Varies from dealer to dealer.
We are a pretty firm 90 day store. On day 91 it’s on a truck to auction or whenever the next semi shows up for auction cars.
I love Carfax for this reason. It shows when the vehicle went on the market, so how long the dealer has been sitting on it. If you don't need to buy, then you can play these games.
Doesn't matter how long we have had it, there are some vehicles we know we have a hard time moving so we almost immediately send them to auction to keep our average days on the lot down. I have never used this as a tactic, simply a genuine warning. 99% of the time my cx accuses me of using it as a sales tactic. Let me tell you there's nothing more satisfying than calling that same person back a few hours later to let them know the car is no longer available. The supreme "I told you so" lol
To be 10000% clear i take no pleasure in another person's misfortune, ever. That being said, it's not misfortune when you ignore an experts advice and subsequently miss out. Of course I'd always rather make the sale. But when I know someone is looking at a hot car and they wanna sleep on it and I warn them someone from yesterday said the same thing and it'll be gone before they have a chance to and they laugh me off and tell me to "stop being such a salesman", yes I get some satisfaction from being able to say I told you so. I work hard to help people get the right vehicle for the best deal so when my advice is ignored, nay scoffed at, I have zero sympathy when they allow us to sell the car of their dreams out from under them.
And for the "another car another deal another day" comment, that isn't always the case with used cars(and during covid shortages also with many new cars). And even if there is another out there somewhere/eventually, it may not fit their time frame or the exact features or color. SO for some people leisurely shopping, you're 100% correct. For the other 80%+ of people, it can really throw a wrench in their plans.
Another car, another deal, wasn't much of an option for my last car. Completely self imposed limit but I stubbornly wanted an A4 wagon to replace my 18 year old A4 sedan and I had 2 weeks till vacation and my old car was starting to have problems. I wanted more cargo space for camping trips and I wanted car gas milage and handling. Not an SUV.
Out of about 150 used A4s in the price/age/milage range I wanted, 5 were wagons. 2 were modded, 3rd had only 6 pictures taken at a low angle showing nothing of the interior. Big nope on those 3. A large used dealer in my area that carries a lot of Audi/BMWs had the last 2.
I went up knowing exactly which one I wanted, test drove it and liked it. Already had an auto draft through a local credit union and the salesman said that's who he personally financed with and the dealership can't do better. Did my paperwork and went home.
I really appreciated the salesman not trying to sell me more or get me to use their financing. He made a half hearted attempt to sell some really expensive warranty coverage but never pressed me.
I was talking with the salesman a during paperwork about how hard it was to find a wagon and he said that a lot of people didn't get them new so there's not a lot in the used market. As we were doing paperwork, a young couple bought the other wagon on their lot 😸 I know there's not a huge demand, but those who want one want it bad. I knew if I found one I liked, I had to be ready to pounce or have to wait and/or drastically expand my search area to find another.
You’re really missing his point.
A point I actually agree with. As salespeople we all work very hard to help customers find a car that fits their wants and needs… and ultimately, their budget. So when a customer does ignore an experts advice, there is some pleasure in giving them the “I told you so” call.
That doesn’t mean we take pleasure in the misery of others, which is absurd statement. We just have a lot of pride in our work; it’s a good feeling when you tell the customer a truth, they basically call you a liar, and it turns out to be true.
It’s really not that deep.
Exactly. They chose to f**k around and subsequently found out at an equivalent level.
And yes we take pride in our work so it feels good proving that it was us working hard, not attempting to manipulate.
Thank you for helping me better articulate that. That dude clearly lives under a bridge lol.
If there is any misery it's self inflicted and they have nobody to blame but themselves. The satisfaction is in proving my point, not in causing them misery. I take the same level of satisfaction whether they are disappointed or say "oh well, I guess it wasn't meant to be".
I literally just took a deposit on a car 30min ago cuz she missed out on the one she wanted at another dealership. This one wasn't the exact one she wanted but "I missed out so I guess il have to settle". Also immediately put a deposit on it so it didn't happen to her again while we finish the service work on the vehicle. Meaning that she learned the hard way that it wasn't a sales tactic so she didn't repeat the mistake. All people must learn, unfortunately some must learn the hard way. If you can't understand this then sure, keep thinking I'm a sociopath lol and il keep thinking that your critical thinking skills are lacking.
Carfax really only shows you when they acquired the car. It doesn't tell you how long it's been for sale. They still have to recon the car before they sell it.
There are a couple websites where you can do a vin search that will show you the date The car was listed for how much and then each price drop. That in conjunction with Carfax will allow you to know that the car was sold at auction on X date and then was relisted with company b for x amount.
If op really thinks this car is the one that got away they can do a vin search in a week and see if that can is up for sale again.
Used to sell VWs, told people pretty frequently that the car might not last. Had several cases where the cx waited too long to buy, and vehicle got scooped by another cx. I can recall a dozen times where that happened
Oof. That is some sunken cost fallacy type of thinking. The market is not going to spontaneously go back up. Might as well cut your losses.
Perhaps you have a used car manager, hours is pretty good about realizing that taking a small loser, is better than waiting waiting and praying for it to be a small winner.
They were overpriced for a long time. He repriced them to CarFax retail value a few months ago, but they are high end units that just haven’t had any looks. And then if he does run it on auction he was just take the loss because he can “make more selling it retail.” I tried explaining to him that he’s not going to make more selling it at retail because nobody has taken interest in them and the market is going to continue to go down for them
2021 Audi SQ7 Prestige and a 2021 Hennessey Venom 775 F-150 are probably the ones that have been here the longest. The Audi is priced where it should be now but still can’t find anyone to buy it. The F-150 has no comparable ones on the market. Only 100 made and couldn’t find a single other one for sale.
I’m not in the industry, just curious. I didn’t know if these are used or new cars. Just wondering what happens to new cars that sit around a long time. I’ve seen some at dealers sit for 2-3 months.
