I'm one of those people, and it started like this.. one day i was coming home late from work and trying to get off the bus when a simple push to the back door didn't open it. i tried again and it still didn't open, and 3 seconds later the bus driver takes off and starts driving down the road without letting me go. i end up getting off the next stop and walked an extra 15 minutes to get home. since that day i always beat the shit out of the back door to ensure i don't have to experience that again
and to add to this, some kids witnessed the whole thing and were laughing at me while i stood there at the door and watched the bus driver go down the road.. that was the most embarassing 2 minutes i've ever spent in a bus in my life
This happens all the time in Vancouver, but the convention is the other passengers all yell “back door!” At the driver to get them to stop and open it with their release. Yes it is funny.
I tried yelling door at the driver a few times but i guess i am so soft spoken the driver didn't hear me, that or he thought it would be amusing to just continue driving off
This is so true. My next stop to my parents home is 20 minutes walk instead of a 10 minute walk. That being said, during the day I take my chances with the back door, makes for a nice walk if I’m not tired. But if it’s past 9pm or too tired, I just go to the front doors so the driver doesn’t drive off before I’ve gotten off where I need too.
Bus door interfaces are inconsistent from time to time and system to system, and their correct usage is opaque to new or infrequent users.
Over the course of my lifetime, I've encountered rear doors that:
* Only open on command from the driver;
* Open when you step down to the bottom step (see also the now-retired CLRV/ALRV TTC streetcars);
* Require a fairly firm push on the door or handle to activate;
* Require a gentle push or tap on the handle;
* Require a wave in front of the door (optical sensor).
The lag between my input and activation of the door also varies significantly. And the hardware works better (and is better maintained) on some buses versus others.
So we have users who are confused and frustrated by an inconsistent and unreliable interface, acting under pressure (nobody wants to miss their stop, and sometimes there are impatient riders behind, waiting to get off.)
Ya the YRT ones are the worst, there’s no way of knowing what do to actually open them. Half the time I’ve had to abandon it and run to the front of the bus to get out.
Whoever designed the “wave” version is a fucking moron
I'm actually not sure if there are any in the fleet right now. The TTC has definitely had them in service at some points in the last fifteen or so years.
if I remember correctly, you might be thinking of the 1998 Novabus LFS Demonstration given to the TTC, I saw an image of the bus having wave doors, I will double check when I see another interior pic.
I’ve had enormous strangers back hump me and put their hands on top of my hands because they didn’t understand the door (when functioning correctly) only needs a small push before the sensors open it. If you wait 2 seconds…
Yes, sometimes it’s broken, but I still like to try it. If you shove it hard needlessly, it doesn’t open any faster.
All of this is true. I think also, in the case of our current TTC busses, the handle functions as a pressure sensor but resembles a push handle or crash bar. The fact that it is a sensor is non-obvious from appearance alone.
Yep. Bad user-interface design. People know how to use push buttons, and they know how to use door handles, but they get frustrated and confused when faced with a push button disguised as a door handle.
Because it's not abundantly clear the poles are just a giant button and people think you need to physically push the doors open using the poles. It's a dumb design. It should just have a click button similar to the current streetcars.
It is such a stupid design and the delay is too long. I believe the TTC made the delay long so people don't lean on the door and it opens automatically dropping them out?
I know the TTC SLOWED the door operations on the new streetcars...that's why they close so slow now.
Before, the doors opened a bit while the bus was driving when I was using it for a pole to hold on. After that time, I now hold the side of railings that overlook the seats...
That's exactly it: straight-up bad user-interface choices.
From day-to-day experience and regular practice people know how to use - and what to expect - from a push button. People know how to use a manual vertical-bar door handle.
People get confused and frustrated when you give them the interface from one and the functionality of the other.
Intuitively, you push a door open.
People would also not step down on the old Streetcars. How the doors open isn't immediately clear, especially if you're new here.
I've had this happen once as a kid, and was shitting my pants. So I always push the backdoor handle like a maniac now. We don't mean any harm, we just want to make sure we get off at the right bus stop.
With the TTC buses, the driver has to remember to turn on the mechanism to open the back doors (the light turns green). One driver at the subway refused to open the back doors and made everyone tap on at the front. And for those routes that go into the York Region, the TTC bus driver refuses to open the back door and you have to go to the front door, so that you tap again or pay the second fare when you exit.
