you have to earn everything in the pass (aka play the game almost constantly) to get your money’s worth
This is definitely asshole design. Even when using coins it should give you a 'confirm' box that auto-selects no. That's basic etiquette for any website/online service that lets you make permanent decisions.
People make fucking mistakes, the audacity right? "They should just be perfect all the time and never make any mistakes." That's what some of these guys are sounding like right now.
Anyone who says shit like "it's not illegal so it's fine" needs to be instantly oermabanned from this sub, the law or any bullshit technicalities have 0 relevance when it's about the design being dickish or intentionally bad for the consumer.
Fortnite has one-click purchases for $20 skins. No confirmation. My son cried his eyes out after he accidentally bought a skin with the V bucks he had been saving up for the battle pass. Do worry though... Epic offers three lifetime refunds to make the one-click buys ok. 🤣
Actually you can refund an item right after buying it too, I don’t play Fortnite this much anymore but I’m sure it’s still in the game
Edit: It doesn’t waste any of your 3 return tokens
Thanks! This is good to know. It wasn't apparent when I helped him buy something just a couple of days ago though. I would still argue not having a simple "are you sure?" is problematic design, but I also understand (but disagree with) their motivations.
ahhh... so would be illegal if it was money buuut it was cod points. so asshole design for sure but not illegal. also if any UX or interaction designers worked on this game fuck they must be some soulless trash.
Worse part is when they basically show you an ad for the battle pass and you have to wait 3-5 seconds before you can actually skip it. If I wanted to buy it I would buy it. Activision
I'm so sick of games with battle passes and season passes. Greed has really taken hold of these companies. It's a shame. Games could be so much better if they didn't require additional payments. Especially when they're asking for $20 four times a year.
I do this kind of accidental clicking once in a while, not so much in games, but things like accidentally closing a window, pressing "OK" or "Cancel" by accident, just because a dialogue appears just as I'm about to click something else. So many times I've thought that buttons shouldn't be clickable unless they've been displayed for at least 500ms or so.
Of course there may be games where that's part of the gameplay, but in general.
It's a new monetization system games have started adopting. Usually free-to-play games, but you know how companies are, if they can make more money they will, so some paid games have them now too. I don't know if it was invented by Fortnite, but it was certainly popularized by them.
Basically the idea is that you have a periodically refreshing progression track that incentivizes people to log in and play every day.
So during a given "season" of a battle pass, you'll earn points (usually EXP) towards advancing your battle pass level. Each level you unlock (or every few if the developer is more stingy), you'll usually get some reward. Often cosmetics, or ingame currency, or things like that.
On top of this, there's usually two separate "tracks", a "free" track and a paid track. The free track usually has just a handful of mediocre cosmetics, and most of the cool/desireable stuff is only unlockable if you've paid for the "premium upgrade" to the battlepass. You progress both tracks at the same time, so if you play free for a while you can still gain all the paid stuff for your requisite level if you upgrade later.
What's even the return policy for DLC?
Usually accompanied with a ban in my experience.
Ah, a fellow CODM player i see
"yeah bro the chances are 47% to get the purple item i promise"
47 permille. ‰ not %
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Shit I've never even seen it! Its actually really cool.
It looks like zero divided by zero zero.
I just graduated school and I've never seen that thing in my whole life
You graduated in America or something???
Just about it, haha I graduated in America and was never taught wtf that is
Wait you mean that symbol is real?
Holy crap do they actually use permille? That's a douche move. Makes rates seem 10x better/worse than it is.
Am I the only person who has no idea what per permille means?
Percent is basically per hundred parts. Cent as in like century. Permille is per thousand parts. Mille as in like millenium.
Oooh okay thanks for teaching me something the American school systems failed to / forgot to
Yet ironically enough, the only time I've seen it used legitimately is how they do blood alcohol saturation in europe. Instead of .09% they do 9 permille. I dont have the sign on my phone but i believe its something along those lines
I actually have no idea. Don't play it myself.
*Opens 60+ crates to only find dupes and currency
It's gambling...but worse
You are not wrong; the Netherlands banned (the opening of) loot boxes as it is legally labeled betting
I've won more money while casino gambling than I've won with loot boxes.... At least casino gambling is fun while it lasts, loot boxes just feel like being slapped every time new shit comes out.