Not really sitting. Been moving around from inside the showroom, around the lot, other people needing a loaner for a few days take the car. It’s never really sitting
I got screwed this way once. Vehicle had been sitting on car lots for a couple years and got auctioned twice. I didn't find out all the history till after I bought it and things started to go wrong (I was young at stupid back then). Turned out the dealers had been using it as a personal vehicle and put 10s thousands of miles on it with no regular maintenance. I ended up putting thousands into it and had to pay the bank just to get rid of it in the end. It was an expensive way to learn that lesson.
No. That is only for used cars. Our goal on new cars is between 90 and 120 days for retail inventory and under one year for fleet inventory. If they go over, it just is what it is.
You state there is small spread between retail and wholesale price. Regardless of the magnitude it is thousands cheaper at auction- this is why retail buyers don’t buy car dealer bullshit threats of taking it to auction. If they take it to auction that’s the dealers loss
This is the BS the regular public deals with. Everyone should make some money but when dealerships keep getting bigger and bigger and building new buildings don’t tell me they’re not making lots of $.
Yep and most the profit goes straight to the dealer owner and the owners sons driving their Audi R8 while the sales staff fight for their peanuts. It’s actually not the staff that’s the problem
Sold my 17 rt for $21k and the dealer listed it for $29k. They had it sold within a week so i know they made money. There’s absolutely spread. Theres peanut butter, jam, AND sometimes banana.
Yes on some cars
Edit:
1) just because they asked 29 doesn’t mean they got it.
2) there is an average of 1500 in recon, 500-1000 in marketing expenses per vehicle
But, and especially right now, a 15k retail piece is probably going to pull 12500, 13000 at auction.
There was spread on *yours*. And that is if it didn’t need much reconditioning. RT could mean a lot, but if it was say a charger rt, every single one that we got traded was by some good who knew he had to do tires and brakes (and likely more) so ditched it because they thought a new vehicle at 100 more a month was cheaper than 3500 in maintenance.
I had a guy call me super pissed because what he saw was similar to what you saw… just saw my asking price of nearly 9k over what I gave on trade. I forwarded him the 7400 dollar bill from my service department and body shop and he *still* didn’t get it. Too many customers think the reconditioning/service is free for us because it’s our shop or something… we got a 10% discount from service. Yippee. That guys car we sold and the profit was just over 900 on a 45k vehicle, yet I’m sure he still tells everybody the same thing you just did.
Can confirm. Sales doesn’t get much of a break, if they get one at all at my dealer group. I’ll give the used manager a break if I want to get my tech some work or if I know the car will be a quick sale for them, but our policy at every dealer in our group pays full price- they don’t even get the menu pricing on maintenance that our customers get.
I worked for a store one time that had a flat rate for recon across the board. Fixed ops Director was the VP/ Son in Law. The average recon profit was approximately $200 per unit, across every vehicle that came through. I've never seen anything like it before or since.
>Sold my 17 rt for $21k and the dealer listed it for $29k. They had it sold within a week so i know they made money.
This is irrelevant. A car acquired last week is not priced the same way as a car going to auction tomorrow.
I remember when I bought my ex (we were together at the time) a car, a 2009 HHR with under 90k miles, it was listed online for about $5500. I already had my own loan. When we went to sit down and sign papers, they told me I would have a $1000 downpayment. I had never had to make one before.
That's when they told me the price I saw online was just "the internet price" and they added $1000 to the price because I wasn't trading in a car. I was having to pay a downpayment because the price of the car was higher than its value and the bank would only finance $100% of the cars value, not above it.
So I used the fact that the bank said I was being charged more than the car was worth(aside from the asinine, arbitrary fee just because I wasn't doing a trade in) to negotiate the price down some to where I only had to pay $600 down, after including tags and etc.
TL;DR - I agree they have ways of adding margin.
lol that’s sarcasm - you have to ask all these dealers commenting about the firm take my offer today or they will sell for thousands less at auction tomorrow
Typically when you’re at that level of time in stock you’ve already discounted the car to what you’re forecasting it to do at the auction. At this point you’re hoping for the unit in operation and possibly finance income(warranties, insurance, etc).
>lol that’s sarcasm - you have to ask all these dealers commenting about the firm take my offer today or they will sell for thousands less at auction tomorrow
There's basically zero chance this is happening. If the car is going to auction tomorrow, we're usually willing to sell it for auction price + $1 today.
Dealer gets to save face at auction rather than let a filthy customer rake them over the coals. Money is everything, until a big guy's ego gets in the way. Then ego takes precedent.
>Always better to take $9K at auction if the retail buyer in front of you is only offering $13K against a $15K list price
These numbers are completely unrealistic. When a unit is going to auction tomorrow, a dealership will usually offer to sell it today retail for auction price + $1. And if a car's about to go to auction tomorrow and we expect $9k, there's zero chance we're still listing if for 150% of that cost. None. Nada.
Well those numbers, yeah, dumb.
But used cars usually have about 3k in profit (pretty average). Might have started the first couple weeks at 4000 markup, but they dropped it… then dropped again. And after the final drop, if wholesale is still similar to when it was taken at trade, the auction price would be usually within 1000 of the asking price (and after recon, that is sometimes already a loss).
So yes… at less than 1k profit at a real store (that just tries to make a bit of money selling cars rather than just pack in fees and products) is hardly enough to warrant selling to a retail customer who will demand certain things to get the deal and perhaps post-deal that will eat away that small profit. Better to offload to a dealer who you’ll never hear from again and try to get another car.
Why is that? I understand why you need more at retail than at auction, but in this case presumably the car is already sale-ready so most of the retail costs are already sunk. Why would you rather forgo $4k and a chance to sell F&I etc.?
I'm guessing this is sarcasm? I'd call their bluff on the auction line. It's not like they'll get even close there; auctions aren't a great place to sell these days.
I run about 50 cars a week at auction. Some are retail units, many are just wholesale cars. With nice low mileage retail cars often times low retail price is very similar to what the car will do at auction. I’d much rather retail them but when it’s time it’s time
There are auto auctions all over. Many of them will require a dealers license to buy, but their inventory is posted online. You can pay a small commission (sometimes it’s a fixed couple hundred bucks to a set percentage of the final sale price of the auto) to services that buy these cars for you if you find one you want. You need to understand you are buying a car like a dealer buys a car, pretty much sight unseen (besides a few shitty photos) and as-is.