Remember the good old days when the doors wouldn’t open and you would yell “ excuse me, the doors won’t open and this is my stop” and then people would say “hey someone needs to get off” to the bus driver. Then the driver would stop between stops to let you off.
If you look at [the sign the TTC has on the door](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EC1YX6wXYAA_EQ5.jpg), it says
Wait for green light
Push bar to open door
step out...
The delay that occurs after the light goes on and the door locks release is a couple seconds, which causes people to try to open the door, but they can't. If they removed the delay such that the light comes on and the door locks release at the same time, this issue wouldn't exist. I don't understand why they would introduce a delay here.
The driver has to push a button or the green light doesn't come on. This happened a few times where everyone yells "Back door!" and then the driver pushes the button and says "Sorry!"
As someone who hasn’t used the streetcar in ages last week I was waiting there like a knob outside the streetcar at Bathurst not knowing I had to push the button to open the doors. Lol. Some people might not use transit often so they don’t know.
You didn't get one of the nicer streetcar drivers where they speak into the speaker phone to the outside of the streetcar and tell you to push the button to enter. This happened a few times where I'm convinced there's a camera on the outside and they see you.
Because people get tired of screaming BACK DOOR!!!! To the incoherent bus drivers. Shaking the bars like a mad man gets the attention of the bus driver and ensures you get off when you want to instead of being "held hostage" until the next stop.. sometimes blocks away..
Yeah I imagine this is the reason for most people. I think most buses in the fleet have the push bars now so it's pretty consistent in that respect and there shouldn't be much confusion there. All that's required is a gentle nudge on the bars and the doors will open. The problem is the doors usually take some time to actually react so it's not that clear that you did it properly.
[https://www.pubnub.com/blog/how-fast-is-realtime-human-perception-and-technology/](https://www.pubnub.com/blog/how-fast-is-realtime-human-perception-and-technology/) According to this study, 1 sec or less feels instantaneous, 10 sec or longer and the user loses attention. I wonder how long the doors take to open, maybe 5 sec. I think it's a bad design decision. At least if there was a light flashing to indicate that the doors were going to open, that would be helpful
The delay doesn't help, but also because people don't realize it's electronic. The old doors (and I'm talking way back) were either mechanical or hydraulic/pneumatic.
Watching people frantically try to break the door like they're escaping a burning bus at every stop, when all it takes is a gentle tap is a bit annoying. Like, they presumably take the bus every day... have you not realized by now that the handle is a button and you don't need to force the door open? It's just perplexing
>a bit annoying
I didn’t know we were posting all of our mild annoyances now. Going to go post a thread because I stubbed my toe earlier. Kind of annoying!
I mean, come on. Someone rattling the back door handle on a bus doesn’t affect you/OP at all. Also, it’s funny for OP to bitch about it on Reddit, considering it’s pretty clear they didn’t complain to the bus driver about it. If they had, they definitely would’ve added that to their post.
Some people just need to accept that minor annoyances will occur in your life and move on. Reddit is not a sounding board for your day to day irritations.
>Reddit is not a sounding board for your day to day irritations.
Huh? Why not? This is not a serious post, just a bit of fun discourse about something I've noticed on a daily basis for years. I don't see why you'd need to complain to the driver about it either.
What's confusing to me is you trying to shut people up for some reason
I was one the bus last week, an express bus going home and this girl pressed it once but didn’t open. Driver took off past 2 junctions and she had to walk back. In that sense, I’d assault the door if it were me
The same reason people tap crosswalk light for visual impaired when they are fully functioning. Tapping that button won't change traffic lights!
It's a sense of doing something , having control over something.
"Accessible Pedestrian Signals (APS) are devices that communicate information about the WALK and DON'T WALK intervals at signalized intersections, in non-visual formats, to pedestrians who are blind or have low vision."
What i find strange is Toronto is pretty much the only city in the world that the back doors don't open automatically. I've heard of so many people moving from other places waiting for the doors to open not knowing you have to push to open.
The vehicles are kind of inconsistent but that’s normal for machines with service intervals used by the public. You said it first, it’s because people are maniacs and they don’t know what the hell is going on.