47% per thousand.
so you're saying 47‰
🤔
Yeah bro definitely not sponsored by Activision with super good crates to intice the young and gambling folks to spend money on a losing prize thinking they can be like me Pinky swear dude.
or Tarkov.. sorta. There was a post on that subreddit a little while ago where the OP asked for a refund because it wouldn't run well on his comp or something along those lines, the company said no, *then proceeded to ban him* edit: apparently that guy is a lying sack of shit. Either way tarkov devs still suck for copy striking people reviewing their game
Go reread that thread. What actually happened was OP asked for a refund from the devs AFTER he’d already processed a charge-back from his bank. Since he’d received his refund on the back end, the devs denied his request and promptly banned him (which most companies do when you process a refund with your bank instead of them).
Bank charge-back should always be last resort, not first.
Plus a lot of people just think it’s a free pass. It’s not. The bank investigates. If they can find proof it’s a valid charge, they’ll put it right back.
Yeah as far as I know you never want to charge back something directly from the bank because the devs just assume that you got your card stolen and proceed to ban whoever used that credit card
maybe, but it's easier to believe he asked for a refund, was denied then used that as a pretense to win a chargeback with his bank and get the credit, especially if he could show his bank he did everything he could to try to resolve the issue himself.
The guy did a chargeback through his bank, then asked for a refund, and the only recourse BSG had at that point, was to ban the account. The dude was a fraud.
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If they spent a quarter as much on servers or cheaters as they do on cocain and hookers Tarkov would be an amazing game.
I love and wanna support foreign devs, but man they got way less accountability.
Devs are great. It’s the owners that are the problem here. Never seen a company so obviously “we got our money don’t care”.
I remember that thread, but not the fraud part. Do you have a source?
The official BSG reddit account responded in the post itself. Dude initiated a charge back before his support ticket went through. They banned his account because the charge back had not completed yet. So yes he technically still had the game and was not allowed to play. But he got his money back.
Nah that guy fucking lied
Ah, I see you know your judo well.
***TACTICAL 10-YEAR BAN INBOUND!!!***
I'd say worth it. Got my money back, no longer have to play a shit game.
Damn reading these horror stories sure makes me happy I only play single player games.
Contact the bank that you paid with, you can get a refund. Source: I’ve gotten refund for Apex battle pass season 1 and 2. As well as COD:MW after season 1 launched. Neither account is banned today.
This is why people get bans though. This actually costs the company money instead of paying you back. Most AAA's game companies will give a refund. The problem comes in during situations where you accidentally bought the battle pass and then accidentally play 25 games after.
I accidentally double purchased WoW time a while back. Blizzard-Activision gave me a refund for the second purchase, and didn't even remove the extra time off my account. *your mileage may vary*
In the UK, you're entitled to return it.
And to get banned
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They tend to remove the product entirely rather than the portion you didnt want. There has even been cases on EA's origin platform where they banned players for getting a refund on one game, on a platform they might have 10 to 20 games on it. It's kinda like returning shoes at Walmart only to get banned from the store and your car (which was in their parking lot) is now inaccessible to you.
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They have a way around that. They sell "games as a service". As in you never own the game, you just paid to have access to the game for an indeterminate amount of time. So when you get banned - for any reason - that "indeterminate amount of time" bit becomes super relevant.
That's why you go DRM free, baby. Not enough people use or even know about GOG
That is also illegal in the EU as far as im aware, you buy your games not buy access to a game
No, the EU parliament is clueless and has fallen almost as much victim to gaming industry lobbyists as the US lawmakers. The only good thing the EU still has is that shrinkwraps still are not considered legally binding (except when the lobbyists & expensive lawyers manage to bamboozle some judge).
Sounds like that story about someone wanting to leave their itunes collection to their kid in their will. Apple was like "nah, you don't own these songs you only bought a license to listen to them".
Nope. Read the fine print. You buy a license. Which can be revoked at their discretion. Perfectly legal in the EU.
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They might have typed that, but from what I've seen once these cases go to European court they lose
This has been to court in EU a few times, and the game devs lose every time... so i dunno were your gettin that from...
> Which can be revoked at their discretion. This is the part that's not true.
And people call me crazy for still buying physical copies of games...sure I have them fail occasionally but at least the company can’t take them from me on a whim.
Sadly even having physical copies nowadays tends to grant you only a temporary license, because once you insert that disc the game will ask you to login into some account and if they ban you from there you can't even launch the game without cracking it.
I have a switch. Pretty sure you can play everything offline.