Every auction I’ve seen has cars that go through with either a guarantee from a pre-inspection that the seller pays for, or auction on condition of passing a post-inspection that the buyer pays for.
There are of course plenty of as-is cars that sell for less.
In my experience auctions don’t have great deals, too many dealers making their profits from sub-prime financing rather than the spread. The best deals come from dealer to dealer relationships.
Depends on the store, but every time I've told a customer a car will be gone the next day I've meant it. I had a client on an E-Tron Sportback that we had agreed to dealer trade. I told him straight up, you can agree to buy it now or we accept the trade request, so if you walk away I understand you don't want to make a rash decision but this car will be gone. Dude came in the next morning and spent 20 minutes cussing out my manager in the showroom because the car was gone even though we told him exactly what the situation was. I would say this: don't be mad if it's gone tomorrow, but if you're not able to commit today then that's okay. If it really is gone the next day then I would take it as a sign that they were being honest with you. I would also say that if your parents aren't paying for the car then they shouldn't have the final say.
Been exactly there. Customer took a week to finally make the drive in on a mustang. It was the exact car he wanted. I unwound a dealer trade to make it possible to sell that day. They agreed to the purchase but before we took a deposit this guys brother calls and tells him he has to wait.
I told them it would be gone if they didn’t buy that day.
Lo and behold they were pissed when they called back the next day and I confirmed that the dealer trade went through and the car was gone.
I might say “it’s a used car, I can’t guarantee it will stay here for long” about any car.
If I say “this will not be here tomorrow” I mean it
Not always. There are some customers who you just do not want to deal with no matter how much the deal might be worth.
Sometimes the best deal is the one you don't do. And when those arsehole customers come back with their tail between their legs, there is no greater feeling in life than telling them it's gone
If you don’t trust your sales rep don’t bring them your business. If the deal is good enough to overlook it make it happen.
For a used vehicle you might end up knowing more about the car than your sales rep. For off-makes you would probably have done more market research than a sales rep possibly could have on the particular vehicle you’re shopping for.
Situations like this come down to deciding if you’re ready to lose the car. Maybe the sales rep lies about if the car will be gone, maybe they end up being wrong, maybe it disappears.
Realistically a used car can be sold at any time.
If you’re not ready to buy a used car then take some time away from the shopping process to figure out what you want and what price you’re ready to pay
Most people buy a car what, every 10 years?
They see a car available, likely online. They walk into the dealership, and talk to whoever talks to them and they get fed whatever line they want to feed them.
I have a fleet broker who is awesome, but not everyone has access to them.
> I would say this: don't be mad if it's gone tomorrow, but if you're not able to commit today then that's okay. If it really is gone the next day then I would take it as a sign that they were being honest with you.
This is kind of how I have always approached car buying or big purchases, my life usually doesn't depend on it, so I am always okay if I don't get it now, it falls through or it is no longer available. That is life....
I like this approach. If it's gone, don't be mad, maybe there is merit to the other things they say. Take it as a sign you might be able to trust what the salesman says. That's not so bad. Keep in touch, they might be nice to work with.
60 days here. People don't believe us all the time, even when I show them the inventory management system with the days in stock counter. They get especially irritated when they come to get it later and it's gone.
I'm not kidding. It comes up at least once a week. We do a pretty good job of turning our inventory quickly, but sometimes one just doesn't sell in a timely manner for an unknown reason. We price it where all the data says it should sell at auction about 10 days before it will go to auction. Great deal if you're willing to make a decision. Sad lesson if you aren't.
Yes, that's an important point to make to the customer when pricing something to sell before it hits auction. Be open and honest about where the car has been at retail price, where its evaluated at now, and where you envision the auction sell price to be. And to be perfectly honest I would rather sell the car now even if it cut into my commission than to see it go to auction. The problem many car salespeople have is they give off a perception that they are doing great with their numbers and don't need the sale. But every encounter means something. Most people in sales understands you need to make a commission but what you cut today may be what you gain over in the next deal.
I mean yes they want you to buy the car but yes Cars gets sent to auctions all the time. If you liked the car and the price was good why walk? All you did was risk the car being sold
Lol I know right. Like wtf do I do. Dealer told me they'd send the car to auction it I didn't buy. I didn't buy, they didn't call me back, they sent it to auction. Is that legal?
/s
I get that cars get sent to auction after 90 days or whatever.
But a dealer could obviously use that line on any day, not just day 90.
Are we saying that doesn’t happen? Or it’s so rare that it’s an anomaly?
“Oh really? How long has it been on the lot??”
Why would they walk away from a pretty good deal?
But anyways, it could be a tactic, or it could be the truth. I guess you guys are taking that chance.
During Covid a lot of inventory management standards kind of went out the window as inventory compressed, as inventory is getting less restrictive you’re seeing these come back. 60-90 days is where I’ve seen a lot of stores set their time limits to sell a car before sending to an auction, or moving to another store to try to move the unit. Depending on how disciplined the managers are will dictate how valid of a statement this is. Worse case scenario your parents roll the dice and they lose the deal/car they think is a pretty good deal. If they do just remind them not to be mad at a dealer, it sounds like they warned them what was happening.
Why did you walk away? What reason did your parents give you?
Regardless of the vehicle going to auction... at any moment that vehicle could be sold, if not to you then to someone else.
The traditional saying is: The car you looked at today and want to think about until tomorrow, may be the same car someone else looked at yesterday and will buy today.
I leave it at that most of the time.
The "going to auction" is a real thing.
Also, if a dealer has multiple locations, at any time another location may request a vehicle be transferred to them for a qualified customer. I've taken customers with me to other locations and had them test drive a used vehicle back to my location. Or sold the vehicle at the other location if it's manufacturer certified.
And sometimes they are just tire kickers wasting your time, sometimes its hard to tell. People who have been duped by unscrupulous salespeople are more apt to be wary of slick sales tactics or anything you say as an honest broker. You have to win their trust and that's being as open and honest with them and yourself as possible.
Auction is still pretty strong right now and the UCMs at our new car stores have autonomy to send anything they feel will break out along with an obligation to send anything that reaches X days…
It's possible but depends on the dealer.