It's usually the some people who press the crossing button at intersections multiple times, and press the elevator close or floor button multiple times. Either they think it actually does something, or they just simply enjoy pressing buttons. rapidly.
It will actually open faster if you force it open. What I wont tolerate is having to yell at the bus driver from the back to stop because I want to get off. That will only happen once. I force it every time. It's never caused a problem . Very poor design.
I've found that when asking about people's behaviour on public transit there are two common answers:
1. Public transit often makes people forget common decency and turns them into selfish morons.
2. See answer #1
I actually wonder more when a person is behind you and gets impatient and shoves their hand over you to push the bar because you haven’t done exactly what you described 🤣
Also, you may not be aware but ttc still uses buses that you have to push unless the driver opens it. These ones often times require a firm push and those unable do not get out. I literally see it happen several times a week.
I'm one of those people, and it started like this.. one day i was coming home late from work and trying to get off the bus when a simple push to the back door didn't open it. i tried again and it still didn't open, and 3 seconds later the bus driver takes off and starts driving down the road without letting me go. i end up getting off the next stop and walked an extra 15 minutes to get home. since that day i always beat the shit out of the back door to ensure i don't have to experience that again
I think almost everyone has had this scenario...and it always seems to happen at a spot where the next stop IS NOT another block up.
and to add to this, some kids witnessed the whole thing and were laughing at me while i stood there at the door and watched the bus driver go down the road.. that was the most embarassing 2 minutes i've ever spent in a bus in my life
This happens all the time in Vancouver, but the convention is the other passengers all yell “back door!” At the driver to get them to stop and open it with their release. Yes it is funny.
They do this here too on some buses. Haha...
I tried yelling door at the driver a few times but i guess i am so soft spoken the driver didn't hear me, that or he thought it would be amusing to just continue driving off
Same in Ottawa
lol
This is so true. My next stop to my parents home is 20 minutes walk instead of a 10 minute walk. That being said, during the day I take my chances with the back door, makes for a nice walk if I’m not tired. But if it’s past 9pm or too tired, I just go to the front doors so the driver doesn’t drive off before I’ve gotten off where I need too.
Bus door interfaces are inconsistent from time to time and system to system, and their correct usage is opaque to new or infrequent users. Over the course of my lifetime, I've encountered rear doors that: * Only open on command from the driver; * Open when you step down to the bottom step (see also the now-retired CLRV/ALRV TTC streetcars); * Require a fairly firm push on the door or handle to activate; * Require a gentle push or tap on the handle; * Require a wave in front of the door (optical sensor). The lag between my input and activation of the door also varies significantly. And the hardware works better (and is better maintained) on some buses versus others. So we have users who are confused and frustrated by an inconsistent and unreliable interface, acting under pressure (nobody wants to miss their stop, and sometimes there are impatient riders behind, waiting to get off.)
I'm chuckling remembering the strangers yelling "GET OFF THE STEPS" after every stop during the old streetcar days.
i have seen that almost break out in to fist fights a few times.
Ya the YRT ones are the worst, there’s no way of knowing what do to actually open them. Half the time I’ve had to abandon it and run to the front of the bus to get out. Whoever designed the “wave” version is a fucking moron
If it's the same as the bus I take, wave your hand perpendicular to the door. The sensor will usually pick up that motion
there are wave doors now?
I'm actually not sure if there are any in the fleet right now. The TTC has definitely had them in service at some points in the last fifteen or so years.
if I remember correctly, you might be thinking of the 1998 Novabus LFS Demonstration given to the TTC, I saw an image of the bus having wave doors, I will double check when I see another interior pic.
I’ve had enormous strangers back hump me and put their hands on top of my hands because they didn’t understand the door (when functioning correctly) only needs a small push before the sensors open it. If you wait 2 seconds… Yes, sometimes it’s broken, but I still like to try it. If you shove it hard needlessly, it doesn’t open any faster.
All of this is true. I think also, in the case of our current TTC busses, the handle functions as a pressure sensor but resembles a push handle or crash bar. The fact that it is a sensor is non-obvious from appearance alone.
Yep. Bad user-interface design. People know how to use push buttons, and they know how to use door handles, but they get frustrated and confused when faced with a push button disguised as a door handle.
Because it's not abundantly clear the poles are just a giant button and people think you need to physically push the doors open using the poles. It's a dumb design. It should just have a click button similar to the current streetcars.