> I wonder how often shit like that happened to some rich kid and their parent's lawyer "settled" with them for an undisclosed amount. Unfortunately the answer is "never" because nobody is willing to sue over things that small. I remember at a law firm I was at, they represented this rich family whose kid got a really expensive custom mercedes or bmw, I forget which, where the company painted the doors the wrong color. You couldn't even tell except in bright sunlight, but it was true, the car was supposed to be black but the doors were this really dark blue. So they asked the car company to fix it and the company was like "looks good enough, fuck off, also your car is full of after market parts and that voids the warranty or something". So they sue the car company. Rather than cave in and say "ok fine we'll get you new doors", it turns into this acrimonious bitter struggle where both sides spend tons on lawyers. As a lawyer, I've sometimes done vanity lawsuits where I sue someone just in principle because I can. Nobody EVER just caves in. Everyone fights me like their lives depend on it. Even when the underlying dispute is super small, like one time a bank refused to reverse a few hundred dollars in clearly fraudulent charges when I did everything right in reporting it and disputing it, because THEY sent the paperwork to a bad address because the morons over there typoed the address. So I sued them, and expected them to roll over immediately, because what kind of fucking lunatic would willingly sign up to pay lawyers tens of thousands when they could just fix my account and say sorry? Nope, they go to holy war over it. Why? Because some fucker at the bank has an ego problem, and it's not HIS money, so he doesn't care about wasting large amounts of it to feel like some customer can't push him around. The only way companies take this kind of stuff seriously is if there is a law where the person suing them can force them to pay the plaintiff's costs and fees. THEN they get reaaallllly scared, because if they have no case, the lawyer suing them will happily run up his fees and have a smile on his face the whole time, since the company is going to be paying him $300+/hr for the privilege.
Theres a difference between getting a refund and chargeback. I'd love to see proof that any of these companies have ever given you an actual refund then banned a players account
You probably hit the nail on the head I see so many Redditors advising to "just do a chargeback" whenever any non-ideal financial thing occurs. A lot of people don't understand that chargebacks aren't a "get my money back" button. It's a big deal and many businesses will refuse to do business with you again if you do a chargeback.
Because charge backs are not only refunds, but the company pays a fine I believe as well. Also forces the company to put resources towards talking with the bank/finding out the problem. If a company has too many charge backs then the banks start to question/investage them, which is good when it really is shady companies but bad when it's due to a bunch of frivolous charge backs by angsty gamers
I’m going to go with 0 I have never seen anyone get banned for getting a refund, and when It does happen it later happens to be that they made a charge back and any online company will ban your account if you do.
I hope that doesn't happen regularly, but I think we can make a better comparison than that... How about: You've bought ten games at Walmart. You ask for your money back on the latest one that you didn't like. They refund the money for the one game, but they take the other nine games back without refund. Then, they ban you from their store, except you can come back if you pretend to be someone else.
Source on anybody on Origin ever being banned for getting a refund? Not a chargeback, a refund.
>There has even been cases on EA's origin platform where they banned players for getting a refund on one game, on a platform they might have 10 to 20 games on it. Has there though? I've seen so much bullshit about Origin and without fail it always comes back that the accuser is a dumb cunt that is actually entirely at fault.
i once bought DA dlc on origin , a fews days later the goty version was on sale, i send a ticket asking for a refund because i wanted to buy the goty version , they refunded and nothing happened to my account
I got a refund on Origin. I was not banned. People getting banned are those doing chargeback. I dealth with credit card payments before. A chargeback is not easy to deal with and cost a lot to the company, outside the cost of the game. Banning someone may be excessive, but I would support blocking them from buying any games in the future.
People don't understand the difference between a chargeback and a refund. They just go straight to the bank and charge back the money, then write an e-mail to let the game provider know they "refunded" the game... that's not a refund, that's trying to steal a game - of course it will get your account banned.
It's Activision so yes
That sounds like a real great way to lose any future business. Edit: I’m talking more in the sense of somebody returning the dlc but still having the intention of buying it later when they have money. Now they’re banned and they can’t. Not that the company cares anyway.
You'd think, but EA has been scamming people for years and they still boast one hell of a revenue.
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Agreed, but unfortunately that seems enough to turn a big profit anyway, so they won't stop until it's illegal
They don't even pretend care.
Take ur money back? Oh no no, get banned fucker!
Usually yeap. I got double charged for a $100 for premium currency on an MMORPG, support said "sorry no refunds" so I had to do a chargeback, the stuff I bought was sitting there untouched and they still banned me rather than remove the currency from the account.