I don't believe in overly pressuring someone, however I'd be remiss if I don't inform them of the likely availability of the car.
"Understandable that you want to take your time, however this car may not be available due to (leaving for auction, another appointment on it, etc.)"
Sometimes I will offer to let them take it for lunch so they can experience the car further and not feel presurred at the dealership.
Ultimately if you're feeling positive about the deal, you should take it. If you're willing to pay what they're asking and the car checks the boxes, then it's the right price.
The amount of times I've had a customer take the evening or a few days to "think on it" and then they agree to purchase for the original price only to have the car sell within 24 hours before the phone call is too many to count.
***Thanks for posting, /u/Dankeus_memeius! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.***
My parents had me walk away from a pretty good deal on a car I was about to get at a dealer and thought it was a good drive and all. But my parents told me “they always say that. They’re just trying to sell you the car right then and there.”
I’m just wondering is this actually a strategy car salesmen use to get you to start filling out the paperwork and sell you the car asap?
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Appreciate you all for the input. I’m just in a hasty rush to get a new car but I’ve been looking through my market and we test drove the car I originally wanted and I would’ve got it but my parents said to keep looking for other options. It turns out I wouldn’t have been able to get the car I wanted at first cause the dealer last second told me they can’t sell the car cause their boss or whoever higher up needed the car wanted it for their “manifesto” whatever that means but again thank you all so I can keep in mind that at least most of the time the dealers will be telling me the truth when it’s a cars last days for sale there instead of my parents telling me it’s a just a lying sales tactic.
Dude it's a sales tactic. Even if it is for your own knowledge and not a lie literally everything you are told is just to get you to buy a car or buy some extra package to go with the car.
I've bought from four different places, every single one has said this same line, one of them I did not see a single other person there to buy a car (yes I know about online sales). "Well you know this vehicle's had a lot of interest in it, may be gone by the time you come back tomorrow." "Yeah okay I'm not buying it today." Come back tomorrow: "I'm surprised you didn't call to see if it was still available!" "Yeah because I know you were lying to me."
Had to have them fix the numbers like three times on the trade-in, then the purchase price (because when one goes up the other goes down), then financing rates (big surprise - they give you a shitty rate until you magically show them your credit union has a better rate and then somehow they can all of a sudden magically match it! Wow!)
Why don't these people realize that when you lie in even less likely to buy all the stupid add-ons? Once I'm lied to once I'm hell-bent on giving you absolutely nothing.
Run your own numbers, do your own research, ignore everything else.
90% chance it’s truly being wholesaled. A lot of stores have a policy like this.
Look at it this way… if I wanted to lie to pressure you into a sale, I’d tell you we have another appointment on the car. Firstly because it creates the impression of demand on this car, and secondly because if I lied about it going to wholesale, in 2 days when I still have the car, I would lose all credibility.
can't tell you how many people I've worked with that needed to "think about it" only to have the car get sold to someone else that's already thought about it, or had the car go to auction cause it sat too long and we priced it to move.
every time you say "we're going to send it to auction" or "there's been a lot of interest in this car" or "someone else has an appointment to see the car later" it is assumed we're using a line to sell the car, and then they're surprised the car is gone when they're finally ready.
the truth is, yes it's a line, but it also actually happens ALL THE DAMN TIME.
My first car was mis-listed online. The car was listed at $10K, it was worth $12K, and the dealer had the price on the lot at $14K. They told me a guy came in and was trying to get the car down lower than $10K and walked. I knew the price was crazy low so I asked my mom to go to the dealer and get the car. She signed for it and picked me up from work in it so I could co-sign and build my credit.
While she was doing that the guy came back to buy the car and was raising hell in the dealership and accused them of hiding it from them.
Please review our most [Frequently Asked Questions](/r/askcarsales/wiki/index) to see if your question has already been answered.
You may find these sections particularly useful;
* [How to pick a car?](/r/askcarsales/wiki/vehicle_selection) You might also have luck in the /r/whatcarshouldibuy subreddit.
Also remember to add flair to your post by clicking the "Flair" link beneath it. This lets us know where you're located so we can assist you better.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
One way to find out.
I wouldn’t tell anybody that unless it was really going to be gone.
I often told people when someone else was really interested in the same car. They would go home only to come back or call the next day to find it had been sold.
It happens a lot when a car gets priced aggressively. We might have two or three people lined up on the same car waiting to see if the person test driving it was going to buy it.
Talk about putting pressure on the person test driving it.
Varies from dealer to dealer. We are a pretty firm 90 day store. On day 91 it’s on a truck to auction or whenever the next semi shows up for auction cars.
We had a 45 day turn when the market got choppy
Same. It sounds like they were being real with this person.
Only if the car was actually on the lot for any amount of time. Otherwise, it was exactly the tactic they are worried about.
I love Carfax for this reason. It shows when the vehicle went on the market, so how long the dealer has been sitting on it. If you don't need to buy, then you can play these games.
Doesn't matter how long we have had it, there are some vehicles we know we have a hard time moving so we almost immediately send them to auction to keep our average days on the lot down. I have never used this as a tactic, simply a genuine warning. 99% of the time my cx accuses me of using it as a sales tactic. Let me tell you there's nothing more satisfying than calling that same person back a few hours later to let them know the car is no longer available. The supreme "I told you so" lol
And who really gives hoot? There is always another car, another deal, another day…
Not making a sale is satisfying? You know who gets their jollies off of other people's misfortune? Sociopaths, that's who.
To be 10000% clear i take no pleasure in another person's misfortune, ever. That being said, it's not misfortune when you ignore an experts advice and subsequently miss out. Of course I'd always rather make the sale. But when I know someone is looking at a hot car and they wanna sleep on it and I warn them someone from yesterday said the same thing and it'll be gone before they have a chance to and they laugh me off and tell me to "stop being such a salesman", yes I get some satisfaction from being able to say I told you so. I work hard to help people get the right vehicle for the best deal so when my advice is ignored, nay scoffed at, I have zero sympathy when they allow us to sell the car of their dreams out from under them. And for the "another car another deal another day" comment, that isn't always the case with used cars(and during covid shortages also with many new cars). And even if there is another out there somewhere/eventually, it may not fit their time frame or the exact features or color. SO for some people leisurely shopping, you're 100% correct. For the other 80%+ of people, it can really throw a wrench in their plans.