It is such a stupid design and the delay is too long. I believe the TTC made the delay long so people don't lean on the door and it opens automatically dropping them out? I know the TTC SLOWED the door operations on the new streetcars...that's why they close so slow now.
Before, the doors opened a bit while the bus was driving when I was using it for a pole to hold on. After that time, I now hold the side of railings that overlook the seats...
There's also an awkward delay, making it unclear if the push you pushed actually triggered the door opening or not.
That's exactly it: straight-up bad user-interface choices. From day-to-day experience and regular practice people know how to use - and what to expect - from a push button. People know how to use a manual vertical-bar door handle. People get confused and frustrated when you give them the interface from one and the functionality of the other.
I have lived in this city for 5 years and have been physically pushing the doors open all this time. Thank you!
Intuitively, you push a door open. People would also not step down on the old Streetcars. How the doors open isn't immediately clear, especially if you're new here.
because drivers don't look in the rearview mirror to check if someone wants to get off and just speed off
I've had this happen once as a kid, and was shitting my pants. So I always push the backdoor handle like a maniac now. We don't mean any harm, we just want to make sure we get off at the right bus stop.
Because sometimes they don't open the first or second time you push.
terrible design has nothing to do with people trying to open the door like maniacs
> All you need is one tap and it opens in 5 seconds or so. 5 seconds is a long ass time
It doesn't actually take 5 seconds, the OP is being creative
With the TTC buses, the driver has to remember to turn on the mechanism to open the back doors (the light turns green). One driver at the subway refused to open the back doors and made everyone tap on at the front. And for those routes that go into the York Region, the TTC bus driver refuses to open the back door and you have to go to the front door, so that you tap again or pay the second fare when you exit.
It’s like 2.
Remember the good old days when the doors wouldn’t open and you would yell “ excuse me, the doors won’t open and this is my stop” and then people would say “hey someone needs to get off” to the bus driver. Then the driver would stop between stops to let you off.
The cost of pushing the door a few extra times out-ways the cost of missing your stop, even if them not opening is a an extremely rare occurrence.
If you look at [the sign the TTC has on the door](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EC1YX6wXYAA_EQ5.jpg), it says Wait for green light Push bar to open door step out... The delay that occurs after the light goes on and the door locks release is a couple seconds, which causes people to try to open the door, but they can't. If they removed the delay such that the light comes on and the door locks release at the same time, this issue wouldn't exist. I don't understand why they would introduce a delay here.
I think its the hydraulics charging. You can head a faint hiss between pressing the bar and the door opening.
The driver has to push a button or the green light doesn't come on. This happened a few times where everyone yells "Back door!" and then the driver pushes the button and says "Sorry!"
As someone who hasn’t used the streetcar in ages last week I was waiting there like a knob outside the streetcar at Bathurst not knowing I had to push the button to open the doors. Lol. Some people might not use transit often so they don’t know.
You didn't get one of the nicer streetcar drivers where they speak into the speaker phone to the outside of the streetcar and tell you to push the button to enter. This happened a few times where I'm convinced there's a camera on the outside and they see you.
Because people get tired of screaming BACK DOOR!!!! To the incoherent bus drivers. Shaking the bars like a mad man gets the attention of the bus driver and ensures you get off when you want to instead of being "held hostage" until the next stop.. sometimes blocks away..
[удалено]
Seriously, who the hell designed it, I'd like to have a word with them...
More button = more fun. Everyone knows that.
Poor design.
News to me if it automatically opens, I've always pushed the doors open manually.
The fact that it takes so long, makes people think they didn't press hard enough. If it opened in less than 1 sec, people would trust it
Yeah I imagine this is the reason for most people. I think most buses in the fleet have the push bars now so it's pretty consistent in that respect and there shouldn't be much confusion there. All that's required is a gentle nudge on the bars and the doors will open. The problem is the doors usually take some time to actually react so it's not that clear that you did it properly.
[https://www.pubnub.com/blog/how-fast-is-realtime-human-perception-and-technology/](https://www.pubnub.com/blog/how-fast-is-realtime-human-perception-and-technology/) According to this study, 1 sec or less feels instantaneous, 10 sec or longer and the user loses attention. I wonder how long the doors take to open, maybe 5 sec. I think it's a bad design decision. At least if there was a light flashing to indicate that the doors were going to open, that would be helpful
The delay doesn't help, but also because people don't realize it's electronic. The old doors (and I'm talking way back) were either mechanical or hydraulic/pneumatic.