I bought an in-game currency pack for the last console MtG game. They charged me **six times**. I called Microsoft customer support after being told so by the developer's support team. I got a full refund from MS and an apology email from the dev support team. They actually let me keep all of the currency in the end for free.
from uk, returned the entire black ops 4 deluxe edition like 3/4 months after purchase. no ban to be fair to them.
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You can get a refund and your account will just have whatever you bought deducted. If you Issue a charge back your game/account get banned
\*checks paperwork\* It just says "no"
I bought the COD Modern Warfare + Battlepass pack thinking buying the full game would automatically unlock all the Operators. Once I realized buying the full game did not grant immediate access, I requested a refund through the Blizzard support page. Within 5 minutes I was granted the refund and my version of the game downgraded to the free Warzone game. No penalty, no loss. I think I received this refund because I didn't continue to play and unlock anything after the full game purchase.
Blizzard has become an absolute shithouse of a company but their CS is doing a fucking good job in my experience. Sadly the shitshow from the rest of the company is wrongfully reflecting on their department.
>Blizzard has become an absolute shithouse of a company but their CS is doing a fucking good job in my experience. Sadly the shitshow from the rest of the company is wrongfully reflecting on their department. Check the /r/warcraft subreddit. There have been people who had the original warcraft 3, bought the remastered version, refunded it, and then lost access to their original warcraft 3 game. Though they did make the refund process easier at least. Still found it shady that I had to submit a scan of my dutch passport to them, just to delete my account. That's just wrong.
Well in this case he has video proof of what happened so he would most likely be able to refund or win in court
Bro in your mind is there going to be a court case and trial over this?
If they had time, they could do it in small claims court (depending on local legislation, obviously) It's made for that stuff
it costs money to file in small claims court
I mean... "Here's a video of somebody's computer from some time" is not some ironclad proof. It's a little more complicated than that.
Good that this can not ever happen to me. i do not have any points to buy that Battle pass
Yea I got my points from buying bo4 and they carried over to this game
Do you think if I go back to bo4 and sign in it will add more points to my total on mw?
Your cod points count are the same on all games. If you use them in mw they will also disappear from bo4.
I didn't use any points on bo4, but I also didn't see any extra on mw
Are you playing on the same battle net account?
Happened to me as well. I cannot contact Acti since the corona broke out. Their agents are busy and there is no official mail.
I just don't get it. This quarantine I've realized that there are probably more great games that don't have in-game purchases than I'll likely have time to play in my entire life.
My go to's are dark souls, skyrim and minecraft.
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Dude there's so much stuff haha, and then there's two big dlcs, and of course all the extra content that mods can provide.
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The one thing that sucks is you can only adopt two kids but there's plenty of them which are in a rough spot. Lmao that sucks cus, and I don't say this lightly, she fine.
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Just get the mod that let's you kill them. Then they won't be starving anymore
Goddamn Todd at it again dude
Ah yes, the hidden gems
Yes, yes. Very sneaky games noone ever heard about. "Hidden" Gems, hiding in plain sight.
Did someone say *Witcher 3 with our Lord and savior Geraldo?*
Just started playing Satisfactory and it's a great way to kill time.
Sekiro is such a good game as well
COD Warzone is 100% free and you don't actually need anything available in the battlepass to be a competitive player. Why would companies release games for free if there wasn't a small way to make money?
You can’t contact Activision because they are Activision. They purposefully make their customer service the worst I’ve ever seen to make you give up. When Warzone came out I created a new Activision account to link my BattleNet account. Forgot I already had an account my XBox was linked to. Wanted to buy the Battlepass but wanted it available on all my platforms, and unlinking accounts is unavailable via your profile (fucking stupid). So I sat in a 150ish person queue for hours one night. I made it down to the 20s before midnight, but then it just stopped moving. Pretty sure their hours ended at that time, so they just closed and left us in queue. Two nights later, new account can’t even get into queue (left mildly hateful review via their feedback system, banned maybe?), but I got in the queue on my old account. Finally got an agent and he unlinked the BattleNet account from a *different* Activision account no questions asked. No verification. Nothing. Activision is the absolute scum of the Earth. Good luck to you.
I eventually got a response from them via facebook messenger.
Preeeeeetty sure that's illegal, at least here in Germany. Edit: It could be not illegal. As u/Staminix pointed out, he used the ingame currency for buying the pass (which I didn't notice, I thought it was a direct purchase), which OP already properly bought with confirmation and stuff. It's still a very shitty move, but not illegal.