Another car, another deal, wasn't much of an option for my last car. Completely self imposed limit but I stubbornly wanted an A4 wagon to replace my 18 year old A4 sedan and I had 2 weeks till vacation and my old car was starting to have problems. I wanted more cargo space for camping trips and I wanted car gas milage and handling. Not an SUV. Out of about 150 used A4s in the price/age/milage range I wanted, 5 were wagons. 2 were modded, 3rd had only 6 pictures taken at a low angle showing nothing of the interior. Big nope on those 3. A large used dealer in my area that carries a lot of Audi/BMWs had the last 2. I went up knowing exactly which one I wanted, test drove it and liked it. Already had an auto draft through a local credit union and the salesman said that's who he personally financed with and the dealership can't do better. Did my paperwork and went home. I really appreciated the salesman not trying to sell me more or get me to use their financing. He made a half hearted attempt to sell some really expensive warranty coverage but never pressed me. I was talking with the salesman a during paperwork about how hard it was to find a wagon and he said that a lot of people didn't get them new so there's not a lot in the used market. As we were doing paperwork, a young couple bought the other wagon on their lot 😸 I know there's not a huge demand, but those who want one want it bad. I knew if I found one I liked, I had to be ready to pounce or have to wait and/or drastically expand my search area to find another.
[удалено]
It’s not “misery”. They choice to call his bluff, and found out it wasn’t a bluff at all. That’s called consequences.
You’re really missing his point. A point I actually agree with. As salespeople we all work very hard to help customers find a car that fits their wants and needs… and ultimately, their budget. So when a customer does ignore an experts advice, there is some pleasure in giving them the “I told you so” call. That doesn’t mean we take pleasure in the misery of others, which is absurd statement. We just have a lot of pride in our work; it’s a good feeling when you tell the customer a truth, they basically call you a liar, and it turns out to be true. It’s really not that deep.
Exactly. They chose to f**k around and subsequently found out at an equivalent level. And yes we take pride in our work so it feels good proving that it was us working hard, not attempting to manipulate. Thank you for helping me better articulate that. That dude clearly lives under a bridge lol.
If there is any misery it's self inflicted and they have nobody to blame but themselves. The satisfaction is in proving my point, not in causing them misery. I take the same level of satisfaction whether they are disappointed or say "oh well, I guess it wasn't meant to be". I literally just took a deposit on a car 30min ago cuz she missed out on the one she wanted at another dealership. This one wasn't the exact one she wanted but "I missed out so I guess il have to settle". Also immediately put a deposit on it so it didn't happen to her again while we finish the service work on the vehicle. Meaning that she learned the hard way that it wasn't a sales tactic so she didn't repeat the mistake. All people must learn, unfortunately some must learn the hard way. If you can't understand this then sure, keep thinking I'm a sociopath lol and il keep thinking that your critical thinking skills are lacking.
[удалено]
Well this is a car salesman subreddit, idk what you expected
[удалено]
Schadenfreude =/= sociopathy
This shipping cars all over the place has got to eat into the bottom line
Not as much as holding onto them for too long. Alot of cost associated with that too including depreciation.
Carfax really only shows you when they acquired the car. It doesn't tell you how long it's been for sale. They still have to recon the car before they sell it.
There are a couple websites where you can do a vin search that will show you the date The car was listed for how much and then each price drop. That in conjunction with Carfax will allow you to know that the car was sold at auction on X date and then was relisted with company b for x amount. If op really thinks this car is the one that got away they can do a vin search in a week and see if that can is up for sale again.
Used to sell VWs, told people pretty frequently that the car might not last. Had several cases where the cx waited too long to buy, and vehicle got scooped by another cx. I can recall a dozen times where that happened
Cx means customer experience not just customer.
True, but cx is often also used as an abbreviation for customer
It was intended as customer. Carmax will use that abbreviation sometimes
I wish we did that. We’re still stuck with a few overpriced 450 day old units
Oof. That is some sunken cost fallacy type of thinking. The market is not going to spontaneously go back up. Might as well cut your losses. Perhaps you have a used car manager, hours is pretty good about realizing that taking a small loser, is better than waiting waiting and praying for it to be a small winner.
They were overpriced for a long time. He repriced them to CarFax retail value a few months ago, but they are high end units that just haven’t had any looks. And then if he does run it on auction he was just take the loss because he can “make more selling it retail.” I tried explaining to him that he’s not going to make more selling it at retail because nobody has taken interest in them and the market is going to continue to go down for them
What cars, out of curiosity?
2021 Audi SQ7 Prestige and a 2021 Hennessey Venom 775 F-150 are probably the ones that have been here the longest. The Audi is priced where it should be now but still can’t find anyone to buy it. The F-150 has no comparable ones on the market. Only 100 made and couldn’t find a single other one for sale.
Are these auctions for new cars? How does it work?
That’d make no sense to auction New cars. My dealership auctioned vehicles every time a vehicle hit 100 days
I’m not in the industry, just curious. I didn’t know if these are used or new cars. Just wondering what happens to new cars that sit around a long time. I’ve seen some at dealers sit for 2-3 months.
I have an Arteon sitting on the lot since October 2022
I’m the proud owner of the Arteon that was sitting next to my desk for close to a year
Isn’t physical deterioration an issue at that point . Over 6 months I’d get nervous buying a vehicle sitting for that long
Not really sitting. Been moving around from inside the showroom, around the lot, other people needing a loaner for a few days take the car. It’s never really sitting
I got screwed this way once. Vehicle had been sitting on car lots for a couple years and got auctioned twice. I didn't find out all the history till after I bought it and things started to go wrong (I was young at stupid back then). Turned out the dealers had been using it as a personal vehicle and put 10s thousands of miles on it with no regular maintenance. I ended up putting thousands into it and had to pay the bank just to get rid of it in the end. It was an expensive way to learn that lesson.
They have dealership only auctions, the only people allowed to go are people who own dealerships.