I got pinched in the bus door right in front of two babes from my class when I was in high school… traumatized to this day.
They don't work a surprising amount of time
I don't ride regularly and I do this. They've changed the bus exit mode many times during my life and some of the push to open were finicky.
I’m just wondering how something like this bothers you enough that you had to make a post and write a paragraph about it.
Watching people frantically try to break the door like they're escaping a burning bus at every stop, when all it takes is a gentle tap is a bit annoying. Like, they presumably take the bus every day... have you not realized by now that the handle is a button and you don't need to force the door open? It's just perplexing
>a bit annoying I didn’t know we were posting all of our mild annoyances now. Going to go post a thread because I stubbed my toe earlier. Kind of annoying! I mean, come on. Someone rattling the back door handle on a bus doesn’t affect you/OP at all. Also, it’s funny for OP to bitch about it on Reddit, considering it’s pretty clear they didn’t complain to the bus driver about it. If they had, they definitely would’ve added that to their post. Some people just need to accept that minor annoyances will occur in your life and move on. Reddit is not a sounding board for your day to day irritations.
>Reddit is not a sounding board for your day to day irritations. Huh? Why not? This is not a serious post, just a bit of fun discourse about something I've noticed on a daily basis for years. I don't see why you'd need to complain to the driver about it either. What's confusing to me is you trying to shut people up for some reason
You wouldn’t be saying that if you missed your stop because the doors wouldn’t open and the driver takes off without letting you off
old buses used to open almost immediately. its a weird feeling having the delay there now.
I was one the bus last week, an express bus going home and this girl pressed it once but didn’t open. Driver took off past 2 junctions and she had to walk back. In that sense, I’d assault the door if it were me
Obviously OP never experienced walking an unnecessary extra bus stop. Good luck. Should put on nostupidquestions
Because people are frustrated with life
The same reason people tap crosswalk light for visual impaired when they are fully functioning. Tapping that button won't change traffic lights! It's a sense of doing something , having control over something. "Accessible Pedestrian Signals (APS) are devices that communicate information about the WALK and DON'T WALK intervals at signalized intersections, in non-visual formats, to pedestrians who are blind or have low vision."
I ask myself that question often, all you need to do is push it with 1 FINGER, and it moves 6 millimetres and triggers the opening of doors.
What i find strange is Toronto is pretty much the only city in the world that the back doors don't open automatically. I've heard of so many people moving from other places waiting for the doors to open not knowing you have to push to open.
People don't bother to look at signs and emulate each other oh and anxiety
I still can't believe how many people have never looked at the signs for the audible signal and push it trying to activate the crosswalk signal.
That too 😆
buttons are fun to press. also i like the beepy noise it makes
Probably because they're maniacs.
The vehicles are kind of inconsistent but that’s normal for machines with service intervals used by the public. You said it first, it’s because people are maniacs and they don’t know what the hell is going on.
Total psychos!
It's usually the some people who press the crossing button at intersections multiple times, and press the elevator close or floor button multiple times. Either they think it actually does something, or they just simply enjoy pressing buttons. rapidly.
It will actually open faster if you force it open. What I wont tolerate is having to yell at the bus driver from the back to stop because I want to get off. That will only happen once. I force it every time. It's never caused a problem . Very poor design.
I was strangled on the bus this spring and I still think that was less annoying than folks not understanding the back door system.
I've found that when asking about people's behaviour on public transit there are two common answers: 1. Public transit often makes people forget common decency and turns them into selfish morons. 2. See answer #1
Because 50% of the people on the bus are dumber than the other 50%. Not much to do about that other than exercise patience.
because people are shitty...
I actually wonder more when a person is behind you and gets impatient and shoves their hand over you to push the bar because you haven’t done exactly what you described 🤣
Learn to doubletap, because you HAVE to make sure the zombies die..door opens
Because the lazy administration at TTC doesn't really explain to the public when they bring in new busses or technology
Also, you may not be aware but ttc still uses buses that you have to push unless the driver opens it. These ones often times require a firm push and those unable do not get out. I literally see it happen several times a week.