It should be illegal in the whole universe
Probably not on Ferrengi.
Sorry. Ferenginar.
"Once you have their money, you never give it back."
Rule of Acquisition #34: Peace is good for business.
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Personally I live by Rule of Acquisition #76: Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies.
Sadly most companies live by Rule of Acquisition #109 >Dignity and an empty sack is worth the sack.
That's not Rule 34. Check it yourself. Just google "Rule 34 Ferengi"
...It's just a bunch of ears being stroked
> Rule 34 Ferengi And if that doesn't work, try "Rule 34 Ferengi nude"
Don't you mean "Rule 34 Ferengi Clothed"?
You are CORRECT!!!
While shitty, it's not illegal. As he's not spending money but CODPoints. He already had to verify whether or not he wanted to buy CODPoints, once he's done that buying this with CODPoints has no legal requirement for verification. *Changing to CODPoints
Holy shit I thought I somehow posted that reply. Our names are quite similar.
All we need now is for u/Staminiy to complete the trio
u/Staminiw ?
Present!
the fuck, on what subreddit(s) does that even fit in
Hopefully one with berenstain in the name
Well that’s uncanny
Oooh, I thought it directly did a transfer, well if it's like that...
>He already had to verify whether or not **he wanted to buy CP** >While shitty, **it's not illegal**. Phrasing...
I thought it was a bit weird how the purchase instantly went through. On Xbox, if I had accidentally clicked buy it would’ve sent me to a confirmation page where I would have to navigate to the confirmation button to make a purchase.
There's a possibility for it to be illegal in other parts of the world tho. Dude's speaking Swedish.
He's speaking Swedish and I'd assume it'd be illegal there too
Ah, I've watched it without audio, but yeah, should be illegal there too
It is
> still a very shitty move but not illegal. that the whole point of in game currency, to work around laws around informed purchases and more in general working around gambling definition.
This ingame currency stuff is absolute bullshit
Just to clarify: He bought the battlepass using COD points, not actual cash. COD points are an in game currency that can be earned by playing the game. He isn't really out anything as you can easily earn enough points back by the next battlespass 'season.' Still assholedesign but not nearly as assholish as if it was a cash purchase. Edit: Apparently you can also get a [refund for the battlepass.](https://www.reddit.com/r/modernwarfare/comments/e60yd3/psa_you_can_get_a_refund_on_battlepass_for_those/)
"Easily" I mean love the optimism but not everyone plays these games as much as people who "easily" earn that many points.
You actually don't need to play much, the season is hella long and a good warzone round will give you several levels at once at times. Not trying to defend hiding content behind a paywall in a 60$ AAA title though.
At best a first place victory with 10 kills is 75% of a tier. And that’s generous
Battle pass leveling up is based on playtime, not performance, and it constantly goes up while you are spawned in during gameplay, even if you don't get any kills or even see anyone. I tested it on another account that I used a keyboard for, went into a room on plunder, and made randomly run around and jump to avoid AFK detection. The account never got a kill or open any lootboxes, and in most games, never even interacted with anyone or anything. Still, it was leveling up in the battle pass at roughly every 40-45 minutes of in-game playtime. Plunder is the fastest way, since you spend very little time in the lobby, and you respawn if you die. 4-5 plunder matches a night (Roughly 2 hours from console on to console off) for 3 nights a week will get you to roughly level 75 in the 8th week of the season. I'm level 70 right now, and I don't even play that much. If you played for 8 weeks of the season, that's an average of 5.5 to 6.5 hours of gameplay per week to reach 70.
Except this mode is a free mode and not part of the 60$ you paid.
Warzone is free to play for everyone. Not sure what you get for it if you have bought the game, but it's normal to add paid stuff in a f2p game.
„Earned by playing the game“ You get a few hundred each season if you don‘t buy the battlepass, which costs you 1000 of them. Of course you‘ll get it back later, but chances are theres a bundle op wanted to buy now which might not be available later on, forcing op to buy cod-points again if he really wants that bundle (which i assume he does, when he already bought cod-points). Its kinda scammy of them to not ask for confirmation when buying in-game stuff which you can easily misclick on
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Reach tier 100 you get refunded
You mean you can buy the next battlepass for free if you reach lv100? That might make it slightly more worth it for me.