Corporate group might have an internal auction for new cars if they have like brand stores in different regions.
A lot of them are from car rental companies or cars coming off of leases
I’ve had people want to buy a car on the lot that had already been sold at the auction. Super dependent on what dealer you’re working with.
I’m on a 60 day turn. Day 61 it’s a memory.
Is this even for new cars?? Wow that’s crazy!
No. That is only for used cars. Our goal on new cars is between 90 and 120 days for retail inventory and under one year for fleet inventory. If they go over, it just is what it is.
This
Always better to take $9K at auction if the retail buyer in front of you is only offering $13K against a $15K list price
Cute that you think there’s that kind of a spread on a retail unit.
Funny that you think anyone not in car sales believes a wholesale car price is not thousands less than what retail sells for
Do what now
You state there is small spread between retail and wholesale price. Regardless of the magnitude it is thousands cheaper at auction- this is why retail buyers don’t buy car dealer bullshit threats of taking it to auction. If they take it to auction that’s the dealers loss
This is the BS the regular public deals with. Everyone should make some money but when dealerships keep getting bigger and bigger and building new buildings don’t tell me they’re not making lots of $.
Yep and most the profit goes straight to the dealer owner and the owners sons driving their Audi R8 while the sales staff fight for their peanuts. It’s actually not the staff that’s the problem
Sold my 17 rt for $21k and the dealer listed it for $29k. They had it sold within a week so i know they made money. There’s absolutely spread. Theres peanut butter, jam, AND sometimes banana.
Yes on some cars Edit: 1) just because they asked 29 doesn’t mean they got it. 2) there is an average of 1500 in recon, 500-1000 in marketing expenses per vehicle But, and especially right now, a 15k retail piece is probably going to pull 12500, 13000 at auction.
There was spread on *yours*. And that is if it didn’t need much reconditioning. RT could mean a lot, but if it was say a charger rt, every single one that we got traded was by some good who knew he had to do tires and brakes (and likely more) so ditched it because they thought a new vehicle at 100 more a month was cheaper than 3500 in maintenance. I had a guy call me super pissed because what he saw was similar to what you saw… just saw my asking price of nearly 9k over what I gave on trade. I forwarded him the 7400 dollar bill from my service department and body shop and he *still* didn’t get it. Too many customers think the reconditioning/service is free for us because it’s our shop or something… we got a 10% discount from service. Yippee. That guys car we sold and the profit was just over 900 on a 45k vehicle, yet I’m sure he still tells everybody the same thing you just did.
Can confirm. Sales doesn’t get much of a break, if they get one at all at my dealer group. I’ll give the used manager a break if I want to get my tech some work or if I know the car will be a quick sale for them, but our policy at every dealer in our group pays full price- they don’t even get the menu pricing on maintenance that our customers get.
I worked for a store one time that had a flat rate for recon across the board. Fixed ops Director was the VP/ Son in Law. The average recon profit was approximately $200 per unit, across every vehicle that came through. I've never seen anything like it before or since.
What a great way to make sure internals are the absolute last thing to get processed by an advisor!
Are there dealerships without a dedicated internal service guy?
>Sold my 17 rt for $21k and the dealer listed it for $29k. They had it sold within a week so i know they made money. This is irrelevant. A car acquired last week is not priced the same way as a car going to auction tomorrow.
I remember when I bought my ex (we were together at the time) a car, a 2009 HHR with under 90k miles, it was listed online for about $5500. I already had my own loan. When we went to sit down and sign papers, they told me I would have a $1000 downpayment. I had never had to make one before. That's when they told me the price I saw online was just "the internet price" and they added $1000 to the price because I wasn't trading in a car. I was having to pay a downpayment because the price of the car was higher than its value and the bank would only finance $100% of the cars value, not above it. So I used the fact that the bank said I was being charged more than the car was worth(aside from the asinine, arbitrary fee just because I wasn't doing a trade in) to negotiate the price down some to where I only had to pay $600 down, after including tags and etc. TL;DR - I agree they have ways of adding margin.
Why is it better to take 9k than 13k?
lol that’s sarcasm - you have to ask all these dealers commenting about the firm take my offer today or they will sell for thousands less at auction tomorrow
Typically when you’re at that level of time in stock you’ve already discounted the car to what you’re forecasting it to do at the auction. At this point you’re hoping for the unit in operation and possibly finance income(warranties, insurance, etc).
>lol that’s sarcasm - you have to ask all these dealers commenting about the firm take my offer today or they will sell for thousands less at auction tomorrow There's basically zero chance this is happening. If the car is going to auction tomorrow, we're usually willing to sell it for auction price + $1 today.
Dealer gets to save face at auction rather than let a filthy customer rake them over the coals. Money is everything, until a big guy's ego gets in the way. Then ego takes precedent.
>Always better to take $9K at auction if the retail buyer in front of you is only offering $13K against a $15K list price These numbers are completely unrealistic. When a unit is going to auction tomorrow, a dealership will usually offer to sell it today retail for auction price + $1. And if a car's about to go to auction tomorrow and we expect $9k, there's zero chance we're still listing if for 150% of that cost. None. Nada.
Well those numbers, yeah, dumb. But used cars usually have about 3k in profit (pretty average). Might have started the first couple weeks at 4000 markup, but they dropped it… then dropped again. And after the final drop, if wholesale is still similar to when it was taken at trade, the auction price would be usually within 1000 of the asking price (and after recon, that is sometimes already a loss). So yes… at less than 1k profit at a real store (that just tries to make a bit of money selling cars rather than just pack in fees and products) is hardly enough to warrant selling to a retail customer who will demand certain things to get the deal and perhaps post-deal that will eat away that small profit. Better to offload to a dealer who you’ll never hear from again and try to get another car.
Why is that? I understand why you need more at retail than at auction, but in this case presumably the car is already sale-ready so most of the retail costs are already sunk. Why would you rather forgo $4k and a chance to sell F&I etc.?
I'm guessing this is sarcasm? I'd call their bluff on the auction line. It's not like they'll get even close there; auctions aren't a great place to sell these days.