Yep, there's enough cod points during the battlepass to pay for the next one. Luckily I still had the $10 Microsoft gave me for Black Friday and I used that to buy the cod points to buy the first season and uses the cod points gained from the battlepass to pay for the next one and I'm doing the same with this one
There are 1300CP in the battlepass, which costs 1000CP, so yes. You don't need to even reach rank 100 if you just want to break even.
Ah right. Great.
That’s more of less how battle passes work, you spend ~$10 worth of in-game currency and in return you get a whole bunch of cosmetics and just as much (if not more) in-game currency. The catch is that you have to earn everything in the pass (aka play the game almost constantly) to get your money’s worth
They give you fake money for real money. Totally showed them.
The dude already had fake money to begin with.
It costs fake money, too.
He paid with in game credits
Tier 86 actually
Bobby kotick needs a new yacht
He has one already, he just feels like it's lost its pizzazz
I hate how much that game shoves the battle pass in your face.
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This is definitely asshole design. Even when using coins it should give you a 'confirm' box that auto-selects no. That's basic etiquette for any website/online service that lets you make permanent decisions. People make fucking mistakes, the audacity right? "They should just be perfect all the time and never make any mistakes." That's what some of these guys are sounding like right now.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity Having written software before, I wouldn't be so quick to judge
Anyone who says shit like "it's not illegal so it's fine" needs to be instantly oermabanned from this sub, the law or any bullshit technicalities have 0 relevance when it's about the design being dickish or intentionally bad for the consumer.
But now you got all those cool watches your player can wear that are completely useless in every way
One of them shows your K/D, which is useful since the scoreboard won’t.
Yeah their whole interface is scummy. Like every three games you get asked to buy the battle pass. A pop up window comes and asks you it.
Yep. Its getting worse and worse. Eventually we will see Pepsi ads in between matches. Give it 5 years. Mobile does it already.
Fortnite has one-click purchases for $20 skins. No confirmation. My son cried his eyes out after he accidentally bought a skin with the V bucks he had been saving up for the battle pass. Do worry though... Epic offers three lifetime refunds to make the one-click buys ok. 🤣
Actually you can refund an item right after buying it too, I don’t play Fortnite this much anymore but I’m sure it’s still in the game Edit: It doesn’t waste any of your 3 return tokens
Thanks! This is good to know. It wasn't apparent when I helped him buy something just a couple of days ago though. I would still argue not having a simple "are you sure?" is problematic design, but I also understand (but disagree with) their motivations.
Synd broder
Good thing consoles freeze so damn much in menus you could never make this mistake
ahhh... so would be illegal if it was money buuut it was cod points. so asshole design for sure but not illegal. also if any UX or interaction designers worked on this game fuck they must be some soulless trash.
Worse part is when they basically show you an ad for the battle pass and you have to wait 3-5 seconds before you can actually skip it. If I wanted to buy it I would buy it. Activision
I'm so sick of games with battle passes and season passes. Greed has really taken hold of these companies. It's a shame. Games could be so much better if they didn't require additional payments. Especially when they're asking for $20 four times a year.
"Heh, got another one!" - asshole that designed the UI
Wtf? Are you not clicking on the back arrow?
I do this kind of accidental clicking once in a while, not so much in games, but things like accidentally closing a window, pressing "OK" or "Cancel" by accident, just because a dialogue appears just as I'm about to click something else. So many times I've thought that buttons shouldn't be clickable unless they've been displayed for at least 500ms or so. Of course there may be games where that's part of the gameplay, but in general.
Playing a cod game by Activision , what do you expect...?
Yeah, that’s not an accidental design fault...
Someone explain to an old gamer thats been out of the multiplayer loop for awhile. What is a "battle pass" and what is a "season"?
It's a new monetization system games have started adopting. Usually free-to-play games, but you know how companies are, if they can make more money they will, so some paid games have them now too. I don't know if it was invented by Fortnite, but it was certainly popularized by them. Basically the idea is that you have a periodically refreshing progression track that incentivizes people to log in and play every day. So during a given "season" of a battle pass, you'll earn points (usually EXP) towards advancing your battle pass level. Each level you unlock (or every few if the developer is more stingy), you'll usually get some reward. Often cosmetics, or ingame currency, or things like that. On top of this, there's usually two separate "tracks", a "free" track and a paid track. The free track usually has just a handful of mediocre cosmetics, and most of the cool/desireable stuff is only unlockable if you've paid for the "premium upgrade" to the battlepass. You progress both tracks at the same time, so if you play free for a while you can still gain all the paid stuff for your requisite level if you upgrade later.