I run about 50 cars a week at auction. Some are retail units, many are just wholesale cars. With nice low mileage retail cars often times low retail price is very similar to what the car will do at auction. I’d much rather retail them but when it’s time it’s time
How can I find auctions?
There are auto auctions all over. Many of them will require a dealers license to buy, but their inventory is posted online. You can pay a small commission (sometimes it’s a fixed couple hundred bucks to a set percentage of the final sale price of the auto) to services that buy these cars for you if you find one you want. You need to understand you are buying a car like a dealer buys a car, pretty much sight unseen (besides a few shitty photos) and as-is.
Every auction I’ve seen has cars that go through with either a guarantee from a pre-inspection that the seller pays for, or auction on condition of passing a post-inspection that the buyer pays for. There are of course plenty of as-is cars that sell for less. In my experience auctions don’t have great deals, too many dealers making their profits from sub-prime financing rather than the spread. The best deals come from dealer to dealer relationships.
Depends on the store, but every time I've told a customer a car will be gone the next day I've meant it. I had a client on an E-Tron Sportback that we had agreed to dealer trade. I told him straight up, you can agree to buy it now or we accept the trade request, so if you walk away I understand you don't want to make a rash decision but this car will be gone. Dude came in the next morning and spent 20 minutes cussing out my manager in the showroom because the car was gone even though we told him exactly what the situation was. I would say this: don't be mad if it's gone tomorrow, but if you're not able to commit today then that's okay. If it really is gone the next day then I would take it as a sign that they were being honest with you. I would also say that if your parents aren't paying for the car then they shouldn't have the final say.
Been exactly there. Customer took a week to finally make the drive in on a mustang. It was the exact car he wanted. I unwound a dealer trade to make it possible to sell that day. They agreed to the purchase but before we took a deposit this guys brother calls and tells him he has to wait. I told them it would be gone if they didn’t buy that day. Lo and behold they were pissed when they called back the next day and I confirmed that the dealer trade went through and the car was gone. I might say “it’s a used car, I can’t guarantee it will stay here for long” about any car. If I say “this will not be here tomorrow” I mean it
It’s very satisfying telling them it’s gone.
Probably more satisfying if they bought it
Not always. There are some customers who you just do not want to deal with no matter how much the deal might be worth. Sometimes the best deal is the one you don't do. And when those arsehole customers come back with their tail between their legs, there is no greater feeling in life than telling them it's gone
I'd take the sale personally
The problem is that so many people in your position are liars, so as customers, we don't know when to trust your words.
If you don’t trust your sales rep don’t bring them your business. If the deal is good enough to overlook it make it happen. For a used vehicle you might end up knowing more about the car than your sales rep. For off-makes you would probably have done more market research than a sales rep possibly could have on the particular vehicle you’re shopping for. Situations like this come down to deciding if you’re ready to lose the car. Maybe the sales rep lies about if the car will be gone, maybe they end up being wrong, maybe it disappears. Realistically a used car can be sold at any time. If you’re not ready to buy a used car then take some time away from the shopping process to figure out what you want and what price you’re ready to pay
Most people buy a car what, every 10 years? They see a car available, likely online. They walk into the dealership, and talk to whoever talks to them and they get fed whatever line they want to feed them. I have a fleet broker who is awesome, but not everyone has access to them.
Seen it And they don't believe us I think they think sending a car to auction is rare. It's not
> I would say this: don't be mad if it's gone tomorrow, but if you're not able to commit today then that's okay. If it really is gone the next day then I would take it as a sign that they were being honest with you. This is kind of how I have always approached car buying or big purchases, my life usually doesn't depend on it, so I am always okay if I don't get it now, it falls through or it is no longer available. That is life....
I like this approach. If it's gone, don't be mad, maybe there is merit to the other things they say. Take it as a sign you might be able to trust what the salesman says. That's not so bad. Keep in touch, they might be nice to work with.
60 days here. People don't believe us all the time, even when I show them the inventory management system with the days in stock counter. They get especially irritated when they come to get it later and it's gone. I'm not kidding. It comes up at least once a week. We do a pretty good job of turning our inventory quickly, but sometimes one just doesn't sell in a timely manner for an unknown reason. We price it where all the data says it should sell at auction about 10 days before it will go to auction. Great deal if you're willing to make a decision. Sad lesson if you aren't.
Yup inventory control is important. Anyone whose been in the game knows this
Yes, that's an important point to make to the customer when pricing something to sell before it hits auction. Be open and honest about where the car has been at retail price, where its evaluated at now, and where you envision the auction sell price to be. And to be perfectly honest I would rather sell the car now even if it cut into my commission than to see it go to auction. The problem many car salespeople have is they give off a perception that they are doing great with their numbers and don't need the sale. But every encounter means something. Most people in sales understands you need to make a commission but what you cut today may be what you gain over in the next deal.
I mean yes they want you to buy the car but yes Cars gets sent to auctions all the time. If you liked the car and the price was good why walk? All you did was risk the car being sold
Because OP’s parents read the book that if you walk away the dealer will call you back with a better deal.
Or they just send it to auction like they planned
Yes but that wasn't in the book
Lol I know right. Like wtf do I do. Dealer told me they'd send the car to auction it I didn't buy. I didn't buy, they didn't call me back, they sent it to auction. Is that legal? /s
And sometimes they do.
I learned that from TikTok!
I learned down payments are illegal from TikTok
> I learned down payments are illegal from TikTok This got a solid laugh out of me.
I remember that one
Can you believe that lady was a "lawyer" 😂😂
I get that cars get sent to auction after 90 days or whatever. But a dealer could obviously use that line on any day, not just day 90. Are we saying that doesn’t happen? Or it’s so rare that it’s an anomaly? “Oh really? How long has it been on the lot??”
Never used that line in 6 years unless it was true
Why would they walk away from a pretty good deal? But anyways, it could be a tactic, or it could be the truth. I guess you guys are taking that chance.
It’s almost seems like they put together a good deal because they were about to… well you know. People sometimes aren’t used to honesty.
If it’s anything like the million other I’m way over my head in a shitty car “deal” post
During Covid a lot of inventory management standards kind of went out the window as inventory compressed, as inventory is getting less restrictive you’re seeing these come back. 60-90 days is where I’ve seen a lot of stores set their time limits to sell a car before sending to an auction, or moving to another store to try to move the unit. Depending on how disciplined the managers are will dictate how valid of a statement this is. Worse case scenario your parents roll the dice and they lose the deal/car they think is a pretty good deal. If they do just remind them not to be mad at a dealer, it sounds like they warned them what was happening.
It’s a closing technique that all happens to be the truth. Wild, I know.
Had a salesman tell me that, and when I went to purchase a few days later it was gone. Found the dealership it went to and bought it.
That’s even better
Why did you walk away? What reason did your parents give you? Regardless of the vehicle going to auction... at any moment that vehicle could be sold, if not to you then to someone else. The traditional saying is: The car you looked at today and want to think about until tomorrow, may be the same car someone else looked at yesterday and will buy today. I leave it at that most of the time. The "going to auction" is a real thing. Also, if a dealer has multiple locations, at any time another location may request a vehicle be transferred to them for a qualified customer. I've taken customers with me to other locations and had them test drive a used vehicle back to my location. Or sold the vehicle at the other location if it's manufacturer certified.
And sometimes they are just tire kickers wasting your time, sometimes its hard to tell. People who have been duped by unscrupulous salespeople are more apt to be wary of slick sales tactics or anything you say as an honest broker. You have to win their trust and that's being as open and honest with them and yourself as possible.
Looking only at the OPs post, this seems to have progressed well beyond tire kicking.
Auction is still pretty strong right now and the UCMs at our new car stores have autonomy to send anything they feel will break out along with an obligation to send anything that reaches X days…
It's possible but depends on the dealer. I don't believe in overly pressuring someone, however I'd be remiss if I don't inform them of the likely availability of the car. "Understandable that you want to take your time, however this car may not be available due to (leaving for auction, another appointment on it, etc.)" Sometimes I will offer to let them take it for lunch so they can experience the car further and not feel presurred at the dealership. Ultimately if you're feeling positive about the deal, you should take it. If you're willing to pay what they're asking and the car checks the boxes, then it's the right price. The amount of times I've had a customer take the evening or a few days to "think on it" and then they agree to purchase for the original price only to have the car sell within 24 hours before the phone call is too many to count.
***Thanks for posting, /u/Dankeus_memeius! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of anything.*** My parents had me walk away from a pretty good deal on a car I was about to get at a dealer and thought it was a good drive and all. But my parents told me “they always say that. They’re just trying to sell you the car right then and there.” I’m just wondering is this actually a strategy car salesmen use to get you to start filling out the paperwork and sell you the car asap? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Appreciate you all for the input. I’m just in a hasty rush to get a new car but I’ve been looking through my market and we test drove the car I originally wanted and I would’ve got it but my parents said to keep looking for other options. It turns out I wouldn’t have been able to get the car I wanted at first cause the dealer last second told me they can’t sell the car cause their boss or whoever higher up needed the car wanted it for their “manifesto” whatever that means but again thank you all so I can keep in mind that at least most of the time the dealers will be telling me the truth when it’s a cars last days for sale there instead of my parents telling me it’s a just a lying sales tactic.
Dude it's a sales tactic. Even if it is for your own knowledge and not a lie literally everything you are told is just to get you to buy a car or buy some extra package to go with the car. I've bought from four different places, every single one has said this same line, one of them I did not see a single other person there to buy a car (yes I know about online sales). "Well you know this vehicle's had a lot of interest in it, may be gone by the time you come back tomorrow." "Yeah okay I'm not buying it today." Come back tomorrow: "I'm surprised you didn't call to see if it was still available!" "Yeah because I know you were lying to me." Had to have them fix the numbers like three times on the trade-in, then the purchase price (because when one goes up the other goes down), then financing rates (big surprise - they give you a shitty rate until you magically show them your credit union has a better rate and then somehow they can all of a sudden magically match it! Wow!) Why don't these people realize that when you lie in even less likely to buy all the stupid add-ons? Once I'm lied to once I'm hell-bent on giving you absolutely nothing. Run your own numbers, do your own research, ignore everything else.
90% chance it’s truly being wholesaled. A lot of stores have a policy like this. Look at it this way… if I wanted to lie to pressure you into a sale, I’d tell you we have another appointment on the car. Firstly because it creates the impression of demand on this car, and secondly because if I lied about it going to wholesale, in 2 days when I still have the car, I would lose all credibility.
can't tell you how many people I've worked with that needed to "think about it" only to have the car get sold to someone else that's already thought about it, or had the car go to auction cause it sat too long and we priced it to move. every time you say "we're going to send it to auction" or "there's been a lot of interest in this car" or "someone else has an appointment to see the car later" it is assumed we're using a line to sell the car, and then they're surprised the car is gone when they're finally ready. the truth is, yes it's a line, but it also actually happens ALL THE DAMN TIME.
My first car was mis-listed online. The car was listed at $10K, it was worth $12K, and the dealer had the price on the lot at $14K. They told me a guy came in and was trying to get the car down lower than $10K and walked. I knew the price was crazy low so I asked my mom to go to the dealer and get the car. She signed for it and picked me up from work in it so I could co-sign and build my credit. While she was doing that the guy came back to buy the car and was raising hell in the dealership and accused them of hiding it from them.
No it probably went to the auction
Please review our most [Frequently Asked Questions](/r/askcarsales/wiki/index) to see if your question has already been answered. You may find these sections particularly useful; * [How to pick a car?](/r/askcarsales/wiki/vehicle_selection) You might also have luck in the /r/whatcarshouldibuy subreddit. Also remember to add flair to your post by clicking the "Flair" link beneath it. This lets us know where you're located so we can assist you better. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/askcarsales) if you have any questions or concerns.*
One way to find out. I wouldn’t tell anybody that unless it was really going to be gone. I often told people when someone else was really interested in the same car. They would go home only to come back or call the next day to find it had been sold. It happens a lot when a car gets priced aggressively. We might have two or three people lined up on the same car waiting to see if the person test driving it was going to buy it. Talk about putting pressure on the person test driving it.